0'3 fJo^ ^' Y9/
HARVARD COLLEGE
LIBRARY
GIFT OF THE
GOVERNMENT
OF THE UNITED STATES
7 ,,. .
PROBLEMS ARISING IN CASES OF DENATURALIZA-
TION AND DEPORTATION OF COMMUNISTS
(Greater Pittsburgh Area — Part 3)
HEARINGS
BEFORE THE
COMMITTEE ON UN-AMERICM ICTIYITIES
ROUSE OE REPRESENTATIYES
EIGHTY-SIXTH CONGRESS
FIRST SESSION
MARCH 12, 1959
(INCLUDING INDEX)
Printed for the use of the Coramittee on Un-American Activities
HARVARD COLLEGE LIBRARY
DEPOSITED BY THE
UNITED STATES GC'/ERNMENT
JUN13 1959
UNITED STATES
GOVERNMENT PRINTING OFFICE
40173 WASHINGTON : 1959
COMMITTEE ON UN-AMERICAN ACTIVITIES
United States House of Repeesentatives
FRANCIS E. WALTER, Pennsylvania, Chairman
MORGAN M. MOULDER, Missouri DONALD L. JACKSON, California
CLYDE DOYLE, California GORDON H. SCHERER, Ohio
EDWIN E. WILLIS, Louisiana WILLIAM E. MILLER, New York
WILLIAM M. TUCK, Virginia AUGUST E. JOHANSEN, Michigan
Richard Aeens, Staff Director
II
CONTENTS
Page
Synopsis 4(31
March 12, 1959: Testimony of—
Anna De vunich 468
Stephen Devunich 470
Vincent Kemenovich 473
Katherine Kemenovich 478
Mary Golden (resumed) 480
Katherine Kemenovich (resumed) 48 1
Alex Roth Rakosi 482
James Allan Donald McNeil 487
Afternoon session:
Anna Devunich (resumed) 49O
Stephen Devunich (resumed) 497
Steve Nelson 502
Index J
ni
Public Law 601, 79th Congress
The legislation under which the House Committee on Un-American
Activities operates is Public Law 601, 79th Congress [1946], chapter
753, 2d session, which provides:
Be it enacted by the Senate and House of Representatives of the United Slates
of America in Congress assembled, * * *
PART 2— RULES OF THE HOUSE OF REPRESENTATIVES
Rule X
SEC. 121. STANDING COMMITTEES
*******
18. Committee on Un-American Activities, to consist of nine Members.
Rule XI
POWERS AND DUTIES OF COMMITTEES
*******
(q) (1) Committee on Un-American Activities.
(A) Un-American activities.
(2) The Committee on Un-American Activities, as a whole or by subcommit-
tee, is authorized to make from time to time investigations of (i) the extent,
character, and objects of un-American propaganda activities in the United States,
(ii) the diffusion within the United States of subversive and un-American propa-
ganda that is instigated from foreign countries or of a domestic origin and attacks
the principle of the form of government as guaranteed by our Constitution, and
(iii) all other questions in relation thereto that would aid Congress in any necessary
remedial legislation.
The Committee on Un-American Activities shall report to the House (or to the
Clerk of the House if the House is not in session) the results of any such investi-
gation, together with such recommendations as it deems advisable.
For the purpose of any such investigation, the Committee on Un-American
Activities, or any subcommittee thereof, is authorized to sit and act at such
tunes and places within the United States, whether or not the House is sitting,
has recessed, or has adjourned, to hold such hearings, to require the attendance
of such witnesses and the production of such books, papers, and documents, and
to take such testimony, as it deems necessary. Subpenas may be issued under
the signature of the chairman of the committee or any subcommittee, or by any
member designated by any such chairman, and may be served by any person
designated by any such chairman or member.
*******
Rule XII
LEGISLATIVE OVERSIGHT BY STANDING COMMITTEES
Sec. 136. To assist the Congress in appraising the administration of the laws
and in developing such amendments or related legislation as it may deem neces-
sary, each standing committee of the Senate and the House of Representatives
shall exercise continuous watchfulness of the execution by the administrative
agencies concerned of any laws, the subject matter of which is within the jurisdic-
tion of such committee; and, for that purpose, shall study all pertinent reports
and data submitted to the Congress by the agencies in the executive branch of
the Government.
RULES ADOPTED BY THE 86TH CONGRESS
House Resolution 7, January 7, 1959
Rule X
STANDING COMMITTEES
1. There shall be elected by the House, at the commencement of each Con-
gress,
*******
(q) Committee on Un-American Activities, to consist of nine Members.
Rule XI
POWERS AND DUTIES OF COMMITTEES
*******
18. Committee on Un-American Activities.
(a) Un-American activities.
(b) The Committee on Un-American Activities, as a whole or by subcommittee,
is authorized to make from time to time investigations of (1) the extent, char-
acter, and objects of un-American propaganda activities in the United States,
(2) the diffusion within the ITnited States of subversive and un-American prop-
aganda that is instigated from foreign countries or of a domestic origin and
attacks the principle of the form of government as guaranteed by our Constitu-
tion, and (3) all other questions in relation thereto that would aid Congress
in any necessary remedial legislation.
The Committee on Un-American Activities shall report to the House (or to the
Clerk of the House if the House is not in session) the results of any such investi-
gation, together with such recommendations as it deems advisable.
For the purpose of any such investigation, the Committee on Un-American
Activities, or any subcommittee thereof, is authorized to sit and act at such times
and places within the United States, whether or not the House is sitting, has
recessed, or has adjourned, to hold such hearings, to require the attendance
of such witnesses and the production of such books, papers, and documents, and
to take such testimony, as it deems necessary. Subpenas may be issued under
the signature of the chairman of the committee or any subcommittee, or by any
member designated by any such chairman, and may be served by any person
designated by any such chairman or member.
26. To assist the House in appraising the administration of the laws and in
developing such amendments or related legislation as it may deem necessary,
each standing committee of the House shall exercise continuous watchfulness
of the execution by the administrative agencies concerned of any laws, the subject
matter of which is within the jurisdiction of such committee; and, for that
purpose, shall study all pertinent reports and data submitted to the House by
the agencies in the executive branch of the Government.
SYNOPSIS
Problems Arising in Cases of Deistattiralization and Deportation
OF Communists
(Greater Pittsburgh Area — Part 3)
Problems arising in cases of clenaturalization and deportation
of Communists were considered during the third phase of a three-day
public hearing held in Pittsburgh, Pennsylvania, March 10, 11, and 12,
1959.1
In pointing up the issues in the third phase of the hearings, the
chairman of the subcommittee. Honorable Edwin E. Willis, stated:
The Committee on Un-American Activities has maintained
a continuing interest in the administration and enforcement
of om* immigration and naturalization laws because they
are a first line of defense against Communist penetration
of our society. Since the enactment of the Immigration and
Nationality Act in 1952, there have been a number of se-
rious problems develop as the result of certain judicial
opinions interpreting the act.
It is not my purpose here to criticize the opinions or
the Court which rendered them. However, in order that we
may attempt to cope with the problems which do now exist
in the enforcement of those pi'ovisions of the Immigration
and Nationality Act designed to denaturalize and deport
Communists, I shall now recite for the record the essence of
some of these judicial opinions; and we shall then undertake
to explore factual situations in actual cases in which there
have been either deportation or denaturalization proceed-
ings arising in, or having bearing on, cases in the Pittsburgh
area.
On December 9, 1957, the Supreme Court rendered a de-
cision in the case of Rowaldt v. Perfetto, 355 U.S. 115. In
this case the Court held that where the Department of Jus-
tice was attempting to deport a Communist alien, proof of
the alien's membership in the Communist Party was not
sufficient to sustain the order of deportation; that the De-
partment of Justice had to prove that the alien had ''a mean-
ingful association*' with the Communist Party.
In the case of the United States v. Witkovich, 353 U.S.
194, decided on April 29, 1957, the Supreme Court inter-
preted that part of the Immigration and Nationality Act
1 For the other two phases of the hearings see "Current Stratearv and Tactics of Com-
munists in the United States (Greater Pittsburgh Area — Part 1)," March 10. 1959, and
"Problems of Security in Industrial Establishments Holding Defense Contracts (Greater
Pittsburgh Area — ^Part 2)," March 11, 1959.
461
462 DENATURALIZATION AND DEPORTATION OF COMMUNISTS
which requires that an alien against whom a deportation
order lias been outstanding for more than 6 months "give
information under oath as to his nationality, circumstances,
habits, associations and activities, and such other informa-
tion, whether or not related to the foregoing, as the Attorney
General may deem fit and proper." In this case, by a 6 to
2 decision, the Court held that an alien against whom a de-
portation order had been outstanding for more than 6 months
could not be required to answer questions respecting his
present Communist relationships or activities, ai?d that he
could only be required to answer questions regarding his
availability for deportation.
May I say in connection with the problem which is pre-
sented by the Witkovich case that it is the information of the
conunittee that it is becoming increasingly difficult to effect
the deportation of alien Communists because the Iron Cur-
tain countries from which such alien Communists have come
to the United States almost uniformly refuse to issue neces-
sary travel documents pursuant to which they can be admitted
into the countries from which they came.
Turning to the problems of denaturalizing Communists,
I should like to refer to two judicial opinions. Here again
I want to emphasize that I am not criticizing the opinions or
the Court, but I am merely pointing out the issues and prob-
lems which exist as a result of the opinions, and I am doing
so for the purpose of clarifying our record here today as we
enter this third phase of our hearings in an attempt to ex-
plore factual situations for our legislative purposes.
In the cases of Noioak v. United States^ 356 U.S. 660,
and Maisenherg v. United States^ 356 U.S. 670, both de-
cided on May 26, 1958, the Court ruled that for the purposes
of denaturalizing a Communist who had obtained citizen-
ship while a member of the Commmiist Party, the Govern-
ment must not only show that the person against whom the
denaturalization procedures were brought was a member of
the Communist Party and that the Communist Party advo-
cates tlie violent overthrow of the Government, but that, in
addition, the Government must prove that the defendant
knew that the Communist Party engaged in such illegal
advocacy. The decision in the Nowak case was another split
decision of which the Maisenberg case was a comj)anion.
Vincent Kemenovich, Trafford, Pennsylvania, who had been identi-
fied by responsible witnesses under oath as a member of the Com-
munist Party and against whom, since January 14, 1952, there has
been an outstanding final order of deportation as an alien Communist,
invoked constitutional privileges in response to questions respecting
Communist Party membership and activities. It is the information
of the committee that Mr. Kemenovich 's deportation as an alien Com-
munist has not been effected because of difficulty in procuring travel
documents for his admission into the Iron Curtain country from
Avhich he came.
Mrs. Katherine Kemenovich, Trafford, Pa., the wife of Vincent
Kemenovich, testified that she was born in Austria-Hmigary (now
DENATURALIZATION AND DEPORTATION OF COMMUNISTS 463
Yugoslavia) ; that she came to the United States for permanent resi-
dence in 1921; and that she wiis naturalized in Steubenville, Ohio,
in 1941. In 1954, the Immigration and Naturalization Service insti-
tuted proceedings to revoke Mrs. Kemenovich's citizenship, alleging
that it was procured illegally in that she concealed at the time of
her naturalization the fact that she was then a member of the Com-
munist Party.
The Supreme Court of the United States having held that Section
340(a) of the Immigration and Nationality Act of 1952 makes the
filing of an "affidavit showing good cause" a prerequisite to mainte-
nance of a denaturalization case, United States v. Zucca^ 1956, 351
U.S. 91, the Katherine Kemenovich case was dismissed without preju-
dice, there having been a failure to file such an affidavit. Before
the proceeding could be reinstituted, the decisions of the Supreme
Court of the United States came down in the Nowak and Maisenberg
cases. Due to the problem of proving knowledge on the part of Mrs.
Kemenovich tliat the Communist Party advocated the overthrow of
the Government by force and violence at the time of her naturaliza-
tion as required by the decisions in those cases, the proceeding was
not reinstituted.
In the course of the instant hearings, Mrs. Mary Golden, who had
served as an undercover agent of the Federal Bureau of Investigation
in the Communist Party, identified Mrs. Kemenovich as a member
of the Communist Party and testified respecting her current Commu-
nist Party activities.
Mrs. Kemenovich invoked constitutional privileges in response to
questions concerning her Communist Party membership and activities
and whether she was cognizant at the time of her naturalization of
the fact that the Communist Party advocated the overthrow of the
Government by force and violence.
Alex Eoth Rakosi, Irwin, Pennsylvania, against whom denaturali-
zation proceedings were instituted on the ground that he had con-
cealed his membership in the Communist Party at the time of Ills
naturalization, invoked the privilege of the fifth amendment against
self-incrimination in response to all questions respecting his Com-
munist Party membership and activities. In the course of the in-
stant hearings, Mrs. Mary Golden identified Rakosi as a member
of the Communist Party and testified respecting Rakosi 's current
Communist Party activities.
James Allan Donald McNeil, Pittsburgh, Pennsylvania, against
whom deportation proceedings have been pending since 1952 as
an alien Communist, requested a continuance of his appearance in
the instant hearings on the ground that the deportation proceedings
had not been finally determined. He was accordingly excused from
further testimony.
Mrs. Anna Devunich, Pittsburgh, Pennsylvania, a naturalized
citizen, who was identified in the instant hearings by Mrs. Mary
Golden as a member of the Communist Party and who was con-
fronted in the instant hearings with numerous exhibits of Com-
munist Party activities, invoked the privilege of the fifth amendment
against self-incrimination in response to all questions respecting her
Conmiunist Party membership and activities.
40173 — 59-
464 DENATURALIZATION AND DEPORTATION OF COMMXTNISTS
Stephen Devunich, the husband of Anna Devunich, a naturalized
citizen, invoked the privilej^e of the lifth amendment against self-
incrimination with respect to all questions in regard to his Com-
nuuiist Party membership and activities. Mrs. Mary Golden testi-
fied in the instant hearings respecting Devunich's Communist Party
membership and activities.
Steve Nelson, whose record of Communist activity in the United
States is notorious and who is a naturalized citizen, invoked the
privilege of the fifth amendment against self-incrimination with
respect to his knowledge of the nature of the Communist Party at
the time of his naturalization. Although both Hamp and Mary
Golden, in the instant hearings, testified respecting current Com-
munist Party membership and activities of Steve Nelson, he in-
voked the privilege of the fifth amendment against self-incrimination
when interrogated respecting such membership and activities.
Denaturalization proceedings were also instituted against Alex
Roth Rakosi, Anna Devunich, Stephen Devunich, and Steve Nelson,
all of which were dismissed without prejudice for the same reason
that the Katherine Kemenovich case was dismissed, and proceedings
were not reinstituted for the same reason that the Kemenovich case
was not reinstituted.
PROBLEMS ARISING IN CASES OF DENATURALIZATION
AND DEPORTATION OF COMMUNISTS
(Greater Pittsburgh Area— Part 3)
THURSDAY, MARCH 12, 1959
United States House of Representatives,
Subcommittee of the
Committee on Un-American Activities,
Pittsburgh^ Pa.
PUBLIC HEARINGS ^
The subcommittee of the Committee on Un-American Activities
met, pursuant to recess, at 10 a.m., in courtroom No. 6, New Federal
Building, Pittsburgh, Pa.
Subcommittee members present: Representatives Edwin E. Willis,
of Louisiana (presiding) , and William M. Tuck, of Virginia.
