1 00:00:06,31 --> 00:00:10,84 Hello welcome to Moral Politics produced by Bill offered I'm your host Valerie to 2 00:00:10,85 --> 00:00:11,28 Rico 3 00:00:12,20 --> 00:00:18,07 a year ago Moral Politics hosted again Monica Harrington of Catholic Watch dot org 4 00:00:18,73 --> 00:00:23,35 who came in to talk with us about hospice hospital murders across Washington state 5 00:00:23,69 --> 00:00:27,93 in which THANK YOU WERE system were being absorbed by Catholic system the countable 6 00:00:28,15 --> 00:00:34,09 to the will of the bishop for example Swedish Hospital at that time had recently 7 00:00:34,10 --> 00:00:36,40 been absorbed by the Providence system and become 8 00:00:36,41 --> 00:00:41,32 a subsidiary of Providence. The University of Washington was proposing an 9 00:00:41,33 --> 00:00:43,95 affiliation with East health also 10 00:00:43,96 --> 00:00:49,41 a Catholic system and in the San Juan Islands peace health had obtained government 11 00:00:49,42 --> 00:00:54,24 subsidies to provide the only care decisions in that community across the state in 12 00:00:54,25 --> 00:01:00,27 fact many communities only have religiously controlled health care system and the 13 00:01:00,28 --> 00:01:06,23 change is continuing apace here with us today again is Monica Harrington to talk 14 00:01:06,24 --> 00:01:10,37 about what's happened in the intervening time thank you for joining us thanks for 15 00:01:10,38 --> 00:01:15,61 having me out so what is the what is the scoop at this point what's going on with 16 00:01:15,62 --> 00:01:19,44 these Catholic Health Care Manager the University of Washington has entered into 17 00:01:19,45 --> 00:01:26,06 a partnership with the south and east path that has continued to absorb hospitals 18 00:01:26,10 --> 00:01:33,04 particularly after in the northwest section of the state. Franciscan which is 19 00:01:33,05 --> 00:01:38,50 one of the most conservative and has been acquiring hospitals that acquired High 20 00:01:38,51 --> 00:01:44,78 Line it acquired Harrison hospital in Bremerton when you say conservative What do 21 00:01:44,79 --> 00:01:51,04 you mean by that well when I think of the Catholic system I think in terms of tiers 22 00:01:51,20 --> 00:01:56,28 you have ultra conservative you have conservative and you have conservative light 23 00:01:56,69 --> 00:02:03,38 and ultra conservative are the Franciscan and the Franciscan system operates 24 00:02:03,39 --> 00:02:07,86 according to the bishop African religious directive just call them the vision rule 25 00:02:08,58 --> 00:02:13,42 and they follow those one hundred percent so no contraception no abortion under any 26 00:02:13,43 --> 00:02:20,38 circumstances no participation of staff the dignity etc Most bizarre to me in 27 00:02:20,39 --> 00:02:23,85 what you just described is this talk about 28 00:02:23,86 --> 00:02:30,01 a merger between the University of Washington system and people and the University 29 00:02:30,02 --> 00:02:31,62 of Washington system is a is 30 00:02:31,63 --> 00:02:36,50 a public institution for goodness sake when the taxpayers fund it one hundred 31 00:02:36,51 --> 00:02:39,15 percent How is this possible I know. It's 32 00:02:39,16 --> 00:02:46,01 a policy to me that our public university and medical teaching system is 33 00:02:46,02 --> 00:02:46,98 now affiliated with 34 00:02:46,99 --> 00:02:50,30 a capital institution what are the implications of that there's 35 00:02:50,31 --> 00:02:56,11 a few implications one of them is that they are proposing to do joint clinical 36 00:02:56,12 --> 00:03:00,71 programs together joint teaching programs which means University of Washington 37 00:03:00,72 --> 00:03:05,41 Medical students will be training traffic ospital or the care that training they're 38 00:03:05,42 --> 00:03:10,67 already getting will be expanded in Kappa capital so the question the question for 39 00:03:10,68 --> 00:03:11,53 me as 40 00:03:11,54 --> 00:03:17,04 a citizen of Washington is I want science based medicine I want I want to know what 41 00:03:17,05 --> 00:03:21,39 the full range of medically appropriate scientifically appropriate interventions 42 00:03:21,40 --> 00:03:26,17 are if I'm suffering or if somebody in my family is suffering I don't want to think 43 00:03:26,18 --> 00:03:30,23 based medicine is the University of Washington to be practicing faith based 44 00:03:30,24 --> 00:03:35,76 medicine Well the University of Washington says it