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>T INVESTIGATION OF COMMUNIST
PROPAGANDA
HEARINGS
BEFORE A
SPECIAL COMMITTEE
TO INVESTIGATE COMMUNIST ACTIVITIES
IN THE UNITED STATES
OF THE
HOUSE OF REPRESENTATIVES
SEVENTY-FIRST CONGRESS
THIRD SESSION
PURSUANT TO
H. Res. 220
PROVIDING FOR AN INVESTIGATION OF COMMUNIST
PROPAGANDA IN THE UNITED STATES
PART I— VOLUME No. 5
DECEMBER, 1930
UNITED STATES
GOVERNMENT PRINTING OFFICE
1 1 9*56 1 WASHINGTON : 1931
INVESTIGATION OF COMMUNIST
PROPAGANDA
HEARINGS
BEFORE A
SPECIAL COMMITTEE v
TO INVESTIGATE COMMUNIST ACTIVITIES
IN THE UNITED STATES
OF THE
HOUSE OF REPRESENTATIVES
SEVENTY-FIRST CONGRESS
THIRD SESSION
PURSUANT TO
H. Res. 220
PROVIDING FOR AN INVESTIGATION OF COMMUNIST
PROPAGANDA IN THE UNITED STATES
PART I —VOLUME No. 5
DECEMBER, 1930
UNITED STATES
GOVERNMENT PRINTING OFFICE
119651 WASHINGTON : 1931
^ -V-zsuT"
SPECIAL COMMITTEE TO INVESTIGATE COMMUNIST ACTIVITIES IN
THE UNITED STATES
HAMILTON FISH, Jr., New York, Chairman
I EDWARD E.
Virginia. I ROBERT S. I
Walter L. Reynolds, Clerk
JOHN E. NELSON, Maine. I EDWARD E. ESLICK, Tennessee.
CARL G. BACHMANN, West Virginia. I ROBERT S. HALL, Mississippi.
II
CONTENTS
Page
Testimony of Dr. William B. Reid, Rome, N. Y
Testimony of Dr. William B. Reid, Rome, N. Y 1
Bureau, Washington, D. 35,61
Testimony of A. Dana Hodgdon, chief of visa office, Department of State_ 121
Statement of Hon. Thomas L. Blanton, introducing letter from Francis
Ralston Welsh, Philadelphia, Pa 127
Testimony of Judge Paul M. W. Lineharger, legal adviser, National Gov-
ernment of China 128
Testimony of Andrew Irshay, editor Wilbur Herald, Trenton, N. J 137
Article by G. Agabekoff, former leader of Russian O. G. P. U 147
Additional statement presented for record from chief of police, Seattle,
Wash 154
Additional statement by District Attorney George H. Johnson, San Ber-
nardino County, Calif 157
in
PBOVIDING FOR AN INVESTIGATION OF COMMUNIST
PROPAGANDA IN THE UNITED STATES
MONDAY, DECEMBER 15, 1930
House or Representatives.
Special Committee to Investigate
Communist Activities in the United States,
Washington, D. G.
The committee met at 10 o'clock, a. m., Hon. Hamilton Fish, jr.,
(chairman) presiding.
TESTIMONY OF DR. WILLIAM B. KEID
(The witness was duly sworn by the Chairman.)
The Chairman. State your full name.
Doctor Reid. Dr. William B. Reid.
The Chairman. Doctor Reid, from where do you come?
Doctor Reid. Rome, N. Y., sir.
The Chairman. You are an American citizen?
Doctor Reid. I am.
The Chairman. Have you made a study of communist activities
in this country?
Doctor Reid. Yes, sir; and abroad.
The Chairman. And abroad?
Doctor Reid. Yes, sir.
The Chairman. For how many years?
Doctor Reid. Since 1917, intensively. I have been interested in
sociology since I was a young man, as a hobby.
The Chairman. Do you represent any organization?
Doctor Reid. I do not, sir. I am appearing here as an individual,
a scientist, with no ax to grind, pro or con, and would like to know,
as your committee and the country would like to know, regarding the
activities of communism.
The Chairman. Have you made any study of the activities of the
communists in the colleges and universities of the country?
Doctor Reid. I have, sir.
The Chairman. Have you any statement you would like to fur-
nish the committee in regard to the activities in those colleges, or
other communist activities in the country?
Doctor Reid. I would like to enter this whole statement. It will
take about 10 minutes.
The Chairman. Have you a prepared statement?
Doctor Reid. Yes, sir.
The Chairman. If there is no objection by the committee, you
may proceed in your own way. The Chair hears none.
l
2 INVESTIGATION OF COMMUNIST PROPAGANDA
Mr. Bachmann. It is on that question of the activity in the
colleges ?
Doctor Reid. Yes; it covers that. As I stated to you, sir, my pro-
fession is a surgeon. It has been said that he is fortunate indeed who
is skilled enough to have an avocation in life, and extraordinarily
fortunate is the one whose avocation proves serviceable to himself
and to others.
My vocation is a surgeon. I practiced in civil hospitals and mili-
tary hospitals in this country and abroad, for 30 years. I had
charge of Hospital No. 61 in the World War over at Bordeaux. I
want to inject right here, gentlemen, that I spent more than an hour
with your chairman last Friday and it was a most enjoyable and
enlightening thing to me. While I think all of you know something
about it, I want to extend to 3^011 my compliments for the manner
in which you have proceeded and the material you have collected,
and the wonderful waj^ it has been assembled. Furthermore, I am
not only a citizen of the United States, but I am a taxpayer and I
am mighty grateful for the little bit my share will contribute to
this splendid work you gentlemen are doing. I feel in a way I am
" carrying coals to Newcastle" ; however, I think I have some new
material, particularly on that question of colleges, that you have
not assembled in your material.
In this written statement — I will just cover that briefly — is the
mention of Clarence Day's essay entitled " This Simian World,"
and he brings out the point while we are descendants from the higher
monkey race, we inherit both the liabilities and the assets. One of
the greatest assets we have is the characteristic of investigation —
monkeying. We have been doing that with the people of the United
States to a considerable extent as to the license, rather than liberty,
regarding the freedom of the press, and so forth, and I have called
your particular attention here to the propaganda that is going on
throughout the country in regard to this very subject.
Now propaganda is all right in its place, educationally; but what
I object to, or what should be objected to, rather, is the false, mis-
leading, and untruthful propaganda that is going on. So I want
to enter here, as Exhibit No. 1, into your record, a picture of this
subversive communistic work I have put up here before you.
(The picture above referred to was marked as an exhibit, " Reid
No. 1.")
Exhibit No. 2 is an illustration in McCall's Magazine for this
month, December — and it will take me only just a second to call
your attention to one paragraph in particular of the untruthful,
misleading, and false statement that is written regarding this thing.
This is laudatory of this thing. May I give you just a sentence?
Listen to this
Mr. Bachmann. "Who is the author of it?
Doctor Reid. This is entitled " Meet the Smiths— of Russia."
Mr. Bachmann. Who wrote the article?
Doctor Reid. Helen Christine Bennett.
Mr. Bachmann. Do you know who she is?
Doctor Reid. I do not.
Mr. Bachmann. In what periodical does it appear?
Doctor Reid. McCall's Magazine.
. INVESTIGATION OF COMMUNIST PROPAGANDA 3
Mr. Bachmann. Of what date?
Doctor Reid. For this month, December, 1930. I am entering this
as a part of your record. This says:
* * * In Russia to-day women may vote and hold office, with none of
the discriminations found in other countries. She has equal sex rights and
privileges ; she may marry and divorce at will ; she has equal rights in her
children and all her children, born in wedlock or out, are legitimate. She
may do anything a man may do without stigma. She is free as no woman in
the world has ever been free — as man is free.
That is absolutely false, for this reason : She does not vote as our
women do; they are discriminated against. The Bolshevist Party
has a total membership (according to the latest figures I have) of
around 165,000. Now cut down the women vote and you will get my
point. And she is not free. In regard to sex liabilities, she is bound
by the same biological and physiological laws as other human beings.
She can not be free; she has to have those obligations and, on this
point right here, the United States Public Health Service, last year,
reported over a million cases of active syphilis in the United States
and, if she may bear children at will, so-called free love, I point
out to you what will happen during a very, very short period.
The Chairman. Perhaps I misunderstood you, but I understood
you said there were 165,000 members of the Communist Party ?
Doctor Reid. Of voters; legal voters in Russia.
The Chairman. Is not every communist a legal voter?
Doctor Reid. No, sir; not if he is not an atheist.
The Chairman. Well they are all atheists ; you can not remain in
the party a minute unless you are an atheist. I am satisfied and the
committee has been given to understand, generally, there are two
million and a half communists in Russia, and the figures you present,
165,000, are entirely new.
Doctor Reid. My figures are seven years old.
The Chairman. Oh, then, we have no dispute.
Mr. Eslick. The communist to be a voter, though, must be an
atheist, must he not, Doctor?
Doctor Reid. That is true.
Mr. Eslick. In other words, atheism is a condition precedent to
all things communistic, is it not ?
Doctor Reid. Correct, sir. And have I made that sufficiently
clear, that these people in the abolition of the home have the privilege
of changing mates at will, simply by going down to the civic center,
wherever it may be, and erasing their names from the book. Now, I
have overdrawn that; their recent law is that they may not change
mates oftener than three times in five years.
The Chairman. Is that a recent law '.
Doctor Reid. It was.
The Chairman. What law is that?
Doctor Reid. Well, it came out here within the last two or three
years. I have a cop}^ of it ; I think it is in those exhibits.
Mr. Eslick. Our information is, Doctor, they can marry only
30 times in 10 years. Is not that it ?
The Chairman. I understood that was the law ; I do not know.
Mr. Eslick. I say that was stated to us as the law.
Doctor Reid. The point I want to make is that in a country that
has monogeny, as we have here, and considering we have the most
4 INVESTIGATION" OF COMMUNIST PROPAGANDA
wonderful public health laws in the world, yet we have listed over
one million active cases of syphilis in this country, and for God's
sake who will attempt to say what will happen if you turn everybody
loose and allow them to change mates every year. Professional men
are trying to stop that very thing by legislation and education, and
feel very proud of what we did in the World War with the men we
took over there and the percentage of men who returned just as
healthy as they went away. Have I made that point clear?
I want to call your attention — you are speaking about the work
that is going on in the colleges — to this magazine here (exhibiting).
I am entering that as an exhibit. On page 23 is a report of the
National Students Conference by Rubin Levin, in Milwaukee, Wis.,
during the new year vacation.
Mr. Bachmann. What is the date of that pamphlet you are speak-
ing about ?
Doctor Reid. This was in 1927.
Mr. Bachmann. And what is it ? I want you to say for the record
what it is?
Doctor Reid. It is the Haldeman-Julius Quarterly Magazine.
(The article above referred to was marked as an exhibit, " Reid
No. 3.")
At that meeting, there were 3,000 young men and women delegates,
who were representatives of TOO colleges and universities in the
United States. That is taken from their own statement. This is
offered as another example of how T communism is working in our
universities, building communism with noncommunistic hands, so to
speak. And in that meeting, they stressed particularly the sex prob-
lem and there is a picture of two young ladies there [exhibiting].
That certainly could not have been a disagreeable subject.
Exhibit No. 4 is offered as another exhibit illustrating how the
socialists succeed in teaching communism to the students of our uni-
versities.
Mr. Bachmann. Let us get it identified here: What is Exhibit
No. 4?
Doctor Reid. It is offered as an illustration of how the socialists
succeed in teaching communism to students of our universities.
Mr. Bachmann. I know; but what is the pamphlet you have
there ?
Doctor Reid. It is the program of such meetings in Milwaukee,
Wisconsin.
Mr. Bachmann. What is the date of it ?
Doctor Reid. December 28 to 30, 1927.
Mr. Bachmann. Will you mark that as an exhibit?
(The paper above referred to was marked as an exhibit, "Reid
No. 4.")
Doctor Reid. I attended as a delegate and personally witnessed the
activities of the Annual Intercollegiate Conference of the League
for Industrial Democracy in New York City. It had for its general
topic The Student and the Social Order. That meeting was held in
room 301, The Hall of Philosophy, in Columbia University. I want
to enter here what I heard there/ I heard Dr. Harry F. Ward, who
is the professor of religious ethics in Union Theological Seminary,
in New York City, on December 28, 1927, in discussing the subject
Present Day Capitalism in America, make the insinuation that
INVESTIGATION OF COMMUNIST PROPAGANDA 5
armed revolution was the only remedy effective against present-day
injustices as he saw them. It happened in his description of the
miners' strike in Colorado. After criticising labor injunctions and
describing the efforts of the Civil Liberties Union to help the strik-
ing miners through its legal department, he then raised his hands
and said, "Well, what next?" We all understood what he meant.
Mr. Bachmann. Where is he now?
Doctor Keid. He is in New York, still teaching religious ethics in
the Union Theological Seminary. It is right up in the hall, right
next to Columbia University.
Mr. Bachmann. Do you know how many students attend that
college ?
Doctor Keid. No, I do not. It is an old institution.
Mr. Bachmann. Is it a large one ?
Doctor Reid. Yes, sir; very large.
The Chairman. It is one of the largest?
Doctor Reid. It is one of the largest of its kind. It is a theologi-
cal seminary, one of the largest, if not the largest.
The Chairman. Well, it is the best known?
Doctor Reid. Well, it is very well known. On December 29, 1927,
at the same meeting, an invitation was extended to the delegates to
attend a buffet dinner which was to be held at the home of Norman
Thomas, No. 118, East Eighteenth Street, New York City. I
accepted the invitation and attended the dinner with from 80 to 100
other student delegates. After the dinner, we were shown a moving
picture of Social and Industrial Russia. The picture which was
shown included the Kremlin and its surroundings, also Lenin's tomb.
The caption over the entrance of the Kremlin which read thus,
" Religion is an Opiate for the People," had been expurgated by our
own censor before the picture was allowed to be exhibited in this
country. This fact was explained in detail, with criticism by Nor-
man Thomas, which provoked a great deal of merriment, cat calls,
and so forth, among all of us there. After the moving picture had
been shown, an evening of singing and an open forum on communism
was held. A general discussion of communism, socialism, and
kindred subjects was headed by Norman Thomas, Harry W. Laid-
ler, Robert Morss Lovett, and others whose names I do not know.
They were strangers to me. The opinions on communism and its
ideals were all of a favorable tone. During the musical, the songs
that I have offered in that exhibit, were sung with much gusto, par-
ticularly the Internationale (song No. 3), and the Red Flag (song
No. 11), the two most well-known communistic songs.
Your attention is further invited to the article Harry Laidler's
Activities, on page 2 of the News Bulletin. He has gone through
the country extensively and continually and in that particular report
I think he cites 180 lectures to colleges and universities he had given.
Mr. Bachman. Is he a teacher in some college or university?
Doctor Reid. He is one of the leaders and organizers of the League
for Industrial Democracy.
Mr. Bachman. He does not teach in any school or university?
Doctor Reid. Not to my knowledge ; no, sir. Many people in this
country are unaware that this work is being carried on in secret ; that
is, a part of it. Much of their work is carried on according to the
D INVESTIGATION OF COMMUNIST PROPAGANDA
traditions of Weishaupt, Car] M;ux. and the direct orders of Lenin
and his associate-.
Mr. Nelson. Who did you say?
Doctor Reid. Most people are unaware that the Soviets are operat-
ing a secret service in this country. Much of thoir work is carried
on according to the traditions of Weishaupt, Carl Marx, and the
direct orders of Lenin and his associates, either secretly, or in a
deceptive manner — much of it. Of course, the detailed method and
extent are not fully known ; therefore — and here is my point — it
it hoped that this committee will go into this particular phase of the
question thoroughly and make an adequate report.
I want to tell you, briefly, about a personal experience in relation
to this very point which seems to me very strong circumstantial
evidence that the Soviets have a line of communication which in some
manner penetrates into the facts possessed by our military establish-
ment. In 1924, Mrs. Reid and I spent a year visiting Africa, India,
the Malay States, Australia, and New Zealand, studying communism
and socialism. You are undoubtedly familiar with the assertion
that Australia and New Zealand, in particular, are considered the
most advanced sociological laboratory in the world. We went down
to Brisbane, Queensland, to look over the scheme of state socialism,
witnessed its practical application, and saw the wheels go round, so
to speak. We then went on from there to Sidney, where the com-
munists are very strong. They own their own office building and
printing plant, where they publish a daily paper and a weekly paper,
magazines and books, and distribute an immense amount of material.
I met the nephew of Judge Hutchinson, the famous labor man in
the courts of arbitration in Australia, and attended many of the
communist meetings in company with him.
Mr. Nelson. Doctor, you would not consider there had been any-
thing very secret about the work of the communists in this country
since 1924, since the Department of Justice ceased its activities,
would you? It has been quite open, has it not?
Doctor Reid. I think it has and this incident I am offering hap-
pened in 1925, that I am coming to right now.
Mr. Nelson. Well in 1919 and 1920, the party was virtually out-
lawed, was it not, both by the order of the Secretary of Labor stat-
ing that membership in the Communist Party, per se, made a man
deportable, and its support by the court?
Doctor Reid. Yes, sir. I became very much interested concerning
communism during this visit down in Australia; so. when I came
back, I thought the best time to investigate it was right then and
there, and the best place to find out about it was in Russia.
Mr. Nelson. Is that communism in Australia and New Zealand,
or socialism?
Doctor Reid. I am talking about communism there.
Mr. Nelson. There is communism and socialism both ?
Doctor Reid. Yes, sir.
The Chairman. There is communism in New Zealand, besides
socialism ?
Doctor Reid. Yes, sir.
The Chairman. Are they distinct parties in New Zealand?
Doctor Reid. They are, sir.
INVESTIGATION OF COMMUNIST PROPAGANDA /
The Chairman. Separate parties, fighting one another?
Doctor Reid. Not fighting, only as attorney's fight.
The Chairman. They run on separate tickets, do they?
Doctor Reid. No, sir.
The Chairman. Then I for one can not give much credence to
any proposition there is a Communist Party and a Socialist Party
there ; because, if they are working together and do not run different
candidates, we are not interested in socialism at all: at least, we are
not directed to investigate socialism and, if they do not run separate
tickets, I think we had better not waste the time of the committee
going into that.
Mr. Bachmann. It is outside of the scope of the jurisdiction of the
committee, anyway.
Mr. Nelson. But the gentlemen is here as a witness and he has
stated that in Australia and New Zealand, whether we believe it or
not
The Chairman. They have socialism; yes.
Mr. Nelson. And he said communism.
The Chairman. But he says there are no communist candidates.
Mr. Nelson. I think it is of interest if there is socialism in New
Zealand and Australia ; furthermore, I do not see how we can
investigate communism without investigating socialism, to a certain
extent.
The Chairman. "Well; I have no objection to proceeding along
the lines of his statement, if the committee has time to hear it.
Mr. Nelson. "Well, I asked him if there was communism in New
Zealand and Australia, and he said there was.
Doctor Reid. Further, sir, I told you they own their own build-
ings ; they are there as a political and commercial organization.
Mr. Bachmann. Mr. Chairman, I do not think we want to take
the time going to any extent into anything which is in New Zealand.
It is beyond the scope of the committee, and we are not interested
in that. Let us get clown to what he knows about the United States.
Doctor Reid. All right, sir.
May I bring this point out in regard to my personal experience?
When I returned to this country I went over to the State Depart-
ment. I knew I had a problem on nry hands to get into Russia, from
things I had heard. I went over to the State Department and the
State Department told me I could get in through Boris Skvirsky,
who at that time was conducting the Russian Trade Journal at
No. 2819 Connecticut Avenue. I called at this address and presented
my professional card, on May 4, 1925, saw the secretary and she told
me, if I wished to have a personal interview with Skvirsky, it would
be necessary for me to explain what my purpose was, and so forth
and so on. I did it. She gave me an appointment for the next day,
which was May 5, 1925, at 3 p. m. Now I want to make the point
very strongly that the first day I called there I presented nothing
but my personal card, " Dr. William B. Reid/' I called the next
day, at the time of appointment, was shown in the private office of
Boris Skvirsky, who greeted me with, in a questioning tone, " I have
the privilege of meeting Colonel "William B. Reid ? r And right
here I want to emphasize that point ; that is a pertinent point to me :
How did this man, Skvirsky, who, up until that moment was an
entire stranger whom I had never seen before, learn the fact I was
8 INVESTIGATION OF COMMUNIST PROPAGANDA
a colonel in the Officers' Reserve Corps in the United States Army?
This information he got in some way within 36 hours after I had
made my first appearance in that office.
He then put me through the third degree as to my past, present,
and future hopes, ambitions, and so forth, and laid particular stress
on the question as to why I wanted to visit Russia. I explained to
him in detail it was purely for scientific study and personal educa-
tion. He sent me up to New York to interview a Doctor Lemoshko,
who was commissioner of health, Norkonesdow, Moscow, who, he
said, might be able to arrange for me to get into Russia.
I went up to New York the next day and tried to get in contact
with Lemoshko, to get an appointment to see him and to talk to him.
I was not able to do it. He sailed the next day for Russia. I then
came back to Washington and saw Skvirsky again. He then at-
tempted to send me to Dr. M. Michailoosky, No. 18 East Forty-first
Street, New York City. This was the same address that was given
where the other man was stopping and I called his attention to that
and said it would be useless for me to go back there, running around,
spending my money on the railroads. I succeeded in drawing him
out and finally coaxed out of him the opinion that he did not think
it would be possible for me to get into Russia. In explanation, he
gave two important points, that he believed it would be contrary to
the policy of the Soviet Government to have commissioned officers
of any country who did not care to recognize them to enter their
territory and, furthermore, he said, " Now, Colonel, to be perfectly
frank with you, I don't believe you would get anything out of it."
When asked to explain this last remark, he said that it would be
impossible for me to comprehend the principles of communism and
went on to explain further by asking me if I had ever known a per-
son who was tone-deaf and unable to distinguish one musical note
from another. I said I had known such a person, the late Dr. Boris
Sidis, of Boston, whose brother was at that time living in Moscow,
or a little town right outside of Moscow. This information thawed
him out a little bit and he said, " Now, of course, Doctor, I am not
insinuating any personal lack of intelligence, but it is the same thing
as a person being color-blind. You are a bourgeois and you were
born a bourgeois and it would be just as impossible for you to grasp
the principles of communism as it would be for the person who is
color-blind to distinguish red from green." And I have never suc-
ceeded in getting into Russia, although I have made other attempts.
In conclusion, may I offer as Exhibit No. 5 in answer to the oft-
repeated question, " Is Communism making headway in this
country? "
Mr. Bachmann. What is Exhibit No. 5 ?
Doctor Reid. A graphic chart from the Daily Worker, which shows
in 1924 there were 14 States where it was possible for members of
the Workers Party to vote for candidates in their organization.
Mr. Bachmann. Let the stenographer mark it.
(The paper above referred to was marked as an Exhibit " Reid
No. 5.")
Doctor Reid. In 1928 there were 34 States, showing a gain of 20 in
two years. There were 48,000 votes cast in 1928 for communist
candidates and, last week, information was given out at the office
of the Communist Party, by the statistician who is working in this,
INVESTIGATION" OF COMMUNIST PROPAGANDA 9
that at this last election there were over one hundred thousand votes
cast.
Mr. Bachmann. One hundred thousand votes cast for all candi-
dates who ran for office in the United States ?
Doctor Reid. Of the Communist Party ; yes, sir.
The Chairman. But you do not point out there that the 100,000
votes were cast in about 15 States, instead of 35 States.
Doctor Reid. Because I did not know it, sir. It is some more
information from you and I appreciate it. That was not an idle
statement there when I expressed my appreciation to you gentlemen.
I do really feel I have been carrying coals to Newcastle. I feel the
thing is in excellent hands and I know we will be something worth
while out of it from your efforts.
The Chairman. Have you any further information about the
activities of the communists in the colleges and universities besides
what you submitted ?
Doctor Reid. Yes, sir. I would be very glad to have you meet Mrs.
Reid, who will tell you a couple of instances, but what we have, sir,
is not legal evidence, because it has been passed to us by women who
were there.
The Chairman. I would be very glad to see and talk with Mrs.
Reid afterwards. Now, are there any questions by the committee?
You were never able to find out how Mr. Skvirsky learned you were
a Reserve Army officer?
Doctor Reid. No, sir. I have never seen him from that day until
this.
The Chairman. Doctor Reid, I am sure I am speaking for the com-
mittee and I want to thank you for coming here and testifying ; also,
for arranging this exhibit so that the public could see something of
the communist literature that is broadcasted in this country. It is
a very fine exhibit. Are you going to leave it here until to-morrow ?
Doctor Reid. I would be happy to leave it at your pleasure.
The Chairman. Could you leave it for two or three days?
Doctor Reid. If you would like to have it.
The Chairman. You have no objection to an announcement being
made to the House that it is over here, so that the Members can come
over here and see it, if they want to ?
Doctor Reid. Not in the least.
The Chairman. Thank you very much, Doctor, for coming down
here, and also for bringing the exhibit.
(The exhibits submitted by Doctor Reid are as follows:)
Reid Exhibit No. 3
Youth on the Warpath — A Report of the National Student Conference
(By Ruben Levin)
The great inimical force to traditional theology and to pious, unthinking
religion is to-day to be found among the young men and women of America's
colleges. Through fundamentalist glasses, the spectacle of the campus presents
itself as a spewing cauldron of irreligion, a hotbed of heresy. The view is
right. The youth of the institutions of higher learning is heretical. To it
the old beliefs, superstitions, miracles, myths, and rites that make up modern
religion are but relics of the childhood of man. The college youth, in large
part, now comprehends that intelligence and traditional religion can not mix
any more than oil and water.
10 INVESTIGATION OF COMMUNIST PROPAGANDA
The generation of the campus is mobilizing its disregard for hoary tradition,
its skepticism of theology, its passion for the liberty of all human beings, its
optimism in a brighter and more rational future for man — into a great critical
force of the social system.
It may have too much of enthusiasm and too little of fact. It may denounce
roundly and not analyze deeply. It may feel the evils of the social and
industrial order keenly, yet proffer few remedies that are adequate. Never-
theless, it is driven by a discontent that has not entirely become blunted by
the cynicism of the disillusioned nor the hopelessness of the frustrated.
The American university youth movement was demonstrated at its best at
the national student conference of 3,000 young men and women held in Mil-
waukee, Wis., during the New Year vacation period. There were repre-
sentatives of 700 colleges and universities and members of 40 races. They
spent five days, not in the rah-rah spirit of the business convention, not in
the profound paper-reading spirit of the professional convention, but in earnest
inquiry into the panorama of this world by daily discussion groups on sex,
science, capitalism, militarism, the human factor in industry, weaknesses and
defects of university education, equality of races, socialism and communism,
and religion.
There were students frankly atheistic and irreligious; students radical on
social and economic issues ; students desperately searching for reality in intel-
lectual turmoil and the sense of moral disintegration ; students mystical in
spirit and in name ; students seeking deeper spiritual experience.
They came " haunted by a dream of richness, beauty, and strength which life
should afford," to use the words of A. Bruce Curry, of New York, chairman
of the conference. " It was a dream strikingly in contrast with the muddled,
thwarted existence which seems to be about all that most people can manage.
Students want to live ' bravely, colorfully, freely,' but find life about them
poured into molds which somehow defeat this aim — molds of institution, custom,
and attitude.
" Youth is in a mood to question and to doubt all such attitudes, customs, and
institutions on which society has banked — the home, the school, the church,
the State, the economic order, with all their rules, regulations, and assumptions."
Youth did doubt. Very emphatically it doubted militarism and capitalism.
Kirby Page, editor of the World To-morrow, and George A. Coe, professor at
the Teachers College of Columbia University and a member of the committee
on militarism in education, helped the young men and women to multiply
their doubts and strengthen their opposition to the " militaristic and imperial-
istic " policy of this Nation.
" There is a rising tide of misundertanding, suspicion, fear, and hatred against
us in Europe, Asia, and Latin America," Kirby Page told the students. " Some
months ago 20,000 French veterans paraded the streets of Paris in passionate
protest against our Government's attitude on the debt question. The people
of Japan were deeply wounded by the burning insult administered by Congress
in the method of excluding the immigrants. The people of India were greatly
stirred by the recent decision of the United State Supreme Court debarring
Hindus from the rights of citizenship in this country. Antiforeign propaganda
is widespread in China. Deep resentment is felt in the Philippines over our
failure to grant the promised independence.
"Only, the blindest of the blind can fail to see that further travel down
the road of suspicion, fear, bitterness, hatred, and armaments will lead to the
precipice of war and devastation. Yet the startling fact is that few people
are doing anything to change the direction in which the Nation is now traveling.
Blindly and carelessly we are staggering toward the chasm."
At the closing session of the conference, upon a resolution on war, "27
students of 1,518 students who remained, voted to give no aid to any future
war the United States may enter; 740 to support some wars and not others;
95 to support all wars ; while 356 were noncommittal.
The students placed themselves on record, almost without dissent, against
capitalism. Only 38 delegates favored the capitalist system in its present
form ; 800 declared that such a system, based on production for profit instead
of use, was wrong ; 388 promised help to reform capitalism by doing all in their
power to strengthen and improve the organized-labor movement ; 592 wanted
a cooperative, distributive system in which the workers share control ; 57
thought communism preferable and more in accord with ideas of brotherhood.
Almost unanimously, they decided that they were ready to give the members
of other races the same opportunities that they themselves now have and that
they would deny to other races no privileges that they claim for themselves.
INVESTIGATION OF COMMUNIST PROPAGANDA H
They called upon the universities and colleges to provide better opportunities
to learn the facts of international relations, causes and cure of war, the human
factor in industry and causes of discontent in the factory. They demanded
complete freedom to bring speakers of the radical minority to their campuses.
YOUTH ON THE WARPATH
The riddle of the reconciliation of science and religion occupied the students
during several discussion periods, conducted by a theologian, G. A. Studdert
Kennedy, chaplain to the King of England ; a scientist, Dr. Robert A. Millikan,
famous physicist and a Nobel prize winner in 1923 : and a philosopher, Filrner
Northrup, professor of philosophy of science at Yale University.
The extent to which the human factor is considered in industry was studied
at first hand by the students under the direction of Jerome Davis, sociologist,
who conducted trips through the factories of Milwaukee.
Socialism and communism were examined by the students in several groups
under the guidance of Mayor Daniel W. Hoan, head of Milwaukee's socialist
administration, and J. Louis Eugdahl, an editor of the Daily Worker, Chicago.
Probably the most startling part of the conference was the frank seminar on
sex, led for two days by Dr. Editb H. Swift, lecturer for the American Social
Hygiene Association, with an audience of almost half the young men and
women present at the conference.
The sex discussion, termed the most candid of its kind known to American
student groups, encouraged the young ment and women to divulge their sex
problems, delve into current sex standards and develop new sex criteria. ' ; Sex
is not bad ; bring it out into the light ; overcome the repressions and inhibitions
that now stifle men and women," was the theme of the discussion, as expressed
by Doctor Swift.
The students of both sexes, most in their early twenties, many in their late
teens, inquired into premarital sex relations, free love, venereal disease, bh*th
control, illegitimacy, homosexuality, the cult of Buchmanism, petting, dancing,
and other subjects relating to sex.
" There is no apology for sex," said Doctor Swift, introducing the seminar.
" It exists. It is of paramount importance in the human scheme. In it are
bound up all the love impulses of life. Frequently these impulses are diverted
into channels of altruism. This must be made clear to young people if we ex-
pect them to use their minds and their bodies for the highest good."
Many of the students came to the sex symposium to get a few thrills. Many
sought to gain the admission from Doctor Swift that free love was permissible
and obeyed natural, physical needs. The majority, however, came to inquire
sincerely and earnestly into the subject of sex and to relieve repressions by
free, untrammeled talk upon the subject. They were looking for the light,
seeking a way out of the whole sex mess, as they were out of all the problems
now perplexing them.
What the effect of the conference will be only time can tell. Many of the
delegates will undoubtedly pass through an emotional slump following the en-
thusiasm of the conference. But leaders were confident that whatever eager-
ness does remain in the hearts of the students will be sufficient to leave re-
markable impress on the campuses to which they return — an impress of inde-
pendence in thought and action, of rationalism, and of irreligion in the eccepted
sense of the term.
It is to the youth of a nation, of the world, that the nation or the world looks
for indications of its future. The trent of youth is decisive — the fervor may
cool, the brighter colors may fade, but the essential change is there and it will
influence and color the years to come. Youth of to-day offers civilization a
hope of better things — less intolerance, less superstition, less pandering to con-
ventions and institutions for their own sake. Youth is determined to know the
why and the wherefore, to have reasons for what it does, however misguided,
for a little time, some^of those reasons may be. Ultimately, beyond a doubt,
youth will find the right reasons ; youth is dynamic, and the force of healthy
life can never err far from the way that is best and fullest for all that life
holds. And youth is courageous — it will always dare to do what its elders have
lost the vim and impulsiveness to attempt. Once a tradition is really defied and
shown to be outgrown, it is ended ; once the new is tried and found to be
worthy, it is won.
12 INVESTIGATION OF COMMUNIST PROPAGANDA
RETD Exhibit NO. 4
Annual Intercollegiate Conference of the League for Idustrial Democ-
racy, New York City — "The Student and the Social Order"
Wednesday, December 28, 1921
10 to 12.30 p. m. Room 301, Philosophy Hall, Columbia University, East of Co-
lumbia Library; reached via the One Hundred and Sixteenth Street station of
the Broadway subway of I. R. T.
Subject : Present-Day Capitalism in America. What are the positive values
of capitalism? What are its defects? Can industrial waste, social insecurity,
unjust inequality of wealth, industrial tyranny and war be eliminated under
capitalism? How necessary is the profit motive to industrial progress?
Speakers : Ivy Lee, public relations counsellor ; Prof. Harry F. Ward, Union
Theological Seminary.
Chairman : Ludwig C. Hirning, president of Social Problem Club, Columbia ;
Hillman Bishop, chairman of students' conference committee, will make a
few announcements.
2 to 5 p. m. — Room 301, Philosophy Hall, Columbia University
Continuation of discussion on functioning of Present Day Capitalism, par-
ticularly in its relation to labor and to imperialism.
Chairman : Beatrice Heiman, of Barnard.
Speaker : Tom Tippett, Brookwood.
Discussion leader : Prof. Rexford Tugwell, Columbia, author of American
Economic Life.
6.30 p. m. — Buffet Supper to Delegates at the home of Mr. and Mrs. Norman
Thomas, 20G East 18th Street, New York City
Exhibition of Russian films ; brief remarks by some members of the student
delegation to Russia.
Thursday, December 29,1921
10 to 12.30—301 Philosophy Hall, Columbia University
Chairman : An officer of Vassar Chapter.
The students at this session will divide into four groups to consider the fol-
lowing subjects : Liberal activities on the campus. What are students now
doing on the American campus to promote social justice, international peace
and racial tolerance, to fight the spirit of militarism and to promote academic
freedom? How should they conduct their liberal activities so as to be of max-
imum influence?
Discussion Leader : Paul Blanshard, field secretary, L. I. D.
Advisers : The students and Felix Cohen, Harvard Law School ; Justine Wise,
Yale Law ; Hairy W. Laidler ; and others.
Education as a Road to Freedom. Is the modern educational system develop-
ing intelligence and social idealism or conformity and a spirit of materialism?
Is it propagandists ? Has propaganda, has dogma, a place in the educational
process? Does the lecture system or scientific class discussion best develop
creative intelligence? What of workers' education? How should the educa-
tional system be reorganized so as to contribute the maximum results to social
reconstruction?
Discussion leader : A. D. Black, of the New York Ethical Culture School.
Advisers: George S. Counts, professor of education. Teacher's College, and
technical adviser trade-union delegation to Russia, 1927 ; Tom Tippett, of
Brookwood; Robert Morss Lovett, of the University of Chicago (probably).
The Value of Political Act On. How should "'political action" be best de-
fined? What can be accomplished by political action in bringing about a new
social order? What are its limitations? Should those desiring a new order
work through the old party machinery? If not. what should be the nature of
a third party? How can college students aid in a labor party movement?
D'scussion leader: Peter H. Odegard, instructor in government, Columbia.
Advisers : Louis Waldman, ex-Socialist Assemblyman, labor attorney ; Solon
DeLeon, editor American Labor Year Book.
The Class Struggle and Labor Unionism. Is there a class struggle in Amer-
ica? Are there several class struggles? Should the existence of a class strug-
INVESTIGATION OF COMMUNIST PROPAGANDA 13
gle be emphasized? How should labor unions wage the class struggle? To
what extent should labor unions cooperate with employers in producing a more
efficient industry?
Discussion leader : William B. Spofford, of the C. L. I. D.
Advisers : William P. Hapgood. of the Columbia Conserve Co. ; J. S. Potofsky,
assistant secretary, Amalgamated Clothing Workers; Benjamin Stolberg and
McAlister Coleman.
Note. — A number of the expert advisers are interested in two or more of the
subjects discussed and are likely to be called upon to be present for a time at
other groups than those stated on the program.
2 to 5 p. m. — 301 Philosophy Hall, Columbia University
Chairman : William George Fennell, Yale. Continuation of discussion of
groups.
6 30 p. m. — Irving Plaza, 17 Irvin Place (corner Fifteenth Street), New York
City
Annual dinner of the league on Political Prospects for 192S.
Speakers : United States Senator Gerald P. Nye, of North Dakota ; Norman
Hapgood, author of Biography of " Al " Smith ; Max Eastman, writer ; Norman
Thomas, executive director, League for Industrial Democracy.
Chairman : Robert Morss Lovett.
Tickets for the dinner are .$2.50. Balcony seats after S.30 available for
students at 50 cents apiece ; others $1.
Friday, December 30, 1927
10 to 12.30 — Room 301, Philosophy Hall, Columbia University
Chairman: Simeon Gerson, City College, New York.
Reporters appointed from the four discussion groups will give the findings
of the three groups on " Education," " Politics," and the " Class Struggle" to
the main group of delegates. The reports will be followed by discussion.
2 to 5 p. m. — 301 Philosophy Hall, Columbia University
Chairman : William A. Hunt, Dartmouth.
Report of findings of group on "Liberal Activities on the -Campus." Dis-
cussion on What Students Can Do in Their Vocations Following College Days.
Norman Thomas will give the closing address.
8 p. m. — Earl Hall, Columbia University, West of Columbia Library
Skits entitled li The Average Man," " Twisting the Lion's Tail," " The Sand-
wich Men," etc., arranged by Gertrude Weil Klein, Sam Friedman, and others.
The cast will include Hillman Bishop, Georg.'ana Volze, Betty Dublin, William
P. Mangold, and Ambrose Doskow. There will also be skits arranged by the
individual colleges. These will be followed by a dance. Tickets, 75 cents.
The Students' Conference Committee includes Wendell Wheeler and Cecil
Headrick, of Union Theological Seminary ; Ambrose Doskow, of Columbia ;
Georgiana E. Volze and Irrna Rittenhouse, Barnard ; Ida Patigalia, of Brook-
wood ; Arthur Wubnig and J. L. Afros, of New York University; William P.
Mangold, Yale, 1927; Felix S. Cohen, Harvard; Simon Gerson, A. Lifschitz,
Winston Dancis, of City College, New York; S. I. Rothenberg, of University
of Pennsylvania ; Sam Friedman. Hillman Bishop. Columbia, 1926, chairman.
League for Industrial Democracy chapters and affiliated groups are entitled to
2 delegates for the first 10 members and 1 delegate for every succeeding 10
members. Other college students, faculty members, and members of the league
will be welcome at the various sessions of the conference as visitors.
Students who expected to attend the conference are requested to send notice
to the office of the League for Industrial Democracy, 70 Fifth Avenue, New
York City, as soon as possible. It is especially important that we should know
how many will be present at the Wednesday evening supper and the Thursday
evening dinner. Please share this program with any who may be interested.
For further information apply to Hillman Bishop, chairman of the students'
committee, or Harry W. Laidler, executive director of the League for Industrial
Democracy, 70 Fifth Avenue, New York City.
119651— 31— pt 1, vol 5 2
14 INVESTIGATION OF COMMUNIST PROPAGANDA
League fob Industrial Dehocbacx Songs, 1925
1. THE MAliCH OF THE WOKKEES
(William Morris)
Air: John Brown's Body
What is this the sound and rumor? What is this that all men hear?
Like the winds in hollow valleys when the storm is drawing near?
Like the rolling on of ocean in the even tide of fear?
'Tis the people marching on.
Chorus:
Hark the rolling of the thunder,
Lo the sun ! and lo thereunder
Biseth love and hope and wonder,
And the hosts come marching on.
These are they who build thy houses, weave thy raiment, win thy wheat,
Smooth the rugged, till the barren, turn the bitter into sweet,
All for thee this day — and ever. What reward for them is meet?
Till the host comes marching on.
Chorus : Hark, etc.
*
Many a hundred years passed over have they labored deaf and blind ;
Never tidings reached their sorrow, never hope their toil might find.
Now at last they've heard and heard it, and the cry comes down the wind,
And their feet are marching on.
Chorus: Hark, etc.
On we inarch then, we the workers, and the rumor that ye hear
Is the blended sound of battle and deliv'rance drawing near,
For the hope of every creature is the banner that we bear,
And the world is marching on.
Chorus : Hark, etc.
2. TO TABOR
(Charlotte Perkins Oilman)
Air: Maryland, My Maryland.
Shall you complain who feed the world,
Who clothe the world.
Who house the world?
Shall you complain who are the world.
Of what the world may do?
As from this hour
You use your power
The world may follow you.
The world's life hangs in your right hand,
Your strong right hand,
Your skilled right hand.
See to it that you do.
Or dark or light,
Or wrong or right,
The world is made by you.
Then rise as you never rose before,
Nor hoped before,
Nor dared before,
And show as was never shown before
The power that lies in you.
Stand all as one —
See justice done ;
Believe and dare and do.
INVESTIGATION OF COMMUNIST PROPAGANDA 15
3. THE INTERNATIONALE
(Eugene Potter)
Arise, ye prisoners of starvation !
Arise, ye wretched of the earth,
For justice thunders condemnation,
A better world's in birth.
No more tradition's chains shall bind us,
Arise, ye slaves ! no more in thrall !
The earth shall rise on new foundations,
We have been naught, we shall be all.
Chorus
"Tis the final conflict,
Let each stand in his place.
The international party
Shall be the human race.
'Tis the final conflict,
Let each stand in his place.
The international party
Shall be the human race.
4. BROTHERHOOD
(Edwin Markham)
Air: Die Wacht am Rheln
The crest and crowning of all good
Life's final star is brotherhood ;
For it will bring again to earth
Her long-lost poesy and mirth.
'Twill bring new light to every face,
A kingly power upon the race ;
And till it conies, we men, we men are slaves,
And travel downward to the dust of graves.
Come, clear the way, then clear the way,
The fear of kings has had its day.
Break the dead branches from the path,
Our hope is in the aftermath.
Our hope is in heroic men
Star-led to build the world again.
To this event the mighty ages ran.
Make way for brotherhood ; make way for man.
5. MARCHING SONG
Air: Tramp, Tramp, Tramp, the Boys are Marching
In our poverty and toil
Looking out upon the world,
We can see the gathering armies of the cause,
And we feel ourselves a part
Of the new resistless power,
That shall sweep away oppression and its laws.
Chorus
Tramp, tramp, tramp, you hear us marching,
Millions now are on the way,
And our army ne'er shall pause
Till the right to live is ours,
And the sun has risen on a fairer day.
In the days that are to be
When the cause we love has won,
We shall labor for ourselves and for our own ;
Each for all and all for each,
And through many joyful years
We shall pluck the fruit that comrades brave have sown.
Chorm: Tramp, tramp, tramp, etc.
16 INVESTIGATION OF COMMUNIST PROPAGANDA
6. BATTLE HYMN' OF THE REPUBLIC
(Julia Ward Howe)
Air: John Brown's Body
Mine eyes have seen the glory of the coming of the Lord,
He is tramping out the vintage where the grapes of wrath are stored ;
He hath loosed the fateful lightning of His terrible swift sword,
His truth is marching on.
I have seen Him in the watch-fires of a hundred circling camps,
They have builded Him an altar in the evening dews and damps ;
I can read His righteous sentence by the dim and flaring lamps,
His day is marching on.
He hath sounded forth the trumpet that shall never call retreat,
He is sifting out the hearts of men before His judgment seat;
O be swift, my soul, to answer Him, be jubilant, my feet !
Our God is marching on.
7. we're comrades ever
Air: Santa Lucia
Comrades awaiting me, hearts warm and tender,
To them, where'er I be, my love I'll render.
Under broad heaven's dome,
Where'er on earth I roam,
With them I feel at home —
We're comrades ever !
That name so true and strong, title endearing,
Let it resound in song, our life course cheering.
Bound by a deathless tie,
A cause that can not die ;
Hark, hark the welcome cry :
We're comrades ever !
When'er I'm sad or sore, lonely or weary,
Dark clouds a-hovering o'er, the world all dreary,
Then mem'ries sweet and clear
Throng in from far and near ;
They come my soul to cheer —
We're comrades ever !
So comrades, one and all, be our endeavor
To heed Humanity's call — let naught us sever !
A unit be our band,
For brotherhood we stand —
We're comrades ever!
S. THE PEOPLE'S HYMN
Air: The Marseillaise.
Ye sons of freedom, wake to glory !
The day of triumph is at hand !
Crowned in song and throned in story
The people rise in ev'ry land !
The people rise in ev'ry land !
Their ancient birthright, the product of their labor,
Shall be restored to them again,
And no more shall toil in vain
A slave exploited by his neighbor.
INVESTIGATION OF COMMUNIST PROPAGANDA 17
Chorus:
Democracy, arise !
Your standard is unfurled !
Unite ! Unite ! One law for all !
Let justice rule the world !
The blood of heroes, bravely falling
To give their children liberty,
From the ground to you is calling :
A sovereign people must be free !
A sovereign people must be free !
Say, can you live clothed in feudal degradation,
Eat husks and sleep upon a stone,
While class greed robs you of your own?
No ! Men, demand emancipation.
Chorus : Democracy, arise, etc.
9. THE JUBILEE OF LABOR
(H. S. Casson)
Air: Marching Through Georgia.
Raise your voices, comrades, in. a loud and hearty song
Music is the enemy of tyranny and wrong;
Melody will help us to be resolute and strong,
As we are marching to freedom.
Cliorus:
Hurrah, hurrah, we'll bring the jubilee,
Hurrah, hurrah, the workers shall be free ;
So we'll sing a chorus from the center to the sea,
As we are marching to freedom.
When Labor is united we shall conquer every foe,
Right and might are on our side to bring usurpers low,
God is with the workingman, as everyone shall know,
As we are marching to freedom.
Chorus : Hurrah, hurrah, etc.
We mean to fight for justice and for equity again,
Long the new Grand Army has been gathering its men,
Many friends will help us on with ballot, voice, and pen,
As we are marching to freedom.
Chorus: Hurrah, hurrah, etc.
10. MY NATIVE LAND
(Fanny Bixby Spencer)
Air: America the Beautiful
My native land is all the world,
I know no lesser scope
Than vibrant earth and ocean spanned
By brotherhood and hope.
Upon a common soil sustained,
'Neath one all-nurturing sun,
Humanity in every aim
Must win or lose as one.
Where'er the mind of man hath scaled,
I count my country's gain,
And where my brother's blood is spilled,
I touch her carnal stain.
Writ clear upon the scroll of time,
Her cosmic growth I scan,
As God-lit thought reveals the law
Of love of man to man.
18 INVESTIGATION OF COMMUNIST PROPAGANDA
11. THE RED FLAG
( -1 1 1 1 1 Connell I
Air: Maryland, My Maryland
The people's flag is deepest red ;
It shrouded oft our martyred dead,
And ere their limbs grew stiff or cold
Their heart's blood dyed its ev'ry fold.
Chorus :
Then raise the scarlet standard high !
Within its shade we'll live and die.
Though cowards flinch and traitors sneer,
We'll keep the Red flag flying here.
It well recalls the triumphs past ;
It gives the hope of peace at last.
The banner bright, the symbol plain
Of human right and human gain.
Chorus: Then raise, etc.
With heads uncovered swear we all
To bear it onward till we fall.
Come dungeon dark, or gallows grim,
This song shall be our parting hymn.
Chorus: Then raise, etc.
12. ONWARD. FRIENDS OF FREEDOM
Air: Onward, Christian Soldiers
Toilers of the nations, thinkers of the time,
Sound the note of battle loud thro' ev'ry clime.
March ye 'gainst the tyrants, heedless of the steel
Be a band of brothers, speed the common weal.
Chorus:
Onward, friends of freedom, onward for the strife,
Each for all we struggle, one in death and life.
Toil we now no longer, For another's gain,
While our wives and children Pine in want and pain ;
Grieve we now no longer At another's good,
Let us all be brothers, Let us all have food !
13. ONCE TO EVERY MAN AND NATION
(James Russell Lowell)
Air: Austrian Hymn
Once to every man and nation
Comes the moment to decide.
In the strife of Truth with Falsehood,
For the good or evil side ;
Some great cause, God's new Messiah,
Offers each the bloom or blight, —
And the choice goes by for ever
'Twixt that darkness and that light.
Then to side with Truth is noble,
When we share her wretched crust,
Ere her cause bring fame and profit,
And 'tis prosperous to be just ;
Then it is the brave man chooses,
While the coward stands aside,
Till the multitude make virtue
Of the faith they had denied.
INVESTIGATION OF COMMUNIST PROPAGANDA 1<)
Though the cause of Evil prosper,
Yet 'tis Truth alone is strong;
Though her portion be the scaffold,
And upon the throne be Wrong —
Yet the scaffold sways the future,
And, behind the dim unknown,
Standeth God within the Shadow,
Keeping watch above His own.
14. WHEN WILT THOU SAVE THE PEOPLE
(Ebenezer Elliott)
Tune: Commonwealth
When wilt Thou save Thy People?
O God of mercy! when?
Not kings and lords, but nations !
Not thrones and crowns, but men !
Flowers of Thy heart, O God, are they ;
Let them not pass, like weeds, away —
Their heritage a sunless day !
God save the People !
Shall crime bring crime for ever,
Strength aiding still the strong?
Is it Thy will, O Father,
That man shall toil for wrong?
"No," say Thy mountains, "No." Thy skies;
"Man's clouded sun shall brightly rise,
And songs ascend instead of sighs !"
God save the People !
When wilt Thou save the People?
O God of mercy, when?
The People, Lord, the People !
Not thrones and crowns, but men !
God save the People ! Thine they are,
Thy children, as Thy angels fair ;
Save them from bondage and despair !
God save the People !
in. HYMN OF THE TOILERS
(Rose Alice Cleveland)
Air: America
O nation, strong and great.
For thine own honor's sake
Hear thou our call ;
We are thy children too,
From year to year we grew
Silent and patient thro'
Darkness and toil.
But, now, O nation strong,
To thee must truth belong,
Crown thou the right ;
We are thy children still,
Working with might and will,
Ne'er resting till we fill
The world with light.
20 INVESTIGATION OF COMMUNIST PROPAGANDA
16. THE HOPE OF T11K AGES
(E. Nesbit)
Air: Red, White and Blue
If you clam up the river of Progress
At your peril and cost let it be !
That river must seawards despite you
'Twill break down your dams and be free!
And we heed not the pitiful barriers
That you in its way have cast ;
For your efforts but add to the torrent,
Whose flood must o'erwhelm you at last !
Chorus
For our banner is rais'd and unfurled ;
At your head our defiance is hurled :
Our cry is the cry of the Ages —
Our hope is the hope of the World.
Whether leading the van of the fighters
In the bitterest stress of the strife,
Or patiently bearing the burden
Of changelessly common-place life,
One hope we have ever before us,
One aim to attain and fulfill,
One watchword we cherish to mark us
One kindred and brotherhood still !
Chorus: For our banner, etc.
17. TEUE FREEDOM
(James Russel Lowell)
Tune: St. George's Windsor
Men whose boast it is that ye
Come of fathers brave and free,
If there breathe on earth a slave —
Are ye tiuly free and brave?
If ye do not feel the chain
When it works a brother's pain,
Are ye not base slaves indeed —
Slaves unworthy to be freed?
Is true freedom but to break
Fetters for our own dear sake,
And with leathern hearts forget
That we owe mankind a debt?
No, true freedom is to' sliare
All the chains our brothers wear,
And with heart and hand to be
Earnest to make others free.
They are slaves who fear to speak
For the fallen and the weak ;
They are slaves who will not choose
Hatred, scoffing, and abuse
Rather than in science shrink
From the truth they needs must think ;
They are slaves who dare not be
In the right with two or three.
INVESTIGATION OF COMMUNIST PROPAGANDA 21
IS. THESE THINGS SHALL BE
(John Addington Symonds)
Tunc: Mendon
These things shall be ! a loftier race
Than e'er the world hath known, shall rise
With flame of freedom in their souls,
And light of science in their eyes.
They shall be gentle, brave, and strong,
To spill no drop of blood, but dare
All that may plant man't lordship firm
On earth, and fire, and sea, and air.
Nation with nation, land with land,
Unarm'd shall live as comrades free ;
In ev'ry heart and brain shall throb
The pulse of one fraternity.