Stati' members present: Richard Arens, staff director; George C.
Williams and William Margetich, investigators.
Mr. W^iLLis. The subcommittee will please come to order.
We now come to the third phase of the hearings, namely, problems
arising in cases of denaturalizations and deportations of Communists,
of which cases a substantial number have occurred in this district.
That the international Coimnunist conspiracy has directed its efforts
toward undermining our immigration and naturalization system is
evident from a few facts :
Beginning in 1922 the Comm,unist International in Moscow estab-
lislied an organization known as the International Red Aid, with three
purposes : First, the international movement and deployment of Com-
munists and those most pliable to Communist discipline; second, to
fight Communist deportations within the various nations of the world ;
and third, to work in the West among aliens and nationality groups
for (^ommunist objectives.
Within 10 years the International Red Aid had penetrated deeply
into 67 countries. They had 83,000 organizations and various subsid-
iary groups controlled by 40,000 highly placed Communist function-
aries. They had an aggregate membership of 11,500,000. Within the
United States, the Am,erican section of the IRA was organized in 1925
and known as the International Labor Defense. This organization
developed 800 branch subsidiary organizations within the LTnited
States — such groups as the American Committee for Protection of
1 For resolution of committee, authorizing and directing the holding of these hearings in
Pittsburgh, and the order of appointment of the subcommittee to conduct such hearings
beginning March 10, 1959, see "Current Strategy and Tactics of Communists in the
United states (Greater Pittsburgh Area — Part 1)."
465
466 DENATURALIZATION AND DEPORTATION OF COMMUNISTS
Foreign Born, committees to save refugees, and the like — with an
aggregate membership of 225,000.
Parallel with this operation the Nationality Groups Commission of
the Communist Party established the International Workers Order,
cultural societies, the American Slav Congress, and other units to work
among aliens and nationality groups within the United States. They
supplemented and implem,ented this operation by what they call a
"united front tactic," namely, to coalesce or work together with non-
Communist and even anti-Communist groups on specific immigration
programs without the revelation of their Communist objectives.
In 1947, a special congressional committee made an extensive investi-
gation and study of our im.migration and naturalization system whicli
was found to be shot tlirougli with loopholes and weaknesses. As a
result of this investigation and study, the Congress enacted the Immi-
gration and Nationality Act in 1952, which was designed to strengthen
enforcement procedures against subversives and other undesirables.
The Committee on Un-American Activities has maintained a con-
tinuing interest in the administration aud enforcement of our immigra-
tion and naturalization laws because they are a first line of defense
against Communist penetration of our society. Since the enactment
of the Immigration and Nationality Act in 1952, there have been a
number of serious problems develop as a result of certain judicial
opinions interpreting the act.
It is not my purpose here to criticize the opinions or the Court which
rendered them. However, in order that Ave may attempt to cope with
tlie problems which do now exist in the enforcement of those provisions
of the Immigration and Nationality Act designed to denaturalize and
deport Communists, I shall now recite for .the record the essence of
some of these judicial opinions ; and we shall then undertake to explore
factual situations in actual cases in which there have been either depor-
tation or denaturalization proceedings arising in, or having bearing on,
the casos in the Pittsburgh area.
On December 9, 1957, the Supreme Court rendered a decision in the
case of Rovmldt v. Perfetto (355 U.S. 115). In this case the Court
held that where the Department of Justice was attempting to deport
a Communist alien, proof of the alien's membership in the Communist
Party was not sufRcient to sustain the order of de):)ortation ; that the
Department of Justice had to prove that the alien had "a meanino-ful
association" with the Communist Party. And that is very difficult to
understand and administer.
In the case of the United States v. Yiitkovich (353 U.S. 194) , decided
on April 29, 1957, the Supreme Court interpreted that part of the
Immigration and Nationality Act which requires that an alien against
whom a deportation order has been outstanding for more than 6 months
''give information under oath as to his nationality, circumstances,
liabits, associations and activities, and such other information, whether
or not related to the foregoing, as the Attorney General may deem fit
and proper." In this case, by a G to 2 decision, the Court held that an
alien against whom a deportation order had been outstanding for more
than 6 months could not be required to answer questions respecting his
present Communist relationships or activities, and that he could only
be required to answer questions regarding his availability for depor-
tation.
DENATURALIZATION AND DEPORTATION OF COMMUNISTS 467
May I say in connection with the problem which is presented by
the Witkovich case that it is the information of the committee that
it is becoming increasingly difficult to effect the deportation of alien
Communists because the Iron Curtain countries from which such
alien Commimists have come to the United States almost uniformlj^
refuse to issue necessar}- travel documents pursuant to which they can
be admitted into the countries from which they came.
Turning to the problems of denaturalizing Communists, I should
like to refer to two judicial opinions. Here again I want to emphasize
that I am not criticizing the opinions or the Court, but I am merely
pointing out the issues and problems which exist as a result of the
opinions, and I am doing so for the purposes of clarifying our record
here today as we enter this third phase of our hearings in an attempt
to exj)lore factual situations for our legislative purposes.
In the cases of Noioak v. United States (356 U.S. 660) , and Maisen-
herg v. United States (356 U.S. 670), both decided on May 26, 1958,
the Court ruled that for the purposes of denaturalizing a Communist
who had obtained citizenship while a member of the Communist Party,
the Government must not only show that the person against whom the
denaturalization procedures were brought was a member of the Com-
munist Part}^ and that tlie Communist Party advocates tlie violent
overthrow of the Government, but that, in addition, the Government
must prove that the defendant knew that the Communist Party
actually engaged in such illegal advocacy. The decision in the Nowak
case was another split decision of which the Maisenberg case was a
companion.
What legislation ought to be and can be enacted to strengthen
our deportation and denaturalization proceedings in the light of these
decisions ?
Are the persons against w^hom these proceedings have been brought
now a menace to the security of this country ?
What type of factual material can ever be developed in deporta-
tion cases to overcome the impact of these opinions? These and re-
lated questions will be in the minds of the subcommittee as we pro-
ceed now in the third phase of these hearings.
Mr. Arens, call your first witness.
Mr. Arens. Anna Devunich, please come forward.
Mr. Willis. Please raise your right hand.
Mrs. Devunich. Mr. Chairman, Mr. Chairman, Mr. Chairman,
before I take my oath
Mr. Willis. I do not have-
Mrs. Devunich. I v/isli to explain that w^e do not have counsel.
Up until 2 days ago we had counsel or at least we were sure we had
counsel. And up to 7 o'clock
Mr. Willis. Let me swear you in and I will be glad to go over
that with you.
Mrs. Devunich. Up to 7 o'clock we had no counsel. I would like
to ask of you a slight postponement so that we could proceed trying
to get counsel. We would have been sure to have counsel if they" had
not been in fear and had pulled out.
Mr. Willis. Could you have counsel this afternoon ?
Mrs. Devunich. That is something I would not know, but I would
try very hard and so would my husband.
468 DENATURALIZATION AND DEPORTATION OF COMMUNISTS
Mr. Willis. Well, suppose you luive a seat and wait a minute,
please.
( The members of the committee conferred. )
Mr. AViLLis. We will do the best we can to assist you within our
ability. lUit 1 think you must be sworn because you are not under
our jurisdiction now, and then just state to Mr. Arens your problem
about your counsel, why you do not have counsel, and we will do the
best w^e can.
So will you please raise your right hand ? We will not ask ques-
tions about anything but counsel.
Will you please raise your right hand ?
Mrs. Devunich. Mr. Chairman, may I please confer with my hus-
band first ?
Mr. Willis. Surely.
Mrs. Devunich. Before this.
Mr. Willis. Surely.
(Conferred.)
Mrs. Devunich. Mr. Chairman, we have decided that I will take
the oath but will not answer any questions without counsel.
Mr. Willis. Let me swear you. Do you solemnly swear that the
testimony you are about to give will be the truth, the whole truth, and
nothing but the truth, so help you God ?
Mrs. Devunich. I do.
Mr. Willis. Have a seat for a moment. " And Mr. Arens will ask
you only questions about the problem of your counsel, that is all.
Just a few questions to clear that up.
After all, you appear at this last minute and make this plea. We
have to have some facts upon which we can form a judgment in your
case. That is the only reason why we want to ask you a few ques-
tions about your counsel.
TESTIMONY OP ANNA DEVUNICH
Mr. Arens. At this time I do not propose to interrogate you on any
subject other than the issue that is presently before the subconnnittee.
Please identify yourself now on this record by name, residence, and
occupation.
Mrs. Devunich. Honorable sir, I had requested that I not answer
any questions until I have counsel.
Mr. Arens. The only questions I am going to ask you are questions
of your own identity so that this committee can satisfy itself that you
have responded to the subpena for your appearance here and, secondly,
questions respecting the issue that is currently before the committee,
namely, the matter of your counsel.
Would you kindly identify yourself by name, residence, and occu-
pation ?
Mrs. Devunich. Sir, I do not feel secure in answering any questions
without counsel.
Mr. xVrens. Are you Anna Devunich ?
Mr. Willis. You see, you have asked me, as chairman of this sub-
committee, to postpone your questioning until you can get a counsel.
Now, what I am tiying to do is to have you say, if that is the case,
that you have no counsel, and why you do not have a counsel, and that
DENATURALIZATION AND DEPORTATION OF COMMUNISTS 469
will be the end of the questions. I cannot rule upon your request as
this is not a court, this is not a jurisdiction proceeding. But for the
sake of comparison you certainly would not go before a judge at tlie
last minute and say, "I want my case postponed Ijecause I do not have a
laAvyer'' and then not say why you do not have a lawyer. IVe need that
in order to try to assist you if that assistance is within our power.
Now, I assure you that is all we want. But we must have that. So
Avhat he is asking you for the record so you can be identified now is,
wdiat is your name, that is all.
Mr, Tuck, As I understand it, Mr. Chairman, the committee will
take great care to conserve every single constitutional right that she
may have.
Mr. Willis., What is your name ?
Mrs. Devunich. Mr. Chairman, I have to think over now. Should
I answer any questions ? I was under the im — —
jNIr. Willis. Would your husband care to sit next to you ?
Mr. Devunicii. Excuse me.
Mr. Willis. Yes.
Mrs. Devunicii. My name is Anna Devunich.
Mr. Arens. Mrs. Devunich, you are appearing in response to a sub-
pena which was served upon you by this committee ?
Mr. Willis. Do not be too formal. Let that be miderstood. I
think she would not imderstand that.
You are appearing here today in response to a document that was
served upon you asking you to come here, is not that correct ?
Mrs. Devunich. Yes.
INIr. Arens. Now, Mrs. Devunich, you do not have counsel ; is that
correct ?
Mrs. Devunich. As of this moment we do not have counsel.
Mr. Arens. Have you ever had counsel in these proceedings which
a re pending here ?
Mrs. DE\n[jNicii. Have I ever had counsel ?
Mr. Arens. Have you made arrangements heretofore for counsel ?
Mr. Willis. In other words, had you made arrangements and did
you have one up until recently ; we want to know that. Did you have
one ?
Mrs. Devunich. I didn't understand the question. I understand
the question now.
Sir, we thought we had one and we were sure we had one imtil 2
days ago. And we had promises and we made telephone calls and
made personal visits and so on and we were very sure that we were
going to come up with an attorney at least by last night, at least by
yesterday afternoon.
Mr. Willis. I understand.
Mrs. Deahjnich. Now it was no fault of ours. We were sure that
we had an attorney, and what happened there I could not say.
Mr. Arens. Do you want this Committee on Un-American Activi-
ties to solicit counsel for you ?
Mr. Willis. In other words, did you try the local bar association
or the Lawyer Referral Service? Have you tried, ma'am?
Mrs. Devunich. The attorney who we thought was going to be our
attorney tried and it didn't come out the way we thought.
Mr. Arens. Do you want comisel?
Mrs. Devunich. Naturally.
470 DENATURALIZAnON AND DEPORTATION OF COMMUNISTS
Mr. Arens. Do you want this committee to solicit counsel for you?
Mrs. Devunich. No, sir. I wouldn't be able to answer on that
until I see what my husband thinks.
Would you please come over here again ?
Mr, Wiixis. You must understand that we are not trying to name
a lawyer for you. Mr. Arens means would you care for him to try to
make some arrangement with the bar association for counsel for you.
We do not know who the lawyer is going to be. We will not name
a lawyer for you.
Mrs. Devunich. Yes. I think that would be necessary and proper
and I think it would be in agreement with us. Would you say that
if the bar association did something it — that we would
Mr. Devunich. Yes.
Mr. Arens. Mr. Chairman, the next witness we were to call is Mr.
Devunich, who apparently, although he has not identified himself on
this record, is seated beside his wife. I respectfully suggest so that
this record may be clear that we now call Mr. Devunich, who can be
on the record and make his views known on this same issue.
Mr. Willis. You were to be called right after your wife, and we
may as well cover you. You are in the same position as your wife
as to counsel, as I understand it ; is that correct ?
Mr. Devunich. Yes.
Mr. Willis. Let me swear you so you can say the same thing and
then we will see about a counsel.
Do you solemnly swear the testimony you are about to give will be
the truth, the whole truth, and nothing but the truth, so help you
God?
Mr. Devunich. I do.
TESTIMONY OF STEPHEN DEVUNICH
Mr. Willis. What is your name ?
Mr. Devunich. Stephen Devunich.
Mr. Willis. You appear here because you were subpenaed to ap-
pear by this committee; is that correct? You received a subpena, you
received a notice to appear.
Mrs. Devunich. Subpena.
Mr. Devunich. Yes.
Mr. Willis. Now ask him about counsel.
Mr. Arens. Mr. Devunich, have you at any time since you received
your subpena had counsel in anticipation of these proceedings?
Mr. Devunich. M}^ wife she tell you the same thing. We thought
that we have counsel. We worked hard and then we find out late last
night that counsel is unavailable. That is how we are now that I
would ask the committee to give us time to find our own counsel.
Mr. Arens. It was just late last night that you found out you did
not have counsel ?
Mr. Devunich. Even through the phone we tried to get counsel.
Couldn't get.
Mr. Arens. May the record be clear on this. When did you engage
counsel ?
Mr. Willis. He means when did you first talk to a lawyer and
when did you think you had a lawyer. It seems there has been
some slipup somewhere. When did you first try to get a lawyer ?
DENATURALIZATION AND DEPORTATION OF COMMUNISTS 471
Mr. Devunich, Well, after we got the subpena.
Mr. Willis. All right. Did you talk to a lawyer ?
Mr. Devunich. Yes.
Mr. Willis. And discuss your case with him ?
Mr. Devunich. Yes.
Mr. Willis. And you thought that lawyer would be here this
morning ?
Mr. Devunich. Well, last night we found out that he is unavailable
and can't get him last night.
Mr, Arens. Did the lawyer call you last night and, in effect, say he
could not represent you ? Is that what happened ?
Mr. Willis. You said you called the lawyer, is that it? That is
the way I understood it. Did you call the lawyer or did he call you ?
Mr. Devunich. We was in touch 2 days, the last 2 days. So we
don't have attorney.
Mr. Arens. The thing we do not quite understand is your wife has
stated a few moments ago that 2 days ago she learned that she did
not have a firm commitment from counsel, as I understood her state-
ments.
Mr. Devtjnich. Yes.
Mr. Arens. I understood you to say just a moment ago that you
learned just last night that you did not have counsel.