isn't going to practice space 45 00:03:35,77 --> 00:03:42,72 based medicine but what they're doing is they're requiring or making their students 46 00:03:42,99 --> 00:03:46,94 study in Catholic hospitals they do rotations in Catholic hospitals where the 47 00:03:46,95 --> 00:03:51,47 bishops roll apply and it's just the Powerlink because when you work in 48 00:03:51,48 --> 00:03:56,08 a system where religious rules dictate that care patients get you start to get 49 00:03:56,09 --> 00:04:01,99 a sense that that's OK and it's absolutely not OK and our public university system 50 00:04:02,00 --> 00:04:06,00 should not be used to support the expansion of Catholic Health Care what you're 51 00:04:06,01 --> 00:04:08,91 saying is that medical trainees have been too weighted it to 52 00:04:09,09 --> 00:04:15,05 a limited range of services Catholic bishops have opposed them cell research they 53 00:04:15,09 --> 00:04:20,07 have opposed long long acting contraceptives which are the top tier for women 54 00:04:20,34 --> 00:04:23,92 they've opposed contraception being available to women who are delivering babies 55 00:04:23,93 --> 00:04:25,79 who want to be able to come out of the hospital with 56 00:04:25,80 --> 00:04:31,60 a contraceptive in place so what what I guess I wonder then is that we're talking 57 00:04:31,61 --> 00:04:37,94 about our medical trainees we should be cutting edge of best practices. 58 00:04:39,34 --> 00:04:43,47 Perhaps not getting enough for two meetings to witness or to experience or to 59 00:04:43,48 --> 00:04:46,64 practice those techniques themselves let me give you 60 00:04:46,65 --> 00:04:51,63 a very practical example I was down in the limb here earlier today and the A.C.L.U. 61 00:04:51,64 --> 00:04:56,26 Described a situation where a patient with a pregnancy emergency went to 62 00:04:56,27 --> 00:05:02,90 a Catholic hospital accompanied by her physician and she was told that the 63 00:05:02,91 --> 00:05:07,09 procedure she needed the pregnancy needed to be terminated for medical reasons for 64 00:05:07,10 --> 00:05:11,73 health reasons she was told that she would have to wait until the Ethics Committee 65 00:05:12,02 --> 00:05:17,52 weighed in and approved the procedure that she needed and ethics committee but this 66 00:05:17,53 --> 00:05:18,15 is really 67 00:05:18,30 --> 00:05:23,82 a feel logically driven committee absolutely absolutely the ethics committees in 68 00:05:23,83 --> 00:05:28,93 Catholic ospital operate by Catholic role by the bishops role so what this means is 69 00:05:28,97 --> 00:05:35,48 that if you are a resident in a hospital that operates by those rules all of 70 00:05:35,49 --> 00:05:36,29 a sudden you're seeing 71 00:05:36,30 --> 00:05:41,15 a situation where it might seem OK that you have to wait for the Ethical team to 72 00:05:41,16 --> 00:05:42,56 weigh in before a woman gets 73 00:05:42,57 --> 00:05:47,79 a procedure that she needs to save her life or her health that this is not standard 74 00:05:47,80 --> 00:05:49,13 medical ethics this is not 75 00:05:49,14 --> 00:05:54,84 a driven what I'm hearing is that the top priority is not necessarily the world of 76 00:05:54,85 --> 00:05:59,53 the patient the top priority is whether the medical care corresponds to 77 00:05:59,54 --> 00:06:04,01 a set of religious directives let's be clear the top priority for Catholic health 78 00:06:04,02 --> 00:06:10,01 systems is to provide witness to the Catholic faith patient care is subservient to 79 00:06:10,02 --> 00:06:16,95 that higher level mission of providing witness to the Catholic faith. How did 80 00:06:16,96 --> 00:06:22,12 they get in the health care service delivery you know business in the first place I 81 00:06:22,13 --> 00:06:26,25 know it's interesting because when you look that can you go back over one hundred 82 00:06:26,26 --> 00:06:31,13 years ago the men came out to the west and they opened up hospitals or health 83 00:06:31,14 --> 00:06:35,81 systems on the frontier and most of what they offered was nursing care they 84 00:06:35,82 --> 00:06:40,20 comforted people as they died or as they went through sicknesses and Catholic 85 00:06:40,21 --> 00:06:44,06 Health care was not different from the health care they might have gotten in 86 00:06:44,07 --> 00:06:48,08 a secular facility because at that point health care was palliative essentially 87 00:06:48,09 --> 00:06:53,55 right I mean people lived or died based on the