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INVESTIGATION OF IMPROPER ACTIVITIES IN THE
LABOR OR MANAGEMENT FIELD
HEARINGS
^-/f */ UVC^l^'dtf vi4-<.<.<-Zl BEFORE THE
SELECT COMMITTEE
ON IMPROPER ACTIVITIES IN THE
LABOR OR MANAGEMENT FIELD
EIGHTY-FIFTH CONGRESS
SECOND SESSION
PURSUANT TO SENATE RESOLUTIONS 74 AND 221, 85TH CONGRESS
DECEMBER 2 AND 3, 1958
PART 42
Printed for the use of the Select Committee on Improper Activities in the
Labor or Management Field
INVESTIGATION OF IMPROPER ACTIVITIES IN THE
LABOR OR MANAGEMENT FIELD
HEARINGS
BEFORE THE
-i.lJ.l^..:.^ SELECT COMMITTEE
ON IMPEOPER ACTIVITIES IN THE
LABOR OR MANAGEMENT FIELD
EIGHTY-FIFTH CONGKESS
SECOND SESSION
PURSUANT TO SENATE RESOLUTIONS 74 AND 221, 85TH CONGRESS
DECEMBER 2 AND 3, 1958
PART 42
Printed for the use of the Select Committee on Improper Activities in the
Labor or Management Field
UNITED STATES
GOVERNMENT PRINTING OFFICE
:i243 WASHINGTON : 1959
Boston Public Library
Superintendent of Documents
DEPOSITORY
SELECT COMMITTEE ON IMPROPER ACTIVITIES IN THE LABOR
OR MANAGEMENT FIELD
JOHN" L. McCLELLAN, Arkansas, Chairman
IRVING M. IVES, New York, Vice Chairman
JOHN F KENNEDY, Massachusetts KARL E. MUNDT, South Dakota
SAM J ERVIN, Jr., North Carolina BARRY QOLDWATER, Arizona
FRANK CHURCH. Idaho CARL T. CURTIS, Nebraska
Robert F. Kennedy, Chief Counsel
Ruth Young Watt, Chief Clerk
CONTENTS
Sheet Metal Workers International Association (Chicago Area)
Page
Appendix 15913
Testimony of —
Burrows, Carl L 157G0, 15786
Caldwell, Ray 15890
Cronin, Arthur H 15778,15790,15797, 15853
Erck, Harold 15814
Galiger, Bert 15818
Gene, Emil 15866
Howard, Martin J 15820
Jolicoeur, Wilbur 1 5840
Johnson, Cecil L 15825
Kaberlein, Joseph 1 5848
Lischett, Wallace J 15885
Merrow, John 1 5844
Moore, James L 1 5873
Tapper, Warren A 15808, 15870
Tracy, James T 15908
Troutman, Shannon J 15890
Wells, Emmett D 15878
EXHIBITS
Introduced Appears
on page on page
lA. Letter dated Maj^ 8, 1952, addressed to James P. Johnson,
second vice president, Continental Illinois National
Bank Jk Trust Co., Chicago, 111., signed by J. A. Dye,
secretary, the Coleman Co., Inc 15763 15913
IB. Check Xo.' 1015 dated May 8, 1952, payable to Continental
Illinois Bank & Trust Co., drawn by the Coleman Co.,
Inc., in the amount of $2,000 15763 15914
IC. Check requisition dated May 8, 1952, on the Coleman Co.,
Inc., form, payable to Continental Illinois Bank &
Trust Co 15763 15915
2A. Letter dated January 15, 1953, addressed to James P.
Johnson, second vice president, Continental Illinois
National Bank & Trust Co., signed by J. A. Dye, secre-
tary, the Coleman Co., Inc 15764 15916
2B. Check No. 1797 dated January 15, 1953, payable to C. L.
Burrows in the amount of $5,000 drawn by the Coleman
Co., Inc 15764 15917
2C. Check requisition dated January 15, 1953, payable to C. L.
Burrows in the amount of $5,000 on the Coleman Co.,
Inc., form 15764 15918
3A. Letter dated June 18, 1953, addressed to James P. John-
son, second vice president. Continental Illinois Na-
tional Bank & Trust Co., signed by J. A. Dye, secre-
tary, the Coleman Co., Inc 15765 15919
3B. Check No. 2492 dated June 18, 1953, payable to Conti-
nental Illinois National Bank & Trust Co., in the
amount of $5,000 drawn by Coleman Co., Inc 15765 15920
3C. Check requisition dated June 18, 1953, payable to Conti-
nental Illinois National Bank & Trust Co. in the amount
of $5,000 on the Coleman Co., Inc., form 15765 15921
nx
IV
CONTENTS
Introduced Appears
on page on page
4A. Letter dated December 30, 1953, addressed to James P.
Johnson, second vice president. Continental Illinois
National Bank & Trust Co., signed bv J. A. Dye, sec-
retary, the Coleman Co., Inc 15766 15922
4B. Check No. 4692 dated December 29, 1953, payable to
Continental Illinois National Bank, in the amount of
$5,000 drawn by the Coleman Co., Inc 15766 15923
4C. Check requisition dated December 29, 1953, payable to
Continental Illinois National Bank & Trust Co. in the
amount of $5,000, on the Coleman Co., Inc., form 15766 15924
5A. Letter dated June 10, 1954, addressed to James P. Johnson,
Continental Illinois National Bank & Trust Co., signed
by C. B. Kuhn and L. M. Marks, the Coleman Co., Inc.. 15766 15925
5B. Check No. 5111 dated June 3, 1954, payable to Continental
Illinois National Bank & Trust Co. in the amount of
$5,000, drawn by the Coleman Co., Inc 15766 15926
5C. Check requisition dated June 3, 1954, addressed to the
Continental Illinois National Bank & Trust Co. in the
amount of $5,000 on the Coleman Co., Inc., form 15766 15927
6A. Letter dated December 1, 1954, addressed to James P.
Johnson, second vice president, Continental Illinois
National Bank & Trust Co. and signed by J. A. Dye,
assistant secretary, the Coleman Co., Inc 15767 15928
6B. Check No. 5631 dated December 1, 1954, payable to Conti-
nental Illinois National Bank & Trust Co. in the amount
of $5,000 drawn by the Coleman Co., Inc 15767 15929
6C. Check requisition dated December 1, 1954, payable to
Continental Illinois National Bank & Trust Co. in the
amount of $5,000, on the Coleman Co., Inc., form 15767 15930
7 A. Letter dated October 5, 1954, addressed to John Bakshas
from the Coleman Co., Inc 15768 15931
7B. Letter dated October 14, 1954, addressed to C. L. Burrows
from John Bakshas, Home Gas Co 15768 15932
70. Letter dated October 28, 1954, addressed to John Bakshas
from C. L. Burrows, the Coleman Co., Inc 15768 15933
8A. Letter dated December 24, 1954, addressed to Carl Bur-
rows, Coleman Co., signed by A. H. Cronin 15769 15934
8B. Letter addressed to Coleman Furnaces and signed by John
Bakshas, Home Gas Co 15769 15935
8C. Letter dated October 28, 1954, addressed to Coleman Fur-
naces and signed by John Bakshas, Home Gas Co 15769 15936
9A. Cashier's check No. 8397, dated December 1954, payable
to Carl Burrows in the amount of $5,000 15771 15937
9B. Envelope in which the cashier's check was mailed (exact
date illegible) 15771 15938
9C. Return receipt for registered letter 15771 15939
lOA. Letter dated July 2, 1953, addressed to Carl Burrows, the
Coleman Co., signed A. H. Cronin, president, Sheet
Metal Workers International Association 15783 15940
lOB. Letter dated July 7, 1953, addressed to A. H. Cronin, presi-
dent, Sheet Metal Workers International Association,
from C. L. Burrows, the Coleman Co., Inc 15784 15941
11. Check No. 5065 dated July 19, 1956, payable to "Cash" in
the amount of $400, drawn by Galiger Heating Co 15819 15942
12. Check No. 19570 dated October 30, 1952, payable to M. E.
Garvey, trustee, in the amount of $2,500, drawn by Sim-
beam Heating & Air Conditioning Co 15861 15943
13. Check No. 890 dated October 31, 1952, payable to A. H.
Cronin, in the amount of $2,500, drawn by Marie Gar-
vey, trustee, for dividend on stock of Sunbeam Heating
& Air Conditioning Co 15862 15944
CONTENTS V
Introduced Appears
on page on page
14. Memorandums and receipts for cash paid out to the union
for the month of August 1949 in the amount of $250 15871 (*)
15. Check No. 646 dated December 30, 1954, payable to
"Cash — Union dues" in the amount of $400, drawn by
Acme Heating Co 15887 15945
Proceedings of —
December 2, 1958__ 15759
December 3, 1958 15825
* May be found in the files of the select committee.
INVESTIGATION OF IMPROPER ACTIVITIES IN THE
LABOR OR MANAGEMENT FIELD
TUESDAY, DECEMBER 2, 1958
U.S. Senate,
Select Committee on Improper Activities,
IN THE Labor or Management Field,
Washington^ D.C.
The select committee met at 11 a.m., pursuant to Senate Resolution
221, agreed to January 29, 1958, in the caucus room. Senate Office
Building, Senator John L. McClellan (chairman of the select com-
mittee) presiding.
Present: Senator John L. McClellan, Democrat, Arkansas; Sen-
ator John F. Kennedy, Democrat, Massachusetts.
Also present : Robert F. Kennedyj chief counsel ; La Vem J. Duffy,
investigator ; Irwin Langenbacher, investigator ; Ruth Y. Watt, chief
clerk.
The Chairman. The committee will be in order.
(Members of the select committee present at the convening of the
session were Senators McClellan and Kennedy.)
The Chairman. Today the committee opens a hearing into the
activities and practices of the Sheet Metal Workers International As-
sociation in the Chicago, 111., area.
One of the most insidious of union practices occurs when a closely
knit union group exacts tribute from employers for the privilege of
operating, and from workers for the privilege of working. This ap-
pears to be one of the elements of the case we shall investigate in this
series of hearings.
Another destructive practice occurs when unions or managements,
or both, acting in collusion, set out to regulate prices or to prearrange
the order and the amounts of bids which are supposed to be competi-
tive and secret on various types of building projects.
Such practices are extremely detrimental to the general public.
They create artificial high prices, prices which must necessarily come
out of the pockets of the unsuspecting consumer. This element of la-
bor-management improper activities will also be studied during the
current hearings.
We hear a great deal about "labor peace." Such peace gives stabil-
ity to our economy, continuity of output, and production. Such
peace, however, must be based on mutual understanding between labor
and management — on the faithful execution of contracts and the good
faith settlement of union-company grievances and differences.
When labor peace is put on the market as a commodity for sale,
however, it becomes a perversion of the entire concept. We cannot
permit tribute and payoffs to become the substitute for jDroper nego-
15759
15760 IMPROPER ACTIVITIES IN THE LABOR FIELD
tiation and compromise in our labor-management relations. It is
improper for unions to require such tribute or payoffs as their price
for maintaining such peace, and it is equally improper for manage-
ment to make proffers of under-the-table payments in an effort to
secure things from a union which their competitors cannot secure.
One of the grave problems facing this committee during its hear-
ings has been the perversion of what are considered legitimate union
functions and activities into shakedowns and payoff schemes. This
particular facet of labor-management relations will be one of the
focal points of this present series of hearings.
All right, Mr. Kennedy, are there any further statements?
If not, call the first witness.
Mr. Kennedy. Mr. Carl L. Burrows.
The Chairman. You do solemnly swear that the evidence you shall
give before this Senate select committee shall be the truth, the whole
truth, and nothing but the truth, so help you God ?
Mr. Burrows. I do.
TESTIMONY OF CARL L. BUREOWS, ACCOMPANIED BY COUNSEL,
LEONARD E. BANOWETZ
The Chairman. Mr. Burrows, state your name and your place of
residence, and your business or occupation.
Mr. Burrows. My name is Carl L. Burrows. My residence is
Wichita, Kans., and I am the manager of the Coleman Co.'s Mid-
western Division.
The Chairman. You have counsel, have you, Mr. Burrows?
Mr. Burrows. Yes, sir.
The Chairman. Mr. Counsel, identify yourself for the record,
please.
Mr. Banowetz. I am Leonard F. Banowetz, corporate counsel for
the Coleman Co.
The Chairman. Where is your office?
Mr. Banowetz. In Wichita, Kans., with the Coleman Co.
The Chairman. And you are a member of the Kansas bar, are you ?
Mr. Banowetz. Yes, I am a member of the Kansas bar.
The Chairman. Thank you very much.
Proceed, Mr. Kennedy.
Mr. Kennedy. Mr. Burrows, could you tell us what the Coleman
Co. manufactures?
Mr. Burrows. We manufacture outing products, camp stoves, lan-
terns, and that sort of thing, and heating and air-conditioning equip-
ment.
Mr. Kennedy. What was the first ?
Mr. Burrows. Outing products.
Mr. Kennedy. You mean camping equipment?
Mr. Burrows. Yes, sir.
Mr. Kennedy. How long has the Coleman Co. been in existence?
Mr. Burrows. About 53 or 54 years.
Mr. Kennedy. In this field, wdiere does the company rank in the
country, approximately ?
Mr. Burrows. In which field?
Mr. Kennedy. In fields that you mentioned, where it does work.
IMPROPER ACTIVITIES IN THE LABOR FIELD 15761
Mr. Burrows. In outing products, in our lines, we probably do 60
or 70 percent of the total business of this country. In heating equip-
ment we are probably one of the first 10 manufacturers, I would say.
Mr. IvENNEDY. That would include the air conditioning ?
Mr. Burrows. That is ri^ht.
Mr. Kennedy. Air conditioners and heating?
Mr. Burrows. That is right.
Mr. IvSNNEDT. How long have you been with the Coleman Co. ?
Mr. Burrows. Twenty-nine years.
Mr. IvENNEDY. You Were at one time a vice president ?
Mr. Burrows. That is correct.
Mr. KJENNEDY. And you are retiring, are you ?
Mr. Burrows. No, I am not retiring. At my own request I have
taken over the management of our Midwestern Division.
Mr. Kennedy. I thought after 30 years
Mr. Burrows. I am ineligible; but I hope I don't retire at that
time.
Mr. Kennedy. Mr. Burrows, when did your company get into the
air-conditioning and heating-equipment business field ?
Mr. Burrows. Well, we got into the heating equipment business
about 20 years ago, and into the air conditioning and warm-air-
furnace business, I would say we started in about 1950.
Mr. Kennedy. And were you having difficulty when you went into
this field, getting your products placed and having the Sheet Metal
Workers handle those products ?
Mr. Burrows. I would say we were, sir.
Mr. Kennedy. That started in approximately when ?
Mr. Burrows. I think 1951.
Mr. Kennedy. About 1951 ?
Mr. Burrows. I am quite sure that is the date.
Mr. Kennedy. "Wliat steps were taken by your company or by you
to try to get a solution to that problem ?
Mr. Burrows. Well, we tried a niunber of things. A part of our
unit was being produced by a firm in St. Louis. Their union was
the Stove Mounters Union, and we found that didn't solve our prob-
lem. We were having trouble in major metropolitan areas because
while we had a union m our plant, it wasn't the Sheet Metal Workers
Union, obviously, and so we had trouble getting our equipment
installed.
Mr. Kennedy. What union did you have in your plant ?
Mr. Burrows. We had an independent union, sir.
Mr. Kennedy. What was the name of it?
Mr. Burrows. I will have to ask our counsel.
Mr. Bano^\t:tz. The National Appliance Workers Union.
Mr. I^NNEDY. And the Sheet Metal Workers Union refused to
install your products, because your employees didn't belong to their
union ?
Mr. Burrows. In many areas, yes.
Mr. KJENNEDY. Did you meet a Mr. Cronin, who was the vice presi-
dent of the Sheet Metal Workers and have discussions with him ?
Mr. Burrows. Not at that time, sir : I did meet him.
Mr. Kennedy. In 1952 ?
15762 niPROPER activities in the labor field
Mr. BuKROws. In 1952.
Mr. Kennedy. Wliat led up to that meeting ?
Mr. Burrows. I had a sales manager, a Mr. Marks, who is now dead,
and I had given him the responsibility of getting our problem solved
in some manner.
JNIr. Kennedy. What was Mr. Marks" position at that time '.
Mr. Burrows. He was sales manager of our heating division.
Mr. Kennedy. What was his first name \
Mr. Burrows. Louis. He told me that he had a solution to the
situation, and suggested I make a trip with him to Chicago to meet
Mr. Cronin.
Mr. Kennedy. Would you tell us about that trip.
Mr. Burrows. Yes, sir. I don't have the date, but I think it was
in 1952, and I think we have the records. Mr. Marks had told me that
he could correct our problem but it would require a little cash to do
it. I asked him how nmch money he needed, and he told me $2,000.
I went to Chicago with Mr. Marks with a company check on the Con-
tinental Illinois Bank & Trust Co., and the cash was placed in an
envelope and Mr. Cronin was with Mr. Marks, and on the street, out-
side of the Continental Illinois Bank, I handed Mr. Cronin the en-
velope with the $2,000 in it.
Mr. Kennedy. How did you understand, or what was explained to
you, as to why you had to pay Mr. Cronin the $2,000 ?
Mr. Burrow^s. Well, all I can tell you, sir, is Mr. Marks told me that
he thought it could solve our problems.
Mr. Kennedy. That Mr. Cronin could solve our problems ?
Mr. Burrows. Yes, sir.
Mr. Kennedy. And this $2,000 was necessary to do that ?
Mr. Burrows. That is right.
Mr. Kennedy. Did you go in with Mr. Marks to cash the check?
Mr. Burrows. No. Mr. Cronin and Mr. jVIarks and I went into the
bank, and I left Mr. Cronin and Mr. Marks downstairs in the lobby,
and I went up and cashed the check myself.
Mr. Kennedy. And you brought the cash back ?
Mr. Burrows. That is right.
Mr. Kennedy. In the envelope ?
Mr. Burrows. That is right.
Mr. Kennedy. Where did you meet with Mr. Cronin then and give
him the money ?
JNIr. Burrows. On the street, two or three blocks from the bank.
Mr. Kennedy. All three walked clown?
Mr. Burrows. That is right.
Tlie Chairman. Who is Mr. Cronin, and I don't quite understand
who he is?
]\Ir. Burrows. Mr. Cronin is an official of the Sheet Metal Workers
Union, and I believe international vice president.
The Chairman. International vice president of the Sheet Metal
Workers Union ?
Mr. Burrows. I think that is the correct title.
Mr. Kennedy. What were liis responsibilities? Did 3'ou under-
stand that tliey exteudod tln-ough the Alidwest?
Mr. BiRROws. I am not sure that I follow you.
Mr. Kennedy. What were Mr. Cronin's responsibilities? Did 3'OU
understand where his jurisdiction was ?
IMPROPER ACTIVITIES IX THE LABOR FIELD 15763
Mr. Burrows. No ; I do not know.
Mr. Kennedy. Did you understand or know he was vice president
of the Sheet Metal Workers ?
Mr. Burrows. I knew that.
Mr. Kennedy. Did you know it at the time you gave him $2,000 ?
Mr. Burrows. Yes, sir ; I did.
Mr. Kennedy. Mr. Chairman, we have a document here.
The Chairman. ISIr. Burrows, I present to you the following docu-
ments of what purport to be a photostatic copy of a letter dated May
8, 1952, on the Coleman Co., Inc., stationery, signed by J. A. Dye,
secretary, and addressed to James M, Johnson, second vice president.
Continental Illinois National Bank & Trust Co., Chicago, 111.; and
also what purports to be a photostatic copy of a check drawn by the
Coleman Co. in the amount of $2,000 in favor of the Continental Illi-
nois Bank & Trust Co., check dated May 8, 1952 ; and also photostatic
copy of what is termed a check requisition bearing the same date on
the Coleman Co.'s form.
Will you please examine these three documents and state if you
identify them.
(Docmiients handed to the witness.)
Mr. Burrows. Yes, sir ; I can identify them.
The Chairman. Those may be made exhibits lA, IB, and IC.
(Documents referred to marked "Exhibits lA, IB, and IC," for ref-
ence, and will be found in the appendix on pp. 15913-15915.)
The Chairman. Proceed, Mr. Kennedy.
Mr. Kennedy. Mr. Burrows, did you subsequently make further
payments to Mr. Cronin ?
Mr. Burrows. Yes, sir; we did.
Mr. Kennedy. Either you or Mr. Marks made further payments?
Mr. Burrows. That is correct.
Mr. Kennedy. How much in total did vou pay to Mr. Cronin ?
Mr. Burrows. We paid a total of $27,000 ; $5,000 of it was returned.
JNIr. Kennedy. The last payment you made was returned ?
Mr. Burrows. That is right.
Mr. Kennedy. I will just go through those payments, and when
they were made.
You made another payment in January of 1953, did you ?
Mr. Burrows. That is correct.
The Chairman. If I am correct, just for clarification, the check made
exhibit No. lA or IB from which you obtained the proceeds, $2,000,
that $2,000 which you delivered to Mr. Cronin on the street is the
first payment?
Mr. Burrows. That is correct.
The Chairman. Subsequently, then, you paid a total of $27,000, of
which $5,000 was returned to you ?
Mr. Burrows. That is correct.
The Chairman. Paid to the same man for the same purpose ?
Mr. Burrows. That is correct.
Mr. Kennedy. That includes the $2,000 ?
Mr. Burrows. That is correct.
The Chairman. I hand you here another series of documents, the
first of which purports to be a photostatic copy of a letter of January
15, 1953, addressed to James P. Johnson, second vice president, Con-
15764 IMPROPER ACTIVITIES IN THE LABOR FIELD
tinental Illinois National Bank & Trust Co., Chicago, 111., signed by
J. A. Dye, secretary-treasurer of the Coleman Co., Inc.; also what
purports to be a photostatic copy of a check in the amount of $5,000,
dated January 15, 1953, payable to C. L. Burrows, and drawn by the
Coleman Co., Inc.; also, what appears to be a photostatic copy of a
check requisition payable to C. L. Burrows, dated January 15, 1953,
in the amount of $5,000, from which there appears to have been re-
ceived $5,000 in cash.
I present you these documents and ask you to examine them and
state if you identify them.
(The documents were handed to the witness.)
Mr. Burrows. Yes, sir ; I can identify them.
The Chairman. They may be made exhibits No. 2A, 2B, and 2C.
(Documents referred to were marked "Exhibits Nos. 2A, 2B, and
2C" for reference, and will be found in the appendix on pp. 15916-
1-5918.)
Mr. EIennedy. What were the circumstances surrounding the second
payment of $5,000?
Mr. Burrows. I am not sure that I follow you, Mr. Kennedy. Just
how it was done ; is that what you mean ?
Mr. KJENNEDY. Yes ; how it came to be paid and how it was handled.
Mr. Burrows. Well, it was paid because Mr. Marks told me that
he needed — when this thing started, Mr. Kennedy, I didn't know there
was to be a continuation of it. The $2,000, I thought, was all Mr.
Marks needed. But he came back to me then, let's see, in January of
1953, and said that he needed another $5,000. I authorized the check
to be issued, and cashed it in Chicago.
Mr. Kennedy. Did you understand it was going to be for the same
purpose ?
Mr. Burrows. That is right.
Mr. Kennedy. Had the first $2,000 that you paid in June 1952
achieved the purpose that you desired ?
Mr. Burrows. Not wholly, but to a very substantial degree.
Mr. Kennedy. Had it alleviated your labor difficulties ?
Mr. Burrows. It had ; yes.
Mr. Kennedy. The situation had improved a great deal ?
Mr. Burrows. It had improved.
Mr. Kj:nnedy. Over the period of June 1952 to January 1953 ?
Mr. Burrows. That is correct.
Mr. Kennedy. And Mr. Marks told you another $5,000 was nec-
essary ?
Mr. Burrows. That is correct.
Mr. Kennedy. Were you present when that $5,000 was paid ?
Mr. Burrows. I will have to look back at the record, sir. I think
I was. Yes, sir.
Mr. Kennedy. How was that handled ?
Mr. Burrows. That was paid — I cashed the check at the Conti-
nental Illinois. Mr. Marks and I met Mr. Cronin in either Mr.
Marks' room or mine. I can't be sure which room it was in the
LaSalle Hotel in Chicago. It was paid there. I cashed the check,
had the money placed in an envelope, gave it to Mr. Marks, and he
handed it to Mr. Cronin.
Mr. Kennedy. Were you both present when he gave him the
money ?
IMPROPER ACTIVITIES IN THE LABOR FIELD 15765
Mr. Burrows. We were.
Mr. Kennedy. Why did Mr. Cronin allow two of you to be present
at the time you gave the money ? Have you any explanation for that ?
Mr. Burrows. I have no explanation.
The Chairman. Is Mr, Marks living?
Mr. Burrows. No ; he is dead.
The Chairman. Is Mr. Cronin living?
Mr. Burrows. So far as I know.
The Chairman. Is he still an official of the union ?
Mr. Burrows. I couldn't tell you.
Mr. Kennedy. He is. He will be the next witness.
The Chairman. All right ; proceed.
Mr. Kennedy. But you gave him this $5,000 at the LaSalle Hotel,
either in your room or ^Ir. Marks' room ?
Mr. Burrows. That is correct.
Mr. Kennedy. And both of you were present at the time ?
Mr. Burrows. That is correct.
Mr. Kennedy. And those letters, the documents that have been
made an exhibit, indicate that you wrote a letter to the bank prior to
going there, stating that you would need $5,000, or a certain sum of
cash ?
Mr. Burrows. A member of our firm wrote it.
Mr. Kennedy. And said that when you came in with the check, the
check should be made good ; is that right ?
Mr. Burrows. That is right.
Mr. Kennedy. The third payment was made when — in June of
1953?
Mr. Burrows. June 18, 1953.
Mr. Kennedy. And how was that handled ?
Mr. Burrows. It was handled by Mr. Marks.
The Chairman. I again present to you three document, photo-
static copies of a letter of June 18, 1953 ; photostatic copy of a check
of the same date, drawn on the Coleman Co. in the amount of $5,000 ;
and also a check requisition, a photostatic copy of that, similar to
the others I presented you.
Would you please examine those and state if you identify them?
(The documents were handed to the witness.)
Mr. Burrows. Yes, sir ; I can identify them.
The Chairman. They may be made exhibits Nos. 3A, 3B, and 3C.
(Documents referred to were marked "Exhibits Nos. 3A, 3B and
3C" for reference, and will be found in the appendix on pp. 15919-
15921.)
The Chairman. Proceed, Mr. Kennedy.
Mr. Kennedy. What were the circumstances surrounding that pay-
ment?
Mr. Burrows. I can't tell you, sir. Again, Mr. Marks came to
me and told me that he needed an additional $5,000. I had the check
issued. I gave it to Mr. Marks. He cashed it in Chicago.
Mr. Kennedy. And you understood this was also going to Mr.
Cronin ?
Mr. Burrows. That is correct.
Mr. Kennedy. That was why the check was made out?
INIr. Burrows. That is correct.
Mr. Kennedy. And that was why the check was cashed ?
Mr. Burrows. That is correct.
15766 IMPROPER ACTIVITIES IN THE LABOR FIELD
Mr. Kennedy. Were you achieving the labor peace that you de-
sired during this period of time ?
Mr. Burrows. Sir?
Mr. Kennedy. Were you achieving the labor peace that you de-
sired during this period of time ?
Mr. Burrows. I wouldn't say, sir, that we were using the proper
approach, but yes, we were having no further trouble.
Mr. Kennedy. You were getting what you were paying for ?
Mr. Burrows. I think so.
Mr. Kennedy. What was the last one, Mr. Chairman ?
Mr. Burrows. The last one, according to my records, Mr. Kennedy,
was June 18, the last one you asked me about.
The Chairman. The last one presented was June 18, 1953.
Mr. Kennedy. Then on the 30th of December of 1953, another
$5,000?
Mr. Burrows. That is correct.
The Chairman. I hand you three other documents similar to those
I presented to you heretofore, the letter being dated December 30,
1953, a check for $5,000 dated December 29, 1953, and a corresponding
check requisition attached.
I ask you to examine these photostatic copies and state if you iden-
tify them.
'( The documents were handed to the witness. )
Mr. Burrows. Yes, sir ; I can identify them.
The Chairman. They may be made exhibits Nos. 4A, 4B, and 4C.
(Documents referred to were marked "Exhibits Nos. 4A, 4B, and
4C" for reference and will be found in the appendix on pp. 15922-
15924.)
The Chairman. Proceed.
Mr. Kennedy. Then in June of 1954 another $5,000 ?
Mr. Burrows. Correct.
The Chairman. I hand you the letter dated June 10, 1954, the check
dated June 3, 1954, and the requisition dated June 3, 1954, photostatic
copies of those, the letter, the check, and the requisition.
I ask you to examine them and state if you identify them, please, sir.
(The documents were handed to the witness.)
Mr. Burrows. Yes, sir ; I can identify them.
The Chairman. They may be made exhibits Nos. 5A, 5B, and 5C.
(Documents referred to were marked "Exhibits Nos. 5 A, 5B, and
5C" for reference and will be found in the appendix on pp. 15925-
15927.)
Mr. Kennedy. Were you present at that payment ?
Mr, Burrows. No, sir.
Mr. Kennedy. That was, again, handled by Mr. Marks himself ?
Mr. Burrows. That is correct.
Mr. Kennedy. But you participated and had knowledge of it ?
Mr. Burrows. Yes ; I caused the check to be issued.
The Chairman. I hand you similar documents, a letter dated De-
cember 1, 1954, a check dated the same date, and the requisition dated
the same date in the amount of $5,000.
Would you examine these i)hotostatic copies and state if you identify
them ?
( The documents were handed to the witness. )
Mr. Burrows. Yes, sir ; I can identify them.
IMPROPER ACTIVITIES IN THE LABOR FIELD 15767
The Chairman. They may be made exhibits Nos. 6A, 6B, and 6C.
(Documents referred to were marked ''Exhibits Nos. 6A, 6B, and
6C'' for reference and will be found in the appendix on pp. 15928-
15930.)
]Mr. Kexxedy. Thas was in December of 1954 ?
Mr. Burrows. That is correct, sir.
Mr. Kexxedy. That was the last payment?
Mr. Burrows. That is correct.
Mr. Kexxedy. That was for $5,000 ?
Mr. Burrows. That is correct.
Mr. Kexx'edy. Were you present at tliat payment ?
Mr. Burrows. I was the only one present.
Mr. Kexxedy. You took tliat paynuMit by yourself?
Mr. JU'RROws. I did.
Mr. Kexxedy. Why didn't ]Mr. ]Marks handle that one ?
Mr. Burrows. Mr. Marks was no longer with the company.
Mr. Kexxedy. How did you learn tliat another $5,000 was neces-
sary?
Mr. Burrows. Mr. Cronin called me and told me that he would like
to talk — he had been trying to get hold of Mr. Marks. I told him
Mr. ]Marks was no longer with the company, but that I would be glad
to see him in Chicago.
Mr. Kexxedy. Did you understand from that telephone call, or
did he mention anything about the fact that $5,000 was necessary?
Mr. Burrows. No, sir ; he did not.
]SIr. Kexxedy. You just brought along $5,000 ?
Mr. BuRROW'S. Well, I had had quite a record of experience here,
and I assumed that that was the case.
Mr. Kexxedy. Did you assume that you were going to have to pay
$5,000 every 6 months from then on?
Mr. Burrows. Yes, sir ; I would say that I did.
Mr. Kexxedy. Did you think $10,000 was a high figure to be paying
each year?
]Mr. BuRROw^s. Well, it would depend on what you accomplished
witli it. I don't say that it was right, but we were having no prob-
lems. Our business in that particular division is $7 or $8 million
a year.
Mr. Kexxedy. So this was a small percentage of that?
Mr. Burrows. My operating budget was about, as I recall it, in
those years $2i/2 million a year, for my operations. So it was rela-
tively small.
The Chairmax. May I inquire if any of this money went into the
union treasuiy ?
Mr. Burrows. I wouldn't know, sir.
The Chairman. You wouldn't think so, would you ?
Mr. Burrows. I wouldn't have any idea.
The Chairman. Well, if it was going into the union treasury,
wouldn't the proper way to handle it, if it was legitimate and above-
board, be simply to write a check to the union treasury ?
]Mr. Burrows. I would say that is correct.
The Chairman. Therefore, in view of the way you handled, the
transaction, you knew at the time and felt that it was improper, and
that it was something that couldn't be done openly and aboveboard
without criticism I
15768 IMPROPER ACTIVITIES IN THE LABOR FIELD
Mr. Burrows. That is correct.
Mr. Kennedy. Where did you make this last payment in December
of 1954?
Mr. Burrows. In the cocktail lounge in the LaSalle Hotel in
Chicago.
Mr. Kennedy. How did you handle that?
Mr. Burrows. I met Mr. Cronin there in the cocktail lounge. We
sat down at a table and handed him the envelope.
Mr. Kennedy. What did he say he would do?
Mr. BuRROAVs. Nothing specific. We visited for a very short time
and that was all of it.
Mr. Kennedy. Did you furnish him at that time some letters of
complaint that you had had from the west coast?
Mr. Burrows. I gave him one letter.
Mr. Kennedy. Was that in the envelope ?
Mr, Burrows. No, it was separate. There was only cash in the
envelope. I gave him one letter from a firm in Oregon. I believe
Grants Pass, though I am not sure. They told us they were having
some troubles. I acknowledged this letter, and told them I thought
perhaps I could help them. I gave the correspondence to Mr. Cronin
and asked him if he could do something to help me on it.
Mr. Kennedy. Is this the correspondence?
The Chairman. You gave some correspondence to Mr. Cronin;
is that correct?
Mr. Burrows. That is correct.
The Chairman. I hand you here photostatic copies of three letters,
one dated October 5, 1954, another dated October 14, 1954, and an-
other dated October 28, 1954.
The first is from the Coleman Co., Inc., to John Bakshas; is that
correct ?
Mr. Burrows. I can't recall it, sir. I can identify it, I am sure.
The Chairman. He is of the Home Gas Co.
Mr. Burrows. I recall the firm name.
Mr. Kennedy. That is in Oregon.
The Chairman. Grants Pass, Oreg. ?
Mr. Burrows. Grants Pass.
The Chairman. The second one is dated October 14, 1954, and is
addressed to you on Home Gas Co. stationery from John Bakshas.
Do you recall that?
Mr. Burrows. I don't recall it, sir.
The Chairman. And the third one is from Coleman Co., Inc., ap-
parently from you, C. L. Burrows, to this same Mr. John Bakshas,
dated October 28, 1954.
I ask you to examine those photostatic copies and state if you
identify them as such.
(The documents were handed to the witness.)
Mr. Burrows. Yes, sir; I can identify them.
The Chairman. They may bo made exhibits 7A, 7B, and 7C.
(Documents referred to were marked "Exhibits Nos. 7A, 7B, and
7C" for reference and will be found in the appendix on pp. 15931-
15933.)
The Chairman. Are those the letters or the correspondence that
you gave to Mr. Cronin at the time of the last payment ?
Mr. Burrows. Yes, sir.
IMPROPER ACTIVITIES IN THE LABOR FIELD 15769
Mr. Kennedy. There were three letters, then, that you gave to him ?
Mr. Burrows. As I looked it over, Mr. Kennedy, there are appar-
ently two letters there from the dealer and one from me.
Mr. Kennedy. Did you give all of this correspondence to him ?
Mr. Burrows. I am quite sure that I did ; yes, sir,
Mr. Kennedy. And this was a complaint from one of your distrib-
utors. He was having problems installing your equipment out on the
west coast ; is that right ?
Mr. BuRROw^s. That is right.
Mr. Kennedy. He wanted some help ?
Mv. Burrows. He wanted it settled ; yes.
Mr. Kennedy. This was the type of thing that you brought to Mr.
Cronin's attention ?
Mr. Burrows. It was the type of thing that Mr. Marks normally
brought to Mr. Cronin's attention.
JSIr. Kennedy. This was one of the things that you wanted to get
settled, that you expected Mr. Cronin's help and assistance on?
Mr. Burrows. That is correct.
Mr. Kennedy. Did you hear again from Mr. Cronin within a short
period of time after you gave him this last $5,000 ?
Mr. Burrows. I had a letter from him a few days later.
]Mr. Kennedy. Did he return the $5,000 at that time ?
Mr. Burrows. That is correct.
The Chairman. What was that?
Mr. Kennedy. He received a letter from him several days later
when he returned the last $5,000.
The Chairman. That last $5,000 was paid in December 1954, as I
recall.
Mr. Burrows. I am sure that is correct, sir. I don't have it before
me.
The Chairman. All right.
I hand you a letter dated December 24, 1954, signed A. H. Cronin,
addressed to you, Carl Burrows, Coleman Co., Wichita, Kans. ; also a
photostatic copy of a letter dated December 29, 1954, signed by John
Bakshas, addressed to Coleman Furnaces, Wichita, Kans. ; and one on
Home Gas Co. stationery, dated December 29, 1954, addressed to Cole-
man Furnaces, Wichita, Kans., signed by the same John Bakshas.
I ask you to examine those photostatic copies and state if you iden-
tify them.