New art shall bloom of loftier mould,
New arts shall bloom of loftier mould,
And mightier music thrill the skies,
And every life shall be a song,
When all the earth is paradise.
19. GO DOWN, MOSES
(Adapted by H. T. Burleigh)
When Israel was in Egypt's Ian'
Let my people go,
Oppres'd so hard they could not stand,
Let my people go.
Chorus:
Go down, Moses, 'way down in Egypt's Ian'
Tell ole Pharaoh to let my people go.
Thus saith The Lord, bold Moses said,
Let my people go,
If not I'll smite your first born dead,
Let my people go.
Chorus: Go Down, Moses, etc.
[News Bulletin, League for Industrial Democracy, New York City, December, 1927]
Our Intercollegiate Conference, New York City, December 28-30, 1927,
On the Student and the Social Order
The Student and the Social Order has this year been selected as the general
subject of the intercollegiate conference of the League for Industrial Democracy,
which will be held in New York City from Wednesday, December 28, to Friday,
December 30, 1927. Most of the sessions will be held in 301 Philosophy Hall,
Columbia University, as last year.
At the conclusion of the 1926 conference a students' committee was appointed
by the conference for the purpose of planning the 1927 program. This com-
niitte has been hard at work during the past few months under the chair-
maship of Hillman Bishop, Columbia, 1926, and the secretaryship of Georgiana
Volze. It has decided, at the suggestion of last year's conference, greatly to
increase the number of sessions devoted to informal student discussion from
the floor and to limit the number of set speeches by prominent lecturers to
a minimum.
22 INVESTIGATION OF COMMUNIST PROPAGANDA
As a result of tliis decision, the only sessions at which formal addresses are
being planned — outside of the annual dinner — are those of Wednesday morning,
December 28, and the first portion of a Wednesday afternoon. On Wednesday
morning there will be a symposium on The Functioning of Present Day Capi-
talism. Ludwig <'. Hirning, president of the Social Problems Club of Columbia,
will open the conference.
Ivy Lee, adviser in public relations to large corporate interests, will present
some of the positive values of capitalism, wdiile Prof. Harry F. Ward, of Union
Theological Seminary, will deal with the evils of the profit system.
This discussion will be continued ion Wednesday afternoon, when the con-
ference will discuss informally various phases of the social order, such as the
effect of capitalism on labor, capitalism and imperialism, etc. Tom Tippet of
Brookwood will be the principal speaker. Prof. Rexford Tugwell, of Columbia,
will act as discussion leader.
On Wednesday evening Mr. and Mrs. Norman Thomas have invited the dele-
gates to attend an informal reception at their home. Arrangements are being
made for a moving picture made during the visit of the students to Russia and
for brief talks by some of the Russian student delegation.
On Thursday morning and afternoon the delegates will divide into four
groups for discussion purposes. One group will discuss Liberal Activities on
the Campus ; a second group will deal with the Value of Political Action ; a
third group will take up the Class Struggle and Labor Unionism ; while a
fourth will consider the subject of Education as a Road to Freedom.
Among the speakers and expert advisers who, it is expected, will be present
at various sessions on Wednesday and Thursday are William P. Hapgood, of the
Columbia Conserve Co., Paul Blanshard, Norman Thomas, and Harry W.
Laidler of the League for Industrial Democracy, Robert Morss Lovett, presi-
dent of the league, Justine Wise of Yale, McAlister Coleman. Benjamin Stol-
berg, Al Black, Louis Waldman, Prof. George S. Counts, Felix Cohen, Solon
DeLeon, Peter H. Odegard, of Columbia, and William B. Spofford.
The big annual dinner of the league will be held on Thursday evening, De-
cember 29, at the Irving Plaza, 17 Irving Place, corner Fifteenth Street, New
York City, at 6.30 p. m.
The dinner will be devoted to a discussion of Political Prospects for 1928.
The speakers who have already accepted are Senator Gerald P. Nye, the
junior Senator from North Dakota, who will give the point of view of the pro-
gressive Republicans; Norman Hapgood, formerly editor of Colliers and co-
author of a biography of Gov. Alfred Smith, who will speak from the stand-
point of a progressive Democrat; Norman Thomas, who will represent the
Socialists; and Max Eastman. Robert Morss Lovell will preside.
On Friday morning and afternoon the four discussion groups will give their
reports to the general conference and the conference will discuss each report
separately. The afternoon also will be devoted to a consideration of the stu-
dents' contribution to social reconstruction following graduation. Norman
Thomas is being asked to deliver the concluding address.
On Friday evening students from various colleges are arranging skits to
be given at Earl Hall, Columbia, followed by a dance. Sam Friedman and
Gertrude Weil Klein among others are preparing the skits.
The student committee elected at the 1926 conference and other student
advisers who have been helping in the formation of the program follow :
Wendell Wheeler and Cecil Headrick, of Union Theological Seminary: Simon
Gerson, L. Rothenberg, A. Lifsehitz, and Winston Dancis, of Columbia Col-
lege, New York; Ambrose Doskow, of Columbia; William Mangold, Yale, 1927;
Arthur Wubnig and J. L. Afros, of New York University ; Georgiana T. Volze,
of Barnard; Hillman Bishop, of the New York Student's Council; Ida Pati-
galia, of Brookwood ; F. S. Cohen, of Harvard ; and Irma Rittenhouse. Mr.
Bishop is chairman.
Collegians and college groups planning to attend the conference should send
in their names at once. A final program will be mailed to those requesting
it. Students are asked to secure publicity for this conference in the college
papers and among all groups interested in social questions. Let us make
this conference the best ever !
INVESTIGATION OF COMMUNIST PROPAGANDA 23
LEAGUE FOB INDUSTRIAL DEMOCRACY SPEAKERS AND WRITERS BLAN SHARD RESUMES
COLLEGE LECTURING
After a leave of absence from college lecturing Paul Blanshard, field secre-
tary of the League for Industrial Democracy, has returned to the task with
renewed vigor. College students are welcoming him back to this field of activity
with large and attentive audiences. His first appearance of the educational
year was at Westtown School, Westtown, Pa., where he spoke to 200 prep
school students on Henry Ford to Bernard Shaw — Where is Industry Going?
On October IS he spoke on The Chinese Revolution, in Dartmouth College
under the auspices of the Dartmouth Round Table, and on November 2 he
appeared before a large audience of the People's Institute Forum of Newark.
N. J., and before the New York University Liberal Club he discussed industrial
conditions in the South.
In a tour of New England which began on November G he spoke at the
Progressive Club of Northampton the evening of November 6 and at Smith
College chapel on November 7. A group of Smith students met with Mr. Blan-
shard in the afternoon and decided to reorganize a liberal-discussion group.
Miss Stella Eskin is serving as temporary leader of this group.
From Smith College Mr. Blanshard went to Providence, where he spoke before
the Brown University Economics Club and to Amherst where he addressed the
Libera! Club and a class in political science.
At Middletown, Conn., on November 10 he talked at Berkeley Divinity School
and at the Wesleyan Forum.
On November 13 Mr. Blanshard revisited Clark University, where he spoke
before the student assembly and economics classes ; IS students became auxiliary
student members and formed a committee to reorganize the Clark University
Liberal Club. Going to Maine, Mr. Blanshard lectured at Bowdoin, Bangor
Seminary, the University of Maine, Colby College, and the Bangor Kiwanis
Club and Lions Club. Returning to Philadelphia on November 20, he addressed
the Labor Institute Forum.
He is planning a trip in the South during December and a trip in the middle
and far West in the spring.
REPORT OF NORMAN THOMAS
Summer, following our annual conference, is principally a matter of carrying
on the mass of routine but important work, wrestling with finances and whip-
ping into book form our conference proceedings, which book is becoming an
annual feature. With fall begins the more strenuous work of the academic
year. This year the Sacco-Vanzetti tragedy during the summer added a burden
of work and sorrow to our tasks. Our total failure to move the Massachusetts
authorities unquestionably darkens the future for all those who hoped in
reason and some sense of fair play to moderate the bitterness and violence
of the social struggle. But less than ever can we afford to give up the battle
against that terrible caste and class prejudice of which Sacco -and Vanzetti
were only the most conspicuous of recent victims.
A catalogue of my own activities since the Tamiment conference would
include (besides the routine work already referred to and the fight for Sacco
and Vanzetti) some cooperation with Doctor Laidler in editing and completing
Raushenbush's book on Giant Power, speeches at a Washington conference on
imperialism, at the Hillsdale conference of the Fellowship for a Christian
Social Order, the Bellport, Long Island forum, the conference of evangelical
laymen at Hornell, N. Y., a Debs memorial meeting in Buffalo and Baltimore,
a labor Chautauqua at Paterson, N. J., addresses at Yale, Princeton, Hunter
College, and College of the City of New York, cooperation in arranging the
Swarthmore Conference on Students in Industry, numerous speeches before
unions and other bodies in New York, a hard election campaign in the eighth
aldermanic district of New York — the fight against Tammany voting frauds
then uncovered is only beginning — and various continuing activities in connec-
tion with the Debs memorial radio, the Neckwear Makers fight (described
elsewhere), the revival of the Strikers Relief Committee also described else-
where and the organization of a Greco Carrillo committee.
24 INVESTIGATION OF COMMUNIST PROPAGANDA
This last deserves some words. Greco and Carrillo are two anti-Fascist
Italians now charged with the murder of two Fascists on last Decoration Day
in the Bronx, New York City. The murder was a hrutal affair hut there is a
growing body of evidence that Greco and Carrillo had nothing to do with it
but are the victims of the thirst of Fascists in America for a victim. America
can not afford another Saeco-Vanzetti case. While there is reason to hope for
a fair trial in the Bronx, the funds of these imprisoned workers are wholly
inadequate for the expense of investigation, etc., necessary to an adequate
defense and the Fascists will probably scruple at nothing to bring conviction.
Some sensational testimony may be adduced. The entrance of Clarence Dar-
row in the ease is encouraging, but I have felt justified in spending some time
at the request of various Italian groups in helping to get together the elements
that are or should be vitally concerned to see not only that these men get a
fair trial but that a Fascist drive on the Italian community in America is
checked. This drive menaces everything the League for Industrial Democracy
stands for. Thanks to the helpful efficiency of our office staff these activities
do not interfere with the organization of speaking trips and the rest of our
regular work.
Our president, Robert Morss Lovett, is chairman of the defense committee
to which we are temporarily lending office space.
Mr. Thomas will speak in a number of the western colleges in early 1928.
HARRY LAIDLER S ACTIVITIES
During the summer and fall Doctor Laidler assisted in the editing of the
proceedings of the summer conference ; completed the manuscript of H. S.
Raushenbush on Power ; began the writing of a new book on Recent Develop-
ments in Modern Capitalism in collaboration with Inez Pol'ak, research assis-
tant, and revised his pamphlet on Roads to Freedom, beside participating in
the administrative work of the league.
On October 13 Mr. Laidler visited his almo mater, Wesleyan University, and
spoke before a joint meeting of the Y. M. C. A. and a social science discussion
group and at the college assembly. While in Middletown he also spoke before
the students at Berkeley Divinity School. On October 26 the executive direc-
tor, together with Roberto Haberman, addressed the Liberal Club of the evening
session of the College of the City of New York on the Mexican Revolution.
On November 4 he lectured on Roads to Industrial Democracy before 100
students at Adelphi College followed by an informal discussion. Mr. Laidler
also conducted an active aldermanic campaign in Williamsburgh, Brooklyn,
during October. He is planning a short trip through the New York colleges
in December.
Doctor Laidler's History of Socialist Thought, published in May by Thomas
Y. Crowell & Co., and a product of the research department of the league, has
been widely and favorably reviewed in the press of the United States and of
England and -is now in its second edition. An English edition was published
this spring by Constable and negotiations are under way for the translation
of the book in other languages. " It is the only book of its kind," declares
Prof. E. A. Ross of the University of Wisconsin, " which makes it possible for
an educated man to observe the whole trend of socialist comment upon society.
With great clearness and impartiality it sets forth the characteristic ideas of
the various schools of socialist thought."
Savel Zimand in the New York Times refers to it as a " monumental work,"
" discriminating and comprehensive," and declares that he " has never encoun-
tered a more complete summary in English or in any other language."
Among other comments appear the following :
Sidney Webb: "My first reflection is one of congratulation to you on your
persistent industry in turning out so many books, each involving great research
and wonderful grasp of detail and immense range of knowledge. In this work
I think you have succeeded to a remarkable extent in seizing the salient features
of a great mental development, which, so far as England is concerned, seems to
me to be very accurately portrayed.
" I do not find anything to object to in your accounts of other countries, but
I am not sufficiently well acquainted with their evolution to feel the same assur-
ance as to accuracy."
Stuart Chase: "To the outlines of history, science, and religion, Doctor
Laidler adds the outline of socialism. It is a careful, thorough, and withal
INVESTIGATION OF COMMUNIST PEOPAGANDA 25
dramatic outline. Before us passes the great procession of the world's idealists
and dreamers — the divine fools of the ages, and some of the wisest men that
ever lived. * * * On a broad canvass the author has given us one of the
most poignant dreams that ever beset mankind."
Morris Hillquit : " Laidler's History of Socialist Thought is a monumental
work. In a single volume of less than 700 pages the author traces the varying
expressions of the socialist ideal from the fervent religious visions of the
prophets, the philosophic speculations of all ages, the romantic dreams of the
early nineteenth century Utopians, down to the variegated efforts at its prac-
tical realization by powerful bodies of organized workers in our days. It is a
thrilling story and reads like an entrancing novel. But few books of recent
date are as instructive and useful as this. It contains a wealth of information
collected and arranged with rare industry, skill* and discrimination. It is
authoritative, thorough, and complete and will be an indispensable aid and
guide to all students of this vital subject."
Harold J. Laski : " I know of nothing quite so useful for giving the general
reader an insight in the history of socialism."
Solon DeLeon in the Daily Worker : "As a handy reference to the various
schools of revolutionary and near-revolutionary thought there is no better single
volume in existence."
Vernon L. Parrington in New York Herald Tribune : " Mr. Laidler's book
might well have carried as a subtitle the words, A History of Social Idealism.
It is a record of heroic lives, of generous-minded men who have labored to build
the city of God on earth ; and it serves to remind us that there are other con-
ceivable ends for society than the familiar ones which most of us accept unques-
tionably. * * * One can not read it through without coming to think a
little better of that animal called man. What a noble company it is that Mr.
Laidler brings to us — choice spirits of diverse races and creeds and social faiths,
yet all one in the spirit, all disciples and servants of justice."
James Oneal in New Leader : " Universal in its sweep. * * * Not likely
to be replaced by any similar work for decades."
Dr. Benjamin M. Anderson, jr. : " Thorough, scholarly, fairminded."
Benjamin Stolberg: "I read your book into the early hours of the morning.
It reads like a novel. It is really a romance of human decency."
New Leader, London : "An invaluable and admirably unbiased summary of
the various schools of socialist thought."
Daily Herald (England) : "A compendium, almost an encyclopaedia of so-
cialist thought."
Socialist Review (England) : "I welcome with great joy Doctor Laidler's
new book. * * * It is noteworthy for its impartiality and fairness."
Orders for the book are being received by the League ($3.50).
RECENT PUBLICATIONS OF THE LEAGUE FOB INDUSTRIAL DEMOCRACY
Prosperity? Vanguard Press, 50 cents (described elsewhere).
More Power to You. By Evelyn Preston (League for Industrial Democracy,
5 cents). A readable 16-page pamphlet packed full of facts on the power sit-
uation. Here you can get an understanding of the significance of the Muscle
Shoals and Boulder Dam fights that will be waged in Congress. A group in
California has just ordered 800 copies of this pamphlet.
The College Student as Rebel. A concise summary of the challenge of pov-
erty and social injustice to the college student with a carefully selected bibliog-
raphy of recent books on social problems. (Free copies for limited distribution
in colleges.)
Labor in Southern Cotton Mills. By Paul Blanshard. 96 pages, 25 cents.
An accurate, sane, and thoroughly readable statement of condition among the
mill hands in the South, their mill villages, their wages and hours of labor,
and their dependence on the mill owners. Mr. Blanshard spent many weeks
last year in first-hand investigations of the problem and presents here data of
extraordinary interest to all students of the industrial problem in America.
Cooperating organizations.
Roads to Freedom. By Harry W. Laidler. I). ctor Laidler has just revised
his valuable pamphlet setting forth the meaning of socialism, guild socialism,
bolshevism. syndicalism, anarchism, consumerism, and single tax. especially
arranged for discussion groups.
26 INVESTIGATION OF COMMUNIST PROPAGANDA
THE TAMIMEXT CONFERENCE AND
No. this is not a poor joke. We refer not to our prosperity but to the book
which gives in carefully edited form the heart of one of the best of our annual
discussions. How prosperous are we? What effect has our present economic
condition upon American social ideals? What tactics are suggested by our
alleged prosperity? These are some of the questions which our June Conference
at beautiful Camp Tamiment discussed under very competent leadership. The
book, which will shortly go to all regular members and contributors of $10
or over, will speak for itself. May we urged you. if you like, to help us
circulate it by ordering copies for your friends or sending us money so that
we may send it to public and college libraries. Cooperation with the Vanguard
Press enables us to offer this 286 page booklet at 50 cents.
The Tamiment Conference had the largest regular paid enrollment (278)
of any conference in years. The hospitality of the Rand School camp was
delightful. The Saturday night session with the conference play attracted
visitors from Unity House and farther way. Not even a terrific thunderstox*m
disturbed actors or audience. Pocket flashlights took the place of footlights
and the show went on. The subject of the closely related skits was appro-
priately " prosperity " ; the book was by Gertrude Weil Klein and Solon De-
Leon and the lyrics — uncommonly good ones — by Sam Friedman. The list
of players follows : Edith Blumberg, Betty Dublin, Gertrude Weil Klein,
Rowena Rippin, Nellie Seeds, Leonard Bright, McAlister Coleman, Solon De-
Leon. Roland Gibson, Harry W. Laidler, James Phillips, Norman Thomas. At
various sessions of the conference Agnes A. Laidler, James Phillips and Mrs.
William Van Essen gave groups of songs, with Alexander Fichandler and
Marguerite Tucker at the piano.
College Notes
at columbia
Ludwig C. Hirning, president of the Social Problems Club, the Columbia
Chapter of the League for Industrial Democracy, reports the following public
meetings during the fall :
October 13, Dr. Henry Linville on the Teacher's Union (attendance 50).
October 26, Bishop William Brown on Communism (250).
November 3, Otto Glogan on the Medical Profession — a Social Problem (15).
November 10, Professor Schneider on Facism and Fascist! (50).
November 16, Forrest Bailey on Civil Liberties? (60).
The club has initiated a system of seminar groups with the purpose of dis-
cussing social problems in small groups, allowing ample time for investigation
and preparation of material. There is a group now meeting fortnightly on
the subject, Social Duplications of Modern Science. The concept of Intelligence
in Education has been discussed. Other topics this group proposes to consider
are : Intelligence Tests and Political Theory ; Psychology and Crime : Over-
Population and War; Can Human Evolution be Controlled? How Whither?
Other groups will be organized as interest demands.
" The matter of seminar groups," declares Mr. Hirning, " has been entirely
initiated and is being run by students."
wesleyan GKOUr joins l. i. D.
Marshall Bragdon, secretary of the recently formed Liberal Club of Wesleyan
University, sends us the following description of the club's activities:
"A Wesleyan chapter of the League for Industrial Democracy was formed
October 16 and five spirited meetings have been held. The subjects discussed
have been the Development of Capitalist Society, Industrial Autocracy, a
Member's Experiences While Job Hunting in New York, the Profit Motive, and
the Problem of Waste in Industry.
" Paul Blanshard and Harry W. Laidler, of the League for Industrial De-
mocracy, have already spoken at Wesleyan this fall.
"Four men from the group attended the Swarthmore Industrial Conference,
November 4-6, bringing back new ideas and vim. Future plans include a
joint meeting with students of Berkeley Divinity School to discuss the relation
INVESTIGATION" OF COMMUNIST PROPAGANDA 27
of the church to industry ; meetings at which a labor-union man and an em-
ployer opposed to unions will present their views ; study and discussion of
communism, socialism, cooperation, etc. ; and trips to local factories."
DARTMOUTH ARRANGES IMPORTANT LECTURES
The Dartmouth Round Table began its season with an attractive group of
speakers this fall. This semester's speakers include, according to the report
of William A. Hunt, the president of the Round Table, the following :
October 18, Paul Blanshard, on China (200 in attendance).
November 17, Arthur Garfield Hays, on Civil Liberties.
November 29, Bertrand Russell, on Science and Civilization.
January 13, John S. Sumner, on Censorship.
During the next semester the students are looking forward to visits from
S. K. Ratcliffe, of England ; Crystal Eastman ; and Prof. John Broadus Watson,
among others.
The Round Table will be represented at the Christmas conference by the
president and probably one or two other members. It contains from 75 to
100 students and faculty members.
WISCONSIN HEARS BERTRAND RUSSELL
" Bertrand Russell spoke under the auspices of the student forum of the
University^ of Wisconsin to a crowd of 2,000 people that packed the auditorium
on November 2," writes Don Meiklejohn, secretary of the Wisconsin Student
Forum. "Other prominent speakers are being arranged for both large lectures
and small discussion groups."
Mr. Meiklejohn also reports that Dr. William Sharp addressed the chapter
on Western European Attitude toward the United States on October 20. Pro-
fessor Sharp had recently returned from Europe and dealt, among other
things, with the war-debt situation, Lindbergh flight, and the Sacco and
Vanzetti case. Fred Hyslop is president of the club this year; Frederick
Jochem, vice president ; Donald Meiklejohn, secretary ; and Donald Verian,
treasurer.
PROFESSOR DOUGLAS ADDRESSES CHICAGO STUDENTS ON RUSSIA
" At the beginning of the quarter," writes the secretary of the Chicago
Liberal Club, " Paul H. Douglas, professor of economics, who served as economic
adviser of the American Trade Union Delegation to Russia this summer,
addressed the club on Russia — Ten Tears after the Revolution." Three hun-
dred were present at each of his two meetings, the first dealing with the
economic aspects of Russia and the second with political aspects. Professor
Douglas has become a very popular speaker. His two talks on Russia packed
the assembly room. He had his facts well in hand and presented them in a
striking manner. In handling questions from the floor he is quite brilliant."
On November 8 Prof. F. H. Knight spoke on a Machiavellian Interpretation
of the Sacco-Vanzetti episode before a similar audience of 300. " Professor
Knight," writes the secretary, " gave us one of the cleverest speeches I have
ever heard. No one could have disputed his argument without appearing
foolish."
The last meeting of November was addressed by Alain A. Locke on New
Negro Thought. The club has a membership of about 70.
MICHIGAN CLUB PROGRESSES
" The University of Michigan Chapter of the League for Industrial
Democracy," writes Neil Staebler, " Is much more firmly established this year
than last and a much more extensive program is planned. In October some 250
students listened to an address by Carter Goodrich, Professor of Economics, on
Labor Unions Strike Against a Labor Government in Queensland, Australia.
Dorothy Dexter gave an address on Peace before a student group of 50 in early
November, James Rohan delivered an address on the Difficulties of a Union
Organizer in the Detroit Auto Industry."
28 INVESTIGATION OF COMMUNIST PROPAGANDA
THE OHERLIN FORUM
The Oberlin Forum held two interesting discussion meetings during October
and two in November as follows :
October meetings — Professor G. H. Danton on the Youth Movement in China
and Japan, Professor P. T. Fenn, on The Present Political Situation.
November — Dr. D. T. Wang on Pacific Relations, and Bruce Curry on
Radicalism versus Conservatism. C. B. Miller, jr., is the president of the
Oberlin College Forum for the current year. The Forum has approximately
30 members.
DARROW SCHEDULED AT OHIO STATE UNIVERSITY
" We have arranged for at least one dinner meeting each month during the
year, including several speakers of national prominence," writes Richard L.
Garnett of the Liberal Club of the Ohio State University which includes a
membership of 208. " On January 25, Clarence Darrow, Chicago attorney, will
be the speaker. The subject will be The Mechanistic Philosophy of Life. On
February 14, Dr. W. W. Alexander of Atlanta, Ga., will lead a discussion on
interracial problems. The Liberal Club's growth has been a steady one during
its three years of life until it is now one of the largest and most active organ-
izations on the campus."
On October 18, Dr. Henry R. Spencer addressed a meeting of 125 students
on the Williamstown Political Institute. Dr. Alva W. Taylor spoke on Mexico
and Religion before a group of 75 on November 8.
MEADVILLE THEOLOGICAL SEMINARY
Eugene V. Debs was the subject of the address of David Rys Williams at the
November 10 meeting of the Meadville Chapter of the League for Industrial
Democracy. On November 22 the chapter was addressed by John Haynes
Holmes on the Minister and Social Reform. Raymond B. Bragg is president of
the chapter for the coming year.
OTHER COLLEGES
Miss Stella Eskin, Smith College, is active in the formation of a League or
Industrial Democracy group there and has already sent in the names of more
than a dozen applicants.
The Social Problems Club at City College, New York, has voted to affiliate
with the League for Industrial Democracy as has also the Liberal Club of the
evening division. Another organization, the Industrial Democracy Club, which
had previously voted to affiliate, will continue functioning this spring but may
be incorporated in the other clubs of the afternoon and evening divisions after
the first of the year.
Jamestown College open forum is meeting informally this fall and is hoping
to secure Senators Nye and Frasier as speakers during the year. Levy C.
Larson is the chairman.
Robert F. Roberts of the University of Washington hopes to start a chapter
at the university this fall.
The students of Missouri Wesleyan promise also an active season.
CITY COLLEGE, NEW YORK, STUDENTS AND COMPULSORY MILITARY TRAINING
Several years ago, compulsory military training was introduced into the
College of the City of New York. Many students deeply resented the com-
pulsory feature of the drill and on Armistice Day, 1925, a concerted campaign
was begun under the leadership of Felix S. Cohen, editor of the Campus, against
this feature. Meetings and debates were held and editorials and articles were
written on the subject. A vote of the students was taken, the students voting
overwhelmingly against the course. A referendum of the parents of the stud-
ents proved that they also desired the removal of the compulsory martial
INVESTIGATION OF COMMUNIST PROPAGANDA 29
course. Thereupon, the college authorities imposed a ban upon all further
written discussion of the subject. The metropolitan papers took up the matter
with zest. Heywood Broun, the columnist, was specially caustic in the critic-
ism of the administrations' attitude. The college paper, the Campus, refrained
from mentioning the subject again, declaring in a headline over two blank
columns, the Campus May Make No Further Reference to a Certain Course at
the College. The lifting of the ban against discussion after two weeks led to
further agitation in the Campus and, finally, to the consideration of the matter
by the curriculum committee. The result was the institution of civilian drill
for the incoming freshman class of 1926. The class of 1930, however, was the
only class to receive the option. The incoming class of 1927 did not receive the
alternative of taking civilian drill immediately but did deceive the choice of
either taking military science in the first two years at the college or waiting
until their last two years for their civilian course.
On November 11, Armistice Day, the Social Problems Club of Columbia held
a public meeting on the question of militarism. John Nevin Sayre of the Fellow-
ship of Reconciliation spoke against militarism and it was hoped that Major
Penfield of the National Security League would defend cumpulsory military
drill in the colleges. Major Penfield was not present, however, and after the
address by Mr. Sayre, some of the students, particularly Alexander Lifschitz,
criticized the faculty on the ground of insincerity. Leo Rothenberg also drew
attention to certain regulations which made it far easier for the students to
take military drill than civilian drill. Among these was the fact that those
taking civilian drill had to pay $7 for uniforms, while the uniforms provided for
students taking the military course were free of charge. It was also alleged
that civilian drill was given at inconvenient times. The authorities were in-
clined to lay special emphasis on the military drill, and in 1926. it was asserted,
the course was offered after the programs were filled out. These and other
circumstances tended to take away the free choice of the students, many felt,
and to make military training actually if not technically of a compulsory nature.
Many of the students feared that, unless something were done, the civilian drill
might soon be entirely a thing of the past. A stenographic report of the meet-
ing was taken clown by a representative of the administration and the two
students were suspended indefinitely. Messrs. Rothenberg and Lifschitz ex-
plained their statements to the trustees and faculty. Mr. Rothenberg was rein-
stated but Mr. Lifchitz's letter was considered an inadequate retraction. In
the meanwhile, the administration has forbidden the students from making any
remarks which in its opinion are prejudicial to the college, on penalty of suspen-
sion. The faculty committee on military training has promised to make a
report in the spring. In the meanwhile students are warned to keep as quiet
as possible regarding the whole matter and many fear suspension — a power
conferred on the president by the faculty and trustees — in case they publicly
agitate on the subject. The atmosphere seems surcharged with the spirit of
fear — a spirit which should be utterly foreign to university life.
In their call for a meeting addressed by Dr. Harry Laidler on Education and
War on December 1, the Social Problems Club declared that the overwhelming
majority of the studenty body had expressed their sentiment against military
training and that the right of the governed to make their will felt in govern-
ment was applicable here. The announcement called attention to the continued
suspension of Lifschitz, despite the fact that he had withdrawn remarks which
might be construed as derogatory to the faculty. The question naturally arises
in the minds of many students: "why is not Al Lifschitz reinstated? Is it be-
cause he is opposed to the militarization of the American youth? "
Following the meeting a delegation was appointed by the club to visit
President Robinson of the college to find out what he proposed doing about the
Lifschitz case. Later a delegation to city authorities might be appointed. In
the meanwhile, the Student Council of New York called a meeting for December
3 to consider plans for agitating for the abolition of military training in colleges
and for the freedom of student expression. On November 30, the student paper
of New York University in a leading editorial expressed its astonishment at
the suspension of students for expressing their convictions — however erroneous
— that the faculty was not wholly sincere in its dealings with the students.
Shovdd not students, the paper asks, have at least as much right to criticize the
faculty as citizens have to criticize the Government?
119651— 31— pt 1, vol 5 3
30 INVESTIGATION OF COMMUNIST PROPAGANDA
Neokweak Makers and College Students
When lour neckwear shops ran away from New York to escape an agreement
between the union and the manufacturers calling for an end of home work in
neckwear making within 18 months they created an issue out of proportion to
the number of workers involved. Bitter experience has shown that in the
needle trades neither sanitary standards nor good working conditions and
wages can he maintained where home work rules. The success of these run-
away shops in producing under nonunion conditions would ultimately have
imperiled the lite of this union and made the struggle for union conditions
harder in all the needle trades. Very wisely the Neckwear Makers Union
laid its plans to carry a careful organization campaign to the cities where the
runaways had fled.
In two of these cities — New Haven and Poughkeepsie — the League for
Industrial Democracy has close relations with college groups in Yale and
Yassar. AVe invited the students to cooperate with the union in studying
conditions and in helping to shape public opinion as to the issues and merits" of
the strike. The reports from these colleges show what has been done.
"We are now arranging for a meeting early in December," writes Catherine
Bryant, president of the chapter, "at which speakers will present this situation
to the college and in connection with this there will be publicity in the college
newspaper. We have already an informal report from a faculty member, Miss
Caroline Ware, who attended a meeting of the Trade and Labor Council on
the situation held in Poughkeepsie. Several of the liirls thave also talked with
some of the pickets and Mr. Cushing of the Neckwear Union. At that time we
visited the Duchess Manufacturing plant and observed the picketing."
J. B. Whitelaw, of the Yale Liberal Club, reports that the members of the
Liberal Club have been studying the entire situation carefully, and are publish-
ing a leaflet on it which they are submitting to the manufacturers, asking for
the hitter's comments. Fred C. Hyde of the club has written up the situation
for the New Student and Labor. The members of the club had the issue of
Labor containing this article sent to every member of the faculty and distrib-
uted throughout New Haven.
The Yale News of October 27, 1927, gives the following description of the
arrest of the Yale students for distributing circulars regarding the conditions
under which the neckwear workers toiled, an article which shows that some
Yale students are discovering some of the forces confronting labor in America
to-day.
[From the Yale News, Oct. 27. 1927]
On October 25, three Yale students were arrested in the act of passing out
pamphlets to the workers employed in two erstwhile New York neckwear
manufacturing plants.
It was only part of a drama which has been unfolding itself for the last four
years. Bitter competition, strikes, the helplessness of underpaid sweatshop
workers have all played their part.
The story goes back to a period of depression, four years ago. in the neckwear
industry, a depression which brought in its train all the evils of tenement
homework and sweatshop activities. To meet a slump, the manufacturers
started to employ women in the homes to do some small part in the production
of ties. This led to the almost complete manufacture of the ties in homes,
sometimes poorly lighted, poorly ventilated, and under rotten sanitary con-
ditions. Such proceedings violated all humane codes and incidentally the best
interests of the neckwear union, who started an investigation. The result was
an agreement among the makers of neckwear to cease all homework within
two years, that is all the makers but four, two of whom retreated to New
Haven and set up open shop.
The fight aroused the ire of the union men in New York who sent two bus
loads of strikers to New Haven to impress the nonunion workers here with
the necessity of resisting their employers. A mass meeting was he'd. Over
200 men attended and Mr. Murphy, at that time acting mayor of New Haven,
presided, welcoming the strikers to New Haven. Newspapermen were present,
and covered the story all to no purpose, for the next morning not a word ap-
peared in the papers. What was wrong? Nobody knew. Publicity had to be
gained in some manner, so the union tried to insert paid advertisements in the
New Haven papers announcing that a state of strike existed among union neck-
wear workers, but the copy was rejected and never ran. To break the deadlock.
Frederick C. Hyde. Yale. 1928; Charles Janeway, Yale. 1930, and Frederick
INVESTIGATION OF COMMUNIST PROPAGANDA 31
Gignoux, Yale, 3930: took matters into their own hands and tried to distribute
pamphlets to the workers in Stern & Merritt and Berkman & Alder.
They were immediately arrested and taken before District Attorney French
for " distributing circulars without a permit." There is no such ordinance.
District Attorney French attempted to impress the students with the seriousness
of the offense, pointing out the possibility of expulsion from college and charg-
ing them with being iu pay of the neckwear unions. They faced a fine of
$500 and a year's imprisonment until Prof. L. A. Tulin, son-in-law of Rabbi
Wise, arrived to prove that they could not he lawfully detained. But the
desired publicity was gained and the striking possibility was started when one
cutter and one shipping clerk refused to work any longer under existing wages.
Evidently it is a question of educating the workers to tin degradation of their
condition and to the possibility of raising it by a little active resistance. What
are the issues between the recalcitrant companies and the strikers? The union
asks for a 44-hour weeek during the summer months. It asks that the wages
of the girls be increased $2 or $3 a week. It wants increase for the highly
skilled and experienced cutters. Above all it wants the homework system abol-
ished. This practice of sending ties out to the homes to be sewed by women
sometimes results in a revival of the old sweatshop system with work passed
on to the children of the family. Naturally, payment of such low wages for
a fine grade of work enables the employer to underbid his competitors, who. in
self-defense, must go to the old methods. And so the whole industrial structure
is undermined.
Last week, Mr. Louis Waldman, union counsel, addressed some members of
Dwight Hall and outlined the steps which are to be taken to curb " this existing
evil." As a consequence. Dwight Hall unofficially conducted an investigation
and found things much as Mr. Waldman had described them, employers uncom-
municative and workers willing to take almost any step.
The question has evolved into a fight between the union and the employers
and a people apparently too phlegmatic to educate themselves concerning then-
condition. Indications point to an early victory for the unions — partly as a
result of the energy of three Yale undergraduates.
This is the sort of co-operation between students and workers which promises
to bring real fruit in America. Especially where civil liberties are involved
as in the Yale situation there is a service college students can render. Per-
haps that service will not always be easy, for intelligent struggle is the price
of freedom.
NEW YORK CITY ACTIVITIES
Over 700 men and women attended the welcoming dinner to Bertram! Russell
at the Fifth Avenue Restaurant. New York City, on Thursday, October 7,
held under the auspices of the League for Industrial Democracy. The great
British philosopher and socialist gave a masterly survey of the international
policy of the great governments of the world, under the title. " Russia. Asia,
and the West." President Lovett presided.
The first fall meeting of the New York Chapter of the league took place on
Thursday evening, October 20. at the home of Mr. and Mrs. Norman Thomas,
206 East Eighteenth Street. New York City. Leroy Bowman of Columbia
University, president of the chapter, gave a stimulating talk on bis travels in
Europe from Ireland to Russia, and particularly the condition of the labor,
cooperative socialist movements in these countries. Paul Blanshard spoke
brilliantly on recent Chinese developments as seen by him this summer during
his trip to that country. Harry W. Laidler presided.
Alter the meeting, the following were elected officers for the ensuing year:
Leroy Bowman, president: Inez Pollak, vice president: Solon DeLeon, treas-
urer: Mina Weisenberg. secretary. Other members of the executive committee
are Edmund B. Chaffee. McAlister Coleman, Isabelle B. Friedman, Samuel
H. Friedman, Leon R. Land, Evelyn Preston. Eunice Sbaugbnessy, Benjamin
Stolberg and Roy Strycker.
One of the most informative and stimulating evenings held by tlie chapter
in the last few years was the dinner meeting at the Town Hall Club, 123 West
Forty-third Street. New York City, on Russia Ten Years After the Revolution — ■
and Dinted States Recognition. Three of the economic advisers of the Ameri-
can trade-union delegation — Prof. Rexford Tugwell of Columbia, author of
American Economic Life: Stuart chise. of the Labor Bureau. (Inc.). author
of Your Money's Worth ; and Robert W. Dunn, author of Americanization of
32 INVESTIGATION OF COMMUNIST PROPAGANDA
Labor, were the principal speakers. Agnes Armington Laidler sang Russian
folk songs. The speakers gave a been analysis of the economic, political, and
social conditions of the country, which they believed had vastly improved since
1921, although they were still very far from satisfactory. Industrial produc-
tion, Mr. Chase thought, was from 7 per cent to 14 per cent higher than in
1913, while agricultural production was approximately up to the 1913 level.
The condition of the industrial worker, as a result of the system of social
insurance, etc., had improved considerably since 1913. The attempt of the
Gosplan to integrate industrial production was, he felt, one of the boldest and
most interesting industrial experiments in the world to-day.
The New York chapter is planning a series of meetings in the beginning of the
year on the issues of the 192S campaign.
THE EMERGENCY COMMITTEE FOB STRIKERS' RELIEF
Three years ago, in response to urgent appeals for warm clothing and other
relief for the striking miners of West "Virginia, the League for Industrial
Democracy, in cooperation with the Civil Liberties Union, organized an emer-
gency relief committee. With its subsequent activities there, and more
especially in the Passiac strike when it raised over $37,062, our readers are
familiar. Now that committee is again active in response to the moving
pleas of the striking miners of western Pennsylvania and Colorado.
A country less hypnotized than ours by prosperity propaganda would be tre-
mendously moved by the appalling evidence which the officials of the American
Federation of Labor have piled up to show the beastly tyranny under which
the striking miners in West Virginia, Ohio, and more especially central and
western Pennsylvania are compelled to live. They have been ruthlessly evicted
from company-owned houses in cold and stormy weather. They have been set
upon and beaten by coal and iron police. Even the rapid building of tempo-
rary barracks to shelter them and their families has b?en made more difficult by
the sweeping injunction granted by Federal Judge Schoonmaker. The labor
men produce evidence that railroad and coal companies and politicians, includ-
ing Governor Fisher, of Pennsylvania, are in a virtual conspiracy to crush
the union by fair means or foul.
Meanwhile a somewhat similar situation exists in Colorado, where, curiously
enough, the Industrial Workers of the World is the principal force fighting
for the Jacksonville agreement originally made by the United Mine Workers
of America. Once more the Rockefeller company union plan of the Colorado
Iron & Fuel Co. has broken down and we are treated to the usual spectacle of
ruthless coercion, which is the worse in Colorado because of the stringent anti-
pieketing law under which more than 200 strike leaders have already been
arrested. Some of them have had nothing to do with picketing !
It is the business of American citizens who love liberty and justice to sup-
port the workers in their struggle by industrial and political means to break
down this tyranny. There is also the duty to aid the workers to bring relief
to their striking comrades and the thousands of women and children dependent
upon them. To give help in this task the Emergency Committee for Strikers'
Relief originally founded by the League for Industrial Democracy has been
revived. At its office, room 1027, 156 Fifth Avenue, New York City, it will
receive money and warm clothing which it will send to the miners' committees
in the most needy districts. Norman Thomas is chairman of the committee
and Forrest Bailey, treasurer. Correspondence should be addressed to Miss
Susanna Paxton, the secretary. The committee seeks gifts from individuals
who have no other channels through which to contribute to this cause.
We especially urge our college members to see what they can do to get
warm, substantial clothing. It may be sent to the above address in New York
City, or direct to Room 307, 611 Penn Avenue, Pittsburgh, Pa., or Room 314,
Interstate Trust Building, Denver, Colo.
THE AMERICAN COMMITTEE FOR JUSTICE TO CHINA
This committee, organized on the initiative of the League for Industrial
Democracy, continues its occasional bulletins to individuals, newspapers and
periodicals and its vigilant demand for a friendly, non-imperialistic policy
INVESTIGATION Or COMMUNIST PROPAGANDA 33
toward China. It contributed to the expense of Paul Blanshard's recent trip
and will cooperate in using him on some of his lecture tours for the League
for Industrial Democracy. Our members are urged to put their names on the
mailing list of this committee. Neither the happy disinclination of our govern-
ment and people to push an imperialistic policy, nor the unhappy factional
weakness within the Nationalist movements, has solved the problems of our
relations to a great people pressing into the industrial and political life of
the modern world.
THE COMMITTEE OX COAL AND POWER
Miss Vivi Berkman. recently from the University of Lausanne, .s continuing
research work on the power situation under the direction of a subcommittee
on research, consisting of Miss Preston and Messrs. Laidler and Coleman.
Mr. Raushenhush's study on Power and Control, a study completed by Doctor
Laidler after Mr. Raushenhush was called away from the country on account
of illness in the family, is being published by the New Republic aid will be
brought out as one of their .$1 books in January. The committee feels that
the book with the New Republic as publisher is bound to have a large sale and
a big influence in the power fight. The book of about 250 pages, the result of
two years' extensive study of the problem, has valuable chapters on the growth
of the industry, concentration of control, rates, regulation, municipal owner-
ship, Ontario, the St. Lawrence, Muscle Shoals, Boulder Dam propaganda and
the " recapture of control." It may be ordered from the League for Industrial
Democracy — price $1.00.
SUPPORTING THE LEAGUE FOR INDUSTRIAL DEMOCRACY
We do not want to load this Bulletin with appeals. It speaks for itself of
the manifold opportunities before us and the way we are trying to meet them.
If it does not make a case, further words are useless. But we must remind
you of two things :
1. On you we depend for growth in members and friends. Invite your friends
to get acquainted. Send us their names and let us try to interest them.
2. With the utmost care our annual budget must grow, or at least not
diminish, if we are to do our work. The help of the American Fund is rapidly
coming to its end. We must depend on you. Shortly our appeal for next year
(which, alas, must probably include an appeal for a deficit this year) will go
out. In your plans for holiday giving and your budget of gifts for next year
save generous place for the League for Industrial Democracy. If we fail or
have to curtail our work no other organization will take our place !
IX MEMORIAM
In the death of Mrs. Gordon Norrie, of New York, not only the League for
Industrial Democracy but the progressive cause generally lost a friend and
leader of a type too seldom found in the United States. Without affectation
she used her means, her social position, her gracious personality, and her
intellectual gifts in the service of social justice. A series of brief pamphlets
in catechetical form for which she was chiefly responsible won wide attention
and high praise. The League for Industrial Democracy is cooperating with a
number of other organizations in a memorial service to be held Monday,
December 19, in the auditorium of the Y. W. C. A., 600 Lexington Avenue,
New York City. Our members who are in New York are urged to attend.
News of the sudden death of Walter Fuller, in London, came with a shock
to bis many American friends. During the years of his residence in America
the League for Industrial Democracy (then the Intercollegiate Socialist
Society) was one of many organizations to profit by his fund of ideas and his
uncommon editorial skill. These gifts found a beautiful setting in his modest
and friendly self. We who missed him when he returned to his own country
find the world a poorer place without him.
34 INVESTIGATION OF COMMUNIST PROPAGANDA
STUDENT REPRESENT ATI V'ES
Adelphi, Elizabeth Hall; Agnes Scott, Josephine North; Albion, F. G. Piepen-
brock; Alma, Winston Thomas; Amherst, James R. Chase; Antioch, Robert
Parke; Baker, Harold Colvin; Barnard, Elizabeth Dublin; Beloit, Ortou B.
Motter ; Berkeley Divinity, Joseph F. Fletcher ; Boston, Abraham Whin :
Brook wood, Ida Patigalia ; Brown, Herbert Negus ; Buffalo, Daniel Katz : Cali-
fornia Institute of Technology, Kenneth Robinson; Claifornia, Bernard Witkin ;
Carroll. Melvin Brethower ; Central, Walter A. Cutter: Chicago, Charles (Joe;
Cincinnati, Josephine Streit ; College of City of New York, S. W. Gerson ; Col-
lege of City of New York (Evening), Edward Epstein; Clark. Theodore Roth-
man: Coe, William Shirer; Colby, W. Bertrand Downey; Colorado Teachers,
Hildred Struck; Columbia, Ludwig C. Hirning; Cornell College, Lois Wilson;
Cornell University, William Maslow ; Dartmouth, H. R. Horton ; Denver, Earl
Rinker ; Doane. Andrew E. Nuquist ; Earlham, Hugh Grant : Eden. Waldo Berie-
kamp; Emporia. Eugene Link; Franklin & Marshall, J. G. Eddy; Garrett, Stan-
ley S. McKee ; Grinnell. Arthur Moore ; Hamnia Divinity, Howard Laughner ;
Harvard, Bert J. Loewenburg ; Haverford, Royal W r . Davis; Hebrew Union,
N. L. Friedless ; Hillsdale, Donald Costin ; Hobart. Martin Bram ; Hood, Mary
C. Zimmerman ; Howard, Dutton Ferguson ; Illinois, Margaret Read ; Illinois
State, Will A. Miller; Iowa State, Dewitt Sampson; Johns Hopkins, Aaron C.
Snyder: Kansas City Law, Warren S. Earhart ; Kansas, Paul Porter; Kentucky.
James W. Russell: Kenyon. Albert C. Baker: Lutheran, William Conradi ;
Maryland. Geneva E. Reich; Massachusetts Agricultural, Philip G. Johnson;
Meadville, W. Frank Swift; Michigan, Neil Staebler; Milwaukee State, Maurice
Iushewitz : Minnesota, Ole Hellie ; Missouri Wesleyan, Paul K. Crawford : Mount
Holyoke. Ruth Tenny : Nebraska. Ruth Shallcross ; New York University.
Arthur Wubnick : North Carolina Woman's, Brooks Johnson; North Dakota
Agricultural, J. ( !. Ellickson ; Northwestern, Wesley Cook ; Oberlin, Charles B.
Miller; Occidental. Robert Davidson: Ohio State, Richard Garnett : Ohio Uni-
versity, Edwin Kennedy ; Oklahoma, Earl Martin ; Penn, W. Bruch Hadley ;
Philips, Pat Haurm ; Princeton, Robert Ely; Queens. Michael A. Phelan; Reed,
Ward H. Walker : Reformed. Sarlsis Papajian ; Robert Brookings, Max A. Ler-
ner ; Rocbester, W. C. Osgood : Sam Houston. Clifford Davis ; Smith, Stella
Eskin ; Southwestern College, I. D. Harris, jr. ; Southwestern University. Frank
Mood: Springfield Y. M. C. A.. Leonard C. Hardwick; St. Johns. Ernest Von
Hartz : St. Lawrence. M. A. Kapp : Swarthmore. Elmer F. Cope ; Syracuse.
J. Wesley Greene ; Transylvania. Athol V. Havens ; Union Theological. Richard
E. Hanson : Utah, W. B. Murdoch ; Vassar, Elizabeth S. Rogers ; Virginia.
Charles Gleaves: Washington College. A. J. Glover: Washington University.
Robert F. Roberts: Wellesley. Helen Franc; Wesleyan. Takuzo Miyake; West-
ern Maryland, Joy Reinmuth : Willamette. Hugh M. Bell: Wisconsin. Fred
Hyslop : Wittenberg. John Schmidt: Yale. J. B. Whitelaw.
ANNUAL INTERCOLLEGIATE CONFERENCE — LEAGUE FOR INDUSTRIAL DEMOCRACY
Wednesday. December 28, 10 <i. in.: Room 301. Philosophy Hall. Columbia.
Symposium, Present-Day Capital sm. Speakers: Ivy Lee. Prof. Harry F.
Ward. Chairman: Ludwig C. Hirning.
Wednesday, December 28, 2 p. m.: Room 301, Philosophy Hall.
Continuation of discussion. Speakers: Tom Tippett, Brookwood; Prof.
Harry A. Overstreet, City College, New York; Prof. Horace Taylor. Columbia.
Discussion leader: Paul Blanshard. Chairman: Beatrice Heiman, Barnard.
Wednesday, Dm mber 28, 6.30 p. m.: Reception to v siting delegates at home
of Mr. and Mrs. Norman Thomas. 20(5 East Eighteenth Srreet. Followed by
exhib r of Russian films and brief talks by members of Russian student dele-
gation. Chairman: Hillman Bishop.
Thursday, December 29, morning and afternoon sessions in Philosophy Hall.
Group discussions on Liberal Activities on the Campus, with Paul Blanshard
as discussion leader and Felix Cohen. Justine Wise, and Harry W. Laidler,
advisers: The Value of Political Action, with Stephen S. Wilson as discussion
leader and Louis Waldman and Solon DeLeon as advisers; Education as a Road
to Freedom, with A. D. Black as discussion leader and George S. Counts. Tom
Tippett, and Robert Morss Lovett as advisers; The Class Struggle and Labor
Unionism, with William B. Spofford as discussion leader and William P. Hap-
good, Otto H. Beyer, jr., Benjamin Stolberg, and McAllister Coleman as advisers.
INVESTIGATION OF COMMUNIST PROPAGANDA 35
Thursday, December 29, 6.30 />. m.: Animal dinner at Irving Plaza, IT Irving
Place (corner Fifteenth), on Political Prospects for 1928. Speakers. United
States Senator Gerald P. Nye. Norman Hapgood, Max Eastman, Norman
Thomas. Chairman: Robert Morss Lovett. Tickets at $2.00 ($1.50 to student
delegates) should lie secured from League for Industrial Democracy, To Fifth
Avenue (Algonquin 5865).
Friday, December SO, morning and afternoon, in Philosophy Hall. Columbia.
Reports on group meetings and discussion. Simon Gerson, of C.ty College,
New York, and William A. Hunt, of Dartmouth, chairmen. Paul Blanshard,
discussion leader. Afternoon session will also deal with vocations of college
progressives after graduation. Norman Thomas will give closing address.
Friday, December 30, 8.30 /,. m.: Dance and skits in Earl Hall. Columbia.
Admission, 75 cents. Skits on The Average Man. Twisting the Lion's Tail,
The Sandwich Men. and Open Shop Summer. Participants will include the
Brookwood Players. Jasper Deeter, Edith Kowski, Gertrude Weil Klein. Sam
Friedman. Hiliman Bishop, Georgianna Volze, Betty Dublin. William P:
Mangold. Ambrose Doskow, Norman Thomas, aud Harry W. Laidler. •
(Exhibits Nos. 1. 2", and 5 made a part of the committee files.)
The Chairman. Now, is Mr. Skvirsky here?
Mr. Skvirsky. Yes, sir.
The Chairman. Will you be sworn \
Mr. Marshall. Mr. Skvirsky will affirm.
Mr. Skvirsky. I wish to affirm.
The Chairman. For what reason?
Mr. Skvirsky. I am nonbeliever.
The Chairman. You do not believe in God?
Mr. Skvirsky. I do not.
The Chairman. You solemnly affirm that in the testimony you
will give before this committee, created by the House of Representa-
tives, you will testifv to the truth, the whole truth, and nothing- but
the truth '.
Mr. Skvirsky. I do.
TESTIMONY OF BORIS E. SKVIRSKY
The Chairman. Will you state your full name?
.Mr. Skvirsky. Boris E. Skvirsky.
The Chairman. Are you a soviet citizen?
Mr. Skvirsky. Yes. sir.
The Chairman. Where were you born (
Mr. Skvirsky;. Odessa.
The Chairman. What official position do you hold \
Mr. Skvirsky'. I have no official >tatus here; I am director of the
Soviet Union Information Bureau.
Mr. Marshall. If I may suggest. Mr. Skvirsky has a statement
which he would like to submit to the committee, which I think will
shorten this up very much, because a good deal of the information
you seek he states in this paper.
The Chairman. Mr. Marshall. I do no: think the committee is in
any hurry. We have only one other witness, and there are a number
of qualifying questions we would like to ask. and we will give Mr.
Skvirsky ample opportunity to make any statement, no matter how
short or how long.
Mr. Marshall. That is perfectly agreeable.
36 INVESTIGATION OF COMMUNIST PROPAGANDA
The Chairman. But Ave will have to proceed in an orderly way
and ask some qualifying questions.