Mr. Devunich. We wasn't sure 2 days ago and we hoped that we
would, and that is how we worked hard last night that we would have.
Mr. Arens. Do you want this conmiittee to make a solicitation to
the bar association or legal aid or some legal group in Pittsburgh for
the purpose of having them procure, if possible, a lawyer to represent
you in these proceedings ?
Mr. Devunich. We ourselves will try. Would you agree we our-
selves will try first ? We have this postponed, let's say, and we will
try it again.
Mr, Arens. You understand that the committee someplace along the
line has to insist upon your appearance; that a person could just
always say, "Well, I don't have a lawyer" ; and he would then be able
to forever avoid what would be regarded as a necessary appearance
before this committee. So I am trying here now to elicit from you
what your circumstances are on procuring a lawyer.
Mr. Willis. Let me put it this way, if agreeable to you. This is to
be the last day of the hearings here in Pittsburgh. You are entitled
to a lawyer. On the other hand, you cannot play fast and loose with
that, I hope you are not trying that, by making believe you don't
have a lawyer or can't get one when that is not true. We are looking
into it and I think you will be the loser if you tried. But if you hon-
estly want a lawyer you are entitled to one.
Now, would it be agreeable for you in your own way, right now,
to try to get a lawyer ? We will let you do it. And would you permit
counsel to phone the bar association and ask someone to get a lawyer
for you for this afternoon? So you will be working and we will be
trying also and if you get yours first, why, that would be fine. Would
that be all right with you ?
Mr. De\tjnich. We agree with that. The committee will try
Mr. Willis. You understand we want by all means, if possible, to
have your testimony during this day. You understand that?
40173—59 3
472 DENATURALIZATION AND DEPORTATION OF COMMUNISTS
Mr. De\tjnigii. I don't. I didn't understand, Mr. ChaiiTnan.
Mr. Willis. I said you must understand.
Mi-s. Devunich. We make contact with the bar association and we
woukl ^o to the bar association.
Mr. Arens. May I suggest this, so there will be no misunderstand-
ing about the arrangements? Would it be agreeable with you to
remain this morning in the courtroom? One of the members of the
staff will forthwith undertake to solicit from the bar association as-
signment of a lawyer, and then we will let you know what the result of
that conversation is. If you will just remain in the courtroom for,
let us say, an hour, we will do the best we can to solicit a lawyer and
then let the chairman and the committee see where we go from there.
Is that all right with you ?
Mr. De^ojnich. Yes.
Mr. Akens. Then, Mr. Chairman, I respectfully suggest that, for
the present at least, we defer the appearance of Mr. and Mrs.
Devunich.
Mr. Willis. Did they clearly understand you, because you deviated
from what I suggested. You understand that?
Mr. Arens. No, I did not understand it that way. I was just
suggesting if they remain in the courtroom we will forthwith put in
a telephone call to the bar association to see what could be developed
there.
Mr. Willis. He had asked if he could do some phoning. We cannot
deprive him of that. Mr. Devunich, you understand you are under
subpena. You have to be around. You have been served a paper by
the marshal of the United States. You are not released. You are
still under our jurisdiction.
Mr. Devunich. We understand.
Mr. Arens. May I suggest this, Mr. Chairman, that Mr. Margetich
escort the two witnesses, if it is agreeable with them, to the telephone
that is in the office adjoining the courtroom here?
Mr. Willis. And you put in a private telephone call right there.
Mr. Arens. Let them make any calls they want to. Let him, if
tigreeable to the chairman and them, make a call or two to the local
bar association, the legal aid, or any other entity of similar character
here that might be able to accommodate these witnesses. We will
not, of course, insist on your taking any particular lawyer or anything
of that kind. It is just an effort of the committee to be able to facili-
tate its work here in interrogating you with you having the privilege
of counsel.
Mr. Willis. All right.
Mrs. Devunich. Mr. Chairman, before we leave am I to under-
stand that you are going to contact the bar association or we should
contact the bar association ?
Mr. Willis. Both. You go over there and you can phone yourself.
Mrs. Devunich. I see.
Mr. Willis. Then our own staff member will also phone. Every-
body will be trying.
Mr. Arens. Mr, Chairman, I have just instructed Mr. Margetich
of this staff not to be in the presence of these two witnesses when they
are in personal conversation on the telephone to any lawyer.
Mr. Willis. All right.
Mr. Arens. Are you ready, Mr. Chairman, for another witness ?
DENATURALlZATlOlSr AND DEPORTATION OF COMMUNISTS 473
Mr. Willis. Yes.
Mr. Arens. Mr. Vincent Kemenovich, please come forward.
Mr. Willis. Please raise your right hand.
Do you solemnly swear that the testimony you are about to give
will be the truth, the whole truth, and nothing but the truth, so help
you God ?
Mr. ICJEMENOviCH. I do,
Mr. Willis. Please be seated.
TESTIMONY OF VINCENT KEMENOVICH, ACCOMPANIED BY
COUNSEL, HYMEN SCHLESINGER
Mr. Arens. Please identify yourself by name, residence, and occu-
pation.
Mr. I^MENOviCH. Do I have to stand when I
Mr. Arens. No ; you may be seated.
Mr. KJEMENOviCH. Yes. My name is Vincent Kemenovich. I re-
side at 207 Brinton Avenue, Trafford, Pa., and I am a factory worker,
employed in a factory.
Mr. Arens. You are appearing today, Mr. Kemenovich, in response
to a subpena which was served upon you by the House Committee on
Un-American Activities ?
Mr. Kemenovich. That is right.
Mr. Arens. And you are represented by counsel ?
Mr. Kemenovich. I am.
Mr. Arens. Counsel, will you kindly identify yourself on this
record ?
Mr. Schlesinger. Hymen Schlesinger, Pittsburgh, Pa.
Mr. Arens. Wliere were you born, Mr. Kemenovich ?
(The witness conferred with Ms counsel.)
Mr. Kemenovich. Mr. Chairman, in view of the fact that there is
litigation in my case which concerns my birthplace and so on, I feel
that anything I would say concerning this fact may adversely affect
my litigation in the other case. Therefore I claim the protection of
the fifth amendment.
Mr. Arens. Were you born in a country other than the country in
which you presently reside, the United States? In other words, were
you born in a foreign country ?
Mr. Kemenovich. I didn't understand the question.
Mr. Arens. Were you born in a foreign comitry, a country other
than tlie United States ?
(The witness conferred with his counsel.)
Mr. Kemenovich. Mr. Chairman, I am willing to answer this ques-
tion, only but it was not open this, am I answering this question does
not open the door to other additional questions in reference to the
same matter.
Mr. Arens. We won't work any kind of deal of that character at
all ; no, sir.
(The witness conferred with his counsel.)
Mr. I^MENOVECH. Then I claim the protection of the first and fifth
amendment.
Mr. Arens. Are you a citizen of the United States ?
(The witness conferred with his counsel. )
474 DENATURALIZATION AND DEPORTATION OF COMMUNISTS
Mr. Kemenovich. I claim the protection of the first and fifth
amendments.
Mr. Arens. How long have you lived in the United States ?
(The witness conferred with his counsel.)
Mr. Kemenovecii. Mr. Chairman, in view of the fact that all these
questions that you ask and others that you will continue to ask in this
line and direction have been answered and are a matter of record,
therefore I feel that to raise these questions here and take out matters
that have nothing to do with these questions will just make it more
difficult for me, and I am compelled to invoke my rights on the first
and fifth amendments.
Mr. Willis. Let me say this. As I indicated in my opening state-
ment this morning, we are not directing the questions having to do
with your particular case specifically, but what we are interested in
is to develop facts and circumstances, using your case simply as an
illustration, to try to see why administrative difficulties have been
encountered under the present law. In other words, the Congress of
the United States passed the law which permits the deportation of
certain people in certain cases, specified cases. Now, we know that
there were proceedings involving you. We are not directing ourselves
to your case in particular, but we want to find out the circumstances
in your case and then try to find out whether there is something
wrong with the law or whether it should be corrected. So do not
take this as though it is directed as a rehash of your case. We have
nothing to do with the administration of the law. We are trying to
develop facts to know whether we should amend those laws. That is
the basis for the inquiry.
Mr. Arens. Mr. Chairman, perhaps I could supplement your ob-
servation so that the pertinency of these questions and the relevancy
of the subject under inquiry are absolutely clear.
It is the information of this committee, sir, that you have been
identified repeatedly by live witnesses under oath, who are responsi-
ble, credible witnesses, as a person who has been a member of the
Communist Party.
Mr. Kemenovich. By Cvetic.
Mr. Arens. It is further the information of this committee that
since January 14, 1952, there has been outstanding in your case a war-
rant of deportation for the purpose of attempting to effect your de-
portation from this country as an alien Communist.
It is further the information of this committee that the Immigra-
tion and Naturalization Service, notwithstanding its very efficient,
dedicated efforts in attempting to effect your deportation pursuant to
the law, has been unable to do so.
It is further the information of this committee that the chief prob-
lem in your case which has precluded your deportation as an alien
Communist since the order of deportation was issued in 1952 was
because there is an exceeding difficulty in procuring travel documents,
in that the Iron Curtain country from which you came will not issue
travel documents for your admission. That all of these matters have
been finally adjudicated up to the very moment.
Now, I should like to ask you, sir, have you ever applied since 1952
for travel documents to any foreign country ?
(The witness conferred with his counsel.)
DENATURALIZATION AND DEPORTATION OF COMMUNISTS 475
Mr. Kemenovich. Mr. Chairman, I am compelled to state here that
answering this question would lead to additional questions that would,
in turn, make it possible for an agency, not necessarily this committee,
to further persecute me. Therefore I invoke the fifth amendment.
Mr. Arens. Since tne time the order of deportation was issued
against you and since the conclusion of all the administrative processes
in your case resulting in a final order of deportation, have you been
engaged in Communist Party activities in the Pittsburgh area?
(The witness conferred with his counsel.)
Mr. Kemenovich. Mr. Chairman, this question is also in line with
the other questions asked as for the purpose of further opening the
door for my persecution. I feel that to answer I would be helping to
violate the first and fifth amendments. Therefore, I decline to answer
on the basis of the first and fifth.
Mr. Arens. Mr. Chairman, I think that I could clarify the record
on the history of the case a little better than I have done heretofore.
Mr. Willis. Ask him specific questions, a few of them: Was he
ordered deported ? When ? Has he been a Communist ? Has there
been a deportation order ?
Mr, Arens. All right, sir.
Was a warrant of arrest issued by the Immigration and Naturaliza-
tion Service in your case on September 19, 1949, on the ground that
you were a member of a group advocating the overthrow of the Gov-
ernment by force and violence ? Is that a fact ?
(The witness conferred with his counsel.)
Mr. Kemenovich. Mr. Chairman, the question put to me is very
objectionable for the simple reason that the committee has the record
and the record is a matter of the committee records that it is going
to submit to the Congress upon which they will base any changes in
the law and so and so on; and, therefore, to put that question to me
at the open hearings of this type w^ithout giving me an opportunity
to bring defense of myself, I don't think it is fair. I don't think it
is proper and I refuse to become part of this, really part of this
persecution of other people who might be in the same shoes as I am
and who are just as innocent as I am. Therefore I claim the first and
fifth amendments.
Mr. Arens. Was your case completely adjudicated by the Immi-
gration Service over the course of many years?
(The witness conferred with his counsel.)
Mr. Kemenovich. I personally don't see that any benefit is going
to be derived by this committee or me in answering your question.
Therefore I claim the first and fifth.
Mr. Willis. It is a fact, is it not, that the Immigration Service
gave you an opportunity to submit all the evidence you had in con-
nection with whether or not you should be deported and that they
heard your side and presented their evidence and they decided you
should be deported ? Now, is that not a fact ?
Mr. Kemenovich. Will you ask the question again? I was dis-
tracted for a second.
Mr. Willis. Is it not a fact that the Immigi-ation Service after
servicing the case and going through whatever the law requires — is it
not a fact that they entered an order requiring you to be deported?
(The witness conferred with his counsel.)
476 DENATURALIZATION AND DEPORTATION OF COMMUNISTS
Mr. Kemenovich. Mr. Chairman, I don't want to stand here defi-
nitely as if I am defying this committee, the Congress of the United
States, and so on and so on. I don't want anybody to get that idea.
Yet I can safely say that I haven't had court.
(The witness conferred further with his counsel.)
Mr. Kemenovich. Mr, Chairman, as much as I hate to, because I
would like to very much state my case, but to answer your question at
the moment without due explanation will certainly jeopardize me
because I will leave myself open to many other questions. Therefore,
I respectfully claim the protection of the first and fifth amendment.
Mr. Willis. I think, from the questions of our counsel, it ap-
pears to be a fact that the Immigration Service entered an order a
long time ago for your deportation ; and now what I wanted to find
out was why you have not been deported. Do you have any reasons
why?
(The witness conferred with his counsel.)
Mr. Kemenovich. Mr. Chairman, to ask me that question, I cer-
tainly don't know. I mean I am not qualified to answer.
Mr. Arens. Mr. Chairman, I should like to explain the pertinency
and relevancy of this series of questions on this record and I shall read
now the excerpts.
Mr. Kemenovich. Mr. Arens, I am sorry, but I didn't — you inter-
rupted me. I thought — give me courtesy.
Mr. Arens. I beg pardon. I am sorry. I was answering the chair-
man. Proceed.
Mr. Kemenovich. I am not a trained lawyer. I am a factory
worker and I lost my trends of thoughts and I don't want to repeat
myself.
Mr. Arens. Perhaps you will pick up the thread of thought in a few
minutes.
I should like now to explain for the record the pertinency and rele-
vancy of the question to the subject under inquiry. The case history
here, sir, of your case taken from the record of the Immigration and
Naturalization Service is as follows: That on September 19, 1949, a
warrant of arrest was issued by the Immigration and Naturalization
Service for your arrest and deportation as an alien Communist who,
after entry, was a member of a group advocating overthrow of the
Government by force and violence. Thereafter, there was a hearing
on January 9, 1951, in which you were ordered deported. At that time
the Immigration Service produced testimony from five live, competent
witnesses respecting your Communist Party affiliations and activity.
Since then, just 2 days ago in these proceedings here in Pittsburgh
two other competent, honorable witnesses have identified you as a
known Communist.
Thereafter, on June 21, 1951, you were again ordered deported,
from which an appeal was taken on July 6, 1951. Thereafter, on
January 4, 1952, the matter was adjudicated by the Board of Immi-
gration Appeals and the appeal taken by yourself was dismissed.
Thereafter, on January 14, 1952, a warrant of deportation was issued.
Thereafter, on October 8, 1953, there was a denial of your applica-
tion for a stay under a section of the law which prohibits deportation
DENATURALIZATION AND DEPORTATION OF COMMUNISTS 477
of an individual irrespective of his Communist affiliations if his depor-
tation would result in personal persecution.
Now, the intent and purpose of our questions is to ascertain what
you have been doing since the final order of deportation, since all of
these proceedings have been concluded back in 1953, whether or not
you have continued Communist Party functions and Communist Party
activities and to explore with you to get by direction, if possible, and
if not possible, by indirection, the causes as to why your deportation
from this country has not been effected. One of the reasons we under-
stand is that there has been an exceeding difficulty in procuring travel
documents from Yugoslavia, the country from which you came— all
for the purpose of assembling- information which may be taken by this
subcommittee back to Washington to attempt, if possible, to devise
legislative provisions so as to tighten up on Communists who have, as
the chairman said in his opening statement here today, been pene-
trating this country for the purpose of carrying on the work of the
international Communist conspiracy.