(The documents were handed to the witness.)
Mr. Burrows. Yes, sir ; I can identify them.
The Chairman. Thank you very much. They may be made ex-
hibits Nos. 8A, 8B, and 8C.
(Documents referred to were marked "Exhibits Nos. 8 A, 8B, and
8C" for reference and will be found in the appendix on pp. 15934—
15986.)
The Chairman. I am intrigued by this letter of Mr. Cronin's re-
turning this $5,000 to you. I think it should be read into the record
at this point.
December 24, 1954.
Mr. Carl Burrows,
Coleman Co., Wichita, Kans.
Dear Sir : On December 21, 1954, at the La Salle Hotel in Chicago, you
handed me an envelope, together with some correspondence from a Grants Pass,
Oreg., firm and suggested that I examine the letter and contents of the envelope
at my leisure.
21243—59-
15770 IMPROPER ACTIVITIES IN THE LABOR FIELD
When time permitted, I read tlie correspondence you handed me and examined
the contents of the envelope. It was then that I discovered that you handed
me $5,000. Had I Ivnown what the envolpe contained when I was with you,
I would have returned it to you unopened.
I cannot accept this money under any circumstances, and, accordingly, am
enclosing herewith a cashier's check in the amount of $5,000 covering the same.
I am retaining in my possession the correspondence you gave me from the
Home Gas Co. of Grants Pass, Oreg.
Very truly yours,
A. H. Croxin.
I said I was intrigued about it. I wonder why lie couldn't accept
that $5,000 after he had already accepted $2:^,000 from you in similar
fashion ?
Mr. Burrows. I am afraid I can't answer that one, sir.
The Chairmaist. Did you ever inquire?
Mr. Burrows. Yes, I did.
The Chairman. Wliat information did you get ?
Mr. Burrows. Wlien Mr. Cronin wrote me and enclosed the cashier's
check, I was naturally anxious to determine what had happened, so
I called him. I made an appointment. It was some time later, I
believe. That letter was dated December what ?
The Chairman, December 24, 1954.
Mr. Burrows. It would have been sometime in early January,
then. I made a trip to Chicago to talk to him about it, and asked
him what had happened. I was afraid we were going to have some
more difficulty. His answer was that, as was in the letter, had he
known what was in the envelope, he wouldn't have accepted.
The Chairman. He had known about the other $22,000, had he not ?
Mr. Burrows. I would certainly think so.
The Chairman. And had accepted it ?
Mr. Burrows. That is correct.
The Chairman. He never returned any of that?
Mr. Burrows. No, sir.
The Chairman. Ig that the only explanation you got of tlie return
of the money ?
Mr. Burrows. That is correct.
The Chairman. It strikes me he would have gone into some state-
ment about it, that he was running into difficulty or he was afraid
that this was going to be exposed, or some other likely reason he
would have certainly given you,
Mr. Burrows. I clon't think so, sir.
The Chairman. You don't think so ? Do you mean he just wouldn't
comment about it, why he turned it back?
Mr. Burrows. I was there only a short time. I think Mr. Cronin
was somewhat agitated, and I can assure you that I was.
The Chairman. What was he agitated about?
Mr. Burroavs. Well, I can't tell you, sir.
The Chairman. "\Yliat were you agitated alx)ut?
Mr. Burrows. Well, I didn't particularly care to be involved in the
whole situation. This wliole affair was the answer to our problem.
The Ci [AIRMAN. It was off color, you knew that?
Mr, BiTRROws. I certainly did. And T stayed only a few minutes.
The CirAiRMAN. He returned it, he says, by cashier's check. I pre-
sent to you a copy of a cashier's check in the amonnt of $5,000. I
IMPROPER ACTIVITIES IN THE LABOR FIELD 15771
am unable to tell the exact date of it, but apparently it is 1954, in
December some date, in 1954.
I ask you to examine this cashier's check, a photostatic copy of it,
and state if this is correct, if you can identify it; also the envelope
in which it was mailed, I believe; and a return receipt which he
obtained for the registered letter in which he enclosed the check.
Would you examine those photostatic copies and state if you iden-
tify them?
(The documents were handed to the witness.)
Mr. Burrows. Yes, sir ; I can identify them.
The Chairman. They may be made exhibits Nos. 9A, 9B, and 9C.
(Documents referred to were marked "Exhibits Nos. 9A, 9B, and
9C" for reference and will be found in the appendix on pp. 15937-
15939.)
Mr. Kennedy. Did you subsequently learn that the Internal Reve-
nue Department had been watching the transaction between you and
Mr. Cronin in December of 1954?
Mr. Burrows. I didn't know it until about October of this year.
Mr. Kennedy. But you did leam in October that they had had an
agent in the room when you made this payment?
Mr. Burrows. Yes. I obviously didn't know it at the time.
Mr. Kennedy. Do you think that that might have been the ex-
planation, that Mr. Cronin had learned about the fact that they had
an agent there and for that reason had returned the $5,000?
Mr. Burrows. That is about the most plausible answer I can think
of.
The Chairman. Do you know whether he reported the other $22,000
on his income or not?
Mr. BtTRRows. I have no idea.
The Chairman. He never returned any of the other $22,000?
Mr. BuRROw^s. No, sir.
The Chairman. A possible return of it was never discussed between
you?
Mr. Burrows. No. sir.
The Chairman. That he retained, but he did return the last $5,000?
Mr. Burrows. That is correct.
Mr. Kennedy. I have a couple of other matters.
When you first made this payment, the first $2,000 payment, in
1952, it was a question of having the bug, the label, on your products;
is that correct?
Mr. Burrows. That is correct.
Mr. Kennedy. Did you subsequently arrange to have the label
placed on your products?
^[r. Burrows. Yes, sir; we did.
Mr. Kennedy. And that was the union label. That was in Janu-
ary of 1953?
]Mr. Burrows. I believe that is correct, sir ; yes.
Mr. Kennedy. About January 1953 ?
Mr, Burrows. That is right.
Mr. Kennedy. "Were those arrangements made at the sujrjrestion of
Mr. Cronin?
Mr. BuRROW^s. I am sure that they were. Mr. Marks told me that
we needed to get a union label on our equipment.
15772 IMPROPER ACTIVITIES IN THE LABOR FIELD
Mr. Kennedy. How was that done? How was it airanged to get
the union label ?
Mr. Burrows. Well, we had an independent union in our own plant,
so we subcontracted those parts of the distribution system in which
the Sheet Metal Workers were interested to another firm in Wichita.
Mr. Kennedy. What was the name of that company ?
Mr. Burrows. Sterling Manufacturing Co. And they made ar-
rangements for the Sheet Metal Workers Union in their plant.
Mr. Kennedy. They then signed a contract with the Sheet Metal
Workers Union, covering those employees that did your work?
Mr. Burrows. That is correct.
Mr. Kennedy. But only the employees that did your work ; is that
correct ?
Mr. Burrows. I can't tell you for sure, but I think that is right.
Mr. Kennedy. They didn't have the Sheet Metal Workers in there
prior to that time ?
Mr. Burrows. No, sir ; they did not.
Mr. Kennedy. That started in January of 1953, or thereabouts?
Mr. Burrows. I think that is substantially correct.
Mr. Kennedy. But between June of 1952 and January of 1953, even
though you didn't have any label on at all, the difficulties that you had
had with the union were alleviated ?
Mr. Burrows. They were alleviated. Not entirely solved, but
alleviated.
The Chairman. Senator Kennedy, have you any questions ?
Senator I^nnedy. You say you had no union in your company ?
Mr. Burrows. Yes, sir ; we did have a union.
Senator Kennedy. An independent union ?
Mr. Burrows. Yes, sir.
Senator Kennedy. Did the Sheet Metal Workers attempt to organ-
ize your plant ?
Mr. Burrows. No, sir.
Senator Kennedy. There was never an attempt to secure an election ?
Mr. Burrows. No, sir.
Senator Kennedy. No pickets or anything ?
Mr. Burrows. No, Senator. You see, this equipment, the distribu-
tion system, the pipes and the fittings for a furnace, were being pro-
duced for us. We never produced them in our own plant. They
were being produced for us in St. Louis.
We didn't have the proper union label, so Sterling took the thing
over. That equipment had never been produced in our plant.
Senator Kennedy. In the plant where you did the subcontracting,
you say there was not a union in that ?
Mr. Burrows. Yes ; there was.
Senator Kennedy. Excuse me ; there was not an international union
oftheAFL-CIO?
Mr. Burrows. In St. Louis, yes, sir. But it wasn't the proper
union. It was the Stove Mounters Union.
Senator Kennedy. The what union ?
Mr. Burrows. Stove Mounters Union.
Senator Kennedy. I am not familiar with tliat. Are they part of
the AFI^CIO, the Stove Mounters ?
Mr. Burrows. Sir?
IMPROPER ACTIVITIES IN THE LABOR FIELD 15773
Senator Kennedy. Is that part of the AFL-CIO ? Is that a union
that is affiliated with the AFL ?
Mr. Banowetz. It was part of the AFL at that time ; yes, sir.
Senator Kennedy. They were putting on their union bug or what-
ever you might call it ?
Mr. Burrows. The label ; yes.
Senator Kennedy. But the building trades around the country
would not handle it because of the Sheet Metal Workers; it did not
have their bug ? I don't understand that.
Mr. Burrows. That is correct. It wasn't a universal situation, but
it was in many major areas.
Senator Kennedy. Why is that ? A^^iat was the name of the union
again ? The Stove what ?
Mr. Burrows. Stove Mounters Union.
Senator Kennedy. The Stove Mounters Union is affiliated with the
building trades of the AFI^CIO ?
Mr. Burrows. They are an affiliate of the AFL.
Senator Kennedy. And the Sheet Metal Workers, they are what —
AFL?
Mr. BuRROAvs. I think that is correct ; yes, sir.
Senator Kennedy. And the subcontracting was done by the Stove
Mounters and they put their union label on your work, and yet the
building trades around the country would not install it because the
Sheet Metal Workers did not have their bug ?
Mr. Burrows. That is correct.
Senator Ivennedy. I don't understand that.
Mr. Kennedy. It is the Sheet Metal Workers Union that does the
installation, is that correct, for the most part ?
Mr. Burrows. In areas where union labor is used, yes.
Mr. Kennedy. So it wasn't just the building trades. It was specifi-
cally the Sheet Metal Workers Union. They will not install products
that are not manufactured by the Sheet Metal Workers Union.
Senator Kennedy. Even if the product is manufactured by another
union which is affiliated with the AFL ?
Mr. Burrows. I cannot tell you, sir. All I can tell you is that the
Stove Mounters Union label didn't help us any with our problem.
Mr. Kennedy. I might say that this is the same union that we went
into regarding the Burt Manufacturing Co. where they had the Steel-
workers in there, and the Sheet Metal Workers refused to handle the
products of the Burt Manufacturing Co. because they had the Steel-
workers.
Senator Kennedy. It seems to me it is one thing to refuse to handle
the products of a company which is under strike, or which has had a
persistent antilabor policy, or for one reason or another. There may
be some justification for that, but I am not clear on what the possible
justification would be for refusing to install material which happens
to be manufactured by another union, which is in good standing in
that case with the AFL, refusing to install that equipment.
If the facts are as stated, I don't understand it. There may be some
justification. Perhaps we can have the responsible officials of the
Sheet Metal Workers explain it to us, but I don't understand it right
now.
15774 IMPROPER ACTIVITIES IN THE LABOR FIELD
Mr. Burrows. Well, as I said before, Senator, it wasn't a universal
thing. In small towns we had no particular problem. In metro-
politan areas, liighly unionized, we had difficulties there.
Senator Kennedy. Even your own particular problem seems to me
to be inexplicable. But for the general situation to exist, if it is as
you stated, I cannot understand. Perhaps we can get greater infor-
mation from the officials of the Sheet Metal Workers' Union.
Thank you.
The Chairman. Is there anything further ?
Mr. Kennedy. Mr. Chairman, the attorney for the company has a
short statement of a page and a half, suggesting some legislation to
deal with these problems, which he has submittecl in advance.
The Chairman. The Chair does not feel that recommendations for
legislation need to be submitted under oath. Unless there is disagree-
ment with the Chair, you may submit your statement as recommenda-
tions regarding legislation, and, without objection, it will be inserted
in the record at this point, if it deals solely with such recommendations.
If your statement covers or undertakes to cover statements of fact
for the coimnittee's consideration, then it should be sworn to. I have
not read the statement.
Mr. Kennedy. I think it is just a legal question with some recom-
mendations.
The Chairman. Without objection, then, your statement may be
accepted and printed in the record at this point.
Senator Kennedy. Is one of the recommendations to strengthen the
Hobbs Act and the section of the Taft-Hartley Act in regard to
payoffs ?
Mr. Burrows. I would prefer that our attorney answer that.
Mr. Kennedy. It is just a page and a half. Maybe you would like
to have him read it.
The Chairman. I am trying to expedite the hearing.
Senator Kennedy. Do you feel that the labor-management laws
should be strengthened to prohibit or to make it certainly a clearer
Federal fine for anyone to attempt to extort money under the condi-
tions you have described, and also for anyone to pay it ?
This may come under the Hobbs Act and the Taft-Hartley Act
anyway. But do you think it should be more clearly stated if there is
any doubt whether the practice which you engaged in should be very
clearly prohibited on both sides?
Mr. Burrows. I would certainly think so. Perhaps our attorney
would like to comment on it.
Senator Kennedy. I was interested in getting your opinion, because
you were engaged in the practices.
Mr. Burrows. Certainly, with the experience I have had I would
say certainly.
Senator Kennedy. It is an extremely unfortunate practice to have
been engaged in. Is that your view ?
Mr. Burrows. That is correct.
The Chah{man. Is there anything further ?
The counsel's statement of recommended legislation may be inserted
in the record at this point.
IMPROPER ACTIVITIES IN THE LABOR FIELD 15775
(The recommendations referred to are as follows :)
Section 7 of the Taft-Hartley Act presently guarantees certain rights to em-
ployees. However, these rights are of little meaning if the en)i)loyer can be
placed in a position of (Uniding whether he will stop making a product or allow
his i>lant to he organized by the boycotting union, in spite of the fact tliat his
eiiii)loyees may have decided that the.v want either no union or a different union.
The onl.v remedy that is now available is remedial legislation. I would
strcmgly urge that considei-ation be given to amending section 8(h) (4) of the
act in order that its Introdiutory sentence apply not only to employees of any
em])l().ver, but also the employer.
In addition, it woiild seem that any conspiracy of individuals to deny a market
to any manufacturer should also be dealt with.
The Chairman. Mr. Burrows, the Chair personally, without con-
doning; but fully condenining your actions that you have related here,
does eoinmeud you for comino; before this committee in response to a
subpena from your Government and telling the truth as to these
transactions tliat have occurred.
I am assumino: j^ou have told tlie full truth about it. If others who
have coimnitted such infractiotis of propriety, both on the side of
labor and management, would come as you have and give us that
information, it would be very helpful to the Congress in meeting its
responsibility with respect to corrective and remedial legislation that
obviously is needed in many areas of management-labor relations.
You liave the thanks of the Chair. It may be that we will need some
ftirtlier testimony from you as we proceed with this phase of the
hearing. If you will, please remain available for further testimony.
Mr. Burrows. Thank you, sir.
The Chairman. You may stand aside.
Call the next witness, please.
Mr. Kennedy. Mr. Chairman, could we put these affidavits into
the record?
The Chairman. The Chair has before him an affidavit from John
Schul dated the 18th day of November 1958. This affidavit may be
inserted in the record at this point.
(The affidavit referred to follows :)
Affidavit
I, John Schul, reside at 710 Porter Street, Wichita, Kans., and, being duly
sworn, make the following statement to Mr. L. J. Duffy, who has identified
himself to me as an investigator for the United States Senate Select Commit-
tee on Improper Activities in the Labor or Management Field.
Since May 1, 19.j6. I have been vice president and general manager of the
L. D. Supply Co., located at 436 Maple Street, Wichita, Kans. During the
period from November 15, 1936, to November 15, 1955, when I resigned, I was
purchasing agent for the Coleman Co., whose main office is in Wichita, Kans.
During my last 2 years with the Coleman Co., I was director of material and
was a member of the staff of the president of the Coleman Co. AVhile em-
ployed at the Coleman Co., I had access to the general counsel of management
of the company in situations involving policies.
During the period 1951 and early 1952, the Coleman Co. had difficulty in-
stalling its furnaces in various sections of the country because certain prod-
ucts of the company did not have the label of the Sheet Metal Workers Union
stamped on it. This matter was discussed by the management of the Coleman
Co. and Mr. Louis Marks, field sales manager, who had previously become
acquainted with Mr. Arthur Cronin, of the Sheet Metal Workers Intemational
Association.
Mr. IMarks was delegated to contact Cronin to see if some situation could be
worked out to solve the difficulty of the Sheet Metal Workers International
Association on Coleman installations until a permanent solution could be ar-
15776 IMPROPER ACTIVITIES IN THE LABOR FIELD
ranged. Mr. Marks met with Mr. Cronin. Thereafter, the Coleman Co. had
few labor difficulties. It was general knowledge at the Coleman Co. that Mr.
Marks could see Mr. Cronin and have the company labor problems straightened
out.
I am not familiar with the details of the relationship between Marks and
Cronin, although I am sure they were not personal friends.
It was not until some months later that a formal solution to the company's
problem was worked out. This was accomplished by having the Coleman Co.
subcontract its duct work to the Sterling Manufacturing Co., of Wichita,
Kansas. This particular company was not union before it received the contract
from the Coleman Co. In order to secure the Sheet Metal Workers Union
Stamp on the Coleman Co. products, it was necessary that the employees of the
Sterling Co. be organized. However, the Sheet Metal Union organized only
those employees of the Sterling Co. who handled Coleman Co. products.
I make the above statement freely and voluntarily, and with the knowledge
that this statement may be used in public hearings conducted by the above-
named committee.
John Schul.
The Chairman. I have another affidavit from Mr. Floyd Wayland
Kichards, dated the 29th day of November 1958. That may be in-
serted in the record at this point.
(The affidavit referred to follows :)
Affidavit
I, Mr. Floyd Wayland Richards, who reside at 2949 Mabry Road NE., Atlanta,
Ga., freely and voluntarily make the following statement to La Vera J. Duffy,
who has identified himself to me as a member of the staff of the U. S.
Senate Select Committee on Improper Activities in the Labor or Management
Field.
No threats, force, or duress have been used to induce me to make this state-
ment, nor have I received any promise of immunity from any consequences
which may result from submission of this statement to the aforementioned Sen-
ate select committee.
I have been employed by the Coleman Co., Inc., of Wichita, Kans., for 31
years and am presently branch manager of our southeastern branch with main
office at 1022 Marietta Street NW., Atlanta, Ga., telephone Trinity 3-1646.
My home address is 2949 Mabry Road NE., Atlanta, Ga. My home telephone
number is Cedar 7-3447.
During the period approximately 1950 to 1955, I was administrative assistant
to Carl L. Burrows, who was at that time vice president in charge of sales for
the Coleman Co., Inc. Because of my position I did work quite closely with
Mr. Burrows and also with Mr. Lou Marks, who was at that time field sales
manager of our Blend-Air Division. Because of this association, I was usually
informed of out-of-town trips that either of these men planned.
Shortly after Mr. Mai'ks became sales manager of the Blend-Air Division in
Wichita, I attended the January fuimiture market in Chicago and worked with
Mr. Marks in the Coleman booth. During the "market," Mr. Marks mentioned
that we were having difficulty in Chicago because a union identified as the Sheet
Metal Workers Union would not permit installation of our prefabricated (fac-
tory-built) distribution systems used with our Coleman furnaces. There is
apparently no problem in the installation of the furnaces — just the prefabri-
cated pipe and fittings. Mr. Marks mentioned that he was working on the prob-
lem of obtaining approval from the union in the Chicago area.
Later, in connection with the Chicago problem, Mr. Burrows did mention that
we had worked out an arrangement that would enable us to sell our Blend-Air
systems in the Chicago market and that it involved payment of a substantial
sum of money by the company.
At one time I do recall Mr. Burrows telling me he was making a trip to
Chicago in connection with the Sheet Metal Workers Union and that getting
the approval in Chicago for our Blend-Air systems involved a sizable financial
payment and that the matter of course was confidential.
After this particular trip by Mr. Burrows to Chicago, I do recall that Mr. Marks
mentioned on two, or possibly three, occasions that he was making a trip to
IMPROPER ACTIVITIES IN THE LABOR FIELD \blll
Chicago in connection with the Sheet Metal Workers Union arrangement and
at one time he did mention that he was carrying a substantial amount of money.
At another time I recall Mr. Burrows mentioning to me that the financial
arrangements he and Mr. Marks were working on in Chicago with the Sheet
Metal Workers Union would not only solve our problem in Chicago, but also St.
Louis and any other spots where we have been experiencing difficulty.
The information above passed to me in conversation quite informally, because
of my close as.sociation with Messrs. Burrows and Marks. However, until
recently I have never been asked to give any statement, and since I had attached
little significance to it at that time, am unable to attach any jjarticulr dates to
the statements. Furthermore, the long passage of time has made it almost im-
possible. However, I am sure the facts related all occurred at some time between
1952 and 1954.
I have read the foregoing statement, and, to the best of my knowledge, it is
true and correct.
/s/ Floyd Watland Richards.
Sworn to and subscribed before me this 29th day of November 1958.
Ralph E. Dansox,
Notary Public, State of Florida at Large.
My commission expires July 31, 1959. Bonded by American Surety Co. of
New York.
The CiiAiRMAx. I also have an affidavit from Milton K. Arenberg,
dated the 20th day of (3ctober 1958. This may also be inserted in the
record at this point.
(The affidavit referred to follows :)
Affidavit
12.34 West Fltlton, Chicago, III.,
October 20, 1958.
1. I, Milton K. Arenberg, voluntarily make this statement to Irwin Langen-
bacher, who has identified himself as an assistant counsel, U.S. Senate Committee
on Labor and Management. I am president of Robert Barclay, Inc., above ad-
dress, manufacturers and wholesalers of automatic heating supplies.
2. We handled products of the Coleman Co. from about September 1953 to
April 1957. During this period Louis Marks, of the Coleman Co., visited my
office and told me that he had come to see Arthur Cronin of the Sheet Metal
Workers Union because of the fact that in some areas sheet-metal workers were
not permitted to install Coleman products.
He told me that he had straightened it out with Cronin, but gave no further
details. He did not state or even hint that he had entered into any irregular
transaction with Cronin, or that he had given Cronin anything of value. He
did lead me to believe that he and Cronin were good friends, and he told me
that if I had any trouble with the sale of Coleman products, I should call Cronin.
I do not recall that I ever had any trouble in this respect, either before or after
the aforementioned Marks visit.
3. I have no other information of interest concerning the Coleman Co.'s re-
lationship with the Sheet Metal Workers Union.
/s/ Milton K. Arenberg.
Sworn to and subscribed before me this 20th day of October 1958.
Lawrence P. Felker, Notary Public.
My commission expires March 1959.
The Chairman. Call the next witness.
Mr. Kennedy. Mr. Cronin.
The Chairman. Come forward, Mr. Cronin.
Be sworn, Mr. Cronin.
Do you solemnly swear the evidence you shall give before this Sen-
ate select committee shall be the truth, the whole truth, and nothing
but the truth, so help you God ?
Mr. Cronin. I do.
15778 IMPROPER ACTIVITIES IN THE LABOR FIELD
TESTIMONY OF ARTHUR H. CRONIN, ACCOMPANIED BY COUNSEL,
NATHAN M. COHEN
The Chairman. Mr. Cronin, state your name, your place of resi-
dence, and your business or occupation, please, sir.
Mr. Cronin. Arthur H. Cronin. I am president of local 73 of the
Sheet Metal Workers International Association, and fourth vice pres-
ident of the international imion. I live in River Forest, 111.
The Chairman. You have counsel, Mr. Cronin ?
Mr. Cronin. I do.
The Chairman. Mr. Counsel, identify yourself for the record,
please.
Mr. Cohen. Nathan M. Cohen, Chicago, 111.
The Chairman. Are you a member of the Illinois bar?
Mr. Cohen. I am, sir.
The Chairman. Proceed, Mr. Kennedy.
Mr. Kennedy. Mr. Cronin, how long have you been with the Sheet
Metal Workers Association ?
Mr. Cronin. As a member since 1925.
Mr. Kennedy. Wlien did you become an officer ?
Mr. Cronin. In 1941.
Mr. Kennedy. What position did you have at that time ?
Mr. Cronin. At that time, business representative.
Mr. Kennedy. Business
Mr. Cronin. Assistant business representative.
Mr. Kennedy. Of local 73 ?
Mr. Cronin. That is right.
Mr. Kennedy. What area does local 73 encompass ?
Mr. Cronin. Chicago, Cook, and Lake Counties, 111.
Mr. Kennedy. How many members do you have?
Mr. Cronin. About 4,000.
Mr. Kennedy. Did you later become president of that local ?
Mr. Cronin. Of that local.
Mr. Kennedy. When was that ?
Mr. Cronin. 1948 ; in July.
Mr. Kennedy. Have you been president since that time?
Mr. Cronin. Yes, sir.
INIr. Kennedy. You have been an international vice president in the
Sheet Metal Workers Union ?
Mr. Cronin. Since the same year, October 1948.
Mr. Kennedy. How often are the elections ?
Mr. Cronin. Every 5 years.
Mr. Kennedy. When was the last time you were elected?
Mr. Cronin. I think 2 years ago, in June. Two years ago last June.
Mr. Kennedy. Mr. C^ronin, we have had some testimony which you
have lieard before the committee, regarding payments that Mr. Bur-
rows states that he and Mr. Marks made to you over a period starting
in June of 1952 and extending through December of 1954. Did you
receive any oi- all of that money ?
Mr. (yRONiN. I did not.
Mv. Kennedy. You did not receive any of that money?
Mr. CuoNiN. I received one amount oi $5,000, which I returned to
Mr. li arrows.
IMPROPER ACTIVITIES IN THE LABOR FIELD 15779
Mr. Kennedy. But you did not receive the money, the $2,000 in
June of 1952?
Mr. Cronin. I did not.
Mr. Kennedy. And you did not receive the $5,000 in January of
1953?
Mr. Cronin. No.
Mr. Kennedy. And you did not receive the $5,000 in June of 1953?
Mr. Cronin. No.
Mr. Kennedy. And you did not receive the $5,000 in December of
1953?
Mr. Cronin. No.
Mr. Kennedy. Did you receive the $5,000 in Jime of 1954 ?
Mr. Cronin. I did not.
Mr. Kennedy. You did receive the $5,000 in December of 1954, but
you returned the money ; is that correct ?
Mr. Cronin. I think that is the correct time or date.
Mr. Kennedy. The testimony that Mr. Burrows gave before this
committee
Mr. Cohen. I think you said June of 1954. I think you meant to
say December.
Mr. Kennedy. June of 1954, and then in December of 1954 you
received $5,000 which you subsequently returned; is that correct?
yh\ Cronin. That is correct.
Mr. Kennedy. So Mr. Burrows' testimony that lie was present and
made payments to you of $2,000 in June of 1952, another $5,000 in
January of 1953, that he personally was present when that money was
paid to you, that testimony is incorrect ?
Mr. Cronin. That is correct.
Mr. Kennedy. And the testimony that you received these other
payments that he had personal knowledge of, that he made the checks
out and gave the money to Mr. Marks to give to you, as far as your
testimony before the committee it is that that testimony is not correct?
Mr. Cronin. I didn't receive the money.
Mr. Kennedy. You did not receive any of that money?
Mr. Cronin. No, sir.
Mr. Kennedy. Can you give the committee any explanation why
Mr. Burrows would testify to the fact that he paid this money to you?
Mr. Cronin. Well, I wouldn't know, Mr. Kennedy, other than that
if they did take tliat money out of the company, Mr.Burrows and Mr.
Marks, either one of them or both of them did something else with it,
because they didn't give it to me.
Mr. Kennedy. Did they discuss with you the fact — did Mr. Burrows
or Mr. Marks discuss with you the fact that they were having diffi-
culty getting their products installed ?
Mr. Cronin. Yes.
Mr. Kennedy. You know both Mr. Burrows and Mr. Marks ?
Mr. Cronin. Well, I knew Mr. Marks. I didn't know Mr. Burrows
very well. I think I met him two or three times at the very most.
Mr. Kjennedy. Did you meet him in June of 1952 ?
Mr. Cronin. I can't recall as to the exact time or date when I first
met him.
Mr. Kennedy. When did you meet Mr. Marks then ?
15780 IMPROPER ACTIVITIES IN THE LABOR FIELD
Mr. Cronin. Well, I can't be too sure of that, Mr. Kennedy, but
from the testimony I would say that might be right along in 1952,
perhaps.
Mr. Kennedy. Did you ever go to Mr. Marks' or Mr. Burrows'
room at the La Salle Hotel ?
Mr. Cronin. I think that I might have been in Mr. Marks' room
one time when I met Mr. Burrows.
Mr. Kennedy. At the time you met Mr. Burrows ?
Mr. Cronin. I think that is correct.
Mr. Kennedy. How did you happen to go to his room ?
Mr. Cronin. Mr. Marks asked me. I had never met Mr. Burrows.
Mr. IvENNEDY. What was the purpose of going to his room ?
Mr. Cronin. Well, to discuss the Coleman situation. That is as
much as I can tell you.
Mr. Kennedy. Did you perform any services for them then ?
Mr. Cronin. Not esepcially.
Mr. Kennedy. Did you look into the situation for them ?
Mr. Cronin. I referred it to our general office.
Mr. Kjennedy. Did you do anything personally on it ?
Mr. Cronin, Nothing.
Mr. Kennedy. Did you ever contact anyone in connection with it?
Mr. Cronin. I called our general secretary and told him that the
Coleman Co. were desirous of organizing a shop in Kansas, and that
inasmuch as that is far out of my jurisdiction, I have nothing to do
with the general oragnizing, it was turned over to the general office.
Mr. Kennedy, You never became interested in it yourself after that ?
Mr. Cronin. No, sir,
Mr. Kennedy. That shop was organized in January of 1953. Sub-
sequent to that, did they come to you at all, Mr. Marks or Mr. Burrows?
Mr. Cronin. Well, they have had a situation in Chicago, Mr. Ken-
nedy, where, when I became acquainted with Coleman, they did come
to Chicago to install furnaces through their representative there, or
through their distributor, and the chap who was working for the dis-
tributor came to me and asked what we would do about the installa-
tion of Coleman furnaces. I said we would have nothing to do with
it; I mean, nothing against it, that we wouldn't stop them in any way.
I did ask them, however, who was handling their furnaces at the time.
As I remember, they mentioned two or three Chicago sheet-metal con-
tractors who were handling the Coleman product. That was all right.
The worlv went on, there was no stoppage of work, no trouble that I
remember.
Mr. Kennedy. After January of 1953, did you have many conver-
sations with Mr. Marks ?
Mr. Cronin. Not too many.
Mr. Kennedy. Did you spend some time with him ?
Mr. Cronin. No. He would come to Chicago occasionally, and I
might meet him for lunch. But the entire transaction, I believe, was
turned over to the general office, and handled by one of our general
organizers.
Mr. Kennedy. But he discussed the problems that he was having in
the general areas of the country with you ?
Mr. Cronin. He might have, but it was not of too much interest to
me, what happened in the other parts of the country.
IMPROPER ACTIVITIES IN THE LABOR FIELD 15781
Mr. Kennedy. Did you assure him that you would try to help him
out in the other sections of the country ?
Mr. Cronin. At one time he asked me if I would intercede, inasmuch
as I was a vice president.
Mr. Kennedy. When was that ?
Mr. Cronin. I don't remember the exact time, but it was in the early
part of my meetino^s with ^Ir. Marks.
Mr. Kennedy. What was that about?
Mr. Cronin. Well, it was about handling their product in other
parts of the country. He thought, as I remember, that we made the
installations in Chicago, and they did complain, as I remember, about
some of their work being stopped in other parts of the country because
the fittings were not manufactured by them. I did tell him at that
time that inasmuch as he was going to install this new type of furnace
around the country, that it would be a good idea if his shop was organ-
ized. He wanted to know what the procedure would be, and I said
that I would have nothing to do with that; however, that I would talk
to our general office if that was satisfactory with him. It was, and the
matter was turned over in its entirety to one of the international men.
Mr. Kennedy. Then that must have been prior to January of 1953 ?
Mr. Cronin. It could have been.
Mr. Kennedy. Subsequent to that did you ever meet with him and
discuss the problems that he was having throughout the country ?
Mr. Cronin. Not too much.
Mr. Kennedy. You did not?
Mr. Cronin. Only in a general way. Nothing specific.
Mr. Kennedy. What were your meetings with him about, then ?
Mr. Cronin. Sir?
Mr. Kennedy. What did you discuss at these meetings that you had
with him ?
Mr. Cronin. Well, at the beginning it was regarding the Chicago
situation.
Mr. Kennedy. I am talking now about after you made the sugges-
tion or after he said that the shop wanted to become organized. After
that, what were you discussing with him ?
Mr. Cronin. Well, we might have talked about the situation and
the organizing of the shop in Kansas. But it was merely as a matter
of conversation.
Mr. Kennedy. What about after that? The shop was organized
in January of 1953. You met with him subsequently ; did you not ?
Mr. Cronin. Not too many times. I wouldn't remember exactly how
many times I met him. There were no prearranged meetings. If he
happened to be in Chicago he might call me.
Mr. Kennedy. Did he discuss the problems? According to the
testimony of Mr. Burrows, they went to you whenever they had prob-
lems around the country ; is that correct?
Mr. Cronin. The only time Mr. Burrows discussed any problem
with me was in December of 1953 ; is that right ?
Mr. Cohen. 1954.
Mr. Cronin. 1954, when he complained of some stoppages or trouble
they might be having in different parts of the country. I did hear
about Grants Pass, Oreg. I simply had to turn that over to the inter-
national office. I don't remember any other instances. I think per-
15782 IMPROPER ACTIVITIES IN THE LABOR FIELD
haps he might have discussed a problem they had in the East one time.
But in every instance, that was turned over, I told him that he should
turn it over directly to them, to the general office. If he wanted me to
say something to them or to intercede, I would be glad to do it.
Mr. Kennedy. Did you say that you would intercede for him ?
Mr. Cronin. It Avasn't a matter of intercession. I simply suggested
that he contact the general office, and that they would have to handle
it, because I could have nothing to do with it. I had no power to do
anything other than in our own j ur isdiction in Chicago.
Mr, Kennedy. As a vice president, you didn't have authority ?
Mr. Cronin. No, sir ; we don't have that authority.
Mr. Kennedy. You didn't assure him that you would try to help
or assist him in other sections of the country ?
Mr. Cronin. No. I just told him that I would turn the matter
over to our international office. Anything after that would have to
be done by them.
Mr. Kennedy. Did you ever talk or speak to anyone other than the
international office, anyone in the international office ?
Mr. Cronin. No, sir.
Mr. Kennedy. Who did you talk to in the international office ?
Mr. Cronin. I think on one occasion it might have been Ed Car-
lough, our general secretary.
Mr. Kennedy. Wlio is he ?
Mr. Cronin, Our general secretary. Or perhaps even to the presi-
dent.
Mr. Kennedy. Mr. Byron ?
Mr. Cronin. That is right.
Mr. Kennedy. Did you talk to Mr. Carlough ?
Mr. Cronin. I presume, I am not sure,
Mr. Kennedy. You don't remember ?
Mr. Cronin. I think the conversation might be general. But there
was nothing specific about it,
Mr, Kennedy. Did you talk to Mr. Byron about it ?
Mr. Cronin. Only in a general way.
Mr. Kennedy. Nothing specific ?
Mr. Cronin. No, sir.
The Chairman. Who is Mr, Carlough ?
Mr, Cronin, Wliat is it. Senator ?
The Chairman. Who is Mr. Carlough ?
Mr, Cronin, He is our general secretary-treasurer.
The Chairman, Did you discuss this situation in detail with Mr.
Burrows, the problems he was having over the country ?
Mr, Cronin, About wliat, Senator?
The Chairman, About the problems he was having over the coun-
try, getting his products installed,
Mr, Cronin. No, I don't think it was too much in detail.
The CiiAiRisrAN. Did you get enough information from him to have
some idea of the problem he was having ?
Mr. Cronin. Well, I think more of that came from Mr. Marks.
The Chairman. All right, with IVIr. Marks, then.
Mr. Cronin. Well, he did say that they might have had trouble in
different parts of the country. But you understand this was at the
beginning of our meeting.
IMPROPER ACTIVITIES IN THE LABOR FIELD 15783
The Chairman. When did your meetings first begin ?
Mr. Cronin. Well, I can't remember the exact date, I think per-
haps your records show that.
The Chairman. Did Mr. Cronin have any working arrangements
with your union ?
Mr. Cronin. Mr. Cronin ? I am Mr. Cronin.
The Chairman. Did Mr. Burrows have any working arrangements
with your union ?
Mr. Cronin, Mr. Burrows ? No ; not to my knowledge.
The Chairman. Did the Coleman Co. ?