Mr. Marshall. That is perfectly agreeable.
The Chairman. When did you come to this country?
Mr. Skvirsky. In December, 1921.
The Chairman. In what capacity?
Mr. Skvirsky. I came over as a member of the special trade dele-
gation of the Far Eastern Republic to the Washington Disarmament
Conference. We had a delegation composed of three members: I
was one of them. And I was representing this republic until 1922,
when it amalgamated with the Soviet Union.
The Chairman. What republic did you saj T 3^011 represented?
Mr. Skvirsky. The Far Eastern Republic of Siberia.
The Chairman. Now state in what year did it amalgamate with
the Soviet Union ?
Mr. Skvirsky. In 1922. it amalgamated with the Soviet Union.
The Chairman. In 1922?
Mr. Skvirsky. Yes.
The Chairman. And you represented the Far Eastern Republic
when you came here?
Mr. Skvirsky. Yes, sir; was a member of the delegation of the
republic of three ; two of them left in a few months.
The Chairman. So you remained as sole representative of the Far
Eastern Republic?
Mr. Skvirsky. As unofficial representative, of course, because offi-
cially the Republic was not recognized. We came with the consent
of the State Department.
The Chairman. Then, when it was amalgamated with the Soviet
Union, you continued?
Mr. Skvirsky. I continued here just as an unofficial representative
of the foreign office of Moscow.
The Chairman. Official representative?
Mr. Skvirsky. Unofficial representative. I have no official status.
The Chairman. You are not recognized, but you are the official
representative of the foreign office of the Soviet Union here in
Washington ?
Mr. Skvirsky. Yes.
The Chairman. And since what year, then, have you represented
the foreign office of the Union of Socialist Soviet Republics ?
Mr. Skvirsky. I have been here, you know, since the amalgama-
tion took place in 1922; so, since 1922, I have been here for eight
years.
The Chairman. What have you been doing here in Washington
during that time ?
Mr. Skvirsky. Well, I have established
The Chairman. You are going to cover that in your statement ?
Mr. Skvirsky. Yes.
The Chairman. I have a number of questions to ask but, perhaps,
if the committee has no objection, it would be preferable for you to
read your statement at this time, and then we will ask you the
questions afterwards.
Mr. Bachmann. There are one or two questions I would like to
ask there.
The Chairman. Go ahead.
INVESTIGATION OF COMMUNIST PROPAGANDA 37
Mr. Bachmann. How old are you?
Mr. Skvirsky. Forty-three.
Mr. Bachmann. Married and have your family in this country
with you?
Mr. Skvirsky. Married. I was married in Russia: I have been
married for 17 years.
Mr. Bachmann. Is your family in this country?
Mr. Skviksky. Yes; my wife is here.
Mr. Bachmann. You never attempted to obtain citizenship in the
United States?
Mr. Skvirsky. Xo. I was in Russia several times, just going from
here to Russia and back.
Mr. Bachmann. You are a communist '.
Mr. Skvirsky. I belong to the Communist Party; yes.
Mr. Bachmann. All right.
The Chairman. Now read your statement, and then we have a
number of questions to ask afterwards.
Mr. Skvirsky. The Soviet Union Information Bureau was estab-
lished by me in Washington about eight years ago. At that time
there was no commerce between the two countries. The last foreign
troops participating in the armed intervention in eastern Siberia had
already withdrawn. Civil war in Soviet Russia was at an end. The
country had begun to heal its wounds and to restore its productive
life. Foreign trade was beginning to revive.
In these circumstances, I attempted through the bureau to make
available at least a modicum of reliable information about the Soviet
Union for American business organizations, Government depart-
ments, and general inquirers. At the same time, the bureau has
been sending commercial information to soviet business organizations
and Government departments. I have tried to contribute toward a
better understanding between the two countries.
Peace insured rapid progress and development of the Soviet Union.
In a few Years, the trade between the United States and the Soviet
Union has grown to $107,200,000, in 1029, and $86,600,000 during the
first half of this year, according to figures of the Department of
Commerce, with five-sixths of the business represented by American
exports to the Soviet Union. The records of the Department of
Commerce for this year show that the Soviet Union has become the
sixth best foreign customer of the United States. It is a great satis-
faction to think that I have made a small contribution toward build-
ing up this business, which is mutually profitable to both countries.
Mr. Bachmann. Let me interrupt you right on that particular
point: You say the United States is the best customer?
Mr. Skvirsky. The sixth.
Mr. Bachmann. The sixth best customer of the Soviet Union ?
Mr. Skvirsky. No. Well, the Soviet Union purchases goods here
and it occupies the sixth place.
The Chairman. In the United States?
Mr. Bachmann. In other words, there are only five other govern-
ments in the world that buy more than Soviet Union ?
Mr. Skvirsky. According to the Department of Commerce's fig-
ures for this year, — the six months; yes. I am giving the latest
figures.
It is my earnest wish that its development may continue.
38 INVESTIGATION OF COMMUNIST PROPAGANDA
The Soviet Union Information Bureau publishes a monthly bulle-
tin, The Soviet Union Review, which gives facts of an economic, cul-
tural, and general nature about the Soviet Union, and contains
translations of important public documents and decrees. This is sent
to United States Government departments and numbers of business
firms and banks. The bureau has also issued yearbooks giving sta-
tistics of the Soviet Union and several pamphlets giving information
of a legalistic nature, such as translations of the Soviet Constitution,
of the patent laws, and the like.
My office has also served to make contacts between visiting soviet
scientists and technical men with scientific organizations in the
United States or with appropriate Government departments and
bureaus in Washington. I am sure these exchanges have been of
mutual benefit. The unofficial courtesies extended in Washington to
a number Of soviet visitors have been highly appreciated. I am glad
to say that on several occasions, when opportunity offered, the Soviet
Government, at my suggestion, has gladly extended courtesies to
Americans.
Thus when the American fliers, Eielson and Borland, were lost a
year ago in the frozen wilderness of northeastern Siberia, the Secre-
tary of the Interior sent an informal request to me that the Soviet
Government be asked to aid in the search for them. The Soviet
Government immediately called for volunteers for this dangerous
task, and the best soviet fliers, both civil and military, responded,
rushing to the East with their flying equipment with all speed, while
the radio ordered the two planes in the northeastern territory and
all available dog-teams to search for the missing men. This effort
was unsuccessful, for the American fliers unfortunately had crashed
to death weeks earlier.
Again, a year ago last spring, certain scientists connected with the
Department of Agriculture informed me that a new blight had
destroyed the alfalfa crop over large areas of certain Western States.
The department had determined that strains of alfalfa originally
from Russian Turkestan resisted the blight, but in order to assist
the American farmers it was necessary for the experts of the depart-
ment to go to Turkestan and study the varieties on the ground. The
Soviet Government responded promptly and the Soviet Academy
of Sciences made arrangements to have its ow r n alfalfa specialists
accompany the Americans and render every assistance.
Similarly, when the Veterans of Foreign Wars desired to under-
take the difficult task of recovering the bodies of American soldiers
who had died in the Archangel region during the allied invasion at
the close of the World War, the Soviet Government permitted them
to send a commission for their purpose, and made every effort to
assure the cooperation of the local authorities and inhabitants.
In the absence of normal relations between the United States and
the Soviet Union, Americans desiring to obtain visas to enter the
Soviet Union have to apply directly to the Soviet Foreign Office or
to official soviet representatives abroad. An occasional exception is
made to this rule, as a matter of courtesy. Thus, during the past few
years, I have been able to assist a number of Senators and Congress-
men w T ho wished to make the necessary arrangements for a visit to
the Soviet Union. In one case an American diplomat bound for an
eastern post desired to save himself an arduous roundabout journey
INVESTIGATION OF COMMUNIST PROPAGANDA 39
by taking a short-cut across soviet territory. At my suggestion, the
Soviet Government immediately granted the necessary visas for the
diplomat and his family.
I have never hitherto given public reference to these matters and I
do so now with great reluctance; but at this time, when hatreds and
mendacities against the people and the Government of the Soviet
Union are being so widely aired in the United States. I deem it neces-
sary to call them to the attention of this committee.
In the course of the testimony before this committee, photostats of
certain alleged documents have been submitted, the so-called Whalen
documents, in which the name " Sversky "' is referred to as a sort of
paymaster for some vague political conspiracy. Former Commis-
sioner Whalen has stated that " Sversky ' means Skvirsky. Ap-
parently the person who prepared the "document*" was ignorant of
the spelling of my name.
First, I wish to deny emphatically and totally before this com-
mittee the implications contained in these photostats of "documents.' 1
both as applied to me and as applied to soviet business men. en-
gineers, scientists, and students who have visited the United States.
The soviet visitors to this country come in connection with immedi-
ate trade matters or for scientific study connected with the develop-
ment of their country, and indirectly related to business develop-
ment. All come on visas furnished by American consuls. In not one
ease lias there been a suggestion by any American official of miscon-
duct or impropriety on the part of any of these visitors. I. of course,
include officers and employees of the Amtorg Trading Corporation
in this statement.
Second, these " documents " have the familiar earmarks of previous
forgeries of a similar nature and purpose, the proven work of Tsarist
emigres, directed against the Soviet Union. I will recall to vou one
instance. In January, 1920, it was revealed that certain emigre
forgers had attempted to place with an American newspaper cor-
respondent in Berlin certain " documents " purporting to show that
Senators William E. Borah and George W. Norris had received large
sums of money from the soviet representative in Paris to work for
recognition of the Soviet Government. The emigre forgers were
captured by the Berlin police, they were tried and convicted, and
their conviction was sustained by a higher court. Also a committee
of the United States Senate investigated the documents and declared
them forgeries. As I stated when the Whalen " documents " were
first published, they are a link in the same disreputable chain as the
Borah-Xorris forgeries. I stated then that " the purpose of these
forgeries is always the same, to disrupt soviet relations with other
countries and particularly to cripple the foreign trade of the Soviet
Union." In the present case the object is undoubtedly to destroy the
structure of American-Soviet trade, which has been built upon
laboriously during the past six years with profit to both countries.
The Whalen " documents " purport to represent a conspiratorial
interchange between certain employees and officers of the Amtorg
Trading Corporation and one " Feodor " of the Comintern, or Third
International. Your committee has already heard testimony that
the letterheads purporting to be those of the Comintern were printed
in Xew York. You have heard both the printer and the New York
newspaper man who traced down the printing shop. You have
40 INVESTIGATION OF COMMUNIST PROPAGANDA
listened to an analysis of the "documents" by Mr. Michael, resident
attorney of the Amtorg Trading Corporation, showing numerous dis-
crepancies and mistakes in the " documents." I am confident that a
thorough investigation as to the identity of the forgers would reveal
exactly the same sort of conspiracy as was bared in Berlin in 1929.
In its early years the American Government was menaced by
calumny and scandal abroad, often fomented by unscrupulous tory
groups; the Soviet Union has been faced by similar attacks, and has
had to meet conditions even more difficult and more complex than
those that confronted the young; American Republic. The hostile
campaigns against the Soviet Union have greatly increased in inten-
sity during the past few months. The Russian emigre groups seem
to have definitely included the United States into the scope of their
vicious activities and adventures against the Soviet Union.
In their efforts, these groups attempt to build up a war psychology
against the Soviet Union and stir up international hatreds which are
dangerous and a menace to peace.
It is to be regretted that unfounded accusations continue to be heard
against the Soviet Union, a great country of 150,000.000 people.
First Ave had a fine harvest of stories about the famous "nationaliza-
tion of women." Later came tales of the persecution of religion. At
present the accusations concern themselves with more prosaic matters,
such as stories that the Soviet Union is charitably forcing real values
upon its wealthier neighbors at below-cost prices, in order to demora-
lize foreign markets by cutting its own throat, or stories about the
enslavement of labor, in what is basically a workers' republic.
Friendly and mutually profitable foreign relations between coun-
tries can not be built on misrepresentations. The Soviet Union is
wholly absorbed in its task of building up its national economy along
socialistic lines. It is striving for peace and friendly relations with
all countries, and it welcomes any disposition on the part of other
nations which promises to strengthen peace and promote better
relationships.
The Chairman. What are the names of the publications you issue
here ?
Mi-. Skvirsky. The Soviet Union Review is a monthly magazine.
I have a copy here I can show you. The Year Book is the Soviet
Union Year Book; then the constitution. Here i> the last Decem-
ber number.
The Chairman. Of the Soviet Union Review^
Mr. Skvirsky. Yes. and here is the number for November.
The Chairman. Is that the only publication you issue; 1
Mr. Skvirsky. Yes; the only monthly issue.
The Chairman. You present these for the committee to retain
do you ?
Mr. Skvirsky. Yes, please.
(The publication above referred to was marked as an exhibit,
" Skvirsky No. 1.")
Mr. Skvirsky. I can send you copies of all of our publications.
Mr. Bachmann. Now Skvirsky No. 1 is a copy of the December
issue, 1930, of the Soviet Union Review?
Mr. Skvirsky. Yes; and this is the constitution which I publish.
Mr. BachmaNN; And Skvirsky No. 2 is the Constitution of the
Union of Socialist Republics, under date of 1929; is that right?
INVESTIGATION OF COMMUNIST PROPAGANDA 41
Mr. Skvirsky. Yes, it is the Constitution of the Union of Soviet
Socialist Republics.
The Chairman. What are your other publications?
Mr. Skylrsky. Year Books. I have a Year Book of the Soviet
Union, which contains all of the information about the Soviet Union.
The Chairman. When were they published ?
Mr. Skvirsky. Well the last Year Book has been published about
two years ago, 1929.
The Chairman. That is the latest?
Mr. Skvirsky. That is the latest ; we didn't publish any more
The Chairman. Are you publishing another one now 'i
Mr. Skvirsky. I am expecting to ; but not so soon.
The Chairman. When do you expect to have it published \
Mr. Skvirsky. Some time later; six months later. It is difficult
to publish the Year Book.
The Chairman. Are there any other publications?
Mr. Skvirsky. I had published the Patent Laws, besides the con-
stitution. Then, several years ago, I had one on The Agrarian Revo-
lution in Russia, what has happened to date in that field. Then one
about finances.
The Chairman. Are- there any others ?
Mr. Skvirsky. I don't think so. I don't remember. I will send
you all of the pamphlets — everything I published.
The Chairman. Where do you publish them?
Mr. Skvirsky. In Washington.
The Chairman. Whereabouts?
Mr. Skvirsky. The printer ?
The Chairman. Yes.
Mr. Skvirsky. The name of the printer is on the Soviet Review,
I suppose.
The Chairman. Are the} 7 all published by the same printer?
Mr. Skvirsky. All publications?
The Chairman. Yes.
Air. Skvirsky. I think one was published — the Soviet Union Year
Book was published — in New York.
The Chairman. All of the others are by a Washington printer?
Mr. Skvirsky. Yes, sir.; all of the others are by a Washington
printer.
Mr. Eslick. This [indicating] says " Published by the Soviet
Union Information Bureau, 1637 Massachusetts Avenue, Northwest,
Washington, D. C."
Mr. Skvirsky. I will send you the name of the printer.
The Chairman. Do you know the name of the printer?
Mr. Skvirsky. Oh, yes; we deal with him; I will send you the
name of the printer.
The Chairman. Can you tell me his address?
Mr. Skvirsky. In Washington?
The Chairman. Yes.
Mr. Skvirsky. The editor of the paper looks after it. I never
deal with him.
The Chairman. You are responsible for the paper, are 3 7 ou not?
Mr. Skvirsky. Certainly; I am responsible for everything my
office does.
42 INVESTIGATION OF COMMUNIST PROPAGANDA
The Chairman. And could not you toll me the name of the
printer \
Mr. Skvirsky. I will gladly toll you. If you wish, I will ask my
assistant here and shortly give it to you.
The Chairman. I think it would be a very good idea.
Mr. Skvirsky. He will telephone and get it for you.
The Chairman. What is the circulation of the Soviet Union
Review ?
Mr. Skvirsky. The circulation?
The Chairman. Yes.
Mr. Skvirsky. Well, it is about over 5,000.
The Chairman. Over 5,000?
Mr. Skvirsky. It used to be less. I am sending this to the
Government departments — all the departments in the Government
here.
The Chairman. You send this to all of the Government depart-
ments?
Mr. Skvirsky. Oh, yes. The first people who get it are the Gov-
ernment departments, then a number of Senators, the Foreign Rela-
tions Committee — I think, if I am not mistaken — the Foreign Rela-
tions Committee of the House, too; then general business men and
those subscribers, that is, those Avho are interested in it.
The Chairman. Do you send it free?
Mr. Skvirsky. Partly free and partly to subscribers — those who
are interested in it.
The Chairman. And your circulation
Mr. Skvirsky. At the present time is about 5,000.
The Chairman. A little bit over 5,000?
Mr. Skvirsky. Yes.
The Chairman. And what part of the circulation is free and what
part is paid?
Mr. Skvirsky. Oh, about several hundred, I suppose ; maybe
about 1,000. I would not say exactly, now; maybe one-sixth; mostly
free.
The Chairman. Mostly free?
Mr. Skvirsky. Yes.
The Chairman. About 4,000 free and 1,000 paid — or how many
paid ?
Mr. Skvirsky. Possibly more. I think I can look it up and give
it to you ; about that.
The Chairman. About a thousand paid, and 4,000 free ?
Mr. Skvirsky. Yes.
The Chairman. And you have it marked here " 20 cents a copy? !
Mr. Skvirsky. For those who buy it.
The Chairman. For those who buy it ?
Mr. Skvirsky. Because in some places it is being sold.
The Chairman. What are the expenses of that publication?
Mr. Skvirsky. You mean just this publication?
The Chairman. Yes.
Mr. Skvirsky. Not much. I can tell about the expense of all the
bureau. Everything involved is about $40,000, altogether — myself,
with the staff. I have five assistants. Everything included is about
$40,000.
INVESTIGATION Of COMMUNIST PROPAGANDA 43
The Chairman. You have five assistants?
Mr. Skvirsky. Yes.
The Chairman. Do they live with you?
Mr. Skvirsky. No; only one lives with me; but they live in
Washington and work here.
The Chairman. They all live in Washington?
Mr. Skvirsky. Yes; mostly American citizens.
The Chairman. The}' are mostly American citizens?
Mr. Skvirsky. Yes; all of them.
The Chairman. Can you give the names?
Mr. Skvirsky. Yes; I have them here.
The Chairman. Would you read the names, so we can get them
in the record?
Mr. Skvirsky. Yes. Mr. Harold Kellock, who is statistical di-
rector of the bureau, and American adviser; Jessica Smith, editor
of the Soviet Union Review ; S. N. Cheloff is acting secretary ; Sylvia
Feldstone is a Russian typist, and Florence Blechman is the English
typist.
The Chairman. Did you say all of these people are American
citizens ?
Mr. Skvirsky. Mr. Kellock is an American; Jessica Smith is an
American; Mr. Cheloff is an American citizen; Sjdvia Feldstone —
yes, she is an American citizen — Florence Blechman is an American
citizen. All American citizens. Two of them are Americans, born
here — three born here and two born in Russia.
The Chairman. Which two were born in Russia ?
Mr. Skvirsky. Mr. Cheloff and Miss Feldstone.
The Chairman. They were born in Russia?
Mr. Skvirsky. Yes; the rest of them were born in the United
States.
The Chairman. These men are all paid by your organization?
Mr. Skvirsky. Yes; paid by me — by my organization.
The Chairman. What is the pay of Mr. Harold Kellock?
Mr. Skvirsky. He gets $450 a month.
The Chairman. He gets $450 a month?
Mr. Skvirsky. Yes.
The Chairman. And all these five people live in the city of
Washington ?
Mr. Skvirsky. Yes. Mr. Kellock has been here
The Chairman. And you say your total expenses there are $40,000
a year?
Mr. Skvtrsky. Yes.
The Chairman. Where do you obtain the funds; where do you
obtain this $40,000.
Mr. Skvirsky. Already I told you I was officially connected with
the Soviet Government. The foreign office of the Soviet Government
sends my pay.
The Chairman. The foreign office of the Soviet Government puts
up the funds?
Mr. Skvirsky. Yes.
The Chairman. Puts up this $40,000 for this publication?
Mr. Skvirsky. Oh, yes.
The Chairman. And does that cover all publications, or just this
particular one?
44 INVESTIGATION OF COMMUNIST PROPAGANDA
Mr. Skviksky. Everything; I mean all the work for the Soviet
Government.
The Chairman. It pays the salaries of these people, too?
Mr. Skvirsky. Yes.
The Chairman. And all the printing and circulation?
Mr. Skvirsky. Everything; yes.
The Chairman. $40,000 will cover
Mr. Skvirsky. Yes; everything.
The Chairman (continuing). The printing and publication?
Mr. Skvirsky. I have been dealing with one bank for all nine
years I have been in Washington, and this can be established by the
book.
The Chairman. What is your bank?
Mr. Skvirsky. At Dupont Circle. That is a branch bank; it is
called now Federal Exchange. It merged with some other bank
latety. At the present time I think it is called Federal American
National.
The Chairman. You know the name of your bank where you keep
your bank account, don't you?
Mr. Skvirsky. Yes. It is a new name, changed only about two
weeks ago. Mr. Snyder is director. I forget exactly.
Mr. Bachmann. It is a branch of the Federal American ; it used to
be the Merchants?
Mr. Skvirsky. The Merchants Bank & Trust Co. ; that is it.
The Chairman. That is Avhere you keep these funds sent from the
foreign office; is that it?
Mr. Skvirsky. Yes.
The Chairman. Where do you keep your own funds ?
Mr. Skvirsky. Well, if you may call them funds, I use the Riggs
Bank, in the same place ; I mean the branch opposite Dupont Circle.
The Chairman. And where do you keep the funds for the upkeep
of your own office?
Mr. Skvirsky. This is my office ; the Soviet Information Bureau is
my office. It includes everything. I have no other funds and no
other expenses.
Mr. Marshall. Here is the name of the printer.
The Chairman. Will you put that in the record ?
Mr. Skvirsky. It is Terminal Press, 923 Eleventh Street NW.
The Chairman. That is the only press you use?
Mr. Skvirsky. At the present time, the only press.
The Chairman. Have you ever used any others?
Mr. Skvirsky. I said in the past I used one in New York for the
last Year Book, which was about two years ago. I don't remember
the name.
The Chairman. Was that Doctor Trachtenberg's organization?
Mr. Skvirsky. No — you mean the name of the printer?
The Chairman. Yes.
Mr. Skvirsky. No.
The Chairman. What was the name of the place where you have
the printing done here?
Mr. Skvirsky. The Terminal Press.
The Chairman. That is the only place in Washington you use for
your publications?
INVESTIGATION OF COMMUNIS! PROPAGANDA 45
Mr. Skvirskt. Yes. I don't use any other place.
The Chairman. You state you have five people who edit and write
for this Soviet Union Review ; is that correct ?
Mr. Skvirskt. Yes, just for the office; not only for the Review,
because I have numerous visitors. "We have numerous inquiries from
every part of the United States.
The Chairman. Oh, those people live there?
Mr. Skvirskt. They don't live there ; they live in Washington.
The Chairman. They work there in your house — or office ?
Mr. Skvirskt. In my office.
The Chairman. Are your office and house in the same building;?
Mr. Skvirskt. Well, I live there and one of my assistants. No-
body else.
The Chairman. What is his name?
Mr. Skvirskt. Cheloff.
The Chairman. He is the same man who is acting secretary?
Mr. Skvirskt. Yes; a voung man.
The Chairman. S. N. Cheloff?
Mr. Skvirskt. Yes.
The Chairman. Is he an American citizen?
Mr. Skvirskt. Yes; he is.
The Chairman. Born in Russia?
Mr. Skvtrskt. Yes.
The Chairman. Is he a communist?
Mr. Skvirskt. No; not a communist.
The Chairman. Not a communist?
Mr. Skvirskt. No. None of my assistants are communists. I
have not a single communist assistant.
The Chairman. Are there am r other people employed in your
office besides these people?
Mr. Skvirskt. No. Occasionally they come there; whenever I
have very much to do, we just call up the employment office and get
somebody for a few days, or a few weeks, or something of that kind.
The Chairman. You have your own domestic people there ?
Mr. Skvirskt. You mean for cleaning the house, looking after the
house ?
The Chairman. Yes.
Mr. Skvirskt. Oh, yes.
The Chairman. You have a butler?
Mr. Skvirskt. No butler.
The Chairman. You have no cooks or servants?
Mr. Skvirskt. I have one servant who looks after the house.
The Chairman. You have a man who looks after the house?
Mr. Skvirskt. Yes. A janitor and cleaner. He works for a
salary.
The Chairman. Have you a cook?
Mr. Skvirskt. Yes. sir; a servant, and a cook.
The Chairman. So you have two; you have a man and a woman
there to look after the domestic service?
Mr. Skvirskt. Yes.
The Chairman. The3 T are not down here in these names you have
given
119651— 31— pt 1 . vol 5-
46 INVESTIGATION OF COMMUNIST PROPAGANDA
Mr. Skvirsky. No; that is just the office. I did not know you were
interested
The Chairman. No.
Mr. Skvirsky. I wish to say here, as I said before, all publications
are sent to the department. I have always kept in touch with most
of the departments in Washington.
The Chairman. You stated to the committee you helped to get
visas. Do you help to get visas for people to come into the United
States — Russians ?
Mr. Skvirsky. For Russians?
The Chairman. Yes.
Mr. Skvirsky. No. This, as was made clear by Amtorg, is done
through a firm of lawyers.
The Chairman. What firm?
Mr. Skvirsky. Simpson, Thacher & Bartlett get the necessary
visas. I don't take an interest in those myself.
The Chairman. You do not help anyone to come into the United
States ?
Mr. Skvirsky. No.
The Chairman. But you do get visas for Americans who go into
Russia ?
Mr. Skvirsky. Well, as I made clear in my statement, in the
absence of relations there is nobody here who could issue a visa;
so Americans who want to go have to apply directly to the foreign
office in Moscow, or the Soviet ambassadors in Europe. I occa-
sionally — you see, there are a number of Congressmen I helped to
go to Russia.
The Chairman. Certainly ; that is what I want to find out. For
the benefit of the committee and the record, to whom do you apply
for visas?
Mr. Skvirsky. I refer them to the foreign office.
The Chairman. You refer them to the foreign office?
Mr. Skvirsky. I am advising a person who wants to go to send
a letter of application directly to the foreign office in Moscow, and
I write simultaneously that such a man is going to apply, and I
ask them to accord the courtesy to this man and permit him to
enter.
The Chairman. You write direct to the foreign office ?
Mr. Skvirsky. I write direct to the foreign office.
The Chairman. You do not write to Berlin?
Mr. Skvirsky. Oh, no; I write direct to the foreign office, be-
cause the man writes them. You see visas are granted by the foreign
office.
The Chairman. Where does he get it, here, or in Berlin?
Mr. Skvirsky. No, he can not get it here; he has to get it in
Berlin, Paris, or London, wherever there is an official ambassador.
He applies there and gets the visa. Here, I am not official, so I
can not issue visas.
The Chairman. How do you communicate with the foreign office,
bv letter ?
Mr. Skvirsky. By letter, yes. Then, if it is urgent, sometimes
by a cable ; usually just by letter.
The Chairman. With the Commissariat of Foreign Affairs ?
INVESTIGATION OF COMMUNIST PROPAGANDA 47
Mr. Skvirsky. Yes. It depends; sometimes the Commissar of
Foreign Affairs; sometimes with the visa department, what we call
the consular department. It depends on the nature of nry request.
The Chairman. How do you communicate, by letter or cable \
Mr. Skvirsky. As you know, either by letter or cable. Suppose,
when the documents were published about Senator Borah — you
know I made clear to you about the forged documents — Senator
Borah asked me to see whether the matter could be cleared up; it
was an urgent matter, and at that time I cabled to Moscow.
The Chairman. Do you use a code when you cable '.
Mr. Skvirsky. Sometimes.
The Chairman. You have a code, then \
Mr. Skvirsky. Sometimes I use it ; yes.
The Chairman. Are you willing to give your code to the
committee \
Mr. Skvirsky. Xo.
The Chairman. For what reason '.
Mr. Skvirsky. It is a code for me. my personal code, and no codes
are being given to anybody, especially where other governments are
involved, other countries.
The Chairman. But you have no official capacity in this country,
have you?
Mr. Skvirsky. No, I don't.
The Chairman. Yet you use a code and are unwilling to let the
committee have that ?
Mr. Skvirsky. No ; a personal code.
The Chairman. There is nothing you want to cover up?
Mr. Skvirsky. Absolutely not. If there was, I would not have
been here for nine years. As you know, I have been here since 1921,
to 1930, being in communication always with every department. I
suppose you can inquire of every department whether they have
anything — whether there are any illegal activities on my part.
The Chairman. I am not saying there is, at all ; but, if there is
not, I do not see any objection to your giving the code to us. Of
course, if you do not want to, that is another matter. What officials
do you see in the State Department?
Mr. Skvirsky. Usually the man in charge of the Eastern European
Division, which is the Russian Division, Mr. Kelley. In other
departments, I see other people whenever necessary; but, mostly, I
do all of the things through the State Department.
The Chairman. You are the direct representative, as I under-
stand
Mr. Skvirsky. Unofficial.
The Chairman. Unofficial, direct representative, of the foreign
office of the Soviet Government ?
Mr. Skvirsky. Yes.
The Chairman. And you have been that for the last eight years?
Mr. Skvirsky. Yes.
The Chairman. And is it customary for the Soviet Government
to keep their representatives for as long as that in the same post?
Mr. Skvirsky. In the same post?
The Chairman. Yes.
48 INVESTIGATION OF COMMUNIST PROPAGANDA
Mr. Skvirsky. "Well I suppose it depends on either the man, or
whether they need the man anywhere else, you know; it depends; or
the Government may keep him shifting around.
The Chairman. Of course, you make all of your reports right to
the foreign office of the Soviet Government, do you not?
Mr. Skvirsky. Yes.
The Chairman. Mr. Bachmann asked you the question if you had
ever declared your intention of becoming an American citizen?
Mr. Skvirsky. No.
The Chairman. You have never applied in any way to become a
citizen ?
Mr. Skvirsky. No. Only when I had to go to Russia, in 1924,
the first time I was about to leave, I received from the Department
of Labor the papers as a resident. So, usually, when I go to Russia,
I receive a permit to reenter the United States. I am going to
Russia; I am coming back; I do not need any visa to go back. I go
just as a visitor, on the strength of the permit which I obtain from
the Department of Labor.
The Chairman.' Let us get that straight : You say jou have not
applied for first papers ?
Mr. Skvirsky. No.
Mr. Nelson. Mr. Chairman, he says he is a communist, If he is,
he could not honestly apply for citizenship in this country, even if
he wanted to change.
The Chairman. That is why I am asking. The information
given to me is that he had applied, and that is what I am finding
out from him. So you have made no attempt to become a citizen
of this country in any way ?
Mr. Skvirsky. No.
The Chairman. But when you go over there, you go as a resident
of the United States ?
Mr. Skvirsky. Yes. I have been here nine years.
The Chairman. So. when you get a permit to reenter, you get
it as a resident of the United States?
Mr. Skvirsky. Yes. When I go, I usually apply to the Depart-
ment of Labor at Washington for a permit to reenter, which is
usually granted in a week or so. With the permit I go to Russia
and come back.
The Chairman. How often do you go to Russia ?
Mr. Skvirsky. Well. I have been three times. The last time I
was there was last year.
The Chairman. You were over there last year?
Mr. Skvirsky. Yes.
The Chairman. You have only been there three times in the last
nine j^ears ?
Mr. Skvirsky. Yes, sir; three times.
The Chairman. Have you any connection with the American
communists ?
Mr. Skvirsky. No.
The Chairman. Have you ever done any business with Doctor
Trachtenberg?
Mr. Skvirsky. Doctor Trachtenberg?
The Chairman. Yes.
INVESTIGATION OF COMMUNIST PROPAGANDA 49
Mr Skvirskt. Well, he is in charge of the International Publisher,
so 1113- office did business, yes, sir, buying books, sometimes; because
they publish books on various phases and sometimes they are inter-
esting to us. I have a library of everything about Russia, so I
usually buv those.
The Chairman. You do?
Ma. Skvirskt. Yes, sir; for my own office — buy books from time
to time.
The Chairman. Have you ever had any printing done by him?
Mr. Skvirskt. Not by him. I gave the book of mine two years
ago, the Year Book I published — I think it was published by the
same printer where he publishes.
The Chairman. So you have had some printing done by
Trachtenberg?
Mr. Skvirskt. Not Trachtenberg; by the printer.
The Chairman. By the printer. You know Trachtenberg?
Mr. Skvirskt. Oh, yes; I have known him several years.
The Chairman. He is an American communist, is he not?
Mr. Skvirskt. He is an American communist. You didn't ask
me if I knew anybody; you asked me if I had any connection with
the American Communist Party. I said "No." I think he is about
the only man I know; maybe there is one more.
The. Chairman. Do you know Mr. Nock?
Mr. Skvirskt. Mr. Nock?
The Chairman. Yes.
Mr. Skvirskt. Mr. Nock was working at my office for several
years, and his wife
The Chairman. What did he do?
Mr. Skvirskt. He was editor of nry magazine, before.
The Chairman. What does he do now?
Mr. Skvirskt. He lives in New York. If I am not mistaken, he
does some work for the American-Russian Chamber of Commerce,
translating.
The Chairman. What name does he go by now; do you know?
Mr. Skvirskt. What name does he go by now '.
The Chairman. Yes.
Mr. Skvirskt. I don't remember his name. I think his name is
Norton.
The Chairman. How long did he work for you ?
Mr. Skvirskt. He worked for me several years.
The Chairman. When did he leave you '.
Mr. Skvirskt. He left me about a year and a half ago, or two
years ago. He is not a communist; he never belonged to any politi-
cal party.
The Chairman. Well I did not ask you that question. He was
known as Nock when he worked for you \
Mr. Skvirskt. Yes.
The Chairman. And how long did he work for you?
Mr. Skvirskt. How long did he work for me \ About three years.
The Chairman. About three years?
Mr. Skvirskt. Yes.
The Chairman. What position did he hold \
Mr. Skvirskt. He was editor of the magazine.
50 INVESTIGATION OF COMMUNIST PROPAGANDA
The Chairman. Ho was editor?
Mr. Skviesky. Yes.
The Chairman. When his name was Nock, was he an American
citizen?
Mr. Skvirsky. I don't think so: I don't know. I don't think so.
The Chairman. Do yon know whether he is an American citizen
now \
Mr. Skvirsky. I could not tell yon.
The Chairman. Do yon know where he is working now, as Nor-
ton?
Mr. Skvirsky. I don't know where he is working now. I think he
was translating for the chamber of commerce — the American Russion
Chamber of Commerce.
The Chairman. Do yon know whether he holds a position in the
Chase National Bank?
Mr. Skvirsky. In the Chase National Bank?
The Chairman. In New York?
Mr. Skvirsky. I don't know; I could not tell you that.
The Chairman. Yon could not?
Mr. Skvirsky. No ; since he left me, I don't know.
The Chairman. How many years was he with yon '.
Mr. Skvirsky. He was with me about three or four.
The Chairman. As editor of the paper?
Mr. Skvirsky. Yes.
The Chairman. Do you know a man bv the name of Trotsky?
Mr. Skvirsky. Miss Trotsky ?
The Chairman. Yes.
Mr. Skvirsky. His wife. She was my secretary, before.
The Chairman. Your secretary?
Mr. Skvirsky. She used to be : she works now in Amtorg.
The Chairman. She works now 7 with Amtorg?
Mr. Skvirsky. Yes. She had been with about five years, I suppose.
The Chairman. Is she an American citizen ?
Mr. Skvirsky. Her name, by the way, is Trotsky — just Trotsky.
The Chairman. She was your employee for five years?
Mr. Skvirsky. Yes.
The Chairman. When did she leave you?
Mr. Skvirsky. She left me several months ago ; about three
months.
The Chairman. Three months ago?
Mr. Skvirsky. Two or three.
The Chairman. She is the wife of Norton ?
Mr. Skvirsky. Yes.
The Chairman. You do not know where Norton is Avorking now T ?
Mr. Skvirsky. I told you my recollection is he is doing some work
for the American-Russian Chamber of Commerce.
The Chairman. You do not know whether he Avork for the Chase
National Bank ?
Mr. Skvirsky. No; I don't know
The Chairman. But when Nock Avas working for you. he was not
an American citizen?
Mr. Skvirsky. I think he Avas not; so I understood, of course.
The Chairman. And Miss Trotsky
Mr. Ska'irsky. I. think she Avas.
INVESTIGATION OF COMMUNIST PROPAGANDA 51
The Chairman. Miss Trotsky was not an American citizen when'
she worked for you \
Mr. Skvirsky. I think she was. I may not he correct, but this
is my impression.
The Chairman. You do not know (
Mr. Skvirsky. I knew, but forgot. There was no secret about the
matter.
The Chairman. Oh. no; I was just trying to get the information
and facts. She was with you for how long?
Mr. Skvirsky. About five years.
The Chairman. Do you know whether she is an American citizen,
or not ?
Mr. Skvirsky. I think she is; but. when she became a citizen. I
don't know.
The Chairman. She Avas not at first when she came with you I
Mr. Skvirsky. I could not tell you.
The Chairman. You do not know whether she was an American
citizen when she came with you ?
Mr. Skvirsky. Maybe I did know, but I forgot. I have lots of
things to think of. I don't remember now.
The Chairman. You have five employees ?
Mr. Skvirsky. Yes: but I usually see more than five people every
day.
The Chairman. Do you know a man by the name of Max
Eabinoff?
Mr. Skvirsky. Max KabinofF ?
The Chairman. Yes.
Mr. Skvirsky. Yes, sir; I saw this man several times.
The Chairman. What was your association with him?
Mr. Skvirsky. Nothing; just an acquaintance. I saw him several
times. I knew he was working, was connected with the opera busi-
ness before, as a business man; that is all I know about him.
The Chairman. What does he do now ]
Mr. Skvirsky. I don't know.
The Chairman. Where did you know him?
Mr. Skvirsky. In New York; I saw him several times before. I
first met him — I remember him just about 1919, when I came over
to this country — I suppose a year or so after that. Then I saw him
another few times ; that is all.
The Chairman. Do you know Mr. SverdlofF ?
Mr. Skvirsky. Mr. "SverdlofF?
The Chairman. Yes?
Mr. Skvirsky. You mean the one working for the Centrosoyus
office in Xew York?
The Chairman. Yes.
Mi\ Skvirsky. Yes: I have known him.
The Chairman. You have known him?
Mr. Skvirsky. I have known him ; yes.
The Chairman. Have vou ever seen him in Washington?
Mr. Skvirsky. Mr. Sverdloff?
The Chairman. Yes.
Mr. Skvirsky. No: he was in charge of the Centrosoj-us office in
New York; then, if I am not mistaken, he went away west.
The Chairman. To Seattle ?
52 INVESTIGATION OF COMMUNIST PROPAGANDA
• Mr. Skvirsky. Then, if I am not mistaken, I think he wont to
Russia, or is about to go there.
The Chairman. Do yon know Doctor Sheftel?
Mr. Skvirsky. Yes, I did. He is in Russia now. He was repre-
sentative of the public health department.
The Chairman. What was your connection with him?
Mr. Skvirsky. Well, he represented the public health department.
My connection was the same as with everybody else who was from
Russia.
The Chairman. Do you know Mr. Shuster?
Mr. Skvirsky. I have known Mr. Shuster. He is in Russia now.
He was working at Amtorg.
The Chairman. When did he go to Russia?
Mr. Skvirsky. He went to Russia about two months ago.
The Chairman. Do you know Earl Browder?
Mr. Skvirsky. No; never met him.
The Chairman. You never met Mr. Browder?
Mr. Skvirsky. No.
The Chairman. Nor Mr. Harrison George?
Mr. Skvirsky. No.
The Chairman. Have you ever met Mr. Ziavkin?
Mr. Skvirsky. Yes, at Amtorg.
The Chairman. Did you ever meet him in Washington?
Mr. Skvirsky. Mr. Ziavkin — I don't remember that he was ever in
Washington ; maybe he was.
The Chairman. Did you ever see him in Washington?
Mr. Skvirsky. If he was in Washington, I suppose I saw him.
Sometimes he comes over to Washington for an hour or two.
The Chairman. There is no reason why you should not see him?
Mr. Skvirsky. Yes, but I dont remember.
The Chairman. What is the last time you saw him?
Mr. Skvirsky. If he was in Washington, it must have been
once
The Chairman. How long ago was it?
Mr. Skvirsky. Several months ago.
The Chairman. The last time you have seen him?
Mr. Skvirsky. No ; I was in New York lately ; I see people in New
York every two or three weeks, most of the people there in Amtorg.
The Chairman. You go to New York regularly, do you ?
Mr. Skvirsky. Yes; I am in New York regularly every two or
three weeks, because they have people ask to see me, so I see them in
New York. I usually go to the office of Amtorg, and see the people
there.
The Chairman. And naturally, when they come down here they
come to see you?
Mr. Skvirsky. Yes.
The Chairman. And Mr. Ziavkin comes to see you when he comes
down here?
Mr. Skvirsky. I suppose, if he was there, I saw him in
Washington.
The Chairman. Has Mr. Ziavkin ever been to your office ?
Mr. Skvirsky. I say, if he was, I saw him in Washington.
The Chairman. I do not know whether he ever was in Washing-
ton ; I am asking you.
INVESTIGATION OF COMMUNIST PROPAGANDA 53
Mr. Skvirsky. Yes. but I don't remember whether I ever saw him
in Washington.
The Chairman. If you don't remember, just say so. You do not
remember whether you ever saw him in your office in Washington, at
all?
Mr. Skvirsky. Perhaps, if he was here. I don't know, I don't
remember.
The Chairman. How did you happen to know Dr. Reid was a
colonel in the Reserve Corps? You heard him testify this morning.
Mr. Skvirsky. If my memory serves me right, I don't remember
ever seeing Captain Reid. If I did see him, I would be surprised ;
maybe I saw him.
Mr. Nelson. You spoke in your statement of the hatred existing
in America for the Soviet Government : Is not that hatred directed
more at its extension into this country rather than its application to
its own internal affairs in Russia?
Mr. Skvirsky. Well. I have been here for nine years and I have
seen everything which has been done in the Soviet Union has been
misrepresented.
Mr. Nelson. That may be. but you do not find any hatred on the
part of the American people directed at the Soviet Government regu-
lating its own internal affairs?
Mr. Skvirsky. My own experience shows me this
Mr. Nelson. Do you?
Mr. Skvirsky. Whenever the American people know the real facts,
they are friends of Russia ; when they don't know the facts, of
course, they are then.
Mr. Nelson. What I asked you was, you do not find in America
any extensive hatred on the part of our people for the Soviet Govern-
ment, or the Russian people, in their right to carry on their own in-
ternal affairs as they see fit, do you?
Mr. Skvirsky. Well, unless it is artificial.
Mr. Nelson. What?
Mr. Skvirsky. Unless it has been created artificially. You see,
the escaped Russian monarchists here in this country are very active;
are active at the present time in Europe. I suppose you have heard
about the trial that has taken place lately in Moscow. They are ac-
tive now and have been in the last vear in Russia, first about the reli-
gious belief, and then about the nationalization of women, and
everything.
Mr. Nelson. Do not you find in this country a great deal of sym-
pathy for the Russian people and their attempt to establish a stable
government ?
Mr. Skvirsky. My experience is this, that whenever the people
know the real facts in Russia, they are in sympathy; but whenever
the} 7 don't know, 3-011 have the situation as you see it now. I am sorry
to see — I regret to see — how much is being done in this country to
misrepresent Russia.
Mr. Nelson. Then your idea is the American people do not under-
stand Russia's efforts and do not sympathize in their efforts,
naturally?
Mr. Skvirsky. What I have to say is this, that the American peo-
ple don't know sufficiently the real facts about the situation. Person-
ally, while I have been here, what I have been trying to do through
54 [INVESTIGATION OF COMMUNIST PROPAGANDA
my bureau is just to give sonic of the real facts, and those Americans
with whom T have conic in contact. I would say there are thousands,
since I have been here for nine years, and every one, it has been my
experience, when they learn the real situation, they are becoming
friendly and sympathetic.
Mr. Nelson. You would not blame the American people for
resenting any attempt, if there were any, on the part of the Soviet
Government to spread propaganda in this country aiming at the
overthrow of our institutions?
Mr. Skvirsky. I wish to state most emphatically-
Mr. Nelson. I say you would not blame the American people for
resenting that ?
Mr. Skvirsky. If there were any; but there is no such thing.
Mr. Nelson. I am not assuming there is, but I say you would not
blame them if there were those attempts?
Mr. Skvirsky. Yes.
Mr. Bachmann. Did you hold any official .position in the Com-
munist Party before you came to the United States?
Mr. Skvirsky. No. I was, before I came to the United States,
Assistant Vice Minister of Foreign Affairs in the Far Eastern
Republic, in Chita, which is the Russian Far East; and, before that.
I was in what you call here a state government — they had a pro-
visional government in the maritime province, and I was there.
This was during the intervention of the foreign troops in the
Russian Far East as you know, there were foreign troops including
the American troops.
Mr. Bachmann. Do you have any official position in the Com-
munist Party in Russia ?
Mr. Skvirsky. No official position; I have only a position with
the Soviet Government.
Mr. Bachmann. You have no official connection with the Com-
munist Party of America.
Mr. Skvirsky. No.
Mr. Bachmann. Does the Communist Party of America have any
official connection with the Communist Party of Russia?
Mr. Skvirsky. Well, all Communist Parties, as you know, have
their own organization — international organization.
Mr. Bachmann. My question was, Has the Communist Party of
America any connection with the Communist Party of Russia '.
Mr. Skvirsky. Possibly so, through the international organization.
Mr. Bachmann. Your answer is, then, it does have some con-
nection ?
Mr. Skvirsky. Through the international organization — I suppose
so.
Mr. Bachmann. You know it does through the Communist Inter-
national ?
Mr. Skvirsky. There is such a thing.
Mr. Bachmann. I say you know it has some connection with the
Communist Party of Russia through the Communist International?
Mr. Skvirsky. Yes. The Communist Party of Russia has repre-
sentatives in the Third International, the same as any other party.
Mr. Bachmann. What is the purpose of the Communist Party in
America ?
INVESTIGATION OF COMMUNIST PROPAGANDA 55
Mr. Skvirsky. Why don't you — I think it would be reasonable if
you would apply to the representatives of the American Communist
Party, if there is such a question. Why do you ask me '. I can
tell you anything about the Soviet Government
Mr. Bachmann. Because the Communist Party of Russia is con-
trolling the Soviet Government.
Mr. Skvirsky. The Communist Party of Russia controls in an
indirect way.
Mr. Bachmann. Well, it is a fact ; the fact is it is controlling the
Soviet Government, is it not?
Mr. Skvirsky. In an indirect way, inasmuch as ma} T be the Re-
publican Party controls the American Government.
Mr. Bachmann. What is indirect about it? It has direct control
of the Government; has it not?
Mr. Skvirsky. No. You must understand the soviet constitution.
The Soviet Government is directly responsible to the central execu-
tive committee, which is being all the time mixed up. I have read
the testimony here; it is always being mixed up. The central com-
mittee of the Communist Party is being mixed up all the time with
the central executive commiteee. which is our congress, and our gov-
ernment is elected by the central executive committee, which is our
congress.
Mr. Bachmann. And the central executive committee is composed
of communists in the Russian Communist Party \
Mr. Skvirsky. The central executive committee is composed of
communists and noncommunists. There are about one-third non-
communists. We have elections at the present time in Russia,
which will take maybe to complete about a month or two, then we
will be able to read how many communists. The majority are com-
munists; the Communist Party in Russia enjoys the complete
confidence of the people.
Mr. Bachmann. And you are a member of the Russian Communist
Party and unofficial representative, as such, in the United States?
Mr. Skvirsky. Unofficial representative of the foreign office. It
means the Soviet Government; I don't represent the party; I
represent the state, or foreign office.
Air. Bachmann. Xow what is the purpose of the Communist Party
of America; what is it trying to accomplish here?
Mr. Skvirsky. I don't know. You will have to apply for that to
the American communists; I am a Russian.
Air. Bachmann. And you do not know anything about the
American Communist Party, or what its purpose is?
Mr. Skvirsky. I don't see why I should be asked; I am not an
expert on the American party; I don't see why I should answer;
I don't see why a Russian should answer what the purpose of the
American Communist Party is.
Mr. Bachmann. Because the American Communist Party is af-
filiated and a member of the Communist International, the same as
your Russian Communist Party is
Mr. Skvirsky. Then why don't you ask
Mr. Bachmann (continuing). And it is directed from Moscow.
Mr. Skvirsky. I am not an official of the Communist International.
Mr. Bachmann. I know you are not. but I asked you. if you know.
if you would tell the committee what the purpose of the Communist
56 INVESTIGATION OF COMMUNIST PROPAGANDA
Party of America is — if you know. I do not want you to feel that
I am antagonistic to you in asking the question. There are a lot of
people who have testified before this committee and told this com-
mittee a lot of things about the Russian Communist Party and the
American Communist Party, and here you are the unofficial repre-
sentative of the Soviet Government, and a member of the Russian
Communist Party, in the United States.
Mr. Skvirsky. What do you mean bv American Communist Party
of the United State- :
Mr. Bachmann. If you know what the truth of it is, I would like
you to tell the committee. If you do not know, of course you can not
tell the committee.
Mr. Skvirsky. I understand. But since there is a Communist
Party here, its members of the Communist Party will be able to tell
3'ou. I am not a member of the American Communist Party.
Mr. Bachmann. Your answer is you do not know what the pur-
pose of the American Communist Party is, then, in this country ?
Mr. Skvirsky. Mv statement is I do not belong to the American
Communist Party and it is up to the American Communist Party to
answer this question.
Mr. Bachmann. Now I did not ask you whether you belonged; I
asked you whether you knew what the purpose of the American Com-
munist Party was in this country. Do you know, or don't you know?
Mr. Skvirsky. I have given you my answer.
Mr. Bachmann. No, } r ou have not yet answered that question. You
can say you do not know, or you do know. If you do not know, I
would be glad to have you say so.
Mr. Skvirsky. The Communist Party is everywhere. I suppose,
I can presume, the Communist Parties of every country have a pro-
gram, their own program. I suppose you have read the program of
the American Communist Party.
Mr. Bachmann. Yes; but I did not ask you that; I asked you
whether or not you know, or do not know what the program is, or the
purpose is, of the Communist Party of America?
Mr. Skvirsky. I suppose it is the same program as any other Com-
munist Party.
Mr. Bachmann. Well, do you know?
Mr. Skvirsky. I know 7 the^ program of the Communist Party of
Russia, certainly.
Mr. Bachmann. Do you know what the program of the American
Communist Party is? Could not 3 r ou answer that?
Mr. Skvirsky. I said, probably the American Communist Party
has the program of the communists.
Mr. Bachmann. I know, but you are qualifying it with " prob-
ably." I have not asked you that; I asked you whether you know
what the purpose of the American Communist Party is. That is
easily answered, if you know, yes; if you do not know, no.
Mr. Skvirsky. Every Communist Party wants to have established
communism in the country.
Mr. Marshall. Mr. Congressman, may I consult with my client
for a moment?
Mr. Bachmann. All right; I have no objection.
Mr. Skvirsky. I presume the program of the Communist Party of
America is the same as of any other Communist Party.
INVESTIGATION OF COMMUNIST PROPAGANDA 57
Mr. Bachmann. It is the same as the program of the Russian
Communist Party?
Mr. Skyirsky. The Russian Communist Party has its program, as
you know. We had the revolution in Russia, and at the present time,
as a result we have a Soviet Government. The Soviet Government
is building socialism there. We had our revolution.
Mr. Bachmann. Let us see if I can get you to answer this : Then
the purpose of the American Communist Party is the same as the
Russian Communist Party; is that correct?
Mr. Skyirsky. I presume so. But j^ou had here, only a few days
ago, the representatives of the American Communist Party. I sup-
pose they told you all about it. I do not see wlrv I, as a Russian — I
think I could tell you more about Russia, than tell you about Amer-
ica. I am not an American and I am kept sufficiently busy to do my
business in connection with the Soviet Union.
Mr. Bachmann. What is the purpose of the Russian Communist
Party ?
Mr. Skyirsky. The purpose of the Russian Communist Party is
to build a classless society, socialist society, in Russia and, as you
know, for this purpose capitalism was overthrown in Russia. We
have no capitalism ; we have a soviet form of government, and Rus-
sia is building a classless society.
Mr. Bachmann. Classless society?
Mr. Skyirsky. Classless: without classes. You know, there is no
private property, or land, factories, and so on; it belongs all to the
State. Russia is engaged in building socialism and, in Russia, we
had our revolution. Now every soviet citizen working abroad is
just working for the government and strengthening the Soviet
Union.
Mr. Bachmann. That is just what the Communist Party of Amer-
ica is seeking to accomplish in the United States, is it not ?
Mr. Skyirsky. If you ask an American, maybe he will tell you. I
am just interested in Russia and the Soviet Union.
Mr. Bachmann. But you told me the purpose of all Communist
Parties is the same, and now you tell me the purpose of the Com-
munist Party in Russia is to establish communism — a classless so-
ciety.