will of God as they perceived it and 88 00:06:54,25 --> 00:06:58,42 maybe it's because they send or maybe just because God's will was inscrutable but 89 00:06:58,53 --> 00:07:03,66 but basically there wasn't medical science at that point and the other thing is the 90 00:07:03,67 --> 00:07:10,25 bishop had no involvement so and none who cared about science or who wanted to 91 00:07:10,41 --> 00:07:14,92 learn the best medical treatments are whenever she was free to do that because the 92 00:07:14,93 --> 00:07:19,51 bishops weren't overseeing health care that all changed in the twentieth century 93 00:07:19,52 --> 00:07:24,97 the bishops started to say hey we need to apply our rules whenever you talk about 94 00:07:24,98 --> 00:07:29,89 the Catholic bishops. What the association meant for me is that these are the same 95 00:07:30,05 --> 00:07:36,84 people who shuffle pedophile priests from parish to parish to parish right there I 96 00:07:36,85 --> 00:07:40,72 mean what that says to me is that these are people whose loyalty is first and 97 00:07:40,73 --> 00:07:45,97 foremost is not to the wellbeing of vulnerable people it's to the well being of the 98 00:07:45,98 --> 00:07:50,78 Catholic institution and it's interesting it's important that you bring up the 99 00:07:50,79 --> 00:07:56,69 whole issue of abuse in the Catholic Church because I believe we're on the cusp of 100 00:07:56,70 --> 00:08:03,04 identifying. Patients that I think of as victims in the sense that they're being 101 00:08:03,05 --> 00:08:03,86 victimized by 102 00:08:03,87 --> 00:08:10,42 a system where they are not being given access to legal medically appropriate 103 00:08:10,46 --> 00:08:15,20 treatment and oftentimes they don't even know that it's happening it's just 104 00:08:15,21 --> 00:08:19,78 outrageous Well people count on their doctor to tell them you know you have this 105 00:08:19,79 --> 00:08:24,73 choice or this choice they don't expect for the doctor to keep secret based on some 106 00:08:24,74 --> 00:08:29,63 kind of religious directives or religion you know they don't expect anyone to have 107 00:08:29,64 --> 00:08:33,93 a religious veto over their health care because if anybody's religion should come 108 00:08:33,94 --> 00:08:38,96 into it it's privilege in that the patient himself or herself right so there is an 109 00:08:38,97 --> 00:08:41,09 example recently where a woman needed 110 00:08:41,10 --> 00:08:47,16 a terminations of pregnancy terminations and the Catholic hospital the physicians 111 00:08:47,17 --> 00:08:51,20 at the Catholic hospital they told her her pregnancy needed to be terminated but 112 00:08:51,21 --> 00:08:57,02 that was it they didn't tell her how that would happen they didn't arrange for her 113 00:08:57,03 --> 00:09:01,86 to go see a physician at a different facility So imagine if you went to 114 00:09:01,90 --> 00:09:04,25 a doctor and the doctor said you need 115 00:09:04,26 --> 00:09:09,33 a very serious knee operation now I really have no idea how that might happen or 116 00:09:09,34 --> 00:09:11,10 where you might go but you need 117 00:09:11,11 --> 00:09:16,46 a serious knee operation that's not bad Arkell care we wouldn't allow it in any 118 00:09:16,47 --> 00:09:20,32 other facet of medicine but for some reason we're saying it's OK for women's 119 00:09:20,33 --> 00:09:26,66 reproductive health. Well again I come back to the idea that. That 120 00:09:26,67 --> 00:09:33,38 science and patient rights and patient wellbeing kind of are what people 121 00:09:33,39 --> 00:09:37,40 expect when they come into the medical system and specially 122 00:09:37,41 --> 00:09:43,02 a university medical system so who would ever suspect that if you if you walk in 123 00:09:43,03 --> 00:09:46,53 the door of the University of Washington or some place that the University of 124 00:09:46,54 --> 00:09:48,38 Washington has endorsed as 125 00:09:48,39 --> 00:09:53,51 a partner that you might not be getting the full picture right and what we're 126 00:09:53,52 --> 00:09:58,34 seeing is that in the Skagit area for example there are two hospitals that recently 127 00:09:58,77 --> 00:10:04,02 partnered affiliated with these have and they said publicly that one of the reasons 128 00:10:04,03 --> 00:10:07,83 that they're moving ahead with their partnership with the Catholic organization is 129 00:10:07,84 --> 00:10:12,33 because the University of Washington also partnered with that same Catholic 130 00:10:12,34 --> 00:10:15,24 institution so the University of Washington is being used as 131 00:10:15,25 --> 00:10:20,49 a shield to fuel the expansion of Catholic health care and that's just outrageous 132 00:10:20,50 --> 00:10:25,28 that's not how our tax dollars should be used and the University of Washington 133 00:10:25,29 --> 00:10:30,79 should be leading the fight to ensure that secular health care is available to 134 00:10:30,87 --> 00:10:34,89 everyone in Washington state because the brand of the University of Washington is 135 00:10:35,38 --> 00:10:41,56 State of the art right scientific full range of services. 