Mr. Cronin. In the Chicago area, are you talking about ?
The Chairman. I don't care where it was. Anywhere.
Mr. Cronin. The only place I can speak for is the Chicago area.
That was handled through distributors. We had no direct arrange-
ments with the Coleman Co.
The Chairman. There wasn't anything, then, for the Coleman Co.
to be pleased about, the arrangements they had made with your union ?
Mr, Cronin, I couldn't answer. I don't know anything about that.
The Chairman. I hand you a photostatic copy of a letter dated July
22, 1953, on Sheet Metal Workers International Association stationery,
3350 Jackson Boulevard, Chicago 24, 111. The letter is addressed to
Mr. Carl Burrows, the Coleman Co., Wichita, Kans. ; and signed "A.
H. Cronin, president."
I hand you a photostatic copy of that letter, or what purports to be,
and ask you to examine it and state if you identify it.
(Document handed to the witness.)
(The witness conferred with his counsel,)
Mr, Cronin, That is right, that is mine.
The Chairman, That is your letter ?
Mr, Cronin. Yes.
The Chairman, That may be made exhibit No. lOA,
(Document referred to was marked "Exhibit No. lOA" for refer-
ence, and will be found in the appendix on p. 15940.)
The Chairman. Did you receive a reply to that letter ?
Mr. Cronin. I wouldn't remember.
The Chairman. I hand you a photostatic copy of what purports to
be a reply to it. I will ask you to examine that and state if you
identify it.
( Document handed to the witness. )
(The witness conferred with his counsel.)
Mr. Cronin, That apparently was addressed to me, I don't remem-
ber that letter.
The Chairman. Do you keep files of your correspondence ?
Mr. Cronin, Pretty much so. I don't keep them myself. They
are kept in the office.
The Chairman. Are they kept for you ?
Mr. Cronin, They are kept in the office ; yes.
The Chairman. Do you know why a copy of this letter which you
have identified of Mr. Burrows, of July 2, 1953, is not in your files?
Mr. Cronin. I couldn't say that.
The Chairman. What happened to the original, of which this is a
copy of *^he reply you received to it ?
Mr, Cronin, I don't know.
15784 IMPROPER ACTIVITIES IN THE LABOR FIELD
The Chairman. That photostatic copy of the reply may be made
exhibit lOB.
(Document referred to was marked "Exhibit No. lOB" for reference,
and will be found in the appendix on p. 15941.)
The Chairman. The Chair will read the two letters into the record
at this point.
The first one, exhibit lOA, of July 2, 1953, is to Mr. Carl Burrows,
Coleman Co., Wichita, Kans.
Dear Mr. Burrows : The writer spent a pleasant few hours with Lou Marks
in Chicago, 111., last week. We discussed conditions in various parts of the
country relative to your product, and again I would like to assure you of our
cooperation as we feel that the agreement is of mutual benefit.
General Secretary Edward F. Carlough suggested that you visit our ofiices in
th Transportation Building when you are in Washington. He also thought that
it might be a good idea if you could furnish him with some pictures and data on
the manufacturing of your fittings. He thought it might make an interesting
article for our national journal which is published monthly. This, too, would
be a good way of letting our members all over the country know that the fittings
in connection with your installations carry our union label.
Looking forward to seeing you in the near future, and with best wishes, I am,
Very truly yours,
A. H. Cronin, President.
The reply is dated July 7, 1953, to Mr. A. H. Cronin, president,
Sheet Metal Workers International Association, 3350 Jackson Boule-
vard, Chicago 24, 111.
Dear Mr. Cronin : Thanks so much for your letter of July 2. It would appear
that our working arrangements with your union are excellent. I welcome an
opportunity to see your general secretary, Mr. Carlough, on my next trip to
Washington, and I am asking our advertising manager to send him complete
information on our product for an article in your national journal. We would,
by the way, very much appreciate such an article. We think it might be helpful
to us.
With best wishes, I am,
Yours very truly,
The Coleman Co., Inc.
Printed on the left-hand side is "C. L. Burrows." The stenographic
identification is "J. B."
What were the working arrangements that you had, Mr. Cronin?
Mr. Cronin. The only way I could answer that, Senator, is by say-
ing that they did come to an agreement probably with our international
union.
The Chairman. You obviously knew about it.
Mr. Cronin. Sir?
The Chairman. You obviously knew about it, whatever it was.
Mr. Cronin. I knew about the general conditions, but I knew abso-
lutely nothing about how the Coleman Co. entered into an agreement
with our international union.
The Chairman. You had something in mind when you wrote this,
speaking about your visit with Mr. Marks :
We discussed conditions in various parts of the country relative to your prod-
uct, and again I would like to assure you of our cooperation, as we feel that
the agreement is of mutual benefit.
What agreement were you ref eiTing to ?
Mr. Cronin. I would say the international agreement.
The Chairman. What was it ?
Mr. Cronin. I don't recall. I didn't have anything to do with
signing it or entering into it or arranging it.
IMPROPER ACTIVITIES IN THE LABOR FIELD 15785
The Chairman. How could you know that it was going to work to
the mutual benefit?
Mr. Cronin. Because we were told that there was such an agree-
ment.
Tlie Chairman. He hadn't yet seen Mr. Carlough.
Mr. Cronin. Then Mr. Carlough probably told me.
The Chairman. He hadn't yet seen Mr. Carlough.
General Secretary Edward F. Carlough sufigested that you visit our offices
in the Transportation Building when you are in Washington.
Mr. Cronin. Undoubtedly Mr. Carlough had turned the assign-
ment over to an international man who signed the agreement. I don't
think Mr. Carlough had anything to do with signing the agreement.
The Chairman. Had the agreement been signed at that time?
Mr. Cronin. I wouldn't know, Senator ; I don't know.
The Chairman. You seem to know it was in existence.
Mr. Cronin. If that letter was written that way, then perhaps it
was signed at that time. But my recollection of the date of the signing
is vague. I don't know the dates.
The Chairman. When was the first time Mr. Burrows contacted
you ? "Wlien was the first time you saw him ?
Mr. Cronin. I don't know the date.
The Chairman. He testified that the first time he saw you, I believe,
was when he gave you the first money on the 8th of May 1952, or
shortly thereafter. That is the date of the letter to cash the check.
Within just a few days after that.
Mr. Kennedy. One moment, Mr. Chairman.
The Chairman. I am asking the w^itness about this. According
to the testimony here, with evidence corroborating to some extent by
exhibits lA, IB, and IC, when a $2,000 check transaction Avas had with
the Continental Illinois National Bank & Trust Co., Chicago, 111.
Mr. Burrows testified that he cashed this $2,000 check there, walked
down the street with you and Mr. Marks, and gave you this $2,000.
Did you see Mr, Burrows at that time ?
Mr. Cronin. I don't remember whether
The Chairman. Do you deny that you saw him on that trip ?
Mr. Cronin. I deny. I tell you frankly that Mr. Burrows' testi-
mony as to meeting me and handing me an envelope with $2,000 is
false.
The Chairman. All right. You stated that emphatically.
Did you see him at that time that he claims that he handed you that
envelope?
Mr. Cronin. Pardon me. I could have seen him around that time.
It could have been around the time that I met him.
The Chairman. Then you do not deny that you may have met him
and seen him at that time ?
Mr. Cronin. I never did deny that I met Mr. Burrows. I said I
met him two or three times, but I don't know the dates.
The Chairman. Would that date be substantially correct ?
Mr. Cronin. It wouldn't be anything in mv memory.
The Chairman. Obviously you had met him before July 7, 1953.
Mr. Kennedy. Mr. Chairman, that other payment was a payment
of $2,000, according to the previous witness, $2,000 in June of" 1952 ;
$5,000 in Januai-y of 1953 ; and then another payment of $5,000 at the
21243— 59— pt. 42 3
15786 IMPROPER ACTIVITIES IN THE LABOR FIELD
end of June 1953. This letter was then written on Jnly 7, 1953, and
obviously refers to the meeting where Mr. Burrows said that the third
payment was made.
The Chairman. This was July 2, 1953.
Mr. Kennedy. That was about 6 or 7 days after the meeting.
The Chairman. The third payment'^
Mr. Kennedy. That is correct.
The Chairman. I do not recall the number ot times.
Mr. Burrows, come forward a moment, please, sir.
TESTIMONY OF GAEL L. BUKROWS— Resumed
The Chairman. Mr. Burrows, to get the record absolutely clear,
since there appears to be an irreconcilable conflict of testimony be-
tween you and the witness Mr. Cronin, as I understood j^our testimony
the $2,000, which is represented by No. lA, IB, and IC, was on the
day you cashed the check and paid it to the witness :Mr. ( ronm^
Mr. Burrows. That is correct, sir.
The Chairman. By you in person I
Mr. Burrows. That is correct.
The Chairman. With Mr. Marks present ?
Mr. Burrows. That is correct.
The Chairman. That is one payment you made, and that one was
made on the street ?
Mr. Burrows. That is correct. , ^ , 115
The Chairman. How long after you had cashed the checks
Mr. Burrows. I would say within 15 minutes.
The Chairman. Within 15 minutes afterward. The second pay-
ment is represented here by documents made exhibits 2A, 2B, and 2C,
about the 15th of January 1953, the amount being $5,000.
Did you personally deliver that $5,000 to the witness Mr. C ronm {
Mr. Burrows. No, I did not. I delivered it to Mr. Marks, but I was
present when it was delivered to Mr. Cronin. .
The Chairman. You saw Mr. Marks deliver the envelope contain-
ing the money to Mr. Cronin ?
Mr. Burrows. That is correct.
The Chairman. So you know that was delivered {
Mr. Burrows. That is right.
The Chairman. The third one was the 18th of June 19o3, ^.s repre-
sented by exhibits 3A, 3B, and 3C, again in the amount ot $;),000.
Did you deliver that money to Mr. Cronin ?
Mr. BuRRow^s. No, sir. .
The Chairman. You were not present when it was delivered f
Mr. Burrows. No, sir.
The Chairman. You therefore couldn't swear of your own personal
knowledge that it actually was delivered I
Mr. Burrows. No, sir.
The Chairman. Were you present when tlie money was supposedly
delivered to Mr. Cronin; the $5,000, the latter part of December or
the first of January 1953 and 1954 ?
Mr. Burrows. I am sorry, I wasn't following you, J^enntor.
The Chairman. That is the fourth payment.
Mr. Burrows. And there was a fifth one.
IMPROPER ACTIVITIES IN THE LABOR FIELD 15787
The Chairman. There was a fifth one.
Mr. Burrows. I was not present on the occasion of the fourth pay-
ment.
The Chairman. You were not present on the occasion of exhibit 4,
represented by exhibit 4A, 4B, and 4C '.
Mr. BuRROAvs. No, sir.
Tlie Chairman. All you know is the information you have ?
Mr. Burrows. Throu^-h ]Mr. Marks; yes.
The CHAHorAN. You knew the money was withdrawn in both this
instance and the previous instance for the purpose of giving- it to
Mr. Cronin 'i
Mr. Burrows. That is correct.
The Chair:\ean. But you didn't actually see it delivered?
Mr. Burrows. I wasn't present.
The Chairman. You did see the tirst $2,000 delivered. You de-
livered that yourself?
Mr. Borrows. That is correct.
The Chairman. Aud the second ])ayuieut of $.^),0()(), you saw that
delivered yourself I
Mr. Burrows. That is correct.
The Chairman. Xow we have the tifth one. That is in June
11)54. Did you see that one delivered, as is represented here by
exhibits 5A, 5B, and 5C ? That, again, is in the amount of $5,000.
Mr. Ik'RRows. AVe have had so many
Mr. Kennedy. June 1054. Avhich is the llex^ to t!,e last payment.
Mr. liiRRows. Xo, sir.
The Ch AH{MAN. You did not see that one paid '.
Mr. Ik^Kows. Xo, sir.
Tlie CHAHniAN. Do you know tlie money was di-awn for tliat
})ur])()se '.
Mr. J-JuRRows. Yes, sir.
The Chairman. Whom did you instruct to give it to Mr. Ci'onin?
Ml. Burrows. Mr. Marks.
Tiie Cha]R.man. Did he report back to you that it was delivered^
Ml'. I^URRows. I am sure tliat he did, sir.
The Chairman. Xow, we have the last payment represented by
exhibits 6A, 6B, and 6C, dated approximately December 1, 1954.
Were you i)i'esent when tliat was delivered I
Mr. Burrows. I delivered it.
The CHAiR:\rAN. You actually delivered that in person i
Mr. Ik'RRows. That is correct.
The Chairman. Where was it delivered \
Mr. Burrows. In the LaSalle Hotel, in Chicago.
Tlie Chairman. In whose room ?
Afi-. Bi'RRows. It was in the cocktail room.
Ti'.e V\\ -jRMAN. In the cocktail lounge t
Mr. HiRRows. Yes.
The Chairman. Where was the second one delivered, the first $5,000
p-wment, the one vou sav vou were i^resent for when it was delivered
by^I)-. A[arks^
Mr. BiRRows. Tliat was either in mv room or Mr. Marks* room in
the LaSalle Hotel.
15788 IMPROPER ACTIVITIES IN THE LABOR FIELD
The Chairman. May I ask you regarding these letters that I have
iust made exhibits about the one from Mr. Cronin to you dated July
2, 1953, now made exhibit lOA, and the copy of your reply thereto,
dated Julv 7, 1953, to Mr. Cronin. .^ ,
I will ask you to examine these exhibits and state if they are true
photostatic copies of the original.
(Documents handed to the witness.)
Mr. Burrows. Yes, sir.
The Chairman. Do you identify them? ;. cr^onVina
I note in Mr. Cronin's letter to you this language. He is speaking
■with reference to his conversation. He said :
Tlie writer spent a pleasant few hours visit with Lou Marks in Chicago.
111., last week. „ , . i j.
Was any payment made to Mr. Cronin at the time of this pleasant
few hours with Mr. Marks, according to your information ^
Mr. Burrows. I don't have the dates of the checks, sir, but I think
you will find one at about the same time. i ^ ^„ +i.«
^ The Chairman. I do find one here. The check was cashed on t^ie
25th day of June in the amount of $5,000. Do you recall whether Mr.
Marks was in Chicago at that time ?
Mr. Burrows. I am sure that he was. _ j„^o o-f+ar
The Chairman. This letter was received by you a few days alter
Mr. Marks' visit there?
Mr. Burrows Correct. ^ ^^ ^ , i ^.^ at^ iUovL-q
The Chairman. At a time when $5,000 was entrusted to Mr. Marks
to deliver to Mr. Cronin ?
Mr. Burrows. Correct.
The Chairman. He says, after this pleasant few hours :
We discussed conditions in various parts of the country relative to your
product, and again I would like to assure you of our cooperation.
What did you understand him to mean by "cooperation"? What
had transpired preceding this letter that he could be referring to as
""""Mr.'BuRROWS. All I can tell you, sir, is when we had a Problem in
some area, I normally referred it to Mr. Marks and he would take it
up with Mr. Cronin and our troubles were handled in that way.
The Chairman. You troubles w^ould end?
Mr. Burrows. That's right. ^ v ^-Frv.i.fnol
The Chairman. He says "as we feel that the agreement s of mutual
benefit." What did he refer to there as "the agreement i
Mr. Burrows. I can't tell you that, sir. I had no specific agree-
ment with Mr. Cronin. . , ,
The Chairman. Did you have any agreement at that time witli tne
international, as such ?
Mr. Burrows. I can't tell you that, either.
(The witness conferred with his counsel.)
Mr. Burrows. I don't believe we did. ^ , . i «. +
The Chairman. Had you ever visited the international othce up to
that time? . .
Mr. Burrows. I never did visit it. ,, tt j /^ i i.?
The Chairman. Did you at that time know Mr. Howard Carlough?
Mr. Burrows. I don't know him now.
The Chairman. You had never met him ?
IMPROPER ACTIVITIES EST THE LABOR FIELD 15789
Mr. Burrows. No, sir.
The Chairman. He says "the agreement is of mutual benefit."
You had no agreement, as I understand, with the international?
Mr. Burrows. I don't believe so, sir.
The Chairman. That is, other than such an agreement as you may
have had with Mr. Cronin.
Mv. Burrows. That's right.
The Chairman. He had represented the international in his con-
tacts with you, or you had gone to him, you and Mr. Marks, as a
representative of the international ?
Mr. Burrows. Mr. Marks had gone to him when we were in trouble ;
yes.
The Chairman. This says "feel that the agreement is of mutual
benelit." You were getting some benefit from it, were you not, by
not being molested ?
Mr. Burrows. That's right.
The Chairman. ^Vliat benefit could the union be getting from it
other than the payments you were making to Mr. Cronin ?
Mr. Burrows. I don't know.
The Chairman. Well, he says "of mutual benefit." I do not know
whether he meant of mutual benefit to the union, to the lodge, or to
himself and to you.
Mr. Burrows. I wouldn't know that.
The Chairman. You would know $5,000 worth, would you not,
at that time ?
Mr. Burrows. Yes, sir ; that is correct.
The Chairman. Plus what you had previously paid ?
Mr. Burrows. That is correct.
The Chairman. There is that much benefits to somebody, either
Mr. Cronin or the union, is there not, or someone else ?
Mr. Burrows. That is correct.
The Chairj^ian. So he expressed his satisfaction with the arrange-
ment that it was of mutual benefit, and also assured you of his co-
operation or, "our cooperation," as he refers to it. Wliat did you
understand about all of that? What action did you take, or what
satisfaction did it give you to have such assurances from Mr. Cronin?
Mr. Burrows. Well, it gave me no particular satisfaction because
we weren't having any particular trouble. I mean when we had
trouble we would call it to Mr. Cronin's attention and he took care of
it for us.
The Chairman. He took care of it, and you took care of Mr. Cronin,
in turn ?
Mr. Burrows. That is correct.
The Chairman. With cash payments ?
Mr. Burrows. That is correct.
The Chairman. And that was the only agreement that you had?
Mr. Burrows. That is correct.
The Chairman. That is the only arrangement he could possibly be
referring to here, when he savs that the "agi'eement is of mutual
benefit"?
Mr. Burrows. So far as I know.
The Chairman. You know of nothing else he could be referring
to?
15790 IMPROPER ACTIVITIES IN THE LABOR FIELD
Mr. Burrows. No.
The Chairman. You could not have anything else in mind from
your contacts with him and what you Imew about him, except that
he meant that the payoffs to him were of mutual benefit for the serv-
ices rendered to you ?
Mr. Burrows. That is correct.
The Chairman. I note in your reply after thanking him for his
letter you say :
It would appear that our working arrangements with your union are excellent.
Did you write that letter ?
Mr. Burrows. Yes, sir.
The Chairman. What did you have in mind when you made that
statement?
Mr. Burrows. Well, I think just what the letter says, sir.
The Chairman. Just what you have been talking about? .
Mr. Burrows. That we were getting along fine.
The Chairman. Just what you testified to here ?
Mr. Burrows. That is correct.
The Chairman. That is why the arrangements were excellent?
Mr. Burrows. That is right.
The Chairman. And he was head of the union, not only of that
local but also a vice president of the international?
Mr. Burrows. That is correct.
The Chairman. So when you referred to the union, you meant the
things you had worked out with him and the transactions as you were
handling them at the time and the results you were getting, they were
excellent ?
Mr. Burrows. They were satisfactory, excellent.
TESTIMONY OF ARTHUR H. CRONIN, ACCOMPANIED BY COUNSEL,
NATHAN M. COHEN— Resumed
The Chairman. Mr. Cronin, you heard the further testimony of Mr.
Burrows. Do you wish to conunent on it?
Mr. Cronin. Just to say that it is false.
(The witness conferred with his counsel.)
The Chairman. You state that the testimony given here by Witness
Burrows is definitely false ?
Mr. Cronin. Yes. I would like to add to that. Inasmuch as Mr.
Marks comes into the picture, I would only like to say if these finances
were taken out of the Coleman Co., and given to Mr. Marks or Mr.
Burrows, I just say that neither one of them ever gave me any money
except the last payment of $5,0()(), which I returned.
The Chairman. May I ask you if you had a conversation witli Mr,
Burrows after you had' returned the $5,000?
Mr. Croxin. Yes.
The Chairman. Whei-e did you have that conversation?
Mr. Cronin. He called me on the phone and made a date to come to
Chicago and, as I remember, he asked me what the trouble was. I
said, ^'There was no (i-ouble, no trouble at all." 1 told liini tliat I
returned the $5,000 because I didn't want it.
Tlie Chairman. Did you discovei- at tliat time that an internal rev-
enue man was witnessing these payoit's?
IMPROPER ACTI\ITIKS IX THK LABOR FIELD 15791
Mr. Chonix. I (lid not know iinytliin<:- abonl that. 1 don't know
anything abont it now.
The (yHAiKMAx. Yon stall' now yon do not know anything about it?
Mr. Cronin. I don't know anything about it.
The Chairman. Do you mean to say you never heard of such oc-
curring?
Mr. (yRONiN. No; I can't remember hearing anything like that.
The Chairman. If you had heard about it, you would likely have
remembered it?
Mr. Cronin. I am sorry, Senator. I just don't remember anything
about that at all.
The (^hairman. You can't remember anything about it.
The Chair would make this observation.
AYell, tirst, how long did you keep this last $5,000 that has been
testified to here before you returned it ?
Mr. Cronin. I think it was the next day that I sent it back.
The Chairman. xVccording to the testimony here it would seem to
be for about 4 days.
Mr. Cronin. I don't think it was that long. Senator.
Mr. Kennedy. We have the registered letter.
Mr. Cronin. It could have been 2 or o days. I don't know. Maybe
it covered over Saturday and Sunday. I don't remember.
Mr. Kennedy, Four days, Mr. Chairman.
The Chairman. The record will reflect the time. What transpired
during the time you kept the money ?
Mr. Cronin. I don't know what you mean, "what transpired."
The Chairman. Anything that would throw any light on the
transaction ?
Mr. Cronin. Nothing, to my knowledge.
The Chairman. Did you report to the president or to the general
secretary of the international that you had received this money ?
Mr. Cronin. I did not.
The Chairman. You have never reported that you received it ?
Mr. Cronin. That's right.
The Chairman. You have never conveyed that information to any-
one else ?
Mr. Cronin. That's right.
The Chairman. It is something you kept as a secret of your own ?
Mr. Cronin. That's right.
The Chairman. What did you regard the $5,000 as at the time you
received it? When you discovered you had $5,000, what did you think
it w^as intended for, or how did you regard it ?
Mr. Cronin. Well, I didn't like it. I don't know how I regarded it.
I didn't want it. Apparently, it was a present. I didn't w\ant it and I
returned it.
The Chairman. A further check of the records here, the documents
that have gone in as exhibits, that have been sworn to here, reflects that
you retained the money for 7 days instead of 4.
Mr. Cronin. No ; I don't believe that is true.
Mr. Kennedy. We can put the witness on, Mr. Chairman.
We have examined the check and examined the document. The
money was passed on December 20. Your letter was written on Decem-
ber 24, but the letter was not sent. The postmark shows that the letter
was not sent returning the money until December 27.
15792 IMPROPER ACTIVITIES IN THE LABOR FIELD
Mr. Cronin. Could that have been over a weekend, do you think, or
some holiday?
Mr. Kennedy. The least it could have been would be 4 days, Decem-
ber 24, and if you had $5,000 and somebody paid you off, I would think
you would want to get that in the mailbox immediately, that you would
not be keeping it until December 27. It is December 27 when the
letter is postmarked.
The Chairman. Apparently, if it is dated correctly, if it was writ-
ten on that date, it was dated 4 days afterwards but the letter was
not actually mailed until 7 days afterwards. During that time, what
did you do with the $5,000 ?
Mr. Cronin. Well, I don't remember how many days it was. You
tell me it was 4. I don't remember. As soon as I could get to the
bank where I do business, I had a check made out and sent it back,
whether it was 1 day, 2, 3, or 4.
I think there might have been some holidays in between there. I am
not sure.
(The witness conferred with his counsel.)
The Chairman. That could have been. I am just trying to get the
record straight.
Mr. Cronin. Well, as soon as I opened the envelope, Senator, I made
up my mind to send it back.
The Chairman. May I ask you did you make a deposit of that
$5,000?
Mr. Cronin. No, sir.
The (^hairman. You took the same money you received and bought
the cashier's check ?
Mr. Cronin. Yes.
The Chairman. Sir?
Mr. Cronin. Yes.
The (^hairman. The identical money you received?
Mr. Cronin. That is right.
The Chairman. Was that a strange thing to happen to you?
Mr. (Cronin. Quite strange.
The Chairman. So strange that you thought it ought to be kept
secret ?
Mr. Cronin. I didn't think of it that way, as keeping it secret.
The Chairman. Did you ever ascertain in your telephone conversa-
tion or later in your personal conversation with Mr. Burrows — and I
believe you did later have a personal conversation with him; is that
correct ?
Mr. Cronin. That is right.
The Chairman. After you had returned this money, that is. Did
you ascertain from him either in the telephone conversation or in the
personal conversation you had with him thereafter, what he had in
mind, what the purpose was of his handing you this $5,000?
Mr. Cronin. No. I thought it strange, but we didn't talk too much
■when he came to Chicago.
The (^H airman. Did you have any curiosity to inquire into it as to
why he did it?
Mr. Cronin. No, I didn't. I did not ask.
The Chairman. You did not think he was trying to bribe you ?
IMPROPER ACTIVITIES IN THE LABOR FIELD 15793
Mr. Cronin. Well, that did come to my mind. I thought of it more
as a present.
The Chairman. As what?
Mr. Cronin. As a present, prior to Christmas. I didn't want the
thing.
The Chairman. You didn't say that in your letter.
Mr. Cronin. I didn't answer a letter regarding that.
The Chairman. No. You wrote a letter returning the money.
Mr. Cronin. That's right.
The Chairiman. You thought he was handing you a big Christmas
present : was that your idea of it?
Mr. Cronin. That is my idea of it.
The Chairman. Would you have accepted a Christmas present from
him?
Mr. Cronin. No, sir.
The Chairman. Of any kind ?
Mr. Cronin. No, sir.
The Chairman. Then since he called you and wanted to talk to you
about it when he came to see you, why did you not ask him what in
the world he had in mind doing such a strange thing ?
(The witness conferred with his counsel.)
Mr. Cronin. Would you read the question, please?
The Chairman. I say why did you not inquire of him when he came
and talked to you about what he had in mind by doing such a strange
thing.
Mr. Cronin. Well, Senator, we had a conversation in my office and
we might have talked of that, but I don't remember the conversation.
The Chairman. Did you ever have any other employer, business-
man, hand you $5,000 in a package like that ?
Mr. Cronin. No, sir.
The Chairman. Any smaller amounts ?
Mr. Cronin. No, sir.
The Chairman. That was a most unusual occurrence, then, in your
experience, was it not ?
Mr. Cronin. It certainly was.
The Chairman. And you did not have enough curiosity about it to
ask Mr. Burrows when he came to see you to talk to you about it, to
ask him what he had in mind, what he was trying to do, or what the
purpose of giving you $5,000 was ?
Mr. Cronin. It is pretty hard for me to remember the conversation,
Senator.
The Chairman. Don't you think you would remember that, 1954 ?
Mr. Cronin. No, I don't remember. I don't remember the con-
versation we had. It was short. He came to my office. He was only
there about 10 minutes and he left.
The Chairman. Wliat was your first contact with Mr. Burrows, by
telephone or in person ?
Mr. Cronin. If my memory serves me correctly, I think that Mr.
Marks introduced me to him in Chicago.
The Chairman. In December 1954, when this $5,000 payment was
made, which you acknowledge having received but returned, who
initiated that meeting?
Mr. Cronin. Mr. Burrows.
15794 IMPROPER ACTIVITIES IN THE LABOR FIELD
The Chairman. Did Mr. Burrows call you or did you call Mr,
Burrows ?
Mr. Cronin. Mr. Burrows called me. I heard him testify.
The Chairman. It was a meeting that was arranged by a telephone
conversation; is that correct; but it was on Mr. Burrow's call, you
state?
Mr. Cronin. As I remember, Mr. Burrows called me. I do not
remember calling Mr. Burrows to arrange a meeting.
The Chairman. And Mr. Marks died at that time i
Mr. Cronin. I did not know when Mr. Marks died or whether he
was with the firm or not.
Mr. Burrows. He died shortly thereafter.
The Chairman. Was he active with your company ?
Mr. Burrows. He w^as no longer with us.
The Chairman. He was no longer with your company at that time.
May I ask you who initiated this meeting? He testified it was done
by telephone arrangement. Did you place the call to Mr. Cronin or
did he call you i
Mr. BuRROw^s. Mr. Cronin called me.
The Chairman. Do you remember tlie date of it (
Mr. Burrows. I do not.
The Chairman. Have we checked those ?
Mr. Kp:nnedy. We will have to collect it.
The Chairman. We will check the records of the telephone ex-
change to see if we can determine the accuracy of the testimony as to
which is accurate and which is incorrect. Is there anything further
at this time ? Senator Kennedy ?
Senator Ivennedy. On an entirely diU'erent matter, is it customary
for the sheet-metal workers to refuse to install products which are
made by tlie stove mounters ?
Mr. Cronin. We have never refused to install them in Chicago.
Senator Kennedy. Do you know if the union has refused, or have
you ever heard of that ?
Mr. Cronin. Have I heard that? I heard that there have been
stoppages of work. Senator Kennedy, but I don't know where they
were.
Senator Kennedy. In other words, within the area of your com-
petence, you know of no case where your members of your union
refused to install the jn-oducts manufactured by this company ?
Mr. Cronin. That is correct.
Senator Kennedy. Thank you.
Mr. Kennedy. Why did you keep this correspondence that was
turned over to you in December of 1954 ?
Mr. (Cronin. Keep wliat correspondence?
Mr. Kennedy. Corresjjondence dealing with the problems that this
comi)any was having out on the west coast.
Mr. Cronin. Because I was just afraid, and that is why I had the
check pilot ostated and the letter, too, so tluit I would linv(>'a record of
return iug the money.
Mr. Kennedy. Why did you keep the rorrespoudence ( Why didn't
you return that?
Mr. Cronin. Why didn't J return i
IMPROPER ACTIVITIES IN THE LABOR FIELD 15795
Mr. Kennedy. Why didn't you return the correspondence dealing
with tlie problems that the company was having on the west coast that
Mr. Burrows gave to you ?
Mr. Cronin. 1 tliiiik tliat that particular letter, Mr. Kennedy, I
called the international office on. I don't remember just what hap-
pened, but it wasn't of a major proportion, that trouble they had,
insofar as I was concerned.
Mr. Kennedy. Did you call the international office about it?
Mr. Cronin. I think, as I remember, I did; yes.
Mr. Kennedy. Why were you taking such an interest in helping
the Coleman Co. ?
Mr. Cronin, Well, I waasn't taking too much of an interest. The
only interest I took in it was an interest that I would take in any
company that might have been interested in organizing their shop.
Inasmuch as it was out of my jurisdiction, I turned it over to the
international office. I had no personal interest in it whatever.
Mr. Kennedy. Did you read the correspondence while you were in
the restaurant?
Mr. Cronin. What correspondence?
Mr. Kennedy. These letters that Mr. Burrows had with him.
Mr. Cronin. Later on, as I got home, as I remember that day and I
think Mr. Burrows remembers it, it was very dark in that cocktail
lounge.
Mr. Kennedy. So you could not read it ?
Mr. Cronin. I couldn't read it then ; no.
Mr. Kennedy. The only thing in that envelope was the $5,000?
Mr. Cronin. That's right, as I remember it.
Mr. Kennedy. Did you open that envelope when you got home, too?
Mr. Cronin. When I got home ; yes.
Mr. Kennedy. You definitely did not read the correspondence while
you were in the restaurant.
Mr. Cronin. I tried to read it and it was too dark.
Mr. Kennedy. What did you think was in the envelope when he
gave it to you?
Mr. Cronin. I didn't know. I didn't particularly pay any atten-
tion to it.
Mr. Kennedy. Why didn't you open it up tlien ?
Mr. Cronin. I didn't want to open anything up then. I tried to
read the letter and I couldn't even see the printing on the letter.
Mr. Kennedy. What did you expect was in the envelope ?
Mr. Cronin. I didn't have any idea.
Mr. Kennedy. I don't understand. Somebody hands you an enve-
lope and you didn't open it. You did open it that day and did not
return it for 7 days, but there was $5,000 in it. It sounds very peculiar
at best ; don't you think ?
Mr. Cronin. I hadn't given it a thought.
Mr. Kennedy, Did you receive any money from any other com-
panies or employers?
Mr. Cronin. No.
Mr. Kennedy. You never have ?
Mr. Cohen. Senator McClellan ?
The Chairman. We are not through with this witness yet. Before
recessing for lunch, the Chair wishes to make this observation :
15796 IMPROPER ACTIVITIES IN THE LABOR FIELD
It is very disheartening to have witnesses come before us and tell
such conflicting stories. We are only trying to ascertain the truth.
We place witnesses on the stand often without any preconceived ideas
as to whether they will tell the truth or not tell the truth or even not
answer questions.
It is perfectly apparent to everyone that the testimony of Mr.
Burrows and the testimony of Mr. Cronin is in irreconcilable conflict.
The testimony is such, so diametrically opposite as to facts and
truths, that it does not permit acceptance of it as an honest difference
of opinion.
The testimony is in disagreement or in conflict. It is not opinion
evidence but statements of fact on transactions that either occurred
or did not occur. They cannot be accepted, therefore, as honest
differences of opinion, lack of recollection, or even faulty memory.
One of you, in my judgment, and I think we will all agree, has
deliberately perjured himself before this committee. It is not always
possible for us to determine immediately who is committing the
perjury, though we may have a definite opinion about it.
In such cases, it becomes the duty of this committee, as I con-
ceive our function, to promptly transmit the transcript of this testi-
mony to the Justice Department. That will be done today or as
soon as the transcript can be prepared and the Justice Department will
be urged to promptly pursue it to the end that it may be determined
who is the perjurer and who is telling the truth with a view to having
him who committed the crime of perjury prosecuted and a penalty
imposed according to law.
We will recess until 2 o'clock this afternoon, when both of the
witnesses will be back.
Mr. CoiiEN. Senator McClellan?
The Chairman. Mr. Counsel, I beg your pardon.
Mr. Cohen. May I pose a question to the Chair? We did want
to explore further the matter of your exhibits* 10-A and 10-B, which
were testified to in response to your questions by Mr. Burrows.
It seems that there is an impression left that there was some
arrangement spoken of which is unexplained. Mr. Cronin would
like to explain that.
The Chairman. For your information, we will recall the witness
immediately upon reconvening.
(Whereupon, at 1 :10 p.m., the hearing in the above-entitled mat-
ter was recessed, to reconvene at 2:15 p.m. of the same day.)
(Present at the taking of the recess were Senators McClellan and
Kennedy.)
afternoon session
The Chairman. The committee will be in order.
(Present at the reconvening of the session were Senators McClellan
and Kennedy.)
The Chairman. Call the next witness.
Mr. Kennedy. Mr. Cronin, please, Mr. Chairman.
IMPROPER ACTIVITIES IN THE LABOR FIELD 15797
TESTIMONY OF ARTHUR CRONIN, ACCOMPANIED BY HIS COUNSEL,
NATHAN COHEN— Resumed
The Chairman. Mr. Cronin, have a seat. Vou will remain ui'der
the same oath.
Proceed, Mr. Counsel.
Mr. Kennedy. Mr. Cronin, your personal financial books and
records were snbpenaed, were they not, in October of this year ?
Mr. Cronin. That is right.
Mr. Kennedy. Do you have those books and records available?
Mr. Cronin. No, I don't have them with me. I didn't realize I
was coming down here until yesterday afternoon.
The Chairman. Let me have the subpena, please.
Mr. Cronin. May I go ahead ?
The Chairman. Just a moment, please.
Mr. Kennedy. We will have to get it downstairs.
The Chairman. We will send and get the subpena and you may
proceed. The Chair will examine it and then make proper disposition
ofit.
Mr. Cronin. I believe there was a subpena issued in October to me,
as an individual, and also as president of the Chicago local. They
were accepted by my attorney and I am not too sure just what hap-
pened, but I believe that they call for "forthwith," and that was
waived with the understanding that we would submit our records to
the investigators, which we did.
Now, when the others of our union were subpenaed last week, I
believe, I did not receive a subpena.
Mr. Kennedy. I am talking about your personal books and records.
Mr. Cronin. That's right.
Mr. Kennedy. They were subpenaed in October of this year.
Mr. Cronin. That's right, Mr. Kennedy.
The Chairman. May I ask you if you are now prepared to make them
available to the committee ?
Mr. Cronin. I will be glad to make them available, but I don't have
them with me. I didn't know I was coming down here until yesterday
afternoon.
The Chairman. Then I understand you will promptly comply with
the subpena.
Mr. Cronin. As soon as I can get back to Chicago and bring them
back with me. I don't have them with me.
The Chairman. You will be under orders to deliver your records
and make them available to the committee promptly upon your
return.
Mr. Cronin. At any particular time ?
The Chairman. As quickly as you can get them together. How
long do you think it will take you to arrange to submit them.