Mr. Skyirsky. Yes.
Mr. Bachmann. Socialism?
Mr. Skvirsky. Yes.
Mr. Bachmann. Now I ask you if that is the purpose of the Com-
munist Party in America ?
Mr. Skyirsky. I presume so.
Mr. Bachmann. They want to do in the United States just what
they have done in Russia?
Mr. Skyirsky. I suppose so.
Mr. Bachmann. Well, while they are trying to accomplish that in
the United States, then you tell the committee here you are spending
your time trying to work out a better relationship between the Soviet
Government and the Government of the United States?
Mr. Skyirsky. Yes.
Mr. Bachmann. In other words, you want this country to be on
better relations, to have better relations with the Soviet Govern-
ment ?
58 INVESTIGATION OF COMMUNIST PROPAGANDA
Mr. Skvirsky. In the interests of both countries.
Mr. Bachmann. And. at the same time, yon are endeavoring to
establish a classless society and socialism in the United States?
Mr. Skvirsky. In the Soviet Union, we are established already. 1
am a soviet citizen; I am not an American citizen. There are differ-
ent Communist Parties. You should apply to them.
Mr. Bachmann. You said, wherever yon told the American people
the real facts about Russia, that in every instance they had a differ-
ent idea about Russia?
Mr. Skvirsky. Yes.
Mr. Bachmann. Do you tell these people you talk to the facts
about what the communists are trying to do in the United States;
that what the Communist Party of Russia and the Communist Inter-
national are seeking to do is to overthrow capitalism?
Mr. Skvirsky. The Communist International has nothing to do
with the Soviet Government. As you have heard stated on many
occasions, the Soviet Government has nothing to do with the Inter-
national. It is the National Government.
Mr. Bachmann. Do you tell those people about the way you are
convinced yon have things in Russia and do you tell them you are
seeking to overthrow capitalism and to establish a classless society
in this country ?
Mr. Skvirsky. I tell them that capitalism was overthrown in
Russia; that is why Russia had this revolution; for that, at the
present time, there is a Soviet Government and that all these ideas
spread in the United States, that the Soviet Government carries on
propaganda here, are not the real facts.
Mr. Bachmann. Are not the real facts?
Mr. Skvirsky. They ask me about it. They usually ask me more
and usually, when Ave discuss it fully, quietly, they begin to realize
that too much misinformation is being spread in this country about
Russia.
Mr. Bachmann. You tell the people here about the amount of
money the Soviet Government spends in the United States and about
the trade relations between the United States and the Soviet Govern-
ment, but you do not tell them anything about what the Communist
Party is seeking to do in the United States, do you?
Mr. Skvirsky. The Russian Communist Party?
Mr. Bachmann. Yes.
Mr. Skvirsky. The Russian Communist Party — I just told you
what the Russian Communist Party is doing in Russia.
Mr. Bachmann. But you do not tell them what they are trying to
do in the United States \
Mr. Skvirsky. I could not tell them what they are trying to do in
the United States. They are Americans.
Mr. Bachmann. You do not tell them what all Communist Parties
are trying to do in the United States, do you?
Mr/ Skvirsky. I never discuss with anybody questions which are
only of concern to Americans. Since I have been here for nine
years, I have never interfered in American affairs, which are purely
American, and the Soviet Government always insists that no
foreigner should mix into Russian affairs, and here at this time — I
think I can make this statement — the Soviet Government is being
INVESTIGATION OF COMMUNIST PROPAGANDA 59
accused of carrying on propaganda in Germany, and so on, in various
countries, but the Soviet Government at no time has tried to over-
fhrow any government; yet you know we had foreign governments
which sent troops to Russia to overthrow the Soviet Government.
Mr. Bachmann. Is not that because the Communist Party domin-
ates the Soviet Government and also dominates the Third Inter-
national? That is the basis for it. is it not?
Mr. Skvirskt. If this is the basis, I am surprised, because this
means only interference in the affairs of a foreign country; because,
what Russia wants to have in Russia I do not think is of any con-
cern to anybody else, and yet they sent troops to overthrow the
Russian Government, which was a direct interference with Russian
affairs. This has been done by all governments; as you know, there
were American troops sent to Russia.
Mr. Bachmann. You do not know of the Government of the
United States having any political party in Russia, do you I
Mr. Skvirsky. Xo political party; but there are numerous Amer-
icans in Russia ; there are about 2.000 American engineers there; there
are correspondents of all the American papers, of the largest ones,
that have their representatives abroad, and if the Soviet Government
were to bring about the same argument as applies to some Russians
here, they would have suspected every American there — that he is
trying nothing else, but only dream — he does not eat, does not sleep,
but thinks only of overthrowing the Russian Government. As you
know, the Russian Government does not do that ; they do not suspect
any American until they get the facts about it. But what is going on
here? Every Russian over here is suspected that he does not eat,
does not sleep, but only thinks of overthrowing the Government of
the United States.
Mr. Bachmann. What is your opinion as to why that is true?
Mr. Skvirsky. Why the Russians are suspected?
Mr. Bachmann. Yes.
Mr. Skvirsky. On account of the antisoviet propaganda of a lot
of people in this country, a lot of foreigners, and a lot of Americans.
Mr. Bachmann. Is it not because your Communist Party in Rus-
sia, dominating the Soviet Government over there, is endeavoring to
revolutionize the world and to establish socialism all over the world I
Mr. Skvirsky. Not the Soviet Government. The Soviet Govern-
ment is recognized by the mass of the people.
Mr. Bachmann. But that is the purpose of the Communist Party
of Russia, is it not (
Mr. Skvirsky. The Communist Party has achieved it there: we
have had the social revolution in Russia. You have to realize this
fact, that we had the social revolution in Russia and we are working,
of course, everybody who does anything, we are working to
strengthen our State.
Mr. Bachmann. Well. Stalin is the unofficial head of the Soviet
Government, is he not \
Mr. Skvirsky. Xo; Stalin is the head of the Communist Party.
Stalin is not the head of the Soviet Government.
Mr. Bachmann. And as secretary of the Communist Party, he
dictates the policy of the Soviet Government in Russia, does he not?
60 INVESTIGATION OF COMMUNIST PROPAGANDA
Mr. Skvirskt. No member of the Communist Party can dictate
directly to the Government. The Government is responsible to the
Soviet congress, which elects the central executive committee, and if
the Communist Party has no confidence in any member that he may
carry out this party's resolution, then the communists who are in the
central executive committee may carry out and usually they do carry
out the wishes of the Communist Party. But not directly. I have
seen many statements here that if the Communist Party, or the
central committee, or anybody wants to remove any member of
the committee, they can do it, and I wish to say here, to state,
that this never has been done; it is not being done. If you want to
compare, let's take for a moment, the American Constitution, in the
case of impeaching the President. The President of the United
States can be impeached by Congress only, but the initiative for this
may come from the people ; it may come from the Republican Party,
or any party. And the same thing is in Russia; the initiative for
removing a member of the Government may come from the Russian
people, in general, through the Communist Party, but can be done
only through the Soviet congress, by the Central Executive Commit-
tee. As you know, then we have authority above the central execu-
tive committee ; once in two years we have a congress of Soviets of all
Russia, which includes several thousand members. Usually there
are two-thirds communists and about one-third nonpartisan. Every-
thing the Government does is ratified Try the Central Executive Com-
mittee; everything the central executive committee does is ratified
afterwards, approved, by the congress of the Soviets, which has
several thousand people.
Mr. Bachmann. Do not 3^011 think you would succeed in establish-
ing better friendly relations between the Government of the United
States and the Soviet Government, if this propaganda that is being
spread, through the Communist Party of America, were stopped?
Mr. Skvirsky. With every country with which the Soviet Govern-
ment has relations, there is always a clause that no party is to inter-
fere with the internal affairs of the other country. The Soviet
Government has said, on many occasions, that it is not responsible
for the acts of the Third International. For instance, you take our
relations with Italy; not withstanding the different character of
the governments in Italy and in Russia, we have never had any
trouble with Italy ; the Soviet Government has trade and diplomatic
relations with Italy and the same thing would be true in the relation-
ship with the United States.
Mr. Bachmann. Are you familiar with conditions in the Russian
Government ?
Mr. Skvirsky. Yes.
Mr. Bachmann. There has been considerable testimony before this
committee about convict labor and enforced labor being used in the
production of certain commodities in Russia and shipped to the
United States?
Mr. Skvirsky. Yes.
Mr. Bachmann. What have you to tell the committee about that?
Mr. Skvirsky. I wish to state that w T e have no convict labor, have no
forced labor. We are a country of workers, a workers' republic, and
how could they have forced labor in such a country? The difficulty
we have in Russia now is in connection with the 5-year plan. We have
INVESTIGATION" OF COMMUNIST PROPAGANDA 61
about 13,000,000 workers ; it is the only country where there is no unem-
ployment. We can not get enough workers. The difficulty in Russia
now, as for instance, in the coal districts, is in the turnover of the
workers who go from one place and then to another place where
there are better conditions for the worker, better places to live, and
so on. This is the trouble we have in Russia; the workers move
too much at the present time. You see, we have two types of work-
ers in Russia, one type of worker is purely an industrial type, used
to work in the factory for many years; the other type just come in
the village for a month, or two months, or three months — of course,
they are not used to staying in one place — and work for a few days
there and then go to some other place. There is the problem we
have at the present time.
Mr. Bachmann. Do you know how many prisoners there are in the
prisons in Russia?
Mr. Skvtrsky. I don't know exactly the number, but certainly far
less than before the war — before the revolution.
Mr. Bachmann. I mean at this time?
Mr. Skviesky. I do not know.
Mr. Bachmann. Do the prisoners have to work?
Mr. Skviesky. The prisoners usually, in most places, do work.
Mr. Bachmann. What kind of work do they perform?
Mr. Skviesky. They usually do the work that they need. You
mean in jails, or the so-called colonies?
Mr. Bachmann. In the colonies.
Mr. Skviesky. Usually every colony is trying to be self-sustain-
ing, which means that they have their own dairies, have their own
fisheries, have their own gardens. The government is trying to
teach them, everyone, to learn a trade, with the idea when you leave
this colony you get out and be an honest citizen, and do work in
a proper way.
Mr. Bachmann. Do the prisoners in the colonies cut timber?
Mr. Skviesky. The prisoners in the colonies cut timber for their
own needs.
Mr. Bachmann. For their own needs?
Mr. Skviesky. Oh, certainly ; they cut timber for their own needs,
but not for export as they are being accused. They cut timber for
their own needs, when they need it. But we hold there is no such
thing as their cutting timber for export ; such accusations are base-
less and usually come from Russian monarchists.
(The committee thereupon took a recess until 2 o'clock p. m.)
AFTER RECESS
The committee reconvened pursuant to the taking of the recess,
Hon. Hamilton Fish, jr. (chairman), presiding.
The Chaieman. Mr. Skvirsky, will you resume the stand?
TESTIMONY OF BORIS E. SKVIRSKY— Continued
Mr. Skviesky. I have here all the publications of the bureau : the
old ones and the new ones.
The Chaieman. These are all the publications ?
Mr. Skviesky. Yes.
119651— 31— pt 1, vol 5 5
62 INVESTIGATION OF COMMUNIST PROPAGANDA
Mr. Baohmann. T wonder if you could not give each member of
the committee a copy of the constitution?
Mr. Skvirsky. Yes; I will be glad to send it.
Mr. Bachmann. Send each member of the committee a copy of
the constitution ?
Mr. Skvirsky. I will be glad to do it.
The Chairman. Will you mark these as exhibits.
(The papers above referred to were marked as Exhibits " Skvirsky
No. 3 " to " Skvirsky No. 10," inclusive.)
Mr. Nelson. I was interested in what you said, Mr. Skvirsky, in
regard to the organization over in Russia and the mistakes that
possibly might have crept into the record, especially in regard to
the central executive committee. Now, as I understand it, there are
three, still are, distinct and perhaps interrelated organizations in
Russia: The Russian Communist Party; the Soviet Government, and
the Third or Communist International. That is correct, is it not?
Mr. Skvirsky. The Third International
Mr. Nelson. Now, that is correct, is it not ?
Mr. Skvirsky. Pardon me, but what I said, you did not state it
right. I did not mean to say they are interrelated.
Mr. Nelson. Well there are those three organizations?
Mr. Skvirsky. There are these organizations, yes.
Mr. Nelson. Now the Russian Communist Party is the only legal
party in Russia, is it not?
Mr. Skvirsky. Yes.
Mr. Nelson. The Russian Communist Party is controlled by its
central executive committee?
Mr. Skvirsky. Well, the Communist Party has a central commit-
tee. It is called central committee ; sometimes called central executive
committee, but usually it is called central committee.
Mr. Nelson. And the committee of the International is called the
central executive committee, is it not ?
Mr. Skvirsky. The same — called central committee, or central
executive committee. Very often, it is called central executive
committee.
Mr. Nelson. Let me stick to this one. The governing committee
of the Russian Communist Party is called the central committee?
Mr. Skvirsky. Yes — central committee of the Communist Party.
Mr. Nelson. And that is elected by the Soviets ?
Mr. Skvirsky. The Communist Party?
Mr. Nelson. Yes.
Mr. Skvirsky. No, it is elected by the communists. The congress
of the communists of the Soviet Union elects the central committee
of the party ; it is purely a party organization.
Mr. Nelson. I did not intend to ask you that question. The cen-
tral committee of the Communist Party acts through subcommittees,
does it not ?
Mr. Skvirsky. Yes.
Mr. Nelson. And one of them is the politbureau?
Mr. Skvirsky. Yes.
Mr. Nelson. And the other is what?
Mr. Skvirsky. It is called orgbureau, which means organizational
bureau.
Mr. Nelson. And also called control bureau?
INVESTIGATION OF COMMUNIST PROPAGANDA "* 63
Mr. Skvirsky. Well, the control bureau — or rather the central
control committee — is not a part of the central committee; it is a
separate body. It is a body which looks after— well is interested
in seeing that the members behave in conformity with the principles
of the party.
Mr. Nelson. The politbureau and the control bureau are smaller
committees made up of members of the central committee?
Mr. Skvirsky. Yes, sir.
Mr. Nelson. The control bureau members may or may not be
members of the central committee ?
Mr. Skvirsky. Right.
Mr. Nelson. I understood you to say these members of the central
committee of the Russian Communist Party were selected perhaps
every two years at the congress of the party ?
Mr. Skvirsky. Yes.
Mr. Nelson. Now the politbureau has quite a little to do with the
Soviet Government, does it not?
Mr. Skvirsky. Yes; it is a purely party organization.
Mr. Nelson. Does not the politbureau dominate the Soviet
Government ?
Mr. Skvirsky. As I said, the party controls the policy, in an
indirect way, which means this
Mr. Nelson. And does it through the politbureau ?
Mr. Skvirsky. Well, you see the central committee is higher than
the politbureau.
Mr. Nelson. I understand, but they act through the politbureau?
Mr. Skvirsky. The way they act is this: The policies are being
discussed by the congress, the party congress. Sometimes weak
political parties have a congress and discuss problems and carry out
resolutions.
Mr. Nelson. Then it is the duty of the central committee to see
that the policy is carried out?
Mr. Skvirsky. You mean the central committee of the party %
Mr. Nelson. Yes.
Mr. Skvirsky. Yes.
Mr. Nelson. Now, you are making the same mistake you said we
made.
Mr. Skvirsky. No. What I mean is that the central committee
is the committee that carries out the policy.
Mr. Nelson. I understand. After the congress has met and deter-
mined the policy, then it is the duty of the central committee of the
Communist Party to see that that policy is carried out ?
Mr. Skvirsky. Yes.
Mr. Nelson. And, through the politbureau, it informs the Soviet
Government what that policy is and what they would like to have
it do?
Mr. Skvirsky. No.
Mr. Nelson. What do they do?
Mr. Skvirsky. When resolutions are carried, every member of the
Communist Party knows it, and when the congress of the Soviets is
in session, which is once in two years, and questions of policy are
being discussed the communists are naturally taking up the same
position as the party took.
64 INVESTIGATION OF COMMUNIST PROPAGANDA
Mr. Nelson. So that after the congress of the party has met and
stated what they want to do, why all the members of the Soviet
Government know what it is and carry it out?
Mr. Skvirsky. If the central executive committee of the Soviets
carries those and passes the same resolutions as the communists, then
they carry it out. Usually they do, because the majority of the
central executive committee are communists.
Mr. Bachmann. Do I get you clearly there, Mr. Nelson, that the
central committee dictates the policy that is followed by the Soviet
Government %
Mr. Nelson. Yes.
Mr. Skvirsky. You mean the central committee of the party?
Mr. Bachmann. Of the Communist Party — dictates the policy for
the Soviet Government?
Mr. Skvirsky. No.
Mr. Bachmann. That is the thing I am not clear about.
Mr. Skvirsky. No ; what I say is this
Mr. Nelson. Of course, he does not say they do.
Mr. Bachmann. You did not get a direct answer there.
Mr. Nelson. I did not expect to. He is not going to admit the
politbureau runs the Soviet Government. I could spend the whole
afternoon questioning him about it, and he would say no.
Mr. Skvirsky. I would say no.
Mr. Nelson. Now, the Soviet Government was organized by the
Russian Communist Party?
Mr. Skvirsky. The Soviet Government was organized by the cen-
tral executive committee ; of course, from the beginning — after the
revolution, you mean?
Mr. Nelson. Yes.
Mr. Skvirsky. After the revolution the old government was over-
thrown and the Soviets elected a new government, which was com-
posed of communists.
Mr. Nelson. We know r that.
Mr. Skvirsky. No it is not a party organization that elects the
government. That is mixed up.
Mr. Nelson. My question was if the Russian Communist Party
did not conceive and form the Soviet Government. The did, did
they not ?
Mr. Skvirsky. As far as conceiving the idea of the Soviet
Government.
Mr. Nelson. Yes.
Mr. Skvirsky. But the actual electing of the Soviet Government
has been by the congress of Soviets. From the very beginning of
the revolution until now, we have a congress of Soviets, which has
party members and nonparty members.
Mr. Nelson. I understand that; but I say the government was
created originally by the Russian Communist Party and now it is
being run by its own members?
Mr. Skvirsky. At the present time, the State is being run by the
Government. There is one important question — the Russian central
executive committee is not only a legislative institution. You see,
here you have a division of powers; under the Soviet Union, it is
different; the central executive committee is an administrative, as
well as a legislative body, both, and, for administrative purposes,
INVESTIGATION OF COMMUNIST PROPAGANDA 65
it elects the so-called government — I mean the council of peoples
commissars.
Mr. Nelson. But now you have anticipated me a little. The
Russian Communists Party through its central committee, conceived
the Soviet Government, did it not?
Mr. Skvirskt. You mean the idea of the Soviet Government?
Mr. Nelson. Yes.
Mr. Skvirskt. Oh, yes; that is true.
Mr. Nelson. Now the Soviet Government also acts through the
executive committee?
Mr. Skvirskt. The Soviet Government has departments as you
have in the United States.
Mr. Nelson. Yes; but what do you call the group — the congress,
or commissars, or how do you term them ?
Mr. Skvirskt. The council of peoples commissi r<. We have
various commissars of departments; we have a foreign affairs de-
partment; we have a war department; a department of finance, of
trade, and so on. which is administrative.
Mr. Nelson. What do you call them — council of commissars?
Mr. Skvirskt. Yes; council of peoples commissars; or. in short,
it is called sovnarkum.
Mr. Nelson. Do you have no central executive committee of the
Soviet Government ?
Mr. Skvirskt. No.
Mr. Nelson. So, when you speak of the central executive com-
mittee, or of the executive committee, exercising authority, you are
not referring to nay committee of the Soviet Government ?
Mr. Skvirskt. I am referring to the central executive committee
of the Soviets, which is being elected by the congress of the Soviets.
We have Soviets in Russia which are self-governing bodies; the
Soviets send their representatives to the congress.
Mr. Nelson. Is that the one that meets every two years i
Mr. Skvirskt. It meets every two years and it is composed of
at least 1,500 members. There are more.
Mr. Nelson. What do they elect ?
Mr. Skvirskt. They elect the central executive committee, which
is composed of two branches.
Mr. Nelson. You have gone back now to the central executive
committee of the Russian Communist Party \
Mr. Skvirskt. No.
Mr. Nelson. Well is not the central executive committee of the
Russian Communist Partv the central executive committee that the
congress of Soviets elects ?
Mr. Skvirskt. No; they have nothing to do with it. It is just
two separate and distinct organizations.
Mr. Nelson. Then you have a central executive committee?
Mr. Skvirskt. Which is composed of two chambers, I will call
them. One is called the council of the union, which is like the
House of Representatives here; the other is called the council of
nationalities, which is like the Senate here, because each republic
elects the same number of deputies. Both of these chambers con-
stitute the central executive committee.
Mr. Nelson. Of the congress of Soviets?
66 INVESTIGATION OF COMMUNIST PROPAGANDA
Mr. Skvirsky. Of the congress of Soviets. This central executive
committee has about 400 — over 500 — members; about 535 members.
Well you have about two-thirds. I would say. that are party members
and about one-third are just nonpartisan, elected by the people. I
may say that last year we had about To per cent of the electors in
the cities participating in the elections and about 60 per cent in the
villages. The central executive committee is the permanent body.
You see, the sessions — the congress of Soviets meets once in two years.
and the central executive committee about once in three months, and
the committee has a permanent so-called presidium which is com-
posed of 9 members of the council of the union, 9 members of the
council of nationalities, and 9 members which are elected by both
branches, making up 27 people, and each law passed by the peoples
council of commissars is ratified by the presidium.
Mr. Nelson. What is that?
Mr. Skvirsky. I say each law, each decree, published by the coun-
cil of peoples commissars, the most important decrees have to be
ratified by the presidium of the central executive committee, and you
can always see each decree signed by the president of the central
executive committee, with the signature of the president of the
peoples commissars.
Mr, Nelson. Then the laws that are passed by the people's com-
missars must be approved by
Mr. Skvirsky. By the presidium.
Mr. Nelson, By this presidium of the central executive committee
of the congress of Soviets.
Mr. Skvirsky. And usually the policies in general are discussed
by the central executive committee in plenary sessions.
Mr. Nelson. That is the policy of the Soviet Government ?
Mr. Skvirsky. Yes, the policies which the country is going to
follow. When they are adopted there, the Soviet Government has
to carry them out.
Mr. Nelson. The Third International, or Communist Interna-
tional, was created by the Russian Communist Party?
Mr. Skvirsky. The initiative at first was not only Russian. Sev-
eral parties were those parties who were part of the Second Inter-
national and who, before the war, established the German Socialist
Party. So other members decided to have their own international,
being opposed to war, and the Russian Communist Party was one
of them.
Mr. Nelson. But those who met and formed the party were
Russians, largely, who predominated — Russian communists?
Mr. Skvirsky. Well, you see, the Russian party, which had already
been successful, had a successful revolution, was more influential;
that is all.
Mr. Nelson. The Third International is also governed by the
central executive committee? •
Mr. Skvirsky. Yes; they have an executive committee.
Mr. Nelson. Well is not that its governing body?
Mr. Skvirsky. Well, it is something like an executive body.
Mr. Nelson. Well what is highest authority in the Third Inter-
national?
Mr. Skvirsky. The congress.
INVESTIGATION OF COMMUNIST PROPAGANDA 67
Mr. Nelson. That meets every two years, or four years — how
often does that meet?
Mr. Skvirsky I don't know; I think about every two years, or
so; I don't know.
Mr. Nelson. Your party meets every two years, I think. Well,
that is the highest authority in the Third International?
Mr. Skvirsky. I understand so.
Mr. Nelson. But not being in session all the time, its power has
to be carried on by some smaller body that is on the ground?
Mr. Skvirsky. I suppose so.
Mr. Nelson. And that is what?
Mr. Skvirsky. That is the committee.
Mr. Nelson. That is the central executive committee?
Mr. Skvirsky. Yes.
Mr. Nelson. Now the central executive committee acts through
what, a smaller committee ?
Mr. Skvirsky. I suppose so. I am not an official or the Komin-
turn. sir: I can not tell you exactly every committee they have.
Mr. Nelson. Does not the Third International have its presidium ?
Mr. Skvirsky. You mean the executive committee?
Mr. Nelson. Yes.
Mr. Skvirsky. I suppose so; every organization acts through a
few people which it elects.
Mr. Nelson. Now. when you stated this morning there was con-
fusion in the understanding in this country as to the use of the central
executive committee, what did you mean?
Mr. Skydrsky. I mean this: When the Soviet Government has to
submit for ratification every measure it takes to its parliament,
which means the central executive committee, which adopts its policy
on the basis
Mr. Nelson. The central executive committee of what?
Mr. Skvirsky. Of the Soviets. This is the only one which is
usually called central executive committee. That is called in Russia
ZIK, and the government is responsible to them, to this committee,
and not to anybody else. So that is why, when I say the Soviet
Government has nothing to do with the Third International, it is an
independent body completely, that is what I mean. It is only
subordinate to the central executive committee of the soviet.
Mr. Nelson. And you say it is not subordinate in any way to the
polit bureau?
Mr. Skvirsky. No.
Mr. Nelson. Well, have you read the writings of Stalin and Lenin
and all of these official documents that come straight from Russia,
that we have here?
Mr. Skvirsky. Surely, I have read much of it; I did not read it
all.
Mr. Nelson. They do not seem to indicate the same ground, or
opinion, you take here.
Mr. Skvirsky. I don't know, who takes.
Mr. Nelson. The highest leaders and the greatest exponents of
communist socialism in Russia.
Mr. Skvirsky. I know they are the leaders ; I have read them.
Mr. Nelson. They differ from you on that point.
68 INVESTIGATION OF COMMUNIST PROPAGANDA
Mr. Skvirsky. I do not think they differ with me on this point
at all.
Mr. Nelson. Apparently they differ with you on that point.
Mr. Skvirsky. No. As I said, the Communist Party of Russia
has the confidence of the people. The Communist Party in Russia,
when it passes certain resolutions, the policy they would like to have
the country follow, are carried out through the majority in both
houses. That is why the ideas of the Communist Party are made
the policies in Russia.
Mr. Nelson. Who elects the council of people's commissars?
Mr. Skvirsky. The central executive committee of the Soviets.
Mr. Nelson. And that consists of this council of the union and
council of nationalities?
Mr. Skvirsky. Yes. There are over 500 people, about 535 or 540.
The communists have their own congress.
Mr. Nelson. Yes. Now the Soviet Government is responsible
only to
Mr. Skvirsky. The central executive committee and its presidium.
Mr. Nelson. The central executive committee of the congress of
Soviets ?
Mr. Skvirsky. Yes.
Mr. Nelson. What office does Stalin hold in that central executive
committee of the congress of Soviets.
Mr. Skvirsky. Stalin, I think, is a member of the central executive
committee. He is secretary of the Communist Party; but, in the
committee he is just a member.
Mr. Nelson. Just a minute. Is he a member of the central execu-
tive committee of the congress of Soviets?
Mr. Skvirsky. Yes.
Mr. Nelson. Or is he secretary and a member of the central com-
mittee of the Communist Party ?
Mr. Skvirsky. Well, he is both.
Mr. Nelson. Well, do you know he is a member of the central
executive committee of the congress of Soviets?
Mr. Skvirsky. I think he is.
Mr. Nelson. You think he is?
Mr. Skvirsky. Yes.
Mr. Nelson. Is he a member, or just the secretary?
Mr. Skvirsky. You mean of the
Mr. Nelson. Of the central executive committee of the congress
of Soviets?
Mr. Skvirsky. Just a member.
Mr. Nelson. Where was he elected and from what constituency?
Mr. Skvirsky. In Moscow, I think, some factory. As you know,
all of the elections are at the place of occupation — each factory, or
each village, and so on.
Mr. Nelson. Is there not a publication known as the Calender of
the Communists — an official state publication of the Union of Socialist
Soviet Republics?
Mr. Skvirsky. There is a calendar of the communists, but it is not
an official publication.
Mr. Nelson. Well, it is official enough, is it not ?
Mr. Skvirsky. It is a party publication ; not official.
Mr. Nelson. Yes.
INVESTIGATION OF COMMUNIST PEOPAGANDA 69
Mr. Skvirsky. Well, it is not the same thing.
Mr. Nelson. It is published by whom ?
Mr. Skvirsky. It is published by the party.
Mr. Nelson. By the Communist Party of Russia?
Mr. Skvirsky. Yes ; but not by the government. Government pub-
lications are distinctly separate from any other publications in the
country.
Mr. Nelson. Is it not true in Russia to-day that practically the
same men hold office in the central committee of the Communist
Party of Russia, in the Third International, or Communist Interna-
tional, and in the government ?
Mr. Skvirsky. No. There may be one or two in common, but the
majority of them are not. If you take the list of the government
officials, the majority of them art not.
Mr. Nelson. What office does Stalin hold
Mr. Skvirsky. He is a secretary.
Mr. Nelson (continuing). In the Government?
Mr. Skvirsky. No offce at all.
Mr. Nelson. He holds no office in the government at all ? .
Mr. Skvirsky. No office at all.
Mr. Nelson. Then he is not a member of the central executive com-
mittee of the congress of the Soviets?
Mr. Skvirsky. Oh, yes. By " Government " I mean the Council
of the Peoples Commissars. If you mean the government this way,
then he is; but the government is usually called Council of Peoples
Commissars," which is the cabinet.
Mr. Nelson. Well, the central executive committee of the Soviets
are simply members of the Russian Communist Party, are they not ?
Mr. Skvirsky. Not all.
Mr. Nelson. Well practically all of them?
Mr. Skvirsky. You mean in the central executive committee of the
Soviets ?
Mr. Nelson. Yes.
Mr. Skvirsky. Oh, no. There are about 200 of them, I suppose,
out of 550 ; about one-third are nonparty people.
Mr. Nelson. Yes; one-third are nonparty, and two-thirds party?
Mr. Skvirsky. That is about the proportion.
Mr. Nelson. Two-thirds of the 535 members are members of the
Russian Communist Party?
Mr. Skvirsky. Two-thirds; yes. The proportion is usually the
same proportion as in the congress of Soviets.
Mr. Nelson. Then the only difference between the central com-
mittee of the Communist Party and the central committee of the
Soviets is that the central committee of the Soviets has perhaps a
third nonparty members?
Mr. Skvirsky. Well, it is a state organization ; it is like you have
the Congress here
Mr. Nelson. But as far as the constituency goes?
Mr. Skvirsky. They are not all the same people.
Mr. Nelson. Oh, no; not all the same people, but all of the mem-
bership of the central executive committee of the congress of Soviets
are members of the Russian Communist Party, except about a third?
Mr. Skvirsky. Yes.
70 INVESTIGATION OF COMMUNIST PROPAGANDA
Mr. Nelson. Well, when you speak, in Russian terminology, of
a man being a member of the presidium, what do you mean — presi-
dium of the Third International, or presidium of the executive
committee of the Soviets?
Mr. Skyirsky. We always have in mind the executive committee
of the Soviets.
Mr. Nelson. And not of the Third International \
Mr. Skvirsky'. No. It is only abroad that you can hear so much
about it.
Mr. Nelson. But the Third International does have its presidium
and its governing body of the Third International ?
Mr. Skvirsky. I suppose so. Everybody has a presidium;
I mean president and members. I suppose so.
Mr. Nelson. Are you telling me what you suppose
Mr. Skvirsky. I think so.
Mr. Nelson. About the constitution of the Third International?
Mr. Skvirsky^. I think so. I am not an expert; but, as far as I
know, I am giving my answers. I think so.
Mr. Nelson. Well, if a man of your ability and attainments and
experience in communism and the government of Russia can not
tell us the facts, you can not blame us very seriously if we get
confused on some of those things, can you?
Mr. Skyirsky Well, I was trying to give you all the facts.
I am willing to give you all of the facts.
Mr. Nelson. I was not criticising; I am simply showing the
difficulty under which we labor.
Mr. Skyirsky. Yes; but I think as far as this question is con-
cerned, every body of people has to have a presidium of some kind
to carry on its work. It is only natural that they have.
Mr. Nelson. I think, in this calendar of the communists, Stalin is
given as a member of the central executive committee. You used
the expression "ZIK" ; what does that mean ?
Mr. Skyirsky. This is the central executive committee of the
Soviets.
Mr. Nelson. What does ZIK mean?
Mr. Skvirsky. It means central executive committee; it is a
Russian word.
Mr. Nelson. It means central executive committee of the Soviets?
Mr. Skvirsky. Yes.
Mr. Nelson. And not of the Russian Communist Party ?
Mr. Skvirsky'. No.
Mr. Nelson. And not of the Third International ?
Mr. Skvirsky. No.
Mr. Nelson. Now, the communist international gives him as a
member of the presidium. He is, is he not ?
Mr. Skvirsky. I beg your pardon; you asked about Stalin?
Mr. Nelson. Yes.
Mr. Skivirsky. Whether he is a member of the presidium of the
Communist Party?
Mr. Nelson. No ; that is not what I asked you.
Mr. Skvirsky. I did not hear you.
Mr. Nelson. I say is he a member of the presidium of the Third
International ?
INVESTIGATION OF COMMUNIST PROPAGANDA 71
Mr. Skyirsky. I think he is in the Russian group which is in the
international, so he ought to be there.
Mr. Nelson. That is the premise to entitle him to sit in the
presidium \
Mr. Skvirsky. Possibly so. Every party has a group of those
representatives in the central executive committee.
Mr. Nelson. You see. we are wasting so much time. I just wanted
to know from you if Stalin was a member of the presidium of the
Third International. Is he \
Mr. Skvirsky. Yes: I think so.
Mr. Nelson. He is also a member of the Third International
executive committee ?
Mr. Skvirsky. Yes ; of the committee.
Mr. Nelson. If he was not a member of the executive committee,
he could not be a member of the presidium, could he \
Mr. Skvirsky. That is right.
Mr. Nelson. He is also down here as being general secretary of
the central committee of the Communist Party. Is that correct?
Mr. Skvirsky. Yes: that is correct.
Mr. Nelson. Now the same, generally speaking, is true as regards
practically every member of the politbureau. is it not '.
Mr. Skvirsky. No: not all of them are.
Mr. Nelson. Name one that is not.
Mr. Skvirsky. (Examines papers.)
Mr. Nelson. Could you name one off-hand (
Mr. Skvirsky. No; I will just have to look. ' (After examining
papers) : Here is a man I could name — Yoroshiloo.
Mr. Nelson. He is commissar for the army and the navy \
Mr. Skvirsky. Yes.
Mr. Nelson. And a member of the central committee of the Com-
munist Party?
Mr. Skvirsky. Yes: he is a member of the politbureau. Here is
another — Kaganovich.
Mr. Nelson. He is secretary of the central committee ?
Mr. Skvirsky. He is one of the secretaries: yes.
Mr. Nelson. And a member of the Central Council of Trade
Unions ?
Mr. Skvirsky. Trade Unions?
Mr. Nelson. Yes.
Mr. Skvirsky. No. He is a member of the politbureau.
Mr. Nelson. Yes; but he is also in the Third International, and
he holds the office of a member of the Central Council of Trade
Unions ?
Mr. Skvirsky. That is not the Third International. It may be
the so-called trade-union international? o
Mr. Nelson. No; this is the communist international.
Mr. Skvirsky. I have here the list.
Mr. Nelson. This is taken from your calendar of communists.
Mr. Skvirsky. Of what year?
Mr. Nelson. 1930.
Mr. Skvirsky. Maybe : but, as far as I know. I think this is the
latest date which I have.
Mr. Nelson. Have vou anything later than 1930?
72 INVESTIGATION OF COMMUNIST PROPAGANDA
Mr. Skvikskv. This is what I have; I have this for July 14, 1930,
and the sixteenth congress of the party was July 14, 1'JoO, and this
must have been published before. There are several others who
are not included there. I think there are only about three of them.
Mr. Nelson. Did not the Soviet Government have so little part
in the decisions of its concerns and were not so many of them referred
directly to the politbureau that Lenin and Stalin had to protest
against it and insist that those matters should be taken off the
shoulders of the politbureau and be decided by the Soviet Gov-
ernment, and leave the politbureau free to carry on its more im-
portant affairs?
Mr. Skvirsky. No.
Mr. Nelson. What?
Mr. Skvirsky. I never heard of it.
Mr. Nelson. You never heard of it?
Mr. Skvirsky. No. I know from the beginning of the revolution,
the Soviet Government was a Soviet Government.
Mr. Nelson. Well, do not you imagine there may be some things
going on over there that you have not heard about ?
Mr. Skvirsky. I do not think so, because I have to follow closely
everything you know 7 , being closely connected with the government.
Mr. Nelson. Well, we have such a record somewhere here, taken
from Stalin's or Leniirs own w T ords. I do not have it before me, but
it is in the record. I think that is all I w T ant to ask.
Mr. Eslick. In order to become a communist, the individual has
to pledge himself to carry out the policies of the Communist Party,
does he not?
Mr. Skvirsky. Yes.
Mr. Eslick. One of the purposes of the Communist Party is to de-
stroy all capitalist governments, is it not?
Mr. Skvirsky. Every communist Avants to establish, is trying to
assist in his own country to establish communism.
Mr. Eslick. In other words, the American communist must stand
for the destruction of the Government? America is classed as a
Capitalist Government, is it not?
Mr. Skvirsky. All governments are classed as such who have the
system of capitalism. The only country which is not capitalistic
is the Soviet Union; so America is included in the countries with
capitalistic governments.
Mr. Eslick. The American communists, then, would stand for the
overthrow- of this Government and the substitution of the soviet
form of government, w r ould he not?
Mr. Skvirsky. Every communist wants to have established the
communist government. Whatever you have to do for that, whether
you will be able to do it by way of overthrowing, or not, depends
on flie conditions in each country. In Russia, you know, there was
no other way. In Russia, there was an overthrow and, if the same
conditions are in other countries, I suppose they will have to do it.
Mr. Eslick. Now, in the overthrow of the government, do they
stand for its overthrow by force, if it becomes necessary ?
Mr. Skvirsky. Well, you see, the communist is a student of his-
tory — every communist wants to improve the lot of the working peo-
ple and history shows that no ruling class has ever parted with its
INVESTIGATION OF COMMUNIST PROPAGANDA 73
power without a struggle, so the communists realize, that un-
doubtedly, since they want to have abolished exploitation by the
ruling class, and since the ruling class is going to oppose, they would
have to have a revolution.
Mr. Eslick. Now, the expectation and the hope of the communist
organization is world revolution, is it not — complete overthrow of
capitalist governments ?
Mr. Skvirsky. The communists believe, that with communism suc-
cessful in other countries, in most of the countries, they have to see
that communism is safe; that the 'communist country is not going to
be attacked by the capitalist countries.
Mr. Eslick. Now, you are a Russian citizen?
Mr. Skvirsky. Yes.
Mr. Eslick. You are a communist?
Mr. Skvirsky. Yes, I am; I consider myself a communist.
Mr. Eslick. You have spent practically nine years here?
Mr. Skvirsky. Yes; except the time which I spent in Russia.
Mr. Eslick. In your own personal view, as the representative of
the Soviet Government, and as a communist, do you believe in the
overthrow of the American Government?
Mr. Skvirsky. As I said, I am a soviet citizen ; I am a communist
and we have already our Soviet Republic. We have established it
in Russia and we are working only for the strengthening of the work-
ers of our Soviet Republic, for this republic, that it may be so strong
that it will become, some day, the largest revolutionary factor, on
account of conditions it will create for its working class. While
nothing can be done about it, it means the growth of influence of the
workers' state. America was, after the American Revolution, the
greatest revolutionary factor in Europe generally. As 3-ou know,
the American Declaration of Independence has had a great deal
to do with revolutions in Europe. You know the First International,
the working class international, was in America from 1772 to 1876.
The First International was here and Karl Marx, who was the head
of the First International, as maybe you remember, sent greetings
to President Lincoln, who replied very warmly. It was during the
Civil War. And as America was a revolutionary factor in European
revolutions, so Russia now becomes a revolutionary factor; America
proclaims the ideas of political democracy ; Russia, the Soviet Union,
proclaims the ideas of industrial democracy. I am here only as the
unofficial representative of the Soviet Government, working to estab-
lish better relations and a better understanding between the United
States and the Soviet Union.
Mr. Eslick. Now, let us get back to the question : You are a Rus-
sian citizen; you are a communist; you have spent nine years here. I
am asking you if it is your own belief, your own faith, that the
Government of the United States should be overthrown and a Soviet
Republic established in its place?
Mr. Skvirsky. I have nothing to do with the United States. As
I said, I am working only for the Soviet Union and it is not for me
to give an opinion as to what Americans have to do in America.
You want to know my opinion — I supposed you wanted only facts
and, as I say, the only fact I can state is that I am here working
for the Soviet Government.
74 INVESTIGATION OF COMMUNIST PROPAGANDA
«
Mr. Eslick. Your allegiance and service, then, is to the Soviet
Republic?
Mr. Skvirsky. Yes.
Mr. Eslick. And you are hands-off as to the American situation?
Mr. Skvirsky. Absolutely. And if I had acted different, I would
have had more trouble, I suppose, in the Soviet Union than here.
Mr. Eslick. Are you not willing to promote communism here,
where you can do it? ,
Mr. Skvirsky. No. I am here just to represent my country, my
government, and working only to improve the relations between
America and the Soviet Government.
Mr. Eslick. I thought communism stood for the improvement of
the working class the world over?
Mr. Skvirsky. The Russian Communist Party is not to look after
the whole world. You have communist parties in every country ;
it is up to them to do whatever they like.
Mr. Eslick. Are you not reaching out, through the Third Inter-
national, to try to reach all other countries?
Mr. Skvirsky. We do not. I made the statement that we had rela-
tions with Italy, with Mussolini, for several years. Yon know the
interests of the facists and communists are not the same; communists
are not fascists, and facists are not communists; nevertheless, we
have developed trade relations and diplomatic relations with Italy,
and have no trouble.
Mr. Eslick. But when you get too active over there, he shakes the
big stick at you, does he not ?
Mr. Skvirsky. But there was no case (I wish to make this state-
ment here again), where any government in Europe, which had rela-
tions with the Soviet Government could prove on us something as a
fact. There was much antisoviet propaganda, it is true, and any-
thing the Third International does, immediately you hear the Soviet
Government is to blame. The Soviet Government disclaims any re-
sponsibility for the actions of the Third International.
Mr. Eslick. In other words, the strikes and outlawry in the United
States are disclaimed by the Soviet Government?
Mr. Skvirsky. Absolutely. It is not a matter for the Soviet Gov-
ernment.
Mr. Eslick. It is a party matter for the communists; not a matter
of the Soviet Government?
Mr. Skvirsky. I don't know about strikes; I don't know whether
you have strikes or communists; I don't know about it.
Mr. Eslick. But such a strike as the Gastonia strike, the New Bed-
ford strike
Mr. Skvirsky. The Soviet Government had absolutely nothing to
do with that. It is the same thing as to say that we have to do with
the American Communist Party.
Mr. Eslick. In other words, if they are called communist strikes,
that is a party matter and not a governmental affair; is that true?
Mr. Skvirsky. Of the American Communist Party, I presume.
The Chairman. Do you know Mr. M. Lulinski ?
Mr. Skvirsky. Yes.
The Chairman. What have been your connections with him?
Mr. Skvirsky. I am glad you asked me about him. I have known
him for several years. He is a man who does not belong to any polit-
INVESTIGATION OF COMMUNIST PROPAGANDA 75
ical party ; he does not know anything about politics. When he went
on business to Mexico, he was sent to take over the goods which the
Trade Legation left there. It was claimed, however, by the Press he
had all kinds of documents. If there are any documents they must
be like the Whalen documents. I want to say there is no scintilla of
truth in the accusations against this man, who is purely a nonpoliti-
cal person, who never knew anything about politics.
The Chairman. What have been your associations with him?
Mr. Skvirsky. I have known him. He was working a long time,
I think, for the Selskosoyus, which means agricultural cooperatives.
For a long time I used to meet him in Xew York, to talk to him and
all. He feels terrible now on account of these accusations.
The Chairman. Was he born in Russia?
Mr. Skvirsky. I think so. He has been here a good many years.
The Chairman. Was he connected with Amtorg ?
Mr. Skvirsky. At the present time, I think he is ; I think so ; may-
be with the cooperatives. I know he has been sent to Mexico on
purely business affairs.
The Chairman. He was the one who was arrested in Mexico?
Mr. Skvirsky. Yes.
The Chairman. And was sent out of Mexico by the Mexican
Government ?
Mr. Skvirsky. Yes ; so I understand.
The Chairman. It is not the United States that made those
charges; it is the Mexican Government that made the charges against
him.
Mr. Skvirsky. They are similar to a lot of other charges. You
know, there was a charge that I was chief of the G. P. U., according
to the Whalen documents. There are many charges here.
The Chairman. Do you know a lawyer by the name of Mr.
Cotton i
Mr. Skvirsky. Cotton?
The Chairman. Yes*.
Mr. Skvirsky. I knew one Cotton, who used to be secretary of the
American-Russian Chamber of Commerce long ago, several years
ago; then I think he is connected with the Society for Cultural
Relations with Russia, in New York, if this is the one.
The Chairman. Yes.
Mr. Skvirsky. I did not know he was a lawyer.
The Chairman. What is your connection with him?
Mr. Skvirsky. I just met him from time to time in New York,
maybe five or ten times in my life ; no special connection.
The Chairman. What position does he hold now?
Mr. Skvirsky. I think he is a member of the
The Chairman. Secretary of the society ?
Mr. Skvirsky. Not secretary ; I think one of the directors of what
is called the American Russian Society for Cultural Relations with
the Soviet Union.
The Chairman. What is his first name?
Mr. Skvirsky. I could not tell you his full name.
The Chairman. Do you know in what business he is engaged ?
Mr. Skvirsky. No.
The Chairman. You have heard of Mr. Zinoviev?
76 INVESTIGATION OF COMMUNIST PROPAGANDA
Mr. Skviksky. You mean the Russian Communist?
The Chairman. Yes.
Mr. Skvirsky. Certainly.
The Chairman. Do you know him?
Mr. Skvirsky. Not personally, no ; I never met him.
The Chairman. Was he head of the Third International?
Mr. Skvirsky. At one time ; yes, long ago.
The Chairman. Did you ever hear of him making the statement
that the Third International is part and parcel of the Communist
Party ; that the Third International and the Soviet Government are
part and parcel of the same house?
Mr. Skvirsky. Well, I do not remember such a statement, but very
often you can hear such statements. You have to go into them, what
they mean. They may not mean anything at all. It is not the same
as the Soviet Government ; they want to say, possibly here, that they
would like to have a Soviet Government, the same as in Russia and
the ideas of those here maj^be of other parties, possibly are that they
would like to have the same thing ; that is perhaps all, but they should
never refer to the Soviet Government, as such.
The Chairman. Well, is not the Third International a creature of
Lenin ?
Mr. Skvirsky. Well, Lenin is a communist, and one of the leaders
who was very bitter — was opposed to the Second International.
The Chairman. Did not he organize the Third International in
Moscow ?
Mr. Skvirsky. He was one of the organizers; yes. He was the
most important man; yes.
The Chairman. And he organized the Third International in
Moscow, did he not?
Mr. Skvirsky. It was in Moscow; yes.
The Chairman. And Trotsky was another of the organizers, was
he not?
Mr. Skvirsky. I think so.
The Chairman. Were not Lenin and Trotsk} T the two main or-
ganizers of the Third International ?
Mr. Skvirsky. Well, there were representatives of other nations,
because Russians were not the only ones who were not satisfied
with the Second International. I wish to say this here: You have
in London the head of the Government, Mr. MacDonald, who is a
member of the Second International; is he responsible for the activi-
ties of the Second International ?
The Chairman. What is that?
Mr. Skvirsky. I was talking about MacDonald being a member of
the Second International.
The Chairman. Did not Mr. MacDonald give out a statement to
the effect that he saw no difference between the Third International
and Soviet Government?
Mr. Skvirsky. I don't remember his making any statement; I
think there was something in the press of a statement made by the
Secretary of Foreign Affairs; but I saw, at the same time, that the
Soviet Government again disclaimed any responsibility for the Third
International.
INVESTIGATION OF COMMUNIST PROPAGANDA 77
(The committee thereupon took a recess until 3.30 o'clock p. m.,
at the conclusion of which the hearing was resumed as follows:)
Mr. Skvtrsky. May I make a statement, say a few words about
Lulinski ?
The Chairman. Yes.
Mr. Skvirsky. I understand that the arrest of Mr. Lulinski was
made at the request of Commissioner Whalen. Lulinski was an
American citizen and was freed on request of the American am-
bassador in Mexico.
The Chairman. Why do you make that statement, that it was
made at the request of Mr. Whalen?
Mr. Skvirsky. I understand that from the press.
The Chairman. From the press?
Mr. Skvirsky. Yes. I know afterwards the American ambassador
in Mexico interfered in his behalf and he was released.
The Chairman. Of course, you may have seen it in the press, but
I never heard that statement before that Mr. Whalen ever knew
Mr. Lulinski, or ever heard of Mr. Lulinski.
Mr. Skvirsky. That is what I saw in the press and the fact
was, as I say, the American ambassador asked for his release by
Mexico, and he was released.
The Chairman. Do } t ou happen to know he did ask for his
release ?
Mr. Skvirsky. Yes.
The Chairman. Do you know the history of the American am-
bassador having asked for his release ?
Mr. Skvirsky. That is what I know.
The Chairman. How do you know that?
Mr. Skvirsky. Well, I have heard about it from Mr. Lulinski,
who told me ; then I heard about it in New York. Here is, I think,
Mr. Marshall who knows it.
Mr. Marshall. I think that is a fact. I would not say it was
Commisisoner Whalen, but it was on a telegram from the New York
Police Department.
The Chairman. Of course, it is news to me that the State De-
partment officially asked for his release.
Mr. Skvirsky. I don't know about the State Department ; I only
say the American ambassador. Maybe he did it himself; not the
State Department.
The Chairman. Perhaps he might have asked that he be com-
municated with.
Mr. Skvirsky. He is an American citizen, Mr. Lulinski, and
naturally he communicated with the Mexican Government to find
out, and he was released.
The Chairman. We were discussing the Third International and
you still claim, in spite of Mr. Nelson's cross-examination, that the
Soviet Government is not responsible for the actions of the Third
International. That is correct, is it not?
Mr. Skvirsky. Correct.
The Chairman. But you do admit that Lenin and Trotsky, and
others, helped to create the Third International in Moscow, back in
1919, is that correct?
Mr. Skvirsky. Yes.
119651— 31— pt 1, vol 5 6
78 INVESTIGATION OF COMMUNIST PROPAGANDA
The Chairman. And that the leaders of the Communist Party are
ver} 7 largely members of the executive committee of the Third
International?
Mr. Skvirsky. Of the Russian Communist Party.
The Chairman. Of the Russian Communist Party?
Mr. Skvirsky. Only a few of them; several of them. There are
about GO, if my memory serves me right ; there are about 60 members
and on the committee only a few are Russians, about 8 of 10, maybe ;
no more. The rest are all representatives of the various nationali-
ties — over 60, I suppose.
The Chairman. You would not be surprised if there were 16
Russian members of the Third International, and the executive com-
mittee of the* Third International ?
Mr. Skvirsky. I do not think so ; I think there is less. How many
are there altogether on your list?
The Chairman. I have only the Russian members of the Third
International.
Mr. Skvirsky. I understood there were about 10.
The Chairman. On the executive committee. How many are
there in the presidium of the Third International altogether?
Mr. Skvirsky. I could not tell you; maybe two or three of them.
The Chairman. No ; in the presidium of the executive committee ;
how many altogether — the presidium of the Third International?
Mr. Skvirsky. I do not remember the number of the members —
how many there are.
The Chairman. Is there any way of you finding out and letting
us know how many altogether are in the presidium of the Third
International ? Could you find out and let us know ?
Mr. Skvirsky. I have here the members of the executive com-
mittee, about 57; and, out of them 9 are Russians. But I have not
the presidium.
The Chairman. Let me see your list. You say there are nine
Russians ?
Mr. Skvirsky. Yes.
The Chairman. On what — on the executive committee of the Third
International ?
Mr. Skvirsky. Yes ; I have not the presidium.
The Chairman. Well, have you Moltov on your list ?
Mr. Skvirsky. Yes.
The Chairman. Have you Rykov on your list?
Mr. Skvirsky. Yes.
The Charman. Have you Bukharin on your list ?
Mr. Skvirsky. No.
The Chairman. You have not got him?
Mr. Skvirsky. No.
The Chairman. Have you Gusev on your list?
Mr. Skvirsky. No.
The Chairman. Khitarov?
Mr. Skvirsky. Yes.
The Chairman. Lozovsky?
Mr. Skvirsky. Yes.
The Chairman. Manuilsky?
Mr. Skvirsky. Yes.
INVESTIGATION OF COMMUNIST PROPAGANDA 79
The Chairman. Piatnitsky?
Mr. Skvirsky. Yes.
The Chairman. Skrypnik?
Mr. Skvirsky. Yes.
The Chairman. Soltz?
Mr. Skvirsky. No.
The Chairman. A. A. Soltz?
Mr. Skvirsky. No.