Now, sir, with that question thoroughly explained, at least to the
best of my competency in this record as to its pertinency and rele-
vancy, I ask you, have you been engaged in Communist Party activi-
ties since October 8, 1953 ?
(The witness conferred with his counsel.)
Mr. Kemenovich. Mr. Chairman, the question that Mr. Arens put
to me
Mr. Willis. A little louder, please.
Mr. Kemenovich. The question that Mr. Arens put to me doesn't
make me feel that my answer will help me or the committee to clarify
anything, I think. Therefore, I claim the fifth amendment.
Mr. Arens. The second question I should like to ask you, which is
thoroughly germane to this subject under inquiry is : To your knowl-
edge have any travel documents been issued in your case by any
country permitting your entry into that country pursuant to the
order of deportation ?
(The witness conferred with his counsel.)
Mr. I^jjmenovich. Mr. Chairman, I am quite certain that the com-
mittee has access to the documents to which I have no access, such
as immigration files, and they should be more qualified to find this
information, as I have none on this subject. Therefore I claim the
fifth amendment.
Mr. Arens. Have you taken any steps to preclude the issuance of
travel documents or to stop the issuance of travel documents by any
country since the order of deportation was made final ?
(The witness conferred with his counsel.)
Mr. Kemenovich. I claim the protection of the fifth amendment.
Mr. Arens. And the final question: Are you now, this minute, a
member of the Communist Party ?
Mr. Kemenovich. Fifth amendment.
Mr. Arens. Mr. Chairman, I respectfully suggest that will con-
clude the staff interrogation of this witness.
Mr. Willis. The witness is excused.
Mr. Arens. Mr. Chairman, please, I have just been advised by Mr.
Margetich of this staff that in the case of the first two witnesses who
were called this morning, Mr. and Mrs. Devunich, arrangements have
been made for them to very promptly confer with a representative of
478 DENATURALIZATION AND DEPORTATION OF COMMUNISTS
the local lawyers' association; and I therefore respectfully request,
Mr. Chairman, that they be released from appearance until the after-
noon session. It is now 5 minutes of 11. If they are now released I
would speculate they could be conferring with the attorney for another
half hour or so, and that would give them ample time, I imagine, un-
less he determines otherwise, to make arrangements of some kind
with him for an appearance.
I respectfully suggest that, if agreeable with you, their appearance
pursuant to their subpena be deferred until 2 o'clock this afternoon.
Mr. Willis, It is so ordered.
Mr. Arens. Mr. Chairman, I respectfully suggest that the next
witness be Katherine Kemenovich.
Mr. Willis. Please raise your right hand.
Do you solemnly swear that the testimony you are about to give wiU
be the truth, the whole truth, and nothing but the truth, so help you
God?
Mrs. Kemenovich. I do.
TESTIMONY OF KATHERINE KEMENOVICH, ACCOMPANIED BY
COUNSEL, HYMEN SCHLESINGER
Mr. Arens. Please identify yourself by name, residence, and occu-
pation.
Mrs. Kemenovich. Katherine Kemenovich, 207 Brinton Avenue,
Trafford, housewife.
Mr. Arens. You are appearing today, Mrs. Kemenovich, in response
to a subpena which was served upon you by this committee i
Mrs. Kemenovich. Yes.
Mr. Arens. And you are represented by counsel ?
Mrs. Kemenovich. Yes.
Mr. Arens. Counsel, please identify yourself.
Mr. Schlesinger. Hymen Schlesinger, Pittsburgh, Pa.
Mr. Arens. Solely for the purpose of identification are you the wife
of the man who preceded you to the stand, Mr. Vincent Kemenovich ?
( The witness conferred with her counsel. )
Mrs. Kemenovich. If it doesn't open any door, I will answer it.
Mr. Arens. It is only for the purpose of identification I asked that
question.
Mrs. Kemenovich. Yes.
Mr. Arens. Where were you bom ?
( The witness conferred with her counsel. )
Mrs. Kemenovich. Well, then it was Austria-Hungary and now it is
Yugoslavia.
Mr. Arens. When did you come to the United States ?
Mrs. Kemenovich. 1921.
Mr. Arens. Did you come for permanent residence then ?
Mrs, Kemenovich. Yes.
Mr. Arens. Are you a citizen of the United States ?
Mrs, Kemenovich, Yes.
Mr. Arens. By naturalization ?
Mrs, Kemeno\t^ch. Yes.
Mr. Arens. Where and when were you naturalized?
(The witness conferred with her comisel.)
DENATURALIZATION AND DEPORTATION OF COMMUNISTS 479
Mrs. Kemenovich. If it doesn't open any door I will answer it.
Mr, Arens. I am not making any commitments here as to what
doors are or are not being opened. I am asking you only, without
reservation and without equivocation, when and where were you
naturalized ?
(The witness conferred with her counsel.)
Mrs. Kemenovich. I claim the protection of the fifth and first
amendments.
Mr. Arens. Do you honestly apprehend that if you told this com-
mittee truthfully, while you were under oath, when and where you
were naturalized as a citizen of the United States you would be sup-
plying information that might be used against you in a criminal
proceeding ?
(The witness conferred with her counsel.)
Mrs. Kemenovich. It would be a link in the chain which would
incriminate me.
Mr. Arens. Were you naturalized in Steubenville, Ohio, on June
10, 1941 ?
(The witness conferred with her counsel.)
Mr. Arens. Excuse me. Did you file a petition for naturalization
at Steubenville, Ohio, on June 10, 1941 ?
(The witness conferred with her counsel.)
Mre. Kemenovich. First and fifth amendments.
Mr. Arens. Were you admitted to citizenship on September 3,
1941 ?
(The witness conferred with her coimsel.)
Mrs. Kemenovich. First and fifth amendments.
Mr. Abens. At the time of your naturalization were you a mem-
ber of the Communist Party ?
(The witness conferred with her counsel.)
Mrs. Kemenovich. The answer is the same.
Mr. Arens. Are you cognizant of the program of the Communist
Party in which it advocates, and has advocated, the overthrow of the
Government of the United States by force and violence ?
(The witness conferred with her counsel.)
Mrs. Kemenovich. The answer is the same.
Mr. Arens. Now, do you honestly apprehend that if yovi told this
committee truthfully, while you are under oath, whether or not at
the time of your naturalization you knew that the Communist Party
advocated the overthrow of this Government by force and violence
you would be supplying information which might be used against
you in a criminal proceeding ?
(The witness conferred with her counsel.)
Mrs. Kemenovich. It could be a link in the chain.
Mr. Arens. According to the files of the Immigration and Natu-
ralization Service in your case — which I assert now is only typical
of numerous cases, as was the case of your husband typical of numer-
ous deportation cases — on June 10, 1941, you filed a petition for natu-
ralization at Steubenville, Ohio; on September 3, 1941, you were
admitted to citizenship and took an oath to support and defend the
Constitution of the United States; that on August 13, 1954, a com-
plaint or petition was filed by the Iimnigration Service here in
Pittsburgh to revoke your citizenship, alleging that your naturaliza-
40173—59 4
480 DENATURALIZATION AND DEPORTATION OF COMMUNISTS
tion was procured illegally in that you concealed at the time that you
were a member of the Communist Party. Thereafter, in April 1958,
just last year, this case was dismissed and was not reinstituted in
light of certain decisions by the courts on the issue of attempting to
prove that you were not only a member of the Communist Party
at the time of your naturalization but that you subjectively knew
that the Communist Party engaged in the advocacy of the overthrow
of this Government by force and violence.
Have I recited so far as your recognition is concerned the essence
of your case ?
Mrs. KJEMENOvicH. First and fifth amendments.
Mr. Akens. Do you know a lady by the name of Mary Golden ?
(The witness conferred with her counsel.)
Mrs. IvEMENovicH. First and fifth amendments.
Mr. Akens. Are you now, this minute, a member of the Commu-
nist Party ?
Mrs. Kemenovich, The answer is the same.
Mr. Arens. Mr. Chairman, I respectfully suggest that in the pres-
ence of this witness Mrs. Golden be requested to come forward just
for the purpose of identification.
Mr. Willis. Mrs. Golden.
TESTIMONY OF MARY GOLDEN— Resumed
Mr. Willis. Mrs. Golden, you have been previously sworn on this
record ?
Mrs. Golden. Yes.
Mr. Akens. You testified a couple of days ago respecting your par-
ticipation in the Communist Party at the behest of the Federal
Bureau of Investigation ; is that correct ?
Mrs. Golden. That is right, sir.
Mr. Akens. During the course of your membership and participa-
tion in the Communist Party, did you know as a Communist a person
by the name of Katherine Kemenovich ?
Mrs. Golden. I did.
Mr. Akens. "V\^ien did you last see her as a Communist and work
with her as a Communist ?
Mrs. Golden. Last Saturday in Hymen Schlesinger's office.
Mr. Akens. Was that a Communist Party meeting in which you
were a participant?
Mrs. Golden. Yes, sir.
Mr. Arens, In passing, may I ask when was the Communist Party
meeting last Saturday set up ; when were the arrangements made for
the Communist Party meeting ?
Mrs. Golden. The arrangements were made the Saturday that they
had the meeting for the Independent Voters League. My husband
was told that he would be called by Alex Staber and told when the
meeting was to take place.
Mr. Arens. Who notified you to come to the meeting ?
Mrs. Golden. Alex Staber.
Mr. Arens. Was the meeting, as you miderstand it, to be a Com-
munist Party meeting or was it to be something else ?
Mrs. Golden. It was a meeting.
DENATURALIZATION AND DEPORTATION OF COMMUNISTS 481
Mr. Arens. And did you go there with any idea that you were there
in the status of a client with an attorney, or did you go there, on the
other hand, with the contemplation that you were there to attend a
cell meeting of a Communist fraction ?
Mrs. Golden. We had no intention of obtaining a lawyer. It was
a meeting.
Mr. Arens. Was it, and I shall not burden you with the details,
but was it in all essence a functional meeting of the Communist
Party?
Mrs. Golden. Yes, sir.
Mr. Arens. In which those attending participated as comrades ?
Mrs. Golden. Yes, sir.
Mr. Arens. Now, at that meeting, did you see Katherine Kemeno-
vich ?
Mrs. Golden. Yes, sir.
Mr. Arens. Did she participate in that meeting as a comrade?
Mrs. Golden. Yes, sir.
Mr. Arens. Was that meeting called and promoted and developed
for the purpose of devising a Communist program and Communist
objectives and Communist strategy, particularly with reference to
these hearings ?
Mrs. Golden. Yes, sir.
Mr. Arens, Was there discussed in the meeting other Communist
activities and other Communist programs ?
Mrs. Golden. Yes, sir.
Mr. Arens. Thank you, Mrs. Golden.
TESTIMONY OF KATHERINE KEMENOVICH— Eesumed
Mr. Arens. Mrs. Kemenovich, just to bring your case, as a typical
case, down to date so that this committee will have factual informa-
tion in this typical case — and I emphasize the word "typical" — when
it returns to Washington to deliberate on tightening the laws, if pos-
sible, to cope with the Communist menace, may I ask you, was Mrs.
Golden in error, or was she accurate, a moment ago when she said, in
essence, that in the course of the last several days she attended" a Com-
munist meeting with you here in Pittsburgh and identified you as a
member of the Communist Party ?
(The witness conferred with her counsel.)
Mrs. Kemenovich. I refuse to dignify the statement of a stool
pigeon. So I take the fifth and fii*st amendments.
Mr. Arens. Mr. Chairman, I respectfully suggest that will conclude
the staff interrogation of the witness.
Mr. Willis. The witness is excused.
We will take an informal recess for 5 minutes to give the reporter a
rest.
(Subcommittee members present: Representatives Willis and
Tuck.)
( Brief recess. )
(Subcommittee members present: Representatives Willis and
Tuck.)
Mr. Willis. The subcommittee will please come to order.
Please call your next witness.
482 DENATURALIZATION AND DEPORTATION OF COMMTJNISTS
Mr. Akens. If you please, Mr. Chairman, the next witness will be
Alex Roth Rakosi.
Mr. Willis. Please raise your right hand.
Do you solemnly swear that the testimony you are about to give will
be the"^ truth, the whole truth, and nothing but the truth, so help you
God?
Mr. Rakosi. I do.
Mr. Willis. Do you object to being photographed ?
Mr. Rakosi. There is no use objecting, sir, because they are taking
it anyway.
TESTIMONY OP ALEX ROTH RAKOSI, ACCOMPANIED BY COUNSEL,
HYMEN SCHLESINGER
Mr. Arens. Please identify yourself by name, residence, and occu-
pation.
Mr. Rakosi. Alex Roth Rakosi, 440 Lincoln Highway, Irwin, Pa.,
home unprovement, house repairs.
Mr. Arens. You are appearing today in response to a subpena
which was served upon you by this committee ?
Mr. Rakosi. Yes.
Mr. Arens. And you are represented by counsel ?
Mr. Rakosi. Yes.
Mr. Arens. Comisel, please identify yourself.
Mr, Sciilesinger. Hymen Schlesinger, Pittsburgh, Pa.
Mr. Arens. How did you pronounce your name? I do not want
to mispronounce it.
Mr. Rakosi. Rakosi.
Mr. Arens. Have you ever been known by any other name ?
(The witness conferred with his counsel.)
Mr. Rakosi. Sir, my name is Alex Roth Rakosi.
Mr. Arens. Have you ever been known by any other name ?
Mr. Rakosi. Let me say this, sir: In answering your question as
to my conclusion in my answer I would like to recall that Jesus, Son
of Mary, when He was confronted with His inquisitors like I am here
now with a question, He remained silent. That was the fifth amend-
ment of His time. In answering your question, I respectfully claim
the first amendment and the fifth amendment.
Mr. Arens. Are you a now a member of a godless conspiracy that
denies the existence of God and is dedicated to the overthrow of this
Government by force and violence ?
(The witness conferred with his counsel.)
Mr. Rakosi. See. This is an attempt of the committee to inject re-
ligious issues.
Mr. Willis. We will not tolerate any audible comment from the
audience.
Mr. Arens. Are you now a member of the Communist Party ?
Mr. Rakosi. The founder of this State if I recall in the I7th cen-
tury, William Penn, and his Friends took the fif tli amendment of their
time. I avail myself of the privilege of taking the fifth amendment.
Mr. Arens. Where were you born ?
(The witness conferred with his counsel.)
Mr. Rakosi. Mr. Counsel, I am sure that you know where I was
born, but solely for identification I was born in Hungary,
DENATURALIZATION AND DEPORTATION OF COMMUNISTS 483
Mr. Arens. When?
(The witness conferred with his counsel.)
Mr. Rakosi. If this question doesn't open any doors
Mr. Arens. Now let the record be clear. We are making no deals.
( The witness conferred further with his counsel. )
Mr. Arens. And will not be precluded by any answer you give.
Mr. Rakosi. If this question doesn't open any doors
Mr. Arens. Do not let your hypothesis there assume any restraint
on the part of this committee from pursuing any objective that we
legitimately can pursue.
Mr. Rakosi. I appreciate your effort to confuse me, sir. And I am
confused. I am confused very much.