Mr. Cronin. Well, I ought to have a week or 10 days.
Mr. Kennedy. This is since October 15.
The Chairman. Have you assembled them since you got the
subpena ?
Mr. Cronin. No, sir, I have not.
The Chairman. What is today ?
Mr. Kennedy. It is December 2.
15798 IMPROPER ACTIVITIES IN THE LABOR FIELD
The Chairman. The Chair will direct you to deliver the records on
December 5. You can get them together and if you cannot deliver
all of them at that time you may confer with counsel or the investi-
gator and there will be no disposition on the part of the committee to
work any undue hardship on you and we only want compliance.
Mr, Cohen. Is that delivery liere in Washington?
The Chairman. You may deliver them to our investigator.
Mr. Kennedy. We want to make sure they are all intact.
The Chairman. Now, I just said that you could deliver them on
the 5th. That is Friday. I will give you until next Monday at noon
and that is the 8th of December. Your records are to be delivered
liere to the committee in room 101, Senate Office Building.
Proceed.
Mr. Kennedy. Now, Mr. Cronin, have you had any other financial
interest or source of income other than your union income, or money
jou receive from the union ?
Mr. Cronin. I have investments in bonds.
Mr. Kennedy. Have you had investments in any companies which
have contracts with the Sheet Metal Workers Union ?
Mr. Cronin. I don't have ; no.
Mr. Kennedy. Have you had in the past ?
Mr. Cronin. Some years ago I owned a fitting company.
Mr. Kennedy. What was tlie name of that company ?
Mr. Cronin. Acme Furnace Fitting Co.
Mr. Kennedy. And when did you sell your interest in that ?
Mr. Cronin, Well, shortly after I became an official of the union
and we incorporated the company and I kept some stock in it.
Mr. Kennedy. When did you get rid of your interest ?
Mr. Cronin. I think about 3 or 4 years ago.
Mr, Kennedy. In 1955?
Mr. Cronin. 1954 and 1955.
Mr. Kennedy. How much of the stock did you own, what per-
centage ?
Mr. Cronin. Well, at one time when I had the company, I owned
the entire company.
Mr. Kennedy. How much did you own at the time you sold it ?
Mr. Cronin, Well, I think I received for the investment around
50 — I'm not sure. I can't be too sure,
Mr, Kennedy, It was around $50,000 ?
Mr, Cronin, It could be ; yes,
Mr, Kennedy, To whom did you sell this company ?
Mr. Cronin, To George Sullivan.
Mr, Kennedy, Who is George Sullivan ?
Mr. Cronin, Well, he is the owner, the present owner of the Acme
Furnace Fitting Co, He was a stockholder of Acme at the time.
The Chairman, I would like to inquire if this Acme P'urnace Co,
was the company that Avas in competition with the Coleman Co,
Mr, Cronin, No, Senator, it wasn't.
The Cii.mr:\ian. Was it in competition with other sheet metal pro-
ducers or Avorkers?
Mr, ( /ROxiN, I think there are other companies.
The Chairman, Was it in competition with other companies you
h a d a 1 a bor con t ract w i tli ?
IMPROPER ACTIVITIES IN THE LABOR FIELD 15799
Mr, Ckonix. There aie other companies in that area manufacturing
furnace fitt in fjs.
The CiiAimiAX. Witli whom your union had a bargaining contract?
Mr. Cronin. I think one of them was, and some were nonunion and
some were union.
Mr. Kexxedy. Did yon suggest to any contractors that they give
business to your comj)any ?
Mr. Cronin". Absohitely not.
The Chairman. Did you instruct any of the business agents of the
local to suggest to contractors that they give business to your com-
pany ?
Mr. Cronin, Xo, sir.
The Ciiairman. You never did (
Mr. Cronin. No, sir.
The (^HAiRMAN. You never had any conversations along those lines?
Mr. Cronin. No, sir.
The Chairman. What was the Acme Co. producing ?
Mr. Cronin. Warm-air furnace fittings.
The Chairman. What volume of business did it do each year ?
Mr. Cronin. I would say, it is pretty hard for me to remember and
I would say it was about half a million dollars worth of business a
year.
The Chairman. How many employees did you have ?
Mr. Cronin. Well, when 1 got rid of the company — I think there
were only seven or eight employees, that is when we formed the corpo-
ration, or when the corporation was formed.
The C 'hairman. When was the corporation formed ?
Mr. Cronin, Well, it had to l>e in the forties sometime and I'm
not sure of the exact date.
The Chairman. When you sold your interest in this company in
1954, how many employees did it have ?
Mr. C'ronin. Well, 1 had no interest in the company and so I couldn't
:tell you.
The Chairman. You had an interest in 1954 ?
Mr. Cronin. I had a financial interest, but a personal interest, none.
The Chairman. You had a financial interest ?
Mr. C'ronin. I wasn't interested in how many they employed.
The Chairman. How^ many employees, approximately, did this
.company have in which you were able to sell your interest for $50,000
and which was the company that you formed ?
Mr. Cronin, I suppose it might have been 25,
The Chairman, Were they all members of the Sheet Metal Workers
XTnion ?
Mr. Cronin. The sheet-metal workers were.
The Chairman. How many of them were sheet-metal workers ?
Mr. Cronin. About, I would say 15 to 18.
The Chairman. With whom did the Acme Furnace Co. si<rn a
contract covering the sheet-metal workers ?
Mr. CSoNiN. They have had a signed contract, or thev have had a
jiabel for, I would say, 28 yeai-s.
The Chairman. AVas this contract with local 73 ?
Mr, Cronin. Yes.
15800 niPROPER ACTIVITIES IN THE LABOR FIELD
The Chairman. This was the union of which you were president?
Mr. Cronin. Understand, it was not a signed contract. They
signed an agreement to use the union label, which label is always
under the ownership of the local union, or the international union.
The ChxMRMAn. Are we to understand from that testimony that
sometimes a label is sold to a business, or transferred to a business
without their people being organized ?
Mr. Cronin. No, the label is never sold.
The Chairman. How do you handle it ?
]\Ir. Cronin. Well, if a company
The Chairman. You just farm it out for some purpose?
Mr. Cronin. No, it is not farmed out.
The Chairman. Tell us how that is handled. I thought a labor
union clearly indicated the goods were produced by union labor, is
that correct ?
Mr. Cronin. That's right.
The Chairman. Although as I understand now, you can have the
use of a union label notwithstanding that there is not a working
contract between management and the union.
Mr. Cronin. That isn't so.
The Chairman. Well, I thought you said that they had no contract.
Mr. Cronin. In the Chicago area we sign a contract with our asso-
ciations, and if for instance, a person were in business in that area
and he didn't sign an individual agreement, as many of our con-
tractors do not, who don't belong to the associations, they are per-
mitted and are accepted as union companies and we give it to them.
That is they hire men, or they use union sheet-metal workers.
The Chairman. I still do not understand it. Your company had
no written contract dealing with labor as to working conditions and
wages, is that correct? Your company, Acme Furnace Co., had no
written contract with your union with respect to Avorking conditions,
hours, wages, and so forth.
Mr. Cronin. Well, they would be governed by the written agree-
ment that is signed by the three associations.
The Chairman. I am asking whether they had a w^ritten contract.
Mr. Cronin. Not to my knowledge, they never had a written con-
tract.
The Chairman. I don't quite understand it.
Proceed.
Mr. Kj;nnedy. As I understand it, you were members of the asso-
ciation ?
Mr. Cronin. Sir?
Mr. Ivj:nnedy. This company was a member of the association, is
that right ?
Mr. Cronin. I tliink some years ago it was, but I don't think it is
now.
Mr. Kennedy. At the time that you had your interest in it, was it
a member of the association ?
Mr. Cronin. I can't recall that.
Mr. Kennedy. How could it have any of your people or how could
it have the union label if they were not members of the association
and they did not sign a contract?
IMPROPER ACTIVITIES IN THE LABOR FIELD 15801
Mr. Cronin. At that time, Mr. Kennedy, each contractor was not
required to sign an individual agreement. There has been an area
agreement in the Chicago area for many, many years.
Mr. IvENNEDY. Who was encompassed in the area agreement?
Mr. Cronin". The ventilating contractors, air conditioning alliance,
and the general sheet-metal contractors.
Mr. Kennedy. What if you did not want to be covered.
Mr. Cronin. It would be perfectly all right. They are not forced
to belong.
Mr. Ej:nnedy. How was it determined who would be covered and
who would not be covered ?
Mr. Cronin. Well, if a man wanted to hire a union sheet-metal
worker and we agreed to give them union sheet-metal workers, it was
not necessary for him to belong to any association.
Mr. Kennedy. You mean he just came to you and the union in order
to get the employees ?
Mr. Cronin. He came to the union.
Mr. I^NNEDY. And if he came to the union to get the employees, he
was covered by the agreement ?
Mr. Cronin. That is right.
Mr. I^NNEDY. And then he would have to live up to this agreement
if he came to the union ?
Mr. Cronin. As written in the regular standard form of agreement,
that the associations signed.
Mr. Kennedy. If he did not come to you, then that meant that he
was not covered by the agreement ?
Mr. Cronin. That is right.
Mr. Kennedy. Could he come to you for some people and not
others ? It had to be all or none ?
Mr. Cronin. All or none.
Mr. Kjinnedy. If he came to you, he could use the union label ?
Mr. Cronin. Well, if he came to me or came to the union and agreed
with the union that he would hire union men, and that he wanted to
manufacture fittings and pay the scale of wages, then we would re-
quest from the international permission to give him a union label and
that, I believe, was done in the case of Acme.
Mr. KJENNEDY. Did you have an interest in any other company
during that period of time ?
Mr. Cronin. No.
Mr. Kennedy. Did you have an interest in the Sunbeam Air Con-
ditioning?
Mr. Cronin. I acquired some stock in the Sunbeam.
Mr. Kennedy. What did the Sunbeam Air Conditioning Co. do?
INIr. Cronin. They installed furnaces in the Chicago area.
Mr. Kennedy. When did you sell that stock ?
Mr. Cronin. Well, that was included in the Acme deal. Sullivan
owned both companies.
Mr. Kennedy. And you also had an interest in the Sunbeam ?
Mr. Cronin. Yes, sir.
Mr. Kennedy. And you sold this stock to him ?
Mr. Cronin. That is right.
Mr. Kennedy. Is that part of the $50,000 ?
Mr. Cronin. That's right.
21243— 59— pt. 42 4
15802 IMPROPER ACTIVITIES IN THE LABOR FIELD
Mr. Kennedy. How many employees did that company have ?
Mr. Cronin. I couldn't tell you.
Mr. Kennedy. Well, approximately, how many employees did it
have ?
Mr. Cronin. They varied. In the building trades, they are up and
down, and I would say, steady employees, they might have had 30
or 35.
Mr. Kennedy. How many of those were sheet-metal workers ?
Mr. Cronin. All of the sheet-metal workers, but not the office
force.
Mr. Kennedy. But out of the 30 or 35, they were all sheet-metal
workers.
Mr. Cronin. Anyone who performed sheet-metal work.
Mr. Kennedy. How long had you owned that stock '(
Mr. Cronin. I don't think it was more than a couple of years.
Mr. Kennedy. From whom did you purchase it ?
Mr. Cronin. From George Sullivan.
Mr. Kennedy. You purchased it and sold it back to him ?
Mr. Cronin. That's right.
Mr. Kennedy. How much did you purchase it for ^
Mr. Cronin. I would have to go to my records.
Mr. Kennedy. That is why we wanted to get youi* records.
Mr. Cronin. I can find that out, and I will be glad to.
Mr. Kennedy. Approximately how much did you pay for the stock?
Mr. Cronin. I can tell you this: I didn't make any money on the
transactions.
Mr. Kennedy. How much did you pay for it ?
Mr. Cronin. I couldn't tell you without going to my records.
Mr. Kennedy. Do you have a bank account, Mr. Cronin ^
Mr. Cronin. Yes, sir.
ISIr. Kennedy. Wliere is your bank account ?
Mr. Cronin. At the River Forest State Bank, and we have a savings
account.
Mr. Kennedy. Do you have any other bank account ?
Mr. Cronin. I have a checking account in the INIerchants National
]5ank.
Mr. Kennedy. Do you deposit all of your money in those bank
ncocunts ?
Mr. Cronin. Yes; and we have a savings acocunt in the Ashland
State Bank, in Chicago, and a savings account in the St. Paul Federal
Savings & Loan.
Mr. Kennedy. Do you keep any cash other than that ?
Mr. Cronin. Oh, some. I keep some cash available.
Mr. Kennedy. IIow much money do you keep available ?
Mr. Cronin. Around a couple of thousand dollars.
Mr. Kennedy. In cash ?
Mr. (Cronin. Yes, sir.
Mr. Kennedy, Where do you keep that ?
Mr. ('ronin. Usually on my person or in my home.
Mr. Kennedy, You carry a couple of thousand dollars in cash
nromid on your person ?
Mr. Cronin. Oh, no. If I am going on a trip to Florida, maybe I
uoiihl, but it is uot customary for me to carry that much.
IMPROPER ACTIVITIES IN THE LABOR FIELD 15803
Mr. Kennedy, Do you keep it at home if you do not have it on your
person?
Mr. Cronin. Yes, sometimes, mostly, yes; and it isn't always that
amount.
Mr. Kennedy. Is it ever more than that ?
Mr. Cronin. Not too iiiueli.
Mr. Kennedy. You transact business much in cash ?
Mr. Cronin. No ; mostly by check.
Mr. Kennedy. Do you have a box at home that you keep it in?
Mr. Cronin. xVt home ?
Mr. Kennedy. Yes.
( Witness conferred with his counsel. )
Mr. Kennedy. Do you have a box at home that j'ou keep it in ?
Mr. Cronin. No.
Mr. Kennedy. Do you have a safe deposit box of your own ?
Mr. Cronin. Yes.
Mr. Kennedy. Where is that ?
Mr. Cronin. River Forest Bank.
Mr. Kennedy. Is that the only safe deposit box you have ?
Mr. Cronin. It is the only one I have.
Mr. Kennedy. I asked you this morning whether you recived any
money from any other contractors or employers. Have you received
any other money ?
Mr. Cronin. Sir ?
Mr. Kennedy. Have you received any other money ?
Mr. Cronin. No.
Mr. Kennedy. Do you exact any kind of payment from any con-
tractor that is going to use sheet-metal workers ?
Mr. Cronin. No.
Mr. Kennedy. Have you ever gone to any of them and said that
they would have to pay you a sum of money in order to go into
business ?
Mr. (Cronin. No ; I have not.
Mr. Kennedy. Have you ever collected $300 or $400 in cash from
any contractor?
Mr. Cronin. I have never collected $300 or $400 in cash.
Mr. Kennedy. For any purpose whatever?
Mr. Cronin. For any purpose, not to my knowledge.
Mr. Kennedy. All the moiiey that is paid by any contractor is
paid by check ; you would only accept money by check ?
Mr. Cronin. I wouldn't know what you are talking about-, Mr.
Kennedy. "V^^iat do you mean ?
Mr. Kennedy. Tell me the payments that a contractor would have
to pay in order to, for instance, start a business.
Mr. Cronin. None, to my knowledge.
Mr. Kennedy. He wouldn't have to pay anything?
Mr. Cronin. No.
Mr. Kennedy. Would he have to pay any union dues ?
Mr. Cronin. Well, if a shop was organized, and there were men in
it that wanted to go into the union, yes, he would have to pay the
equivalent of 100 working hours, and that would be that man's initi-
ation fee. For instance, if there were two or three men in tlia^ shop
when a shop was organized, and those men went into the unicn. th-^"
would have to pay 100 working hours.
15804 IMPROPER ACTIVITIES IN THE LABOR FIELD
Mr. Kennedy. How much would that be ?
Mr. Cronin. Well, it varied, of course, as the wages go up through-
out the years. It went, as far as I remember in the 1940's, from, say,
maybe $200, to now it would be around $375.
Mr. Kennedy. Per person ?
Mr. Cronin, Per person.
Mr. Kennedy. $375 ? Who would pay that ?
Mr. Cronin. The man himself who wanted to join the union.
Mr. I^nnedy. So that wouldn't be money that would be paid by
the contractor ?
Mr. Cronin. Eight into the union ; yes.
Mr. Kennedy. That would not be money paid by the contractor?
That would be paid by the employee ?
Mr. Cronin. That is right, paid by the employee.
Mr. Kennedy. $375 ?
Mr. Cronin. That is the wages now, $3.75 an hour.
Mr. I^nnedy. Do you mean an employee would have to pay $375
as initiation fee in order to belong to the Sheet Metal Workers Union ?
Mr. Cronin. Yes.
Mr. Kennedy. Why is that such a high figure ?
Mr. Cronin. Well, I think if you will check you would find that
is customary in most building trades unions.
Mr. Kennedy. That they have to pay that much money in order
to belong to the union ?
Mr. Cronin. One hundred working hours.
Mr. Kennedy. ^Vliat happens to that money ?
Mr. Cronin. It goes into the union treasury.
The Chairman. What other unions can you name that have that
yardstick for initiation fees?
Mr. Cronin. Well, I wouldn't be authorized to name any of them.
Senator. I just don't know.
The Chairman. It is not a question of being authorized. It is a
question of your having knowledge of that. You have made a gen-
eral statement that that is customary.
Mr. Cronin. I think in some of the other building trades in Chi-
cago — I know in some of the other building trades. Now, I don't
know just which ones. But it is a common practice. It has been in
effect for many, many years. You ask me to name specific unions.
I just can't tell you.
The Chairman. All right. Proceed.
Mr. Kennedy. Where does that money go ?
Mr. Cronin. To the union treasury.
Mr. Kennedy. Do you ever request that that money be paid in the
form of cash rather than check ?
Mr. Cronin. No ; we don't care how it is paid.
Mr. Kennedy. You don't care how it is paid ?
Mr. Cronin. That is right.
Mr. Kennedy. It all goes into tlie union treasury ?
Mr. Cronin. That is right.
Mr. Kennedy. Have you ever stated to any employer that in order
to start up a business he would have to make a payment to you of
$300 or $400 ?
Mr. Cronin. No, sir.
IMPROPER ACTIVITIES IN THE LABOR FIELD 15805
Mr. Kennedy. Do you know if that has ever been done by any of
your business agents ?
Mr. Cronin. I don't know that it has ever been done.
Mr. Kennedy. Do you know a Mr. Warren Tapper?
Mr. Cronin. I know of him. I don't know him personally. I have
met the man.
Mr. Kennedy. You have met him ?
Mr. Cronin. Yes.
Mr. Kennedy. What conversations did you have with him ?
Mr. Cronin. Practically none.
Mr. Kennedy. Did you ever receive any money from him ?
Mr. Cronin. Never.
Mr. Kennedy. He never paid you any money ?
Mr. Cronin. Never in his life.
Mr. Kennedy. Did Mr. Tapper ever come to your home?
Mr. Cronin. Wlio?
Mr. Kennedy. Did Mr. Tapper ever come to your home ?
Mr. Cronin. Never.
Mr. Kennedy. He never paid you $250 in cash ?
Mr. Cronin. Absolutely not.
Mr. Kennedy. Did you tell him that you wanted $500 in cash, for
him to open up a business, and he then paid you $250 in cash?
Mr. Cronin. No, sir.
Mr. Kennedy. Do you know a Wilbur Jolicoeur ?
Mr. Cronin. Well, I know the firm, the Jolicoeur firm. I don't
think I know them personally. I mean the Jolicoeur Bros. I think
there are two brothers who own the firm.
Mr. Kennedy. Did you ever receive any money from him ?
Mr. Cronin. No, sir.
Mr. Kennedy. Did you ever discuss receiving money from him ?
Mr. Cronin. Never.
Mr. Kennedy. Did you ever state to him that it would be necessary
for him to pay $300 in cash for him to go into the sheet-metal working
business in Chicago?
Mr. Cronin. I did not.
Mr. Kennedy. Do you know Mr. Harold Erck ?
Mr. Cronin. I do.
Mr. Ejinnedy. Did you ever receive any money from him ?
Mr. Cronin. No, sir.
Mr. Kennedy. Did you ever request any money from him ?
Mr. Cronin. No, sir.
Mr. Kennedy. Did you tell him that he would have to make a
payment of $300 in cash in order to open up a union shop ?
Mr. Cronin. No, sir.
Mr. KJENNEDY. Did he then come down to the union hall and give
you an envelope with $300 in cash ?
Mr. Cronin. I don't remember him ever coming to the union hall.
Mr. Kennedy. Did he ever give you $300 in cash ?
Mr. Cronin. Never.
Mr. Kennedy. Did you ever meet him at the union headquarters?
Mr. Cronin. Not to my knowledge. As far as my memory serves,
he has never been inside the union hall. He could have been, but I
didn't see him.
15806 IMPROPER ACTIVITIES IN THE LABOR FIELD
Mr. Kennedy. You deny that you received the $300 from him ?
Mr, Cronin. I do.
Mr. Kennedy. Do you know a Mr. Crowe ?
Mr. Cronin. I don't know any Crowe.
Mr. Kennedy. Did you receive $500 from Mr. Crowe for Mr. Crowe
to go into business ?
Mr. Cronin. I don't know Mr. Crowe, Mr. Kennedy.
The Chairman. The question was did you receive the money from
him.
Mr. Cronin. No.
Mr. Kennedy. Did you ever tell any of these contractors that I have
mentioned or any other contractor, that they should not bid on certain
contracts in the Chicago area ?
Mr. Cronin. No.
Mr. Kennedy. Did you ever tell them how much tliey should bid
on certain contracts ?
Mr. Cronin. No.
Mr. Kennedy. You never did ?
Mr. Cronin. No.
Mr. Kennedy. You never called them and told them any particular
contract belonged to another contractor and that they shouldn't bid?
Mr. Cronin. No ; I didn't.
The Chairman. All right, Mr. Cronin, you may stand aside for
the ])resent.
Mr. Cohen. Senator McClellan, before we adjourned at noon, I
requested — I know you want to be fair to Mr. Cronin — I requested
that lie be permitted to explain exhibits lOA and lOB. I believe you
started with him on that.
The Chairman. You are correct. The witness has an opportunity
to make any comment about tliose exhibits that he desires.
Mr. Cohen. Tliank you.
Mr. Cronin. Senator, with regard to the letter of July 2, 1953,
wherein I say, in addressing this letter to Burrows, I would like to
have you know that I am almost positive, without going to my rec-
ords, that the conti'act signed with the Coleman Co. could have been
signed or was signed prior to that. I want you to know that when
I refer to this cooperation and the agreement, I definitely refer to
an international agreement. I don't refer to any arrangement other
than that.
The ('hairman. What international agreement ?
Mr. (Cronin. Made with the international union.
Tlie (^hairman. Made by whom?
Mr. Cronin. By our international office.
The Chairman. With whom?
Mr. Cronin. 1 imagine with the international organizer who was
in that district at the time.
Tlie Chairman. There has to be another party to an agreement
besides the union.
Mr. Cronin. With the Coleman Co.
The Chairman. That is what I am trying to determine. You say
an agreement was made with the (^oleman Co. ?
Mr. Cronin. I would like the opportunity of checking. I am al-
most sure that is so. 1 am })Ositive that is what I refer to in this
IMPROPER ACTIVITIES IN THE LABOR FIELD 15807
letter of July 2, where it might be of mutual benefit. I meant by
that I was glad to see them sign an agreement and run a union shop.
Mr. Kennedy. We have checked, Mr. Cronin, and there was never
any agreement between the Sheet Metal Workers and the Coleman
Co. There was not only no agreement at that time, but there was
never any agreement.
Mr. Cronin. May I say that you may be right, but if it wasn't
with the Coleman Co., then it was with a subsidiary of the Coleman
Co.
Mr. Kennedy. No.
Mr. Cronin. I would like to check that.
Mr. Kennedy. "Wliat was the name of the company it was with?
Mr. Cronin. I don't know.
The Chairman. You will be back here Monday. If you have any
evidence you may present it. According to the witness Burrows,
there was no agreement signed by him on this company.
Mr. Cronin. I am positive there was an agreement. Senator.
The Chairman. According to his testimony, it was all a verbal
understanding between you and him.
Mr. Cronin. No, I am positive there was a written agreement be-
tween our international union and either the Coleman co. or a sub-
sidiary of the Coleman Co. that manufactured fittings.
The Chairman. All right. You will have until next Monday to
review it and see if you can find it.
Mr. Kennedy. We have discussed the fact that they had a contract
with the Sterling Co. that was signed in January of 1953.
Mr. Cronin. That is what I refer to.
Mr. Kennedy. That is not with the Coleman Co. That has already
gone into the record. We discussed that this morning, that at your
suggestion, in order to alleviate the problem
Mr. Cronin. That is exactly the contract I have reference to.
Mr. IvENNEDY. That is not wliat the letter would seem to indicate.
Mr. Cronin. As I told you, Mr. Kennedy, I didn't arrange the
agreement. I did recommend it. I thought it was a good idea. I
wouldn't know whether they had a separate company or whether it
was signed with Coleman. I didn't know. But I do know that that
company makes the fittings that Coleman uses where they install
their furnaces.
The Chairman. You may be excused, but remain here to be
available.
Mr. Cohen. If Mr. Cronin has to return Monday, we are wonder-
ing when he can return to Chicago.
The Chairman. We will try to let him off sometime this afternoon.
There is some other testimony. I tiy to be fair to witnesses where
we are going to have derogatory testimony to give them an oppor-
tunity to hear it firsthand, because there may be furtlier interrogation
about it. You remain for the present, and we will determine tliis
afternoon as to when we will need you again.
Mr. Cohen. Thank you.
The Chairman. Mr. Tapper.
Be sworn, please. You do solemnly swear tliat the evidence you
shall give before this Senate select committee, shall be the truth, the
whole truth, and nothing but the truth, so help you God ?
Mr. Tapper. I do.
15808 IMPROPER ACTIVITIES IN THE LABOR FIELD
TESTIMONY OF WARREN A. TAPPER
The Chairman. State your name, your place of residence, and your
business or occupation.
Mr. Tapper. Warren A. Tapper, Arlington Heights, 111. I am the
president of Tapper's Central Heating Co. in Des Plaines, 111.
The Chairman. You waive counsel, do you, Mr. Tapper ?
Mr. Tapper. I do, sir.
The Chairman. Proceed, Mr. Kennedy.
Mr. Kennedy. You are president and owner of Tapper's Central
Heating Co.?
Mr. Tapper. That is right, sir.
Mr. Kennedy. It is located in Des Plaines, 111. ?
Mr. Tapper. Des Plaines, 111.
Mr. Kennedy. How far is that from Chicago?
Mr. Tapper. About 22 miles.
Mr. Kennedy. How many employees do you have?
Mr. Tapper. At the present time, 10.
Mr. Kennedy. When did you start your business ?
Mr. Tapper. 1947.
Mr. KJENNEDY. At the time that you started your business, did you
have any conversations with any official of the Sheet Metal Workers
Union ?
Mr. Tapper. I was running nonunion when I started the business,
and I bought out a union shop in Chicago and moved it to Des
Plaines in January of 1958.
Mr. Kennedy. In January 1958 ?
Mr. Tapper. That is right, sir.
Mr. Kennedy. Prior to that you had been in Chicago ?
Mr. Tapper. No, prior to that I operated nonunion.
Mr. Kennedy. In 1948, are you talking about ?
Mr. Tapper. 1948 is when I bought out a union shop in Chicago
and moved it to Des Plaines.
Mr. Kennedy. So then you were operating nonunion in 1948 ?
Mr. Tapper. 1947.
Mr. Kennedy. 1947. All right.
Will you tell us whether you had any conversations then with any
union official of the Sheet Metal Workers Union ?
Mr. Tapper. Well, in the fall of 1947, about September, Mr. Cronin
called me and asked me if I was doing some heating work on new
buildings in Des Plaines, which I said I was. He told me I wasn't
allowed to do that, that that was his work.
I said, "Well, I have the contract."
"Well, that belongs to union men, and you are nonimion."
So I said, "Well, as long as I have the contract, I consider it my
work, and according to the Taft-Hartley Act I could run nonunion
men."
He stated, "Well, we don't believe in the Taft-Hartley Act." He
asked me how many homes I had to complete. I said there were ap-
proximately 10. He said, "Do you intend to finish those 10?"
I said, "Yes, I intend to finish them."
Pie said, "Well, I will make a deal with you. If you will promise
not to start any more new work until you meet with me, I won't give
you any trouble, and I will allow you to finish those 10 homes."
IMPROPER ACTIVITIES IN THE LABOR FIELD 15809
I said, "That is a good deal with me. I will abide by that de-
cision."
Mr. Kennedy. So you finished the homes ?
Mr. Tapper. I finished the 10 homes. It was after that that I
bought out the union shop.
Mr. Kennedy. What was the name of the shop ?
Mr. Tapper. Crow Sheet Metal.
Mr. Kennedy. Crow Slieet Metal Co. ?
Mr. Tapper. That is right.
Mr. I^nnedy. What was Mr. Crow's first name? Do you have
that?
Mr. Tapper. I can't recall at the moment.
Mr. Kennedy. Did JMr. (Jrow relate anything to you regarding the
operations?
Mr. Tapper. Well, he told me that we were all set, that we wouldn't
have any further trouble as he had paid Mr. Cronin $500 for the
privilege of operating. So he said, "You will not have to pay any
more money."
Mr. Kennedy. Did you have any difficulty after that ?
Mr. Tapper. Twice Mr. Crow was called down to union headquar-
ters and sat on the bench all day Avithout anything coming of it.
Finally he met with Mr. Cronin and Mr. Cronin informed him there
w^ould be another payment due or he would have to get out of my
shop, that he couldn't stay there.
Mr. Kennedy. How much more money was needed ?
Mr. Tapper. An additional $500.
Mr. Kennedy. Did he come back and relate this to you ?
Mr. Tapper. Mr. Crow related to me that he argued against that
with Mr. Cronin, stating he had carried a card for a good many years,
and he didn't see why an additional $500 w^as necessary.
So the question was dropped at that point, and approximately 3 to
4 weeks later Mr. Crow was killed in an automobile accident on the
way to work. The day after the funeral they were back in my shop
looking for money.
The Chairman. Under what circumstances was he killed ?
Mr. Tapper. In an automobile accident.
The Chairman. I understand, but was there anything to indicate
that it was more than just an accident ?
Mr. Tapper. No, sir ; it was strictly an accident. He collided with a
gasoline truck at an intersection.
The Chairman. I think the record should be clear on that.
Mr. Kennedy. You didn't pay that $500 ?
Mr. Tapper. No, sir.
Mr. Kennedy. Then what happened ?
Mr. Tapper. The day after the funeral Mr. Troutman
Mr. Kennedy. T-r-o-u-t-m-a-n?
Mr. Tapper. Eight, sir.
Mr. Kennedy. Shannon Troutman of local 73 ?
Mr. Tapper. Yes, sir.
Mr. Kennedy. He came to visit you ?
Mr. Tapper. He came in to visit me, and he
Mr. Kennedy. He is the business agent ?
Mr. Tapper. He is the business agent. He seen the size of the build-
ing we then had under construction for the new operation, and he said
15810 IMPROPER ACTIVITIES IN THE LABOR FIELD
it would cost me $500 to <>'et straightened up. He suggested that I call
Mr. Cronin and meet with him.
Mr. Kennedy. So what happened after that? Did you agree to
pay the $500 ?
Mr. Tapper. In the meantime I was contacted by the Pipefitters
Union, and a member of the Contractors Association, advising me not
to pay any money, that there was an investigation on and I would only
be getting myself in the middle if I met with Mr. Cronin and paid
any money.
I called Mr. Cronin and agreed to meet w^ith him. He suggested I
meet at his home, where I went the following morning.
Mr. Kennedy. Who was the contractor that called you ?
Mr. Tapper. Mr. J. Boslough.
Mr. Kennedy. B-o-s-l-o-u-g-h ?
Mr. Tapper. That is right.
Mr. Kennedy. Of the Boslough Heating Co. ?
Mr. Tapper. That is right.
Mr. Kennedy. And he suggested not to make the payment ?
Mr. Tapper. He told me there was an investigation on and that the
Pipefitters would give the men union cards if the Sheet Metal AVorkers
took the union cards away from my men, and they would continue to
work, and they would continue to work, and that he wanted a show-
down on it.
I decided they were tiying to make a guinea pig out of me, and I
didn't want any part of it. So I called Mr. Cronin and made an
api^ointment to meet with him at his home. When I met there, I told
him I was not going to give him any money. I told him what I had
heard, about the investigation that I understood was underway, and
I didn't want to become involved in it.
He said, "Under the circumstances, I won't take any money from
you now." He said, "What do you want to do?"
I suggested everything stay as is for approximately 60 days. At
the end of GO days Mr. Troutman was back in my office, hollering and
yelling that I had no business operating, and what business did I have
going in business without checking with them. He said, "Call Harry
Cronin."
I called Harry Cronin at his office and made an appointment to meet
with him at his home the following morning, at which time I laid
$250 in cash on his breakfast table.
Mr. Kennedy. This w^as in August of 1949, was it ?
Mr. Tapper. August of 1949 ; yes, sir.
Mr. Kennedy. Was there any discussion of how much you were to
pay, whether it was to be $500 ?
Mr. Tapper. He picked it up and counted it and said, "Where is the
rest of it?"
I said, "Well, you promised me that I could get in for less money."
He said, "Whe'n was that ?"
I said, "When we were discussing the money before I asked you to
give me a break and you said you would look into it."
That was the extent of our conversation.
Mr. Kennedy. What was the money for ?
Mr. Taim'ek. For the privilege of operating and hiring union sheet-
metal men.
IMPROPER ACTIVITIES IN THE LABOR FIELD 15811
Mr. Kennedy. Did you know what the money was going to be used
for ; wliere it was goinc ^
Mr. Tapper. I was told tlie money was to be in cash and no records
kept of it. I had no idea what he was going to do with it.
Mr. Kennedy. lie said lie wanted it in cash, though ?
Mr. Tapper. That is right.
Mr. Kennedy. First, did you understand this was a general prac-
tice followed by all the contractors in the Chicago area ?
Mr. Tapper. As far as I know, nobody can open up a sheet-metal
shop and hire union men without first i)ayingoff.
Mr. Kennedy. And the payoti' amounts to what— $300 or $400 ?
Mr. Tapper. Wliat the traffic will bear, depending on the size of the
shop.
Mr. Kennedy. But is it generally accepted in the Chicago area that
this payment has to be made ?
Mr. Tapper, Yes ; it is generally accepted by everybody in the busi-
ness that it is a necessary payment.
Mr. Kennedy. Did you ever have any trouble with the Sheet Metal
Workers Union after that ?
Mr. Tapper. No, except occasionally complaining because there
wasn't union labels on pipefittings in the shop.
Mr. Kennedy. Did you have all union employees thereafter ?
iNIr. Tapper. I had all union sheet-metal men.
Mr. Kennedy. Did they ever come around and check that at all ?
Mr. Tapper. At various times they checked the sheet-metal men.
Mr. Kennedy. Have you ever heard of the Acme Co. that we were
also discussing?
Mr. Tapper. Yes ; I have.
Mr. Kennedy. The Acme Furnace Co. that Mr. Cronin had an
interest in.
How did you hear about the Acme Co. ?
Mr. Tapper. Well, their salesmen called on me from time to time
and let us know it would be a good thing for us to buy their products ;
but I never bought any of their products.
Mr. Kennedy. What basis did they give you as it being a good
thing for you ?
Mr. Tapper. Well, that it was owned by Mr. Cronin and ae long as
we bought their products we would be on the good side.
Mr. I^NNEDY. Did you ever discuss this matter with any union
official ?
Mr. Tapper. Well, there was discussions of various business agents
from time to time about the union label on pipe and fittings and
gutters.
Mr. Ivennedy. Was it ever suggested by any miion official that you
purchase your goods from Acme ?
Mr. Tapper. I was told that there had to be a union label on there.
When I objected and made a remark about I didn't want to buy from
Acme, I was told, "You don't have to buy from Acme. Make it your-
self, as long as it is made by union help."
jNIr. Kennedy. Did they indicate that Acme was the only one that
sold it at that time that was union ?
Mr. Tapper. Acme was the only shop in the Cliicago area with the
union label.
15812 IMPROPER ACTIVITIES IN THE LABOR FIELD
Mr. I^NNEDY. So if you had the union label, you had to get it from
Acme?
Mr. Tapper. That is right, sir.
Mr. I^NNEDY. You have heard the testimony of Mr. Cronin here
this afternoon ?
Mr. Tapper. I did, sir.
Mr. Kennedy. He stated that you never came to his home.
Mr. Tapper. Yes, sir.
Mr. Kennedy. Is that correct?
Mr. Tapper. No, sir ; it is not. _
Mr. Kennedy. You went to his home ?
Mr. Tapper. On two occasions.
Mr. Kennedy. On two different occasions ?
Mr. Tapper. Yes, sir.
Mr. Kennedy. He stated he never received any money from you.
Is that correct ?
Mr. Tapper. No, sir ; it is not correct.
Mr. Kennedy. You paid him money ?
Mr. Tapper. I paid him money at his home.
Mr. I^j:nnedy. $250?