136 00:10:42,57 --> 00:10:46,84 Is where you go where nobody else can take care of you right and no one else knows 137 00:10:46,85 --> 00:10:53,23 what to do when you've got something really complicated when when your home 138 00:10:53,24 --> 00:10:57,46 position will be at last when you need specialized medical technology news you 139 00:10:57,47 --> 00:11:03,22 expect that the University of Washington is going to endorse the very best and I'm 140 00:11:03,23 --> 00:11:08,40 going to provide the very best right my own sister underwent melanoma treatment at 141 00:11:08,41 --> 00:11:12,22 the University of Washington and it was high and treatment unfortunately she didn't 142 00:11:12,26 --> 00:11:19,21 make it but I know how strongly my sister felt about Catholic institutions and she 143 00:11:19,22 --> 00:11:21,32 made it very clear she didn't want to go near 144 00:11:21,56 --> 00:11:28,38 a path. Institution and so it's really bothersome to so many people that the 145 00:11:28,39 --> 00:11:32,30 University of Washington with essentially let its guard down and basically say 146 00:11:32,80 --> 00:11:37,41 we're going to abandon our principles where medicine should be completely rooted in 147 00:11:37,42 --> 00:11:39,90 science because it's C.D.N. 148 00:11:40,04 --> 00:11:40,72 Are asked to do 149 00:11:40,73 --> 00:11:45,61 a deal with the Catholic institutions that just shouldn't be allowed what the 150 00:11:45,62 --> 00:11:48,79 doctors at the University of Washington think about this whole notion of faith 151 00:11:48,80 --> 00:11:54,22 based medicine on their own home turf yet it's crazy a few months ago I was in 152 00:11:54,23 --> 00:11:56,70 a meeting where O.B.-G.Y.N. 153 00:11:56,71 --> 00:12:00,51 From around the state including from the University of Washington from some 154 00:12:00,52 --> 00:12:05,33 Catholic institutions and from other secular institution we were talking about the 155 00:12:05,34 --> 00:12:10,23 whole religion and health care issue and the people from the University of 156 00:12:10,24 --> 00:12:15,75 Washington which included students and faculty where extremely bothered and they 157 00:12:15,76 --> 00:12:21,82 were especially bothers me ministration is not publicly answering questions and is 158 00:12:21,83 --> 00:12:27,52 not clearly addressing the conflict between the type of care that these faculty 159 00:12:27,53 --> 00:12:32,08 members and students believe they should be getting and what the requirements are 160 00:12:32,12 --> 00:12:37,90 at the South in terms of abiding by the bishops rules. As we start talking about 161 00:12:37,91 --> 00:12:43,12 the role of the Catholic Church in Washington health care. One of the questions 162 00:12:43,13 --> 00:12:48,14 that comes to mind her me is I think of this also in the context of national in 163 00:12:48,15 --> 00:12:48,53 there being 164 00:12:48,54 --> 00:12:54,72 a conversation in which religious privilege is being elevated and it's growing 165 00:12:54,73 --> 00:12:59,60 rapidly you know and whether it's religious institutions or religious and 166 00:12:59,77 --> 00:13:04,27 individual many people are arguing and winning arguments in the courts that they 167 00:13:04,28 --> 00:13:09,02 shouldn't be subject to the obligations of civil society like providing 168 00:13:09,75 --> 00:13:14,84 contraceptive coverage comprehensive kind of coverage and in health care for their 169 00:13:15,23 --> 00:13:20,26 employees basically people are willing Kansas for example recently they were you 170 00:13:20,27 --> 00:13:23,94 know on the law they're arguing that they should be subject to civil rights laws. 171 00:13:25,31 --> 00:13:30,29 In fact there was an argument just this week that even more to should and shouldn't 172 00:13:30,30 --> 00:13:36,14 have to serve gay