Mr. Arens. Please tell us when you were born.
Mr. Rakosi. I am confused. I am harassed. Your methods made
me penniless. So please— the photographers are all around me here.
I don't know whether I am a boy or a girl. I don't even know what
I want to say.
Mr. Arens. Do you know when you were born ?
Mr. Rakosi. I was born in Himgary.
Mr. Arens. When ?
( The witness conferred with his counsel. )
Mr. Rakosi. This is a matter of record. Solely for identification,
sir, I was born in 1907.
Mr. Arens. When did you come to the United States for permanent
residence ?
(The witness conferred with his counsel.)
Mr. Rakosi. The same basis, that is if it doesn't open a door for
further harassment. To my recollection I came to this country in
1923.
Mr. Aeens. Are you a citizen of the United States ?
(The witness conferred with his counsel.)
Mr. Rakosi. For identification purposes, yes.
Mr. Arens. Were you naturalized as a citizen ?
( The witness conferred with his counsel. )
Mr. Rakosi. Well, it is obvious from the fact that I was born in
another country.
Mr. Arens. Not necessarily. There is such a thing as derivative
citizenship. Now, when were you naturalized as a citizen in the
United States?
(The witness conferred with his counsel.)
Mr. Rakosi. Wliat was the question, sir ?
Mr. Arens. Wlien were you naturalized as a citizen ?
Mr. Rakosi. Sir, I listened to the opening remarks of the chairman,
and I just can't see what this question has anything to do with why
I was called here.
Mr. Arens. I will explain it to you.
Mr. Rakosi. And for this reason, sir, before you explain
Mr. Arens. I will explain it to you right now.
Mr. Rakosi. Before you explain, I want to finish. I invoke the
fifth amendment privilege.
Mr. Arens. Now I am going to explain to you because you don't
understand what we are doing here apparently. At least you assert
you do not.
484 DENATURALIZATION AND DEPORTATION OF COMMUNISTS
It is the information of this committee, taken from the records of
the Immigration and Naturalization Service in your case, which we
are advised is typical of numerous cases, that on May 17, 1938, you
filed a peition for naturalization.
Mr. Rakosi. When was that, sir ?
Mr.AitENs. May 17, 1938; is that correct?
(The witness conferred with his counsel.)
Mr. Willis. When you filed a petition.
Mr. Arens. Is that correct?
Mr. Rakosi. I just— I didn't hear, sir. I am a little hard of hearing.
Mr. Arens. May 17, 1938, you filed a petition for naturalization to
become a citizen of this great Republic ; on January 5, 1940, you took
an oath to be a loyal American, to defend and support the Constitution
of the United States against all enemies foreign and domestic; that
you at that time — I do not have the exact language — asserted that you
were not then a member of any organization dedicated to the over-
throw of this Government by force and violence ; and that you were
then admitted to citizenship.
It is further the information of this committee, taken from the rec-
ords of the Immigration and Naturalization Service in this typical
case, that on May 5, 1954, a complaint was filed in the United States
District Court here in Pittsburgh, alleging that you procured citizen-
ship illegally in that you concealed from the Government that you were
a member of the Communist Party as of the time you took that oath.
It is the further information of this committee, also taken from the rec-
ords of the Immigration and Naturalization Service, that due to cer-
tain judicial decisions which had in the meantime been handed down,
it was virtually impossible for the Immigration and Naturalization
Service to proceed in your case, notwithstanding the fact that they had
then live witnesses of proven integrity who were prepared to testify
under oath that they knew you as a member of the Communist Party
as of the time you took that oath.
Since then, sir, just a couple of days ago, there appeared before this
committee a lady who had served in the Communist Party at the behest
of the Federal Bureau of Investigation. She testified under oath that
she knew you as a member of the Communist Party, active in the Com-
munist Party ; and she gave considerable information respecting your
participation in that conspiratorial organization.
Now, notwithstanding the fact that your denaturalization case has
been dismissed, it is the intent of this committee — by indirection, prob-
ably, and by direction, if possible — to get such information as may be
available from you to enable this committee, when it returns to Wash-
ington, to appraise this typical case and attempt, if it can, to devise
legislative provisions so as to tighten up and facilitate, within the
framework of fair play, the processes of this Government so that it can
rid itself of Communist traitors who have in the past and are to this
day penetrating our defenses for the objective of subverting this great
Republic in the interest of a godless international conspiracy.
_ Now, sir, with that explanation, I should like to ask you : At the
time you took your oath as a citizen of the United States on January 5,
1940, were you then a member of this atheistic conspiracy known as the
Communist Party ?
DENATURALIZATION AND DEPORTATION OF COMMUNISTS 485
Mr. Rakosi. Sir, with these long speeches I just understand that the
motive of this committee is to harass, to ruin people, their lives, liveli-
hoods.
Mr. Arens. Would you kindly answer the question ?
(The witness conferred with his counsel.)
Mr. Rakosi. And I am not going to give any help to help you to
ruin the lives of innocent people, and I respectfully claim the fifth
amendment.
Mr. Arens. Have you been engaging in Communist Party activities
since the dismissal of the denaturalization proceedings against you?
Mr. Rakosi. I claim the fifth amendment.
Mr. Arens. Have you been back to your native Hungary at any
time since you left there ?
(The witness conferred with his counsel.)
Mr. Rakosi. I imagine this committee has the record of — I claim
the fifth amendment.
Mr. Arens. "V\nien were you last absent from the United States ?
(The witness conferred with his counsel.)
Mr. Rakosi. I claim the fifth amendment.
Mr. Arens. Have you been absent from the United States at any
time in the course of the last 5 years ?
Mr. Rakosi. I claim the fifth amendment.
Mr. Arens. Are you, or have you been in the last few years, active
in the American Committee for Protection of Foreign Born ?
(The witness conferred with his counsel.)
Mr. Rakosi. I claim the first and fifth amendments.
Mr. Arens. Wliat was your employment immediately prior to
your present employment ?
(The witness conferred with his counsel.)
Mr. Rakosi. I claim the fifth amendment.
Mr. Arens. Have you been engaged in any publishing work, any
writing, editing, anything of that character ?
(The witness conferred with his counsel.)
Mr. Rakosi. Is there any freedom of the press ?
Mr. Arens. Yes, sir, and there is also freedom of inquiry by this
committee to undertake to determine what Commmiists are domg to
subvert this great Nation.
Mr. Rakosi. Then I claim the first and fifth amendments.
Mr. Arens. I put it to you as a fact, sir, that you were for 5 years
on the editorial staff of a Hungarian language paper in Cleveland
and tliat you were, thereafter, a reporter and writer for the Com-
munist Daily Worker and managing editor of a Hungarian news-
paper in New York City, all or part of the time prior to the time you
came to Pittsburgh. If that is not true, please deny it while you are
under oath.
(The witness conferred with his counsel.)
Mr. Rakosi. That question is direct interference with my privilege.
The freedom of speech, press is concerned as you very well know.
I claim the first and fifth amendments.
Mr. Arens. How old were you when you came to the United States ?
I want to be sure I have that on the record. I could figure it from the
date of your birth, date of admission. I think you could help me on
that, if you please.
486 DENATURALIZATION AND DEPORTATION OF COMMUNISTS
Mr. Kakosi. It would have been much faster and saved money of
the Government and taxpayers if you would have looked it up. But
to help you for identification only— now let's see how old was? Do
I have to be exact? . . .„
Mr. Arens. No; your best recollection or approximation, it you
please, sir.
Mr. Rakosi. Yes ; about 15.
Mr. Arens. Were you educated in the United States after you
arrived here ? Did you go to school here ?
Mr. Rakosi. No; I am getting an education here now, from this
committee, education in harassment.
Mr. Arens. Would you kindly answer the question ?
Mr. Rakosi. What was the question, sir ?
Mr. Arens. The question is. Did you attend school in the United
States after you arrived here ?
(The witness conferred with his counsel.) _
Mr. Rakosi. You mean by that, sir, a public school ?
Mr. Arens. We will start with that ; yes.
Mr. Rakosi. All right. And where will we finish, sir ?
Mr. Arens. Now, would you kindly answer the question. Did you
attend public schools?
Mr. Rakosi. Well, to the best recollection, I went to an unsegre-
gated public school in East Pittsburgh, unsegregated, for about 6
months or so. I don't recall. I have to look it up.
Mr. Arens. Was this a high school ?
Mr. Rakosi. It wasn't a high school. Public school.
Mr. Arens. Did that complete your formal education, public edu-
cation ? I should say education in a public school.
Mr. Rakosi. My public education, as I said before, is being con-
tinued here today, sir, and yesterday.
Mr. Arens. Did that complete your formal education m the public-
school system, is what I am asking.
(The witness conferred with his counsel.)
Mr. Rakosi. As far as I recollect.
Mr. Arens. Have you attended any other schools, training schools
of any variety, since you completed your "formal education in the
public schools?
( The witness conferred with his counsel. )
Mr. Rakosi. Sir, I do not admit whether I did or did not, and this
is, after all, none of the business of this committee, and I claim the
first and fifth amendments. . .
Mr. Arens. Have you attended any Communist Party training
schools since you completed your formal education in the public
school system ? Please answer that question.
Mr. Rakosi. I claim the first and fifth amendments. I claim the
first and fifth amendments.
Mr. Arens. Are you now, this very minute, a member of the Com-
munist Party ?
(The witness conferred with his counsel.)
Mr. Rakosi. AVell, of course, you must know that this is an im-
proper question, sir. Do I have any rights under the first and fifth
amendments ? I claim the first and fifth amendments.
Mr. Arens. Mr. Chairman, I respectfully suggest that will conclude
the staff interrogation of this wi I ness.
DENATURALIZATION AND DEPORTATION OF COMMUNISTS 487
Mr. Willis. The witness is excused.
Mr. Arens. The next witness, if you please, Mr. Chairman, will
by Mr. Allan McNeil.
Would you kindly come forward? The name, according to our
record here, is James Allan Donald McNeil.
Mr. Willis. Please raise your right hand, sir. Do you solemnly
swear that the testimony you are about to give will be the truth, the
whole truth, and nothing but the truth, so help you God ?
Mr. McNeil. I do.
TESTIMONY OF JAMES ALLAN DONALD McNEIL, ACCOMPANIED
BY COUNSEL, HYMEN SCHLESINGER
Mr. Arens. Please identify yourself by name, residence, and occu-
pation.
Mr. McNeil. My name is Allan D. McNeil. My residence is 3444
Ward Stret, Pittsburgh, and I am unemployed.
Mr. Arens. You are appearing today, Mr. McNeil, in response to
a subpena which was served upon you by the House Committee on
Un-American Activities ?
Mr. McNeil. That is correct.
Mr. Arens. And you are represented by counsel ?
Mr. McNeil. That is right.
Mr. Arens. Counsel, kindly identify yourself.
Mr. Schlesinger. Hymen Schlesinger, Pittsburgh, Pa.
Mr. Arens. Have you been known by any name other than the name
to which you just responded, Mr. McNeil ?
Mr. McNeil. Mr. Chairman, I must claim the first and fifth amend-
ments on this question.
Mr. Arens. Where were you born and when ?
(The witness conferred with his counsel.)
Mr. McNeil. Mr. Chairman, there is at present in progress sonie
litigation with the Immigration Service in my case. Because of this
fact, any questions relative to this business I must answer with the
first and fifth amendments.
Mr. Arens. Were you born outside the United States ?
Mr. McNeil. My answer is the same.
Mr. Arens. When did you come to the United States ?
Mr. McNeil. My answer is the same.
Mr. Arens. Are you a citizen of the United States ?
Mr. McNeil. I answer the same.
Mr. Arens. Have you ever been naturalized ?
Mr. McNeil. I answer the same, sir.
Mr. Arens. Mr. McNeil, I should like to recite to you certain ele-
ments in the case of yourself which we have procured from the Immi-
gration and Naturalization Service. It is the basis on which I speak.
Mr. McNeil. Before you do, Mr. Arens
Mr. Arens. On the basis of which I propose to interrogate you on
certain matters.
Mr. McNeil. Before you do, Mr. Arens, may I appeal to the Chair ?
Mr. Arens is now going to recite, apparently, matters that are still
in litigation, and he is now going to put in the record, I presume,
alleged facts ; and I think that this is highly irregular, sir, and I ask
you please to exercise your authority and stop it.
488 DENATURALIZATION AND DEPORTATION OF COMMUNISTS
Mr. Arens. Mr. Chairman, I believe the record will be clear after
I make my explanation, here as to why this witness is here and the
status of his case.
Mr. McNeil. I must again, Mr. Chairman, appeal to you, sir, please.
Mr. Willis. Well, Mr. Arens apparently disagrees with you.
Mr. McNeil. Mr. Chairman
Mr. Arens. Before I pose any more questions to the-
Mr. McNeil. It is you has the authority, not Arens, in this matter.
Mr. Arens. Before I pose any more questions to the witness, the
explanation I believe should be in the record and then the chairman
may make a determination, if you desire, Mr. Chairman, as to whether
or not you would like to proceed with this interrogation.
It is the information of this coinmittee, taken from the records of
the Immigration and Naturalization Service, sir, that you were born
in India — in Calcutta, India ; that you came to the United States in
1920 in transit as a seaman ; that in 1937 you went to Spain and par-
ticipated in the Abraham Lincoln Brigade and there assumed the name
of Allen Johnson, and were given a status by the Communist brigade
there as Maj. Allen Johnson. Thereafter, you came back to the
United States and returned again to Spain in 1939. In 1952, a war-
rant of arrest and deportation was served in your case, the grounds be-
ing that after reentry you were a member of the Communist Party.
Under the provisions of the Walter-McCaiTan Immigration and Na-
tionality Act you were ordered deported after all of the administrative
processes had been gone through with.
Mr. Willis. Wlien?
Mr. Arens. That was on June 6, 1954. That thereafter because of
a series of decisions by the courts the warrant of deportation was
withdrawn, giving a very brief summary of the case.
Mr. Willis. When was that?
Mr. Arens. January 8, 1957, the order of deportation was with-
drawn, sir.
Mr. Willis. Are there any actual pending proceedings before any
court against the man ?
Mr. Schlesinger. The warrant was not withdrawn. Your Honor.
The order of deportation was reversed and the proceedings remanded
to the Immigration Service and there is a hearing scheduled.
Mr. McNeil. April 20.
Mr. Schlesinger. April 20, 1956. I mean 1959. Next month.
Mr. McNeil. Mr. Chairman.
Mr. Arens. Mr. Chairman, I would say this. If the case is cur-
rently pending administratively or in the courts, I would respect-
fully suggest we suspend interrogating this witness. It was the infor-
mation which we have been assured is accurate
Mr. Willis. Let us get the record straight. Do you assert, as a
fact under oath, that some administrative steps or proceedings are
scheduled for a hearing either before a court or before the Immigra-
tion Service in April next ?
Mr. McNeil. April 20, to be precise. May I before
Mr. Arens. Under those circumstances
Mr. McNeil. Before Mr. Arens gets into it, may I please — L am
merely asking for a courtesy in this matter. Mr. Arens has sat here,
and I think it is a most inadvisable and highly dishonorable kind of
practice
DENATURALIZATION AND DEPORTATION OF COMMUNISTS 489
Mr. Willis. Now, wait a minute. Did you not hear what he just
suggested ?
Mr. McNeil. I understand it. After he gets the stuff in the record,
sir.