Mr. Tapper. Yes, sir.
Mr. Kennedy. And he had requested on several occasions that you
pay him $500?
Mr. Tapper. Yes, sir.
Mr. IvENNEDY. And he denied that also under oath before this
committee ?
Mr. Tapper. Yes, sir.
Mr. Kennedy. But you say your testimony is correct?
Mr. Tapper. My testimony is correct ; yes, sir.
The Chairman. As I understand this, what it actually amounted
to was a payoff to a labor union local president and who is also a
vice president of the international, to grant you the privilege of stay-
ing m business and employing workers who were members of the
union.
Mr. Tapper. Yes, sir ; that is correct.
The Chairman. In other words, you couldn't employ union labor
even if you wanted to until you made this payoff?
Mr. Tapper. That is right, sir.
The Chairman. You had to pay off the high mogul of the opera-
tion in cash in order to get a little cooperation in getting union labor
so you could put a union label on your products ?
Mr. Tapper. Well, it wasn't a union label we put on. It was a mat-
ter of hiring union men. The union label is a figure of speech, really.
The Chairman. It was actually a figure of speech ?
Mr. Tapper. Yes, sir.
The Chairman. But before you could employ union labor, you had
to pay off the labor boss ?
Mr. Tapper. Yes, sir.
The Chairman. That is what is amounted to?
Mr. Tapper. Yes, sir ; that is it.
The Chairman. And I believe you said someone else — Mr. Crow,
was it
Mr. Tapper. Mr. Crow was the gentleman I bought out.
IMPROPER ACTIVITIES IN THE LABOR FIELD 15813
The Chairman. And he had paid off to the extent of $500 ?
Mr. Tapper. Yes, sir ; that is correct.
The Chairman. That was before you bought him out?
Mr. Tapper. That is right, sir.
The Chairman. And at the time you bought him out, you under-
stood that was to take care of it ?
Mr. Tapper. Yes, sir ; that is right.
The Chairman. But that failed to take care of it?
Mr. Tapper. That is right.
The Chairman. Thereafter, demands were made on you to which
you responded?
Mr. Tapper. Yes, sir.
Mr. Kennedy. You said there was another business agent that also
had these conversations with you, and that was Mr. Troutman, I
believe?
Mr. Tapper. That is right, sir.
Mr. Kennedy. There is no question in your mind about the identity
of Mr. Troutman?
Mr. Tapper, No, sir ; I know him very well.
The Chairman. Mr. Troutman, come forward, please.
Mr, Witness, Mr. Tapper — that is all right, Mr. Troutman ; you can
stand where you are.
Mr. Tapper, will you look at the gentleman standing immediately
behind you and state if you know him ?
Mr. Tapper. Yes, sir ; that is Mr. Troutman.
The Chairman. That is the man you have been talking about ?
Mr. Tapper. Yes, sir ; that is.
The Chairman. Look at him again. You couldn't be mistaken in
the identity?
]Mr. Tapper. No, sir. I have known him for 8 years.
The Chairman. Thank you very much.
Thank you, Mr. Troutman. You may be seated.
Mr. Kennedy. That is the man that told you to go see Mr. Cronin
and straighten yourself out with the payment of the money ?
Mr. Tapper. Yes, sir.
The Chairman. Thank you very much.
Mr. Tapper, you will remain under your present subpena of this
committee, subject to being recalled when the committee may desire
further testimony from you after having given you reasonable notice
of the time and place where your testimony will be desired.
Do you agree to that ?
Mr. Tapper. Yes, sir ; I do.
The Chairman. That will be so as to avoid another subpena. So
you will remain under the jurisdiction of this committee. If you are
molested in any way, any threats or intimidations, report it promptly.
"Wlioever commits such act, in my opinion, would be guilty of con-
tempt of the U.S. Senate.
Thank you. Call the next witness.
Mr. Kennedy. Mr. Erck. Harold Erck.
The Chairman. Be sworn, please, Mr. Erck.
You do solemnly swear the evidence you shall give before this
Senate select committee shall be the truth, the whole truth, and nothing
but the truth, so help you God ?
Mr. Erck. I do.
15814 IMPROPER ACTIVITIES IN THE LABOR FIELD
TESTIMONY OF HAROLD ERCK
The Chairman. State your name, your place of residence, and your
business or occupation.
Mr. Erck. Harold Erck, 338 South Highland Avenue, Lombard.
My business is in Chicago. I am president of Air-way Heating &
Ventilating Systems.
The Chairman. Do you waive counsel, Mr. Erck ?
Mr. Erck. I believe so. I am not familiar with this.
The Chairman. The rules of the committee provide that any wit-
ness may have counsel of his own choice present when he testifies in
order to advise him with regard to his legal rights.
Mr. Erck. I will waive coinisel.
The Chairman. Thank you very much.
Proceed, Mr. Kennedy.
Mr. Kennedy. How many employees do you have?
Mr. Erck. Well, that varies. An average of 10 or 12.
Mr. Kennedy. AVhat kind of goods do you make ?
Mr. Erck. We are in the ventilating business.
Mr. Kennedy. Are tliese employees members of the Sheet Metal
Workers Union (
Mr. Erck. They aie all ineml)ers of the Sheet Metal Workers
Union.
Mr. Kennedy. How long have you had this partnership in the Air-
Way Heating & Ventilating System ?
Mv. Erck. We started in 1950, November.
Mr. Kennedy. AVere you organized at that time, when you started?
Mr. P]rck. That is when we did organize and go into business, 1950.
Mr. Kennedy. Did you have a contract with the union, or were
your employees members of the Sheet Metal Workers Union ?
Mr. Erck. All of our employees are members of local 73.
Mr. Kennedy. Were they since 1950, when you began ?
Mr. Erck. Yes.
Mr. Kennedy. How did tliat come about ?
Mr. Erck. Well, when we decided to go into business, or I did,
rather — there Avas another fellow with me — we went over to the union
hall to see the president. We knew we had to make some arrange-
ments to get men.
Mr. Kennedy. Who did you talk to there ?
Mr. Er.CK. Mr. Cronin.
And we told him tliat we wanted to go into business for ourselves.
We had worked at this line for sometime, but not as an owner, of
covu'se.
He asked me if I thought it Avas good to go in business inasmuch as
I had worked for one company for some 19-odd years and it would
seem unfair that I should go in and maybe take away customers.
But I suggested he call my former cmj^loyei-, wliicli lie did, and
evidently lie must have told him there was no friction between the two
of us, that it was perfectly all I'ight with him if I \v(Mit in business, he
had no objection whatever. Mr. Cronin then agreed that it would be
all ri'i:ht that I would go into business.
Then there was one suggestion made. I don't know if this is the
exact words, that there was a fund, liut anyhow, the sum and sub-
stance was that tliei-e was a collection for sl'ieet-inetal woi-kers who
IMPROPER ACTIVITIES IN THE LABOR FIELD 15815
were sick or in hospitals or out of work, and he asked if I wanted to
luiike ii donation to this, and 1 ag:reed.
At no time was I tohl I ninst make this donation. I was asked.
Mr. KKXNEnv. How was it airreed to as to the amount that you
would i>ive^
Mr. km-K. Well, the amount was $800 that I agreed to give.
Mr. Kennedy. And did you give him a check?
Mr. Erck. No; I gave him cash.
Mr. Kennedy. Why did you give him cash?
Mr. Erck. I was asked to give cash.
Ml-. Kennedy. If it was for old, sick sheet-metal workers, why
didn't you just give a check?
Mr. Ekck. I was asked to give casli, and I gave cash.
Mr. Kennedy. Did you think at the time you gave the cash that it
was for sick sheet-metal workers?
Mr. Erck. Well, 1 don't know. Eight years ago I may or may not
have. But it Avas asked for in cash, so I gave it in cash.
The Chairman. You knew what that meant, didn't you ?
Mr. Erck. Well, maybe I am not supposed to know, but at least I
gave it in cash.
The CiiAiR:\rAN. I said you knew what that meant. That was to
conceal the donation ?
Mr. Erck. Well, that might have been my personal suspicion, yes.
The Chairman. You had no other reason to think that it should be
in cash and not in check ?
Mr. P]rck. Well, probably not.
The Chairman. Did he give you the name of any old metal workers
organization, charity ?
Mr. Erck. Xo.
The Chairman. I mean to identify exactly where the money was
going '.
Mr. Erck. Xo. Of course, it was about 3 weeks before Christinas,
and it could have been construed as such if you wanted to.
The Chairman. You would have to stretch the construing a little,
would you not?
Mr. Erck. Well, maybe.
The Chairman. Of coui"se, you knew what it was, a payoft', .so that
you could go into business, didn't you ?
Mr. Erck. Well, you are telling me.
The Chair:\ian. I am asking you.
Mr. Erck. Well, I imagine it was.
The Chairman. That is what you regarded it as at the time ; is that
correct ?
Mr. Erck. I took it that way. yes.
The Chairman. All right,
Mr. Kennedy. How did you make that ])ayment ?
Mr. Erck. I went to the bank and drew $H()0. I think I put it in an
envelope. I don't remember exactly, but I think I put it in an en-
velope and took it over to the union hall.
The Chairman. That was the accepted method of delivering it.
wasn't it, putting it in an envelope?
Mr. Erck. I don't know. This is the first and only time 1 have done
it, so I don't know whether it was the accepted method or not.
15816 IMPROPER ACTIVITIES IN THE LABOR FIELD
The Chairman. I think if the records here are correct, the evidence
we have kind of bears tliat out.
Mr. Erck. But that is what I did.
The Chairman. So that, based on the testimony you have heard
here today, wasn't the only envelope that had been passed to Mr.
Cronin ?
Mr. Erck. Well, I only heard one man testify just a few minutes
ago.
The Chairman. You didn't hear the other ?
Mr. Erck. I didn't hear anything this morning. I wasn't up here.
The Chairman. Very well.
Mr. Kennedy. You brought the envelope or brought the cash back
and gave it to whom, then ?
Mr. Erck. Well, I was in Mr. Cronin's office, and I can't say for
sure if I actually handed it to him or if I put it on the table. I don't
remember the details. At the time I had no thought I would ever be
refreshing my memory 8 years later about this, and I didn't pay
special attention to every detail.
The Chairman. However you handled it, you handled it so you
thought it went to Mr. Cronin ?
Mr. Erck. Definitely.
The Chairman. No one else was in on the deal except you and
him ?
Mr. Erck. No, I don't think so, and I don't remember anyone else.
Mr. Kennedy. It was done in the union headquarters in his office ?
Mr. Erck. I am sure it was.
Mr. Kennedy. You didn't get any receipt for it ?
Mr. Erck. No, sir.
The Chairman. Did you deduct it as a charitable donation from
your income tax ?
Mr. Erck. Well, actually it was only 2 months of the year before
the end of the calendar year, and we had a loss anyhow because we
had just started up in business, and it was shown as an expense.
The Chairman. Business expense ?
Mr. Erck. Business expense.
The Chairman. That was correct, was it?
Mr. Erck, Yes, sir.
Mr. Kennedy. Have you heard generally in the Chicago area that
these payments have to be made in order to go into business?
Mr. Erck. Well, I don't recall ever discussing it with anybody,
and as I say, I don't know too many of my competitors. The people
that I have known have been in business for years and years. I mean
they were in business long, long before I went in business, and I
don't know many of the people who have gone in business in the last
10 years.
Mr. Kennedy. Did you hear of this, the fact that this kind of
payment had to be made ?
Mr. Erck. Well, I couldn't definitely say, I might have heard some-
thing, and I might have heard it from anybody, and I might have
heard it from salesmen, and those things I don't know.
Mr. Kennedy. I am asking you if you heard it and then you can
explain who yon heard it from. Did you hear it?
Mr. Erck. Well, I think that I have heard rumors of it, yes.
IMPROPER ACTIVITIES IN THE LABOR FIELD 15817
Mr. Kennedy. A little bit of it. You say you heard a little bit
of it?
Mr. Erck. I said I have heard rumors of it.
Mr. Kennedy. Was the payment always $300 or $400?
Mr. Erck. That I could not answer, and I have no idea.
Mr. Kennedy. When was that payment made by you?
Mr. Erck. That was made in November of 1950.
Mr. Kennedy. Is that the only payment you ever made to any
union official?
Mr. Erck. I did make one other payment at one time, and I can't
say which year it was, another payment, and I don't laiow, I don't
remember the exact amount, and it was somewhere between $30 and
$50, and I am not sure if it was $30 or $50.
Mr. Kennedy. That was to a business agent?
Mr. Erck. That was in their office.
The Chairman. Who was that ?
Mr. Erck. The local 73.
The CiiAiRAtAN. The same union office Avhere you liad the other
transaction?
Mr. Erck. Maybe not the same identical room, but the building.
The Chairman. But the same headquarters ?
Mr. Erck. Yes, sir.
Mr. Kennedy. To whom was that payment made ?
Mr. Erck. I am not absolutely sure.
Mr. Kennedy. Then I won't go into it.
Mr. Erck. I wouldn't want to swear that it was made, because I
don't know all of those gentlemen down there, and when I see them
all, they all look alike.
The Chairman. Why was it made ?
Mr. Erck. We had gone to work on a job, and previous to our
arriving on the job certain work had been done which was supposedly
to have been done by local 73 men but it was not. It was done by
members of another union.
The Chairman. Another union, but they were union men?
Mr. P^rck. They were union men, yes. But they were Steamfitters
Union or the Pipefitters Union.
The Chairman. So because some pipefitters, although union men,
bad worked on a job, you were required to make a payment ?
Mr. Erck. To compensate for the loss of time by somebody who
would have been doing that work if the pipefitters had not been
doing it.
The Chairman. Do you know whether the fellows avIio lost the time
ever got the money or not ?
Mr. Erck. That I do not know.
The Chairman. You have doubts about it, don't you ?
Mr. Erck. Well, that would be strictly my own thoughts.
The Chairman. I was able to interpret your thoughts correctly ?
Mr. Erck. I think that you were.
The Chairman. Thank you.
Mr. Kennfj)y. That is all.
The Chairman. Thank you very much.
Call the next witness.
21243— 59— pt. 42 5
15818 IMPROPER ACTIVITIES IN THE LABOR FIELD
Mr. Kennedy. We have one witness, and it is very important that
he leave the city, and it is a little bit out of order, but I would like
to take him now.
The Chairman. All right.
Mr. Kennedy. Mr. Gali^er.
The Chairman, Mr. Galiger, will you come around, please?
Will you be sworn ?
You "do solemnly swear that the evidence you shall give before
this Senate select committee shall be the truth, the whole truth, and
nothing but the truth, so help you God ?
Mr. Galiger. I do.
TESTIMONY OF BERT GALIGER
The Chairman. State your name, your place of residence, and your
business or occupation, please.
Mr. Galiger. My name is Bert Galiger, 225 McKinley Avenue.
Libertyville, 111., sole proprietor of Galiger Heating Co.
The Chairman. Do you waive counsel, Mr. Galiger ?
Mr. Galiger. Yes, sir.
The Chairman. All right. Proceed.
Mr. Kennedy. You were an independent sheet-metal worker and
heating contractor until 1956 ; is that right '\
Mr. Galiger. That is right.
Mr. Kennedy. Now you have your own company, and do you have
any employees ?
Mr. Galiger. I was a contractor prior to that time for about 10
years, and independent, hiring nonunion help.
Mr. Kennedy. How many employees do you have at the present
time ?
Mr. Galiger. Five at the present.
Mr. Kennedy. Are they all members of the Sheet Metal Workers ?
Mr. Galiger. No,
Mr. Kennedy. How many of them are ?
Mr. Galiger. Two sheet metal men, and three pipefitters.
Mr. Kennedy. When did your men join the Sheet Metal Workers?
Mr. Galiger, I believe it was in July or August of 1956.
Mr, Kennedy, Did you call the Sheet Metal Workers headquarters,
local 73 ?
Mr. Galiger, Yes, sir ; I did.
Mr. Kennedy. Wlio did you talk to there?
Mr, Galiger, I don't recall just who I talked to, but a representa-
tive, Mr, Howard, M-as sent to contact me,
]Mr, Kennedy, That is Marty Howard, a business agent of 73 ?
]\Ir. Galkjer. That is right.
Mr. Kennedy. What conversations did you have with him when he
came to see you ?
Mr. Galiger. I stated the fact we had work coming up on new con-
struction tliat was expected to be done by union emplovoos, and I
wanted my sheet-metal men to be accepted in the union, and that was
about the extent of it.
Mr. Kennedy. Wha did he say would be necessary for you to do?
Mr. Galiger, Well, he suggested tliat a contribution be made to the
IMPROPER ACTIVITIES IN THE LABOR FIELD 15819
older sheet-metcal men who had been such before welfare and pension
funds were set up.
Mr. Kennedy. How much did he want you to contribute?
Mr. Galiger. Four hundred dollars was the sum mentioned.
Mr. Kennedy. Did you agree then to pay him the $400 ?
Mr. Galioer. Yes, sir ; I did.
Mr. Kennedy. Did you wish to give him a check ?
Mr. Galkjer. Yes, but he stated it should be in cash, and I wrote a
check to cash for that amomit, and I went over to the bank and
caslied it.
Mr. I^nnedy. Then did you return Avith the cash?
Mr. Galiger. Tliat is right.
The Chairman. I present you a photostatic copy of the check, and
we have the original here, and you may identify both, and the original
may be returned to you.
Will you compare the original check, and also the photostatic copy
and state if you identify them.
(Documents handed to the witness.)
Mr. Galiger. That is right.
The Chairman. Do you identify both of them ?
Mr. Galiger. Yes, sir.
The Chairman. The photostatic copy may be made exhibit No. 11.
(Document referred to was marked "Exhibit No. 11" for reference
and will be fomid in the appendix on p. 15842.)
The Chairman. You may keep the original check.
Mr. Ivennedy. This Avas the check you went across to the bank and
cashed ?
Mr. Galiger. Yes, sir.
Mr. Kennedy. And you got the $400 in cash and this check is dated
July 19, 1956, and you got $400 in cash and you returned and gave
that cash to Mr. Howard : is that correct ?
Mr. Galiger. Yes, sir.
The Chairman. What was he, a business agent ?
Mr. Galiger. Yes.
The Chairman. Where did this money go ?
Mr. Galiger. I have no idea.
The Chairman. Do you know of any organization or any setup
whereby money is collected for old sheet-metal workers who "got old
and out of business before they set up the pension for them ?
Mr. Galiger. I don't, sir.
The Chairman. Is that the onlv time vou ever heard of such a
thing?
Mr. Galiger. That is right.
The Chairman. You were rather skeptical about the truthfulness
of that statement at the time, were you not?
Mr. Galiger. That is right.
The Chairman. You knew actually what you were doing was mak-
ing a payoff to a union official ?
Mr. Galiger. Well, as far as general hearsay was concerned.
The Chairman. You had heard of such things before?
Mr. Galiger. That is right.
The Chairman. So therefore you didn't protest very much, and you
just knew that was expected of you and if you went in business that
is the way you would have to do it ?
15820 IMPROPER ACTIVITIES IN THE LABOR FIELD
Mr. Galiger. That is right.
The Chairman. And you went and got tlie money for that pur-
pose?
Mr. Galiger. That is right.
The Chairman. Have you ever heard of any one old sheet -metal
worker getting one dime out of any of these collections?
Mr. Galiger. No, sir.
The Chairman. Do you know anyone Avho might give us some in-
formation about that ?
Mr. Galiger. No, sir.
The Chairman. Was this business agent an old sheet-metal worker
himself?
Mr. Galiger. Well, he was older than I am. It is possible that he
had been a sheet-metal worker at one time.
The Chairman. Would you recognize him again if you would see
him now ?
Mr. Galiger. Yes, sir.
The Chairman. What is his name ?
Mr. Galiger. Marty Howard.
The Chairman. Mr. Marty Howard, will you come around, please?
Do you think you can identify Mr. Marty Howard ?
Mr. Galiger. I think so.
The (^hairman. Will you look at the gentleman standing imme-
diately behind you and see if you identify him ?
Mr. Galiger. Yes, sir.
The Chairman. Who is he?
Mr. Galiger. He is Marty Howard.
The Chairman. Is he the one who got your $400 ?
Mr. Galiger. That is right.
The Chairman. How long have you known him ?
Mr, Galiger. I don't think that I met him much before that.
The Chairman. Have you met him some since ?
Mr. Galiger. I don't recall having seen him only on one occasion
since then.
The Chairman. You did see him on one occasion since. Could you
be mistaken in who he is?
Mr. Galiger. No, silr.
The Chairman. You couldn't be mistaken ?
Mr. Galiger. No, sir.
The Chairman. Thank you.
You may stand aside for the moment. I may want to recall you.
Mr. Howard, you may take the stand at this time, please.
Will you be sworn, ]\Ir. Howard ?
You do solemnly swear that the evidence you shall give before this
Senate select connnittee sluill be the truth, tlie whole truth, and noth-
ing but the ti'uth, so help you (jod ?
Mr. Howard. I do.
TESTIMONY OF MARTIN J. HOWARD, ACCOMPANIED BY COUNSEL.
NATHAN M. COHEN
The Chairman. State your name and your phice of residence ami
your business or occupation, please.
IMPROPER ACTIVITIES IN THE LABOR FIELD 15821
Mr. Howard. Martin J. Howard, 60G0 North Belanche Street, Chi-
ago, 111. I am lassistant business representative of Local 73, Sheet
Metal Workei-s Union.
The Chairman. Counsel, will you identify yourself for the record ?
Mr. Cohen. Nathan M. Cohen, Chicago, 111.
The Chairman. You previously stated, I believe, you are a mem-
ber of the Chicago bar?
Mr. Cohen. The Illinois b-ar ; that is correct.
The Chairman. All right ; you may proceed.
Mr. Kennedy. How long have you been with tlie Sheet Metal
Workers ?
Mr. Howard. I believe, Mr. Kennedy, it was in January of 1953,
Mr. Kennedy. "What were you doing prior to that ?
Mr. Howard. I was working for the city of Chicago.
Mr. Kennedy. What was your position with the cit}' of Chicago?
Mr. Howard. Ventilating inspector.
Mr. Kennedy. AYere you made a business representative of the
union in January of 1953 ?
Mr. Howard. Yes, sir.
Mr. Kennedy. Had you had any experience in unions prior to that
time (
Mr. Howard. I have been in the Sheet Metal Workers Union for
about 25 years.
Mr. Kennedy. What is tliat?
Mr. Hoavard. I have been a member for about 25 years.
Mr. Kennedy. You have heard the testimony, Mr. Howard, of the
previous witness, who testified that Mr. Galiger gave you some $400.
Is that testimony correct ?
Mr. Howard. Mr. Kennedy, I am going to invoke the fifth amend-
ment and refuse to answer the question for fear that anything I may
say may tend to incriminate me.
The Chairman. Well, let me ask you this: Do you know anything
about a fund for old sheet-metal workers?
Mr. Howard. I still invoke the fifth amendment.
The Chairman. What would there be incriminating about a fund
to support indigent old sheet-metal workers? I just can't quite get
the incrimination that would be involved in doing a charity job or act.
Mr. Howard. I still invoke the fifth amendment. Senator.
The Chairman. Do you honestly believe if you answered the ques-
tion truthfully that a truthful answer thereto might tend to incrim-
inate you ?
Mr. Howard. I do.
The Chairman. It is a strange relationship between a charity or-
ganization if there is anything such as that, that to say you collected
some money to help people who are old and need assistance that such
act might tend to incriminate you.
You, of course, know best. That within itself, it seems to me,
wouldn't tend to incriminate you. But if you collected money under
the pretense tliat you were collecting it for a charitable purpose such
as this I would construe to be, and then kept the money and didn't use
it for that purpose, that I can well see might tend to incriminate you,
if not to completely incriminate you.
Now, do you want to make any explanation of that ?
15822 IMPROPER ACTIVITIES IN THE LABOR FIELD
Mr. Howard. I still invoke the fifth amendment, Senator, on the
ground that anything I may say may tend to incriminate me.
The Chairman. I accept your invoking it with your statement,
and with the full implications thereof, but you have an opportunity
here, if your actions have been within the propriety of business ethics,
you have the opportunity now to make a statement and to correct the
record if you are willing to do so.
But if you can't make a tnithful statement without incriminating
yourself, then I can appreciate you might want to elect to continue
to shield yourself behind the fifth amendment. I give you your
choice and let you make the decision.
Mr. Howard. I still invoke the fifth amendment. Senator.
The Chairman. Are there any further questions, Mr. Counsel?
Mr. Kennedy. I might just ask you if you kept the money?
Mr. Howard. I still invoke the fifth amendment.
The Chairman. Do vou know Mr. Galiger, who just testified that
he gave you the $400 ?
Mr. Howard. I will still invoke the fifth amendment.
The Chairman. I suppose you would continue to do that if we
kept you here until the day after tomorrow asking you questions;
wouldn't you ?
Mr. Howard. I still invoke the fifth amendment.
The Chairman. I thought you would. I am glad you answered
that question because I will not waste any more time on you. You
may stand aside for the present, but remain here, as there may be
something else I would like to interrogate you about.
Call the next witness.
Well, before recessing, and we shall soon recess until in the morn-
ing, before doing so I want Mr. Galiger back for a moment and also
Mr. Cronin.
Will Mr. Galiger come forward, please, just for 1 moment?
Mr. Galiger, you will remain imder your present subpena, subject
to being recalled by the committee at such time as it may desire
further testimony from you. Reasonable notice will be given you
of the time and place where your testimony will be desired.
Do you accept that agreement ?
Mr. Galiger. Yes, sir.
The Chairman. Thank you veiy much. I may say to you that
you will remain under that subpena and under the jurisdiction of
this committee. If you are molested in any way, any threats, any
intimidation or violence undertaken against you, you will report it
to this committee, because those who may attempt such action or
commit such acts, in my judgment, would be guilty of contempt of
the United States Senate, and I would want to take the proper pro-
ceedings against them. Will you do that ?
Mr. Galiger. Yes, sir.
The Chairman. Thank you very much. You may be excused for
the present.
Mr. Cronin, I understand there will be further derogatory testi-
mony against you, and, therefore, we will not he able to excuse you
this afternoon. Further testimony will be heard against you to-
morrow.
IMPROPER ACTIVITIES IN THE LABOR FIELD 15823
In the meantime, take such action as you can with respect to hav-
ing your records assembled. We will try to dismiss you tomorrow if
we can so that you can get back, but those records will be required.
Are there any further questions ?
Mr. Croistin. Yes. Will they be required by tomorrow ?
The Chairman. No. I told you the order was to deliver them by
Monday at noon.
Mr. Cronin. But you want me here tomorrow ?
The Chairman. Yes. Thank you.
The committee will be in recess until 10 o'clock tomorrow.
(Members of the select committee present at time of recess : The
chairman and Senator Kennedy.)
( Wliereupon, at 3 :42 the select committee recessed, to reconvene
at 10 a.m., Tuesday, December 3, 1958.)
INVESTIGATION OF IMPROPER ACTIVITIES IN THE
LABOR OR MANAGEMENT FIELD
WEDNESDAY, DECEMBER 3, 1958
United States Senate
Select Committee on Iimproper Acti\tties,
IN the Labor or Management Field,
Washington^ D. C.
The select committee met at 10 a.m., pursuant to Senate Resolution
221, agri-eed to January 29, 1958, in the caucus room, Senate Office
Building, Senator John L. McClellan (chairman of select committee)
presidino; :
Present: Senator John L. McClellan, Democrat, Arkansas; Senator
John F. Kennedy, Democrat, Massachusetts.
Also present : Robert F. Kennedy, cliief counsel ; La Vern J. Duffy,
investigator ; Irwin Langenbacher, investigator ; Ruth Y. Watt, chief
clerk.
The Chairman. The committee will come to order.
(Members of the select committee present at the convening of the
session were: Senators McClellan and Kennedy.)
The Chairman. Call the next witness.
Mr. Kennedy. I would like to call Mr. Johnson, please.
The Chairman. You do solemnly swear that the evidence you shall
give before this Senate select committee shall be the truth, the whole
truth, and nothing but the truth, so help you God ?
Mr. Johnson. I do.
TESTIMONY OF CECIL L. JOHNSON
The Chairman. State your name, your place of residence, and your
business or occupation.
Mr. Johnson. My full name is Cecil L. Johnson, and I live at 11117
Depot Street, "Worth, 111., and I am president of the Bond Ventilating
Co.
The Chairman. That is Bond Ventilating, Inc. ?
Mr. Johnson. That is right, sir.
The Chairman. Do you waive counsel, Mr. Johnson ?
Mr. Johnson. What is that ?
The Chairman. Do you want a lawyer to be present when you
testify to advise you as to your legal rights ?
Mr. Johnson. I have no need for a lawyer.
The Chairman. Thank you very much.
Mr. Kenned}', you may proceed.
Mr. Kennedy. How long have vou been in this business of ven-
tilating?
15825
15826 IMPROPER ACTIVITIES IN THE LABOR FIELD
Mr. Johnson. Since 1949.
Mr. Kennedy. And you had your own company then ; you had your
own company in 1949 ?
Mr. Johnson. Yes, sir.
Mr. Kennedy. How many employees do you have now ?
Mr. Johnson. Six of us total, including the office ; four employees,
and two in the office.
Mr. Kennedy. What kind of work do you do ?
Mr. Johnson. Industrial and commercial sheet-metal work.
Mr. Kennedy. Is that installing ventilating equipment?
Mr. Johnson, Yes, sir.
Mr. Kennedy. Are all of your employees members of the Sheet
Metal Workers Union ?
Mr. Johnson. Yes, sir.
Mr. Kennedy. Now, Mr. Johnson, you say you went in business in
1949.
Mr. Johnson. Actually, I went in business on November 18, 1949.
Mr. Kennedy. Wlien did your shop become union ; at that time ?
Mr. Johnson. Approximately the same time.
Mr. Kennedy. How did that happen ?
Mr. Johnson. Well, I set the shop up and I went down to con-
tact the Sheet Metal Union, and they told me it would cost $300 to
go into business.
The Chairman. Wliy did you go down to see the Sheet Metal
Union ?
Mr. Johnson. In order to contact or to be accepted in all offices,
like architects, and heating contractors, or factories of other kinds,
you must be union or they will not accept you.
The Chairman. In other words, you cannot go in business without
making it satisfactory to the union ?
Mr. Johnson. No, sir.
The Chairman. Is that correct ?
Mr. Johnson. Yes, sir.
The Chairman. In other words, you have to make a deal with the
union before you can go in business ?
Mr. Johnson. Yes, sir.
The Chairman. All right.
Mr. Kennedy. Let me understand; you set up your business and
you went down to union headquarters — and could you speak up a
little louder ? It is very difficult to hear you.
Mr. Johnson. Yes, sir.
Mr. Kennedy. You went down, and whom did you talk to there?
Mr. Johnson. Mr. Cronin.
Mr. Kennedy. He was president of local Y3 ?
Mr. Johnson. Yes, sir.
Mr. KJENNEDY. Of the Sheet Metal Union ?
Mr. Johnson. Yes, sir.
Mr. Kennedy. What did he say to you at that time ?
Mr. Johnson. Well, I said I was going into business and he got
mad, and finally he told me that he would let me go in if I gave him
$300.
Mr. K!ennedy. He got mad that you were going in business, but he
said he would allow you to go in if you paid him $300 ?
IMPROPER ACTIVITIES IN THE LABOR FIELD 15827
Mr. Johnson. Yes, sir.
Mr. Kennedy. "VVliat control did he have over who should go into
business ?
Mr. Johnson. Well, I really don't know, or the union supplied you
with union men.
Mr. Kennedy. You had to go to the headquarters to get your em-
ployees ; is that right ?
Mr. Johnson. Yes, sir.
Mv. Kennedy. And so he had the control over determining who
should go into business or not ?
Mr. Johnson. Yes, sir.
Mr. Kennedy. And he said, for you to go into business, you would
have to pay him $300 ; is that right ?
Mr. Johnson. Yes, sir.
Mv. Kennedy. Did you make out a check ?
My. Johnson. Yes, sir ; I did. Originally I made out a check, and
I took it down to him, and he would not accept it.
Mr. Kennedy. He would not accept the check ?
Mr. Johnson. No, sir.
Mr. Kennedy. What did he say to you ?
Mr. Johnson. Go back and get it cashed and bring it back.
Mr. Kennedy. Could you speak a little louder ?
Mr. Johnson. He said to go back and get it cashed, if I wanted to
go into business.
Mr. Kennedy. So did you do that ?
Mr. Johnson. Yes, sir.
Mr. Kennedy. And you brought the cash back ?
Mr. Johnson. Yes, sir.
Mr. Kennedy. And you gave him the $300 ; is that right ?
Mr. Johnson. Yes, sir.
Mr. IvENNEDY. What did he say the money was going to be used
for?
Mr. Johnson. He said that some of it was going to go for Christmas
baskets to the poor people.
Mr. Kennedy. Christmas baskets for the poor people ?
Mr. Johnson. Yes, sir.
Mr. Kennedy. Why couldn't you give him a check if it was going
to be for Christmas baskets for the poor people ?
Mr. Johnson. That is a hard one to answer.
Mr. Kennedy. You understood, or felt it was not just for the poor
people, did you not ?
Mr. Johnson. I beg your pardon ?
Mr. Kennedy. You understood it wasn't for the poor people, did
you not ?
Mr. Johnson. Well, I pretty well assumed it wasn't.
The Chairman. The fact is you Imew it was just a payoff to get
the privilege of going into business without being molested ; is that
not true ?
Mr. Johnson. Yes, sir ; and we know you have to give that to go
into business, and that is standard practice.
The Chairman. You had known about that before you started
to go into business, had you not ?
Mr. Johnson. No ; I can't say that. But I found it out real quick
when I set my business up.
15828 IMPROPER ACTIVITIES IN THE LABOR FIELD
The Chairman. You found it out immediately you set up
business ?
Mr. JoHNSOX. Yes, sir.
The Chairman. You had not heard of this racket before that
time ?
Mr. Johnson. Not up to that time.
Mr. Kennedy. It is generally accepted now? Do you know that
in order to go into business you have to make this payment ?
Mr. Johnson. I have heard it around a couple of times, and I
couldn't say for sure, sir.
Mr. Kennedy. But is it a practice that is understood, that takes
place in Chicago ?
Mr. Johnson. Oh, yes.
Mr. Kennedy. You were bidding on industrial and commercial
jobs then starting ?
Mr. Johnson. Small industrial and commercial jobs; yes.
Mr. Kennedy. Did you receive any communication or telephone
calls from any contractors from the period of 1950 to the present
telling you not to bid on any contracts ?
Mr. Johnson. Yes ; one. You are talking about the contract.
Mr. Kennedy. First on contractors, did you receive telephone calls
from them on occasion, telling you not to bid on contracts ?
Mr. Johnson. Yes, I did.
Mr. Kennedy. Two or three times a year ?
Mr. Johnson. No. Only twice that actually contractors have
called me.
Mr. Kennedy. Did Mr. Cronin call you ?
Mr. Johnson. Yes, sir.
Mr. Kennedy. How many times did he call you about it?
Mr. Johnson. On jobs, about two or three times.
Mr. Kennedy. And tell you not to bid on contracts ?
Mr. Johnson. Yes, sir.
Mr. Kennedy. What contracts were they ?
Mr. Johnson. One \yas, I believe, the "seventh floor of the county
building, they were going to revamp some ventilation work, and we
had taken on a plan, and he told me not to bid it.
Mr. Kennedy. It was a county building in Chicago ?
Mr. Johnson. Yes, sir ; county hospital.
Mr. Kennedy. Tlie hospital ?
Mr. Johnson. Yes, sir.
Mr. Kennedy. And he told you not to bid on it ?
Mr. Johnson. Yes, sir.
Mr. Kennedy. What reason did he tell you not to bid on it ?
Mr. Johnson. Well, it was out of my territory, and I should not bid
on tlie bigger stuff.
Mr. Kennedy. Did he call you on any other jobs?
Mr. Johnson. Yes; he called me on one other job, on the Chicago
Transit Authority job.
Mr. Kennedy. And he told you not to bid on that ?
Mr. JojiNSON. Well, yes, he did; not to bid, or complement the bid.
Mr. Kennedy. What do you mean, "complement the bid?"
Mr. Johnson. Put in a higher bid.
Mr. Kennedy. Put in a liigher bid ?
IMPROPER ACTIVITIES IN THE LABOR FIELD 15829
Mr. Johnson. Yes, sir,
Mr. Kennedy. Did he say he would liave the contractor call you and
tell you what fij^ure to put in ?
Mr. Johnson. He had the contractor contact me.
Mr. Kennedy. He had the contractor contact you ?
Mr. Johnson. He said he would.
Mr. Kennedy. Did the contractor contact you i
Mr. Johnson. Yes; he did.
Mr. Kennedy. And did you follow his instructions ?
Mr. Johnson. No ; I did not.
Mr. Kennedy. I )id you put in your own bid ?
Mr. Johnson. I definitely put in my own bid, the way I see them.
Mr. Kennedy. What bid did you put into that?
Mr. Johnson. On tliat particular job, I think it was around $53,000.
Mr. Kennedy. Did you win it ?