The Chairman. Stuchka \
Mr. Skvirsky. No.
The Chairman. Tskhakaya?
Mr. Skvirsky. No.
The Chairman. And Yaroslavsky?
Mr. Skvirsky. I have not Yaroslavsky.
The Chairman. You haven't the number on the presidium I
Mr. Skvirsky. No.
The Chairman. Could you find out the number on the presidium?
Mr. Skvirsky. I would have to look up the papers somewhere.
The Chairman. Have you the papers there (
Mr. Skvirsky. Not here. I don't know.
The Chairman. Have you any idea how big the presidium is of
the Third International \
Mr. Skvirsky. I don't remember. I could just guess, but I don't
remember the exact numbers.
The Chairman. In spite of the fact that Mr. Zinoviev, who is the
head of the Third International, says it is not only the creature of
Lenin, but it was part and parcel of the Communist Party and Third
International, you say it is wrong?
Mr. Skvirsky. Personalh' I think so.
The Chairman. Mr. Lozovsky is on the executive committee of
the Third International — that is correct, is it?
Mr. Skvirsky. Yes; he was according to my list.
The Chairman. Do you know him?
Mr. Skvirsky. No.
The Chairman. Do you know anything about the Pan Pacific
Monthly ?
Mr. Skvirsky. The Pan Pacific Monthly?
The Chairman. Yes.
Mr. Skvirsky. I have heard of such a magazine in the West.
The Chairman. Do you know what that is?
Mr. Skvirsky. No; it is just a commercial magazine, I think, if
this is the one I have in mind.
The Chairman. You stated to the committee it was your desire to
see friendly relations established between your Government and the
American Government?
Mr. Skvirsky. Yes.
The Chairman. And if I should read you a communication here,
purporting to come from Mr. A. Lozovsky, whom you say is on the
executive committee of the Communist International and who is
also, we find out from you — do you know what other positions he
held in the Soviet Union?
Mr. Skvirsky. I do not think he occupies any other position in the
Soviet Union.
80 INVESTIGATION OF COMMUNIST PROPAGANDA
The Chairman. Does he hold a position on the central executive
committee ?
Mr. Skvirsky. No; I do not see him on the list. He does not
occupy any other position. He was mostly, I think, working with
the trade unions.
The Chairman. Yes; he is in the Red International.
Mr. Skvirsky. He may be in the Trade Union International.
The Chairman. Yes ; the Red International of Labor Unions.
Mr. Skvirsky. But he has nothing to do with the Government.
The Chairman. And is he also connected with the All Union
Central Soviet of Labor Unions?
Mr. Skvirsky. Possibly, or the Trade Union Federation.
The Chairman. Yes.
Mr. Skvirsky. Possibly so.
The Chairman. And the Union Central Executive Committee?
Mr. Skvirsky. He may be there a member.
The Chairman. What is the Labor Central Executive Committee?
Mr. Skvirsky. This is a committee of the Soviets ; it is our congress.
The Chairman. That is your congress?
Mr. Skvirsky. Yes.
The Chairman. Would you consider this a friendly act if this
communication is correct, which I read to you, dated May 4, 1930,
addressed to Browder, U. S. A. :
Dear Friend: It is many months now since I received anything" from you
with regard to the Pan Pacific Monthly. Who is on this work in San Fran-
cisco now that Harrison George is on the Daily Worker? We started to pub-
lish this organ in San Francisco in order to have another center for the Pan
Pacific secretariat. I have received information from Shanhai that all attempts
to get in touch with you have failed. What is the matter? If you are so
engaged on other work that you are absolutely unable to deal with the Pan
Pacific Monthly you should let me know. If the party has instructed Harrison
George to carry on other work there should be another comrade put in his
place ; otherwise we will harm the Pan Pacific secretariat.
Besides the question about the position of the Pan Pacific Monthly, I have
another question to deal with. The position in Mexico and Central America at
the present is such that reinforced assistance for our comrades in these
countries is required. Formerly we were able to extend a certain amount of
help from Mexico. Now that the Mexican party and the Unitary Unione of
Mexico have been driven underground it is necessary to organize a bureau
for Central America in New York. It is hardly possible that you would be
able to take this up personally. But would it not be possible for Harrison
George to deal with it, together with his other work? He knows Spanish,
knows those countries, and his participation would be extremely desirable. I
want a telegraphed reply to this question, as we have taken a decision to set
up a bureau for Central America in New York, and we must arrange with
yon who should direct this work.
With comradely greetings,
A. Lozovsky.
Mr. Skvirsky. Such cables could be sent from America to Russia,
as well, and the Soviet Government is not any more responsible for
it than the American Government would be responsible for cables
from America to Russia that they could not control.
The Chairman. They could be sent from where?
Mr. Skvirsky. From America to Russia ; a similar cable could be
sent from American Communists to Russia and the American Gov-
ernment is as much responsible for it as the Soviet Government for
the actions of the communists. If he were a member of the Gov-
INVESTIGATION OF COMMUNIST PROPAGANDA 81
ernment, if lie were over here for the Commissar of Foreign Affairs,
for instance, they you could say —
The Chairman. But you think it is all right for an official of the
Third International to send a telegram like that to an American
communist ?
Mr. Skvirsky. It is not up to me to suggest whether it is right,
or not, I was discussing all the time here this question, and said,
that the Soviet Government has nothing to do with those things. I
say it has nothing to do with those things. If anybody sent a cable
from Russia, or from America, has nothing to do with it. There
are cables, maybe, back and forth; people communicate on all kinds
of matters, congratulate each other on their birthday, and so on.
The Chairman. This is not anything about a birthday; it is
about setting up a bureau of Central America in New York, by the
Communist Party in this country, and purports to come from Lozov-
sky. who is on the executive committee of the Third International,
along with Stalin and Rykov and Molotov and those names you read
in the record. He is on the same board, on the executive committee
of the Third International, with these leading communists, who are
admitted to be by everyone the leaders in Soviet Russia to-day.
Mr. Skvirsky. May I ask you a question?
The Chairman. Yes.
Mr. Skvirsky. Is the American Communist Party legal or illegal
here ( As far as I understand, they are legal.
The Chairman. It still exists.
Mr. Skvirsky. And they have their candidates for President 1
The Chairman. Yes.
Mr. Skvirsky. And for governors?
The Chairman. Yes.
Mr. Skvirsky. Well, I don r t know why this question is directed to
me. You have people who are American citizens; their work is
legal.
The Chairman. You think it is legal for a communist member of
the Third International to send a telegram of that kind to the United
States ?
Mr. Skvirsky. What I want to say is this: If this cable, as you
read to me, has been sent from Moscow, I say the Soviet Government
is not responsible for it. because it can no more control the individual
communists than the American Government can control its own
communists.
The Chairman. Of course. I disagree with you emphatically.
What I started to say was, this is true and comes from Moscow, from
a member of the executive committee of the Third International,
where all of these leading members, active members, are on the
presidium, and do you consider this a friendly act ?
Mr. Skvirsky. I personally can not approach it from such point
of view, friendly or unfriendly. The question was of a cable from a
communist in Moscow, and then you ask me if it is a friendly act
on the part of the Soviet Government. I say the Soviet Government
has nothing to do with it. Otherwise, you want opinions on some-
thing; I am only speaking of the facts.
The Chairman. Oh. no; it is facts.
82 INVESTIGATION OF COMMUNIST PROPAGANDA
Mr. Skvirskt. I can onby speak for the Soviet Government. They
are not responsible for that and therefore we can not speak of it as
a friendly or unfriendly act.
The Chairman. The Third International, as you have admitted,
is a creature of the Communist Party and there is only one party in
Russia today; is not that the fact?
Mr. Skvirskt. Yes. The Communist Party.
The Chairman. And the Communist Party controls the Soviet
Government ; is not that a fact ?
Mr. Skvirskt. As I said, in an indirect way.
The Chairman. The Communist Party controls; is not that the
fact?
Mr. Skvirskt. In an indirect way.
The Chairman. Why indirectly? It controls. Are there any-
body but communists holding high official positions in the Soviet
Government ?
Mr. Skvirskt. There used to be, and maybe so yet; but most of
the important positions, of course, are occupied by communists.
The Chairman. Are there any of the important positions you
know of that are not occupied by Communists?
Mr. Skvirskt. Most of the important positions are occupied by
Communists.
The Chairman. 'Do 3^011 know of any important positions that
are not — any of the commissars?
Mr. Skvirskt. Well, I knew there were such people in the State
bank ; there were experts in the various departments. '
The Chairman. But none of the commissars?
Mr. Skvirskt. None of the commissars.
The Chairman. There were noncommunists in the Third Inter-
national many years ago, but not now ?
Mr. Skvirskt. I think, if my memory serves me right — I think
there are members of the Third International who are nonparty
members — just sympathizers.
The Chairman. Can you name anybody on the executive commit-
tee of the Third International who was not a communist ?
Mr. Skvirskt. I can not name them to you. I told you I am not
an expert on the Third International: I don't know of any.
The Chairman. The only reason I am stressing these questions
with you is — you are appearing before us as a communist, a Russian
communist, and a representative, of course, of the Soviet Govern-
ment, and you are supposed to have more information on this ques-
tion than anybody else who has appeared before the committee. That
is why, when you make the statement to the committee that the Soviet
Government is not responsible for the Third International and inti-
mate it has no connection with the Third International — is that
correct ?
Mr. Skvirskt. That is absolutely correct.
The Chairman. Has no connection with the Third International?
Mr. Skvirskt. The Soviet Government?
The Chairman. Yes.
Mr. Skvirskt. The Soviet Government has no connection. I am
supposed to know about it.
The Chairman. That is why I ask this question of you, but per-
haps have taken unnecessary time on it.
INVESTIGATION" OF COMMUNIST PROPAGANDA 83
Mr. Skvirsky. I am willing to answer any question that will be
helpful to the committee.
The Chairman. You are not able to supply the number in the
presidium of the Third International?
Mr. Skvirsky. No. I don't know.
The Chairman. But you admit all these leaders you have named
are on the executive committee?
Mr. Skvirsky. Yes, sir.
The Chairman. Including Lozovsky?
Mr. Skvirsky. I think so.
The Chairman. And nobody but communists are on the executive
committee of the third international?
Mr. Skvirsky. I think so.
The Chairman. You also state that the communists control the
Soviet Government I
Mr. Skvirsky. Indirectly, the Russian Communist Party.
The Chairman. And also control the Third International. They
control both, don't they?
Mr. Skvirsky. You see
The Chairman. Wait a minute: I am asking you is it not a fact
that the Communist Party controls the Third International and con-
trols the Soviet Government?
Mr. Skvtrsky. What Party ?
The Chairman. Well, the Communist Party of Russia. They all
have the same principles. Take all communist parties, then.
Mr. Skvirsky. Well. I can not talk about all communist parties;
I can talk only about the Communist Party of Russia. As I say, the
Communist Party of Russia is the party which has the confidence
of the people and controls, indirectly, the policies and we had the
revolution, as I stated already and, by working now for the Soviet
State, we are just strengthening the Soviet ideas. As you know,
Russia is occupied with the 5-year plan and there is enough to do
for the Government to be occupied absolutely completely with the
5-year plan. If it works successfully, you know it is all right; if
it is not successful
Mr. Bachmann. Too bad ?
Mr. Skvtrsky. Yes.
The Chairman. We are not taking that question up. I just want
to emphasize the fact you admit that the Communist Party controls
the Soviet Government; that is correct?
Mr. Svtrsky. No.
The Chairman. Oh, it is not correct ?
Mr. Skvirsky. No.
The Chairman. Indirectly?
Mr. Skvirsky. If you say the Russian Communist Party controls
indirectly, yes, because the Russian Government is responsible to the
Central Executive Committee of the Soviets.
The Chairman. It is responsible to the Central Executive Com-
mittee ?
Mr. Skvtrsky. Yes, which is a State organization; not a party
organization.
The Chairman. That is their Congress, you mean?
84 INVESTIGATION OP COMMUNIST PROPAGANDA
Mr. Skvirsky. Yes. There are two-third party members, and
one-third nonparty members, the same as you may have in your
Congress.
The Chairman. Are there anybody but communists in the political
bureau ?
Mr. Skvirsky. The political bureau is an organization of the par-
ties. All party members are party members on there.
The Chairman. I know.
Mr. Skvirsky. It is not a state organization.
The Chairman. But there is nobody but communists on it ?
Mr. Skvirsky. Only communists.
The Chairman. And there is nobody on the executive committee
but communists?
Mr. Skvirsky. Only communists.
The Chairman. And nobody but communists on the Third Inter-
national executive committee?
Mr. Skvirsky. Communists; there are Russian communists and
other communists.
The Chairman. I just want to bring out that the communists, as
you say, indirectly control your Government?
Mr. Skvirsky. The Soviet Communist Party.
The Chairman. And all the communists control the Third Inter-
nationale ; that is correct, is it not ?
Mr. Skvirsky. It is an international organization, sir.
The Chairman. And you do not know anybody in the high official
positions of the Soviet Government who is not a communist, do you?
Mr. Skvirsky. No. But the Soviet Government is not responsible
for the activities in any way of the Third International, and from
this point of view Russia has been recognized by most of the coun-
tries, and that has been accepted by them.
The Chairman. Except for the fact that Stalin, Molotov and
Rykov — does Rykov hold any official position with the Soviet
Government ?
Mr. Skvirsky. Yes.
The Chairman. And he is still on the executive committee of the
Third International ?
Mr. Skvirsky. Yes; but it does not mean anything.
The Chairman. It does not mean anything?
Mr. Skvirsky. No.
The Chairman. Why does it not mean anything?
Mr. Skvirsky. Because, being in the Soviet Government, which
is the national government, he acts with the government, and if he is
in the Third International as a communist and one of the 65 of
various nationalities he may discuss problems of interest to com-
munism in general.
The Chairman. Does Molotov hold any position in the Soviet
Government?
Mr. Skvirsky. No.
The Chairman. But Rykov holds a position. What is his
position ?
Mr. Skvirsky. Rykov?
The Chairman. Yes.
Mr. Skvirsky. He is chairman.
INVESTIGATION OF COMMUNIST PROPAGANDA 85
The Chairman. Chairman of of what?
Mr. Skvirsky. Council of the peoples commissars.
The Chairman. In the Soviet Government?
Mr. Skvirsky. Yes.
The Chairman. And he is on this executive committee?
Mr. Skvirsky. Yes: he was.
The Chairman. That, you say, the Soviet Government has no>
connection with ?
Mr. Skvirsky. Yes; that the Soviet Government has no connec-
tion with.
The Chairman. Yet he is one of the highest officials in the Soviet
Government ?
Mr. Skvirsky. He is just one more person in the Communist In-
ternational, and, as I say. can discuss with them problems of the
communists in general.
The Chairman. Is not he one of the highest members in your
Government ?
Mr. Skvirsky. In Russia it is not a question of highest or not
highest, he is just a member of the Government, and as a member
does not represent the government in the Third International.
The Chairman. What position does he hold in the Government,
again ?
Mr. Skvirsky. I told you — chairman.
The Chairman. He holds the highest position in the Government ?
Mr. Skvirsky. He is chairman. If you want to call that the high-
est, possibly.
The Chairman. Is that the highest ?
Mr. Skvirsky. In Russia, still higher than he is, is the presidium
of the central executive committee, which has the power of both
the executive and legislative, and as you know Mr. Kalinin is presi-
dent of that.
The Chairman. That is still higher than chairman of the Soviet
Government — the presidium ?
Mr. Skvtrsky. He is just like the President, of course; he re-
ceives ambassadors and any documents go to him.
The Chairman. The presidium of the union Central Executive
Committee — that is the one Kalinin is the head of?
Mr. Skvtrsky. Yes.
The Chairman. And is it not a fact Mr. Molotov is a member
of that?
Mr. Skvirsky. Of the Central Executive Committee?
The Chairman. Yes.
Mr. Skvirsky. I think he is. If you have the list of the Council
of the Peoples Commissars of the Government, there is nobody
except Rykov
The Chairman. I asked you about Molotov.
Mr. Skvtrsky. Whether he is in the Central Executive Committee?
The Chairman. Exactly.
Mr. Skvirsky. I do not see him in the Central Executive Com-
mittee presidium, but I think — oh. yes, Molotov is here ; he is a mem-
ber of the presidium.
The Chairman. You just told me, when I asked you a little while
ago, when I said Molotov was on the executive committee of the
86 INVESTIGATION OF COMMUNIST PROPAGANDA
Communist International, that he did not hold any office in the
Soviet Government.
Mr. Skvirsky. Yes; as I say, we understand by "Government"
the Council of the Peoples Commissars.
The Chairman. You mean the Council of Peoples Commissars of
half a dozen people?
Mr. Skvirsky. Yes.
The Chairman. Now I ask yon in the Government, and you tell
me the presidium is higher than any organization.
Mr. Skvirsky. You asked me about Molotov.
The Chairman. No; I asked you if he held any position in the
Government, and you said no; and then I asked you if the presidium
is higher than these commissars.
Mr. Skvirsky. When you speak about the Government we always
understand by it the Council of the Peoples Commissars.
The Chairman. How many commissars are there?
Mr. Skvirsky. Well, there are 11 — 10, and the chairman, mak-
ing 11.
The Chairman. That constitutes the Government, 11?
Mr. Skvirsky. That constitutes the Government.
The Chairman. And of those 11 people Bykov is one?
Mr. Skvirsky. Yes.
The Chairman. And he is on the executive committee of the
Communist International ; but you say that the presidium you refer
to here, of the central committee, is higher than the commissars,
above the commissars? •
Mr. Skvirsky. Yes ; the decrees of the Government
The Chairman. They are part of the Soviet Government, are they
not?
Mr. Skvirsky. The decree of the Government, or council of the
Peoples Commissars, usually are ratified by the Central Executive
•Committee.
The Chairman. But you made the statement yourself they were
higher.
Mr. Skvirsky. In this respect they are higher, because they have
to be ratified.
The Chairman. So Molotov is a member of the Soviet Govern-
ment, is he not ?
Mr. Skvirsky. If you consider — you see, it is a legislative and
executive body, so that I can not call it the government. I would
call it this way, that he is on the legislative and executive body of the
Soviets.
The Chairman. And you still want us to believe that the Soviet
Government has no responsibility for the Third International ?
Mr. Skvirsky. Yes; absolutely.
Mr. Bachmann. I want to clear up a little bit, Mr. Skvirsky, about
Mr. Stalin's authority over there: He is secretary general of the
Communist Party ?
Mr. Skvirsky. Yes.
Mr. Bachmann. And a member of the central committee of the
[Russian Communist Party ?
Mr. Skvirsky. Yes.
INVESTIGATION OF COMMUNIST PROPAGANDA 87
Mr. Bachmann. He is also elected as a member of the Central
Executive Committee of the Soviets?
Mr. Skvirsky. Yes.
Mr. Bachmann. And he is also a member of the central committee
of the Communist International ?
Mr. Skvirsky. So I understand ; yes. He is not a member of the
Government.
Mr. Bachmann. I did not say he is a member of the Government ;
I asked you if those three things I have said are true?
Mr. Skvirsky. Yes.
Mr. Bach -mann. He is only connected with the Government by
being a member of the Central Executive Committee, which is the
committee that runs the Government ?
Mr. Skvirsky. Yes: that is right.
Mr. Bachmann. What are his duties as a member of the executive
committee ?
Mr. Skvirsky. Of the Soviets I
Mr. Bachmann. Yes.
Mr. Skvirsky. The same as the duties of a Congressman or Senator
here.
Mr. Bachmann. The same as any other member of that com-
mittee ?
Mr. Skvirsky. Yes.
Mr. Bachmann. Does he have any more authority than any other
member of the executive committee ?
Mr. Skvirsky. No; everything is decided by majority vote.
Mr. Bachmann. Does he have any more power than any other
member of that committee ?
Mr. Skvirsky. No.
Mr. Bachmann. Why is he referred to, generally, as the dictator
of the Soviet Government ?
Mr. Skvirsky. Well, we have no dictators in Russia at all. There
are many things that people refer to. He is a member of the central
executive committee.
Mr. Bachmann. He releases all information pertaining to the
Government ?
Mr. Skvirsky. Well, you may say that he is considered the leader
of the Communist Party.
Mr. Bachmann. He is the big man in the Soviet Government, is
he not? Is not he the one 3^011 would look to as the head of the
Soviet Government ?
Mr. Skvirsky. No.
Mr. Bachmann. Is he not recognized as the head of the Soviet
Government ?
Mr. Skvirsky. No.
Mr. Bachmann. He is recognized, however, as the head of the
Communist Party?
Mr. Skvirsky. He is recognized as the authoritative spokesman of
the party.
Mr. Bachmann. And as that spokesman he lays down the policy
of the Soviet Government?
Mr. Skvirsky. Nobody lays down the policy of the government.
Whenever, as I said, there is a congress of the party the whole
88 INVESTIGATION OF COMMUNIST PROPAGANDA
policy of the country, that is, as they would like to have it, as the
communists would like to have it, is being discussed.
Mr. Bachmann. Is not this the situation, that your Russian Com-
munist Party is controlled by your central committee?
Mr. Skvirsky. You see, the congress is above the central com-
mittee.
Mr. Bachmann. I understand that, but the congress only meets
every two years.
Mr. Skvirsky. Yes.
Mr. Bachmann. Then, your central committee carries on the
policies ?
Mr. Skvirsky. Yes.
Mr. Bachmann. They are recognized as the permanent head of
the Russian Communist Party?
Mr. Skvirsky. Yes.
Mr. Bachmann. Now, the same members who are members of the
central committee of the Russian Communist Party, or two-thirds
of them, are also members of the Central Executive Committee of the
Soviets ?
Mr. Skvirsky. No, no.
Mr. Bachmann. I understood you to say that a while ago, and
I want to know whether that is what you meant.
Mr. Skvirsky. No. The two-thirds which I refer to is the Central
Executive Committee of the Soviets ; not of the party.
Mr. Bachmann. But I say two-thirds of the members of the Cen-
tra) Executive Committee of the Soviets are also
Mr. Skvirsky. Communists.
Mr. Bachmann. Members of the party?
Mr. Skvirsky. Yes.
Mr. Bachmann. And Stalin, then. I conclude from what you sa} 7 ,
is only spokesman for the Communist Party?
Mr. Skvirsky. Yes. Maybe you saw lately in the interview pub-
lished in the press where he joked himself about being called 'dic-
tator." The only dictator in Russia is the working class of Russia.
Mr. Bachmann. Does Stalin occupy the same position Lenin had
when he was alive?
Mr. Skvirsky. Well, about the same position; yes.
Mr. Bachmann. Was not Lenin recognized as head of the Soviet
Government ?
Mr. Skvirsky. Because, you see. Lenin held the position occupied
bj 7 Rykov as head of the government. Lenin occupied both. Mr.
Stalin does not occupy that as head ; but, as far as spokesman of the
party, he occupies the same position as Lenin.
Mr. Bachmann. Now, I understood you to say you were director
of the Soviet Union Information Bureau?
Mr.. Skvirsky. Of the Soviet Union Information Bureau ; yes.
Mr. Bachmann. Here in Washington?
Mr. Skvirsky. Yes.
Mr. Bachmann. And you are maintained here by the Soviet
Government ?
Mr. Skvirsky. Yes.
Mr. Bachmann. Why do you use the name "director"; what is
the purpose of the name " director " of the Soviet Union Information
Bureali ?
INVESTIGATION OF COMMUNIST PROPAGANDA 89
Mr. Skvirsky. You see, I have no status in this country, on ac-
count of the absence of diplomatic relations; so I have established
this bureau, just established this bureau, and I am the director of
the bureau.
Mr. Bachmann. But, as the director of that bureau, you perform,
to all intents and purposes, just the same as the representative of a
foreign government who is officially recognized?
Mr. Skvirsky. Well, there are too many duties to be carried out
by an official representative, which I do not carry out, because, since
I am not recognized, all I can do is just to supply information to
Government departments on business matters.
Mr. Bachmann. Of course, with those limitations, you carry on
the best you can ?
Mr. Skvirskt. They are very large limitations. As I say
Mr. Bachmann. Well, you take up with the State Department
and the Department of Immigration and other governmental depart-
ments questions concerning your citizens, or your Government, do
vou not?
Mr. Skvirsky. Well, you see, since we have to carry on trade here
and there are very often some questions to come up that are im-
portant, they have to be cleared up ; otherwise, it would be impos-
sible to carry on trade. I take up those questions.
Mr. Bachmann. But you are the official agency in this country
through which the Soviet Government speaks to the departments
of this Government ?
Mr. Skvirsky. An unofficial agent.
Mr. Bachmann. But you are the official agency of the Soviet
Government, but not officially recognized here?
Mr. Skvirsky. Yes.
Mr. Bachmann. And you are entertained at those departments on
matters coining before them relating to the interests of the Soviet
Government ?
Mr. Skvirsky. Yes. As I stated before, in my statement, when
this question came up about the American aviators lost in the north,
the Secretary of the Interior referred it to me, of course in an in-
formal way, and asked that I convey that to the Soviet Government,
which I did.
Mr. Bachmann. And the Soviet Government follows through
your recommendations in matters of that kind \
Mr. Skvirsky. Yes; whenever they consider it necessary, they do
it. They have done it on many occasions.
Mr. Bachmann. You also work with the Amtorg, the Russian
Trading Corporation?
Mr. Skvirsky. Yes ; I see them.
Mr. Bachmann. You work in conjunction with them?
Mr. Skvirsky. Yes.
Mr. Bachmann. And you assist the Amtorg whenever you con-
sider it is necessary to have visas granted to certain Russian
citizens ?
Mr. Skvirsky. No; the visas are taken up by the lawyers: the
firm of Simpson, Thatcher & Bartlett is looking after visa matter?.
They are working with Amtorg.
Mr. Bachmann. That is a New York firm of lawyers ?
Mr. Skvirsky. A New York firm of lawyers ?
90 INVESTIGATION OF COMMUNIST PROPAGANDA
Mr. Bachmann. And the Mr. Thacher of that firm is now Solic-
itor General of the United States?
Mr. Skvirsky. Yes; he is the same man.
Mr. Bachmann. It is his firm that represents the Anitorg?
Mr. Skvirsky. Yes.
Mr. Bachmann. And does his firm represent you?
Mr. Skvirsky. Simpson, Thacher & Bartlett?
Mr. Bachmann. Yes.
Mr. Skvirsky. No; this man represents me, Mr. Marshall here.
Mr. Marshall. Covington, Burling & Rublee.
Mr. Bachmann. You have nothing to do with asking for visas or
extensions of visas for citizens of the Soviet Government who are in
this country on business?
Mr. Skvirsky. No; it all goes through this same firm. They take
up this matter with the Department of Labor and ask the extension.
Mr. Bachmann. Those men who come here to this country are
sent by the Soviet Government?
Mr. Skvirsky. Well, they are sent mostly by the various organi-
zations. We have various trusts and syndicates to carry on business.
Mr. Bachmann. The Soviet Government?
Mr. Skvirsky. The Soviet Government, of course, owns them.
Mr. Bachmann. In other words, the Soviet Government is back
of those men who come to this country for business purposes ?
Mr. Skvirsky. Yes; but I wish to say here, in that connection,
in not a single case, although many people have come here, has any
complaint been made on the part of an American officiar-that any
Soviet citizen abused these hospitalities.
Mr. Bachmann. You mean while in this country on a visa ?
Mr. Skvirsky. Yes.
Mr. Bachmann. Have they all gone back?
Mr. Skvirsky. Yes ; mostly when they have finished their business
they have gone back. I was inquiring myself of the State Depart-
ment whether they knew personally of any complaint, and they
said no.
Mr. Bachmann. Some of them have been here for four of five
years ?
Mr. Skvirsky. Yes; some have been here for four or five years;
but, usually, they come over here for six months and, if they finish
the work — you see, it is difficult for Amtorg to get people, and some-
times they ask people who are familiar with the work to stay, and
if those people do get extensions, they stay for a year or two. or
maybe three. Otherwise, you can not carry on trade relations. You
see, you have to know the conditions at both ends, especially the con-
ditions there. They get orders from Russia ; so that they have to
have people here who know Russia.
Mr. Nelson. It has been suggested heretofore and I think has been
suggested here to-day that Stalin holds no office in the Soviet Gov-
ernment. That is not correct, is it?
Mr. Skvirsky. That is correct. He holds no office in the Soviet
Government.
Mr. Nelson. You say he does not ?
Mr. Skvirsky. Does not.
Mr. Nelson. Well, the Congress of Soviets is a part of the Soviet
Government ?
INVESTIGATION OF COMMUNIST PROPAGANDA 91'
Mr. Skvirsky. As much as the American Congress, if you want
to take it this way, or a little bit more, because it has not only the
legislative but also has executive power.
Mr. Nelson. Well it is a fundamental part of the Government, is
it not?
Mr. Skvirsky. Yes; if yon take it in the large sense.
Mr. Nelson. Is there anj 7 question about it? I am asking for
information.
Mr. Skvirsky. Yes.
Mr. Nelson. Is not the Congress of Soviets the very foundation
of your Soviet Government ; is it not the source of all power and
authority ?
Mr. Skvirsky. Well, the source is the Congress of Soviets.
Mr. Nelson. That is what I am talking about.
Mr. Skvirsky. You are talking about the central executive com-
mittee, now.
Mr. Nelson. Let us let the other things go and talk about this, or
I can never get this straightened out. The Congress of Soviets is
a fundamental part of the Soviet Government, is it not ?
Mr. Skvirsky. Yes; the supreme part of the Government in
Russia.
Mr. Nelson. And is a fundamental part of your Government ?
Mr. Skvirsky. The Supreme Soviet authority. They decide every-
thing.
Mr. Nelson. The Congress is a fundamental part of the Soviet
Government. Now an essential part of the Congress of Soviets and
a creature of the Congress of Soviets is the Central Executive Com-
mittee, or the Central Committee, is it not?
Mr. Skvirsky. The Central Executive Committee of the Soviets?
Mr. Nelson. Yes; and that is a fundamental part of the Soviet
Government, is it not?
Mr. Skvirsky. Yes.
Mr. Nelson. And one of the instrumentalities through which it
functions, is it not?
Mr. Skvtrsky. Yes.
Mr. Nelson. And Stalin is a member of that committee, is he
not?
Mr. Skvirsky. Just a member ; as there are several hundred mem-
bers, he is a member.
Mr. Nelson. Well, let us not get interested in the other several
hundred. Stalin is a member of that committee ?
Mr. Skvirsky. Yes; he is.
Mr. Nelson. Therefore, Stalin is a member of a very essential part
of the Soviet Government, is he not ?
Mr. Skvirsky. If you take the Government, in the large sense, if
you take the Government as you take it in the United States, which
means the Cabinet, he is not.
Mr. Nelson. Oh, well, I did not ask you whether he is in the
cabinet of the Soviet Government. But he does not a very essential
office in the Soviet Government ; does he not ?
Mr. Skvirsky. He is just a member of the central executive
committee.
Mr. Nelson. And that is an essential part of the Soviet Govern-
ment?
92 INVESTIGATION OF COMMUNIST PROPAGANDA
Mr. Skvirsky. Well, it is an essential part of the Soviet Govern-
ment ; yes.
Mr. Nelson. Is it, or isn't it ?
Mr. Skvirsky. It is.
Mr. Nelson. Then, this central committee, or the Congress of the
Soviets through its central committee, selects what you now term
the Government, or the cabinet?
Mr. Skvirsky. Right.
Mr. Nelson. And that is called the People's Commissars?
Mr. Skvirsky. Yes.
Mr. Nelson. And when you say Stalin is not a member of the
Government, you simply mean that he is not a member of the
People's Commissars, or the equivalent of our Cabinet?
Mr. Skvirsky. Yes.
Mr. Nelson. He is not at the head of any particular department?
Mr. Skvirsky. No.
Mr. Nelson. Now, this may not be important, Mr. Skvirsky, but
I asked you if Lenin and others had not suggested it was the Polit-
bureau that had the final say in these matters over the Soviet Gov-
ernment. Here is a quotation from the speech of Lenin, made in
March, 1922 :
* * * There has grown up among us an incorrect relation between the
party and Soviet institutions, and in this regard there is complete unanimity
of opinion. I pointed out one example of how specific small matters drag along
already in the political bureau. Formally, a solution of this problem is very
difficult, because the only legal party among us controls the Government, and it
is impossible to forbid a member of the party to complain. Therefore every-
thing is dragged along from the Soviet People's Commissars to the political
bureau.
Then Trotsky suggests this, speaking of some matter of impor-
tance, I think executing a treaty, or something of that kind :
* . * * We have the Council of the People's Commissars, but that council
must be under a certain control. That control can not be exercised by the
unorganized working masses. We therefore have to summon the central com-
mittee of the party and have it formulate an answer to this proposition.
Would not this at least indicate that possibly the political bureau
had quite a complete control over the Soviet Government ?
Mr. Skvirsky. No ; I would not say so.
The Chairman. Now, I would like to get back to this question.
1 have listened to a great many arguments as to this particular ques-
tion we are dealing with of the relation of the Soviet Government to
the Communist Party, or the Communist Party to the Soviet Gov-
ernment, and you have stated here, and others have stated before,
that Stalin was not a member of the Soviet Government. It is very
obvious he is a very important member of the Soviet Government,
according to your testimony. He is a member of the executive com-
mittee of the Congress ; is not that correct ?
Mr. Skvirsky. Yes; the Central Executive Committee.
The Chairman. Of the Congress?
Mr. Skvirsky. Of the Soviets.
The Chairman. And when the Congress is not in session — it is
only in session once every two years — the executive committee is the
legislative body
Mr. Skvirsky. Everv three or four months.
IN VESTIGATK ) N OF C< IMJIU X 1ST PROPAGANDA 93
The Chairman (continuing')- -^ im i* functions for congress dur-
ing all that time — this executive committee.
Mr. Skvirsky. Yes.
The Chairman. And Stalin, then, is a very important member of
your Government, because he is a member of your executive com-
mittee?
Mr. Skvirsky. He is one of 550 people.
The Chairman. Not of the congress, but of the executive com-
mittee.
Mr. Skvirsky. I am talking about the executive committee. It
has 535 members, and he is one of 535 members.
The Chairman. Not on the union Central Executive Committee,
there are not?
Mr. Skvirsky. Yes. I can give you the members.
The Chairman. On the union Central Executive Committee?
Mr. Skvirsky. Of the soviet-?
The Chairman. Yes.
Mr. Skvirsky. Yes: there are over 400 that are members of the
council of the union, and there are over 100 in the council of nation-
alities, and Stalin is one of the members.
The Chairman. He is one of the members of the union Central
Executive Committee ?
Mr. Skvirsky. Which is composed of 535 people, or 540.
The Chairman. We won't argue about the numbers, as long as
we can establish that your statement is incorrect, by your own testi-
timony.
Mr. Nelson. Now, I do not think that is quite fair, because he told
me Stalin represents a constituency in Moscow.
The Chairman. I do not think it is intentional but you did say
that he did not hold any government position?
Mr. Skvirsky. Yes; in the cabinet.
The Chairman. You just admitted he was not a cabinet official,
and now you admit he does hold, right now. a position in the legis-
lative branch of the government.
Mr. Skvirsky. I mean, when I refer to government, as I under-
stand, that is what you call cabinet, and he is not there — that is,
they have this Central Executive Committee and have the cabinet.
The Chairman. When we speak of the Government in this coun-
try we do not mean the Cabinet at all ; in fact, the Cabinet does not
exist as far as we are concerned, under the Constitution. When we
speak of the Government we speak of the executive, legislative, and
judicial branches.
Mr. Skvirsky. Yes: but in Europe and parliamentary countries
that I have in mind they have a parliament and cabinet.
The Chairman. You are talking about 10 men?
Mr. Skvirsky. Yes.
The Chairman. As a matter of fact, then, Stalin does hold an
official position in the legislative branch of your government?
Mr. Skvirsky. We can draw the parallel a little further, like in
Europe, if the cabinet is not agreeable to the parliament they may
have to resign, and if the Central Executive Committee would not like
the way they carried out the policies they would just pass a resolu-
tion and they would have to change.
1 19651— 31— pt 1, vol 5 7
94 INVESTIGATION OF COMMUNIST PROPAGANDA
The Chairman. That just shows how powerful the Central Execu-
tive Committee is.
Mr. Skvirsky. It is like the parliament.
The Chairman. This executive committee could throw out the
government to-morrow, throw out the commissars; they could just
take the council of commissars and throw it out?
Mr. Skvirsky. The same as parliament.
The Chairman. Exactly. Then Stalin is in the legislative branch,
and he has an official position on the executive committee that makes
the commissars and can, as you say. throw it out if he wants to; is
not that the fact? •
Mr. Skvirsky. Together with 535 ; otherwise, he can not do it.
The Chairman. I do not care whether there are 5,000,000, he still
holds this legislative job and is this same man you told me a little
while ago was on the Central Executive Committee, and the executive
committee of the Third International — you told me that he held no
office in the Soviet Government; yet practically all of them are on
this executive committee of the congress, and that is your legislative
branch; is not that true?
Mr. Skvirsky. Many of them are members of the Central Execu-
tive Committee.
The Chairman. That is just what I was trying to bring out.
Mr. Skvirsky. Two-thirds are communists.
The Chairman. You told me most of those men whose names you
read did not hold any position in the government. You meant they
were not commissars, but hold very important positions in the
legislative branch of the government ?
Mr. Skvirsky. But, you see, the government deals only with the
council of commissars.
The Chairman. I know that, but these people make that; Stalin
and these people make the commissars.
Mr. Skvirsky. Yes.
The Chairman. And, in that respect, they are a part of the
government, because they are a part of the executive committee of
the government ; is not that the fact ?
Mr. Skvirsky. The executive authority rests with the council of
peoples commissars. They are responsible to the central executive
committee. They are elected by that.
The Chairman. They are elected by that?
Mr. Skvihskt. Yes.
The Chairman. And Stalin and those men on the Third Inter-
national are members of the Central Executive Committee?
Mr. Skvirsky. Members of the Central Executive Committee of
the Soviets.
The Chairman. Therefore, being in the executive committee of the
congress of Soviets and the congress making the commissars, they
are also on the Third International executive committee and that is
what has been pointed out here a long time ago, by Mr. Nelson, on
the relation between the Soviet Government officials and the Third
International.
Mr. Skvirsky. I said there is no relationship.
The Chairman. That is exactly what was brought out by him.
There is no difference of opinion.
INVESTIGATION OF COMMUNIST PROPAGANDA 95
Mr Skvirsky. I proved to you, and I will make my statement
again there is no relationship at all, The Soviet Government is
not the Third International and is not responsible in any way for
the Third International.
The Chairman. But these people who are on there are members
of the legislative branch of the Soviet Government, who make what
you call the government, the council of peoples commissars, and
they are on the executive committee of the Third International, all
of them.
Mr. Skvirsky. Yes; but yon take one member, two members, or
three members, and I say that Stalin is just one of 535 members ot
the executive committee.
The Chairman. But he is the important member.
Mr. Skvirskt. All members are alike.
The Chairman. Mr. Stalin has not any more powers than the
other 500?
Mr. Skmrsky. Mr. Stalin is spokesman of the party, and when
the party has to make certain decisions, Mr. Stalin's opinion; of
course, carries more weight than the others.
Mr. Bachmann. In addition to that, he is secretary?
Mr. Skvirsky. Yes.
Mr. Bachmann. And is recognized as the head of the party?
Mr. Skvirsky. Yes.
The Chairman. Are you a member of the Third International?
Mr. Skvirsky. No; I never occupied any position.
The Chairman. Are you a member of it — not an official in it?
Mr. Skvirsky. No.
The Chairman. Are you a member of it?
Mr. Skvirsky. No.
The Chairman. Have you any connection with-it?
Mr. Skvirsky. No. The only connection I have is with the Soviet
Government.
The Chairman. How many Kussian subjects are there in this
country at the present time?
Mr. Skvirsky. You mean soviet citizens; because you have a law
under which you admitted several thousand czarist emigres
Mr. Bachmann. I did not catch the last answer.
Mr. Skvirsky. I say the United States has admitted several thou-
sand of those Kussian czarist emigres, those who were fighting in
Russia and were driven out, and you permitted them to enter into
this country. They are not considered by us, of course, as Russian
citizens. Of soviet citizens we have very few here; maybe several
hundred of them ; maybe more.
Mr. Bachmann. Did you say the Government of the United States
only admits, in the quota, Russian subjects who are not citizens of
the Soviet Union?
Mr. Skvirsky. You see, it is called Russian quota, but from Rus-
sia there is very little immigration ; maybe a few people ; maybe 50 or
100 ; I don't know how many — less than that from Russia that come
here as immigrants. The most of them come from Europe, from
the Far East, from Turkey, and those European countries, who were
in the white army, the Czar's army, and they come over here as
Russians.
9G INVESTIGATION OF COMMUNIST PROPAGANDA
Mr. Bachmann. In other words, the great majority of those who
come to this country in the quota are Russians who were formerly
citizens under the Czar's regime?
Mr. Skvirsky. Yes.
Mr. Bachmann. And who fled from Russia and are now being
admitted into this country under the quota?
Mr. Skvirsky. Yes.
Mr. Bachmann. And there are very few soviet citizens?
Mr. Skvirsky. Very few.
Mr. Bachmann. What is the reason for there only being a few
soviet citizens?
Mr. Skvirsky. First of all, emigration is not encouraged in Russia
because in connection with the 5-year plan, as I explained before,
we have no unemployment in Russia and need every man and do not
encourage emigration.
Mr. Bachmann. In other words, as far as citizens of the Soviet
Government are concerned, then, there is no desire for them to emi-
grate to this country?
Mr. Skvirsky. No opportunity. But. of course, you know how
the Soviet Union would feel if soviet citizens would not be permitted
to go to every country, in principle. We like to have every count rv
open to us; but, in fact, very few go from Russia except on business
and stay a few months and then go back. I have been here so many
years and I only know a very few who have emigrated from Russia.
and most of the cases are where you have an American citizen, and
his wife is in Russia, and he wants his wife to come over here.
Mr. Bachmann. Now, about 27,000 Russian subjects came in in
the last five y ears?
Mr. Skvirsky. Mostly Russian whites.
Mr. Bachmann. Do you know what proportion of them are Soviet
citizens ?
Mr. Skvirsky. Yes; part of them are Soviet citizens; but, as I say,
I would be surprised if you have a thousand here. The most of them
are those Russian monarchists who are carrying on the antisoviet
propaganda in this country. They are one of the reasons why I say
so little is known about the real Russia.
Mr. Bachmann. And about 7,000 of that 27,000 came in here for
temporary business purposes. What percentage of those were soviet
citizens?
Mr. Skvirsky. For business purposes, they are mostly those who
are citizens of the Soviet Union. You say 7,000?
Mr. Bachmann. In the last five years.
Mr. Skvirsky. I would not think so, because I saw the list of the
State Department. I do not think so. Maybe there are about a
thousand or fifteen hundred.
Mr. Bachmann. That may be of those you know about, who have
been sent over by the Soviet Government, but I am talking about all.
I am talking about students and all.
Mr. Skvirsky. They admit students to come. I heard of a case
lately, a few days ago. where we have a contract with Ford to build
an automobile factory in Russia, and. according to the contract.
Ford has to teach the Russian workers to do the work, and we had
35 people waiting for six weeks in London who could not get visa-.
[INVESTIGATION OF COMMUNIST PROPAGANDA 97
People like that come over. They work for six months and then go
back and go home. But those people who remain as immigrants,
they are very, very few: as I said, some people who want to bring
their wives over here, but most of them, the biggest part, are czarist
emigres.
Mr. Bachmann. The Soviet Government does not recognize those
at all?
Mr. Skvirsky. No.
Mr. Bachmann. All you deal with are those who are recognized
as Soviet citizens?
Mr. Sk-irsky. Yes: those with soviet passports.
Mr. Bachmann. When you get one <»f what do you call white
Russians, do thev have to get a soviet passport to come into the
United States?
Mr. Skvirsky. Under the quota of Russia, with passports they
come as citizens. You see, the position is this: Suppose to-morrow
there should be established relations between the two countries, and
an ambassador would come here, and then the former czarist emigre,
who wants to become a citizen, would apply for passports, and sup-
pose the proper investigation be made and finally they go before the
department then to get a soviet passport for one of the soviet citizens.
when he is not: he is just a citizen. But. in America, you think
mostly of what they call the white Russians. They are not soviet
citizens; they are just czarist emigre. Those are just the type of peo-
ple who are forging these documents about Russia and involving us.
Mr. Bachmann. They are not the type who are joining the Com-
munist Party of America and carrying on the propaganda here, are
they ?
Mr. Skvirsky. I could not say about that; I don't know whether
they join it.
Mr. Bachmann. How is that?
Mr. Skvirsky. I could not say who joins and who does not join.
Mr. Bachmann. I say that is not the same type that is affiliating
with the Communist Party of America and spreading the communist
propaganda '.
Mr. Skvirsky. A monarchist is the one who carries on the propa-
ganda against the Soviet Government.
Mr. Bachmann. So the fact remains those soviet citizens in the
United States or those Russians who are in the United States, carry-
ing on this communist propaganda, are soviet citizens?
Mr. Skvirsky. Not a single one.
Mr. Bachmann. You would not think those who fled from Russia,
because of the soviet regime over there, would come over to the
United States and carry on that same thing that the Russian Com-
munist Party is carrying on in Russia, would j^ou?
Mr. Skvirsky. They are human beings. I don't know what is
going to happen to people after they work here for some time.
Mr. Bachmann. You could not reasonably expect that could be the
situation, could you?
Mr. Skvirsky. I don't know. It may happen to anybody; every-
body may come over here and become citizens. I don't know what
may happen to their ideas later.
98 INVESTIGATION OF COMMUNIST PROPAGANDA
Mr. Bachmann. Do I understand you to saj, correctly, there are
no soviet citizens connected with the Communist Party in America?
Mr. Skvirsky. No soviet citizens?
Mr. Bachmann. Yes; you did not mean that?
Mr. Skvirsky. I know that if soviet citizens, who are members of
the party, they are members of the Russian Communist Party, and
you have people, I suppose American citizens, who are members of
the American Communist Party.
Mr. Bachmann. You mean that happens to apply to members of
the American Communist Party?
Mr. Skvirsky. What anybody may call them individually, there
are such people here ; most of the Russians you admit are the czarist
emigres.
Mr. Bachmann. You do know a number of Russians who are
affiliated with the American Communist Party, do you not?
Mr. Skvirsky. I don't know of any Russians affiliated with the
American Communist Party are soviet citizens: I don't know about
that. I don't know that at all; I never met anyone. But, theoreti-
cally, whether these may be such, I will say there are not soviet
citizens.
Mr. Bachmann. You would not think they would be other than
soviet citizens, would you. who, if they stayed over there in Russia
and had the same beliefs, would be affiliated with the Russian Com-
munist Party?
Mr. Skvirsky. The Russian people?
Mr. Bachmann. Yes.
Mr. Skvirsky. The Russian, if he is a communist, is a member of
the Russian Communist Party. You know, when it comes to com-
munism, always Russia is blamed; but you know communism, the
ideas of communism, came from Germany to Russia. The First
International was in the United States.
Mr. Bachmann. But the practical demonstration is in Russia.
Mr. Skvirsky. The First International was in the United States,
and the head of the First International was Karl Marx, who was in
direct communication with the American President and sent and
received cables.
Mr. Bachmann. Let me ask you this: You are familiar with the
affairs of the Soviet Government and generally familiar with the
conditions in the United States and understand this country now, or
at least you ought to, considering the period of time you have been
here and the position you have been in, and you are here, as you say.
endeavoring to establish a more friendly relationship between the
American Government and the Soviet Government, and for the
Soviet Government to be officially recognized. That is your ultimate
aim. is it not — you would like to see the Government of Russia
officially recognized?
Mr. Skvirsky. I would like to see the establishment of friendly
relations; yes. I would like
Mr. Bachmann. That is your ultimate aim, is it not ?
Mr. Skvirsky. My aim is just to assist Americans to obtain the
real facts about the Soviet Government.
Mr. Bachmann. To establish a more friendly relationship?
Mr. Skvirsky. Yes.
INVESTIGATION OF COMMUNIST PROPAGANDA 99
Mr. Bachmann. And the purpose of establishing a more friendly
relationship is so that it will be officially recognized ?
Mr. Skvibsky. Yes; to contribute to a better understanding.
Mr. Bachmann. Do not you think you would reach your goal
much more quickly, at least, if you would make some effort to stop
the communist propaganda that is being spread in this country?
Mr. SkvipvSky. As you raise this question, I will tell you this, that
the Soviet Government is in no way responsible for that. Of course,
if you persist in accusing the Soviet Government for that
Mr. Bachmann. I understand your statement is that the Soviet
Government is in no way responsible for it, but the Communist
Party of Russia is responsible for the Soviet Government, and the
Soviet Government is under the domination of the Communist
Party.
Mr. Skvirsky. I did not say the Communist Party is responsible
for the Soviet Government. What I said is that the Soviet Govern-
ment, the responsible government, does not consider itself respon-
sible for the Third International, and in every treaty we have with
every nation there is a clause that both governments undertake, on
the basis of reciprocity, not to interfere with the internal affairs of
each country. And, as I explained before, there was a case where
American troops, together with the troops of other foreign govern-
ments, tried to overthrow the Soviet Government. This was a direct
interference. So, having this experience once, we insist that no
government in the future shall interfere with the Soviet Govern-
ment, and the Soviet Government never interferes in the internal
affairs of another country.
Mr. Bachmann. But you are in this situation : The Communist
Party of Russia, which is a member of the Communist International,
is trying and endeavoring to work along to revolutionize the world ;
that is a fact, is it not?
Mr. Skvirsky. Yes.
Mr. Bachmann. And the Soviet Government is the creature, is
the child, of the Communist Party of Russia and, at the same time
you are trying to establish friendly relations, you are trying to
revolutionize and overthrow the Government of the United States
and establish your communistic ideal and, at the same time, in the
same breath, you want the Government of the United States to rec-
ognize the child of the Communist Party of Russia — the Soviet
Government ?
Mr. Skvirsky. Well, if the United States would recognize the
Soviet Government it would be no more than other States did ;
because the Soviet Government, as I explained, is not engaged in
this thing. We all have very strict instructions, every one of us,
before we leave our country, under no circumstances to interfere
with the affairs of the country where we go. That is why I said
before there was not a single case
Mr. Bachmann. I do not doubt that: I am not criticizing you or
finding fault with what your instructions are. I do not doubt that
is true; but the fact remains, nevertheless, that what I said to you is
the fact.
Mr. Skvirsky. It is a fact, as I stated before, that the Soviet Gov-
ernment and its representatives have never abused, never interfered
in any internal affairs of any country.
100 INVESTIGATION OF COMMUNIST PROPAGANDA
The Chairman. What you keep repeating here is that those 11
commissars do not interfere — those 11 commissars in Russia do not
interfere with the inner workings of any foreign government, with
the domestic concerns of any foreign government — but anybody else
outside of those 11 commissars, the 1,500.000 communists, no matter
what position they hold, whether they hold a position in the legisla-
tive body or anywhere else, they can do what they want '.
Mr. Skvirsky. No; what I stated was this, that the Soviet Gov-
ernment, or the central executive committee, or the congress of
soviets — those are the state organizations — never interfere in the
affairs of any foreign country.
The Chairman. You just admitted here that in these state organi-
zations, which 3^011 keep referring to, are Stalin, liykov. Molotov, and
half a dozen others, who are on the executive committee of the Third
International, which is the organization that promotes world revo-
lution — that they are part of your government there, and yet they
are on the executive committee of the very thing that promotes world
revolution.
Mr. Skvirsky. What I stated is that Stalin is a member of the 550
members of the central executive committee.
The Chairman. Which is the legislative branch of your govern-
ment, and they are on this executive committee of the Third Inter-
national.
Mr. Skvirsky. Which is purely a separate affair and has nothing
to do with our state institutions.
The Chairman. Well, you just made the statement a minute ago
that nobody on what you call the union central executive committee,
which is your legislature, had anything to do with spreading revolt in
other countries.
Mr. Skvirsky. I did not speak about an individual member; what
I said concerned our institutions, like the people's council of com-
missars and the central executive committee and the Soviets. If you
say a member or two members, I say you are talking about individual
members.
The Chairman. I say practically all of the Russian members who
are on the executive committee of the Third International, which is
stirring up revolt all over the world, are officials of your Soviet Gov-
ernment, in your legislative branch.
Mr. Skvirsky. Our Communist Partv membership is about
2,000,000 at the present time
The Chairman. Sixty of these people, as I say, are on the execu-
tive committee and also on the executive branch of the Soviet Gov-
ernment.
Mr. Skvirsky. I say tho>e institutions do not and are not respon-
sible in any way for the activities of the Third International.
The Chairman. l£ut the members themselves are.
Mr. Skvirsky. There are several members who may be there.
The Chairman. Who are on the committee and are also members
of the Third International ?
Mr. Skvirsky. Yes.