people if being gay offends their religious sensibilities really 173 00:13:36,15 --> 00:13:40,11 interesting to here in Washington we have so many enlightened them liars and the 174 00:13:40,12 --> 00:13:45,10 voters are in line and we voted for same sex marriage and yet the Catholic Church 175 00:13:45,11 --> 00:13:51,07 just recently won the right to be completely exempt from Washington's 176 00:13:51,12 --> 00:13:56,86 anti-discrimination law when it comes to couples in same sex marriages or gay 177 00:13:56,87 --> 00:13:59,66 people there's no protection for somebody who works in 178 00:13:59,67 --> 00:14:04,54 a Catholic hospital and who is in any way involved in furthering their religious 179 00:14:04,55 --> 00:14:09,65 mission there's no protection for that person from being fired and as we've seen 180 00:14:09,97 --> 00:14:16,67 the Catholic bishop in Seattle is perfectly happy to dismiss. Same sex married 181 00:14:16,68 --> 00:14:21,32 people who work for Catholic institutions Well I just happened to at the to the 182 00:14:21,65 --> 00:14:26,28 vice principal at Eastside Catholic Right right and it made news national news it 183 00:14:26,29 --> 00:14:30,73 made international news and so it made international news because the kids fought 184 00:14:30,74 --> 00:14:37,10 back right right and so the question is why aren't people fighting back more and 185 00:14:37,14 --> 00:14:41,28 a huge part of this is that people have 186 00:14:41,29 --> 00:14:47,95 a hard time really grasping how horrendous it is that we have 187 00:14:47,96 --> 00:14:54,14 allowed three Catholic bishops to take control of employment and health care policy 188 00:14:54,39 --> 00:14:59,68 for almost half our health care system the church going to court for the right to 189 00:14:59,69 --> 00:15:04,83 discriminate I mean people think of the Church of providing morals spiritual 190 00:15:04,88 --> 00:15:11,43 ethical leadership you know in the civil rights movement there was there was 191 00:15:11,81 --> 00:15:16,55 a lot of religious leaders who were out in front willing to put their well being on 192 00:15:16,56 --> 00:15:21,43 the line with their reputations on the line and so the thought again of like the 193 00:15:21,47 --> 00:15:26,19 church taking it all that all the way up through the court system because they want 194 00:15:26,20 --> 00:15:31,15 the right to discriminate Yeah it's really twisted I know it's really it's really 195 00:15:31,22 --> 00:15:38,18 just so appalling and it's not the Catholic Church that my parents. Supported they 196 00:15:38,19 --> 00:15:38,72 supported 197 00:15:38,73 --> 00:15:44,33 a version of the Catholic Church that was much more compassionate and the idea that 198 00:15:44,34 --> 00:15:49,01 the Catholic Church went out of its way to win the right to fire people that 199 00:15:49,02 --> 00:15:52,87 disagree with that philosophy it's just outrageous Well it reminds me of 200 00:15:52,88 --> 00:15:59,08 evangelicals right I mean we have World Vision based in Federal Way that went all 201 00:15:59,09 --> 00:16:04,50 the way to the Supreme Court of the United States and won the right to discriminate 202 00:16:04,95 --> 00:16:09,38 based on religion right because they argued that they couldn't fulfill their 203 00:16:09,39 --> 00:16:11,83 Christian mission if there was be 204 00:16:11,84 --> 00:16:17,76 a logical diversity among their their warehouse workers I think it's so disturbing 205 00:16:17,77 --> 00:16:24,04 that for everybody who works in health care today in Washington State that if half 206 00:16:24,05 --> 00:16:29,96 the employment opportunities are with the system that refuses to acknowledge same 207 00:16:29,97 --> 00:16:36,81 sex marriages that has views that people who. Find themselves 208 00:16:36,82 --> 00:16:41,64 pregnant and I'm married are sinful and should be fired and in fact the Catholic 209 00:16:41,65 --> 00:16:46,96 Church has fired people from Catholic institutions that happened just recently 210 00:16:46,97 --> 00:16:50,25 again they had actual news right what was the story it did so there was 211 00:16:50,26 --> 00:16:51,36 a middle school teacher 212 00:16:51,40 --> 00:16:56,18 a single woman who was pregnant and her employer the Catholic 213 00:16:56,22 --> 00:17:02,07 a Catholic institution fired her and it's ironic because that's exactly the sort of 214 00:17:02,08 --> 00:17:06,16 behavior that going to drive somebody who needs