Mr. Johnson. No, sir.
Mr. Kennedy. What happened on that ?
Mr. Johnson. Zack Co. took it for $47,000.
Mr. Kennedy. AVill you describe what happened? What occurred
just prior to that, and what led up to this ?
Mr. Johnson. Well, prior to that I had gone down to see them and
got on the bidders' list.
Mr. Kennedy. One second. The CTA refers to the Chicago Transit
Authority ?
Mr. Johnson. Yes, sir.
Mr. Kennedy. All right, go ahead.
Mr. Johnson. They let me bid on a small ventilation job on 76th
and Vincennes Street, or 77th and Vincennes, and I bid the job at
$17,500, and I was low bidder. The closest bid to me was $32,000-and-
some.
Mr. Kennedy. There was that much dift'erence between your bid
and the next bidder ?
Mr. Johnson. Yes, sir. They asked me to come into the office after
I was so low and to make sure I could do it, and I asked for time to
look it over: and so I went back and looked it over, and we found we
could make money, not a lot of money, biit a little money at that rate.
So we went back downtown to CTA, and they asked us to qualify our
bid, wiiich we did, showing them that we could make money at
$17,500, or at least break even.
So they gave me the contract, and prior to that they had another
job tliat was bid at $79,000, and 1 don't know if these figures are right
exactly, or not.
Mr. Kennedy. This is another job going on at the same time?
Mr. Johnson. That had been bid prior to me bidding this $17,000.
Mr. Kennedy. That was also the Chicago Transit i
Mr. Johnson. I was not on the bidders, and they withdrew that bid
and they hadn't let the contract yet, and they asked me to bid that
one, too.
Mr. Kennedy. You had the low bid by far on this earlier snuiller
job: is that correct?
Mr. Johnson. Yes, sir.
Mr. Kennedy. And at the same time tliey were putting out bids for
a much larger job ?
Mr. Johnson. Yes, sir.
15830 IMPROPER ACTIVITIES IN THE LABOR FIELD
Mr. Kennedy. Is that right ?
Mr. Johnson. Yes, sir.
Mr. Kj^nnedy. And the lowest bid on this hirger job was $79,000 ?
Mr, Johnson. That larger job was bid prior to me cominpf in on
the $17,000 job.
Mr. Kennedy. So the Chicago Transit Authority then got in touch
with you and said they wanted you to bid on this other job as well ?
Mr. Johnson. That is right.
Mr. Kennedy. And so you put in your bid on the other job, where
the lowest bid had been $79,000 ?
Mr. Johnson. Approximately; yes, sir. So then we all rebid tlie
job, and my bid was $53,000, I think, and the low bid that got it was
$47,000.^
Mr. Kennedy. So the bids changed when they put the bids out
again, you then were able or felt you were able to do it for $53,000 ?
Mr. Johnson. Yes, sir.
Mr. Kennedy. Which was some $26,000 lower than had been orig-
inally bid ?
Mr. Johnson. Yes, sir.
Mr. Kennedy. Now, why had somebody gotten even lower than vou,
$49,000 ?
Mr. Johnson. I assume they wanted it real bad or wanted to keep
me from getting it.
Mr. Kennedy. Wliat conversations did you have with that bidder
prior to that ?
Mr. Johnson. He came out and tried to get me to go with them, and
he said it was very embarrassing and to go with them on that bid.
Mr. Kennedy. Wlio was that that came out ?
Mr. Johnson. I don't remember his name exactly, but I am sure he
is head of Keynolds Corp.
Mr. Kennedy. Mr. Brown?
Mr. Johnson. I believe that is his name.
Mr. Kennedy. Of the Reynolds Corp. ?
Mr. Johnson. Yes, sir.
Mr. Kennedy. In Chicago ?
Mr, Johnson. Yes, sir.
Mr. Kennedy, And he told you it would be very embarrassing, your
bidding on this job?
Mr. Johnson, Yes, sir.
Mr. Kennedy. And asked you not to bid ; is that right ?
Mr. Johnson. Well, he asked me not to bid, or he asked me to
complement his bid.
Mr. Kennedy. So that you would bid a little bit above what he was
going to bid ?
Mr, Johnson, Yes, sir,
Mr. Kennedy. Did he bring someone with him Avhen he came to see
you?
Mr. Johnson. He had a big follow that made a k^t of noise and tried
to be rough, and he didn't hurt me, and he didn't threaten me or any-
thing, but just cracked his knuckles, and stuff like that,
Mr, Kennedy, He was cracking his knuckles ?
Mr. Johnson, Yes,
The Chairman. In other words, he was making a demonstration so
as to intimidate you ; is that right?
IMPROPER ACTIVITIES IN THE LABOR FIELD 15831
Mr. Johnson. I be<>: your pardon ?
The Chairman. He was making a demonstration of his brute
strength so as to try to intimidate you ; is that right?
Mr. Johnson. In a way ; yes, sir.
The Chairman. Sir?
Mr. Johnson. Yes, sir.
The Chairman. In other words, he was strutting around there, and
showing his authority ?
Mr. Johnson. Yes, sir.
The Chairman. You understood what he was doing?
Mr. Johnson. It didn't bother me.
The Chairman. You understood what he was doing?
Mr. Johnson. Yes, sir.
The CiiAiRiMAN. All right.
Mr. Kennedy. So you refused to go along with this ?
Mr. Johnson. I definitely refused to go along.
Mr. Kennedy. And you put your bid in for what you thought you
could do the work, which was $53,000, but he put in a lower bid for
$47,000?
Mr. Johnson. I think it was Zack Co. took it on the second go
around, took it for $47,000.
Mr. Kennedy. That is the Zack Co. ?
Mr. Johnson. Yes, sir.
Mr. Kennedy. How do you spell that ?
Mr. Johnson. Z-a-c-k.
Mr. Kennedy. That was still some $32,000 lower than the bids as
they had been originally replaced ?
Mr. Johnson. Yes, sir.
Mr. Kennedy. And where the lowest bid before had been $79,000?
Mr. Johnson. Approximately
Mr. Kennedy. The transit authority ultimately got the work done
for $47,000?
Mr. Johnson. Yes, sir.
Mr. Kennedy. Did you have any conversations with Cronin about
that?
JVIr. Johnson. Well, after I had bid this $17,500 job, he called me
in the office and told me that I should go with these boys in this thing.
Mr. Kennedy. Go with the employers?
Mr. Johnson. Yes, sir.
Mr, IvENNEDY. What did he say, and what conversations did you
have with him?
Mr. Johnson. He said that they will contact you, and "now this is
very embarrassing, and you should go with them on the next go-
around."
Mr. Kennedy. Did he tell you not to enter into any more bids with-
out clearing it with him?
Mr. Johnson. Yes, and I should clear all bids through him.
Mr, Kennedy. When was this Chicago Transit Autliority job?
Mr. Johnson. I am not too sure of the date, but I think it is 1955.
Mr. Kennedy. When was the hospital job?
JMr. Johnson. Right around that time, too, or a little prior to that;
3 or 4 months prior to that.
Mr. Kennedy. This has been going on for the last couple of voitvs?
Mr. Johnson. The last year and a half.
15832 IMPROPER ACTIVITIES IN THE LABOR FIELD
Mr. Kennedy. The last year and a half ?
Mr. Johnson. Yes, sir.
Mr. Kennedy. Did Croiiin say anything to you that you should
turn over any percentage of your business to him or that he could
help you? .
Mr. Johnson. He said that if I would go along with them on
things, he would try to get me some State work and I would have to
pay him 2 percent.
Mr. Ivennedy. How much?
Mr. Johnson. Two percent,
Mr. Ivennedy. What did you say to him about that ?
Mr. Johnson. I didn't say nothing, sir.
Mr. Ivennedy. You didn't say anything?
Mr. Johnson. No, sir.
Mr. Kennedy. Did you have an argument with him at the time?
Mr. Johnson. We had a pretty severe argument; yes, sir.
Mr. Kennedy. Did you ever pay these union officials any money
other than the $300 to Mr. Cronin ?
Mr. Johnson. I paid $50 for all apprentices except one.
Mr. Ivennedy. All of the what ?
Mr. Johnson. All of the apprentices that I have got from tlie
union hall.
Mr. Kennedy. How many apprentices have you received ?
Mr. Johnson. Approximately five.
Mr. Kennedy. You liad to pay $50 for each one ?
Mr. Johnson. Yes, sir.
Mr. Kennedy. To whom do you pay the $50 ?
Mr. Johnson. Mr. Cronin,
Mr. Kennedy. Mr. Cronin himself ?
Mr, Johnson. Yes, sir,
Mr, KJENNEDY. Why do you have to pay that ?
Mr. Johnson, I guess that is tlie fee to get an apprentice.
Mr, Kennedy. Check or cash ?
Mr. Johnson. Cash.
Mr, Kennedy. Is there anything else?
Mr, JoHSON, Well, I paid an annuity a couple of times to business
agents for the men tliey have sent out, I would say just twice.
Mr, Kennedy, How much did you pay them ?
Mr, Johnson. Fifty dollars each time,
Mr. Kennedy, What would the business agents be coming out for?
Mr, Johnson, Well, they send men out, and tliey come out and
check your shop, and see if it is wholly union and there is nothing
that isn't acceptable to the union rules and regulations.
Mr, Kennedy. To whom did you pay that money ?
Mr. Johnson. Once it wjis to Mr. Kaberlain, and the other time
was Mr, Caldwell.
Mr. Kennedy, That was $50.
Mr. Johnson. Yes, sir,
Mr, Kennedy, Was that at a time they were coming out to ex-
amine complaints against you ?
Mr. Johnson, Well, we had one little complaint about the ap-
prentices with taking tools on the job, and that is against the union
regulations.
IMPROPER ACTrVITIES IN THE LABOR FIELD 15833
Mr. Kexnkdy. Did tliey drop the complaint?
Mr. Johnson. Yes, sir.
Tlie Chairman. A complaint abont tlie apprentices taking tools
on the job?
Mr. Johnson. They definitely are not allowed to take tools on the
job.
Tlie Chairman. In other words, they go to work without tools?
Mr. Johnson. Yes, sir. I could never understand that myself.
The Chairman. You send them to work without tools?
Mr. Johnson. Yes, sir.
The (^hairman. And if they take tools the boss has got to pay off;
is that right?
Mr. Johnson. Yes, sir.
The Chairman. I am trying to get it straight, and I just can't
understand a thing like that.
Mr. Johnson. I never could either myself.
Tlie Chahoian. But if they take tools to go out and do the work
they are supposed to do, why, then, you as the employer get penalized
and you have to pay off tribute to them?
Mr. Johnson. Yes, sir.
The Chairman. You did that on two occasions?
Mr. Johnson. Yes, sir. On one occasion on that, and the other
one was McGill-Weiseimer Co. had moved to their plant which we
had done, and their employees were unloading sheet-metal work on
the back docks, which wtis against union regulations, and they were
going to stop the job at that time, and the only way we could smooth
things over was to give them $50.
Mr. Kennedy. To whom did you give that $50?
Mr. Johnson. Mr. Caldwell.
Mr. Kennedy. Mr. Ray Caldwell?
Mr. Johnson, Yes, sir.
The Chairman. Up to now your testimony reflects that first you
])aid $800 for the privilege of going into business.
Mr. Johnson. Yes, sir.
The Chairman. Is that true?
^Ir. Johnson. Yes, sir.
The Chairman. And you paid it in cash ?
Mr. Johnson. Yes, sir.
The Chairman. You first made out a check to whom?
Mr. Johnson. To Mr. Cronin.
The Chairman. To him personally?
Mr. Johnson. Yes, sir.
The Chairman. And he declined the check ?
Mr. Johnson. Yes, sir.
The Chairman. And ordered you to get the money in cash?
Mr. Johnson. Yes, sir.
The Chairman. Did you keep that original check you made out
to him ?
Mr. Johnson. At that time, sir, I was in business with E. W. Berg,
Inc., and when I formed this ventilating company known as Bond
Ventilating, Inc., we were each 50-50 partners in it and we had just
incorporated for $2,000, and I believe the check was made at that
21243— 5S — pt. 42 -6
15834 IMPROPER ACTIVITIES IN THE LABOR FIELD
time. It had cross entries from his books to my books until we got
so we could get started. He made the check out himself.
The Chairman. But you carried it out i
Mr. Johnson. I wouldn't know, and I doubt if he would have it.
The Chairman. You carried the check in person ?
Mr. Johnson. Yes, sir.
The Chairman. And tendered it to Mr. Cronin ?
Mr. eToHNSON. Yes, sir.
The Chairman. All right, that is $300 you were out.
Now, you had five apprentices ^
Mr. Johnson. Yes, sir ; I have had about six, sir.
The Chairman. You have had about six ?
Mr. Johnson. Yes, sir ; on one occasion I didn't have to pay.
The Chairman. Then you had five apprentices that you had to
pay on ?
Mr. Johnson. Yes, sir.
The Chairman. That would be $50 each, and that would be $250?
Mr. Johnson. Yes, sir.
The Chairman. Then you have paid out $50 on two occasions to
business agents or representatives to straighten out little grievances ?
Mr. Johnson. Yes, sir.
The Chairman. Just as you have testified ?
Mr. Johnson. Yes, sir. *
The Chairman. That makes a total of $650 that you have been out
in cash ?
Mr. Johnson. That is right, sir.
The Chairman. For the privilege of doing business?
Mr. Johnson. Yes, sir.
Mr. Kennedy. Did you make any other payments, other than the
ones you have mentioned ?
Mr. Johnson. No, sir.
Mr. I^NNEDY. Did you make any other payments to Mr. Cronin?
Mr. Johnson. No, sir.
Mr. IvENNEDY. Did Mr. Cronin ever come to you with certain com-
plaints and you had an exchange of the cigarette box ?
Mr. Johnson. That was for apprentices, sir.
Mr. Kennedy. How was that handled ?
Mr. Johnson. I had to meet him somewhere and give him his $50.
Mr. ICennedy. How would you give him the $50 ?
Mr. Johnson. In an empty cigarette box, a hard box. That was
on a couple of occasions.
Mr. Kennedy. You put the $50 in the cigarette box and then gave
it back to him ?
Mr. Johnson. Yes, sir.
The Chairman. What was that for ?
Mr. Johnson. That was for apprentices, for the right to have an
apprentice.
The Chairman. I thought you had already covered that in the
$250.
Mr. Johnson. That is the same thing we are talking about.
The Chairman. That isn't in addition to the $650 ?
Mr. Johnson. No, sir.
IMPROPER ACTIVITIES IN THE LABOR FIELD 15835
Mr. IvENNEDY. He was describing how it was paid on occasion.
Then you gave him some cuff links, did you ?
Mr. Johnson. Yes, sir.
Mr. I^NNEDY. How much did you pay for them?
Mr. Johnson. $75 for the cuff links.
Mr. Kennedy. At Christmastime?
Mr. Johnson. Yes, sir.
The Chairman. That $75 is in addition to the $650 ?
Mr. Johnson. Yes, sir.
Mr. IvENNEDY. Then you gave his daughter a wedding present?
Mr. Johnson. No, that wasn't me. That was my partner at that
time.
Mr. Kennedy. Your partner, AVliat was his name?
Mr, Johnson. E. W. Berg, who owns Berg, Inc.
Mr. Ivennedy. And he gave the daughter a wedding present?
Mr. Johnson. Yes.
Mr. Ivennedy. How much was that worth ?
Mr. Johnson. I really don't know.
Mr, Kennedy. Did INIr. Cronm speak to you on any other occasion
about staying out of any of the bids in Chicago ?
Mr. Johnson. No.
Mr. Kennedy. Did he call you one time from Florida?
Mr, Johnson. That was on the county building, the county
hospital.
Mr, Kennedy, Well, at that time he was in Florida, was he?
Mr, Johnson. Yes, sir.
Mr. Kennedy. And he called you from there?
Mr. Johnson. Yes, sir.
Mr. Kennedy, And he told you not to bid on the job ?
]Mi'. Johnson, Yes, sir,
]\rr, Kennedy, Did he tell you what would happen to you if you
did bid on the job?
Mr. Johnson. He would have a business agent at the door and
they would rip their cards in half and I would be out. of business.
Mr, Kennedy. If you put a bid in ?
Mr, Johnson. Yes.
Mr, Kennedy, They would rip your employees' union cards in half
and you would be out of business immediately if you bid on this
contract?
Mr, Johnson, Yes, sir,
Mr, Kennfj)y, Did you bid on the contract?
Mr, Johnson. No, sir.
Mr. Kennedy. TYhat was that contract? Can you describe it any
more ?
Mr. Johnson. It is the county hospital, the seventh floor. It is a
section of the building,
Mr, Kennedy, How much did the bid go for, do you know ?
Mr, Johnson, I really don't know. We never even figured the job.
The Chairman, This $75 that vou spoke of for a Christmas present,
that was in addition to the $650 ? ^
Mr, Johnson, Yes, sir.
The Chapman, Making a total of $725 ?
Mr, Johnson, Yes, sir.
15836 IMPROPER ACTIVITIES IN THE LABOR FIELD
The Chairman. Why did you feel you had to give him a Christmas
present ?
Mr. Johnson. "Well, in order to expedite our work we knew that it
was necessary.
The Chairman. In other words, you knew you had to pay ott' in
the form of a Christmas present to save trouble ?
Mr. Johnson. Yes. sir.
The Chairman. Who sugg:ested that to you?
Mr. Johnson. Well, nobody suggested it. This was right after I
had gone into business, and the $300 was involved.
The Chairman. You had already been sufficiently indoctrinated
with their methods of operation that you knew that this was expected
of you ?
Mr. Johnson. Yes, sir.
Mr. Kennedy. Were you told by any of these contractors who calle<l
you that they had control over certain areas and that you shouldn't
try to come in and bid on those ?
Mr. Johnson. Yes. One case Avas the Kaiser Corp.
Mr. Kennedy. The what 'i
Mr. Johnson. The Kaiser Corp. They called me and told me that
I shouldn't be bidding on this one job. 1 believe it was Photocopy,
a company that nrakes re])rint machines. We bid it, but we never
got it.
Mr. Kennedy. Why did they say you shouldn't bid it ?
Mr. JoHNSOx. Well, they said tliat they had l^een in there for yeai-s
and it belonged to them.
Mr. Kennedy. Wliat about Xarowetz ?
Mr. Johnson. He took my partner and I out to lunch one time
and told us that we should stick out on the outer edge of town and
try to develop those little factories that are going to grow into bigger
factories some day and tliat the T>«oop belonged to him and the other
boys.
Mr. Kennedy. To the big contractors ?
Mr. Johnson. Yes, sir.
Mr. Kennedy. He is a big ventilating contractor in Chicago ?
Mr. Johnson. Yes.
Mr. Kennedy. That is Mr. Louis Narowetz ?
The Chairman. About this wedding present, did you get an invita-
tion to his daughter's wedding?
Mr. Johnson. Yes, I did, sir.
The Chairman. Did your partner get one, also?
Mr. Johnson. Yes, sir.
The Chairman. Was a wedding present bought by the firm for the
two of you ?
Mr. Johnson. I don't remember. I think Mr. Berg paid for that.
We had just started in business on the ventilating venture just a couple
of months j)rior to that.
The Chairman. How much did you pay for that wedding prevsent^
Mr. Johnson. I really don't know. Probably around $100.
The Chairman. I understocnl it was about $200.
Mr. Johnson. That is possible.
Tlie Chairman. Wliere is your partner?
Mr. Joiixsox. He is in business at lOK) West <>-)d Street now, in
the steam-lieat iii<r business.
IMPROPER ACTIVITIES IX THE LABOR FIELD 15837
The Chairman. Senator Kennedy, have you any questions ?
Senator Kknnedy. You say you went into business. Why did you
have to jro to the union to ^et employees? Couldn't you have gone
ahead and just hired them yourself?
Mr. JoiiNSox. In some cases, if I have a friend that knows someone,
I get the sheet-metal worker, but that is very seldom. They are
actually supposed to go through the union hall.
Senator Kennedy. That is not permitted by the act. The union
hall is not supposed to operate as a hiring hall.
Mr. Johnson. Well, we are supj)osed to call them, in our case, for
men every time you need them, in every case.
Senator Kennedy. Who says you can't hire men 3'ourself ?
Mr. Johnson. I beg your pardon ?
Senator Kennedy. Who says you can't hire men yourself? You
don't have a union shop cxjntract, obviously.
Mr. Johnson. I have a union shop.
Senator Kennedy. But at the time you went into business? What
I am trying to ask you is, by what process of education did you learn
that you had to go down to the union hall to hire employees?
Mr. Johnson. 'Well, originally when I paid Mr. Cronin the $300,.
lie briefed me on saying that I nuist call there for manpower, and if
I was union employer I would get consideration.
Senator Kennedy. Did you underetand that if you didn't hire as
employees members of the Sheet Metal I^nion, that your products
wouldn't be serviced by building trades? Why didn't you hire your
own people?
Mr. Johnson. You must be union or you can't be accepted in any
architect's office or any manufacturing place or anywhere else, because
these manufacturers do not want union trouble.
Senator Kennedy. In other words, you have to go to the union to
get the men ?
Mr. Johnson. Yes, sir.
Senator Kennedy. As I understood it, Mr. Cronin stated that you
couldn't get these union people unless you had contributed the $300
which he said was for the Christmas fund; is that right ?
Mr. Johnson. Will you please say that over?
Senator Kennedy. That you couldn't get the union men — tliat you
had to get union men or you couldn't operate, and you couldn't get
the union men until you made the contribution of $300 to Mr. Cronin?
Mr. Johnson. That is right.
Senator Kennedy. After you made the $300 contribution to Mr.
Cronin, you were able to get the union men and you have been able to
get them ever since?
Mr. Johnson. Yes, sir. Once in a while we can't. I Avould say 50
])ercent of the time we can't get any men. Sometimes we can and some-
times we can't. It depends on whether they are out of work or not.
Senator Kennedy. What ?
Mr. Johnson. If any of them are out of work and are lianging
around the union hall.
^ Senator Kennedy. Let's say there is enough Avork for all of tliem.
Then what do you do if you want people? Do they just tell you that
there are no men available?
Mr. Johnson. There is nothing available, unless you go get a new
fellow, an apprentice or something, and they might accept him.
15838 IMPROPER ACTIVITIES IN THE LABOR FIELD
Senator Kennedy. Then you pay the $50 for the apprentice. Sup-
pose they don't want to take him f
Mr. Johnson. There is nothing you can do about it.
Senator Kennedy. And you pay $375 to get into the Sheet Metal
Workers? He pays $375 entrance dues to get into the Sheet Metal
Workers?
Mr. Johnson. $300.
Mr. Kennedy. It is $375 now.
Senator Kennedy. It is $375 now. How good were the men that
were sent to you ?
Mr. Johnson. About 99 percent of the time they were lousy.
Senator Kennedy. In what way were they lousy ?
Mr. Johnson. They would go to sleep on the job; drink on the job.
The Chahiman. What ? Say it over.
Mr. Johnson. I said they would sleep, take naps on the job. I
found three of them sleeping on the job once.
Senator Kennedy. Did you fire them ?
Mr. Johnson. Yes ; I did.
Senator Ivennedy. What happened ?
Mr. Johnson. Nothing happened in that case.
Senator Kennedy. Did you get some more men ?
Mr. Johnson. Not right then, no. At a little later date I did.
Senator Kennedy. How long do you think it takes to learn how to
be a sheet-metal worker ?
Mr. Johnson. Well, I would say to be a fair sheet-metal worker it
would take 4 years.
Senator Kennedy. Four years.
Mr. Johnson. Yes, sir.
Senator Kennedy. It is that highly skilled ?
Mr. Johnson. That would have to be a very studious individual.
Senator Kennedy. You mean it would really take you 4 years in
order to learn how to do it ?
Mr. Johnson. Yes.
Senator Kennedy. Are you a sheet-metal worker ?
Mr. Johnson. Yes, sir.
Senator Kennedy. Are you in the union ?
Mr. Johnson. Yes, sir.
Senator Kennedy. You are not in it now ; is that right ?
Mr. Johnson. Yes, sir.
Senator Kennedy. But you were ? That is how you started ?
Mr. Johnson. Yes, sir.
Senator Kennedy. It took you 4 years to do it ?
Mr. Johnson. At that time I served my first part of my sheet metal
up in Michigan.
Senator Kennedy. Did you used to get hired by having people
come to the union hall to hire you ?
Mr. Johnson. We had no unions up there, sir.
Senator Kennedy. You were nonunion there?
Mr. Johnson. That was quite a few years ago.
Senator Kennedy. Thank you.
Mr. Kennedy. When you lired these people, did you fire them your-
self?
Mr. Johnson. Yes.
Mr. Kennedy. Did you have to pay any penalty for firing them ?
IMPROPER ACTIVITIES IN THE LABOR FIELD 15839
Mr. Johnson. Not at the time he was talking about. We had the
Ivanhoe School, I believe it was, a small job, and I walked in the
boilerroom about noon, the furnace room, and the apprentice was
working all alone.
I asked him where the men was and he said they just went to lunch.
So I went back out and talked to the superintendent on tlie job and
he said that, "Your men don't get here until 9 o'clock in the morning,
they leave at 10, and they come back at 2 :30."
I had an appointment on the north side and had to leave at once.
I told the apprentice to tell them, to fire them, when they come in. So
he fired them, and that was almost the end of his union career. I had
to pay them an extra day's wages each because they had been fired
wrongly. They should be fired by an executive of the company.
Mr. Kennedy. You were told on a number of occasions, were you
not, by ]\Ir. Cronin, that you should not bid on contracts without
clearing through him first ?
Mr. Johnson. A couple of times.
The CiiAiRjMAN. Mr. Jolmson, from information I have received,
I realize that you have testified somewhat reluctantly because of appre-
hension and concern about what can or could happen to you. Is that
correct ?
Mr. Johnson. Yes, sir.
The Chairman. First, I want to commend you for your cooperation
with the committee and for your coming, even though reluctantly,
because of the terror that has been instilled in the small businessman
of your category of business in that area, and because of the exploita-
tion of you that is going on through this racket-infested union.
I want to commend you for having the courage to do it. This com-
mittee has a stupendous task. We are confronted, not only the com-
mittee, but the Government of the United States, with a challenge
from these racketeers, gangsters, thugs, crooks, hoodlums, who are
undertaking to take over the economy of this country.
The committee has faithfully and diligently undertaken to try to
bring these facts to light so that the Congress might have the informa-
tion to guide it with respect to legislation that is needed to remedy
these conditions.
Good Americans, people like you, who, although under the stress and
strain of apprehension as to the retaliation that might be taken against
them, who come before the committee and give us this information
to help preserve our Government, you are to be highly commended
for it.
I cannot command words at tlie moment to express the commenda-
tion that you deserve. I want to place you under recognizance to
reappear before this committee. You will remain under your present
subpena.
If at any time, while you remain under the jurisdiction of this com-
mittee, these thugs, hoodlums, and racketeers, exploiters, gangsters,
that element, undertake in any way to intimidate you, to coerce or
threaten you, or anj'one in your family, I want you to report it imme-
diately to this committee. I think we can take some action. I think
we can command other agencies of the Government to act. We will
give you every protection within our power.
Will you accept that recognizance ?
Mr. Johnson. Yes, sir.
15840 IMPROPER ACTIVITIES IN THE LABOR FIELD
The Chairman. Thank you very much, and also the thanks, I can
say, of all decent citizens in this country go to you, and to others who
have appeared here who have been willino;, in the face of this crying
situation, to come before the committee and tell the truth. Thank you
very much.
Call the next witness.
Mr. Kennedy. Mr. Jolicoeur.
The Chairman. You solemnly swear the evidence you shall give be-
fore this Senate select committee shall be the truth, the whole truth,
and nothing but the truth, so help you God ?
Mr. Jolicoeur. I do.
TESTIMONY OF WILBUR JOLICOEUR
The Chairman. State your name, your place of residence, and your
business or occupation.
Mr. Jolicoeur. Wilbur Jolicouer. I live in Medina, 111. I operate
the Jolicoeur Metal & Heating Co. of Melrose Park. I am president.
The Chairman. Do you waive counsel, Mr. Jolicoeur ?
Mr. Jolicoeur. Yes.
The Chairman. All right, Mr. Kennedy ; proceed.
Mr. Kennedy. Mr. Jolicoeur, how many employees do j^ou have ?
Mr. Jolicoeur. At the present time we have nine.
Mr. Kennedy. And they are all members of the Sheet Metal Work-
ers Union ?
Mr. Jolicoeur. Yes, all of them are members of the 72 local except
the men we have working in Michigan.
Mr. Kennedy. How long have you been in business yourself ?
Mr. Jolicoeur. Since 1948.
Mr. Kennedy. How" long have you been affiliated with the union ?
Mr. Jolicoeur. I believe it was in 1952.
Mr. Kennedy. How did that come about ?
Mr. Jolicoeur. Well, we had been approached a couple of years
prior — well, I think in 1950 — about joining the union, and I couldn't
see any definite advantages to it at that time. So we declined the
offer.
Mr. Kennedy. What happened after that ?
Mr. Jolicoeur. Well, as tlie work started to come in and our busi-
ness was being built up, we were approached at a later date, T think
it was in 1952 then, to join the union, to form a union sliop. And after
talking it over, I was told to bring $300 down to tlie union hall.
Mr. Kennedy, Who told you that ?
Mr. Jolicoeur. I couldn't remember the exact name at the time. I
think it was probably either Mr. Cronin or Mr, Troutman.
Mr, Kennedy. Either Mr. Cronin, the head of the union, or Mr.
Troutman, the business agent?
Mr. Jolicoeur. Yes,
Mr. Kennedy. And one of those two men told you to bring $300
down to the union hall ?
Mr. Jolicoeur, Yes,
Mr. Kennedy, That was after you decided to join the union ?
Mr. Jolicoeur, Yes.
Mr. Kennedy. Was that to be by check or cash ?
IMPROPER ACTIVITIES IN THE LABOR FIELD 15841
Mr. JoLicoEUR. By cash.
Mr. Kennedy. Were you told tliat ?
Mr. .loLicoEUR. Yes.
Mr. Kennedy. What. Mas the purpose of the $300 ?
Mr. .loLicoEUR. Well, at the time I passed it over to one of the two
gentlemen I was told it was for compensation for tlie union officials,
Mr. Kennedy. What kind of comi)ensation i
Mr. Joi.icoEUR. They just mentioned it was compensation.
Mr. Kennedy. It wasn't regular union dues?
Mr. JOLICOEUR. Xo.
Mr. Kennedy. They told you that; that it was just compensation?
Mr. JoLicoEUR. They said it was compensation for the union officere.
Mr. Kennedy. Did they tell you it wouldn't go into the regidar
union funds? Was there any conversation about that?
Mr. JoLicoEUR. Well, I assumed that it wouldn't go into the union
fund.
]Mr. Kennedy. About 1953 or 1954 did you start bidding on indus-
trial work?
Mr. JoLicoEUR. Yes.
^Ir. Kennedy. Would you tell me if you had any convereations
witli any union official in connection with that?
Mr. JoLicoEUR. Well, I think the first few jobs we bid we started
getting some calls from the union about, saying that our shop wasn't
big enough, wasn't equipped well enough to handle big work; that
we shouldn't be taking it. As a matter of fact, it was mentioned that
w^e shouldn't even attempt to undertake any job larger that $5,000, and
if we did, we should call down to tlie hall and get clearance from them
first.
Mr. Kennedy. Who told you that ?
Mr. JoLicoEUR. This was on a phone call that I received from the
hall.
Mr. Kennedy. Do you know who it was that called you ?
Mr. JoLicoEUR. I can't truthfully say.
Mr. Kennedy. Had any union official been out to your shop to find
out if it was too small to do this w^ork ?
Mr. JoLicoEUR. I think since we had joined the union, we were
in one location in Melrose Park, and in between that period we moved
to another location and put up a new building. No one had ever been
in our shop.
Mr. Kennedy. No union official had ever been there ?
Mr. JoLicoEUR. No.
Mr. Kennedy. Yet they were calling you and telling you you were
too small ?
Mr. JoLicoEUR. Yes.
Mr. Kennedy. Why is it their prerogative, anyway, to tell you
Avhether you should bid on a contract or not ?
Mr. JoLicoEUR. I don't understand that myself.
Mr. Kennedy. What did you say to them ?
Mr. JoLicoEtJR. I don't think I said anything about it. We just
went ahead and kept bidding.
Mr. Kennedy. You didn't feel that you were bound by the instnic-
tions from the union ?
Mr. JoLicoEUR. No.
15842 IMPROPER ACTIVITIES IN THE LABOR FIELD
Mr. Kennedy. Did they say that you should just handle contracts
up to $5,000 and you should clear it with them before you bid on the
contract ?
Mr. JoLicoEUR. Yes.
Mr. Kennedy. You could handle the ones under $5,000, but clear
the rest with them ?
Mr. JoLicoETjR. Yes.
Mr. Kennedy. Did you clear it with them when you bid ?
Mr. JoLicouER. No. When we were called in to bid on a job, we
just went ahead and bid it, unless we o:ot a call.
Mr. Kennedy. Did they tell you that if you did bid on these other
contracts what you shovild bid on them ?
Mr. JoLicoEUR. They never did tell us what to bid on a job, although
we had calls on certain jobs. We were practically through with the
estimating on them and they told us not to turn in our bid.
Mr. Kennedy. These were calls from the union headquarters?
Mr. JoLiooEUR. Yes.
Mr. Kennedy. Did they ever tell you that if you did bid on any
contracts, they would give you a number and tell you what to bid ?
Mr. JoLicoEUR. Just on one occasion.
Mr. Kennedy. They never identified who they were when they
called you from the union headquarters ?
Mr. JoLicoEUR. Not that I can remember ; no.
Mr. Kennedy. How often did this happen, that you received the
calls from the union headquarters not to bid on the contracts?
Mr. JoLicoEUR. Well, I think there was possibly six or seven in-
stances.
Mr. Kennedy. Was there an instance, a situation, that arose re-
cently in the Illinois Institute of Technology in Chicago ?
Mr. JoLicoEUR. Yes.
Mr. Kennedy. Would you tell us about that ?
Mr. JoLicoEUR. Well, we were bidding the job, and I think it was
about the day before the bids were to go in, or I think 2 days before.
I got a call from the hall and was asked if I was bidding the job and
I said "Yes."
They mentioned that I shouldn't be bidding, but if I were going to
go ahead with it, they would give me a number to go in with before
the bidding was due.
Mr. Kennedy. They w^ould tell you what you were to bid ?
Mr. JoLicoEUR. Yes.
Mr. Kennedy. Did you bid on it?
Mr. JoucOEUR. No.
Mr. Kennedy. Why didn't you bid on it ?
Mr. JoLicoEUR. Well, rather than go in to the false price, I just for-
got about the whole thing.
Mr. Kennedy. You didn't want to be mixed up with that ?
Mr. JoLicoEUR. No.
Mr. Kennedy. What was the size of the job, approximately?
Mr. JoLicoEUR. Well, I would be a little bit reluctant to say. I
would imagine $25,000 or $30,000.
Mr. Kennedy. It was the men's residence hall at the Illinois Insti-
tute of Technology ?
Mr. Jolicoeur. Yes.
IMPROPER ACTIVITIES IN THE LABOR FIELD 15843
Mr. Kennedy. Did you have any calls from any contractors telling
you not to bid?
Mr. JoLicoEUR. No, I didn't.
Mr. Kennedy. All of these calls were from union officials?
Mr. JoLiooEUR. Yes.
The Chairman. Have you made any payoffs to the union or any
officials of the union other than the $300 that you paid initially ?
Mr. JoLicoEUR. No.
The Chairman. Have any demands been made on you for any
further payments?
Mr. JoLicoEUR. No.
The Chairiman. Do you employ your men through the union?
Mr. JoLicoEUR. Generally speaking, no. We have called down tliere
for men sometimes, but they don't seem to be the best. We just hesi-
tate to call. We try to find men who are out of work ourselves who
have union cards and hire them that way.
The Chairman. If you employ somebody who does not have a union
card, what happens ?
Mr. JoLicoEUR. Well, he would get pulled off the job.
The Chairman. Can he join the union by making a payment ? I am
just asking about your experience, now.
Mr. JoLicoEUR. I haven't had any experience. As far as our ap-
prentices are concerned, some of the men that we have in the shop now
started with us originally. They have made their own arrangements
about getting their permit cards.
The Chairman. Do you know what they had to pay ?
Mr. JoLicoEUR. No, I don't.
The Chairman. But they made their own arrangements ?
Mr. JoLicoEUR. Yes.
The Chairman. Is there anything further ?
Mr. Kennedy. That is all, Mr. Chairman.
The Chairman. All right. Thank you very much.
You will remain under your present subpena under the jurisdiction
of the committee, subject to being recalled at such time as the commit-
tee may need further testimony from you.
The same admonition I have given to other witnesses with respect
to any molestation or intimidation or attempt to coerce you, threats
and so forth, will apply to you. You will report to the committee any
incident of tliat nature that might happen.
Mr. JoLicoEUR. Thank you.
Mr. Kennedy. Could I ask you this : On the question of identificca-
tion, when these people would call up from the union headquarters, did
they give you any name at all ?