The Chairman. They are officials in the Soviet Government; yet
the Soviet Government, you say. has no connection with the Third
International. Now, one of those members you spoke about, which
INVESTIGATION OF COMMUNIST PROPAGANDA 101
we discussed a little while ago, whom you said was a member of the
union central executive committee of the congress, was this very-
same man, A. Lozovsky, and he is the man who wrote this letter and
therefore does hold an official position. He is in the legislative
branch of the government and the executive committee and writes a
letter, which I read a little while ago, urging the creation of a com-
munist bureau for Central America in Xew York City.
Mr. Skvirsky. Suppose an American communist is elected to the
American Congress and sends a cable to Russia. Would Congress be
responsible if he sends a cable to Russia ?
The Chairman. If he is on the Third International?
Mr. Skvirsky. If an American communist is in your Congress —
you have had a Socialist, and maybe you will' have a communist —
if he cables to Russia, are you' personally responsible for such
member ?
The Chairman. I imagine if he was on a committee of Congress,
it might be so. Those men are all on the executive committee of
Congress ; they are not nonparty members.
Mr. Skvirsky. I do not think this Congress would be responsible
for a member. You know, you have communists in the various
parliaments.
The Chairman. If you only had one lone man. your reasoning
might be logical, but it so happens that every one of those men is on
the executive committee of your congress.
Mr. Skvirsky. You see, the trouble is this
Mr. Nelson. Mr. Chairman, we do not get ahead in arguing that
matter. He draws one conclusion and you draw another, and you
two are never going to agree.
The Chairman. Did you tell Mr. Bachmann how many engineers
there are in this country at the present time?
Mr. Skvirsky. Russian engineers?
The Chairman. Yes.
Mr. Skvirsky. I said several hundred; I do not know the exact
number.
The Chairman. Is that all ?
Mr. Skvirsky. That is all. If you need the exact number, I can
get it for }'Ou. I suppose there are six or seven hundred, altogether.
Mr. Bachmann. I wish you would get that, if you will. I would
like to compare your figures with some figures that I have right in
that connection.
Mr. Skvirsky. Yes: I will get those figures for you.
The Chairman. This is a list of those officials we have been dis-
cussing. You ma}- have a later list, but I wish you would take that
and revise it.
Mr. Skvirsky. I have no list at all; I have the papers. I can look
it up.
The Chairman. I thought you said you had the latest one?
Mr. Skvirsky. No; I just have the papers, so I will have to look
up the papers and see what I can find. Who is this list from?
The Chairman. That is not stated.
Mr. Skvirsky. That is not stated ? I guess all kinds of lists are
being put out.
102 INVESTIGATION OF COMMUNIST PROPAGANDA
Mr. Nelson. I do not think it has been put in as a fact, in evi-
dence, who appoints the people's commissars. Is it the congress of
Soviets, the executive committee, or the presidium ?
Mr. Skvirsky. The central executive committee of the Soviets.
Mr. Nelson. Does the Second International still exist?
Mr. Skvirsky. Yes; it does.
Mr. Nelson. With headquarters at London?
Mr. Skvirsky. The headquarters were partly in Amsterdam, and
they were then in London. MacDonald is one of the heads of the
Second International
Mr. Nelson. That is known now as some union — the labor union
and socialist international?
Mr. Skvirsky. No; this is a different one; this is the so-called
Amsterdam International, which is the international of certain trade-
unions. But what I mean is the International of Socialist Parties.
Mr. Nelson. The Second International — the remnants of it — do
they have their headquarters at Brussels or London?
Mr. Skvirsky. They have at the present time, I think, mostly in
Amsterdam. You see, they shifted; they were at Amsterdam, and
partly, sometimes, in Brussels, and then in London. As you know,
the Minister of Foreign Affairs in Belgium, Mr. Von de Veldt — he
used to be but he is not any more — he is one of the heads of the
Second International. Mr. MacDonald is also one of the heads of
the Second International in London.
Mr. Nelson. You say there are 2,000,000 members of the Com-
munist Party now in Russia?
Mr. Skvirsky. Yes, about, not counting the Young Communists,
which are two million and a half separate. The Young Communists
are two and a half million; so. altogether, it is about four and a
half million.
Mr. Nelson. Two and a half million Young Communists?
Mr. Skvirsky. Yes; from 16 to 23; then the Communist Party,
about 2,000,000.
Mr. Nelson. I think the Pravda claimed you had about three
million and a half.
Mr. Skvirsky. You mean in the party?
Mr. Nelson. Yes.
Mr. Skvirsky. No ; the Pravda never could claim that. I read it.
No; the Pravda could never claim that, because, you see, we never
had such a number.
Mr. Nelson. That includes all the communists in the Union of
Socialist Soviet Republics, does it?
Mr. Skvirsky. Yes.
Mr. Bachmann. What is the population of Russia now ?
Mr. Skvirsky. One hundred and fifty million.
Mr. Bachmann. In the credits that are extended, is there any
credit extended to the Soviet Government by any of the banks or
firms in the United States?
Mr. Skvirsky. Well, the credit is extended to Amtorg Trading
Corporation.
Mr. Bachmann. I understand that.
Mr. Skvirsky. Yes ; much of it ; not directly to the Soviet Govern-
ment under a loan.
INVESTIGATION OF COMMUNIST PROPAGANDA 103
Mr, Bachmann. There is «o credit extended direct to the Soviet
Government ?
Mr. Skviksky. Xo; just to Amtorg Trading Organization, and to
some other organizations which are in Russia, but not directly to the
Russian Government.
Mr. Bachmann. That is how the credit is obtained in this country?
Mr. Skvirsky. Yes.
Mr. Bachmann. Although these organizations over there, includ-
ing Amtorg. belong to the Soviet Government?
Mr. Skvirsky. They send orders to Amtorg, of course. Of course,
the Soviet Government has credits in Europe but not here — we had
lately one agreement with the Italian Government and the German
Government, where both Governments are guaranteeing GO or 75 per
cent of whatever the Soviet Government purchases in their countries.
Mr. Bachmann. That is a different .situation than what we have in
this country '.
Mr. Skvirsky. Yes: in this country Ave have not. I can say only
one thing, that but on account of this credit trouble with Amtorg, of
course, the trade between the United States and Russia could have
been easily live times as much as it is now.
Mr. Bachmann. I do not share your view, because I think you are
smart enough over there to buy wherever you can buy the cheapest
and obtain the greatest amount of credit.
Mr. Skvirsky. But this situation is not so.
Mr. Bachmann. I do not share the same view you do in that
respect.
Mr. Skviksky. I will tell you why I think so.
Mr. Bachmann. Yes.
Mr. Skvirsky. We have to-day 150,000,000 people; you have 120,-
000,000. You have mass production, which is exactly what we need.
We would like to work; you know Russia was very backward, and
then all of a sudden you hear that something is going to happen under
the 5-year plan to American industry. As you know, it will take,
maybe, three or four 5-year plans before Russia succeeds in getting
where America is now, considering America is not going ahead. We
would like to accelerate our development. You know the more a
country is developed the more it buys; you know that very well from
the experience with America. America was buying 50 years ago
much less than it is buying now. although America has become an in-
dustrial country. If we become an industrial country, the more we
buy now of machinery, the more we will have to buy in the future,
you know — repairs, parts, and so on. So, from that point of view,
America and Russia are exactly the countries which could get to-
gether and be of great help to each other; but, unfortunately, there is
so much misrepresentation being passed around now in this country
that it is difficult.
The Chairman. Would it help this country a great deal if we sold
to Russia a great many more tractors (
Mr. Skvirsky. I do not see why not.
The Chairman. Do you think it would help our wheat farmers a
great deal if we sold to Russia a great many more tractors '.
Mr. Skvirsky. I will answer this way: You know what Russia is
after: Russia wants to get back her own market which she had. You
104 [NVESTIGATION OF COMMUNIST PROPAGANDA
know that Russia has always been a grain-exporting country, and
this year she exported one-third of what Russia used to export.
The Chairman. How much are yon going to export next year — this
coming year (
Mr. Skvihskt. I suppose she will export about one-third.
The Chairman. How much do you expect to export next year?
Mr. Skvirsky. I could not tell yon that; T don't know the figures.
The Chairman. You know the plan.
Mr. Skvirsky. The plan?
The Chairman. You know how much yon expect to export?
Mr. Skvirsky. I am not a business man and nobody usually talks
about things like that, if you are a good business man.
The Chairman. Do you think it is helpful to America to sell
Russia a lot of lumber machinery?
Mr. Skvirsky. Yes; I think so; because, if we import anything
here, it is not in competition with the United States. If we bring
in coal, it is of such a quality not obtainable in America. I was
myself in Moscow last year
The Chairman. Is it not a fact you can produce wheat much
cheaper than it can be produced in the United States? How much
is the cost of the production of wheat in Russia I Do you know-
how much it costs to produce a bushel of wheat in Russia ?
Mr. Skvirsky. I do not know the exact figure. You see, those
large soviet farms are really only beginning to work. Certainly
Russia, in general, can. of course, produce cheaper, because Russia
is a socialist country, has no unemployment questions: you have no
advertising to pay, because you know you have no competitors in
Russia ; so, certainly, they can produce cheaper.
The Chairman. How much does it co.-t to produce a bushel of
wheat in Russia?
Mr. Skvirsky. I could not tell you. I suppose they will publish
those figures and I will be glad to send them to you. I did not see
any exact figures for that. I can say one thing, the Soviet Union
has developed such large farms in Russia, as amout 300,000-aere
farms, they are completely mechanized: the peasants work there for
eight hours and get the ordinary w T ao-es as other workinffmen
Mr. Eslick. What is the largest farm they have over there?
Mr. Skvirsky. The so-called Giant Farm.' which is nearly 400.000
acres. Then we have over 100 farms which are just about 50,000
acres. 100,000 or 150.000 acres, and the number of farms now is
growing since abolishing the old system, where the peasant had a
small strip of land which was divided, one piece in one place and
about 2 miles farther a piece in another place. The only way to
help the Russian peasants who were poor in the majority was for the
government to teach them to got the advantages of large-scale farm-
ing in collective farms. While under the old system the farmer was
poor, by combining a thousand farmers or 5,000 together, and com-
bining what they have, certainly the}' can produce cheaper and
better. This was the result this year of the so-called collective
farms. Every member of the collective farm had about twice as
much income as the farmer working on his small individual strip of
land.
INVESTIGATION OF COMMUNIST PROPAGANDA 105
The Chairman. What is the largest farm?
Mr. Skyirsky*. The Giant Farm.
The Chairman. How many acres?
Mr. Skyirsky. Nearly 400.000 acres. I was there last year myself
and I visited it, so I know.
The Chairman. Is it a wheat farm?
Mr. Skyirsky. It i> just a wheat farm. We have a number of
wheat farms.
The Chairman. How many other wheat farms docs the Govern-
ment have?
Mr. Skyirsky*. At the present time over 100, and are going to
develop more.
The Chairman. And they are going to develop more?
Mr. Skyirsky. Yes; the collectives also. There are about 5,000,000
peasants already in the collectives, mostly in the grain region. We
have about 43 per cent of the farmers in the grain region who are
members of collectives. If }"ou take the peasants as a whole, about
25 per cent of the peasants are already in the collectives. With the
results this year, which have shown that the collective is economically
sound, because it gives the peasant a better chance to live, to raise the
standard of living, and it is expected by next year to have about
half of the peasantry in the collective farms. This will mean, of
course, increased production.
The Chairman. How many acres have you in wheat land?
Mr. Skyirsky. I do not remember exactly. If you would like. I
could get the figures and bring it back here ; I can look it up. Off-
hand, I have been speaking so much
The Chairman. You have not read Mr. Campbell's article, then,
in Collier's?
Mr. Skyirsky. I read about the article and saw Mr. Campbell
The Chairman. You know what figures he gives, do you not ?
Mr. Skyirsky'. I do not remember the figures.
The Chairman. I think you would be very much interested if you
read that article.
Mr. Skyirsky. You mean about the Giant Farm?
The Chairman. Yes.
Mr. Skyirsky. The area is not stable ; they are increasing and en-
larging it. The land has never been scratched before, and so thos< j
farms are on land that has never been used before. They have a few
smaller and some are to be larger.
The Chairman, You think it would not hurt the American wheat
farmers if all of the European wheat markets were taken awav from
them ?
Mr. Skyirsky*. It would; yes, sir; but Russia would go back to
where Russia was before the war. As a matter of fact, you captured,
as I sa}-, the Russian markets while Russia was engaged in civil war.
The Chairman. How would it go back to where it was before the
war? Assuming she can produce cheaper, assuming she can produce
wheat for 20 cents a bushel, why should not Russia take all of the
markets away — take the entire foreign market?
Mr. Skyirsky. If there are any problems between governments,
they can always be solved in a friendly way when they can sit around
106
INVESTIGATION OF COMMUNIST PROPAGAN DA
the table and discuss these problems; but you can never discuss any
problem by having interviews in the press in Moscow or Washington,
which are usually misrepresented, misinterpreted, and so on.
The Chairman. Can you ever solve any problem as long as the
Third International has its headquarters in Moscow ?
Mr. Skvirsky. I hope to see the American Government, as the
European governments are ; friendly with the Soviet Government,
beyond the Third International, and deal with the Soviet Govern-
ment as a government.
The Chairman. The European governments do not take that
attitude, though.
Mr. Skvirsky. Why not?
The Chairman. England does not take that attitude.
Mr. Skvirsky. Why not?
The Chairman. They hold the Soviet Government responsible for
the Third International.
Mr. Skvirsky. When relations were reestablished with England
our representatives the attitude of the Soviet Government, they
agreed to it. The press reports to this effect from time to time; and
they may have some disagreements, as other governments, but that
is all.
The Chairman. Are there any other questions? If not, thank
you very much, Mr. Skvirsky.
(The following are figures and lists submitted by Mr. Skvirsky,
as requested by the committee:)
[From Moscow Izvestia, July 14, 1030]
POLITICAL BURKAU OF THE COMMUNIST PARTY
(Elected at XVI party congress, July 13, 1930)
Members :
Voroshilov. KliiiK'iiti E.
Kaganovich, Lazar M.
Kalinin, Mikhail I.
Kirov, Sergey M.
Kossior, Stanislav V.
Kuibyshev, Valerian V.
Molotov, Viacheslav M.
Ordzhonikidze, G. K. (19).
Members — Continued.
Rudzutak, Ian E.
Stalin, Joseph V.
Candidates.
Mikoyan, Anastasi I.
Chubar, Vlas Y.
Petrovsky, Grigory I.
Andreyev, Audrey A.
Syrtsov, Sergey I. 1
ORGANIZATION BUREAU OF THE COMMUNIST PARTY
(Elected at XVI party congress, July 13, 1930)
Members :
Akulov. I. A.
Ba uma n, K. Y.
Bubnov, A. S.
Gamarnik, Y. B.
Kaganovich, L. M.
Lobov, S. S.
Molotov, V. M.
Moskvin, I. M.
Members — Continued.
Postishev, P. P.
Stalin, J. V.
Shevrnik, N. M.
Candidates:
Smirnov, A. P.
Tsikhon, A. M.
Kosarev, A. V.
Dogadov, A. I.
1 Dropped from Central Committee of Party December 1, 1930. See " Izvestia " Dec. 2,
1930.
INVESTIGATION OF COMMUNIST PROPAGANDA
107
CENTRAL COMMITTEE OF THE COMMUNIST PARTY
(Elected at sixteenth party congress, July 13, 1930)
Members :
Alexeyev, P. A.
Andreyev, A. A.
Antipov, N. K.
Badayev, A. E.
Bavarian, K. Y.
Bubnov, A. S.
Bukharin, N. I.
Vareikis, I. M.
Voroshilov, K. E.
Gamarnik, Y. B.
Goloschekin, F. I.
Zhdanov, A. A.
Zhukov, I. P.
Zelensky. I. A.
Kabakov, I. D.
Kaganovich. I. M.
Kadatzky. I. F.
Kalinin, M. I.
Kviring, E. I.
Kirov, S. M.
Knorin, Y. G.
Kolotilov, N. N.
Komarov, N. F.
Kosior, I. V.
Kosior, S. Y.
Krjijanovsky, G. M.
Krupskaya, N. K.
Kubiak, N. A.
Kuibyshev, U. V.
Lebed, D. Z.
Leonov, F. G.
Lobov, S. S.
Lominadze, Y. Y.~
Loniov, G. I.
Liubimov, I. E.
Manuilsky, D. Z.
Menjinsky, V. R.
Mikoyan, A. I.
Molotov, Y. M.
Moskvin, I. M.
Nosov, I. P.
Orakhelashvili, I. D.
Petrovsky, G. I.
Postyshev, P. P.
Piatakov, Y. L.
Platnitsky, I. A.
Rudzutak, Y. E.
Rumiantsev, I. P.
Rukhimovich, M. L.
Rykov, A. I.
Ryndin, K. V.
Skrypnik, N. A.
Smirnov, A. P.
Stalin, J. V.
Stetsky, A. I.
Strievsky, K. K.
Sulimov, D. E.
Members — Continued.
Syrtsov, S. I. 3
Tolokontsev, A. F.
Tomski, M. P.
Ukhanov, K. V.
Khatayevich, M. M.
Tsikhon, A. M.
Chubar, V. Y.
Chuvyrin, P. E.
Chudov, M. S.
Shwartz, S.
Shvemik, N. M.
Sheboldayev, B. P.
Eikhe, R. I.
Yakovlev, Y. A.
Candidates :
Baranov, P. I.
Uryvayev, M. E.
Afanasiev, S. J.
Griadinsky, F. P.
Kuritsyin, V. I.
Isayev, U. D.
Kartvelishvili ( Lavrenti ) .
Rumantsiev, K. A.
Smorodin, P. I.
Oshvintsev, M. K.
Stroganov, V. A.
Unshlikht, I. S.
Ivanov, V. I.
Kaminsky, G. N.
Mussabekov, G. K.
Sukhomlin, K. V.
Chutskayev, S. E.
Yolkov, P. Y.
Voronova, P. Y.
Khlopliankin, M. I.
Pozern, B. P.
Yurkin, T. A.
Bulatov, D. N.
Goloded, N. M.
Briukhanov, N. P.
Kalmanovich, M. I.
Mezhlauk, V. I.
Gei, K. V.
Semenov, B. A.
Terekhov, R. Y.
Eliava, S. Z.
Ikramov, A.
Mikhailov, V. M.
Lozovsky, S. A.
Nikolayeva, K. I.
Savelev, M. A.
Amosov, A. M.
Kakhiani, M. I.
Antselovich, N. M.
Kosarev, A. V.
Tsarkov, F. F.
Ossinsky, V. V.
2 Dropped from central committee of party, Izvestia, Dec. 2, 1930.
108
INVESTIGATION 01' COMMUNIST PROPAGANDA
Candidates — Continued.
Bnlin. A. S.
Chaplin, N. P.
Yakir, I. E.
Serebrovsky, A. P.
Perepechko, I. \.
Yagoda, G. G.
Popov, N. N.
Mikhailov-Ivanov, M. S.
Kalygina, A. S.
Pakhomov, N. I.
Weinberg, G. D.
Sedelnikov, A. I.
Klimenko, I. B.
< ' .- 1 1 h 1 i « 1 : 1 1 • s < '(mi inued.
Buiat, I. L.
Kiinitski, A. I,
Pofonsky, V. I.
Sokolnikov, G. Y.
Ptukha, V. V.
Schmidt, V. V.
Bergavinov, S. A.
Kiselev, A. S.
Koslov, I. I.
Dogadov, A. I.
Mirzoyan, L. I.
Uborevich, I. P.
CENTRAL CONTROL COMMISSION OF COMMUNIST PARTY
(Elected at XVI Party Congress, July 13, 1930)
Members :
Akulov, I. A.
Ansa-Mukbamedov.
Apse.
Aronsbtam, G. N.
Aronsbtam, L. H.
Artiukhina, A. V.
Baicburin, G. G.
Balitsky, V. A.
Baltabayev, S.
Bauer, Y. Y.
Belenky, Z. M.
Belenky, I. S.
Berezin, N. S.
Bliznichenko, A. E.
Bobbe, M. Y.
Bogdanov, I. A.
Bogdanov. M. V.
Bogdanov, P. B.
Boichenko, A.
Bolotnikov, M. F.
Borschevsky, A. G.
Brize, M. M.
Bnsse, K. Y.
Vassiliev, S. V.
Vassilieva, E. O.
Velikanov, S.
Vent, A. I.
Viksnin, S. O.
Vitkovsky, A. F.
Vladimirov, R.
Volkov. A. V.
Voloshtn.
Voerobiev.
Gaza. I.
Gemerwehl. M.
Ginzburg, S. Z.
Gorchayev, M. D.
Goltzman. A. Z.
Goreva, E.
Grigorieva. M. P.
Grossman, V. Y.
Grossman, M. B.
Gruzel, V. P.
Griazev. I. A.
Gurevicb, A. I
Gusev, C. I.
Members — Continued.
Descheuko, P. P.
Dirik, K. Y.
Dovletbayev.
Drojjin, I. V.
Endokimov, E. G.
Evreinov, N. N.
Evseyev, M. E.
Egorov, Y. G.
Enukidze, A. Z.
Jucbayev, D. A.
Zaitsev, G. A.
Zaitsev, F. I.
Zangwill, Z. G.
Zarin, R. P.
Zatonsky, V. P.
Zvonarev, S. A.
Zemliachka, R. S.
Z : min, N. N.
Ivanov, A. A.
Ivanov, I. I.
I va nov-Kavkazcky .
Ignat, S. I.
Ilin, N. I.
Isayev ( Sormovo ) .
Kaganovich, M. M.
Kalashnikov, M. I.
Kalnin, A. Y.
Karavayev, P. N.
Karasen.
Karpov.
Kasumov.
Kirkkizh, K. O.
Kiselev, A. L.
Klynev, P. N.
Kovalev, M. I.
Kozhevnikov, I. F.
Kozen, I. F.
Kokovikhin, M. N.
Koltun, I. M.
Kopiev, A. K.
Korostelev, G. A.
Korotkov, I. I.
Kostanyan, G. A.
Kochkarev (Izhevsk)
Krivov, T. S.
Krnglikov, S. L.
INVESTIGATION OF COMMUNIST PROPAGANDA
109
Members — Continued.
Krumiu. G. I.
Krylenko, N. V.
Kriukov, P. V.
Kulkov. M. M.
Kulpe, Y. K.
Larin, V. F.
Larichev. A. I.
Leizor, I. I.
Liaksutkin, F. F.
Matador, B. O.
Maiorov, M. M.
Maltsev. N. V.
Mandalian.
Manzhara, D. I.
Martinovich, K. F.
Medvedev.
Messing-, S. A.
Milchakov, A. I.
Miliutin, V. P.
Muranov, M. K.
Xazaretian, A. M.
Nazarov. S. I.
Novoselov, S. A.
Xosov. P. N.
Ozersky, A. Y.
Ordzhonikidze, G. K.
Osmov, N. M.
Pavluuovsky, I. P.
Panov, N. F.
Perekatov, I. G.
Peters, A. K.
Pokrovsky, M. N.
Pospelov, P. N.
Pylayev, E. N.
Rakutin. N. G.
Rastopchin. N. P.
Redens. S. F.
Rivkin. O. L.
Rozenholtz, A. P.
Roizenman. B. A.
Romanov. G. I.
Ruben, R. G.
Rumantsiev, G. K.
Saltanov, S.
Savostin, D. I.
Sakbarova, P. F.
Sakbianova, M. M.
Members — Continued.
Sevriugin, E.
Semichev, E. T.
Sergusbev, M. S.
Sidoroy, K. G.
Siansky-Mikhailov, S. I.
Slavinsky, A. S.
Smirnov, M.
Smorodin, I. T.
Soifer, Y. G.
Sokolovsknya, E. K.
Soltz, A. A.
Sonis, K. P.
Srasova, E. D.
Streltsov, G. M.
Struppe, P. I.
Strucbkov, I.
Strurua. I. F.
Sudin, S. K.
Tatko, F. P.
Tevosyan, I. T.
Trilisser, M. A.
Ulianova, M. I.
Uralov, S. G.
Feigin. Y. G.
Figatner. Y. P.
Filler, S. I.
Frolov, A. T.
Kbitarov, R.
Tsvetkov, N. G.
Tsilko, F. A.
Cbanke, A. K.
Cbemodanov, V. G.
Chubin, Y. A.
Cbukenova Zbamal.
Sbaduntz, S. K.
Sbaposbnikova, L. K.
Shatzkin. L. A. 3
Sbveitzer, V. L.
Sbkirieh.N. R.
Sbkiriatov. M. F.
Sbotman, A. Y.
Shtraukh, E. N.
Sbushkov, P. S.
Scbadenko, E. A.
Ego, F. G.
Yakovlev, N. M.
Yaroslavsky, Em.
Note. — According to tbe New York Times of December 23, Audrey Andreyev
has been made chairman of the central control commission to succeed G. K.
Ordzhonikidze.
UNION CENTRAL EXECUTIVE COMMITTEE
According to the list of members elected at the fifth congress of Soviets of the
Union of Soviet Socialists Republics on May 28, 1929, and published in the
Moscow Izvestia of May 29, 1929, the names listed in the chart as being among
the members and candidates (alternates) of the central executive committee are
correct.
The names given as being among the members of the presidium of the union
central executive committee are also correct.
b Dropped from Control Committee Dec. 1, 1930. See Izvestia, Doc. i'. 19:'.0.
119651— 31— pt 1. vol 5 8
110 INVESTIGATION OF COMMUNIST PROPAGANDA
Soviet of people's commissars of the union of soviet socialist republics
President. Molotov. V. M. (18).
Vice president, Rudzutak, Y. E,
Vice President, Kuibyshev. V. V.
Commissar for foreign affairs, Litvinov. M. M. (1).
Assistant commissar for foreign affairs, Krestinsky. N. N. (1).
Assistant commissar for foreign affairs, Karakhan, L. M. (1).
Commissar for army and navy, Vorosbilov, K. E.
Assistant commissar for army and navy, Uborevich, I. P. (2). •
Assistant commissar for army and navy, Gamarnik, Y. B. (2).
Commissar for internal trade, Mikoyan, A. I.
Commissar for foreign trade, Rozenkoltz, A. P. (3).
Assistant commissar for foreign trade, Liubimov, I. E. (4).
Assistant commissar for foreign trade, Ozersky, A. V. (4).
Assistant commissar for foreign trade, Weitzer, I. Y. (4).
Commissar for transport, Rukbimovich, K. E. (2).
Assistant commissar for transport, Postnikov, A. M. (5).
Assistant commissar for transport, Zof, V. I. (6).
Commissar for post and telegraph. Antipov, N. K. (7).
Assistant commissar for post, and telegraph, Liubovich, A. M. (7).
Assistant commissar for post and telegraph, Smirnov, N. I. (7).
Commissar for workers' and peasants' inspection (Ordzbinikidze, formerly
commissar, transferred to supreme economic council ; successor not yet an-
nounced ) .
Assistant commissar for workers' and peasants' inspection (Ordzbinikidze,
foi'merly commissar, transferred to supreme economic council; successor nut
yet announced).
Commissar for labor, Tsikhon. A. M. (1).
Assistant commissar for labor. Kraval. I. A. (S).
Commissar for finance, Grinko, G. F. (9).
Commissar for agriculture, Yakovlev. Y. A. (10).
Assistant commissar for agriculture, Klimenko. I. E. (11).
Assistant commissar for agriculture. Ezbov, N. I. (11).
Assistant commissar for agriculture, Odintsov, S. S. (12).
Assistant commissar for agriculture. Schmidt, V. V. (13).
Assistant commissar for agriculture, Birn, I. G. (13).
President supreme council of national economy, Ordjonikidze, G. K. (9).
Vice president supreme council of national economy. Pavlunovsky, I. P. (14)
Vice president supreme council of national economy, Lobov, S. S. (15).
Vice president supreme council national economy, Dogadov, A. I. (16). 4
The state plan commission (gosplan) is erroneously listed under the soviet
of people's commissars. It should be listed under important state organs.
Its officers are as follows: President of gosplan, Kuibyshev, V. V. (9) ; vice
president of gosplan, Krzhizhanovsky, G. M. (9).
The other vice presidents listed in the chart still stand, according to the
All-Moscow Directory for 1930.
A corrected list of the chiefs of important state organs follows :
President of supreme concession committee, Kamenev, L. B.
President of central union of consumers cooperatives, Badayev, A. E.
President of united state political administration, Menzbinsky, V. R.
Vice presidents, Yagoda, G. G. ; Meissing, S. A.
President of board of directors of State Bank of Union of Soviet Socialist
Republics, Kalmanovich, M. Y. (9).
President of supreme court of Union of Soviet Socialist Republics, Vino-
kurov, A. N.
President of Moscow soviet, Ukhanov, K. V.
President of Leningrad soviet, Komarov, N. P.
President of soviet of commissars of the Ukraine, Chubar, V. Ya.
President of Ukrainian central executive committee, Petrovsky, G. I.
President of White-Russian soviet of commissars, Goloded, N. M.
President of White-Russian central executive committee, Cherviakov, A. G.
President of Trans-Caucasus central executive committee, Mussabekov, V.
G. F. (17).
4 According to the New York Times of Dec. 22 Dogadov has been removed as a vice
chairman of the supreme council of national economy.
INVESTIGATION OF COMMUNIST PROPAGANDA 111
President of Trans-Caucasus soviet of commissars, Eliava, Shalva, Z.
President of Uzbekistan central executive committee, Akhun-Babayev, Yu.
President of Uzbekistan soviet of commissars, Khodzhayev, F.
President of Turkmenistan central executive committee, Aitakov, N.
President of Turkmenistan soviet of commissars, Atabayev, K. S.
President of R. S. F. S. R. central executive committee, Kalinin, Mikhail.
President of R. S. F. S. R. council of people's commissars, Sulinov, D. E. (9).
Names of officials of the Krestintern (correct translation of the word is
Peasant International and not International Peasant Soviet) Mopr, and the
Communist International of Youth are erroneously placed under the same
heading as above. These are in no way state organs. The Soviet Union In-
formation Bureau has no means of checking whether or not the names of the
officials of these organizations are given correctly.
The list of. members of the Soviet of Labor and Defense (STO) corresponds
to the list given in All Moscow, the 1930 directory, except that the name of the
chairman, A. I. Rykov, is omitted as well as the names of the members V. V.
Schmidt and G. L. Piatakov.
According to the Kalendar Kommunista 6 for 1929, the names given as being
among the members of the executive committee and the international control
commission of the Communist International are correct with the exception
of Tsakaya. Bukharin was dropped from the political secretariat of the
Comintern in July, 1929. The names given as being among the members of
the presidium of the executive committee and the political secretariat of the
Comintern are correct, with the exception of Gusev.
The information bureau has no means of checking up the members of the
central council of the Red International of trade-unions and executive bureau
of the Red International of labor unions beyond the references given in the chart.
Source of information :
1. Soviet Union Review, September-October, 1930.
2. Soviet Union Review, July-August, 1930.
3. Izvestia, November 23, 1930.
4. Izvestia, November 29, 1930.
5. Izvestia, July 16, 1930.
6. Collected laws of the Union of Soviet Socialist Republics, section 2, No. 3,
February 18, 1930.
7. Izvestia, August 7, 1930.
8. Za Industrializatsia, August 6. 1930.
9. Soviet Union Review, December, 1930.
10. Soviet Union Review, January, 1930.
11. Izvestia, November 19. 1929.
12. Izvestia. February 9, 1930.
13. Izvestia, December 2, 1930.
14. Izvestia, November 14, 1930.
15. Izvestia, June 24, 1930.
16. Izvestia, April 2, 1930.
17. Collected laws of Union of Soviet Socialist Republics, section 2, No. 23,
June 17, 1929.
18. New York Times, December 20, 1930.
19. New York Times, December 22, 1930.
(The following are the exhibits submitted by Mr. Skvirsky :)
Skviksky Exhibit No. 2
The Constitution of the Union of Soviet Socialist Rkpitrlics
PBEFACE
The Union of Soviet Socialist Republics consists at present of the following
six independent republics: The Russian Socialist Federated Soviet Republic,
the Ukrainian Socialist Soviet Republic, the White Russian Socialist Soviet
Republic, the Transcaucasian Socialist Federated Soviet Republic, the Turko-
man Socialist Soviet Republic, and the Uzbek Socialist Soviet Republic.
6 It is possible that changes have been made since the publication of the Kalendar
Kommunista, but the information bureau has no record of them.
112 [NVESTIGATI02S OF COMMUNIST PROPAGANDA
KnHi of these independent republics has its own constitution defining the
government organs of the given republic, establishing the jurisdiction of those
organs, and formulating the basic rights of the citizens of the republic.
The constitution of the Russian Socialist Federated Soviet Republic was the
lirst to be published, having been adopted by the Fifth All-Russian Soviet
Congress of July 10, 1918.
The Soviet Republics of the Ukraine, White Russia, and Transcaucasia (the
latter including the republics of Georgia, Armenia, and Azerbaijan), which
were organized after the Russian Socialist Federated Soviet Republic, were
for several years connected with the Russian Socialist Federated Soviet Repub-
lics through treaties of alliance under which some branches of the state ad-
ministration were united.
The need for a closer union of the allied republics was responsible for the
formatio nof a single union state, built on the principle of federalism — viz, the
Union of Soviet Socialist Republics.
The constitution of the Union of Soviet Socialist Republics, which upon
recommendation of the First All-Union Soviet Congress (December 31, 1922),
was adopted by the central executive committee on July 6, 1923, was finally
ratified by the Second All-Union Soviet Congress in 192-1.
In 192o the Union of Soviet Socialist Republics was joined by the Uzbek and
Turkoman Republics, which were formed out of the Turkestan Autonomous
Republic and the Bokhara and Khiva Republics, which had been previously
allied to the Soviet Union. In this connection a few changes and additions
were embodied in the constitution of the Third All-Union Soviet Congress.
Further changes and additions were made in the Soviet Constitution at the
Fourth All-Union Soviet Congress, which was held in April, 1927.
The present edition includes the latest text of the constitution of the Union
of Soviet Socialist Republics actually in force, with all the amendments adopted
by the All-Union Soviet Congresses held in 1925 and 1927.
CONSTITUTION
The Central Executive Committee of the Union of Soviet Socialist Republics,
solemnly proclaiming the permanency of the foundations of the soviet power,
in execution of the resolution of the First Congress of Soviets of the Union of
Soviet Socialist Republics, and likewise, on the basis of the agreement for the
formation of the Union of Soviet Socialist Republics, adopted at the First Con-
gress of Soviets of the Union of Soviet Socialist Republics in Moscow on
December 30, 1922, and taking into consideration the corrections and amend-
ments proposed by the central executive committees of the constituent republics,
resolves :
The declaration of the formation of the Union of Soviet Socialist Republics
and the treaty concerning the formation of the Union of Soviet Socialist Re-
publics shall form the fundamental law (constitution) of the Union of Soviet
Socialist Republics.
Section I. — Declaration Regarding the Formation of the Union of Soviet
Socialist Republics
Since the formation of the Soviet Republics, the states of the world have
divided into two camps — that of capitalism and that of socialism.
There — in the camp of capitalism — are national enmity and inequality, colon-
ial slavery and chauvinism, national oppression and massacres, imperialist
brutalities and wars.
Here — in the camp of socialism — are mutual confidence and peace, national
freedom and equality, a dwelling together in peace and the brotherly collabora-
tion of peoples.
The efforts of the capitalist world, in the course of the decades, to solve the
question of nationalities by the joint methods of the free development of peo-
ples and the exploitation of man by man have proven vain. On the contrary,
the web of national antagonism is becoming even more entangled, threatening
the very existence of capitalism. The bourgeoisie has proven incapable of
bringing about cooperation among peoples.
Only in the camp of the Soviets, only under the prevalence of the proletarian
dictatorship around which the majority of the population has rallied, has it
become possible to destroy national oppression root and branch, to create an
atmosphere of mutual trust, and to lay the foundations for the brotherly
cooperation of peoples.
Investigation of communist propaganda 113
Only, thanks to those circumstance^ have the Soviet Republics been able to
repel the external as well as the internal attacks of world imperialism Solely
because of these circumstances were they able successfully to end the civil war,
to secure .their existence, and to pass to the tasks of peaceful economic recon-
struction.
But the years of war have not passed without leaving traces. The devastated
fields and idle factories, the destruction of productive forces and the depletion
of economic resources, this legacy of the war. make the isolated efforts of indi-
vidual republics toward economic reconstruction inadequate. The restoration
of national economy was found impossible as long as the separate republics
maintained a divided existence.
On the other hand, tlte instability -)f the international situation and the
danger of new attacks point to the necessity of creating a common front of the
Soviet Republics in the face of the surrounding capitalist world.
Finally, the very structure of the soviet power, which is international in
irs class character, calls the working masses of the Soviet Repuhlic toward
a unity of one socialist family.
All these circumstances imperatively demand the unification of the Soviet
Republics into one federal State, able to assure both its external security and
internal econonrc prosperity, as well as the unhampered development of the
various nations.
The will of the peoples of the Soviet Republics recently assembled at the
congresses of their Soviets and there unanimously accepting the decision for
the formation of the " Union of Soviet Socialist Republics," serves as a reli-
able guaranty that this union shall be the voluntary association of equal
nations, that each republic is secured the right of free withdrawal from the
union ; that admission to this union shall be open to all socialist soviet
repuhlics. such as are now existing and such as shall arise in the future, that
the new united State is a fitting consummation of the beginnings which had
their inception in Novemher. 1917. toward the peaceful and brotherly collabora-
tion of the peoples, that it shall stand as the firm bulwark against world
capitalism, and form a decisive step toward the union of the workers of all
countries into one world socialist soviet republic.
Section II. — Covenant
The Russian Socialist Federated Soviet Republic, the Ukrainian Socialist
Soviet Republic the White Russian Socialist Soviet Republic, the Transcauca-
siau Socialist Federated Soviet Republic (consisting of the Soviet Socialist
Republic of Azerba'jan. the Soviet Socialist Republic of Georgia, and the
Soviet Socialist Republic of Armenia), the Turkoman Socialist Soviet Republic,
and the Uzbek Socialist Soviet Repuhlic, by this covenant enter into a single
Federal State to he known as Union of Soviet Socialist Republics.
Chapteb I. — Competence of the supreme organs of authority of the Union of
Soviet Socialist Republic*
1. The sovereignty of the Union of Soviet Socialist Republics, as exercised
through the supreme governing departments, shall include :
(a) The representation of the union >n international relations, the conduct
of all diplomatic intercourse and the conclusion of political and other treaties
with other foreign States.
(&) The modification of the external frontiers of the union and the regula-
tion of questions dealing w.'th the alteration of boundaries between the con-
stituent republics.
(c) The conclusion of treaties tor the admission of new republics into the
union.
(d) The declaration of war and the conclusion of peace.
(e) The contracting of foreign and domestic loans by the Union of Soviet
Socialist Republics and the sanctioning of foreign and domestric loans of the
constituent republics.
(f) The ratification of international treaties.
(//) Control of foreign trade, and establishment of a system of internal
t rade.
tin Establishment of the basic principles and of a general plan for the
whole national economic system of the union; determination of the branches
of industry and of separate industrial undertakings which are of federal
114 INVESTIGATION OF COMMUNIST PROPAGANDA
scope; and the conclusion of concession agreements, both of federal scope and
in behalf of the various constituent republics.
(?) The control of transport, posts, and telegraphs.
(j) The organization and control of the armed forces of the Union of Soviet
Socialist Republics.
(fc) The approval of a single state budget for the Union of Soviet Socialist
Republics comprising the budgets of the constituent republics ; determination
of the taxes and revenues applying to the whole Union of Soviet Socialist
Republics, as also of deductions therefrom and additions thereto for the
budgets of the constituent republics; authorization of additional taxes and
dues for the budgets of the constituent republics.
(/) Estahlishment of a single curency and credit system.
(»)) Establishment of general principles governing the distribution and use
of land and the exploitation of mineral wealth, forests, and waterways through-
out the whole territory of the Union of Soviet Socialist Republics.
00 Federal legislation on migration from one republic to another, and
establishment of a colonization fund.
(o) Establishment of basic principles for the composition and procedure of
the courts and the civil and criminal legislation of the union.
(p) The establishment of fundamental labor laws.
((/) Establishment of the general principles of public education.
(r) Adoption of general measures for the protection of public health.
(s) Establishment of a system of weights and measures.
(t) The organization of federal statistics.
(;/) Fundamental legislation in the matter of citizenship of the Union of
Soviet Socialist Republics in relation to the rights of foreigners.
(v) The right of amnesty extending over the whole teritory of the union.
(w) The repeal of decisions adopted by the different soviet congresses and
central executive committees of the 1 several constituent republics infringing
upon the present constitution.
(x) Settlement of controversies arising between the constituent republics.
2. The ratification and amendment of the fundamental principles of the
present constitution shall be exclusively delegated to the congress of Soviets of
the Union of Soviet Socialist Republics.
Chapter II. — The sovereignty of the several constituent republics and federal
citizenship
3. The sovereignty of the constituent republics is restricted only within the
limits stated in the present constitution, and only in respect of matters referred
to the competence of the union. Beyond these limits each constituent republic
exercises its state authority independently. The Union of Soviet Socialist
Republics protects the sovereign rights of the constituent republics.
4. Each of the constituent republics shall have the right of free withdrawal
from the union.
5. The constituent republics shall introduce alterations in their respective
constitutions to bring them in conformity with the present constitution.
6. The territory of the constituent republics shall not be altered without their
consent. For the modification, limitation, or repeal of article 4 of the present
constitution the consent of all the republics forming the Union of Soviet
Socialist Republics is required.
7. A uniform citizenship of the Union of Soviet Socialist Republics is estab-
lished for citizens of the constituent republics.
Chapter III.- — Coiuiress of Soviets of the Union of Soviet Soeialist Republics
8. The supreme authority of the Union of Soviet Socialist Republics shall be
vested in the congress of Soviets, and, during the intervals of sessions of the
congresses of Soviets, in the Central Executive Committee of the Union of Soviet
Socialist Republics, which shall consist of the council of the union and the
council of nationalities.
9. The congress of Soviets of the Union of Soviet Socialist Republics shall
be composed of representatives of city Soviets and Soviets of urban settlements
on the basis of 1 deputy for each 25,000 electors, and of representatives of
provincial and district soviet congresses on the basis of 1 deputy for each
125,000 inhabitants.
10. The representatives to the congress of Soviets of the Union of Soviet
Socialist Republics shall be elected at the provincial and district soviet con-
INVESTIGATION OF COMMUNIST PROPAGANDA 115
gresses. In those republics which have no provincial or district units the
delegates shall he elected directly at the congresses of Soviets of the respective
republics.
11. Ordinary congresses of the soviet* of the Union of Soviet Socialist Re-
publics shall be convened by the Central Executive Committee of the Union of
Soviet Socialist Republics once in two years; extraordinary congresses shall be
convened by the Central Executive Committee of the Union of Soviet Socialist
Republics either on its own initiative or on the demand of the council of the
union or council of nationalities, or of any two of the constituent republics.
12. Under extraordinary circumstances preventing the convening of the con-
gress of the Soviets of the Union of Soviet Socialist Republics at the appointed
time, the Central Executive Committee of the Union of Soviet Socialist Republics
shall have the right to postpone the convening of the congress.
Chapter IV.— The Central Executive Committee of the Union of Soviet Socialist
Republics
13. The Central Executive Committee of the Union of Soviet Socialist Repub-
lics shall consist of the council of the union and the council of nationalities.
14. The congress of Soviets of the Union of Soviet Socialist Republics shall
elect the council of the union from among the representatives of the constituent
republics counted in proportion to the population of each republic, the number
to be determined by the congress of Soviets of the Union of Soviet Socialist
Republics.
15. The council of nationalities shall be formed of the representatives of the
constituent and autonomous soviet socialist republics on the basis of five rep-
resentatives from each ; and of the representatives of autonomous areas on the
basis of one representative from each. The composition of the council of
nationalities as a whole shall he subject to confirmation by the congress of
Soviets of the Union of Soviet Socialist Republics.
16. The council of the union and the council of nationalities shall examine
all decrees, codes, and regulations submitted by the presidium of the Central
Executive Committee of the council of people's commissars of the Union of Soviet
Socialist Republics, by separate people's commissariats of the union or by the
Central Executive Committees of the constituent republics : as well as those
proposed on the initiative of the council of the Union and the council of
nationalities.
17. The Central Executive Committee of the Union of Soviet Socialist Repub-
lics issues codes, decrees, regulations, and orders, combines the work of legis-
lation and administration of the Union of Soviet Socialist Republics, and de-
termines the scope of activities of the presidium of the Central Executive Com-
mittee and the council of people's commissars of the Union of Soviet Socialist
Republics.
18. All decrees and ordinances determining the general principles of the
political and economic life of the Union of Soviet Socialist Republics, and also
those which introduce fundamental changes in the existing practice of the
state organs of the Union of Soviet Socialist Republics, must be submitted for
the examination and ratification of the Central Executive Committee of the
Union of Soviet Socialist Republics.
19. All decrees, regulations, and orders issued by the Central Executive Com-
mittee must be immediately carried out throughout the territory of the Union
of Soviet Socialist Republics.
20. The Central Executive Committee of the Union of Soviet Socialist Repub-
lics shall have the right to suspend or repeal decrees, regulations, and ordi-
nances of the presidium of the Central Executive Committee of the Union of
Soviet Socialist Republics, of the congresses of Soviets, and of the Central
Executive Committees of the constituent republics, and of other organs of
authority within the territory of the Union of Soviet Socialist Republics.
21. The regular sessions of the Central Executive Committee of the Union of
Soviet Socialist Republics shall be convened by the presidium of the Central
Executive Committee three times a year. The extraordinary sessions shall be
convened by decision of the presidium of the Central Executive Committee of
the Union of Soviet Socialist Republics upon the demand of the presidium of the
council of the union or the presidium of the council of nationalities, and also
upon the demand of the Central Executive Committee of any one of the con-
stituent republics.
22. Legislative bills submitted for consideration by the Central Executive Com-
mittee of the Union of Soviet Socialist Republics shall become laws only after
116 INVESTIGATION OF COMMUNIST PROPAGANDA
having been passed by both the council of the union and the council of nation-
alities ; they are published in the name of the Central Executive Committee of
the Union of Soviet Socialist Republics.
23. In case of disagreement between the council of the union and the council
of nationalities, the question at issue shall lie referred to an adjustment com-
mission appointed by these two organs.
24. If no agreement be reached in the adjustment commission, the question
shall be referred to n joint session of the council of the union and of the council
of nationalities, wherein, in the event that no majority vote of the council of
the union or of the council of nationalities can he obtained, the question may
be referred, on the demand of either of these bodies, for decision to either the
regular or extraordinary congress of Soviets of the Un'on of Soviet Socialist
Republics.
25. The council of the union and the council of nationalities each elects a
presidium of nine of its members to arrange its sessions and conduct the work
of the latter.
26. In the intervals between sessions of the central executive committee of
the Union of Soviet Socialist Republics supreme authority is vested in the
presidium of the central executive committee of the Union of Soviet Socialist
Republics, formed by the central executive committee of the Union of Soviet
Socialist RepuMies of 27 members, amongst whom are included the whole of
the presidium of the council of the union and the presidium of the council of
nationalities.
For the purpose of constituting the presidium of the central executive com-
mittee of the Union of Soviet Socialist Repuhlics and the council of people's
commissars of the Union of Soviet Socialist Republics, in accordance with
articles 26 and 37 of this constitution, a joint session of the council of the
union and of the council of nationalities is called. The voting at the joint
session of the council of the union and of the council of nationalities is effected
separately by the council of the union and by the council of nationalities.
27. The central executive committee elects, in accordance with the number
of constituent republics, the chairmen of the central executive committee of the
Union of Soviet Socialist Republics from among members of the presidium of
the central executive committee of the Union of Soviet Socialist Republics.
28. The central executive committee of the Union of Soviet Socialist Re-
publics shall be responsible to the congress of sov'ets of the Union of Soviet
Socialist Republics.
Chapter V. — The presidium of the central executive committee of the Union of
Soviet Socialist Rci>itl)Hcx
29. The presidium of the central executive committee of the Union of Soviet
Socialist Repuhlics shall during the intervals between the sessions of the cen-
tral executive committee of the Union of Soviet Socialist Republics be the
highest legislative, executive, and administrative organ in the Union of Soviet
Socialist Republics.
30. The presidium of the central executive committee of the Union of Soviet
Socialist Republics shall have the power to supervise the carrying into effect of
the constitution of the Union of Soviet Socialist Republics, and the carrying
out by all organs of authority of all decisions of the congress of Soviets and of
the central executive committee of the Union of Soviet Socialist Repuhlics.
31. The presidium of the central executive committee of the Union of Soviet
Socialist Republics shall have the power to suspend or to repeal the decisions
of the council of people's commissars and of the individual people's commis-
sariats of the Union of Soviet Socialist Republics and of the central execu-
tive committees and the councils of people's commissars of the constituent
republics.
32. The presidium of the central execut've committee of the Union of Soviet
Socialist Republics shall have the power to suspend the decisions of the con-.
gresses of Soviets of the constituent republics, and subsequently thereto to
submit such decisions for examination and ratification to the central executive
committee of the Uniou of Soviet Socialist Republics.
33. The presidium of the central executive committee of the Union of Soviet
Socialist Republics shall pass decrees, regulations, and ordinances, shall exam-
ine and ratify draft decrees and resolutions submitted by the council of people's
commissars, by the separate departments of the Union of Soviet Socialist
Republics, by the central executive committees of the constituent republics, their
presidia and by other organs of authority.
INVESTIGATION OF COMMUNIST PROPAGANDA 117
'.'<A. The decrees and decisions of the central executive committee, of its
presidium, and of the council of people's commissars of the Union <>t' Soviet
Socialist Republics shall be printed in the languages in general use within the
constituent Republics (Russian, Ukrainian, White Russian. Georgian. Armenian,
Ttirko-Tartar).
35. The presidium of the central executive committee of the Union <>f Soviet
Socialist Republic's shall have the power to decide the questions pertaining
to the interrelations between the council of people's commissars of the Union
of Soviet Socialist Republics and the individual people's commissariats of the
Union of Soviet Socialist Republics, on the one hand, and the central executive
committees of the constituent republics and their presidia, on the other hand.
36. The presidium of the central executive committee <>f the Union of Soviet
Socialist Republics shall be responsible to the central executive committee of
the Union of Soviet Socialist Republics.
Chapter VI. — The council of people's commissars of tlie Union of Soviet .socialist
Republics
37. The council of people's commissars of the Union of Soviet Socialist Re-
publics shall he the executive and administrative organ of the central executive
committee of the Union of Soviet Socialist Republics, and it shall be formed
by the central executive committee of the Union of Soviet Socialist Republics,
as follows :
Chairman of the council of people's commissars of the Union of Soviet
Socialist Republics.
Vice chairman.
People's commissar for foreign affairs.
People's commissar for army and navy.
People's commissar for foreign and domestic trade.
People's commissar for transport.
People's commissar for posts and telegraphs.
People's commissar for workers' and peasants' inspection.
Chairman of the supreme council of national economy.
People's commissar for labor.
People's commissar for finance.
Director of central statistical board.
38. The council of people's commissars of the Union of Soviet Socialist
Republics, within the limits of the powers conferred upon it by the central
executive committee of the Union of Soviet Socialist Republics and by virtue
of the statute about the council of people's commissars, shall issue decrees
and regulations which must be executed throughout the territory of the Union
of Soviet Socialist Republics.
39. The council of people's commissars of the Union of Soviet Socialist
Republics shall examine decrees and regulations submitted by the individual
people's commissariats of the Union of Soviet Socialist Republics, or by the
Central Executive Committee of the constituent republics and by their presidia.
40. The council of people's commissars of the Union of Soviet Socialist
Republics shall be. in all of its work, responsible to the Central Executive Com-
mittee of the Union of Soviet Socialist Republics and to its presidium.
41. Decrees and regulations of the council of people's commissars of the Union
of Soviet Socialist Republics may be suspended and repealed by the Central
Executive Committee of the Union of Soviet Socialist Republics and its
presidium.
42. The central executive committees of the constituent republics and their
presidia may appeal against the decrees and decisions of the council of people's
commissars of the Union of Soviet Socialist Republics to the presidium of the
Central Executive Committee of the Union of Soviet Socialist Republics without
suspending their execution.
Chapter VII. — The supreme court of the Union of Soviet Socialist Republics
43. In order to maintain revolutionary legality throughout the territory of
the Union of Soviet Socialist Republics there shall be created a supreme court,
attached to the Central Executive Committee of the Union of Soviet Socialist
Republics, which shall have the power and jurisdiction :
(a) To give the supreme courts of the constituent republics guiding inter-
pretations on questions concerning general federal legislation.
118 INVESTIGATION OF COMMUNIST PROPAGANDA
(b) To examine and appeal to the Central Executive Committee of the Union
of Soviet Socialist Republics, on the motion of the attorney general of the
supreme court of the Union of Soviet Socialist Republics, against resolutions,
decisions, and verdicts of the supreme courts of the constituent republics on
the ground of their being in contradiction to the general legislation of the
Union of Soviet Socialist Republics, or in so far as they affect the interests
of other republics.
(c) To give opinions at the request of the Central Executive Committee of
the Union of Soviet Socialist Republics on the legality of any regulations made
by the constituent republics from the point of view of the constitution.