to keep their job into having an 215 00:17:06,17 --> 00:17:10,85 abortion which they have disapprove of right there basically saying Catch twenty 216 00:17:10,86 --> 00:17:16,55 two sorry you're outta luck Right right and what's the other thing that is 217 00:17:16,92 --> 00:17:21,14 a little crazy making about this whole situation is the fact that most of these 218 00:17:21,15 --> 00:17:24,19 Catholic institutions are not getting their money from the church from the 219 00:17:24,20 --> 00:17:28,55 offerings like they're getting their money from the taxpayer right as I understand 220 00:17:28,56 --> 00:17:34,23 it ninety five ninety eight percent of the money flowing through Catholic Social 221 00:17:34,24 --> 00:17:41,13 Services actually comes from from past payers and in fact they have also one 222 00:17:41,14 --> 00:17:43,49 in court the right to say that if 223 00:17:43,96 --> 00:17:50,48 a religious institution. Isn't allowed to compete for social service grants and 224 00:17:50,84 --> 00:17:55,10 health care grants that they're being discriminated against this bizarre notion the 225 00:17:55,11 --> 00:18:00,10 Catholic Church says and some other ultra conservative leaders have this notion 226 00:18:00,43 --> 00:18:06,44 that religious freedom is all about having the right to impose your values on other 227 00:18:06,45 --> 00:18:08,81 people and so here in Washington State we have 228 00:18:08,82 --> 00:18:13,41 a health care system that is paid for in large part by government makes up about 229 00:18:13,42 --> 00:18:19,29 forty five percent of the revenues broadly speaking and then you have the private 230 00:18:19,33 --> 00:18:20,50 employers who make up 231 00:18:20,51 --> 00:18:24,10 a huge percentage and then people who just pay for their own insurance coverage or 232 00:18:24,11 --> 00:18:28,04 who pay out of pocket so that's where the funding time from and all of these 233 00:18:28,05 --> 00:18:29,68 Catholic systems operate at 234 00:18:29,69 --> 00:18:35,55 a surplus so the care that they provide is funded by all of us it's not coming from 235 00:18:35,56 --> 00:18:39,65 Catholic specific coffers The other thing that is 236 00:18:39,79 --> 00:18:44,71 a myth about Catholic Health care is that they provide more charity care than other 237 00:18:44,72 --> 00:18:49,97 hospitals in fact Catholic hospitals provide less charity care than the industry 238 00:18:49,98 --> 00:18:52,31 average and the A.C.L.U. 239 00:18:52,64 --> 00:18:55,32 The American Civil Liberties Union and Richard Watch released 240 00:18:55,33 --> 00:19:00,70 a report in December of two thousand and thirteen itemizing that because I think 241 00:19:00,71 --> 00:19:05,31 most people would have no idea that Catholic institutions actually provide less 242 00:19:05,32 --> 00:19:10,11 care. That it's most than charitable and they kind of think of it as Catholic money 243 00:19:10,12 --> 00:19:14,37 Intel's expected to do with that would they choose I mean I actually think that it 244 00:19:14,38 --> 00:19:17,79 was earlier I said that most of the money came from the taxpayers I met from the 245 00:19:17,80 --> 00:19:23,49 taxpayers and from the Insurance Program right right in fact if you look at what's 246 00:19:23,50 --> 00:19:25,87 happened at fund family on the island where 247 00:19:25,91 --> 00:19:30,12 a Catholic hospital that is directly subsidized by taxpayers has been open for more 248 00:19:30,13 --> 00:19:33,58 than a year the cost of health care up on C.N.N. 249 00:19:33,59 --> 00:19:38,43 Island has gone up dramatically now why did it go up because they built 250 00:19:38,44 --> 00:19:40,95 a gorgeous new facility with 251 00:19:40,96 --> 00:19:47,54 a combination of donated dollars and that facility per. By the high end services 252 00:19:47,83 --> 00:19:53,67 but what's interesting is because it. Goes by Catholic rules it doesn't provide any 253 00:19:53,68 --> 00:19:58,71 subsidized care to pregnant women or new mothers that provide no maternity care 254 00:19:58,72 --> 00:20:00,13 services on 255 00:20:00,14 --> 00:20:04,21 a subsidized basis in the San Juan Islands resident even though all of their health 256 00:20:04,22 --> 00:20:10,87 care is that devised in some way so and that's just because they receive is 257 00:20:11,22 --> 00:20:17,98 to follow the state laws that voters enacted which could tax at the patient's right 258 00:20:18,14 --> 00:20:23,32 to make reproductive