Mr. JoLicoEUR. There were names given, and a lot of times I had to
call back. I can't truthfully say which one it was.
Mr. Kennedy. But were there a number of names that were given
to you ?
Mr. JoLicoEUR. Well, it would be either Mr. Troutman or Mr.
Cronin. Just those two are the only gentlemen I have had any deal-
ings with at the union.
Mr. Kennedy. You can't identify any particular call with any
particular individual, but the people that called you from the head-
quarters were either Mr. Troutman or Mr. Cronin; is that right?
15844 IMPROPER ACTIVITIES IN THE LABOR FIELD
Mr. JoLicoEUR. Yes.
Mr. Kennedy. I wanted to be sure we had that straightened out.
The calls from the union headquarters came from either Mr. Troutman
orMr. Cronin.
Mr. JoLicoEUR. Yes.
Mr. Kennedy. Thank you.
The Chairman. We have here an affidavit from Mr. Arthur L. Xel-
son, dated the 25th day of November 1958. It may be printed in the
record at this point.
Mr. Nelson is vice president of John H. Nelson Co., Inc., heating
and sheet-metal contractors. It states, among other things, that his
usual contracts are around $1,000 and the highest has been $38,000,
and when a contractor asked him to bid on a job he was called by
either Mr. Cronin, Mr. Troutman or Mr. Tracy of local 73, who told
him he was not supposed to bid on school jobs and, therefore, he en-
tered no bid.
That is the substance of the affidavit,
(The affidavit referred to follows :)
Affidavit
8200 South Vincenxes Avenue,
Chicago, III., November 25, 195S.
I, Arthur L. Nelsou, voluntarily make this statement to Irwin Langenbacher.
who has identified himself as an assistant counsel, U.S. Senate Committee on
Labor and Management. I am vice president of John H. Nelson Co., Inc., heat-
ing and sheet-metal contractors. Our usual contracts are around $1,000, and our
highest has been $38,000.
About a year or two ago one of our salesmen obtained plans from a general
contractor pertaining to the ventilating installation at a school. Shortly after-
ward I received a call from either Cronin, Troutman, or Tracy of local 73 who
said I was not supposed to bid on school jobs, and I said I did not intend to.
No bid was entered by our company.
I have read the above statement and it is true to the best of my knowledge
and belief.
/s/ Aethuk L. Nelsox.
Sworn to and subscribed before me this 25th day of November 1958.
E. J. Gorman, Notary Public.
The Chairman, Call the next witness.
Mr. Kennedy. Mr. John Merrow.
The Chairman. Be sworn, please.
You do solemnly swear the evidence you shall give before this
Senate select committee shall be the truth, the whole truth, and
nothing but the truth, so help you God ?
Mr. Merrow. Yes.
TESTIMONY OF JOHN MERROW
The Chairman. State your name, your place of residence, and your
business or occupation,
Mr, Merrow, John Merrow. I live at 8734 Duffy, in Hometown.
111. My business is at 3215 East 83d.
The Chairman. I didn't get the last.
Mr. Merrow. The business is 3215 East 83d.
The Chairman. What is the business?
Mr. Merrow. Sheet metal. J & M Heatintr Co.
IMPROPER ACTIVITIES IN THE LABOR FIELD 15845
The Chairman. J & M Heating Co. ?
Mr. Merrow. Yes.
The CiiAiRMAx. What is your connection with the company?
Mr. Merrow. I own the company.
The Chairman. You own the company ?
Mr. Merrow. Yes.
The Chairman. You waive counsel, I assume?
Mr. Merrow. Yes, I do.
The Chairman. Proceed.
Mr. Kennedy. You owned the company since September 1954?
Mr. Merrow. Yes, sir.
Mr. Kennedy. How many employees do you have ?
Mr. Merrow. Four.
Mr. Kennedy. Prior to going into business for yourself, you were
a sheet-metal worker?
Mr. Merrow. That is right.
Mr. Kennedy. And had a union card in local 73 in Chicago?
Mr. Merrow. Yes, sir.
Mr. Kennedy. You went in business in 1954. Did you speak to a
business agent of the Sheet Metal Workers Union ?
Mr. ]Merrow. AVell, I tried to get in quite a while before. I had
some union men working for me. I didn't understand that I had to
clear the hall to go into business. I was operating a couple of weeks
and then they called and pulled all the men out of my shop.
Mr. Kennedy. Even though you had all union men ?
Mr. Merrow\ Yes, they did.
The Chairman. Who pulled them out?
Mr. Merrow. The business agent, Mr. Kaberlein.
The Chairman. Why did he pull them out?
Mr. Merrow. Because I hadn't l)een properly signed up with the
union to be a contractor.
The Chair^ian. Although you were employing union men, all of
vour employees were union, you hadn't made the proper arrangements
yet?
Mr. Merrow. Well, the thing was that I called up and wanted to
]y,\\ their welfare and pension fund, and he said, "How can you do
that when you are not even a contractor?" xlnd that is what started
the ball rolling.
The Chairman. Tell us how it rolled.
Mr. jSIerrow. That was in April. Then I had to go back to work
for another contractor at that time, and I had a chance to buy tools
from an older fellow that went out of business, and so I had this in-
vestment and I still M-anted to go into business. So at the time I
didn't feel that I could sell the tools and get my money back, and then
in August I called them again and he said, "Come in the next board
meeting," which was on the third Friday of the month. So I came
in, and tliey decided to look my shop over the following Wednesday,
and when lie came out to look my shop over
The Chairman. You appeared before the board ?
Mr. Merrow. Yes, sir.
The Chairman. That is about 12 membei-s?
Mr. Merrow. Yes, sir ; at least that man}^
The Chairman. Tliey were the ones to decide Avlietlier you could
cro into business or not?
15846 IMPROPER ACTIVITIES IN THE LABOR FIELD
Mr. Merkow. Yes, sir.
The Chairman. You just can't start a business, you have to ap-
pear before the board ?
Mr. Merrow. You have to sign up that you are willing to pay wel-
fare and pension funds.
The ChxVirman. Once you agreed to do that, this board is the one
that decides whether you can go into business or not ?
Mr. Merrow. Yes, sir.
The Chairman. And that board has its meeting down at the union
headquarters ?
Mr. Merrow. They send out their business agent later, and look
you over, and if he says it is all right, it is OK.
The Chairman. The business agent came out?
Mr. Merrow. Yes, sir.
The Chairman. That was Mr. Kaberlein again ?
Mr. Merrow. Yes, sir.
The Chairman. What did he say ?
Mr. Merrow. He looked the shop over, and he said that he didn't
think I could make it, that there was a lot of competition, and that he
advised me not to go in, but if I still wanted to, all right. Then he
suggested that for the Christmas baskets and the older sheet-metal
workers, that I pay $300.
The Chairman. For what?
Mr. Merrow. For Christinas baskets and the older sheet-metal
workers that couldn't keep a job very often, it was a practice that
everyone gave $300 toward contributions to the people that couldn't
hold a job very often.
The Chairman. What time of year was this that you went in
business ?
Mr. Merrow. It was in September of 1954.
The Chairman. They started collecting Christmas baskets in
September ?
Mr. Merrow. That is what he said, sir.
The Chairman. What is that?
Mr. Merrow. That is what he said.
The Chairman. Did you believe him ?
Mr, Merrow. Well, I have my own opinion, I don't know what it is.
The Chairman. I am sure j'^ou did have an opinion, and you knew
it was just a shakedown, didn't you ?
Mr. Merrow. Well, I have heard of it a lot of times, it is standard
practice.
The Chairman. And you were then experienced ?
Mr. Merrow. Yes, sir, and I have been in the union quite a while.
The Chairman. And so you knew how they operated ?
Mr. Merrow. Yes, sir.
Tlie Chairman. You knew what that was for ?
Mr. Merrow. Yes, sir.
The Chairman. It went to the officers, didn't it ?
Mr. Merrow. Pardon me?
The Cii AiRBfAN. It went to the officers ?
Mr. Merrow. I can't say that, and I don't know.
The Chairman. You don't think it ever went beyond them, do you?
Mr. Merrow. There are a lot of old slieet-metal workers, and I
know if they come to my shop they couldn't hold a job very long.
IMPROPER ACTIVITIES IN THE LABOR FIELD 15847
The Chairman. There are old people in all professions and all vo-
cations, and do you know of them getting this money ?
Mr. Merrow. I never heard of it.
The Chairman. What is that ?
Mr. Merrow. I never heard of it.
The Chairman. All right. I understand the staff has examined
the books of the union ; is that correct?
]\Ir. Kennedy. Yes, that is correct.
The Ciiair:man. And they find no entry anywhere where any money
was paid out for old sheet-metal workers 'i
Mr. Kennedy. Or that this money was ever received in the books.
The Chairman. There is no record or accounting of this money ; is
that correct?
Mr. Kennedy. That is correct.
The Chairman. All right.
]\Ir. Kennedy. Did he say the money had to be paid in cash ?
Mr. MERROw^ Yes, sir.
]\Ir. Kennedy. He told you that ?
Mr. Merrow. I had already been informed of that before, and so I
had the money in cash.
Mr. Kennedy. You knew about this ?
Mr. Merrow. "Well, he informed me before.
Mr. Kennedy. Did you pay it to him at the time he was out there?
Mr. Merrow. Yes, sir.
Mr. Kennedy. He told you before that vou Avere going to have to
pay the $300?
Mr. Merrow. He said $450, but when he got there he changed it
to $300.
Mr. Kennedy. You got by with $300 ?
Mr. Merrow. Yes, sir.
]\Ir. Kennedy. And he said it would have to be in cash ?
Mr. Merrow. Yes, sir.
jNlr. Kennedy. He didn't give you any receipt for it ?
Mr. Merrow. No, sir.
Mr. Kennedy. That is all.
The Chairman. Is tliere anything further. Senator Kennedy ?
Senator Kennedy. No, sir.
The Chairman. Thank you very much.
You have heard the injunction the Chair gave to the other wit-
]iesses, and you will remain under your present subpena under the
jurisdiction of tlie committee, and you will report to us any attempts
to intimidate or coerce or threaten you.
Mr. Merrow. Am I allowed to go home today ?
The Chairman. Yes, and you agree to return and give further testi-
mony to the committee at such time as you may be notified to do so?
Mr. Merrow. Yes, sir, I do.
The Chairman. Thank you.
Mr. Kennedy. Mr. Kaberlein.
The Chairman. Mr. Kaberlein, will you come around.
You do solemnly swear that the evidence you shall give before this
Senate select committee shall be the truth, the whole truth, and noth-
ing but the truth, so help you God ?
Mr. Kaberlein. I do.
15848 IMPROPER ACTIVITIES IN THE LABOR FIELD
TESTIMONY OF JOSEPH KABERLEIN, ACCOMPANIED BY COUNSEL,
NATHAN M. COHEN
The Chairman. Mr. Kaberlein, give us your name and your address
and your business or occupation, please.
Mr. Karerleijst. Joseph Kaberlein. I live at 654.'*> Nokomis Ave-
nue, Lincolnwood, and I am a business representative for the Sheet
Metal Workers Local 73.
The Chairman. You have counsel, do you?
Mr. Kaberlein. I do have.
The Chairman. Counsel, identify yourself for the re<^ord.
Mr. Cohen. Nathan M. Cohen, Chicago, 111., and I am a member of
the Illinois bar.
The Chairman. Proceed, Mr. Kennedy.
Mr. Kennedy. Mr. Kaberlein, how long have you been with the
Sheet Metal Workers l^nion?
Mr. Kaberlein. I started my apprenticeship in 1928.
Mr. Kennedy. When did you become a sheet-metal worker I
Mr. Kaberlein. A full-fledged journeyman, you mean I
Mr. Kennedy. Yes.
Mr. Kaberlein. In 1935.
Mr. Kennedy. When did you become an officer?
Mr. Kaberlein. In 1948.
Mr. Kennedy. Were you elected or appointed ?
Mr. Kaberlein. I was appointed the hrst time — or no ; I was elected
both times.
Mr. Kennedy. You were elected both times ?
Mr. Kaberlein. Yes, sir.
Mr. Kennedy. In 1948 and then in 1953 ?
Mr. Kaberlein. Yes.
Mr. Kennedy. Now, what compensation do you re<?eive from the
union ?
Mr. Kaberlein. Pardon me?
Mr. Kennedy. What compensation do you receive from the union
at the present time ?
Mr. Kaberlein. In what way ; salary ?
Mr. Kennedy. Salary and expenses.
Mr. Kaberlein. My salary is $350 a week, and we have expense for
the car, $129 for every 2 weeks.
Mr. Kennedy. $129 every 2 weeks for your car ?
Mr. Iv.\berlein. Car and incidental expenses.
Mr. Kennedy. That is $350 a week salary and $258 a month ex-
pense ?
Mr. Kaberlein. That is about right.
Mr. Kennedy. Do you also receive any travel expenses that you
miglit have?
Mr. Kaberlein. I do when I go out of towiu
Mr. Kennedy. Do you also receive any money fi'om any of the con-
tractors who are setting up business in Chicago?
Ml-. Kab.erlein. There isn't a contractor that could come in here
and trutlifidly say he has given me any money.
Mr. Kennedy. We have had two of them who have sworn under
oath that they gave you money. The ])revious witness just testified
IMPROPER ACTIVITIES IN THE LABOR FIELD 15849
that he ]xiid you $800 in cash after you requested $450 from him
ori<2;inally.
Mr. Kaberlein. The previous witness, he lied when he said that I
took men out of his shop and closed his shop, or that he had gave me
any money.
Air. Kennedy. Let us stick strictly to the question of giving you
money. He testified that he gave you $300 in cash in approximately
September of 1954; did he give you $300 in cash in September of
1954 ^
Mr. Kaberlein. I deny that he gave me any money at any time.
Mr. Kennedy. Mr. Johnson, one of the Avitnesses that preceded him
this morning, testified that on several occasions he gave you $50 in
casli.
Mr. Kaberlein. Mr. Johnson has never given me any money.
Mr. Kennedy. So those statements by both of those witnesses that
they gave you money in cash in order to settle their labor difficul-
ties, and labor problems, is untrue ; is that correct ?
Mr. Kaberlein. That is correct.
Mr. Kennedy. You didn't receive any money from these indi-
viduals?
Mr. Kaberlein. I did not receive any money.
Mr. Kennedy. Did you ever suggest to any contractor that he not
bid on any contract ?
Mr. Kaberlein. Not to my knowledge did I ever tell any contractor
not to bid on any job.
Mr. Kennedy. Well, you would remember if you had done that.
Is your answer unequivocal ?
]\Ir. Kaberlein. I did not tell any contractor not to bid on any
job.
Mr. Kennedy. Did you ever tell any contractor what he should bid
on a job?
]\Ir. Kaberlein. I did not.
Mr. Kennedy. Did you ever tell any contractor that you would
have anotlier individual contact him and tell him how much he should
bid on a job?
]\Ir. Kaberlein. I did not tell any contractor that.
Mr. Kennedy. Did you tell any individual that ?
Mr. Kaberlein. I did not.
Mr. Kennedy. That is all.
The Chairman. Are there any questions, Senator ?
Mr. Cohen. The witness states that the taking of pictures at this
time does make him a bit nervous and distracts him. I will ask these
gentlemen to withhold their pictures.
The Chairman. The photographers will withhold taking further
pictures while the witness is testifying.
All right, proceed.
Senator Kennedy. Some reference has been made by a previous
witness to what amounts to a hiring hall, as far as the Sheet Metal
Workers are concerned in the Chicago area. Now, if they go into
business, do they come to the union for employees; is that the
custom ?
Mr. Kaberlein. Every contractor has the riglit to hire anyone he
wishes, and that is the right to discharge anyone he wishes.
21243— 59— pt. 42 7
15850 IMPROPER ACTIVITIES IN THE LABOR FIELD
Senator Kennedy. Well, you heard the previous statement as to
what the procedure was in the cases involved; is that not correct?
Mr. Kaberlein. Those statements are false.
Senator Kennedy. That isn't the procedure that they follow ?
Mr. Klaberlein. That is not the procedure.
Senator Kennedy. Now, if a company is going to be set up, is it
customary in the area where you have a responsibility for the em-
ployer to come to you in regard to the employees that he will hire ?
Mr. Kaberlein. Mr. Kennedy, I didn't hear the first part of your
statement.
Senator Kennedy. Is it customary where an employer goes into
business in your area, to come to the Sheet Metal Workers for
employees ?
Mr. Kaberlein. They don't come in for employees.
Senator Kennedy. You don't suggest employees ?
Mr. Kaberlein. We don't suggest any employees, and they have
a right to hire any employees they wish.
Senator Kennedy. Well, I know they do have a legal right to, and
the question is, do they ?
Mr. Kaberlein. They do.
Senator I^nnedy. They don't come to you for employees, and you
don't recommend employees to the employers ?
Mr. Kaberlein. Occasionally an employer has no one that he can
obtain, and he doesn't know of any men out of work, and he may
come in and ask if we had any men out of work, or select men in the
office that are sitting downstairs and waiting for work, and many
of our contractors have done that.
Senator Kennedy. They do come to your union then to get em-
ployees. In other words, your union people do come and wait around
the union in order to get work ?
Mr. Kaberlein. At times they do, and most of the time they are
always selected on the jobs.
Senator Kennedy. In other words, it is unequivocally false that
employers, the ones that came here and employers in a similar posi-
tion, come to you for employees and are subject to possible action by
your members around the country if they do not do so? That is
false ; is that correct ?
Mr. Kaberlein. Senator Kennedy, I didn't hear that earlier state-
ment.
Senator Kennedy. Wliat I am trying to do is ask you whether the
statement that they made, that they came to you in order to get
employees recommended to them ; I am asking you whether that state-
ment is false.
Mr. Kaberlein. That statement is false.
Senator Kennedy. And in addition that they paid you in order to
get the employees ; that that is false, too ?
Mr. Kaberlein. That is false.
Senator Kennedy. Now, it is not customary for the majority of
employers in the area wliere you have responsibilities to come to the
union for employees ; is that correct ?
Mr. Kaberlein. It is not customary for the employers to come to
our oflice for meiu Thoy may hii'e anyone they wish.
Senator Kennedy. And tliere has been no attempt to force them
to clear their employees with you ?
IMPROPER ACTIVITIES IN THE LABOR FIELD 15851
Mr. Kaberlein. No attempt made to that effect.
Senator Kennedy. It is customary in a good many areas for tliem
to do what these men liave said tliat you liave forced tliem to do.
There is no doubt that that goes on all of the time, and it is a bootleg
operation, but it is in effect in a good many of the building trades
circles, as you know. It is not a complete surprise to you, this state-
ment. I am quite aware that it goes on, and so are you, are you not?
You never have heard of it going on, where the employer must come
to the union for employees ?
JNIr. Kaberlein. There have been occasions where the employer
would come in for men, yes. But they are not forced to come in for
men, and it is not suggested that they come in.
Senator Kennedy. How much does it cost to join your union?
Mr. Kaberlein. $375; equivalent to 100 working hours.
Senator Kennedy. Hoav much for an apprentice?
Mr. Kaberlein. An apprentice, it doesn't cost him anything to
join the union.
Senator Kennedy. $300 is quite a lot of money, is it not ? "What
are the dues?
Mr. Kaberlein. The dues are $15 a quarter.
Senator Kennedy. That is quite a lot of money, that initiation fee,
$375 to join the union.
Mr. Kaberlein. That has been in the constitution, 100 working
hours, ever since the start of the union.
Senator Kennedy. How many members of your local are there?
Are you a business agent ?
Mr. Kaberlein. Yes, sir.
Senator Kennedy. How many members of the local are there?
Mr. Kaberlein. About 4,000.
Senator Kennedy. You receive $1,658 a month ?
Mr. Kaberlein. Approximately.
Senator Kennedy. How often are you traveling ?
Mr. Kaberlein. Well, in the spring we have a State conference.
Senator Kennedy. How many of you get this amount of money
that you get ; how many people are there on the payroll in your local ?
Mr. Kaberlein. There are seven.
Senator Kennedy. Seven of you ?
Mr. Kaberlein. Yes, sir.
Senator Kennedy. How much do they all get ?
Mr. Kaberlein. Pardon me ?
Senator Kennedy. What do they get paid ?
Mr. Kaberlein. It varies, depending on the length of the trip.
Senator Kennedy. Wliat do they get paid per month? Do they
average the same salary you do, and expenses ?
Mr. Kaberlein. About the same ; yes, sir.
Senator Kennedy. They have a car ?
Mr. Kaberlein. Yes, sir.
Senator Kennedy. Seven of them ?
Mr. Kaberlein. Yes, sir.
Senator Kennedy. Who are they, and what are the titles ?
Mr. Kaberlein. The business representatives.
Senator Kennedy. Is there a secret election in your local ?
Mr, Kaberlein. Pardon me ?
Senator Kennedy. Is there a secret election in your local ?
15852 IMPROPER ACTIVITIES IN THE LABOR FIELD
Mr. Kaberlein. It is an election.
Senator Kennedy. When were you elected ; what year ?
Mr. Kaberlein. The first time in 1948, and in 1952, and 1957.
Senator Kennedy. Did anybody run against you in 1957 ?
Mr. Kaberlein. No, sir.
Senator Kennedy. Was it by a secret ballot, or open ballot?
Mr. Kaberlein. It was by acclamation.
Senator Kennedy. Did anybody run against any of your other
seven members of the union wlio are officers ?
Mr. Kaberlein. Pardon me ?
Senator Kennedy. Did anybody contest any of the elections in your
local?
Mr. Kaberlein. No ; there was no contest.
Senator Kennedy. They were all by acclamation ?
Mr. Kaberlein. All by acclamation.
Senator Kennedy. That is quite a large salary, is it not, for seven
members of a local to receive, average $1,660 a month plus expenses
when you are traveling? That is about $18,000 a year, that six of you
get from the local. There are seven of you. What do seven of you
do?
Mr. Kaberlein. Excuse me.
Senator Kennedy. That is a total of pretty nearly over $120,000
for salaries in that local a year. What is it that you all do?
Mr. Kaberlein. We each have a territory that we check, and we
travel and we service whatever complaints we have with the members.
Senator Kennedy. You all average $20,000 a year in this local ?
Mr. Kaberlein. Approximately.
Senator Kennedy. Tell me how this compares to a number of other
unions. Let us say the International Brotherhood of Electrical
Woi'kers.
Mr. Kaberlein. I don't know what their salarv is.
Senator Kennedy. How much does it cost for them to join, and
what is their initiation fee?
Mr. Kaberlein. I have no knowledge of their initiation fee.
Senator Kennedy. Tell me about some of the others. What does it
cost to join the Plumbers?
Mr. Kaberlein. I have no knowledge of the other building trades.
Senator Kennedy. You have no knowledge of any other building
trades, what they charge ?
Mr. Kaberlein. I never inquired.
The Chairman. Mr. Kaberlein, do you have in your union, local 73,
a fund for the relief of old, indigent, sheet-metal workers?
Mr, Kaberlein. There is no fund, and we don't collect for any fund.
The Chairman. I beg your pardon ?
INIr. Kamberlein. There is no fund.
The Chairman. There is no fund maintained by your union for
that purpose ?
Mr. Kaberlein. No, sir.
The Chairman. Either from voluntaiy donations or from dues or
assessments ?
Mr. Kaberlein. That is correct.
The Chairman. No such fund has ever existed in your union?
Mr. Kaberlein. No.
IMPROPER ACTIVITIES IN THE LABOR FIELD 15853
The Chairman. If you have collected money, $300 and so forth,
from people going into business, for such a fund, then it was collected
under false pretense because there is no such fund; is that true?
Mr. Kaberlein. I have never collected money for that purpose.
The Chairman. I didn't say you had. I said if it is collected, then
it is obtained under false ]iretense, for there is no such fund?
Mr. ICvHERLEiN. I don't know how to answer that.
The Chairman. You know how to answer it, and if there is no fund,
you can't pay into something that isn't.
Mr. Kaberlein. That is true.
The Chairman. That is true, isn't it?
Mr. Cronin, come forward a moment, please.
You may stand rijrht there by your counsel, INIr. Cronin. I just
want to ask you one question about tliis fund. You will remain under
your same oath that was administered to you yesterday.
TESTIMONY OF ARTHUR H. CRONIN, ACCOMPANIED BY COUNSEL,
NATHAN M. COHEN— Resumed
The Chairman. Do you have in your union, local 73, a fund for
the relief of old, indignent, sheet-metal workers?
Mr. Cronin. There is no fund at the present time.
The Chairman. Was there ever such a fund ?
Mr. Cronin. Some years ago.
The Chairman. How many vears ago ?
Mr. Cronin. As far back as 1925 or 1926.
The Chairman. Back in 1925 or 1926 ?
Mr. Cronin. And it lasted until about 4 or 5 years ago. They were
voluntary contributions that were sent in by the contractors. At one
time they used to donate their trucks to send baskets, turkeys, hams,
anything, to people that were out of work, and when work became
plentiful several years ago we stopped it, and sent checks back that
were sent in for that purpose.
The Chairman. When was the last time that fund operated?
Mr. Cronin. I believe. Senator — I am not exactly sure — I think
it was 4 or 5 years ago.
The Chairman. Did you keep a record of it any time ?
Mr. Cronin. No.
The Chairman. Never any record kept ?
Mr. Cronin. No.
The Chairman. There is no way to check on it ?
Mr. Cronin. No, sir.
The Chairman. Have you any record of the distribution of the
money ?
Mr. Cronin. We might dig up some names for you, if you want
them, but I don't have them.
The Chairman. I am talking about a record.
Mr. Cronin. No ; we didn't keep a record.
The Chairman. You kept no records at the time ?
Mr. Cronin. That is right.
The Chairman. Either of receipts or disbursements ?
Mr. Cronin. That is right. It wasn't a huge fund.
15854 IMPROPER ACTIVITIES IN THE LABOR FIELD
The Chairman. You heard this testimony. Did you have tlie
practice of requiring these people who went into business to pay you
$300 for that fund ?
Mr. Cronin. Absolutely not.
The Chairman. So there was no money paid into that fund by these
people that testified ?
Mr. Cronin. They could have. I don't know as to that.
The Chairman. No, I am talking about paid to you.
Mr. Cronin. To me ?
The Chairman. Yes.
Mr. Cronin. For what ?
The Chairman. For that fund.
Mr. Cronin. Paid to me for that fund ?
The Chairman. Yes.
]Mr. Cronin. They could have sent some money in to me that I saw
several years ago.
The Chairman. Well, did they? These people testified that they
gave you money — —
Mr. Cronin. None of these people who testified ever sent me 5 cents.
The Chairman. All right. I wanted to get that clear. There was
no fund in the first place for these people to send money to ?
Mr. Cronin. Well, I don't know how far back you refer to.
The Chairman. I am talking about these who testified.
Mr, Cronin. I don't know. I haven't got the testimony in front
of me. I can't tell you. Some of these fellows said it was 1947 and
1948. At that time maybe they did contribute something.
The Chairman. Well, did they?
Mr. Cronin. I don't know.
The Chairman. In other words, there is no record ?
Mr. Cronin. That is right.
The Chairman. And some as late as 1954.
Mr. Cronin. I don't think there was 1 cent later than that.
The Chairman. So 1954 couldn't be correct ?
Mr. Cronin. It could and it couldn't be, Senator. I am not sure.
The Chairman. Who administered that fund ?
Mr. Cronin. Well, we would usually pick somebody who was out
of work to handle it and take notes, letters, that were sent in to the
union by men who were out of work, and at times there were as many
as two and three and four hundred.
At that time, the contributions never, never came up to what were
needed to make up the Christmas baskets. Contractors would send
in trucks. We would buy the baskets, use the money that was sent in
for that purpose, and if money was necessary we did take it out of
the miion at that time to add
The Chairman. Are there any records of the money you took out
of the union?
Mr. Cronin. Well, I imagine they would be there. But that is some
years ago, now.
The Chairman. Wouldn't you know as president whether you kept
records or not ?
Mr. Cronin. I don't keep the books, Mr. McClellan.
The Chairman. No, but you supervise it. You are responsible, if
you have any duties at all.
IMPROPER ACTIVITIES IN THE LABOR FIELD 15855
Mr. Croxin. That is rifflit.
The Chairman, Well, do you know that they -were kept?
Mr. Cronin. "Well, possibly if you go far back enough you can find
them.
The Chairman. How far back ?
IVIr. Croxix, Well, in the later years we didn't need anything out
of the union, so I would say you would have to go back until right
after the postwar era when Avork was plentiful.
The Chairman. What do you mean by that? 1947 or 1948?
JNIr. Cronin. I would say prior to 1943 or 1944.
The Chairman. Prior to that ?
Mr. Cronin. Yes.
The Chairman. You would have to go back prior to that?
Mr. Cronin. Yes.
The Chairman. Do j'ou have your records prior to that ?
INIr. Cronin. I don't know. I don't think we do. I don't think
we have them that far back.
The Chairman. So there are no records available to substantiate
that?
JSIr. Cronin. I don't think there are.
The Chairman. Did you ever refuse to take checks for that fund ?
Mr. Cronin. I certainly did.
The Chairman. Why ?
Mr. Cronin. Because we didn't want them. The men, tliey sent
them in voluntarily, and Ave sent them back to them.
The Chairjian". You sent the checks back ?
Mr. Cronin. Yes, sir.
The Chairman. You Avouldu't take a check for that fund?
Mr. Cronin. I wouldn't take a check for anything.
The Chairman. You don't take checks. You try to avoid records?
Mr. Cron^ix^ Well, I don't mean it that way.
The Chairmax"^. You said it. I don't understand what you mean.
Mr. Croxix^. I knoAv I said it, but, my goodness, we do not take
checks or cash for anything. Let me put it that way.
The Chairmax. You don't take checks or cash for anything ?
]Mr. Croxix. That is right.
The Chairman. How do you get money into the treasury ?
Mr. Croxix. That is a union matter. Men pay their dues and that
is the only way money comes into the treasury.
The Chairsiax. You don't take checks or cash ?
jNIr. Crox^ix. We take checks or cash for union initiation, for union
dues.
The Chairmax. That is what I asked you.
Mr. CR0XIX^ I didn't understand you, I am sorry.
The Chairmax, You don't take checks or cash for contribution to
this fund?
]Mr. Croxix'. There are no checks or contributions coming in for
any fund at this time.
The Chairmax, You say you have no fund now, but you have had
it. I am talking about when you had the fund. Did "you insist on
cash or did you accept checks ?
Mr. Croxix, No, avc did not. We would take anything then.
The Chairmax. You would take anything you could get.
15856 IMPROPER ACTIVITIES IN THE LABOR FIELD
Mr. Merrow and Mr. Johnson, come forward, please.
Mr. Merrow, I believe you testitied that you had given $300 in cash
to Mr. Kaberlein ; is that correct?
Mr. Merrow. Yes, sir ; that is correct.
The Chairman. Who is the Mr. Kaberlein that you gave that money
to?
Mr. Merroav. The fellow on the left.
The Chairman. The man who sits in the witness chair at the present
time ?
Mr. Merrow. Yes, sir.
The Chairman. And he did exact $300 from you ?
Mr. Merrow. Yes, sir.
The Chairman. And you paid him in cash ?
Mr. Merrow. That is right.
The Chairman. Do you remember the date of that, or about the
approximate time ?
Mr. Merrow. In September of 1954. The date I don't know.
The Chairman. September 1954. Did he tell you at that time
they had a fund for those old, indigent, sheet-metal workers ?
Mr. Merrow. Yes, sir; he did.
The Chairman. And that it was to go into that fund?
Mr. Merrow. That is right.
The Chairman. Mr. Cronin, I will ask you did you have a fund at
that time for this money to go into ?
Mr. Cronin. No, sir; I don't believe we did.
The Chairman. Mr. Kaberlein, what did you do with the money?
Mr. Kaberlein. I never received any money from Mr. Merrow.
The Chairman. You say that statement is false ?
Mr. Kaberlein. The statement of Mr. Merrow's is false.
The Chairman. Mr. Johnson, you stated at different times you paid
money. I think to Mr. Cronin, was your testimony. Did you pay
any money to Mr. Cronin ?
Mr. Johnson. Yes, sir.
The Chairman. According to your testimony, as the record reflects
a nmnber of times, who is the Mr. Cronin that you paid that money
to?
Mr. Johnson. This man right here.
The Chairman. The man sitting right there in the witness chair
now?
Mr. Johnson. Yes, sir.
The Chairman. Sitting by his attorney, Mr. Cohen ?
Mr. Johnson. Yes, sir.
The Chairman. Did you pay money at any time to a ]\Ii'. Kaber-
lein?
Mr. Johnson. Yes, sir.
The Chairman. Who is the Mr. Kaberlein you paid the money
to?
Mr. Johnson. The gentleman on the far side.
The Chairman. The gentleman on the far side who has just been
testifying?
Mr. Johnson. Yes, sir.
The Chairman. In other words, the two men that you paid money
to, one Mr. Cronin and one Mr. Kaberlein, are each sitting on either
IMPROPER ACTIVITIES IN THE LABOR FIELD 15857
side of their counsel, Mr. Cohen, at the present time, and testifying
before this committee?
Mr. Johnson. Yes, sir.
The Chairman. All right ; thank you, gentlemen. You may have a
seat.
Is there anything further. Senator Kennedy ?
Senator Kennedy. Have you any explanation of how this might
come about?
Mr. Cronin. Are yon talking to me ?
Senator Kennedy. Either one of you. Is there any explanation
that you might have ?
Mr. Cronin. As to the Johnson case ?
Senator Kennedy. Let's just take the case today.
Is there any possibility that there could be any misunderstanding in
this matter that they could make the statements that they gave you
money and you could make the statement that you never received it?
Have you any explanation ?
Mr. KA.BERLEIN. I presume they made false entries in their income
tax returns.
Senator Ivennedy. You are presuming that they are lying and that
they made false statements and they are trying to explain what they
did with the money themselves. Is that the charge you are making?
Mr. IviVBERLEiN. That is correct.
Senator I^nnedy. There is no possibility that you received the
money, that they gave it for the purposes they described ? There is no
such fund and you never received the money and they are the ones
who are lying? There is no misunderstanding about it; is that
correct ?
Mr. I^berlein. I received no money from either party.
Senator Kennedy. And you never had a conversation about it?
Mr. Ivaberlein. Never had any conversation about money.
Senator Kennedy. There is no chance of their having given you
the money for the purpose described ?
Mr. Kaberlein. They have not given me any.
Senator Kennedy. There was no such fund ?
Mr. KA.BERLEIN. No sucli fund at that time.
Senator Kennedy. "Wliat do you say ?
Mr. Cronin. Senator, I heard Mr. Johnson testify and never in my
life have I heard such lies as I heard him swear to about paying $50
for every apprentice. That is an unmitigated lie. I say that under
oath.
I also would like to explain, if I may, how he went into business.
Senator Kennedy. That would be fine, but I would like to ask you :
You deny receiving not only the $50, but also that he gave you any
money. There is no chance that he gave you the money for this fund
that you described?
Mr. Cronin. He didn't give me any money at any time.
Senator Kjennedy. If there was a fund in effect at that time, any
money he gave you was not for such a fund? There is no chance
there is any misunderstanding about it, that you received money from
him for a fund ?
Mr. Cronin. He didn't give me money for anything.
15858 IMPROPER ACTIVITIES IN THE LABOR FIELD
I would like to verify this. Mr. Jolinson worked for one of our
ventilating companies, and went in business with a partner. He
didn't go into business himself. He went in business with a man
named Borg. I don't know how long he was in business, but without
any explanation to us, which may not be necessary, he left Borg and
went into business for himself.
We didn't know at the union that he went into business. He never
came near us to tell us he went into business.
The Chairman. Is that required ?
Mr. Cronin. Sir?
The Chairman. Is that required, that he must come to you before
he goes into business?
Mr. Cronin. If he needs sheet-metal workers it is required, if he is
going to open up a union shop, and he has men he wants to initiate
into the union.
The Chairman. A man can't, in other words, open up a shop and
hire union men without consulting you ?
Mr. Cronin. Yes, he can. But, Senator, many times these men will
want to open up a shop and they will want men who don't belong to
the union to work for them. In that case, they must pay an initiation
fee, as I have told you before.
Senator Kennedy. Mr. Chairman, I would like to find out about
that from Mr. Cronin.
You say if they want to hire people who are not members of the
union, they must pay an initiation fee?
Mr. Cronin. I know the law now, Senator. They have to wait 30
days to go in. But in those years
Senator Kennedy. Then you let them join the union if they pay
the initiation fee of what ?
Mr. Cronin. It all depends. 100 working hours. Whatever the
scale was at that time.
Senator Kennedy. In my opinion, Mr. Cronin, that is much too
much. If you are going to demand that a man join a union after 30
days, then I don't think you should charge him $375 to join the union,
particularly when the work may not be work which endures for a
long period of time.
Mr. Cronin. That I tried to explain yesterday. I guess I didn't
make it clear. I can't today. But for many, many years the ini-
tiation fee in the Sheet Metal Workers Union has been 100 working
hours. That is for construction work.