Mr. Willis. Now wait a minute.
Mr. Arens. I was going to suggest, Mr. Chairman, that if this
witness will testify under oath that there is some additional proceed-
ing which is yet to be held, something else to transpire, we do not
pursue or open up the questions which we were going to pose to the
man, which we have not yet even gotten into. On the other hand,
if the fact is, as we have been ad\dsed — at least my records reflect
here from the investigators who have been in contact with the Immi-
gration Service — that the warrant of deportation was withdrawn,
then I suggest we proceed.
I would respectfully suggest that we lean over backward in this
case, as we do in other cases, and avoid any possi'jle conflict with an
administrative proceeding.
Mr. McNeil. May I submit to this here ?
Mr. Arens. As' far as you blackening my character here, I am
used to that by traitors and Communists that appear before this com-
mittee, and it goes off my back like water off a duck.
Mr. McNeil. May I ask that be stricken from the record ?
Mr. Willis. You opened up the door, quite uncharitably.
What do you suggest, Mr. Arens ?
Mr. Arens. I suggest this man be continued under subpena, sub-
ject to the call of the Chair after such time as we are able to make a
determination if there is any additional administrative proceeding
pending in this matter.
Mr. Willis. That course will be followed and the subpena will re-
main outstanding,
Mr. ScHLEsiNGER. Your Honor, I might say — —
Mr. Willis. So the witness is excused.
Mr. ScHLESiNGER. There is a representative here of the ImmigTa-
tion Service.
Mr. Willis. You asked for a continuance. Now you just want to
have further debate. Tlie witness is excused. The witness is excused
under the conditions I have stated.
The subcommittee will stand in recess until 2 o'clock this afternoon.
(Whereupon, the subcommittee recessed at 12 o'clock, to reconvene
at 2 p.m. of the same day.)
AFTERNOON SESSION— THURSDAY, MARCH 12, 1959
(Subcommittee members present : Representatives Willis and Tuck.)
Mr. Willis. The subcommittee will please come to order.
Counsel, call your first witness.
Mr. Arens. Mrs. Anna Devunich, please come forward and remain
standing while the chairman administers an oath.
Mr. Willis. Please raise your right hand.
Do you solemnly swear that the testimony you are about to give
will be the truth, the whole truth, and nothing but the truth, so help
you God ?
Mrs. Devunich. I do.
490 DENATURALIZATION AND DEPORTATION OF COMMUNISTS
TESTIMONY OF ANNA DEVTJNICH, ACCOMPANIED BY COUNSEL,
HYMEN SCHLESINGER— Eesumed
Mr. Arens. Mrs. Devunicli, you have been previously sworn on this
record and liave testified to the effect that you did not have counsel
this morning. I was advised just a few minutes ago that you expressed
yourself to a member of this staff that you now have counsel and are
ready to proceed.
Mrs. Devunich. Yes. With your permission may I give you a
report on this, a slight report ?
Mr. Arens. Do you have counsel ?
Mrs. Devunich. Yes, we have counsel.
Mr. Arens. Would counsel for Mrs. Devunich please come forward ?
So that the record may not be confusing at this time, would it be
agreeable with you if we start all over again ?
Could you kindly identify yourself now by name, residence, and
occupation ?
(The witness conferred with her counsel.)
Mrs. Devunich. My name is Anna Devunich.
Mr. Arens. Would it be convenient for you to raise your voice a
little bit, please?
Mrs. Devunich. My name is Anna Devunich. I live at 221 Colum-
bia Avenue, Pittsburgh 29, Pa.
Mr. Arens. Your occupation, please ?
Mrs. Devunich. And my occupation is housewife.
Mr. Arens. You are appearing today, Mrs, Devunich, in response
to a subpena which has been served upon you ?
Mrs. Devunich. That is right.
Mr. Arens. And you are now represented by counsel?
(The witness conferred with her counsel.)
Mrs. Devunich. I would like to make a statement on that.
Mr. Arens. Are you represented by counsel ?
(The witness conferred with her counsel.)
Mrs. Devunich. I am represented by counsel.
Mr. Arens. Now, Counsel, will you kindly identify yourself on this
record ?
Mrs. Devunich. I am represented by counsel because I was unable
to secure another attorney.
Mr. Willis. All right; now. Counsel, will you identify yourself,
please ?
Mrs. Devunich. I did identify myself.
Mr. Willis. I am talking about your lawyer.
Mr. Schlesinger. Hymen Schlesinger, Pittsburgh, Pa.
Mr. Willis. Proceed.
Mr. Arens. "Wliere were you born ?
(The witness conferred with her counsel.)
Mrs. Devunich. I was born in Croatia, at that time known as Aus-
tria-Hungary.
Mr. Arens. When did you come to the United States for permanent
residence ?
(The witness conferred with her counsel.)
Mrs. Devunich. For identification purposes I came into the United
States of America in the year 1927.
DENATURALIZATION AND DEPORTATION OF COMMUNISTS 491
Mr. Arens. Are you a citizen of the United States ?
(The witness conferred with her counsel.)
Mrs. Devunich. For identification purposes, I am a citizen of this
great Nation.
Mr. Arens. Are you a citizen by naturalization ?
(The witness conferred with her counsel.)
Mrs. Devunich. For purposes of identification, yes.
Mr. Arens. "Where and when were you naturalized?
(The witness conferred with her counsel.)
Mrs. Devunich. I will answer this question if this line of ques-
tioning will not be pursued.
Mr. Arens. This committee will not make any deals. We will
ask all questions that are germane to the subject under inquiry pur-
suant to the duty that is imposed on this committee.
Mrs. Devunich. Because according to the Walter-McCarran Act,
my answer may be detrimental although the charges for denaturali-
zation have been dropped, they may be renewed. Therefore, I am
not in a position to answer these questions any further.
Mr. Arens. Have you in the course of the last 10 years
Mr. Willis. Now, she didn't specifically
Mr. Arens. She did not invoke the, constitutional privileges.
Mr. Willis. Right.
Mr. Arens. I therefore, Mr. Chairman, respectfully suggest you
order the witness to answer the last outstanding principal question.
Mr. Willis. Yes. I direct you to answer the question.
(The witness conferred with her counsel.)
Mrs. Devunich. Since the Bill of Rights gives me protection, I
now invoke the first and the fifth amendments to the Constitution
of the United States.
Mr. Arens. In the course of the last 10 years have you traveled
abroad ?
(The witness conferred with her counsel.)
Mrs. Devunich. I wish to invoke the fii'st and the fifth amendment
to the Constitution.
Mr. Arens. Do you honestly apprehend if you told this commit-
tee whether or not, in the course of the last several years, you have
traveled abroad, you would be supplying information that might
be used against you in a criminal proceeding?
Would you please answer the question?
Mrs. Devunich. I am sorry. I have forgotten what the question
was,
Mr. Arens. Do you honestly feel that if you told this committee
whether or not you have traveled abroad in the course of the last
several years, you would be supplying information which might be
used against you in a criminal proceeding?
(The witness conferred with her counsel.)
Mrs. Devunich. I am very sorry. Anything I would say might
be used. Therefore, I invoke the first and the fifth amendment.
Mr. Arens. I lay before you now, if you please, a photostatic repro-
duction of a passport application, bearing the signature of Anna
Devunich, applying for a passport to go to Yugoslavia, according to
this form, to visit relatives in Yugoslavia. The date of this passport
application is February 27, 1946. Kindly look at that document
492 DENATURALIZATION AND DEPORTATION OF COMMUNISTS
whicli I now display to you and tell this committee, while you are
under oath, whether or not that is a true and correct reproduction of
the passport application filed by you with the Department of State,
in which you allege that you wish a United States passport at that
time for the purpose of going to Yugoslavia to visit relatives.
(The witness conferred with her counsel.)
Mr. Willis. What is the date of that '^
Mr. Arens. 1946.
(The witness conferred with her counsel.)
Mrs. Devtjnich. Without recognizing or denying, the Supreme
Court of the United States said that everybody has a right to travel ;
and, as I see by the papers that Americans are going all over the world
everywhere, therefore I claim the first and the fifth amendment to
the Constitution.
(Document marked "Anna Devunich Exhibit No. 1" and retained
in committee files.)
Mr. Arens. Do you honestly apprehend that if you told this com-
mittee truthfully, while you are under oath, whether or not the docu-
ment which is now before you is a true and correct reproduction of a
passport application filed by yourself with the Department of State
in wdiich you solicited a passport on the pretense that you were to go
to Yugoslavia to visit relatives, you would be supplying information
which might be used against you in a criminal proceeding ?
(The witness conferred with her counsel.)
Mrs. Devunich. I am sorry, but any statement I would make may
be misused. Therefore, I claim the first and the fifth amendment to
the Constitution.
Mr. Arens. Did you, pursuant to a passport application, receive a
United States passport which would have permitted you to go on a
trip to Yugoslavia?
(The witness conferred with her counsel.)
Mrs. Devunich. Sir, the Supreme Court has said everj^one has a
right to a passport. Therefore, I claim the protection of the first
and fifth amendment to the Constitution.
Mr. Arens. Did you go to Yugoslavia to visit relatives ?
(The witness conferred with her counsel.)
Mrs. Deatjnich. Same answer,
Mr. Arens. Did you receive a passport ?
(The witness conferred with her counsel.)
Mrs. Devunich. Same answer.
Mr. Arens. Now I lay before you a thermof ax reproduction of an
article appearing in the Communist Daily Worker in 1948, "Delegates
Back From World's Women's Congress," in which it tells of a world
women's congress held at Budapest, Hungary, and lists a number of
persons who participated in that, including one "Ann Devunic,'* Pitts-
burgh, Pa.
Kindly look at this article which I shall now display to you, and
tell this committee, while you are under oath, whether or not the
facts recited in that article are substantially true and correct respect-
ing your participation in a women's congress in Budapest, Hungary.
(The Vv'itness conferred with her counsel.)
Mr. Arens. According to the article, too, may I add for the record,
it was under the auspices of a group known as the Congress of Ameri-
DENATURALIZATION AND DEPORTATION OF COMMUNISTS 493
can Women, which has been found by the agencies of this Govern-
ment to be controlled by the Communist conspiracy. And, if the
chairman please, may the article be made a part of the record.
Would you now kindly answer the question.
Mrs. Devunich. Sir, this is so hard to read.
Mr. ScHLESiNGER. Mr. Counsel and Mr. Chairman, it is impossible
to read this, and I will ask the counsel to read it to us.
Mr. Arens. I will read that which I can perceive here under the
light.
Delegates Back From World's Women's Congress
Women delegates from the American Slav Congress who went to the Second
Congress of the Women's International Democratic Federation in Budapest,
Hungary, have just returned to the United States on the Queen Elisabeth.
The American delegate — I am a little reluctant in this particular
proceeding to mention names other than the name of the witness who is
now being interrogated, Mr. Chairman.
Mr. Willis. Do not name them.
Mr. Arens. Mentioned here are a number of women, including "Ann
Devunic of Pittsburgh," who according to this document —
gave reports of their journey through Europe, the deliberations of the Congress,
and the work for peace which was accomplished on their mission.
In an interview at the ASC National Office yesterday Ann Devunic expressed
great hope that the resolutions passed by this women's convention of over 400
delegates from every part of the world would be carried through in the respective
countries.
That is what I have just now read from the article.
(Document handed to witness.)
Mr. Arens. And the outstanding principal question is. Are the
facts recited in that article substantially correct to the best of your
knowledge and belief?
(The witness conferred with her counsel.)
Mrs. Devtjnich. Sir, I would not know because I did not write this
article myself.
(Document marked "Anna Devunich Exhibit No. 2" and retained
in committee files.)
Mr. Arens. Then kindly tell us whether or not you went to Buda-
pest, Hungary, to participate and did participate in this women's
congress ?
(The witness conferred with her counsel.)
Mrs. Devunich. Sir, American citizens under the first amendment
have a right to free association and so forth, and therefore I claim
the first and the fifth amendment.
Mr. Arens. Did you misrepresent to the State Department when
you told them that you anticipated going to Yugoslavia to visit some
relatives when you filed your passport application ?
(The witness conferred with her comisel.)
Mrs. Devunich. Sir, were they giving out passports to Yugoslavia
at that time ?
Mr. Arens. Just please answer the question.
Did you at the time you filed your application for a United States
passport — in which application you, as the reproduction evidences,
indicated that you wanted to go to Yugoslavia — did you at that time
intend, instead of going to Yugoslavia, to go to Hungary to partici-
494 DENATURALIZATION AND DEPORTATION OF COMMUNISTS
pate in this international conference under the auspices of the Com-
munist conspiracy ?
(The witness conferred with her counsel.)
Mr. ScHLESixGER. Mr. Arens, could we see the passport application
again ?
(Document handed to counsel.)
Mr. ScHLESiNGER. Thank you.
(The witness conferred with her counsel.)
Mrs. Devunich. Sir, doesn't the passport say that it is not valid
for Yugoslavia ? Do you have a copy so that I could see it ?
Mr. Arens. Let us just make the record clear. Which passport are
you talking about ?
Mrs. Devunich. The one that you are talking about.
Mr. Arens. Is that the one tliat was issued to you as a then United
States citizen for the purpose of travel ?
(The witness conferred with her counsel.)
Mrs. Devunich. Well, what was the question now ?
Mr. Arens. You were asking a question, and I just gave a response
to you. The thing I want to know, so we are not quibbling, is this :
At the time 5^011 signed this passport application — according to the
document itself, the following appears : "I intend to visit the follow-
ing countries for the purposes indicated." Answer, "Yugoslavia,
Visit relatives."
Did you sign that passport application and did you make those
representations in that passport application which I have displayed
to you ?
(The witness conferred with her counsel.)
Mrs. Devunich. Sir, I have answered your question, your original
question, and I will answer it again.
The Supreme Court of the United States has said that everyone is
entitled to a passport and, therefore, I cannot answer your question
about the passport on the claim of the first and the fifth amendment.
Mr. Arens. The Supreme Court has never said that a person is en-
titled to procure a passport by fraud. Did you, at the time you filed
this application for a passport, and told the State Department with
an affidavit over your signature under oath that you intended to go to
Yugoslavia to visit relatives, did you at that time intend to use this
passport for the purpose of gaining admission into Hungary to attend
a conference under the auspices of the Communist conspiracy ?
(The witness conferred with her counsel.)
Mr. Schlesinger. May we see that application again?
(Document handed.)
(The witness conferred with her counsel.)
Mrs. De\tjnich. Sir, I think in view of, because some of tJiese things
are not clear to me, the best thing for me to do is to claim the first and
fifth amendment to the Constitution.
Mr. Arens. Have you been the executive secretary of the National
Council of Croatian Women ?
(The witness conferred with her counsel.)
Mrs. Devunich. Sir, under the Constitution we have the freedom of
assembly. So I claim the first and fifth amendments.
Mr. Arens. We display to you now, if you please, a thermof ax copy
of an article appearing in the Pittsburgh Press with respect to a
DENATURALIZATION AND DEPORTATION OF COMMUNISTS 495
gathering of a Slav Congress in which tlie following appears : "Mrs.
Anna Devunicli of 221 Columbia Avenue, West View, executive sec-
retary of the National Council of Croatian Women" and so forth.
This will now be displayed to you by Mr. Williams.