(d) To adjudicate judiciable controversies between the constituent republics.
(e) To try charges against high officials of the Union of Soviet Socialist
Republics for offenses committed in the discharge of their duties.
44. The supreme court of the Union of Soviet Socialist Repulics shall function
through —
(a) Plenary sessions of the supreme court of the Union of Soviet Socialist
Republics.
(&) Civil and criminal departments of the supreme court of the Union of
Soviet Socialist Republics.
(c) Military division.
45. In its plenary session the supreme court of the Union of Soviet Socialist
Republics shall consist of 15 members, including 1 chairman, 1 vice chairman,
the chairmen of the plenary sessions of the supreme courts of the constituent
republics, and a representative of the joint state political department of the
Union of Soviet Socialist Republics (see art. 61). The chairman, vice chair-
man, as well as the other seven members, shall be appointed by the presidium
of the Central Executive Committee of the Union of Soviet Socialist Republics.
46. The attorney general of the supreme court of the Union of Soviet Socialist
Republics and his deputy shall be appointed by the presidium of the Central
Executive Committee of the Union of Soviet Socialist Republics. The duties of
the attorney general of the supreme court of the Union of Soviet Socialist
Republics shall include the rendering of opinions on all questions subject to
the decision of the supreme court of the Union of Soviet Socialist Republics,
to support accusations at its sessions, and in case of nonagreement with the
decisions of the plenary session of the supreme court of the Union of Soviet
Socialist Republics, to appeal to the presidium of the Central Executive Com-
mittee of the Union of Soviet Soc'alist Republics.
47. The right to submit questions specified in article 43 for examination by
the plenary session of the supreme court of the Union of Soviet Socialist Re-
publics is reserved only to the initiative of the Central Executive Committee
of the Union of Soviet Socialist Republics, its presidium, the attorney general
of the supreme court of the Union of Soviet Socialist Republics, the attorneys
general of the constituent republics and the joint state political department
of the Union of Soviet Socialist Republics.
48. Plenary sessions of the supreme court of the Union of Soviet Socialist
Republics set up special legal tribunals (benches) for examination of:
(a) Criminal and civil cases of exceptional importance affecting by their
nature two or more of (he constituent republics; and
(b) Cases of personal legal liability of the members of the Central Executive
Committee and the council of people's commissars of the Union of Soviet
Socialist Republics.
The acceptance by the supreme court of the Union of Soviet Socialist Re-
publics of these cases in its procedure, can take place solely by special reso-
lution, in each case, of the Central Executive Committee of the Union of Soviet
Socialist Republics or its presidium.
Chapter VIII. — The people'* commissariats of the Union of Soviet Socialist
Republics
49. For the direct conduct of the separate branches of state administration
included in the sphere of the council of people's commissars of the Union of
Soviet Socialist Republics, 10 people's commissariats are set up, enumerated
in article 37 of the present constitution, which shall act in accordance with
the statutes regarding people's commissariats, confirmed by the Central Execu-
tive Committee of the Union of Soviet Socialist Republics.
50. The people's commissariats of the Union of Soviet Socialist Republics
shall be divided into (a) Federal people's commissariats for the entire Union
INVESTIGATION OF COMMUNIST PROPAGANDA 119
of Soviet Socialist Republics, and (6) joint people's commissariats of the Union
Of Soviet Socialist Republics.
51. The Federal people's commissariats for tlie whole Union of Soviet Social-
ist Republics shall be the following:
Foreign Affairs.
Army and Navy.
Foreign and domestic trade.
Transport.
Posts and telegraphs.
Note. — In the matter of regulating domestic trade the people's comniissiariat
for foreign and domestic trade of the Union of Soviet Socialist Republics en-
joys the rights of a joint people's commissariat of the L'nion of Soviet Socialist
Republics.
52. The joint people's commissariats of the Union of Soviet Socialist Re-
publics shall he the following:
Supreme council of national economy.
Tabor.
Finances.
Workers' and peasants' inspection.
Central statistical board.
53. The Federal people's commissariats of the whole Union of Soviet Socialist
Republics shall have their plenipotentiary representatives in tiie constituent
republics, who shall be directly subordinated to the Federal people's com-
missariats.
54. The organs of the joint people's commissariats of the Union of Soviet
Socialist Republics, which fulfill their functions in the territory of the con-
stituent republics shall be the people's commissariats of the same name of
these republics.
55. At the head of the people's commissariats of the Union of Soviet Socialist
Republics, stand the members of the council of people's commissariats— the
people's commissars of the Union of Soviet Socialist Republics.
56. Attached to each people's commissar, under his chairmanship, is set up
a collegium, the members of which are appointed by the council of people's
commissars of the Union of Soviet Socialist Republics.
57. The people's commissar has the right to take personal decisions on all
questions within the competence of the corresponding commissariat, reporting
them to the collegium. In case of nonagreement with one or other decision
of the people's commissar, the collegium or individual members thereof, without
suspending the execution of the decision, may lodge a protest with the council
of people's commissars of the Union of Soviet Socialist Republics.
58. Decrees issued by individual people's commissariats of the Union of
Soviet Socialist Republics, may be repealed by the presidium of the central
executive committee of the Union of Soviet Socialist Republics, and by the
council of people's commissars of the Union of Soviet Socialist Republics.
59. The decisions of the people's commissariats of the Union of Soviet
Socialist Republics may be suspended by the central executive committees or
the presidia of the central executive committees of the constituent republics,
whenever such decisions are in manifest conflict with the constitution of the
Union of Soviet Socialist Republics, with the legislation of the Union of Soviet
Socialist Republics, or with the legislation of the respective constituent re-
publics. The central executive committees or the presidia of the central execu-
tive committees of the constituent republics shall immediately report such
suspension to the council of people's commissars of the Union of Soviet Socialist
Republics and to the corresponding people's commissar of the Union of Soviet
Socialist Republics.
60. The people's commissars of the Union of Soviet Socialist Republics shall
be responsible to the council of people's commissars, to the central executive
committee of the Uuion of Soviet Socialist Republics, and the presidium thereof.
Chapter IX. — The joint state political department of the Union of Soviet
Socialist Republics
61. In order to combine the revolutionary efforts of the constituent republics
in the fight against political and economic counterrevolution, espionage, and
banditism, a joint state political department (O. G. P. U.) is created, attached
to the council of people's commissars of the Union of Soviet Socialist Republics,
120 INVESTIGATION OF COMMUNIST PROPAGANDA
the chairman of the department entering the council of people's commissars of
the Union of Soviet Socialist Republics, with the right of advisory vote.
02. The joint state political department (O. G. P. U.) of the Union of Soviet
Socialist Republics shall direct the activities of the local branches of the
State political department (<;. P. U.) through its representatives attached to
the councils of people's commissars of the constituent republics, acting in accord-
ance with a special statute ratified by legislative act.
0.'i. The control of the legality of the acts of the joint state political depart-
ment of the Union of Soviet Socialist Republics shall be exorcised l>\ the
attorney general of the supreme court of the Union of Soviet Socialist Republics
on the basis of a special decree made by the central executive committee of the
Union of Soviet Socialist Republics.
Chapter X. — The constituent republics
04. Within the territory of each constituent republic the supreme organ of
authority of the latter shall be the congress of Soviets of the republic, and
during the intervals between congresses its central executive committee.
05. The interrelations between the supreme organs of governmental authority
of the constituent republics and the supreme organs of authority of the Union
of Soviet Socialist Republics are defined by the present constitution.
<>0. The central executive committees of the constituent republics shall
elect from among their number their presidia, which during the intervals be-
tween the central executive committee sessions shall constitute the supreme
organs of governmental authority.
07. The central executive committees of the constituent republics shall
establish their own executive organs, which shall be the councils of people's
commissars, consisting of the following :
Chairman of the council of people's commissars.
Vice chairmen.
Chairman of the supreme council of national economy.
People's commissar for agriculture.
People's commissar for finance.
People's commissar for trade.
People's commissar for labor.
People's commissar for internal affairs.
People's commissar for justice.
People's commissar for workers' and peasants' inspection.
People's commissar for education.
People's commissar for health.
People's commissar for social welfare.
Director of central statistical board.
And also, with an advisory or deciding vote, according to the decisions
of the respective central executive committees of the constituent republics,
the plenipotentiaries of the people's commissariats of the Union of Soviet
Socialist Republics for foreign affairs, army and navy, foreign and domestic
trade, transport, and of post and telegraphs.
OS. The supreme council of national economy and the people's commissariats
for trade, finance, labor, workers' and peasants' inspection, and the central
statistical board of the constituent republics, while subordinate to the central
executive committees and councils of people's commissars of the constituent
republics, shall, in their activities, carry out the instructions of the corre-
sponding people's commissariats of the Union of Soviet Socialist Republics.
00. The right of amnesty, as well as the right of pardon and rehabilitation
in regard to citizens condemned by the judicial or administrative organs of the
constituent republics, shall he the prerogative of the central executive com-
mittees of these republics.
Chapter XI. — The emblem, the flu;/, and the capital of the Uiiion of Soviet
Socialist Repiiblics
7U. The stale emblem of the Union of Soviet Socialist Republics shall con-
sist of a sickle and hammer mounted on a terrestrial globe illuminated by
sun rays and surrounded by ears of grain: the ears are intertwined with rib-
bons bearing the inscription in the six languages mentioned in article 34,
"Proletarians of all countries, unite!" Above the emblem is a 5-ppinted star.
71. The flag of state of the Union of Soviet Socialist Republics shall lie of
red or scarlet cloth; in the upper corner at the staff are a golden sickle and
INVESTIGATION OF COMMUNIST PROPAGANDA 121
hammer, surmounted by a 5-pointed star with a golden border. Proportion of
width tr» length is 3 : 12.
72. The capital city of the Union of Soviet Socialist Republics shall lie the
city of Moscow.
(Skvirsky Exhibits Nos. 1. 3. 4. 5. 7. 8. 9. and 10 made a part of
committee's files.)
TESTIMONY OF A. DANA H0DGD0N
(The witness was duly sworn by the chairman.)
The Chairman. Please give your name.
Mr. Hodgdon. A. Dana Hodgdon.
The Chairman. You appear here under subpoena?
Mr. Hodgdon. Yes, sir.
The Chairman. What is your official position in the State Depart-
ment ?
Mr. Hodgdon. Chief of the visa office of the State Department.
The Chairman. How long have you held that position ?
Mr. Hodgdon. Since July 1, 1930'.
The Chairman. What were you doing before that ?
±VIr. Hodgdon. Assistant chief of the visa office.
The Chairman. How t long did you hold that position?
Mr. Hodgdon. From February. 1929.
The Chairman. Are you familiar with the testimony of Mr. Sim-
mons before this committee ?
Mr. Hodgdon. Yes, sir ; I have read it.
The Chairman. Do you agree with the facts that he presented
before the committee ?
Mr. Hodgdon. Mr. Chairman, am I asked to testify now in open
session or executive session ?
The Chairman. Why. this is an open session ; we called you here
for that purpose. That is why you were subpoenaed.
Mr. Hodgdon. In this connection, gentlemen, I told the secretary
of State of this subpoena and of Mr. Fish's statement that I was
asked to testify in open session, and he directed me, as secretary of
State, to say that Mr. Simmons and Mr. Kelley — Mr. Simmons
being my predecessor and chief of the visa office — both gave to this
committee all the testimony that was asked of them at that time.
He further instructed me to state I was at liberty to testify before
this committee, to amplify Mr. Simmons's testimony, or to add to
it in any way that your committee may desire, in executive session.
He further instructed me to say that I am not at liberty to testify
in open session to the committee, since such testimony, if published,
would be contrary to the public interest.
The Chairman. So you do not w r ant to answer questions in regard
to carrying out the laws of the United States in a public hearing (
Mr. Hodgdon. No, sir.
The Chairman. You do not want to answer how the State Depart-
ment carries out the laws enacted by the Congress of the United
States, in a public hearing?
Mr. Hodgdon. For the reason the Secretary of State believes that
the publicity in that connection would be contrary to the public
interest.
122 INVESTIGATION OF COMMUNIST PROPAGANDA
The Chairman. Well, the Secretary of State wants the public to
understand it is contrary to the public interest to have the public
know how the laws of Congress are carried out?
Mr. Hodgdon. Yes, sir. I should like to add that
The Chairman. Just one minute; I will have to take this up
with the committee.
Mr. Hodgdon. I should like to add to that, Mr. Chairman — be-
cause of the nature, certain nature, of the means by which it is
necessary to administer these laws.
The Chairman. All I can say to you is that I was at the hearing
when Mr. Simmons testified and I observed nothing of a confiden-
tial nature, nothing that he testified to, as far as I remember, that
should not have been testified in a public session, and the very reason
you were asked to appear here was so that we could use the informa-
tion in making up our report.
Mr. Hodgdon. You knew, Mr. Fish, the Secretary had replied to
your request to make public that information, in a similar way.
In other words
The Chairman. Well, I made a request of the Secretary, in writ-
ing, that the testimony of Mr. Kelley and Mr. Simmons be made
public.
Mr. Hodgdon. Yes, sir.
The Chairman. I understood that Mr. Kelley desired his testi-
mony to be made public, the man who testified desired it himself,
and I was very much surprised to receive a letter that it was against
the public interest to have it made public.
Mr. Nelson. In what way is it against public interest? I would
like to understand that. Could you explain that to us as to what
way that could do any harm ?
Mr. Hodgdon. I think that would be testifying before the com-
mittee.
Mr. Nelson. You are not even at liberty to tell in what way it
would do harm ?
Mr. Hodgdon. In executive session, sir.
Mr. Bachmann. The witness is detailed here, in ansAver to the
subpoena, by the Secretaiy of State. He says his testimony is against
the public interest or ought not to be heard in public. I do not
know what his testimony is, but I think the department is entitled,
until we know what his testimony is, to be protected in that respect.
The Chairman. I do not think the committee differs with you
on the general premise, but the committee believes it is entitled to
know why it is against the public interest to answer questions as to
facts in regard to the carrying out of the laws of the Congress of
the United States.
Mr. Eslick. Public laws of the United States.
Mr. Nelson. Public duties.
Mr. Bachmann. As a general principle, that is true; but there
may be something here he has in mind, that no member of this com-
mittee is familiar with, that for some reason he needs to be protected.
The Chairman. The committee is not going to stultify itself by
attempting to force it at the present time without consultation fur-
ther with the State Department on this.- The commitee will again
make request of the witness if he can present any reason why it is
against the public interest for him to answer questions from the
INVESTIGATION OF COMMUNIST PROPAGANDA 123
committee in regard to the carrying out of the laws of the Congress
of the United States by the State Department?
Mr. Hodgdon. I think I have answered that in the testimony.
The Chairman. What is your answer?
Mr. Bachmann. Mr. Chairman, I reallv do not think it is a fair
question, because the question assumes something that may or may
not be the fact. I do not think the witness ought to be compelled to
answer your question. I am just as much interested as you are in
this whole thing, but Ave have to be fair.
Mr. Eslick. I do not think this witness is in the least to blame;
he is only carrying out the instructions of his superior.
The Chairman. Positively he is not to blame.
Mr. Nelson. The situation must be that the larger part of any
answers this man would give, there would be no reason why he could
not give in public. If there are certain things that may come up in
his testimony that do not want to be given in public, you can easily
tell what thej 7 are, and he can say he is not prepared to answer in
public; but the larger part of his testimony we are entiled to and
the public is entitled to.
Mr. Eslick. But, in the last analysis, this witness is simply carry-
ing out the instructions of his superior.
Mr. Nelson. Absolutel}\
Mr. Hodgdon. Thank you, sir.
The Chairman. The question has already been propounded by
Mr. Nelson, and his answer is it is against the public interest to make
that statement.
Mr. Nelson. Manifestly it is not against the public interest to give
us the great mass of information we want. If there is some one
thing there — two things or three things — that are against the public
interest to reveal, he can tell us.
The Chairman. The question I asked has already been answered.
I do not mean to insist on an answer to the question that has already
been answered. The committee is of the opinion the witness should
not be forced, under the subpoena, to answer pending our taking the
matter up further with the State Department.
Mr. Bachmann. I do not think you can force him to answer pub-
licly, myself. It is not a question of whether the witness wants to
give you the information ; he says he will give it to you in executive
session. That is not a denial to answer. He wants to give you the
information, and so does the State Department, but says it is in-
formation he can not give you in public.
Mr. Hodgdon. That is correct, sir.
Mr. Bachmann. All you can do is to stop there until you find
out what his testimony is in executive session ; then you can proceed,
if you want to and make it public.
The Chairman. I do not know that we have that authority at
all under our power. I am in accord, as a member of the Committee
on Foreign Affairs, with the suggestion he should not be required
to answer. Whether this committee should take this matter up fur-
ther with the State Department, and whether we should hear the
gentleman in executive session, is a matter for the committee to
decide. The committee has already informed the State Depart-
ment, the majority of them, that they do not want to hear the
124 INVESTIGATION OF COMMUNIST PROPAGANDA
testimony in executive session and decline to hear it in executive
session.
Mr. Bach. mann. As a member of this committee, I do not know
anything about what information he is going to give us.
The Chairman. Do you want to hear him in executive session?
Mr. Bachmann. I do not know what testimony he is going to give.
The Chairman. Do you want to hear him in executive session?
Mr. Bachmann. If he has anything that will help this committee
to reach a conclusion, I would like to hear it.
Mr. Eslick. But. after all, if we can not use it, what is it worth
to us?
Mr. Bachmann. The question of whether we can use it is to be
determined after we get it.
The Chairman. Certainly.
Mr. Eslick. How can we use it ?
Mr. Bachmann. Who is going to stop you?
Mr. Nelson. Let us find out what there is in the evidence that is
objectionable.
The Chairman. I am going to send back Mr. Simmons's statement
to the State Department, to the Secretary of State, and ask him
kindly to read it over and find out what is objectionable in Mr.
Simmons's statement to the committee in executive session and what
is against the public interest in publishing the whole thing.
Mr. Hodgdon. I think I have a copy of it, if you will tell me the
pages.
The Chairman. Mr. Simmons's entire statement from the begin-
ning to end. It is very brief — going from page 375 to page 396.
Part II. volume 3. We would like to know what there is in that
statement of his that is against the public interest to publish, and we
would like to hear from the Secretary of State.
Mr. Hodgdon. In executive session?
The Chairman. No; we want to find out what statement Mr. Sim-
mons made before the committee in executive session is against the
public interest to publish openly, and using it as far as the public is
concerned ?
Mr. Hodgdon. Mr. Chairman, would not that have the effect, if
that was pointed out, of giving you publicly a document which you
could publish?
The Chairman. No; you can write it in a confidential note to the
committee or to the chairman of the committee.
Mr. Bachmann. Well, we can meet with him in executive session
here and have him point it out ; he can come in executive session and
point out to the committee what they consider objectionable.
The Chairman. You want the Secretary of State to appear?
Mr. Bachmann. Anybody.
The Chairman. He is speaking for the Secretary of State ; he gets
his orders from the Secretary.
Mr. Bachmann. But he wants to come before the committee, in
executive session, and point out to the committee what it is that is
objectionable.
Mr. Nelson. I think we ought to have the Secretray of State point
it out.
INVESTIGATION OF COMMUNIST PROPAGANDA 125
The Chairman. If you want the Secretary to appear before this
committee, we can decide that later. You take that up to the Secre-
tary of State and ask him if he has any objections to anything stated
there by Mr. Simmons being published; and, if he has, point it out in
a confidential letter.
Mr. Hodgdon. Would there be any objection to your making that
request in writing?
The Chairman. I think that will be the way to do it; then the
committee can determine later on whether they will ask the Secretary
of State to appear himself and show any objections he may have to
publishing that document.
(The committee thereupon went into executive session, at the con-
clusion of which an adjournment was taken subject to the call of the
chairman.)
119651— 31— pt 1, vol 5 9
PROVIDING FOR AN INVESTIGATION OF COMMUNIST
PROPAGANDA IN THE UNITED STATES
thursday, december 18, 1930
House of Representatives,
Special Committee to Investigate
Communist Activities in the United States,
Washington, D. C.
The committee met at 10 o'clock a. m., Hon. Hamilton Fish, jr.
(chairman) presiding.
TESTIMONY OF HON. THOMAS L. BLANTON
(The witness was duly sworn by the chairman.)
The Chairman. Just state your name.
Mr. Blanton. My name is Thomas L. Blanton and I am of law-
ful age.
The Chairman. An American citizen?
Mr. Blanton. A Member of Congress from the seventeenth district
of Texas, and have been for 13 years, off and on.
The Chairman. Mr. Blanton, have you any information to furnish
this committee?
Mr. Blanton. I have received a letter from one of the most re-
sponsible, creditable, substantial citizens of the United States, who,
by the way, is a Republican, but, nevertheless, prominent and sub-
stantial and creditable.
Mr. Eslick. And reputable?
Mr. Blanton. And reputable, and is one of the leading citizens of
Philadelphia, Pa., and is my friend and has been my friend for years,
and I have absolute confidence in him. He has appeared before this
committee previously, and since appearing has sent me, unsolicited, a
letter which he said contained data that he had overlooked bringing
before the committee, and he would like very much if I would bring
it before the committee and get their permission just merely to insert
it in the record as a part of the hearing, and I am performing the
request of this Republican friend of mine in doing so.
The Chairman. You want that to be included in his testimony?
Mr. Blanton. Has his testimony been printed yet ?
The Chairman. No.
Mr. Blanton. I would like this to be printed as an addendum to
his testimony.
The Chairman. It is on the same subject?
Mr. Blanton. Yes; on the same subject. This is from Mr. Francis
Ralston Welsh, of No. 20 South Fifteenth Street, Philadelphia.
The Chairman. All right; it will be so received and put in the
record with that notation.
127
128 INVESTIGATION OF COMMUNIST PROPAGANDA
Mr. Blanton. That it comes as an addendum to it.
The Chairman. Yes.
Mr. Blanton. Thank you very much.
(The statement referred to was inserted in the record as part of
Mr. Welshes testimony.)
TESTIMONY OF JUDGE PAUL M. W. LINEBARGER
(The witness was duly sworn by the chairman.)
The Chairman. Will you give your name ?
Judge Linebarger. Paul M. W. Linebarger.
The Chairman. Do you represent any organization appearing
here ?
Judge Linebarger. I am the legal adviser of the National Gov-
ernment of China, but I wish to appear here as an American citizen.
The Chairman. You are an American citizen ?
Judge Linebarger. I am, since 1735, my forebears.
The Chairman. Are 3^ou a lawyer?
Judge Linebarger. I am.
The Chairman. And have you a residence in this country?
Jud^e Linebarger. Yes; I own a residence at No. 200G R Street
NW, Washington, D. C.
The Chairman. When did you first go to China?
Judge Linebarger. About a quarter of a century ago. I went out
to the Philippines as the judge of the seventh district in 1901, and
I resigned on the 1st of January, 1906, to become the legal adviser of
Sun Yet Sen, the founder of the Chinese Republic, and I have been
identified with China, either overseas China or China itself, ever
since that time.
The Chairman. What do you mean, more specifically, by " over-
seas China " ?
Judge Linebarger. Well, our 60,000 Chinese here now are over-
seas Chinese. We have millions of Chinese overseas.
The Chairman. Are you more or less familiar with the Chinese
in America ?
Judge Linebarger. Very closely since 1907.
The Chairman. Will you tell the committee whether there is any
indication of communism or communistic activities among the Chi-
nese in this country?
Judge Linebarger. If the honorable chairman will permit me, I
would like to refer, in answering that question, to the transcript of
the testimony given in this very excellent record on page 66, in which
exhibit Costello No. 1 appears — page 66, Part 5, Volume II, of this
committee's record.
Mr. Bachmann. Where were those hearings held?
Judge Linebarger. In Snn Francisco. There is a caption on this
exhibit Costello No. 1, A Night in Soviet China and, if it pleases
the committee, I should like to answer this question, very pertinent
question, very briefly, by indicating the errors that may come up
in the minds of the American people in believing that the Chinese
are communistic in China ; whereas, they really are simply opponents
to what we call the unequal treaties.
The great difficulty in my labor — I am laboring both for my coun-
try and for China — the great difficult}' in my labor of bringing
INVESTIGATION OF COMMUNIST PROPAGANDA 129
China and America together is the fact that neither China under-
stands America, nor does America understand China.
The Chinese have been continuously charged with communism in
America ; more particularly from the year 1918, when I went up
into Canada to obtain the removal or abrogation of an order of the
Canadian Government, abrogating the right of the Kuomintang to
continue, which involved the imprisonment of over half a hundred
Chinese. Since that time, there have been intermittent indications
of what Americans would call communism, but what I think should
more justly be termed an indiscreet or ill advised attempt on the
part of certain Chinese to show the grievance they have against the
unequal treaties. You will notice here how cleverly in this Costello
Exhibit Xo. 1
Mr. Baciimann. Do I understand from your testimony it is be-
lieved generally in the United States that the Chinese have been
mixed up in this communist movement ?
Judge Linebarger. The charge is made not infrequently, as you
will notice here in this exhibit. This is just one of a considerable
number of accusations made in that regard. Here it is alleged that
35 Chinese (p. 65 of the report just referred to) attended this
soviet China night and, if it pleases the committee, I would like to
explain how cleverly the soviet workers try to antagonize or, rather,
try to stir up a spirit of animosity between America and China, by
claiming that the Chinese in America and elsewhere are communistic.
Mr. Baciimann. Where; over there, or here in America (
Judge Linebarger. Here in America and elsewhere. For exam-
ple, I had, before I left Nanking, referred to me as legal adviser of
the National Government, a very, very serious situation involving
practically the annihilation of the Kuomintang in the Federated
Malay States, involving the deportation of the president of the
Kuomintang in Singapore, as well as one of the leading directors of
the Kuomintang, on the ground there was communistic activity, of
which there was none whatsoever. That is to say, if the soviet can
stir up a feeling of distrust against the Chinese authorities through
their laws or syndicalism, or what corresponds to them, their general
effort is in that direction.
Mr. Bachmaxn. Let me ask you right there: Another thing that
may not be clear to me, or I may not understand you, you say if the
Soviets can stir up unrest among the Chinese. Do you mean to use
that term literally?
Judge Linebarger. Soviets?
Mr. Bachmann. Yes.
Judge Linebarger. It is all done under the direction of the
Soviets.
Mr. Bachmann. Or do you mean the communists?
Judge Linebarger. Well, the Soviets are the communists. I can
not understand how anyone can be a part of the Soviet Government
without being a communist, in our American sense of the word.
Mr. Bachmann. Well, all soviet citizens are not communists.
Judge Linebarger. Well, that enters into a field of controversy,
of course, that it would take a long while to overcome, and I am
not an expert in these fine distinctions. I know what communism
is, as we understand it in China, and know what we are fighting in
130 INVESTIGATION OF COMMUNIST PROPAGANDA
China, and although your fine distinctions can be drawn and you
have just as many varieties of Soviets as 3^011 have followers of any
religion, I come before this committee not wishing to embarrass it
with too much explanation.
Mr. Bachmann. I just w T ant to get straight what you intended to
mean by using that term.
Judge Linebaroer. Here is the situation : I come to you with a
fund of information that would take me weeks and weeks to tell
you anything at all about, a fund of information that has been ac-
cumulated in 25 years' dealing with another world, a world that
even this honorable committee does not understand. Consequently,
whatever I say will have to be said very briefly; because, if we were
to get entangled and enmeshed in these Chinese conditions, I am
sure this committee would find it tedious and tiresome.
But getting back to this Costello Exhibit No. 1, you notice how
cleverly the communistic workers, evidently comparatively well-
educated communist workers, bring in twice the gunboat treaty
idea. You notice in the second paragraph the words " We must
demand the immediate withdrawal of American gunboats and
marines from Chinese water." Now, that is a slogan that has been
in China ever since the days of Caleb dishing, and that goes back
into the forties. The Chinese believe they have a right to govern
their country, just as we Americans believe we have a right to govern
our country, and they can not govern their country until the gun-
boats in China are there only with the permission of China. At
the present time they are there against the will and Avish of China.
You find another reference to gunboats in this Costello exhibit,
along the line of that testimony, I believe; in all events, you have a
charge of the American Imperialist Government — another usual
argument that the soviet uses against Americans in their effort to
win over China as their great ally. And let me say here that if the
soviet is successful in making a full alliance with China, the whole
fa^e of the globe would be changed in very short order; nothing
could withstand it then. China represents one-quarter of the popu-
lation of the whole world. Man to man, they are just as good as
we are.
Mr. Bachmann. What proportion of the population did you say ?
Judge Linebaroer. One-quarter of the population of the whole
world/ 450,000.000. I really think it is nearer 500,000.000 than
450,000,000.
Mr. Bachmann. Well, it is pretty hard to find out?
Judge Linebaroer. Yes ; very hard. And if the soviet can obtain
the full alliance of the Chinese, the eventual results will be very
contrary to those that our forebears in this country contemplated
when they struggled to form our constitutional Government, which
we still hope will continue forever.
Referring again to this exhibit and to the clever way in which it
brings out the unequal treaty argument, to develop animosity
against Americans and to put in the hearts of all Chinese the feeling
of a grievance against America, you see how they have invited them
to a Chinese banquet and concert. That is the penultimate para-
graph of that exhibit.
Now, I gave a two hours' speech about a month ago to the
Kuomintang. That is the only political party we have in China.
INVESTIGATION OF COMMUNIST PROPAGANDA 131
The Chairman. What is that, the Nationalist Party \
Judge Linebarger. Yes ; the Nationalist Party, founded by the
great leader Sun Yet Sen, whom we think is the greatest man of all
time and with whom I was identified for 18 years — from the time I
resigned as judge until he died, March 12, 1925. It is the trustee
party of the Chinese people. Our Chinese masses are not ignorant;
the} 7 are illiterate, but not ignorant. You can not say that even
the Chinese coolie of the very lowest sort is ignorant, because he is
only illiterate; he has that wonderful Chinese brain that picks up
anything like a sponge, absorbs anything. It does not take him any
time at all to catch on to a new trade. And, in order to protect those
masses we have this party over there. This Kuomintang Party is
acting as trustee of the masses for the development of China, through
what we call a period of tutelage. The Chinese, as political work-
ers, are remarkably strong in the solidarity and they are exceedingly
clever; they are just as clever in politics as they are in business, and
I think the world agrees there is no one quite as clever in business
as the Chinese merchant.
As a final word, in the matter of this Costello exhibit, let me say
I doubt, in view of the fact I was in San Francisco just a month ago
addressing the Kuomintang organization there, just about a month
ago, as their guest, or as being with them — I doubt if there were 35
Chinese that came to that soviet China night, and San Francisco
is the largest Chinese center we have in the United States of America.
The Chairman. You doubt if 35 Chinese came ?
Judge Linebarger. It says 35 Chinese came. If those 35 Chinese
came there, they came there for the purpose of identifying them-
selves with the movement against what we call " gunboat treaties ; r
they did not come there as communists, I do not think.
Mr. Bachmann. Right at that place, Judge : Do you think there
are any Chinese communists in the United States?
Judge Linebarger. I think, Mr. Bachmann, and I am very safe
in saying that the number of Chinese communists is very negligible,
when you consider the fact they are merely identifying themselves,
from time to time, with communistic forces, in order to abolish the
unequal treaties.
Mr. Bachmann. You would not think, then, there were very many
in the United States ; that is, actual Chinese/ communists identified
with the party \
Judge Linebarger. At the present time, since we have won the last
great war, that is to say, the last stage of the 17 years of war in
China, they have vanished; they have lost face, as we say in Chinese —
they have lost face and got out; joined with us, or else lost face, and
are just innocuous. I doubt if you attempted to assemble, unpro-
voked, a conference of Chinese communists here in America, that } 7 ou
could get even a score or so.
Mr. Bachmann. The reason I asked that question was this : I had
an opportunity to visit in New York City, last June, the Seventh
Annual Convention of the Communist Party in Madison Square Gar-
den. Was there the whole night and saw the whole proceedings, and
1 counted about 12,000 people in there attending that convention.
There was a delegation in there that marched down the aisle carry-
ing banners, the same as they do at political conventions, where you
have seen different delegations march down the aisle with banners.
132 INVESTIGATION OF COMMUNIST PROPAGANDA
There was a delegation of what I took to be Chinese. Some may
have been Japanese, but there were some Chinese in the delegation.
There were 48 in that delegation that we counted. Now, that is just
one place — in New York City, at that convention.
The Chairman. Furthermore, it is known that they have Chinese
instructors at the workers school in New York, who teach some of the
main classes there.
Judge Linebarger. This very pertinent inquiry is something I will
have to answer in a double-barreled manner. My first answer will
be in regard to those slogans. I have here some clippings that just
came in from a New York clipping bureau, two of them did, in regard
to slogans, which consists of letters I have written to two papers here,
that will interest you I think, Mr. Bachmann. There is one of them
and here are two others [submitting] — one in answer to mine, a
scurrilous sort of answer.
Mr. Nelson. Mr. Chairman, I do not think we ought to spend any
more time on this. We found very few Chinese communists in the
United States. This gentleman has spent the most of his time in
Chine and does not claim to be thoroughly familiar with all the
Chinese of the United States.
Judge Linebarger. That is true.
The Chairman. I think you are quite right, but I think we would
like to hear from him, though, in regard to whether he thinks the
Chinese Government is able to resist communism over there and, if
not, what effect it w T ould have on this countrj 7 .
Judge Linebarger. Will the chairman just permit me here to give
the additional answer to this question proposed by Mr. Bachmann?
It will only take about 20 words.
The Chairman. I do not see why you should, because you know
very little about the situation among the communists in this country.
Judge Linebarger. Very little.
The Chairman. And I do not know why you should testify as to
that; because, if we wanted to get that information, we would get
Chinese here. What we particularly w T ant to hear from you is what
strides communism is making in China and how it affects the United
States.
Judge Linebarger. The question then being as to what the condi-
tion of communism is in China at the present time, I shall answer by
calling your attention to the fact that China is not a country, or a
land, or anything in the geographical sense as we know a nation in
the western country. It is more than all that; it is a continent. It
constitutes a continent within itself, and a continent that does not
have very quick methods or, in fact, any quick methods of general
communication. And right while I am speaking now, conditions
may be very different in certain parts of China than they were when
I left there. But I can give you one great authority for saying to
you that the National Government of China can control communism
in China.
Mr. Bachmann. It can, or can not ?
Judge Linebarger. It can — can control communism in China.
About 12 weeks ago, I had to go to the battle front of Liuho, where
Gen. Chiang Kai Shek, whom I wish you to remember is one of the
greatest strategic generals the world has ever known, was making his
INVESTIGATION OF COMMUNIST PROPAGANDA 133
final drive and, at the close of a very hard day, when we were down
in this shelter eating a meal, with a little- candle behind a big pillar,
I was feeling pretty weak and, for want of something better to say,
I said " General, when you are victorious in this war, do you think
you can handle the communists? ' He put down his chop sticks and
looked at me with a smile, saying " It will be a very small matter
compared to what I have in hand now." So that is enough for me.
When Gen. Chiang Kai Shek sa3 7 s he can put the communists down, I
believe it is right ; because there is no question but what his record of
the past shows he knows what the necessary program is to be, and
whether or not he will be victorious.
Mr. Eslick. Have you any idea as to the number of communists in
China?
Judge Ltxebarger. Any man with an empty stomach will be any-
thing at all. We have probably in China two or three hundred mil-
lions that are existing on just a little less than what is necessary to
sustain life from our viewpoint.
Mr. Eslick. Well, are they accredited communists?
Judge Linebarger. They are not communists, except they have the
slogan which is before them constantly, " Share property," which is
veiy attractive to them, because that means something to eat. Com-
munism would not exist in China were it not for the three great allies
of famine, want, and hunger, which are there at the present time and
which will disappear just as soon as America is awake to the fact
that its generosity and philanthropy can be profitable to the Ameri-
can people in China. There is no place in the world where America
can invest its money with greater safety and greater assurances of
large and profitable return than in China.
Mr. Nelson. Well, Soviet Russia has been active among the Chinese
people for some years ?
Judge Linebarger. Yes ; the Russians are our next-door neighbors
there and, of course
Mr. Nelson. Well, they have emissaries and teachers and men mov-
ing around there fomenting trouble.
Judge Linebarger. A wonderful organization.
Mr. Nelson. And that is going on all the time?
Judge Linebarger. That is going on all the time, 24 hours a day.
Mr. Nelson. And if those Chinese, or a part of them, are not com-
munists, it is not the fault of Russia.
Judge Linebarger. To the contrary, Russia's greatest desire, or
the Soviet's greatest desire, is to obtain that enormously precious prize
of China's splendid ports. When they have that, they will rule the
world.
Mr. Nelson. Are the Russians directing the movement of those
so-called reds in China ?
Judge Linebarger. They are Chinese converts. The Russians who
are in China are susceptible to the very closest control.
Mr. Nelson. And this is a Russian red movement in China?
Judge Linebarger. Yes.
Mr. Nelson. And they make some converts to communism and
there are thousands of others who are trying to improve their own
living conditions?
Judge Linebarger. Yes.
134 INVESTIGATION OF COMMUNIST PROPAGANDA
Mr. Nelson. And how many would you say there are in China-
several hundred thousand?'
Judge Linebarger. I would hesitate to guess, because it will
change according to conditions of the harvest, according to the
conditions, for example, of the Robert Dollar boats in China, which
can make a quarter of a million communists in one day by shooting
at them from their American ships.
Mr. Nelson. I remember having read recently of those alleged
reds wiping out 20,000 National Government soldiers. Is that cor-
rect ?
Judge Linebarger. I am afraid to answer that, because all these
reports are so exaggerated from China that I can not believe them
until I have first-hand information through the mails.
Mr. Nelson. Well, there are many thousands of those so-called
red Chinese and communists in China and they constitute a serious
problem for the National Government.
Judge Linebarger. Intensely so. During this last war, our great
concern was to try to control the communists who were stabbing us
in the back while we were fighting their allies in the front.
Mr. Nelson. Well, there are enough of them now so it is going to
require an army of two, or three, or four hundred thousand men to
campaign against them, will it not?
Judge Linebarger. Yes; it will require large armies, but armies
of short duration. I think Gen. Chiang Kai Shek, with the help of
America, will clean all the communists out, say, in 90 days after
America has come in and given some material support.
Mr. Nelson. Well, how can you do that? These communists are
men who live there, have their homes there; they are reds to-day
and go back home and go to bed. How are you going to tell them?
Judge Linebarger. By taking away from the reds their allies of
famine, want, and hunger, and taking away the unequal treaties and
making loans to China so that China can develop her own vast
resources and put people to work.
Mr. Nelson. The way to subdue and obliterate communism in
China is to improve the living conditions?
Judge Linebarger. Improve the living conditions. There will be
no communism in China just as soon as the Chinese people have
enough to eat and wear.
Mr. Nelson. And the same is true in this country, is it not?
Judge Linebarger. Yes; that is it, and it seems to me, if your
honorable committee will allow me to inject there this statement,
that if we will only help them fight their own misery in China,
America will have a market for our own products. There are
numerous people in China where we will create a market for our-
selves at home, if we only help to fight the misery in China.
Mr. Eslick. But, in that connection, do not you think charity
ought to begin at home?
Judge Linebarger. Yes, I do; and there is where it does begin —
at home — by going overseas and creating a market in China for our
own products. We are troubled with unemployment here, because,
in the largest county of the whole globe, over there they have
nothing, and they are our best potential customers and every dollar
we spend over there we will get a return on it — let me be considered
INVESTIGATION OF COMMUNIST PROPAGANDA 135
not to be exaggerating when I say we will get a return of tenfold
on it in the next generation. There is where charity begins, right
at home, because China is as much your home as anywhere else ;
because the world is no more separated, and China is part of the
economic world.
The Chairman. You think the biggest and most important objec-
tive of the Soviet Government, through the Third International at
the present time, is to convert China to communism ?
Judge Linebarger. Everything is strained and stressed to that.
The Chairman. You think they are concentrating every effort
now to try to overcome and bring China in as part of the soviet
form of government I
Judge Linebarger. I am positively satisfied that the soviet has, as
the greatest ambition of its whole history, the political full alliance
with China.
The Chairman. And you believe, if that should occur through
some catastrophe, that would be a serious menace to the United
States of America \
Judge Linebarger. I do not see how we could exist here in Amer-
ica very long with that combination against us. That would mean
India would fall in with the Soviets and that would be half of the
world against America.
Mr. Nelson. A little more than half of the world.
Judge Linebarger. Yes. Of course, we Americans will stand out
and we will make them pay heavily for any aggression that they
commit against us, but what good will that do us?
The Chairman. You are convinced, then, that if China should go
communist, line up with the Soviet Government, it would be a very
serious menace not only to our trade but to the country^
Judge Linebarger. Yes; I think it would be eventually the ruin
of this country we have struggled so hard from our forebears to
develop. It sounds like hot air but it is not. You go over there and
go through what I have, even this last summer, and you will fully
concur in my idea. You are dealing there with a quality and kind
of men that are not our inferiors, but our equals.
The Chairman. Do you find the leaders of communism among the
Chinese are apt to be college students, educated in the United States
and foreign countries?
Judge Linebarger. Yes; the leaders, propagandists, particularly
those Russia picks out, are always very clever, splendidly educated
Chinese. They not only have something of that deep Chinese classi-
cal education but they have the modern education and are very fit
and superior men, generally very youthful. But it is precocity that
has developed their education and they have that willful, aggressive
instinct that vouth and wisdom generallv develops.
The Chairman. Do you find many of the communist Chinese
leaders are educated in American universities and foreign univer-
sities ?
Judge Linebarger. I should not say many of them because there
again you have the old question of the difference between the Chi-
nese who looks with tolerance upon communism as a means of abol-
ishing the unequal treaties, and one who is a communist just from
sheer adherence to the doctrines. You see, China would not be com-
136 INVESTIGATION OF COMMUNIST PROPAGANDA
munistic in the soviet sense without a great deal of propaganda,
because the Chinese naturally are individualistic and there is no
capitalism in China except that we have imported from foreign
countries with the comfort of our gunboats and unequal treaties.
You can not have communism really in a country where there is
capitalism unless it is communism that comes from want, misery,
and hunger, such as the}' have in China.
The Chairman. Ami they would not have communism except for
the fact their next door neighbor is Russia and they are concentrat-
ing on it?
Judge Linebarger. That is truly the trouble. Communism is an
imported disease; it has been imported into America and has broke
out here as a small boil ; but in China it has been imported from
Russia, and they are inoculated with it through constant contact over
the frontiers and easy accessibility.
The Chairman. Thank you very much.
Judge Linebarger. I want to thank the members of the committee
for the privilege of appearing before you this morning, and I wish
"to say that I hope this committee may be made permanent. I think
it is the most important committee, outside of the Appropriations
Committee ; it is the most important committee at the present time in
America, and I have looked over the record you have developed and
I think this committee is in such splendid hands that it should be
made a permanent committee and should cooperate with China, and
we will have an opportunity to cooperate with you there.
Mr. Bachmann. That is a nice thought, Judge, but serving on a
permanent committee and putting in the time that we have in the
labors of this committee, you do not know what you are wishing on us.
(The following are the clippings submitted for the record by Judge
Linebarger:)
I. ! XEBARGER LETTER ON RED MENACE PROVOKES RETORT
Washington, D. C, December 10, 1930.
Editor the News: It appears that Mr. Paul Linebarger is back in town, and
bas modestly let the fact be known by offering to save us from the red menace.
It is too bad that Mr. Linebarger was not furnished with that " premonitory
information" of the "transpiration" of Chinese 1 participation in the "com-
munistic demonstrations '" at the Capitol. If that had been done, then "we"
in China might have enjoyed an auto-da-fe worthy of the " destructive forces"
of capitalism.
Since when, however, I wonder, is it the duty of an American citizen — as Mr.
Linebarger goes impudently on to proclaim himself — to pay the Snooper for a
reactionary foreign government? Aiul is Mr. Linebarger, I wonder further, the
agent that Chiang Kai-shek — the recent convert to Methodism — has sent to
Washington to arrange for a loan of $360,000,000? If so, I have an idea that
it might be better for the American taxpayers to let our Chinese communists
(if any) alone and to deport Mr. Linebarger.
A. D. G ABM AN.
LIXEBARGER WOULD DEPORT ANY CHINESE IN BEDS PROTEST
Washington, D. C, December .7, 1930.
Editor, The News : I have heard of published and other rumors that certain
Chinese took part in the communistic deinonstrat'on at the opening of Con-
gress.
I doubt this very much, for I think that I would have had some premonitory
information if the same were to transpire. I shall be very grateful to any-
INVESTIGATION OF COMMUNIST PROPAGANDA 137
one who can give me any information concerning the identity of these alleged
Chinese, so that I can promptly apply for deportation papers and have the
guilty ones deported back to Ch na, where we have a method of dealing with
the destructive forces of communism which has proved very successful.
Please note that I write this letter as an American citizen, desirous of a
further perpetuation of the friendship which China feels and always will feel
toward America.
Paxil Linebarger.
[Letters to the Editor]
CHINESE GOVERMENT AND PEOPLE MISREPRESENTED BY COMMUNISTS AT THE CAPITOL
DEMON STRATION
To the Editor of the Post.
Sir: As an American, and not in my official capac ty, I beg through this public
letter, to correct the impression that in the communist demonstration at the
Capitol, at the opening of Congress, any Chinese supported such demonstra-
tion, with banners bearing such slogans as " Down with Chinese Exclusion."
I shall not excuse the alleged presence of Chinese at this unlawful gather-
ing, by claiming that they were Koreans, or Filipinos, or Asiatics other than
Chinese ; for such a suggestion would be unfair even if it could be proved.
Moscow is very cunning, and it would not be surprising if a few unworthy
Chinese could be found, who would lend themselves for hire, to combat not
only the interests of their 450.000,000 patriotic and law-biding brothers, but
indeed align themselves with the whole destructive movement of communism.
The banner with the slogan " Down with Chinese Exclusion " is a clever ruse
of the soviet, to alarm the American people into believing that China is seek-
ing to break down the exclusion laws. In fact, there is no issue at all in
this regard, for the very efficient National Government of China (which will
compare favorably with any other government on the planet), recognizes
America's right to take such steps as are necessary to protect the economic
life of its citizens. The National Government of China is not seeking to
dictate any policy which the great American people consider to be contrary
to its own domestic needs according to American judgment. Cooperation with
the constitutional control of America is the aim of our National Government
of China, which is certain that our American people will so assist us in stabil-
izing constitutional government in China that, with improved Chnese economic
conditions in China, it will be no longer necessary for the Chinese to migrate
overseas. With the enormous virgin wealth of China, ready for development as
soon as the extraterritorial treaties are abrogated, China will need every,
one of its hundreds of millions, and will provide for them all better at home
than they can be provided for in foreign lands.
So let it be understood that this clever ruse from Moscow has nothing what-
soever to do with any ambition of the Chinese people, who only want to be
in the employment of their own land, just as we Americans believe that we have
a full right to the enjoyment of cur own country.
Paul Linebarger,
Legal Adviser National Government of China.
TESTIMONY OF ANDREW IRSHAY
(The witness was duly sworn by the chairman.)
The Chairman. State your full name.
Mr. Irshay. Andrew Irshay, Trenton, N. J.
The Chairman. Do you represent any organization?
Mr. Irshay. No, sir.
The Chairman. Are you an American citizen ?
Mr. IrshaY. Yes, sir.
The Chairman. Are you native uorn?
Mr. Irshay. Naturalized.
The Chairman. How long have you been an American citizen?
Mr. Irshay. Since 1919.
13S INVESTIGATION OF COMMUNIST PROPAGANDA
The Chairman. Where do you live?
Mr. Irshay. In Trenton, N. J.
The Chairman. What is your business?
Mr. Irshay. Newspaper editor and publisher.
The Chairman. How long have you been in that business?
Mr. Irshay. I have been in that business most of my life.
The Chairman. Do you own a newspaper?
Mr. Irshay. I own a newspaper. I just reorganized it into a
bilingual newspaper, Hungarian and American. I am reorganizing
it now to make a 2-language paper.
The Chairman. What was it before — Hungarian?
Mr. Irshay. American.
The Chairman. What information can you furnish the committee
in regard to communist activities in your vicinity?
Mr. Irshay. I believe I can furnish the most peculiar phase of
< ommunism that exists anywhere in the world. I have brought with
me some of the documents and clippings from newspapers. The
peculiar part of it is this: Hungarian communists are working
within the organizations, such as churches, lodges, political organi-
zations — Democratic and Republican. Their leaders, the heads, the
presidents of these so-called communistic organizations, are members
of the churches, are office holders in churches, office holders in lodges,
office holders in political Republican and Democratic organizations;
they are inside, in something respectable, legitimate, and honorable,
and they are boring from within. Thereby the danger is much
greater than if they had stayed outside and tried to show their faces
or to press their influence upon people in some legitimate way.
The Chairman. Now you are speaking of people of Hungarian
origin, are you not?
Mr. Irshay. I am speaking of people of Hungarian origin, mainly ;
that is true.
The Chairman. And communism is quite widespread among a
certain class of Hungarians?
Mr. Irshay. The Hungarian labor class, more than the trades-
men.
The Chairman. That is, among the Magyars; you are not refer-
ring to the Hungarian Jew in particular, but to these Magyars?
Mr. Irshay. Including the Jews.
The Chairman. Including the Jews?
Mr. Irshay. Because the Hungarian Jew is such a nationalist that
he never says he is a Jew, unless he is in church. The Hungarian
Jew is a Hungarian all the time.
The Chairman. When you refer to Hungarians, you include the
Jews, but it is just as widespread among the Magyars?
Mr. Irshay. The Magyars are in the majority ; of course, the Jews
are in the minority, but the Jews are the big leaders in New York ;
the most of them are of Jewish origin, because they have been con-
nected with this movement from the time the communist government
was in existence in Hungary.
The Chairman. But in Trenton there are not many Jews there,
are there; they are mostly Hungarians?
Mr. Irshay. Very few Jews there.
The Chairman. What is the population in Trenton ?
INVESTIGATION OF COMMUNIST PROPAGANDA 139
Mr. Irshay. The estimate is about 15,000 of Hungarian birth.
You have to take into consideration that after the war Hungary
has been split up into four parts, and, although they have been born
in Hungary, they are now classed as Roumanians, Czeschoslovakians,
Austrians, and Jugoslavs. Like myself, I was born in Hungary,
but at present that part of the country I was born in is Czecho-
slovakia.
The Chairman. Where were you born, up in the Carpathian Hills ?
Mr. Irshay. Not the Carpathians; I was born on the plains of
Hungary, further up there near Sciget on the border line. Where
1 was born, that city is on the border line of three countries — Hun-
gary, Czechoslovakia, and Roumania.
The Chairman. Now, proceed and give us the facts about com-
munist activities among the Hungarians in Trenton.
Mr. Irshay. The communists in Trenton are determined to com-
munize everything there is in Trenton and all over the State of
New Jersey, because Trenton is the center for all Hungarian com-
munists in the State of New Jersey, especially. There are 26 inter-
state lodges, and they get in there as officers — they are presidents,
treasurers, and secretaries — and by being on the inside in the high
positions the}^ can direct the membership or intimidate the member-
ship to play along with them. And it happens we have a society that
has 6,500 members, adult members, and that society is now quivering,
it has an element that is quivering, afraid the whole organization
will be handed over to the reds. And the main influence is this
paper, which is the biggest Bolshevik paper, subsidized Bolshevik
paper, anywhere on the face of the earth; this one here [exhibiting].
Mr. Bachmann. What is the name of it ?
Mr. Irshay. Uj Elore.
The Chairmax. What is the circulation?
Mr. Irshay. The circulation, according to the sworn post-office
statement of last October, the semiannual postal statement, was
39,000 and something daily.
Mr. Bachmann. A man bv the name of Bebrits is the editor of
that (
Mr. Irshay. He is one of the occasional editors; when he is not in
jail he is editor; when he is in jail somebody else is editor. This
paper is full of some terrible stuff. The paper has been suppressed
once during the war. I was influential' in getting this paper kept
out of the mail, but it worked only for two weeks. The mail was
denied to them in 1917, and then restored. This paper is the biggest
menace there is, because the paper is read by those people who have
not read newspapers in the old country, or studied. Some of them
are. peasants, have been peasants at home, and some of them are
mechanics of some kind, they have learned a trade, and those people
have not read newspapers at home, and now this is the only paper
they read, and it is full of this revolutionary propaganda. Naturally,
they believe it; just like other people believe the Bible, they believe
this paper. Now, what happens? It .is full of agitation* terrible
agitation. I wish I could just submit the whole entire translation
of any copy. Here are three copies of this week [exhibiting].
The Chairman. Is it a daily paper or weekly paper?
Mr. Irshay. It is a daily paper — seven times a week.
140 INVESTIGATION OF COMMUNIST PROPAGANDA
The Chairman. Seven times a week; it is published on Sunday,
too?
Mr. Irshay. Sunday, too. This paper is causing all the trouble.
It demands that everything should be run by them and they are
sending their editors to all these lodges. When they are going to
have meetings in Trenton and all over the United States, there is a
list of them, and he can pick out all the meetings that will be held for
the next month all over the United States, and they send their men to
agitate, and the main purpose is to turn everything over, the whole
Hungarian life of the United States should be directed by com-
munists. That is their main purpose. And if they can't fight by
words, they fight with fists, and there is a lot of bloody fighting.