choices based upon their own conscience based upon their own 259 00:20:23,33 --> 00:20:27,49 feelings and what makes sense for their own family. When you talk about the sound 260 00:20:27,50 --> 00:20:30,90 when islands I think of people who go there to retire and intend to send 261 00:20:30,91 --> 00:20:35,93 a child the last years of their lives and I know that the bishops rules profoundly 262 00:20:35,94 --> 00:20:42,73 affect the rights of patients to decide how to how in their lives right I mean 263 00:20:42,90 --> 00:20:43,38 to have 264 00:20:43,39 --> 00:20:47,96 a control over their dying process when the time comes the Catholic Church and the 265 00:20:47,97 --> 00:20:53,01 bishops forbid any participation in this death with dignity and exponentially if 266 00:20:53,02 --> 00:20:54,62 they put a noose around there 267 00:20:55,55 --> 00:21:00,23 a gag order on their doctors for the doctors are not allowed to discuss staff with 268 00:21:00,24 --> 00:21:06,37 dignity with patients Origen refer them directly to compassion in Theresa's which 269 00:21:06,38 --> 00:21:08,47 is that organization that helps people find 270 00:21:08,48 --> 00:21:12,00 a doctor who can help them exercise their rights under the law so you have 271 00:21:12,01 --> 00:21:15,65 religious directives that trump patient directive America Act the Catholic Church 272 00:21:15,66 --> 00:21:20,10 is very upfront about this remark so outrageous I know your end of life directive 273 00:21:20,19 --> 00:21:24,35 will be honored as long as it doesn't conflict with Catholic doctrine and so we had 274 00:21:24,36 --> 00:21:25,05 to get married having 275 00:21:25,09 --> 00:21:31,75 a religious veto right right and the consequences can be horrifying so down in the 276 00:21:31,76 --> 00:21:36,28 Vancouver area a patient who was terminal in 277 00:21:36,29 --> 00:21:40,04 a great deal of pain and wanted to exercise his rights under the death of dignity 278 00:21:40,05 --> 00:21:41,77 law couldn't find 279 00:21:41,78 --> 00:21:46,30 a physician who was able to help in the reason is that the South has expanded 280 00:21:46,31 --> 00:21:50,60 dramatically down in that Cooper area and they are the big health care providers 281 00:21:50,61 --> 00:21:50,99 and there's 282 00:21:51,00 --> 00:21:55,35 a chilling effect when they think none of our physicians will participate in 283 00:21:55,36 --> 00:22:01,28 desperate dignity and so this patient unfortunately took his own life by shooting 284 00:22:01,29 --> 00:22:05,71 himself now that's the sort of thing that we enacted the deficits need 285 00:22:05,72 --> 00:22:10,36 a lot to prevent we want people to be able to choose 286 00:22:10,40 --> 00:22:13,19 a peaceful death if they're facing 287 00:22:13,50 --> 00:22:18,16 a painful terminal illness I know the New York Times just had an article last week 288 00:22:18,20 --> 00:22:23,89 about the whole notion of death with dignity or aid in dying and they talked about 289 00:22:23,90 --> 00:22:29,81 a Colorado man who is facing the same pitch. And it can't. Doesn't have the right 290 00:22:30,21 --> 00:22:36,39 to manage his own dying process and the This whole of him nobody should have to 291 00:22:36,40 --> 00:22:40,98 themselves nobody should have to shoot them to her random violent way to have to 292 00:22:40,99 --> 00:22:46,82 die when somebody is simply wanting to be able to manage the level of pain 293 00:22:47,80 --> 00:22:52,65 the the all of all of everything that goes along with that at the end of life 294 00:22:52,93 --> 00:22:53,18 there's 295 00:22:53,19 --> 00:22:58,01 a chilling effect for doctors if you know that your employer that you're Catholic 296 00:22:58,02 --> 00:23:05,02 employer refuses to allow abortion or birth control or any participates in this 297 00:23:05,03 --> 00:23:09,05 doc but. Then what happens is that you make 298 00:23:09,06 --> 00:23:14,79 a different set of decisions. And so physicians who used to participate with Death 299 00:23:14,80 --> 00:23:18,68 with Dignity love no longer do it and the reason they don't because they want to 300 00:23:18,69 --> 00:23:21,10 help patients but they also want to get 301 00:23:21,11 --> 00:23:24,32 a paycheck I think it goes back to what you're talking about at the University of 302 00:23:24,33 --> 00:23:27,56 Washington you know doctors do what they're familiar with and they do with their 303 00:23:27,57 --> 00:23:30,34 colleagues do they deal with