Kindly look at that article and tell this committee, while you are
mider oath, whether or not tlie characterization of yourself in that
status with that organization is true and correct.
(Document handed to witness.)
(The witness conferred with her counsel.)
Mrs. Devunich. I claim the first and fifth amendments.
(Document marked "Amia Devunich Exhibit No. 3" and retained
in committee files.)
Mr. Arens. I should like to explain to you the background perti-
nency and relevancy of certain questions which I intend to pro-
pound to you.
It is the information of this committee, taken from the records of
the Immigration and Naturalization Service, that on September 20,
1943, you filed a petition to become a citizen of the United States;
that on February 4, 1944, you took an oath and were admitted to citi-
zenship. In that oath you swore to defend and protect the Consti-
tution and you swore that you were not a member of an organization
dedicated to the overthrow of this Government by force and violence.
It is further the information of this committee that on May 5,
1954, a complaint was filed in the United States District Court here in
Pittsburgh to revoke your citizenship on the ground that, in truth and
in fact, notwithstanding your oath, you were at the time of the filing
of your petition, and have been since approximately 1930, a member
of the Communist Party.
That thereafter your case was dismissed, and because of certain
judicial opinions in other cases respecting the type and nature of
proof which is required in a denaturalization case, it was not rein-
stituted.
I should like now — and I would like to invite your attention specific-
ally to the language which I am going to use to ask you this question.
I have two questions.
At the time you filed your petition to become a citizen of the United
States were you a member of the Communist Party ?
(The witness conferred with her counsel.)
Mrs. Devunich, I am sorry. I must claim the first and the fifth
amendments to the Constitution.
Mr. Arens. This is tlie second question : At the time that you filed
your petition to become a citizen of the United States as well as at
the time you took your oath when you did become a citizen of the
United States, did you know that the Communist Party advocated the
overthrow of the Government of the United States by force and vio-
lence ?
(The witness conferred with her counsel.)
Mrs. Devunich. Upon the advice of counsel, I now invoke the first'
and the fifth amendment to the Constitution.
Mr. Arens. Since the dismissal of the denaturalization petition
against you on April 15, 1958, have you been engaged in Communist
Party activities ?
(The witness conferred with her counsel.)
496 DENATURALIZATION AND DEPORTATION OF COMMUNISTS
Mr. Arens. As a member of the Communist Party ?
(The witness conferred with her coiinseL)
Mrs. Devunich. Same answer.
Mr. Arens. Mary Goklen took an oath before this committee 2 days
ago and stated that wliile she was an undercover agent in the Com-
munist Party for the Federal Bureau of Investigation, she knew you
as a Communist and that you recruited her into the Communist Party.
Was her testimony on that score true or was it in error ?
(The witness conferred with her counsel.)
Mrs, Devunich. Sir, in reference to the question I wish to say let
her conscience be her pride, and upon the advice of counsel I do here
now invoke the first and the fifth amendments to the Constitution.
Mr, Arens. She stated further under oath that as recently as some
10 days ago — a week or 10 days ago — you and a number of other
Communists met in an office here in Washington for the purpose of
planning strategy and tactics against this committee and for the
purpose of soliciting funds, advertisements, and organizations to
create a hostile sentiment to the work of this committee, and she enu-
merated some of the activities of yourself in that regard as recently
as 10 days ago. Was she in error on that or was she accurate in her
testimony ?
(The witness conferred with her counsel.)
Mrs. Devunich. Sir, I listened very carefully to your question and
I think you said here in Washington, is that so ?
Mr. Arens. Here in Pittsburgh.
(The witness conferred with her counsel.)
Mrs. Devunich, Sir, I say again let her conscience be her pride,
I invoke the first and the fifth amendments to tlie Constitution,
Mr. Arens. Was this meeting which Mrs. Golden was describing a
Communist Party functional activity meeting or was it a meeting
for some otlier purpose ?
(The witness conferred with her counsel.)
Mrs. Devunich. Same answer.
Mr. Arens. Are you now, this moment, a member of the Communist
Party?
(The witness conferred with her counsel.)
Mrs. Devunich, Sir, I wish to use the first, the protection of the
first and fifth amendments to the Constitution,
Mr. Arens. Mr. Chairman, I respectfully suggest that will conclude
the staff interrogation of this witness.
Mr. Willis, The witness is excused.
Mr. Arens. The next witness, if you please, sir, will be Mr.
Devunich.
Would you kindly come forward and remain standing while the
chairman administers an oath ?
Mr. Willis. Please raise your right hand.
Do you solemnly swear that the testimony you are about to give will
be the truth, the whole truth, and nothing but the truth, so help you
God ?
Mr. Devunich. I do.
DENATURALIZATION AND DEPORTATION OF COMMUNISTS 497
TESTIMONY OF STEPHEN DEVUNICH, ACCOMPANIED BY COUNSEL,
HYMEN SCHLESINGER^Resumed
Mr. Arens. Please identify yourself by name, residence, and occu-
pation.
Mr. Devunich. My name is Stephen Devunich. My occupation is
machinist and the address 221 Columbia Avenue, Pittsburgh 29.
Mr. Arens. You are appearing today in response to the subpena
which was served upon you by the House Conunittee on Un-American
Activities ?
Mr. Devunich. I beg your pardon ?
Mr. Arens. You are appearing today in response to a subpena of
this conunittee ?
Mr. Devunich. Yes.
Mr. Arens. And you are represented by counsel ?
Mr. Devunich. Yes, sir.
Mr. Arens. Counsel, would you kindly identify yourself on this
record ?
Mr. Schlesinger. Hymen Schlesinger, Pittsburgh, Pa.
Mr. Arens. What other name or names have you been known by
other than the name pursuant to which you appear here today,
Devunich ?
(The witness conferred with his counsel.)
Mr. Devunich. I claim the first and fifth amendment.
Mr. Arens. Do you honestly apprehend, sir, that if you told this
coinmittee truthfully, while you are under oath, any other names under
which you have been known, you would be supplying information
that might be used against you in a criminal proceeding ?
(The witness conferred with his counsel.)
Mr. Devunich. It might be used as a link in a chain by this com-
mittee.
Mr. Arens. Where and when were you born ?
(The witness conferred with his counsel.)
Mr. Devunich. For the purpose of identification, I was born in
Croatia, town capital of Croatia, presently Yugoslavia.
Mr. Arens. When, please, sir ?
(The witness conferred with his counsel. )
Mr. Devunich. I was born— for identification, I was born Decem-
ber 13, 1899.
Mr. Arens. Wlien did you come to the United States for perma-
nent residence ?
Mr. Devunich. For identification, I came to this conntrv, I believe
It was May, '27, from Canada.
Mr. Arens. In what year ?
Mr. Devunich. In '27, 1 believe.
Mr. Arens. 1927?
Mr. Devunich. 1927.
Mr. Arens. Are you a citizen of the United States ?
(The witness conferred with his counsel.)
Mr. Devunich. For identification of this committee, I am proud to
be a citizen of this great Nation.
498 DENATURALIZATION AND DEPORTATION OF COMMUNISTS
Mr. Arens. When did you become a citizen of tlie United States ?
(Tlie witness conferred witli liis counsel.)
Mr. Devunicii. I am sorry. I think I cannot answer tliis question.
It might injure me.
Mr. Akens. Are you a citizen by naturalization ?
(The witness conferred with his counsel.)
Mr. Devunicii. For identification, yes.
Mr. Arens. Have you traveled abroad in the course of the last
several years — last 15 years, we will say ?
(The witness conferred with his counsel.)
Mr. Devunicii. Sorry. I will plead the first and fifth amendment
to that question.
Mr. Arens. We will display to you now, if you please, sir, a passport
application filed with the Department of State subscribed and sworn
to under date of February 27, 1946, in w^hich the applicant, Stephen
Devunich, asserts under oath to the Department of State in his ap-
plication for a passport, "I intend to visit the following countries for
the purposes indicated : Yugoslavia, To visit relatives."
Kindly look at this document which 1 shall now display to you and
tell this committee, while you are under oath, whether or not that is a
true and correct reproduction of tlie application you filed with the De-
partment of State for a United States passport.
(The witness conferred with his counsel.)
Mr. Devunich. I must claim the first and fifth amendment on ad-
vice of counsel.
(Document marked "Stephen Devunich Exhibit No. 1" and retained
in committee files.)
Mr. Arens. Do you honestly apprehend, sir, if you told this com-
mittee truthfully, while you are under oath, whether or not that is a
true and correct reproduction of an application filed by you with the
Department of State for a passport, you would be supplying informa-
tion that might be used against you in a criminal proceeding ?
(The witness conferred with his counsel.)
Mr. Devunich. It could be misused.
Mr. Arens. Would it be a misuse ?
Mr. Devunich. And that is why I use the first and fifth amendment.
Mr. Arens. You said it would be a misuse. Did you make a mis-
representation in your passport application to the Department of
State?
(The witness conferred with his counsel.)
Mr. Devunich. On advice of counsel I plead the first and fifth
amendment.
Mr. Arens. Did you receive a United States passport pursuant to
this ap])lication which you filed ?
(The witness conferred with his counsel.)
Mr, De^tjnicti. Same answer.
Mr. Arens. Did you travel abroad on the United States passport?
(The witness conferred with his counsel.)
Mr, Devunich. Same answer.
Mr. Arens. Did you go to Yugoslavia ?
(The witness conferred with his counsel.)
Mr. Devunich. Same answer.
DENATURALIZATION AND DEPORTATION OF COMMUNISTS 499
Mr. Akens. Was your mission abroad pursuant to an objective pro-
gram and plan of the international Communist conspiracy i
(The witness conferred with his counsel.)
Mr. Devunich. Every citizen has his right to travel. And I plead
the first and fifth amendment.
Mr. Arens. Do you honestly apprehend, sir, that if you told this
committee truthfully, ^'hile you are under oath, whether or not you
traveled abroad on a plan and purpose of international Communist
conspiracy, you would be supplying information which could be used
against you in a criminal proceeding ?
( The witness conferred with his counsel . )
Mr. Devunigh. I will say it would be misuse by this committee.
That is why I plead first and fifth amendment.
Mr. Areists. Mr. Chairman, I respectfully suggest then the witness
be ordered to answer that question.
Mr. Willis. I direct you to answer the question.
(The witness conferred with his counsel. )
Mr. De\ijnicii. It could be a link in the chain. That is why I
plead the firet and fifth amendment.
Mr. Arens. Now, sir, at the time you took your oath as a citizen of
the United States, when you were naturalized, were you a member
of the Communist Party ?
(The witness conferred with his counsel.)
Mr. Devunich. I claim the first and fifth amendment.
Mr. Arens. Now, I should like to recite to you background explana-
tion of the pertinency and relevancy of certain questions which I pro-
pose to propound to you.
It is the information of this committee that under date of March 25,
1940, you filed a petition for naturalization in the United States
District Court at Pittsburgh, Pa. That on March 23, 1942, you were
admitted to citizenship and took an oath to defend the Constitution
of the United States against all enemies foreign and domestic and that
you were not then, or never had been, a member of an organization
dedicated to the overthrow of the Government of the United States
by force and violence.
It is further the information of this committee that on May 5,
1954, a complaint was filed in the United States District Court in
Pittsburgh, Pa., to revoke your citizenship on the grounds that, in
truth and in fact, at the time of filing of the petition and since
approximately 1930, you had been a member of the Comm.unist Party.
Thereafter on April 15, 1958, this complaint was dismissed, and in
light of certain decisions which had been announced in other cases by
the Supreme Court of the United States respecting the nature and
burden of proof required in the presentation of denaturalization
cases, it was not reinstituted.
It is the information of this committee that your case is typical of
numerous cases wherein persons have been identified by live, com-
petent, credible vatnesses under oath as Communists at the time of
their naturalization, as well as Communists since their naturalization
and before their naturalization, but the cases have been dismissed
because of the legal difficulties stemming from certain judicial
opinions.
500 DENATURALIZATION AND DEPORTATION OF COMMUNISTS
It is the intention of this committee to undertake to solicit from
you by certain questions, perhaps to jjain information by indirection,
which will assist this committee in its letrislative endeavors, if it is
])ossible to do so, to devise legislation wliich can tigliten up and meet
the problem of Communists Avho have penetrated the defenses of this
Nation and who have masqueraded behind the facade of their citizen-
ship to perpetrate Communist objectives and Communist designs.
Now, sir, wnth that explanation in mind, I ask you, at the time you
filed your petition to become a citizen of the United States and at
the time you took your oath as a citizen of the United States, did you
know that the Communist Party advocated the overthrow of the
Government of the United States by force and violence ?
(The witness conferred with his counsel.)
Mr. Devunich. Believing that anything I will say before this com-
mittee will be used against me, I plead the first and fifth amend-
ments.
Mr. Arens. Do you honestly apprehend, sir, if you told this com-
mittee truthfully, while you are under oath, whether or not you knew
at the time you filed your petition for naturalization and at the
time you took your oath as a citizen, that the Communist Party advo-
cated the overthrow of the United States by force and violence,
you would be supplying information which might be used against
you in a criminal proceeding?
(The witness conferred with his counsel.)
Mr. Devunich. On advice of counsel I plead the first and the fifth
amendment.
Mr. Arens. Since the dismissal of the complaint against you, the
denaturalization proceedings, on April 15, 1958, have you engaged as
a member of the Communist Party in Communist Party activities?
(The witness conferred with his counsel.)
Mr. Devitnicii. Without admitting or denying, I believe ever^'body
and anyone has the right to associate and that is why I plead the first
and fifth amendment.
Mr. Arens. Just 2 days ago a lady who had served for 12 years in
the Communist apparatus as a member of the Communist Party at
tlie behest of the Federal Bureau of Investigation testified respecting
a meeting held in a certain office last Saturday which has been mis-
construed in certain quarters, a meeting in which she said you were a
participant, a meeting in which Communists assembled to work out
strategy and tactics in dealing with tliis particular committee before
which you appear now; and she told in her testimony about contri-
butions which were made to buy advertisements for the Emei-gency
Civil Liberties Committee, advertisements for an Independent Voters
League, and the like, and other strategy and tactics and ordere and
directives that were issued to the comrades in furtherance of the pro-
gram of the Communist conspiracy in this community. In each and
every instance in the meeting, she told the names of persons known
by her to be comrades, including your own. That lady's name was
Mary Golden. "Was she in error in her statements respecting you or
was she accurate ?
(The witness conferred with his counsel.)
DENATURALIZATION AND DEPORTATION OF COMMUNISTS 501
Mr. Devunich. On advice of my counsel I plead the first, fifth, and
sixth amendments.
Mr. Arens. Tliis Committee on Un-American Activities is pres-
ently engaged, as it has been through the years, in developing factual
information whicli can be used in creating legislative devices to cope
with this Communist conspiracy which is threatening freedom every-
where and wliich is threatening freedom in the United States, a con-
spiracy designed to overthrow the Government of the United States
by force and violence.
' Do you, sir, as a citizen of the United States, bearing the protection
of the flag of this country, presently have information respecting the
current operations of the Connnunist Party in the Pittsburgh area?
(The witness conferred with liis counsel.)
Mr. Devunich. My devotion to the country and the flag is higher
than anybody and that is why I plead the first and fifth amendment.
Mr. Arens. Do you honestly apprehend that if you told this com-
mittee truthfully right now, while you are under oath, Avhether or
not you have current information respecting the operation of the
Communist Party in the Pittsburgh area, you would be supplying
information that "could be used against you in a criminal proceeding?