Mr. Bachmann. Well, the Hungarian people themselves are op-
posed generally to any movement of that kind, are they not, in the
United States?
Mr. Irshay. Those Hungarian people in the United States who
have lived here during the war and have become naturalized, they
are upholding the American Government in every shape or form;
but these newcomers that have come in since the Soviet Government
was in existence in Hungary there is a big job for the Immigration
Commission, for the United States Government. These are the big-
gest agitators, because those men who lived here through the war,
they know better; they know the actual America; they came over
before and got to know the actual America and not the eighteenth
amendment America. That is one of their stamping grounds ; that is
where they start at first. I have to mix up those two ideas, because
these Bolsheviks, it may interest the committee to know, these same
leaders in Trenton and all around, are distillers and big bootleggers
in Trenton, so you can not separate the red Bolshevik from red
whisky.
The Chairman. You mean the communist leaders in Trenton ?
Mr. Irshay. Are the biggest distillers.
The Chairman. Are bootleggers?
Mr. Irshay. Are bootleggers; and are not only bootleggers, but
they are in the manufacturing business.
Mr. Nelson. Are the great majority of the Hungarian communists
aliens?
Mr. Irshay. The great percentage of them are aliens. I should
say about 75 per cent of those I followed up are aliens. Those that
are American citizens are afraid; they are not so familiar with the
law and they are afraid if they come out openly for communism
their citizenship papers may be revoked ; so even if they are, they
keep it to themselves and are very careful in committing themselves.
The Chairman. The fact is that communism has made consider-
able inroads among people of Hungarian origin in the country?
Mr. Irshay. It is spreading very fast.
The Chairman. And it is mostly in the last two or three years, is
it not ?
Mr. Irshay. Well, mostly in the last two or three years.
The Chairman. The increase ?
Mr. Irshay. The increase; the rapid increase is in the last two
or three years, but it started since the Hungarian Government was
in the hands of the Soviets.
INVESTIGATION OF COMMUNIST PROPAGANDA 141
The Chairman. How long has this Uj Elore been running?
Mr. Irshay. That has been running for 25 years.
The Chairman. For 25 years ?
Mr. Irshay. It has been a socialist, and since the Soviet Govern-
ment in Hungary came into existence they went along with the
government, and they were the mouth piece, the mouth organ, of
the Hungarian Soviet Government when Bela Kun was President.
Since that time they were communists ; up to that they were revolu-
tionary socialists; they were an Industrial Workers of the World
group.
The Chairman. Have you any translation there of particularly
revolutionary articles that you would like to submit to the commit-
tee, so that the matter could be taken up as to what action should be
taken by the committee ?
Mr. Irshay. Well, Mr. Chairman, when I saw you the other day
I telephoned to Trenton to send me such papers, and they got here
last night. These are this week's papers, and here is wiiat 1 have
underscored. I read them all up until this morning and underscored
everything of interest and value, and I could go to work and trans-
late all this thing, and would be glad to, but I could not accomplish
it because the time was too limited. But I have enough material.
Mr. Bachmann. How would it be to let him translate some of
those articles he has reference to and submit them to you, and if you
think there is anything that ought to go into the record, put it in?
The Chairman. I wish 3^011 would translate one or two of the more
radical ones you think the committee should know about and which
might affect their recommendation.
Mr. Irshay. All right.
The Chairman. It is not necessary to do it now.
Mr. Irshay. Here is one that will interest you especially, as far as
the strategic part of their work is concerned :
Our party is directed directly from Russia ; it is not from New York. We
are now 12 years in existence as the Hungarian Communist Party. We do not
call ourselves the Russian Communist Soviet; we are the Hungarian branch
of the Hungarian working class and we are fighting ourselves without any out-
side help. That is why we can not be destroyed. Throughout the world,
wherever they are Hungarians, they have pledged allegiance to us and will
keep on with the fight.
This is from this week's paper. Here it takes up the Fish com-
mission, giving it half a page :
The Fish commission is connected internationally with the organization of
which the Whalen commission was part, Matthew Woll was, and the papal
delegate.
I don't know whether they meant the Pope of Rome or some other
pope they had in mind. I can not say who this pope is, because it is
not spelled with a capital letter, and there may be some other pope.
The Fsh commission directs a campaign against soviet America —
Not Soviet Russia, but soviet America —
first of all, from a business point of view. But the Fish commission is not
only trying to suppress labor all over the United States but they are directly
causing or preparing war with Soviet Russia. The Fsh commission has spent
months to convince the population of America that the Communist Party is a
party of criminals and of gangsters; with this propaganda they prepare to
suppress communism in general.
119651— 31— pt 1, vol 5 10
142 INVESTIGATION OF COMMUNIST PROPAGANDA
So much for that; but this is the trend, you see. They are doping
these people and its readers do not know any better and they take
it for a whole lot.
The Chairman. Before you read another one, it is evident from
what you said that a large number of those Hungarians are
Catholics.
Mr. Irshay. The most of them.
The Chairman. There is a certain amount of communism in the
Hungarian Roman Catholic Church?
Mr. Irshay. It is the greatest thing in the world. The Roman
Catholic Church in Trenton — I am speaking fearlessly, because I
have no fear of contradiction at their hands — the trustee of the
St. Stephens Roman Catholic Church of Trenton comes to con-
fession, for instance, whenever he feels he must confess, to Father
Sabel, and this blame sheet is sticking out of his pocket.
The Chairman. Are you a Catholic ?
Mr. Irshay. No. sir; I am a Protestant, but I like them just the
same, because I have a great many dealings with them. I am just
referring to this particular instance. When a Catholic is a
Bolshevik, or red, then I have no mercy for them : but it is not
with any idea of prejudice I am speaking when I speak of
Catholics. This man is the trustee of this church ; he handles all
of the money, and there is plenty of money he handles of the
church, because it is the biggest Catholic Church in the United
States, because it has 3,600 members.
The Chairman. The biggest Hungarian Catholic Church?
Mr. Irshay. The biggest Hungarian Catholic Church in the
United States; they claim it is. This man handles all of the money,
and he reads this paper, is a faithful reader of the paper, and would
not give it up for all of the money in the world. I have asked him
several times — I would not mention his name — "How can you recon-
cile your faithfulness to the Catholic Church and to this sheet?"
"Well," he says, "that is nothing; they are preaching good things;
the church is preaching good things." " Well," I says, " they are
not that kind of good things in themselves that the two, together,
would make a better one good thing." I explained it to him in such
a manner that he did understand it, that they are entirely opposite.
" Well," he says, " our church, after all, is part of that communistic
philosophy." Now, then, you go and talk to a man like that. This
sheet has made them dizzy all over the United States. I can tell
a man if he reads this paper, I can tell him by talking one word to
him; I can tell whether he is affected by this or not, because he has
a type of thinking, a type of mind which is twisted all the way
around.
The Chairman. Have you any suggestions to make to the com-
mittee or any recommendation?
Mr. Irshay. I have a suggestion to make which I think is a good
one. I think this paper, in the first place, should be checked up on
and anything that warrants some further action. The suppression
of this paper, to about a million people of Hungary, probably, would
do them more good than anything else.
Mr. Bachmann. You mean to stop it from going through the mails,
or interstate commerce?
INVESTIGATION OF COMMUNIST PROPAGANDA 143
Mr. Irshay. Interstate commerce and through the mails. It has
been done once, and should be done again, because it is the most
dangerous propaganda sheet in the country, admittedly, by far;
because their readers are members of churches, and they are breaking
up the churches and lodges, or trying to.
Mr. Bachmann. Is it not true that a good many of your people
get the conception, too, that if the Government of the United States
permits the United States mail carrier to bring a paper like that to
their door, that it is all right ?
Mr. Irshay. That is what the opinion is of the people. They say
4 ' We can become communists, because communist candidates are on
the ticket, so the Government O. K.'s it ; it is all right. It is a free
country." That is the way they are thinking; that is what this paper
is preaching. That is one of my suggestions.
The other would be, as I have endeavored to do, if there is any such
way, educating these people through the Government Printing Office.
The Government Printing Office should, from time to time, or regu-
larly, issue some sort of informative articles, to be broadcast through
these lodges and organizations, calling the attention of those people
to the danger from every angle if they follow this propaganda up —
not antagonizing them, because that would not do much good. They
are just like tigers; if they see flesh, they get wild. You should not
antagonize them, but only give a lot of information as to the priv-
ileges and responsibilities as American citizens, and those that are
not American citizens, chase out as far as you can, because they are
the trouble makers. There are plenty of reasons in the deportation
law. The best thing that could be put across, and I am a believer in it.
The Chairman. What about the registration of aliens?
Mr. Irshay. Positively so. I am a foreign-born man; but I say
the most blessed thing in the world — I put up an argument for it,
that everybody must be convinced. I was talking this week to an
alien — this will interest vou, gentlemen — I was talking to a man
this week in Trenton that came into the country illegally, yet that
man believes in the registration of aliens, and I can produce my man
to any committee. He says it is reasonable, and he believes in the
registration of aliens. He says, "I could not run around in this
country if this country would be Hungary, Germany, or France; I
would have to check out in every city I leave at police headquarters."
" Now," he says, " if it is all right in Europe, why shouldn't it be
all right in America % " That is the greatest argument in the world
for the registration of aliens. If anybody says it is not democratic,
he does not know what he is talking about.
The Chairman. In fact, there is not a single civilized country in
the world that has not registry for aliens except the United States.
Mr. Bachmann. Do you understand, when you talk about the
deportation of aliens, that it is necessary for the Government of
the United States first to get the consent of the government to which
they are going to deport?
Mr. Irshay. I understand that.
Mr. Bachmann. Before you can deport the alien?
Mr. Irshay. Yes, sir; I understand that.
Mr. Bachmann. And you know it is an expensive proposition to
proceed and prepare to deport an alien?
Mr. Irshay. But, let him bo made to work for it.
144 INVESTIGATION OF COMMUNIST PROPAGANDA
Mr. Bachmann. You know the Government of the United States
can not deport an alien to those countries with which we have no
diplomatic relations?
Mr.lRSHAY. In this case it would be Hungary, and Ave have diplo-
matic dealings with Hungary. But, as far as that is concerned, they
should be made to work their way over, or to earn transportation.
And if they do not wish
Mr. Bachmann. You know, too, in making that recommendation,
that all the Government can take care of now, under the present
personnel and appropriations, is to deport the aliens that are in the
insane asylums and penal institutions?
Mr. Irshat. They are sending them in there on purpose to be
deported. There is a case in Trenton right now where the father
sent his son to the crazy house last week, when he had served the
United States Navy with an honorable discharge, because the son
stood in the way of the father being a Bolshevik and running around
in Trenton, and the father thought him to be undesirable and had
him locked up in the State Insane Hospital as insane, which is the
outgrowth of communism right along.
Mr. Bachmann. Right along that line, you suggest that we can
better our deportation laws : How can it be done, from your
experience ?
Mr. Irshat. I think the deportation laws should be revised in
such a fashion that each State or each county takes into custody
those undesirables, and puts them into the workhouse to break
stones and earn the money, and, when he has done that, in cooperation
with the Government, they can deport him. They should do it,
because they are multiplying overnight.
Mr. Bachmann. For what offense should they be deported?
Mr. Irshat. First of all, for treacherous propaganda; next, for
this illegal activity they are in. Most of them are in some illegal
activity, such as bootlegging, or getting people over from Canada,
bootlegging people in from Canada, and they will be intermingled
with each other in crooked dealings. A Pennsylvania newspaper
writer told me this week it is the hothouse there; that the city of
Coatesville has many, many people who have gotten into the country
here through some agent that he has in Canada, either in Windsor,
Ontario, or Detroit, and brings anyone in — that is the headquarters —
and he is giving them jobs in the mill and collecting revenue from
them; that most of them go down there because they know they are
protected. Now, if the Government don't get after them, they will
be an independent republic.
Mr. Eslick. About what is the population of Trenton ?
Mr. Irshat. The population of Trenton, according to the last
census, is 136,000.
Mr. Eslick. How many communists do you estimate there are in
Trenton ?
Mr. Irshat. Well, as far as numbers are concerned, visible num-
bers I can speak of, I should say about 200 I know of who are
Hungarian reds; but the invisible are in the majority. That is
understood — that there are more invisible ones than visible.
Mr. Nelson. That is, you think there are 200 real reds there in
Trenton — Hungarian reds ?
INVESTIGATION" OF COMMUNIST PROPAGANDA 145
Mr. Irsiiay. Hungarian reds that they could check up easy, I
think. I should say there are more. There are 600 copies of this
paper that come into Trenton every day; so you see, gentlemen, I
am very conservative in my suggesting how many. Six hundred
copies come into Trenton by mail every day. Now, I take only every
third person, because the way he propagates — what he reads in the
morning paper, he propagates it in the shops. It could easily be
checked up.
Mr. Eslick. In the last two years, have they increased rapidly?
Mr. Irsiiay. They have. They have increased through this policy
to concentrate on the lodges, getting the lodges to be controlled by
Bolsheviks.
Mr. Eslick. Would you say, in the last two years, the communists
have doubled in Trenton?
Mr. Irshay. More than that.
Mr. Eslick. More than that ?
Mr. Irshay. Yes; because it is getting to be a menace there to
live among the Hungarians. I happen to live in the American sec-
tion; I would not live among them, because my little boy told me
a little while ago — when I lived in a certain section where they had
all kinds of elements — he told me, " Daddy, let us move out of this
neighborhood.'" , I said, "Why!' 51 He said, "I don't want to live
among foreigners "—my own boy. I said, " What is the trouble
with living among foreigners? ' He told me why; he gave me the
reasons why, showing that an American-born child, if he is intelli-
gent, right now realizes there is a menace to that child's future.
And that is why. There are a lot of things that can be brought up.
The Chairman. Thank you very much.
(The following papers were submitted for the record by Mr.
Irshay:)
Trenton, N. J., December 21, 1930.
Hon. Hamilton Fish. M. C,
House Office Building, Washington, D. C.
My Dear Congressman Fish : Inclosed please find translation of several arti-
cles and extracts from the Uj Elore, the Hungarian communist daily. It seems
to me that there is enough treason in these articles to warrant action against
the publishers by the Government.
You will be interested to know that as I returned to Trenton from Wash-
ington, the reds around here got busy and sent threats of various sorts to me
by way of warning. One of the largest dried fruit and hop, malt and sugar
merchants, who took my testimony very much to his heart, and who is supply-
ing many or most of the distillers with "stuff," got real scared reading the
newspaper account of my testimony before your committee.
I shall continue to be on guard against the menace which is agitating many
a patriotic American at present.
Wishing you, Congressman, and the other members of the committee con-
tinued success in this direction, and hoping to be of future service in this
connection. I wish to remain, with sincerest best wishes of the season,
Faithfully yours,
Andrew Irshay.
[From the Uj Elore Hungarian communist newspaper, December 16, 1930]
Our party is no longer directed by foreign influence, and our battles are now
being waged by our own people. On this twelfth anniversary of the founding
of Hungarian communism we can boast with leadership of our own people,
chosen from our own midst. And this is the reason why we are indestrictible.
The Communist International is hopeful of victory which will restore the
second Hungarian Soviet republic.
146 INVESTIGATION OF COMMUNIST PROPAGANDA
[Same organ, December 12]
The counter-revolutionary Industrial Party of Moskau had its trial re-
cently which reaffirmed the belief of the class-conscious workers the world
over whereby the imperialistic governments are determined to make war with
Soviet Russia with France as the leader. It was discovered that such war is
planned to commence during the year of 1931 with the participation of American
capitalists. Admiral Pratt, Secretary Wilbur, and Secretary Hyde, of the
Hoover Cabinet, in their recent public utterances have indicated that this war
organization is being sponsored by the American Government. Even the Fish
commission is in closest cooperation with this international war-making con-
spiracy. The Fish commission has been leading an aggress ve campaign against
Soviet-American commercial relations. The Fish commission is not only de-
termined to subdue American labor, but also prepares tor war against the
Soviet Union. The Fish comm'ss on spent months to convince the people that
the Communist Party is composed of criminals and terrorists. This was done
in order to discredit the Communist Party.
The Communist Party is preparing the workers of America for the day when
the majority (workers) shall rule over the m'nor ty, and the capitalistic gov-
ernment will have to play its last trump card, war. The communists are pre-
paring for the proletarian revolution in accordance with the principles laid
down in the declaration of independence whereby it becomes the duty of
the workers to remove the government in order to set up a more safe and secure
rule for the workers' protection. The future security of the working class lies
only in the establishment of a proletarian dictatorship and the setting up of a
soviet government.
[News item, same, December 15]
EEn NEWSPAPER BUILDING CLUBS ORGANIZED
In order to raise the circulation of the F>aiiy Worker to 60,000 paid copies,,
there are being formed in New York City and other sections of the country
red newspaper building clubs. In this campaign we rind the workers of every
nationality participating. Hungarians should do their part as they must realize
that it is as important to spread this revolut'onary newspaper amongst the
native-born Americans as it is to spread the Uj Elore in the Hungarian com-
munities. Only the Daily Worker writes the truth in the language of the
country. Let us acquaint our children with this (Daily Worker) revolutionary
newspaper so that they learn the truth from the workers' own organ and not
from the capitalistic newspapers which only infects their mind with the
poisonous stories of malice and hate which they spread. We should train our
children in class conscious manner lest they turn against us on the picket line
or on our war front. The best method in training our children thus is by giving
them the Daily Worker.
CALL FOR MOBILIZATION TO WHITE AND BLACK WORKERS NATIONAL CONFERENCE
FOR PROTECTION OF THE FOREIGN BORN
Fellow workers, remember that the bosses and the Government are out to
defeat you and destroy the lives of the 9,000,000 of unemployed workers of
America. They are determined to annihilate you before you have won the
battle of freedom by way of starving you out. But the bosses shall not suc-
ceed. Workers, you must unite in order to defeat your oppressors, such as
Cable, Aswell. Blease, and the Fish committee, with their proposed legislation
whereby you would be discriminated against in many ways. They want such
laws as alien registration, ringer printing, and mass deportation. * * * The
number of negroes lynched, burned at stake, and hanged increases daily in
the South and throughout the West. And if these bosses would succeed in
subduing the 50,000,000 of foreign born by terrorizing them into submission,
the negroes would be open to any sort of cruelty at the hands of the capi-
talistic Government. The watchword of the bosses is : Divide them and rule
over them. Against this we should choose the following watchword : Unite
and fight.
INVESTIGATION OF COMMUNIST PROPAGANDA 147
Our mission is as follows : We must mobilize the many hundreds of thou-
sands of white and negro workers throughout the United States of America
and join the local branches of the league for protection of the foreign born.
If we present a solid front at the time these above-stated measures are intro-
duced in Congress, then we will be ready for the struggle against those dis-
criminatory laws, either through mass demonstrations or otherwise. You
should demand that all laws be repealed which tend to discriminate against
the foreign-born worker, no matter in what way that affects the alien. Or-
ganize protest meetings and mass demonstrations at every opportunity, and
especially when some one is to be deported. Protest against deportation of
aliens ! Whenever some one's naturalization papers are revoked stage a
large demonstration in front of the courthouse where such an act was com-
mitted. Demand freedom and security for all political refugees in the United
States. * * *
The Chairman. I have some papers here which I desire to submit
to the committee and take up with them whether they should go into
the record. Here is a statement I believe would be very helpful,
taken as a translation from a Russian paper here called "The New
Russian Word," by a former Chekist leader, one of the leading men,
by the name of Agabekoff. I know about Agabekoff ; I know people
who know him verv well. I read this last night verv carefully, and
it is a complete history written by him about six months ago about
the life of the G. P. U.. and his entire history of all the different
sections, the American section, and it is very interesting. I think it
would be very helpful to have it in the record, not as being respon-
sible for the translation, but I know the man who wrote it is one of
the leading Chekists who left them about six months ago.
Mr. Bachmann. Let us put it in for what it is worth.
The Chairman. Is there any objection?
Mr. Nelson. You say it purports to be a translation ?
The Chairmax. From an article written by G. Agabekoff, formerly
a leader of the Russian G. P. U.
Mr. Nelson\ And published in The New Russian Word of October
13, 1930, New York City ?
The Chairman. Yes.
(The paper above referred to is as follows:)
The G. P. U., Formerly the Cheka, the Secret Police of the Russian Soviet
Government
[Novoye Russkoye Slove, The New Russian Word, October 13, 1930, Xew York City (a
liberal Russian Newspaper) ]
O. G. P. U. — Reminiscences of the Chekist, G. Agabekoff
internal organization of the ogpu
The united state political department (O. G. P. U. or OGPU) is the most
important department of the Soviet system, occupying the entire hlock between
Bolshcy and Maly Lubianka.
THE BUILDING AT LUBIANKA
The chief building faces Lubiansky Square, in the back of which is the
OGPU " territory " extending to the " Select Hotel " on Srentenka. Houses on
Versonofievsky and Milutinsky Place are occupied by commune barracks for
its workers. Thus the entire area between Lukianka and Sretenka is in fact
under the control of the OGPU.
About 2,500 persons work in the central department of the OGPU. Only
1,500 of them are communists ; the remainder are members of the Communist
148 INVESTIGATION OF COMMUNIST PROPAGANDA
Youth League and nonparty people. The nonparty people, of course, occupy the
lower positions — women typists, head office workers, etc.
The OGPU is divided into the following departments: The Intelligence service
(KRO), the foreign department (INC), the secret department (SO), the special
department (OO), the extra special department (SPEKO), the department of
economics (EKU). the information department (INFO), the oriental depart-
ment (VO), the frontier service (PO), and the executive and organization
department.
OGPU CHIEFS AND WORKERS
Menjinsky is the head of the OGPU, as is known. He has no prestige either
in the party's central committee or in the polithureau. He is always sick. He
seldom meddles with the affairs of the internal department of the OGPU,
reducing his functions as president solely to presiding over the OGPU in the
central committee (organ of the Soviet Government).
Menjinsky has two assistants. His first assistant, Yagoda, practically con-
trols the entire OGPU.
YAGODA
Yagoda is a man with an iron will, greedy for power, who would stop at
nothing to gain his ends. He is rough and uncultured. His servility to the
members of the polithureau, his personal services to Stalin, and his skill in
intrigue, of which he is a master, are what keep him in office. Yagoda dis-
covers possible rivals in time and takes prompt measures to eliminate them.
Trilisser, the second assistant to the president of the OGPU, was his latest
victim.
Yagoda gains his ends easily and feels secure in his position. He has sur-
rounded himself with devoted people, ready for anything. His secretary,
Shamin. a jack of all trades, is one of these flunkeys. In order to gain Yagoda's
favor he often arranges orgies with wine and women. The girls for these
parties are recruited from the Communist Youth League.
Yagoda is the boss in complete control of the OGPU. He is not only the first
assistant to the president, but also the head of the secret executive department,
which embraces all the departments of the OGPU except the foreign department,
the frontier department, and the special department. The board of the OGPU
is composed of the heads of the departments, the president of the OGPU, and
his two assistants.
What are the functions of the OGPU departments?
COUNTERINTELLIGENCE SERVICE
The intelligence service department carries on within the Union of Socialist
Soviet Republics, a fighting foreign espionage and counterrevolutionary out-
breaks. The field of this department is also the foreign legations in the Union
of Socialist Soviet Republics. It carries on intelligence service in them, pro-
curing information and documents. This department has a numerous per*
sonnel. All the hotel managers and the managers of the movies and the
theaters are its agents.
The intelligence service department, or, in brief, KRO, has agents in all soviet
departments, and receives data daily from its agents concerning what is going
on. It also supplies house workers, maids, cooks, chauffeurs, etc., for the for-
eign legations, and through them obtains all kinds of data, at the same time
recruiting for this service other employees of the foreign legations. Olsky is
at the head of the KRO. He is about 35 years of age, a devoted adherent of
Yagoda.
The department is subdivided into several branches, each taking care of its
own particular work. So the first branch of the KRO carries on shadowing in
hotels, theaters, and restaurants. It also opens intercepted mail, mostly the
diplomatic mail of the foreign legations, which somehow finds its way into the
OGPU. The second and third branches are occupied with work of fighting
espionage by the neighboring Baltic countries ; the third branch, for instance,
lured Savinkov and others to Russia. The fourth branch fights espionage by
the oriental countries ; the fifth, Anglo-American espionage, etc. Every branch
has its own personnel, unknown to the personnel of the other branches.
INVESTIGATION OF COMMUNIST PEOPAGANDA 149
THE SECRET DEPARTMENT
The secret department (SO) carries on the work of fighting political parties
inimical to communism, tights certain tendencies within the Communist Party
itself, and it fights religion and carries on work to corrupt it.
The work with the clergy is assigned to the sixth branch of the SO, and
the famous Tuchkov is in charge.
The secret department, like all the rest of them, is divided into branches
with strictly defined functions. Deribas, the head of the department, an old
member of the party, is interested most of all in the factions within the party,
hopiug to make capital of them, and to be promoted to the post of second
assistant to the president of the OGPU.
THE DEPARTMENT OF ECONOMICS
The department of economics (EKU) carries on work in the industrial,
trade, and financial institutions of the Union of Soviet Socialist Republics,
exposing mismanagement and reasons for not carrying out plans, as well as
fighting economic espionage in the Union of Soviet Socialist Republics. Proko-
fieff is the head of the department.
INFORMATION DEPARTMENT
The information department (INFO) keeps track of the movements in every
stratum of the public and maintains an enormous staff of secret informers. The
same department has the role of censor of literary and theatrical productions,
and censors all the mail. Alexeyev, a former anarchist, who joined the Com-
munist Party in 1920, I think, is the head. Alexeyev works for work's sake,
but does not* enjoy the confidence of the presidium of the OGPU. One of the
most trustworthy members of the party is always with him as his assistant.
One Zaporojetz, a tested Checkist, Trilisser's former assistant in the foreign
department, is such a " guardian angel " at the present time. This Zaporojetz
became famous because during Petlura's occupation he got into the good graces
of the head of Petlura's troops, and was at one time his personal adjutant.
THE SPECIAL DEPARTMENT
The special department (00) keeps track of the army and navy. The
GPU is always well informed as to the moods of the army through its army
commissars and political advisers, whose duty it is to inform this department.
The OO also inspects the supplying of the army and watches over the protection
of the army warehouses. Yagoda himself is the head of this department, but
Olsky, the head of the KRO, is practically in charge of it.
THE ORIENTAL DEPARTMENT
The oriental department (YO) carries on work in the oriental national
republics (Soviet T) and among oriental national groups. Peters is the nominal
head,' but practically the work is controlled by one Diakov.
THE EXTRA-SPECIAL DEPARTMENT
The extra -special department (SPEKO) works to protect State secrets from
being learned by foreigners, for which purpose it has a staff of agents watch-
ing over the system of filing secret papers. Another important task of this
department is the interception of foreign codes and the reading of code tele-
grams from abroad. It also composes codes for the Soviet departments within
the country and abroad.
The men occupied with these codes attached to any department are under
the direct control of the extra-special department. The extra-special depart-
ment carries on work of reading codes splendidly, and compiles weekly a list
of foreign code telegrams it has read for the information of the heads of the
GPU departments, as well as for the members of the central committee.
150 INVESTIGATION OF COMMUNIST PROPAGANDA
TRILISSER
Messing, formerly a full-fledged representative of the OGPU in Petrograd,
was, until recently, head of the foreign department (INO) and second assistant
to the president of the OGPU. The foreign department is occupied with foreign
countries alone. It has its semiofficial representatives in every legation and
important consulate, to whom aides are sometimes assigned. These repre-
sentatives, or GPU residents, occupy mostly the post of second secretary or
attache at the legations but at times take positions in trade or other economic
institutions abroad.
The work of the foreign department is to give information about the political
and economic situation in foreign countries, to procure all sorts of documents
of value to the Soviet Government, to discover the intelligence service men of
other countries sent into the Union of Soviet Socialist Republics, to inform
about the life of the emigres, to corrupt their organizations, etc. Besides the
above-mentioned specific tasks this department must also carry on the foreign
work assigned to it by other departments of the OGPU. In addition it must
keep track of the activities of soviet citizens abroad as well as of the soviet
diplomatic and trade bodies.
LEGAL AND UNDERGROUND LEGATIONS
Besides the above-mentioned official representatives the foreign department
has its " underground staff " abroad working under assumed names and using
false passports. All these secret " underground " residents enjoy special privi-
leges and confidence. Their chief task is to take root in this or that country,
to make connections and to strengthen their position so much that it would
be possible to continue their work even in case of war, and the deportation of
their official representatives. The sending of underground residents began
about two years ago, when the analysis of the situation abroad convinced
Moscow that w T ar is unavoidable. Since then " underground " residents have
become intrenched in Persia, Afghanistan, Turkey, Irak, and in western coun-
tries. The GPU agents sent abroad on such a basis do not keep in touch with
official soviet representatives.
THE CPU'S BASEMENTS
It is needless to dwell on the other departments, for they all play secondary
roles except the executive department, which controls the staff assigned to in-
vestigation work. Usually any department interested in the activities of this
or that person asks the executive department to investigate and the depart-
ment does the work. The executive department commands the garrison troops.
The garrison troops make arrests, search, and shoot to death those sentenced
in special basements under the GPU's buildings.
These basements are under GPU prisons and are closely watched by special
troops of the Red Army. Without a real reason and a special permit none of
the agents is permitted to enter the prison court, even.
CONSPIRATIVE WORK
The OGPU departments are divided into several branches. As a rule one
department must not know what the other does. Even the branches of the
same department must not disclose their activities to each other.
The OGPU has full-fledged agencies in all the national republics and in all
important centers of the Union of Soviet Socialist Republics. These agencies
are organized after the Moscow pattern, only on a smaller scale. Instead of
departments these are branches — extension branches of the Moscow depart-
ments. These full-fledged agencies controlled by Moscow have in their turn the
extension branches in the regional, provincial, and township centers on a still
smaller scale.
I have dwelt at length on the organization of the OGPU, so that the reader
could grasp its entire structure, without which it is impossible to visualize
this tremendous machinery, the work of which is not disclosed to the other
departments of the Soviet Government, and which carries on conspirative
INVESTIGATION OF COMMUNIST PEOPAGANDA 151
work even within its own walls. Glancing at its organizational plan, the
reader can see that every department has its own independent network of
secret agents. It is easy to believe, then, that there are more than 10.000
secret agents in Moscow alone. Through these people the OGPU controls
not only the routine work of all the institutions and concerns but also the
private life of every outstanding citizen, not to speak of foreigners, who are
watched even more closely than the others.
Besides all this it is necessary to remember that the police and the criminal
investigation departments are aiding the OGPU and that, according to Leninist
biddings, " every communist must be a checkist." Every communist, every
member of the Communist Youth League, nay, every "class-conscious" citizen
of the Union of Soviet Socialist Republics who learns or hears anything
against the interests of the Soviet Government is bound by duty to inform
the OGPU. There are hundreds of thousands of such volunteer informers in
the Union of Soviet Socialist Republics. They either believe that they ought
to aid the OGPU or simply cultivate good relationships with the OGPU, for
only thus can they count on a quiet, safe existence. So the seed sown by
Dzerjinsky 12 years ago bears the fruit of universal espionage; the son
betrays the father, the sister betrays the brother.
MANUFACTURING FALSE PASSPORTS
The third task of the special department is the supervision of jails and
prisons throughout the Soviet Union. A special police, which fabricates all
sorts of documents for this or that purpose necessary in the work of the OGPU
(passports, false certificates, etc.), is attached to this department.
BORKY
Borky. a former political representative of the eheka, who literally ter-
rorized Turkestan in 1911-1920, is the head of the department. Even now,
after 10 years, such stories are circulated about him in Turkestan as that
he eats raw dog flesh and drinks human blood. Despite of the fact that Borky
is only the head of a department, he reports directly to the party's central
committee and has a tremendous prestige in the OGPU.
VELE.TEV VEDERNIKOV
The frontier department (PO) has the special troops of the OGPU under
its command, as well as the frontier troops, and it carries on a fight against
smuggling. All customhouses are required to be in close contact with the PO,
and in fact are practically under its control. Velejev, the head of this de-
partment, was formerly Trileser's aide in the foreign department. It was he
who under the assumed name of Vedernikov went to Bizerta in 1924 to receive
Wrangel's fleet, and afterwards lived in China under the same name, being
one of the leaders of the Chinese revolution and an organizer of the work of
the OGPU.
NOVOYE RUSSKOYE SLOVO, THE NEW RUSSIAN VOICE HOW THE OGPU INTERCEPTS
THE ENGLISH MAIL
P.esides this, the tasks was assigned to me of organizing the network of the
OGPU in Beluchistan and of finding ways of penetration into India.
WITH WHAT WAS THE TEHERAN TRADE DELEGATION OCCUPIED?
****** *
One Dennitzsky, an old Chekist, was head of the trade delegation.
Within a month, thanks to Dennitzky's trade relations, Persian business
men in Meshed, the Gardgewees, Sadry-Tujar, Dannish, and a number of
others were recruited. They procured information necessary to us and intro-
duced us to men we needed. Just at this time negotiations for a trade agree-
ment between the Union of Socialist Soviet Republics and Persia were going on.
The Persian Government in its desire to gain concessions from the Soviet
152 INVESTIGATION OF COMMUNIST PROPAGANDA
Government organized "an economic boycott" hindering the export of Persian
goods to the soviet market. A campaign to influence public opinion along this
line was carried mi in which Englishmen played a considerable role, according
to the information of our agents. It was necessary to disorganize the boy-
cotting group. For this purpose we used the above mentioned business men.
In accordance with our orders they instigated some to break the law, bought
others and thus demoralized the camp lighting against us.
At the very peak of the boycott movement, thanks to the aid of the same
business men, we recruited Sadri-Tujar, one of the active leaders of the anti-
soviet movement. For this work we paid business men not in money but by
concessions, permitting the profitable importation of this or that sort of goods
into the Union of Socialist Soviet. Republics.
The City of Meshed is the religious center of the Mahomedan Sliiah sect.
*******
Naturally, we directed our work along this line, recruiting agents among
the mullahs for the same political purposes. The same Sadri-Tujar helped
us very much also in this enterprise. His task was relatively easy, because
he was a son-in-law of Aga-Zadi, the chief of the mullahs. Sadri-Tujar carried
out our orders through Aga Zadi. For instance, during the economic boycott
it was important for us that the business men of Meshed should themselves
send to the Persian Government a demand to enter into a trade agreement
with the U. S. S. R. This telegram to Persian Government was supposed to
express the independent opinion of business men. Aga-Zadi sponsored the
sending of three such telegrams, and the cost of it was the permit to import
500 " cubes of Persian tea into the U. S. S. R.
EMIGRE KROVJGEOV
* * * (hie Krouglov, an emigre, was sent from Meshed as a representative
of the OGPU to the region of Budjourda. To him was assigned the task of
informing as to the moods of Turkoman tribes. For this work he was provised
political amnesty in the name of the Soviet Government and the reestablish-
rnent of his rights as a soviet citizen.
AN AGENT OF THE OGPU IN PRIESTLY ROBES
A considerable amount of thinking was done in the GPU's foreign depart-
ment before the solution was found to the problems of Tabriz and India.
Archbishop Kletchian, an agent of the OGPU for about two years, was living
in France. At the end of 1028 Kletchian, provided with money, came to
Moscow to see me. I explained the matter to him. He proposed the following
plan: He would go to Erivan to see Oatholicos (the Patriarch of Armenia. T. )
and Catholicos under the pressure of the OGPU would ordain him a bishop
and afterwards appoint him legate to Persia, where he had formerly lived and
where he still had many connections. But Kletchian left his mistress in
France. The OGPU would give him one of its representatives as his secre-
tary who at the same time would pass for the fiance of Kletchian's mistress
and thus cover up the bishop's affair. Kletchian guaranteed that being as-
signed to Persia he would be able to help dismiss Bishop Nereis from Tabriz.
It would be possible to appoint Bishop Mesrer from Ispahan in Nereis' place,
while he. Kletchian, would be head of the diocese of Indo-Persia, and thus
the organization of the network of the OGPU in India would be assured.
During the preliminary talks and later when we approached the question
of payment I gained the impression that Kletchian was a scoundrel. He
differed from the ordinary rascal only by being a priest and by selling his
services at a higher price. Kletchian received 200 dollars a month from the
OGPU. According to the latest dispatches Kletchian accomplished the first
part of his program — that is, he became archbishop and is legate of the
Catholicos of the Armenian Church in Teheran. We will see what he will
do now.
INVESTIGATION OF COMMUNIST PROPAGANDA 153
WORK OF THE GPU IN TEHERAN WORK AMONG EMIGRES IN PARIS
The GPU agents working in the Dashnak Party, among the Mussavists
and Georgian Mensheviks (anti-Bolshevik organizations. T.) as well as inter-
cepted documents showed more and moie frequently that Paris is the center
of the above-mentioned organizations. It was necessary to transfer part of
our work in the Orient to Paris. This was insisted upon especially by the
Caucasian GPU, which demanded from Moscow the intensification of work in
this direction.
In 1925 Moscow called the Checkist Lordkinidze from Titlis and directed
him to Paris, instructing him to penetrate into the antisoviet organizations.
CORRESPONDENCE OK THE BOARD OF ENVOYS
In the spring of 1929 Melzer, the head of the Anglo-American branch
of the foreign department of the OGPU, was sent from Moscow to Tashkent to
organize a foreign branch in the full-fledged section of the GPU in Central
Asia. Because of his absence I had to supervise the work of the section.
Among the materials from abroad my attention was drawn to the corre-
spondence between Gheers, the chairman of the board of former Russian envoys,
and this former representative of czarist Russ'a. Agents of the OGPU would
intercept and send to Moscow the reports of Sablin, former Russian representa-
tive in London, and of Ughet, former Russian financial agent in America. At
that time Sablin in his reports was describing election campaign in England
and was analyzing the chances of the English parties. He foresaw the victory
of the Labor Party which advanced the slogans of doing away with unem-
ployment and resuming diplomatic relations with the U. S. S. R. Sablin's
reports were of enormous interest to the Soviet Government. We had orders
to send copies of these direct to Stalin, Rykov, Tchicherin, Voroshilov, and
Molotov. The Soviet Government had great hopes of the victory of the Labor
Party. It was believed in Moscow that with MacDonald in power not only
would the severe diplomatic relations be reestablished but also it would be
possible to secure extensive credits in Europe.
THE CHEKIST CHATZKY
One Ohatzky was the GPU first resident in America and lived there up to
1929. In 1929 he returned to Moscow and at the present time is in charge of
the Anglo-American branch of the foreign department of the GPU.
Inasmuch as there is not yet a soviet legation in America, Chatzky went there
as an Amtorg worker. His task in America was to familiarize himself with the
attitude of the Government of the United States of America toward the Union
of Socialist Soviet Republics and to endeavor to influence American public meu
and if possible members of the Government — that is, to have them assent to the
official recognition of the Soviet Government.
It is difficult for me to say whether Chatzky was successful or not in his
endeavors, but on his arrival in Moscow he was much praised by those higher up.
REPORTS OF THE BRITISH ENVOY
Reports of the English envoy to Washington as to the activities of the Ameri-
can Government were a permanent source of information to the GPU. It is
necessary to say that at the service of the foreign department of the OGPU
there were reports of almost ail the English representative abroad — envoys
accredited to foreign governments and commissioners to the countries under
British protectorates. I was convinced of this many times. English diplomats
without their knowledge rendered valuable service to the Soviet Government
through their detailed reports to the foreign office. In connection with events
in Afghanistan and Persia I often received assignments to compile a paper on
this problem " according to English data." I would go to the files of the foreign
154 INVESTIGATION OF COMMUNIST PROPAGANDA
department of the GPU and would take the reports of the Operator B-3, who
systematically conveyed to us the reports of the English envoys to the Foreign
Office. The reports of British diplomats 'accumulated in 1921) occupied a whole
big closet in the OGPU. Among them I also found reports of envoys of all
countries of the world and I would take those concerning the country which
interested me.
CORRESPONDENCE OF TJGHET
Ughet, the representative of the old Russian department of finance, was also
a useful source of information serving to familiarize us with the internal situa-
tion in the United States. He reported systematically and in detail concerning
the economic and political situation of the country in his letters to Gheers. the
former Czarist diplomat in Paris. These letters were intercepted and copies of
them were sent to the OGPU.
AMERICAN PASSPORTS
America occupied an exceptionally important place in the work of the Comin-
tern, although the GPU paid comparatively little attention to the country.
Almost all the representatives of the Third International travel abroad with
American passports, which give them entrance into all countries and permit
them to carry on communistic work without arousing suspicion. I have already
mentioned that Pyanitzky, in charge of the liaison department of the Third
International, considered that the easiest and most convenient way to send Roy,
the communist, clandestinely to India would be through America with an
American passport. Bucharin, who at that time was the president of the Com-
munist International, held American passports in the same high esteem. Once
in 1927, in the office of Trilisser, the head of the foreign department, Goldstein,
resident of the GPU in Germany, Velejev, Trilisser's assistant, and I came
together. The problem of sending GPU workers to Irak was being discussed.
At this moment Bucharin arrived to see Trilisser. To Bucharin's question
whether or not he was intruding, Trilisser replied that quite to the contrary,
inasmuch as we were discussing the problem of sending GPU workers clandes-
tinely to oriental countries, we would hear with great pleasure Bucharin's
opinion as to the ways of sending them. Bucharin replied that he was not
acquainted with the technique of such trips, this being Piatnizky's business, but
in the Comintern American passports are considered the best guarantee of
safety for the trips of communists abroad.
G. Agabekov.
The Chairman. Here is a letter from the chief of police of Seattle,
dated November 4, giving the names of the Russian communists con-
nected with the Amtorg and the communist leaders in Seattle, which
he promised to send us.
Mr. Bachmann. That is the same chief of police who was on the
stand at Seattle ?
The Chairman. Yes. It is short and quite interesting; just gives
the names and the positions they hold.
(The paper above referred to is as follows:)
City of Seattle, Wash., Department of Police,
November 4, 1930.
Mr. Hamilton Fish, Jr.,
Chairman Special Committee to Investigate Communist Propaganda.
Sir: Since your committee's meeting in Seattle I have continued with in-
vestigations of the communistic activities in this city and have discovered
evidence which I believe should be laid before you in order that you may keep
informed on conditions as they progress here.
You will find inclosed reports, which I am absolutely certain are correct
in every detail.
INVESTIGATION OF COMMUNIST PROPAGANDA 155
I also wish to inform you, although the information may already be in your
hands, of reasonable evidence in connecting the Amtorg Trading Corporation
with political influences of the Soviet Government of Russia.
I particularly call your attention to a man by name A. Bogdanoff, formerly
the manager for the Amtorg in the city of Seattle. Just after your committee
met in Seattle he hurriedly left Seattle, going to Mexico, and a man by name of
N. Sverdloff was appointed manager of the Seattle branch of the Amtorg
Trading Corporation, with offices at room 71S, Smith Tower Building, Seattle.
This man arrived from Moscow, Russia, not so very long ago. You will also find
inclosed in these reports names and descriptions of prominent communists in
the Seattle section.
Hoping this information will be of some value to you, I am,
Yours very truly,
Louis J. Forbes, Chief of Police.
Names and addresses of members of the Communist International in Seattle,
Wash.
1. N. Sverdloff, vice president of the Amtorg Trading Corporation (manager
of Seattle branch office), room 718, Smith Tower, Seattle. Lately appointed
and arrived from Moscow, Russia. Took place of A. Bogdanoff, who left Seattle
immediately after congressional committee commenced investigation of com-
munist activities in the United States. Member of the Communist Party and
OGPU in Moscow. Residence .
2. Belsky Peter, inspector of Amtorg in Seattle, member of Communist Party.
In charge of general information section, OGPU (clearing house). Residence:
City directory shows R-4327, Ninth Avenue NE. Very active in propaganda.
(Russian.)
3. Paul Umoff, inspector of Amtorg in Seattle, although he maintains separate
office at the White Building as a broker, room 666. Member of the Communist
Party; OGPU (clearing house in Seattle). Residence: 2221 Thirty-second
Avenue South. Very active in directing general propaganda. Keeps office at
the White Building as disguise and fense against his activity and connections
with the Amtorg. (Russian.)
4. Leon Glaser, officially in the pay roll of local Amtorg as an interpreter,
but in reality member of the Communist Party : OGPU ; in charge of the propa-
ganda section ; chairman of the special committee to fight against combinations
hostile to the Soviet Union (in every respect). Greatly praised by ZIK, Com-
munist Party, for his bold antigovernment. provocative, street, and club public
speeches. Occupation, tailer ; residence, 2615 East Pine Street, or 1529 Twenty-
seventh Avenue, Seattle. Organized in Seattle, according to orders from head-
quarters in New York, two organizations: (1) Friends of Soviet Government;
(2) Technical Aid to the Soviet Government. In both organizations he is chair-
man. Nominated as a prospective Soviet consul general in Seattle in case of
recognition by United States of America.
5. C. J. Lapidewsky, physician and surgeon ; member of Communist Party.
Ex-Russian anarchist, escaped from Russia in 1910. In 1917 joined the Com-
munist Party. Has direct connection with Moscow. Chairman of communist
international committee in Seattle. Also directs general propaganda and dem-
onstrations. Residence: 3040 Twenty-fourth Street West, Seattle, and business
office, Stimson Building. Keeps all the secret documents and instructions re-
ceived from headquarters in New York and Mexico City. His immediate chief
is Comrade Ziankin, in New York City, who is the chief operative OGPU for
North America.
6. Keltner (Netty) (Libby), (woman dentist), member of Communist Party.
Secretary-treasurer of the communist international committee, Seattle ; F of
USSR and TI to USSR ; Russian Literary-Dramatic Society. Residence : 420
North Forty-ninth Street; office, 3419 Fremont Avenue.
7. Baumzwieger August (woman dentist), member of Communist Pai'ty. In
charge of all the communist literature coming from New York, Mexico City,
and Vladivostok, Siberia. Residence : 200 Eighteenth Avenue.
156 INVESTIGATION OF COMMUNIST PROPAGANDA
8. M. Maine, member of Communist Tarty. On the pay roll of local Amtorg.
Personal friend of Sverdloff. His official standing not known. Address not
known.
0. Leon G. Gershevich, member of Communist Party, Communist Interna-
tional. Chief inspector of Amtorg in United States. All goods bought in
Pacific Northwest subject to his personal approval. From 1922 till 1928 he was
employed as bread peddler-driver by the Breaner Bakery Co., (Eighteenth and
Yesler). He is official courier between Seattle and New York City. Residence:
2717 Yesler Way. Also he has a residence in New York City. He was ap-
pointed to this high office directly by the Soviet Government. Personal friend
of Mr. Lapidewsky. Member of OGPU in America. Importing motion pictures
for propaganda purposes directly from Moscow.
10. Aron Leaf (dentist), member of Communist Party and Communist In-
ternational. Active in propaganda among the medical societies. Attends all
party meetings. In 1928 attempted to obtain American citizenship, but United
States Government refused to grant it to him. He was charged as to have
been in constant correspondence with the Soviet Government and fund of
communist literature. Residence : 3534 Thirty-sixth Avenue NE. ; office, Medical
Building.
11. Alex Aehieff (wife Natalie), chairman of the Russian section of the Com-
munist International in Seattle. Keeps and distributes general communist
literature among the members and sympathizers. Residence : 1116 East Cherry
Street.
12. Mahamed Zagsutoff, member of the Communist Party and STI to USSR;
very active in propaganda section. Fanatically believes in communism. Com-
munist Party intending to use him as " racketeer " when it will be necessary.
Residence not known. Personal friend of A. Aehieff. (Will kill.)
13. Chaika Michal, member of Communist Party and STI to USSSR; very
active in propaganda. He is always seen together with Zagoutoff and Aehieff.
Residence not known.
14. S. H. Gorny, chairman of parish council of the Seattle Russian Church,
753 Lakeview Boulevard ; chairman of the Russian Literary Dramatic Society ;
member of the FSSR and TI to USSR, secret agent of OGPU in Seattle. He
renders very valuable service to Communist Party, as he is at the head of the
Russian Church organization, the members of which are all white refugees,
and they are considered very active now against the soviet propaganda here.
Residence : 308 Twenty-ninth Avenue. Employed by the Boeing Airplane Co.
15. Gertzman, Minnie, member of FSU, STI to USSR and Russian Literary-
Dramatic Society. Very active in collecting money for Communist Party, to
use as bail when necessary. Residence : 2322 Twelfth Avenue North.
1G. Natalie Notkin (woman), member of Communist International; STI to
USSR, and F of USSR. Manager of foreign books in Seattle Public Library.
Keeps and distributes communist books among Russians (soviet sympathizers)
with propaganda purpose. These communist books are imported directly from
Moscow or Berlin, Germany. Very active in propaganda among all classes, as
she mingles and has contact with different society leaders. Residence: 1307
East Forty-first Street, Seattle.
17. Gregory Bookanoff, member of F of USSR and STI to USSR, assistant
to N. Notkin, to distribute the communist books among the Russian colony
and Finns. Residence: 605% Eastlake Avenue, Apartment E.
Respectfully submitted.
Louis J. Forbes, Chief of Police.
The Chairman. Then here is a letter from District Attorney
George H. Johnson.
Mr. Bachmann. Of San Bernardino County?
The Chairman. Yes; giving us some information that was asked
for by the committee in regard to the use of the red flag, and so
forth.
INVESTIGATION OF COMMUNIST PROPAGANDA 157
(The paper above referred to is as follows:)
County of San Bernardino,
San Bernardino, Calif., October 14, 1930.
Hon. Hamilton Fish,
Chairman Communist Investigating Committee,
United States Congress, Washington, D. C.
Dear Sir : At the recent session of your committee which was held in Los
Angeles I testified regarding the prosecution of some communists who had
been conducting a summer camp or training school for Young Pioneers. In
the course of my testimony attention was directed to section 403a of the Penal
Code of California, which was the section under which the defendants were
prosecuted, and which section, for the information of yourself and the other
members of the committee, read? as follows :
" USE OF RED FLAG PROHIBITED
"Any person who displays a red flag, banner, or badge, or any flag, badge,
banner, or device of any color or form whatever in any public place or in any
meeting place or public assembly, or from or on any house, building, or window
as a sign, symbol, or emblem of opposition to organized government or as an
invitation or stimulus to anarchistic action or an aid to propaganda that is of a
seditious character is guilty of a felony."
From some of the questions asked by members of the committee, and the
general investigation being conducted by the committee, I concluded that it
might be recommended by the committee that such a section as the statute
referred to might be recommended to Congress among other matters, as the
result of the investigation of the committee. For that reason I thought it
might not be out of the way for me to venture the suggestion that the only
question regarding the validity or constitutionality of section 403a, supra, rises
because of a possible question as to whether that section goes so far as to
denounce any activity, whether by peaceful means or otherwise, which might
tend to do or bring about the things covered by the section. In other words,
we must concede that it is within the province and constitutional right of any
person or group of persons to advocate a change in the form of government,
providing such change and such advocacy is by peaceful means, to wit, the
ballot, and not by violent means such as a revolution. A reading of section
403a, supra, will disclose, on first thought, some question as to whether or not
that section denounces opposition to organized government or an invitation or
stimulus to anarchistic action or as an aid to propaganda that is of a seditious
character by revolutionary means only. On closer consideration, however, the
wording of the statute itself tends to disclose that it seeks to denounce such
things only when they are accomplished or advocated by force and violence, such
as a revolution.
With the experience which we have had in mind, therefore, under the prose-
cution in this State, which is the only one involving these questions and the
only one so far as I have ascertained coming under section 403a, it seems to
me that some enactment along the line of section 403a, supra, might very well
be enacted by Congress among other provisions on this question. If such an
enactment is recommended by the committee, I respectfully suggest that the
same should make it more definite and distinct that the action denounced is
such as is based on force and violence. The attempt to change the government
by force and violence as well as the advocacy of such theories, it seems to>
me, could very well be prohibited without interfering with any constitutional
rights.
I have heard the expression since the prosecution under section 403a has.
been pending, that the right of freedom of speech is being interfered with.
In this connection it seems preposterous that a person who actually assassinates
a public official, or burns, or otherwise destroys a public building, may be
prosecuted and punished for such offense, while the person who furnishes the
119651— 31— pt 1, vol 5 11
158 INVESTIGATION OF COMMUNIST PROPAGANDA
stimulus and creates the desire and the inclination to do such things, can not
be reached. In this State a statute has recently been enacted by the legisla-
ture which makes it a felony for one person to solicit another person to com-
mit a felony, even though the felony is not accomplished, and I know of ao
constitutional objection to such legislation.
I am offering my observations for whatever use the committee may have
for them, and if there is any further information or assistance that yourself
Or any member of the committee feels that I might be able to furnish, I will
be pleased to have you call upon me.
If the proceedings of the committee at Los Angeles. Calif., are printed
and for distribution at a later date, I will greatly appreciate the receipt of
a copy of the same.
Yours very truly,
George H. Johnson,
District Attorney.
(The committee thereupon adjourned subject to the call of the
chairman.)
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