what has been millions of them thinking what they have 304 00:23:30,35 --> 00:23:36,88 experience and not and and if you have people coming through the training system 305 00:23:37,37 --> 00:23:43,40 as residents as nurses in training and they're never exposed to conversations about 306 00:23:43,41 --> 00:23:45,50 what it means for a person to be able to have 307 00:23:45,54 --> 00:23:49,58 a good guy going to manage their own dying process they're not exposed to kind of 308 00:23:49,59 --> 00:23:53,72 the complicated conversations about age and directness and preferences and rights 309 00:23:53,73 --> 00:23:59,19 and intentions then then all of that is both questions are going to come up often 310 00:23:59,20 --> 00:23:59,70 in a in 311 00:23:59,71 --> 00:24:04,15 a doctor's office or say Washington would say that they're exposed in some other 312 00:24:04,16 --> 00:24:09,36 situations to care that isn't restricted but the important thing is that they 313 00:24:09,37 --> 00:24:12,96 should not be training in facilities where the rules are staffed by three Catholic 314 00:24:12,97 --> 00:24:19,82 Bishops it's just untenable and it's really important that the region 315 00:24:19,97 --> 00:24:25,36 and the medicine of Washington state make clear that we don't want our public 316 00:24:25,40 --> 00:24:31,84 university system and the teaching medical hospital not just for this state but for 317 00:24:31,85 --> 00:24:38,41 several states in the area to be influenced or under the direction of Catholic 318 00:24:38,42 --> 00:24:44,24 position that abide by Catholic school. Or any systems that are being subjected to 319 00:24:44,25 --> 00:24:45,49 that right there is 320 00:24:45,50 --> 00:24:52,48 a question of autonomy for the physicians themselves and their right to be able 321 00:24:52,49 --> 00:24:56,49 to do what they perceive is best for their patients what is it things to think 322 00:24:56,50 --> 00:25:02,61 about in terms of women's health is that the rules that are in place in Catholic 323 00:25:02,62 --> 00:25:09,26 institutions run completely contrary to the medical procedures and standards that 324 00:25:09,27 --> 00:25:14,52 have been set up by the American Congress of Obstetricians and Gynecologists So the 325 00:25:14,56 --> 00:25:18,90 O.B. G.Y.N. And about ninety five percent of the O.B. G.Y.N. 326 00:25:18,97 --> 00:25:23,82 In the country are members of this organization that major O.B.-G.Y.N. 327 00:25:23,82 --> 00:25:30,67 . Institution they basically support easy access to 328 00:25:30,68 --> 00:25:35,63 contraceptives thing courage the use of long acting reversible contraceptives what 329 00:25:35,64 --> 00:25:41,99 we call the top tier of contraceptive and they believe strongly that all options 330 00:25:42,00 --> 00:25:48,17 should be available to women patients who might face a pregnancy and especially 331 00:25:48,18 --> 00:25:54,92 a pregnancy that runs into complications and so the question is how can all be two 332 00:25:54,93 --> 00:26:00,41 why and who are restricted from doing the very things that the professional body 333 00:26:00,42 --> 00:26:05,30 says are critical to providing women's health care services how can they be 334 00:26:05,31 --> 00:26:07,74 licensed as O.B. G.Y.N. 335 00:26:08,00 --> 00:26:14,01 In this state when they are restricted because of the bishop's rules from providing 336 00:26:14,05 --> 00:26:17,25 contraception providing abortion even when 337 00:26:17,26 --> 00:26:20,41 a woman's life is at risk there's actually 338 00:26:20,67 --> 00:26:27,39 a vicious rule against. Providing an abortion in the case of an extra uterine 339 00:26:27,40 --> 00:26:32,90 pregnancy that. Pregnancy was always life threatening to 340 00:26:32,91 --> 00:26:39,90 a woman and it's absurd that physicians in this day ever be kept 341 00:26:39,91 --> 00:26:46,70 from doing what is appropriate and right. Monica were out of 342 00:26:46,71 --> 00:26:52,95 time I know that the people of Washington state. Want to be in charge of their own 343 00:26:52,96 --> 00:26:54,90 health and that as 344 00:26:54,91 --> 00:27:00,18 a region we think of ourselves as being science driven we're evidence based one of 345 00:27:00,19 --> 00:27:05,37 the out in front not dragging behind we can't afford to have our healthcare 346 00:27:05,72 --> 00:27:12,21 anchored to believe that come down an entire thank you very much thank you. 347 00:27:29,53 --> 00:27:31,21 Very.