(The witness conferred with liis counsel.)
Mr. Devunich. It could be misused in a link of chain.
Mr. Arens. Would it be a misuse, sir ?
Mr. Devunich. And I am not finish yet, and that is why I plead the
first and fifth amendment.
Mr. Arens. Mr. Chairman
Mr. Willis. I direct you to answer it.
(The witness conferred with his counsel.)
Mr. Devunich. I didn't understand the question.
Mr. Willis. You conclude that would be a m;isuse. I will reject
that. You can't pussyfoot on that important question. I direct you to
answer it or invoke proper constitutional grounds.
(The witness conferred with his counsel.)
Mr. Devunich. I claim first and fifth amendment.
Mr. Arens. Mr. Chairman, I respectfully suggest that will conclude
th& staff interrogation of this witness and if it meets with the pleasure
of the chairman, I would like to request a 5-minute recess.
Mr. Willis. The committee will take an informal recess of a few
minutes.
(Subcommittee members present : Representatives Willis and Tuck.)
(Brief recess.)
(Subcommittee niiembers present at the time of the reconvening of
the subcommittee : Representatives Willis and Tuck.)
Mr. Willis. The subcommittee will please come to order. Call your
next witness.
jSIr. Arens. Steve Nelson, please come forward.
Mr. Willis. Please raise your right hand.
Do you solemnly swear that the testimony you are about to give
will be the trath, the whole truth, and nothing but the truth, so help
you God ?
Mr. Nelson. I do.
502 DENATURALIZATION AND DEPORTATION OF COMMUNISTS
TESTIMONY OF STEVE NELSON, ACCOMPANIED BY COUNSEL,
HYMEN SCHLESINGER
Mr. Arens. Please identify yourself by name, residence, and oc-
cupation.
jSIr. Nelson. I notice that Mr. Schlesinger is not in the room. I
^Y0uld appreciate if you wait long enough until he is in. He is my
counsel.
Mr. Arens. Mr. Marshal, would you kindly
The Marshal. Yes, sir; he is looking for him out in the hall now.
Mr. Arens. Now, would you please identify yourself by name, resi-
dence, and occupation ?
IMr. Nelson. My name is Steve Nelson. I live at 3120 Iowa Street,
Pittsburgh, Pa.
Mr. Arens. Your occupation, please ?
Mr. Nelson. My occupation is salesman.
Mr. Arens. You are appearing today in response to a subpena which
was served upon you by the House Committee on Un-American
Activities ?
Mr. Nelson. That is right.
Mr. Arens. And you are represented by counsel ?
Mr. Nelson. Yes, sir.
Mr. Arens. Counsel, kindly identify yourself on this record.
Mr. Schlesinger. Hymen Schlesinger, Pittsburgh, Pa.
Mr. Arens. Hai^e you ever been known by any name other than the
name pursuant to which you appear here today ?
(The witness conferred with his counsel.)
Mr. Nelson. Because this matter that is here before the committee
today may become a problem in possible future litigation, where this
matter, my name, may become a subject of discussion or a problem,
I cannot answer the question other than to plead the fifth amendment
and tlie first amendment.
Mr. Arens. Where and when were you born ?
(The witness conferred with his counsel.)
Mr. Nelson. I think because I am not unfamiliar with the possible
results of what can happen before this committee, in view of the fact
that I have had a number of litigations, trials, and so forth, and in-
cluding a possible threat again of a denaturalization proceeding, I
cannot answer that question other than to plead the fifth amendment
and the first amendment.
Mr. Arens. Are you a citizen of the United States ?
(The v/itness conferred with his counsel.)
, Mr. Nelson. For identification purposes, yes, sir.
Mr. Arens. By naturalization ?
(The witness conferred with his counsel.)
Mr. Nelson. For identification purposes, yes, sir.
Mr. Arens. When were your naturalized ?
(The witness conferred with his counsel.)
Mr. Nelson. Since it appears to me that this matter would be per-
tinent in whatever — should there be any proceedings against me, I
must plead the fifth amendment again and the first amendment and
not answer it any other way.
Mr. Arens. At the time you filed your petition for naturalization
and at the time you took your oath as a citizen of the United States,
DENATURALIZATION AND DEPORTATION OF COMMUNISTS 503
did you know that the Communist Party advocated the overthrow of
the Government of the United States by force and violence?
(The witness conferred with his counsel.)
Mr. Nelson. On advice of counsel I claim the first and fifth amend-
ment.
Mr. Arens. Were you at the time you filed your petition to become
a citizen of the United States, as well as at the time you took your oath
as a citiz(^n of the United States, a member of the Communist Party?
( The witness conferred with his counsel. )
Mr. Nelson. On the advice of comisel I plead the first and fifth
amendment.
Mr. Arens. Now, as a basis upon which I expect to ask just a few
more questions, I should like to recite, so the record may be clear as
to the pertinency and relevancy of those questions, the record taken
from the files of the Immigration and Naturalization Service pertain-
ing to yourself; namely, that you were born in Chaglich, Croatia,
now part of Yugoslavia in 1903 ; that you entered the United States
of America on June 14, 1920; that thereafter you filed a declara-
tion of intention on January 15, 1924, to become a citizen; that your
petition was filed May 17, 1928; that thereafter your certificate of
naturalization was issued on November 26, 1928. Thereafter on April
28, 1954, a complaint was filed for revocation of your citizenship in
the United States District Court at Pittsburgh, Pa., based upon illegal
procurement of naturalization by willful misrepresentation and con-
cealment of material facts. Thereafter on April 15, 1958, the case
was dismissed, and because of certain decisions which had been an-
nounced in other cases by the Supreme Court of the United States, the
complaint against yourself was not reinstituted.
Since the dismissal of the complaint against yourself in the de-
naturalization proceedings by the Immigration and Naturalization
Service, have you engaged in Communist Party activities ?
(The witness conferred with his counsel.)
Mr. Nelson. Gentlemen, I think you know, members of this com-
mittee—I know that I have been tried under the Smith Act and the
Sedition Act ; and having had a sentence of 25 years imposed on me
on the basis of questions, the type of questions you are quoting here
to me, and in view of the fact that the Supreme Court threw out that
case, it seems to me that the reason for the inquiry here into my per-
sonal status and other people here is to hit back at the Supreme Court.
It is clearly evident from the chairman's statement this morning, it
seems to me, that that is the pertinency of your presence here and
none other than that. It is a matter of attempting to persecute peo-
ple who are likely to be framed, as I have been; and people who testi-
fied against me, scores of them, have been exposed as liars and stool
pigeons who wouldn't dare to bring themselves into this court today.
I can name nine of them here for you, who testified against me and
other people, and now you expect me to testify against myself. I
cannot do it and honor your answer, Mr. Arens, other than to say
that I claim the fifth and first amendment which gives me protection
under these circumstances, not because I have done anything wrong in
my life.
Mr. Arens. Mr. and Mrs. Hamp Golden testified just 2 days ago
they were serving as undercover agents in the conspiratorial apparatus
504 DENATURALIZATION AND DEPORTATION OF COMMUNISTS
known as the Communist Party and that they knew you as a Com-
munist in the course of the last year or so. Were they in error on that
testimony or was that accurate?
(The witness conferred with hiscounseL)
Mr. Nelson. I have, Your Honor, gentlemen here, faced, I don't
know whether I should say bigger or smaller stool pigeons in my time,
and I have never dignified her answer because they testified the way the
boss pays them. Whoever pays them last, that is the way they are
going to testify. And they intend to do the same thing here. If you
want me to, I will cite these names to you. Who this committee had
before.
Mr. Arens. Kindly answer the question. Were they in error or tell-
ing the truth when they identified you as a person known by them to be
a Communist?
Mr. Nelson. You know, Mr. Arens, I would be a big fool if I an-
swered that question to walk into a trap set here by you. Therefore, I
claim the fifth and first amendment, and that is as far as I go dignify-
ing any stool pigeon testimony.
Mr. Arens. Just one final observation and question.
It is the objective, and has been the objective, of the committee in
the proceedings here in Pittsburgh, as well as elsewhere, to explore
factual situations to reveal whether or not there are weaknesses or
loopholes in existing laws of this Nation to protect the internal security
of this country. This committee has received testimony in the course
of this last 2 or 3 days respecting what appear to be loopholes in our
security in industrial matters, what appear to be new techniques of the
Communist apparatus. It has received testimony liere today with re-
spect to a number of cases which are typical of individuals who have
been repeatedly found to be members of the Communist Party but
against whom this Government appears to be powerless, at the present
time under the present law, to proceed in causing their removal from
these shores or causing them to be deprived of the mask of citizenship.
Do you, sir, now, at this moment, have information respecting cur-
rent activities, strategies, and tactics of the Communist Party in the
Pittsburgh area ?
(The witness conferred with his counsel.)
Mr. Nelson. Gentlemen, I think I appeared before this committee
before any of you were members of it. I appeared before this com-
mittee in 1948 when Nixon was chairman of the committee and Par-
nell Thomas was chairman of the committee.
Mr. Arens. Kindly answer the question.
Mr. Nelson. I will, Mr. Arens. I will.
Mr. Arens. Please answer it directly. Do you have such informa-
tion or do you not have such information ?
Mr. Nelson. The point I want to make, Mr. Arens, is that as a re-
sult of that testimony, people like you cited me for contempt of Con-
gress and I had to go through an expensive litigation which was finally
thrown out by a court of law, and I suspect the motives of your pres-
ence here today again that are similar as the committee under Parnell
Thomas and Dies and Nixon, and I will not furnisli any information
to you to persecute other people who are disagreeing with you. For
example, Mr. Willis will say anybody that advocates equality in schools
DENATURALIZATION AND DEPORTATION OF COMMUNISTS 505
in the South is a Communist, perhaps. Or he will say that anybody
advocatin<r labor rights, and so forth.
Mr. Willis. You are going entirely too far. Don't be impertinent.
Mr. Nelson. I don't want to be personal, Mr. Willis.
Mr. Willis. But you are indulging in something obviously not
true now. Please
Mr. Nelson. Mr. Willis
Mr. Willis. Will you please answer the question ?
Mr. Nelson. I was going to illustrate as a point that is very fa-
miliar in our countiy.
Mr. Willis. If that last illustration is as true as all the tirades and
all the other illustrations you have given, you, I am sure, are per-
fectly unimpressive. So will you answer the question ? There is one
outstanding question and I think you have answered it, that you do
not care to supply information ; is that it ?
Mr. Nelson. Well, I do not feel that the committee is going after
pertinent information. They are going out to persecute people.
Mr. Willis. Your answer is that you do not care to give any infor-
mation ?
Mr. Nelson. I will give you the answer.
Mr. Willis. I think you have given an answer.
Mr. Nelson. Mr. Chairman, then I will conclude by using the first
and fifth amendment.
Mr. Arens. Mr. Chairman, I respectfully suggest that will conclude
the staif interrogation of this witness.
(Witness excused.)
Mr. Willis. The Chair would like to make a closing statement.
In concluding the hearings in Pittsburgh, I should like to sum-
marize some of the highlights of this particular investigation.
As I announced at the opening of these proceedings, the hearings
were of three phases. On the first phase, namely, current strategy
and tactics of Communists in activities other than in vital industry,
we have heard from the lips of Mr. and Mrs. Golden an account of
current Communist activity and techniques. Their statements con-
firm similar patterns which we have been observing elsewhere in the
Nation. We have also received valuable testimony from Mr. Hardin.
By indirection from the lips of uncooperative witnesses, we have also
elicited substantial corroboration of infoi-mation already in the record.
On the second phase of the hearings, namely, problems of security
in industrial establishments holding defense contracts, we have not
only been able to clarify our record on a number of problems in this
connection from the testimony of the gentlemen from the Depart-
ment of Defense, but have been able to reveal a sampling of activity
by hard-core Communists who are in a position to exert direct Com-
munist discipline in this vital industrial area via their positions in
organizations, and so on.
Finally, on the third phase of our hearings, we have explored con-
crete cases of deportation and denaturalization. The information
which w^e have been developing here will be taken back by the sub-
committee to be appraised along with other factual material available
to the Committee on Un-American Activities in the discharge of its
duties under the mandate of the House of Representatives.
506 DENATURALIZATION AND DEPORTATION OF COMMUNISTS
There is a collateral result, moreover, from hearings such as those
whicli Ave have been conducting which I believe will have a salutary
and inii)ortant effect, namely, to bring liome to the American people
the continuing, menacing threat of communism; that connnunism is
not merely a political and philosophical concept, but that it is a
dynamic force of intrigue and subversion.
Before concluding I should like to express the thanks of the sub-
committee to Federal Chief Judge^ Wallace S. Gourley and to Judge
Joseph P. Willson who made the 'facilities of this courtroom avail-
able to us.
I should like also to express appreciation to United States Marshal
Albert Di Meolo and his deputies for their cooperation. Finally, I
should like to express appreciation to the representatives of the press
and other media of public information for their courtesy.
This concludes the hearings in the Pittsburgh area at this time.
Governor Tuck, would you care to make any supplemental observa-
tion?
Mr. Tuck. I have nothing further to say, Mr. Chairman, except to
say I agree fully with everything that you had to say.
Mr. Willis. The hearings are concluded.
(Whereupon, at 3 :30 p.m., Thursday, March 12, 1959, the hearings
were concluded.)
INDEX
Individuals Page
Cvetic, Matthew 474
Devunich, Anna (Mrs. Stephen Devunich) 463,
4G4, 467, 468-470 ( testimony ), 472, 477, 490-i96 (testimony)
Devunich, Stephen 464, 470—472 (testimony), 477, 497-501 (testimony)
Di Meolo, Albert 506
Golden, Hamp L 464, 503, 505
Golden, Mary (Mrs. Hamp L. Golden) 463,
464, 480-481 (testimony), 496, 500, 503, 505
Goiirley, Wallace S 506
Hardin, R. J. (Reuben J.) 505
Johnson, Allen {See McNeil, James Allan Donald.)
Kemenovich, Katherine (Mrs. Vincent Kemenovich) 462-464,
478-481 (testimony)
Kemenovich, Vincent 462, 473-477 (testimony), 478
McNeil, James Allan Donald (also knovi^n as Allen Johnson) 463,
487-489 (testimony)
Nelson, Steve 464, 502-505 (testimony)
Rakosi, Ales Roth 463, 464, 482-487 (testimony)
Schlesinger, Hymen 473, 478, 480, 482, 487, 490, 497, 502
Staber, Alexander 480
Willson, Joseph P 506
Oeganizations
American Committee for Protection of Foreign Born 465, 466
American Slav Congress .. 466, 493
Communist International 465
Communist Party, USA, Nationality Groups Commission 466
Congress of American Women 492, 493
Independent Voters League 480
International Labor Defense 465
International Red Aid 465
International Workers Ordei* 466
National Council of Croatian Women 494, 495
Women's International Democratic Federation, Second Congress 493
Publications
Daily Worker 4,S5
o
Jiiiffi,,
3 9999 05706 31 oi
This book should be returned to
the Library on or before the last date
stamped below.
A fine is incurred by retaining it
beyond the specified time.
Please return promptly.
Live Music Archive
Librivox Free Audio
Metropolitan Museum
Cleveland Museum of Art
Internet Arcade
Console Living Room
Books to Borrow
Open Library
TV News
Understanding 9/11