There are many parts of our international union that hire indus-
trial workers or production workers and the initiation fee is not that
much. But that does prevail in the building trades.
Senator Kennedy. Well, I am giving you my opinion as a member
of the Labor Committee that that is much too much money, $375, to
be compelled to join the union and then have to be compelled to pay
$375. That is an awful lot of money.
Mr. Cronin. I can only say that is a matter of opinion.
Senator Kennedy. I agree with that. You say if he needs sheet-
metal workers he has to come to you, if he is going into business ; is
that correct ?
Mr. Cronin. No, he doesn't have to come to us for sheet-metal work-
ers. We have never, in the history of local 73, had a hiring hall
IMPROPER ACTIVITIES IN THE LABOR FIELD 15859
arrangement. Any man carrying a card in tliis union can go to
work. By your law now he can go to work for them whether ho has
a card or not. But never did we insist that the contractors come
down and hire men to go to sleep on a job, as JNIr. Johnson mentioned
this morning. We have about 500 men out of work now. Many of
our contractors, if they want sheet-metal workers, do call us. But
they are not required to.
Senator Kennedy. In other words, there is no reason why they
couldn't go out and hire some people, have them join the imion at
the end of 30 days, instead of hiring your unemployed sheet-metal
workers ?
JNIr. Ckonin. Well, there is no reason for them to do it, but they
do it, and there is nothing we can do about it.
Senator Kennedy. No attempt ?
Mr. Cronin. No, sir.
Senator Kennedy. The Congress, as you know, Mr. Cronin, has
been considering making it somewhat easier for employers and em-
ployees in the construction business to work out agreements because
the 30 days' dues present a problem, particularly in many of the con-
struction projects which do not take a long time to develop.
It doesn't make me very happy to consider liberalizing that part of
the law if you are going to charge $375 to join the union when the
work may not last for a long period of time.
It seems to me excessive. If that is the custom, I think the custom
ought to be changed in view of the fact that wages have gone up so
much.
Mr. Cronin. Well, we don't charge them the $375 at one time. We
can charge them $375 immediately if they have it. And if they
haven't got it, we give them a year to join after the 30 days.
Senator Kennedy. Particularly in view of the fact that there are
seven officers who are averaging $20,000 a year minimum in this local
of 4,000 men, of which 500 are unemployed today.
How many officers are there totally, and business representatives,
et cetera, of this local ?
Mr. Kaberlein. A total of seven.
Senator Kennedy. That includes all officers ?
Mr. Kaberlein. All officers.
The Chairman. Does that include the president and secretary-
treasurer ?
Mr. Kaberlein. Correct.
The Chairman. Just seven ?
Mr. Kaberlein. Seven.
The Chairman. Mr. Cronin, I was intrigued with one of A'our state-
ments. You said that Mr. Johnson's testimony was the biggest lie you
ever heard. I wondered if you compared that with the testimony of
Mr. Burrows yesterday, and Mr. Tapper. How do you make the
comparison ?
Mr. Cronin. I think they are about all equal.
The Chairman. Then this is not the biggest. Mr. Johnson's is not
the biggest ?
Mr. Cronin. Just, let's say, one of the biggest.
The Chairman. I wanted to get it in the right proportions.
15860 IMPROPER ACTIVITIES IN THE LABOR FIELD
Mr. Kennedy. There have been four individuals so far, Mr. Cronin,
that have testified to the fact that they have given you money.
Mr. Cronin. I heard them.
Mr. Kennedy. And a fifth individual who said he gave either you
or one of the other business agents money. He was uncertain. So you
have had four and possibly five individuals who testified before this
committee, contractors, that they paid money to you. Are all of them
lies?
Mr. Cronin. That is right.
Mr. Kennedy. What about the bidding ? Did you ever tell any of
these contractors that they should not enter mto any particular bid ?
Mr, Cronin. No, sir; absolutely not.
Mr. Kennedy. So those are lies also by Mr. Tapper ?
Mr. Cronin. That is right.
Mr. Kennedy. By Mr. Johnson?
Mr. Cronin. Yes, sir.
Mr. Kennedy. And Mr. Jolicoeur; is that right?
Mr. Cronin. I don't know anything about Mr. Jolicoeur. I don't
think I ever met the man in my life.
Mr. Kennedy. So his testimony is false also on the bidding?
Mr. Cronin. As far as I am concerned, about his getting any mes-
sage from me, it is.
Mr. Kennedy. You never told him he should not bid on any
contracts ?
Mr. Cronin. That is right.
Mr. Kennedy. You never called Mr. Jolmson down to the office
and got angry at him because he had bid on contracts?
Mr. Cronin. Called Johnson to the office?
Mr. Kennedy. Yes.
Mr. Cronin. No, sir; I didn't. I never called him to the office.
Mr. Kennedy. Did you ever call Mr. Johnson from Florida and
tell him not to bid on a contract?
Mr. Cronin. I can't remember ever calling him from Florida.
Mr. Kennedy. Wliy would you call him from Florida ?
Mr. Cronin. I don't know.
Mr. Kennedy. Did you call Mr. Johnson ?
Mr. Cronin. I don't think I did. I can't recall ever calling anyone
from Florida with regard to business.
Mr. Kennedy. He said you called him from Florida.
Mr. Cronin. If he said I called him, I will have to deny it, because
I don't remember calling him.
Mr. Kennedy. You don't remember calling him ?
Mr. ('ronin. That is right.
Mr. Kennedy. That would be something you would remember, if
you called a small contractor in Cliicago, called him from Florida.
There must be some reason that you called him.
Mr. Cronin. I don't remember calling liim, Mr. Kennedy. As far
as I am concerned, I didn't call him.
Mr. Kennedy. What would you have called him about if you called
him?
Mr. Cronin. I wouldn't have any idea.
Mr. Kennedy. I would think that would be a veiy unusual occur-
rence, if you were down in Florida having a vacation and you called
Mr. Johnson on the telephone. Do you deny that you called him ?
IMPROPER ACTIVITIES IN THE LABOR FIELD 15861
Mr. (^Hoxix. I deny that I called liim.
Mr. Kexxedy. How much money do you receive from the union,
Mr. ('ronin?
Mr. Cronin. $350 a week.
Mr. Kennedy. What about expenses?
Mr. Cronin. I think it is $258 a month.
Mr. Kennedy. The same as the other gentleman?
Mr. Cronin. That is right.
Mr. Kennedy. $258 a month. Do you receive any other money
from the union ?
oNIr. Cronin. I am paid $800 a j^ear by the international and $25 a
day when I attend executive board meetings or go on any mission that
they might send me on.
]Mr. Kennedy. Would you identify these checks, Mr. Cronin,
please ?
The Chairman. Mr. Cronin, I present to you a check dated October
30, 1952, payable to the order of M. E. Garvey, trustee. It is drawn
on Sunbeam Heating & Air Conditioning Co.
I ask you to examine that photostatic copy and state if you can
identify the check. The check appears to be endorsed by ]\I. E. Gar-
vey, trustee, and by Marie Gan^ey. It has a notation, "Received
cash."
Will you examine that check and state whether you identify it?
(The document was handed to the witness.)
(The Avitness conferred with his counsel.)
The Chairman. Do you identify that check?
Mr. Cronin. I don't think I ever saw the check before.
The Chairman. Do you know anything about it ?
Mr. Cronin. No.
Mr. Kennedy. Do you know who the individual is ?
Mr. Cronin. M. E. Garvey?
The Chairman. Yes.
Mr. Cronin. Yes. He works for George Sullivan.
The Chairman. Wlio is George Sullivan ?
Mr. Cronin. He is an attorney in Chicago, and owner of this com-
pany, I believe.
The Chairman. And owner of that company ?
Mr. Cronin. That is right.
The Chairman. Who is Marie Garvey?
Mr. Cronin. Well, I think she is his secretary.
The Chairman. His secretary. Did you receive any of that money?
Mr. Cronin. We went into something. Senator. I am not going'to
say that I didn't receive money. I received money as dividends for
a transaction that was made some years ago. I have identified all of
that to the Internal Revenue.
I can't distinguish this check from any other. This check is not
made to me, so I deny any connection with that check whatsoever.
The Chairman. All right. That check may be made exhibit No. 12.
(Document referred to was marked "Exhibit No. 12" for reference
and will be found in the appendix on p. 15943.)
The Chairman. You deny any connection with that check, what-
soever ; is that correct.
Mr. Cronin. That is correct.
15862 IMPROPER ACTIVITIES IN THE LABOR FIELD
The Chairman. And the owners of it, or any of the funds that it
covers ; is that correct ?
Mr. Cronin. That is correct.
The Chairman. Now, I present to 3-011 another check, dated Octo-
ber 31, 1952, in the amount of $2,500, made payable to the order of
A. H. Cronin. The check is signed "Marie Garvey." It says, '"Trustee
for dividend on stocks of Sunbeam Heating & Air-Conditioning Co."
I ask you to examine this check. It appears that you endorsed it
and said, "Pay to the order of Merchants National Bank," in Chicago,
"for deposit only."
I ask you to examine that check and see if you identify it.
(Document handed to the witness.)
(Witness conferred with his counsel.)
Mr. Cronin. Yes. That is a dividend check. I received that.
The Chairman. You received that money. All right.
That check may be made exhibit No. 13.
( Document referred to was marked "Exhibit No. 13" for reference
and will be found in the appendix on p. 15944.)
The Chairman. I note some significance here in that this check that
was made exhibit No. 12 was finally endorsed and the money received
in cash by Marie Garvey.
Mr. Cronin. I wouldn't know anything about that.
The Chairman. I note then the following day, apparently the same
Marie Garvey, if we can compare signatures, gave you this check for
$2,500.
Mr. Cronin. That was a dividend that I received. I don't know
anything about the other check. Nothing whatever.
The Chairman. Did you declare that dividend on your income tax ?
Mr. Cronin. I think I did. Well, I had two, then, Senator. I re-
ceived two dividend checks, one of which I received and one of which
I inadvertently did not report.
The Chairman. How much was the amount of the other?
Mr. Cronin. The other one was $2,500.
The Chairman. So you received two $2,500 dividend checks from
this same company ?
Mr. Cronin. Yes, but not at the same time, not that close together.
The Chairman. I understand. But what was the occasion for the
dividend check that you were entitled to receive going through this
circuitous route to get to you ?
Mr. Cronin. I had stock in the company.
The Chairman. I understand. But they ordinarily make the check
to the stockholder.
Mr. (Cronin. That check is made to me.
The Chairman. Yes; but it is from an individual.
Mr. Cronin. Well, ap])arently she signs it as trustee.
The Chairman. No, she did not sign it as trustee. It is on her in-
dividual account.
Mr. Cronin. I can't explain tliat.
The Chairman. The Sunbeam check was made to M. E. Garvey,
trustee. Was that stock lield in your name or was it held l^y Marie
Garvey for you?
(Witness conferred with his counsel.)
IMPROPER ACTIVITIES IN THE LABOR FIELD 15863
Mr. Cronik. I don't remember that. When your investigators the
other day told me, or you tohl me yesterday, to brino; my personal
affairs down, you mentioned something about bringing the details
Avith regard to my investments in that company, Avhich you gave me
mitil ^Monday, the 8th, to do. I would like to have time to look over
that.
The CiiAiR^rAx. I will be glad to give you time, but in tlie mean-
time, I wanted to interrogate you with respect to this.
Was the otlier $2,500 check from the same company, or a dividend
from the same company ?
]Mr. Croxix. I wouldn't know that. The only one I know anything
about, Senator, is the one that she gave me or that I cashed.
The (^iiAiRMAN. Which one did you report on your income tax, this
one or the other one ?
Mr. Croxix. That I can't say. I don't know. But I have reported
it since.
The Chairmax". I understand that you did not report this one.
Mr. Cnox'ix'^. I don't know. lUit I did deposit both of them in my
account, and I missed reporting one. I do know that. But I did
report the other one and then I paid. I reported the one later and
paid on it.
The Ciiairmax. Why was this stock dividend handled in this fash-
ion, paid to a trustee and then by the trustee to you ?
]\Ir. Croxix'. I don't know.
The Chairman. You have no explanation of it?
Mr. Crox'ix^. I have no explanation whatsoever.
The Chairmax. Was it a device to conceal your ownership in the
company ?
Mr. Cronix. No, sir.
The Chairmax. Was your ownership in the company generally
known ?
Mr. Croxix-^. I don't think it was, no.
The Chairmax. Was this company a competing company to other
companies that were in this air-conditioning business covered by the
Sheet Metal Workers?
Mr. Crox'ix'. Well, it was competing with about 300 other companies,
yes.
The Chairmax. It was one of the competing companies. How much
stock did you own for which you received
Mr. Crox^ix. That I would have to refer to my records on. I
couldn't tell you offhand.
The Chairmax. I trust you will refer to your records and bring
us that information. Was this one annual dividend?
Mr. Croxix. I think we received $5,000 altogether, two $2,500
checks.
The Chairmax. Was that for 1 year's dividends ?
Mr. Croxix". I think it was 2 years.
The Chairmax. Bring your books so we can determine.
What percentage of the stock of that company did you own at the
time?
IVIr. Croxix. I couldn't tell you that.
Tlie Chairmax. This is one of the larger companies, is it?
Mr. Croxix. Are you asking me a question ?
The Chairmax. Yes
15864 IMPROPER ACTIVITIES IN THE LABOR FIELD
Mr. Cronin. I wouldn't say it was ; no.
The Chairman. What would you call it as compared to the general
run of those companies in that business ?
]Mr. Cronin. Well, it is a little company, Senator, that goes up and
down. Some of those companies will get projects and they will hire
quite a few^ men, and this year or the next year they will be down.
The Chairman. You get your records and try to make further ex-
planation of this when you return next week.
Mr. Kennedy. Did you ask Mr. Johnson to your daughter's wed-
ding?
Mr. Cronin. I did not.
Mr. Kennedy. So his testimony regarding his being invited to the
wedding is not correct ?
Mr. Cronin. Sir?
Mr. IvENNEDY. I believe he testified that he was invited to the wed-
ding.
Mr. Cronin. No ; he wasn't.
Mr. Kennedy. Pie was not invited to the wedding ?
Mr. Cronin. No.
Mr. Kennedy. What about his partner? Did you invite the
partner ?
Mr. Cronin. No.
Mr. Kennedy. Did his partner send a present to your daughter ?
Mr. Cronin. Not that I remember, Mr. Kennedy.
Mr. Kennedy. Did Mr. Johnson ever give you some cuff links?
Mr. Cronin. No; he didn't.
Mr. Kennedy. He did not. So his testimony tliat he gave you cuff
links is not correct either ?
Mr. Cronin. That is not correct.
Mr. Kennedy. Could you give to the committee a list of the gifts
that you received from contractors ?
Mr. Cronin. No; I couldn't. I don't think I ever received any
gifts.
Mr. Kennedy. You never received any gifts ?
]VIr. Cronin. Well, I think I received the fruit of the month, and
maybe some whisky, or something like that. But, personally, I don't
want any gifts, and I don't receive them. I don't take them.
Mr. IvENNEDY. Did you ever receive any money or anything of
value directly or indirectly from any contractor?
Mr. Cronin. No, sir.
Mr. Kennedy. Did you ever receive any money directly or indi-
rectly from the Sheet Aletal Contractors Association?
Mr. Cronin. Absolutely not.
Mr. Kennedy. Did you ever receive any money directly or indi-
rectly from the representative of either the contractors or the con-
tractors association?
Mr. Cronin. No, sir.
Mr. Kennedy. Did you ever receive any money or anything of
value, directly or indirectly, from the Air Conditioning Contractors
Alliance?
Mr. Cronin. No, sir.
Mr. Kennedy. Did you ever receive anything of value directly or
indirectly from the Ventilating and Air Conditioning Contractors
Association ?
IMPROPER ACTIVITIES IN THE LABOR FIELD 15865
Mr. Cronin. No, sir.
Mr. IvENNEDY. Did the Ventilating and Air Conditioning Asso-
ciation ever offer you a free vacation trip to Florida ?
Mr. Ckonin. Did they wliat ?
Mr. Kennedy. Ever offer yon a free vacation trip to Florida?
Mr. Cronin. They invited me down to attend their meeting.
Mr. Kennedy. When was that?
Mr. Cronin. I don't remember the year.
Mr. Kennedy. Did yon go ?
Mr. Cronin. I didn't go, and I didn't accept the invitation.
Mr. Kennedy. When was that ?
Mr. Cronin. I don't know ; it was a few years ago.
Mr. Kennedy. Weren't you invited down in May of this year ?
Mr. Cronin. I was.
Mr. Kennedy. And your waf e also ?
Mr. Cronin. She was.
Mr. Kennedy. You didn't attend that ?
Mr. Cronin. No, sir.
Mr. Kennedy. That was from the Sheet Metal and Air Condition-
ing Contractors ; is that right ?
Mr. Cronin. I believe it was; yes.
Mr. Kennedy. Did you have any explanation as to why these four
witnesses and possibly five witnesses, should testify that they paid you
money ?
Mr. Cronin. I haven't any idea.
Mr. Kennedy. Did you ever hear of this situation, where $300 or
$400, approximately, would have to be paid by small contractors if
they wanted to set up business?
Mr. Cronin. No, sir.
Mr. IvENNEDY. All of this testimony is incorrect?
Mr. Cronin. That is right.
Mr. Kennedy. I will tell you, Mr. Cronin, we went around to these
contractors and they didn't know we had talked to any of the others,
and they all gave us the same story, and I would say two out of every
three contractors that we talked to in Chicago at least that many,
told us the same situation, of having to pay tliis money, and none of
them knew that we had talked to any other contractors, and we just
went in and asked them the questions, and they came in and gave us the
story, and we are going to have some more contractors now.
Mr. Cronin. You have about 600 contractors in the Chicago area.
Mr. Kennedy. We haven't got the staff to go to all of them.
The Chairman. The Chair yesterday announced that this record,
when the sharp conflict arose between the testimony of Mr. Cronin
and Mr. Burrows, that that record would be sent to the Justice
Department. It is perfectly apparent now that the whole record
of this particular series of investigations, particularly with relation
to the operations of local 73, Mr. Cronin's activities and others who
have been testifying here, will go to the Justice Department for its
attention and for appropriate action.
I am convinced that there is certainly willful perjury, and I might
agree with you, some of the biggest lies I have heard possibly in a
long time have been testified to here under oath. It is an imposition
upon the Government of the United States to have people come before
21243— 59— pt. 42 8
15866 IMPROPER ACTIVITIES IN THE LABOR FIELD
this committee and willfully and deliberately lie or give false testi-
mony. It is a crime, and it is a crime that should be punished, and I
am urging the Justice Department to take whatever immediate and
appropriate action to pursue it to the end tliat justice may be admin-
istered, and those who are guilty punished.
The committee will stand in recess until 1 :45 p. m.
(Thereupon, at 12 noon, the committee recessed, to reconvene at
1 :45 p. m., the same day.)
AFTERNOON SESSION
The Chairman. The committee will come to order.
(Members of the select commitee present at reconvening: the chair-
man and Senator Kennedy.)
The Chairman. Call the next witness.
Mr. Kennedy. Mr. Gene.
The Chairman. Be sworn, please.
You do solemnly swear the evidence you shall give before this
Senate select committee shall be the truth, the whole truth, and
nothing but the truth, so help you God ?
Mr. Genc. I do.
TESTIMONY OF EMIL GENC
The Chairman, State your name, your place of residence, and your
business or occupation.
Mr. Genc. My name is Emil Genc. I live at 5128 West Xorth
Avenue. My occupation is heating contractor. My business is at
5469 West North Avenue. I am operating under Eound Oak Sales
& Service, heating contractors.
The Chairman. Heating contractor ?
Mr. Genc. Yes,
The Chairman. You waive counsel, do you, Mr. Genc?
Mr. Genc. Pardon ?
The Chairman. You waive counsel ? You do not desire an attorney
to represent you ?
Mr. Genc. No, sir ; I don't think I need any.
The Chairman. Thank you very much.
Proceed, Mr. Kennedy.
Mr. Kennedy. You spell your name G-e-n-c?
Mr. Genc. Correct.
Mr. Kennedy. And the name of your company is Round Oak Sales
& Service Co. ?
Mr. Genc. Yes, sir.
Mr. Kennedy. West North Avenue, Chicago, 111. ?
Mr. Genc. Right,
Mr. Kennedy. How many employees do you have ?
Mr. Genc, Thirteen,
Mr, Kennedy. You have been in business since about 1927?
Mr. Genc. That is correct.
Mr. Kennedy. On these 18 employees, 5 of tlioui are sheet-metal
workers ?
Mr. Genc. Correct,
IMPROPER ACTIVITIES IN THE LABOR FIELD 15867
^Ir. Kennedy. Yon didn't open a nnion shop nntil 1953; is that
rio:ht?
Mr. Genc. My intention was openin<T a nnion shop in 1953, and one
day I decided I am goin^ to join the nnion. So I iret on the telephone
and I call tlie local 73 and talk to a lady np there and I told her I would
like to join the nnion. Slie said, "All right." Slie made arrange-
ments for me, and a conple of men are going to come in and inspect
my shop, Avhich they did. A few days later I had Mr. Ray Caldwell,
with another gentleman, come in, inspect my premises.
They come in my shop. I have a very nice shop. However, they
are going to make an arrangement for me to come in the office, to the
local 73. So one day INIr. Eay Caldwell called me np and wanted to
know if I can make it, and he set the day and I went over on Jackson
Boulevard to the nnion headquarters.
I was directed to a room with a gentleman there, which I was under
the impression was Mr. Tracy.
The Chairman. Mister who ?
]Mr. Genc. Mr. Tracy. I never met the gentleman. I never met
there Harry Cronin in my life. I hear a lot about him. So we sat
down with who I thought was Mr. Tracy. He told me did I know the
rules and regulations of a union in order to operate a union shop?
I told him I know some. But he later read the regulation down to
me. He said for every seven mechanics we have to have two helpers —
one helper. ^
The Chairman. For every seven what ?
!Mr. Genc. For every seven men we have to have one helper.
The Chairman. For every seven sheet-metal workers
Mr. Genc. We are only allowed to have one helper.
The Chairman. One helper ?
Mr. Genc. That is correct. I was very amazed. I point out to
him there are lots of companies in Chicago operating where they don't
even have or haven't had union shop, which I know — it is Holland
Furnace Co. He told me not to worry about them, he would take care
of them, to just worry about myself.
I agreed to all his agreements, all his specifications and I said to
him, "All right, let's be all through." After he give me his — excuse
me. I am getting ahead of mysel f .
The Chairman. Who was the man you were talking to ?
Mr. Genc. Well, I discovered yesterday morning it was Mr. Harry
Cronin.
The Chairman, You thought at the time it was Mr. Tracy ?
]Mr. Genc. That is correct.
The CiiAiRiMAN. But you have seen Mr. Cronin here ?
Mr. Genc. Yesterday in the hall on the first floor, in a corner. He
was sitting there all alone. I asked him where he was from, and he
said Chicago. Then I knew right away who I was talking to at that
time. It wasn't Mr. Tracy. I still thought it was Mr. Tracy until he
was here and he introduced himself as Mr. Cronin.
The Chairman. You recognize ]\Ir. Cronin who was here yesterday
as the party you were talking to ?
]\rr. Genc. That is correct.
Tlie Chairman. He is the one you had the conversation with there in
tlie union hall ?
15868 IMPROPER ACTIVITIES IN THE LABOR FIELD
Mr. Genc. That is correct.
The Chairman. Proceed.
Mr. Genc. After we got all through, I said, "All right, let's sign
the agreement; I want to get out of here." And he said, "Wait a
minute, not so fast. That will cost you $400. Have you got $400
on you?"
I said, "No, I don't carry that kind of money with me, but I will
mail you a check.''
He said, "No, we don't take checks. That must be cash."
I said, "What is that f or ? "
He said, "Every contractor pays that. Don't act so surprised. You
probably know it."
The Chairman. He told you not to act surprised ?
Mr. Genc. Yes, sir.
The Chairman. That all the contractors knew they had to pay?
Mr. Genc. They pay it. And he said it goes according to the shops,
with sometimes even more. He said but he would make an arrange-
ment for picking up the money. So I went back to the oJ0Bice, to the
shop. I don't hear anything for about 3 or 4 months. Then once
one gentleman came in and he said, "I am from local 73." He said,
"I come over here, I guess you know, to pick up the money. Harry
sent me."
I said, "Well, that is perfectly all right. I am willing to give you
the money." %
He said, "Wait. We have four BA's on the street."
The Chairman. Four what ?
Mr. Genc. Business agents on the street. He called them BA's.
The Chairman. Business agents ?
Mr. Genc. Yes. He said, "I want $400 for each one of them,"
The Chairman, $400 for each of the four ?
Mr, Genc. Yes. So I got violent and shoved him off and got mad.
The man turned around. He walked out of the shop and by the time
I got to the office he was gone. Then I didn't hear anything from
anybody until, from 1954, until I started building my own building.
When I started building my own building once on Wednesday aft-
ernoon I walked in and I see all the union there, except the brick-
layers and plumbers, every one of the two or three business agents
are on the corner and Mr. Ray Caldwell asked me, he said, "Who
the heck tell you or give you any idea you can build a building?"
The Chairman. "Who in the heck told you you could build a
building?"
Mr. Genc. Yes. I said, "Nobody did. WhyV
He said, "Who is going to do your heating ?"
I said, "I am a heating contractor. I will do it myself."
He said, "You will like hallelujah." He said, "I will show you who
will do your job. I will stop the job."
I said, "That is kind of silly. I am a heating contractor. Do you
mean to tell me I can't put my heating in my own building?"
He said, "Heck no ; I will show you that you cannot."
Well, in the meantime another businessman came in, Mr. Sullivan,
head of the Building Trades Union, and he said, "AYliy in the heck
don't you join the union ?"
IMPROPER ACTIVITIES IN THE LABOR FIELD 15869
I said, "I want to, but I was asked for $400, and then somebody
come in collecting $1,600. How do I know if they are not going to
come in for some more later on?" I said, "I am not going to join
anybody." I said, "I would join a union providing I don't pay any
money."
He was very much amazed. Mr. Ray Caldwell told him, Mr.
Sullivan, I was a damn liar; I had no proof. That was it. They did
stop my work and I have to go through lots of pain.
The Chairman. They did what to your work ?
Mr. Genc. I said they did stop the building.
The Chairman. They did stop it?
Mr. Genc. Yes; they did.
The Chairman. Stopped work ?
Mr. Genc. Stopped work on my ])uilding. They make the iron
workers pull out of there ; they make the electricians pull out of there.
The bricklayers were the only union where they were so sure I was
on the up and up, because we had all union help. There was nobody
working on the building from then when they stopped. The elec-
tricians were union, the bricklayers were union, the steelworkers were
union. The only fellows who were nonunion, and we didn't do any
Avork at that time on the building, was us.
Then we finally were compelled to finish up the building ourselves.
WHien we called the union, the contractor, the Hamilton Gas Co. in
Chicago, asking when they were going to put our gas in, they told us
they were stopped by the union, that 1 should get myself straightened
out with the Sheet Metal Workers.
I told them there was nothing to straighten up. So I went over to
see Mr. David from the Hamilton Gas Co. and he told me, he said,
"What the heck, why don't you pay otT the $1,600 and get yourself
straightened out ?"
The Chairman. $1,600?
Mr. Genc. Yes. I don't know where he got it from, or how he got
it, but exactly that is what they told me. Finally a couple of months
later, Mr. Ray Caldwell called me on the telephone. He said, "Emil,
you haven't got the gas and the windows yet." I told him we are just
making a contract with a nonunion contractor to put the gas in. He
said, "Well, I have released your job."
The Chairman. He what ?
Mr. Genc. That he would release our job. He said he would call
off the stop. About 10 minutes later I got a call from the Hamilton
Gas Co. and they asked us if they can install our gas. I told them
as long as I didn't sign up with any other contractor yet they should
go ahead and do so.
The Chairman. Did you ever pay the $1,600 ?
Mr. Genc. No, sir ; I didn't pay a dime to anybody.
The Chairman. Who was the first one that demanded money of
you?
Mr. Genc. Mr. Harry Cronin.
The Chairman. Mr. Cronin, the witness who testified here ?
Mr. Genc. Yes, sir.
Mr. Kennedy. How were you able to identify him ?
Mr. Genc. Well, I saw him yesterday in the morning. I didn't
think that was him. I thought it was Mr. Tracy until he come over
here and sat down to testify. He is the gentleman I talked to.
15870 IMPROPER ACTIVITIES IN THE LABOR FIELD
Mr. Kennedy. He is the gentleman ?
Mr. Geno. Yes, sir.
Mr. Kennedy. Initially you had thought it was Mr. Tracy ?
Mr. Genc. That is correct.
Mr. Kennedy. You thought that the man you talked to was Mr.
Tracy ?
Mr. Genc. Yes, sir.
Mr. Kennedy. But seeing him here yesterday you were able to iden-
tify him ?
Mr. Genc. Yes, sir.
The Chairman. And he told you that all the contractors did that ?
Mr. Genc. That is correct.
The Chairman. So it wasn't just one here or there. His representa-
tions to you were that they all had to pay ?
Mr. Genc. That is right.
Mr. Kennedy. Wlio was the business agent that came back to col-
lect the money ?
Mr. Genc. I wouldn't know, I wouldn't know if he was business
agent or who he was. He isn't in the room. I couldn't point him
out.
Mr. Kennedy. You could not ?
Mr. Genc. No, sir.
Mr. Kennedy. You don't know who that was ?
Mr. Genc. No, sir.
The Chairman, You do know because you wouldn't pay the $1,600
they stopped your work and you had to finish the building your-
self?
Mr. Genc. Well, I thought that was the general idea.
The Chairman, At least they stopped the work ?
Mr. Genc. That is correct. I was stopped entirely.
The Chairman. And you were asked for $1,600 then ?
Mr, Genc, That is correct.
Mr. Kennedy. That is all.
The Chairman, All right. Thank you very much.
Call the next witness.
Mr. Kennedy. Mr. Chairman, we have had a witness by the name
of Mr, Tapper who testified regarding payments to Mr. Cronin. Mr.
Cronin testified this morning that Mr. Tapper's testimony was false,
that he had never received any money from JSIr, Tapper nor did he
ask any money from Mr. Tapper,
Mr, Tapper testified that he went to Mr, Cronin's home. I would
like to recall Mr, Tapper to see if he can give any other supporting
testimony.
The Chairman. Mr, Tapper, come forward, please.
You will remain under your same oath as when you testified yes-
terday.
TESTIMONY OF WARREN A. TAPPER— Resumed
Mr. Tapper. Yes, sir.
The Chairman. Since your testimony yesterday and since Mr,
Cronin has denied that he received any money from you, have you
made a seai-ch of your records to ascertain if you had any notation or
memoranda, anything in connection with that transaction 'i
IMPROPER ACTIVITIES IN THE LABOR FIELD 15871
Mr. Tapper. Yes, sir ; I checked back through the petty cash fund
for several months covering that period, and I found the notation
where $250 in cash had been charged aa a business expense, with a
note that it had been paid to the Sheet Metal Workers Union.
The CiiAiRiHAN. I hand you here some memorandums, quite a num-
ber of them — bills, statements, and so forth. I will ask you to ex-
amine this in bulk and see if you identify the package of
memorandums that I am handing you.
(The documents were handed to the witness.)
Mr. Tapper. These are the various petty cash amounts paid out dur-
ing the month of August 1949.
The Chairman. August 1949 ?
Mr. Tapper. Yes, sir.
Here is one ticket in here marked "Sheet Metal Workers Union,
$250." It is dated August 31, 1949.
The Chairman. Whose handwriting is that in ?
Mr. Tapper. It is in my secretary's handwriting.
The Chairman. Did you instruct her to write that ?
Mr. Tapper. She handled the cash box and she counted the money
out to me and wrote up this voucher.
The Chairman. You told her to whom the money was being paid ?
Mr. Tapper. I told her what it was for and who it was to be paid to.
The Chairman. Did you have that record in mind when you testi-
fied yesterday ? I mean did you know you had that receipt yesterday ?
Mr. Tapper. Yes ; I knew I had the receipt.
The Chairman. You didn't have it with you at the time ?
Mr. Tapper. That is right.
The Chairman. So you do have that memorandum ?
Mr. Tapper. I have this memorandum ; yes, sir.
The Chairman. The other material there — are those memorandums
of other cash payments out of petty cash and so forth?
Mr. Tapper. This is the entire petty cash, the payouts, for the month
of August 1949.
The Chairman. Your full records for that month of cash expendi-
tures ?
Mr. Tapper. The full records of cash paid out of the cash box.
The Chairman. I see.
Let that package of memorandums and receipts be made exhibit
No. 14, in bulk, with special emphasis on the notation of cash paid
out to the union in the amount of $250 to which the witness has
testified.
(Documents referred to were marked "Exhibit No. 14" for refer-
ence and may be found in the files of the select committee.)
The Chairman. What is the date of that cash payment ?
Mr. Tapper. August 31, 1949.
The Chairman. August 31, 1949 ?
Mr. Tapper. Yes, sir.
Mr. Kennedy. Yesterday, I believe you testified that it was made
in September. Is that right ? It was in 1949. Was that your recol-
lection ?
Mr. Tapper. I wouldn't know the exact date. The latter part of
August or the first few days of September.
15872 IMPROPER ACTIVITIES IN THE LABOR FIELD
Mr. I^NNEDY. When we jfirst came to you, Mr. Tapper, you didn't
understand that we were making an investigation of your income tax
returns, did you ?
Mr. Tapper. No, sir.
Mr. Kennedy. It was suggested this morning that possibly you con-
tractors have come in here and testified that you gave this money be-
cause of the fact that you wanted to expLain certain of your books
and records away, the payments that you had made, on your income
tax returns.
There was never any discussion of that whatsoever, was there, Mr.
Tapper ?
Mr. Tapper. There was never any such idea.
Mr. Kennedy. In fact, if you hadn't given us this receipt of $250,
or the slip showing the $250 payment, we would never have known
about it ; is that correct ?
Mr. Tapper. That is right, sir.
Mr. Kennedy. So this was information that we obtained from you
after an interview was conducted with you to find out if you know
anytliing about payments to any union officials ?
Mr. Tapper. That is correct.
Mr. Kennedy. And then you gave us that information ?
Mr. Tapper. Yes, sir.
Mr. Kennedy. This was not us coming in and saying, "We under-
stand that back in 1949 you paid $250 that you are trying to hide"?
Mr. Tapper. No, sir ; that was not it.
Mr. Kennedy. And your testimony is correct; is that right?
Mr. Tapper. Yes, sir.
Mr. Kennedy. And when Mr. Cronin denied it this morning under
oath before the committee, his testimony was incorrect ?
Mr. Tapper. His testimony was incorrect.
Mr. Kennedy. You stated, did you not, that you went to his home ?
Mr. Tapper. I went to his home on two occasions.
Mr. Kennedy. Can you describe his home at all ?
Mr. Tapper. Well, it was a bungalow type of building in the Austin
district of Chicago, either Mason Avenue, or Marmora, one of those
streets in there, south of North Avenue. It was a bungalow situated
on the west side of the street.
I was conducted back into the kitchen or breakfast nook area where
we sat at a table and discussed these things.
Mr. Kennedy. You sat at a table in the breakfast room?
Mr. Tapper. In the breakfast area.
Mr. Kennedy. Was the breakfast room right in the
Mr. Tapper. You came in the front door, a large living room, with
a hallway leading back to the kitchen, and through the kitchen into
this breakfast room, which was on the far end of the building.
Mr. Kennedy. Mr. Cronin states that you were never in his home.
Mr. Tapper. I was in his home on two occasions.
Mr. Kennedy. Did anybody drive to his home on either one of those
occasions?
Mr. Tapper. I had a salesman with me who sat out in the car while
I was in with Mr. Cronin at the time the money was paid.
Mr. Kennedy. You have furnished the name of that salesman to
the committee, have you not ; to the staff ?
Mr. Tapper. I have given his name ; yes.
IMPROPER ACTIVITIES IN THE LABOR FIELD 15873
Mr. Kennedy. We are contacting him.
The Chairman. I merely wanted to ask you one other question.
Are these memorandums of cash expenditures, these slips, this pack-
age you have handed me, are they all the originals and -were they
made at the time ?
Mr. Tapper. They are all the originals, which were packed away
with other old records.
The Chairman. In other words, these are the receipts or memor-
andums that were actually made during the month of August 1949?
Mr. Tapper. The box that they were in had not been opened since
they were packed away, approximately January 1, 1950, until a few
weeks ago when we started going through the boxes, looking for
those records.
The Chairman. Thank you very much.
Mr. Kennedy. Thank you very much.
The Chairman. Call the next witness.
Mr. IvENNEDY. James L. JNIoore.
The Chairman. Be swoni, please.
You do solemnly swear the evidence you shall give before this
Senate select committee shall be the truth, the whole truth, and
nothing but the truth, so help you God ?
Mr. Moore. I do.
TESTIMONY OF JAMES L. MOORE
The Chair:\L:\n. State your name, your place of residence, and
your business or occupation.
Mr. MooRE. James L. Moore. I live at 1551 North Wilkie Eoad. I
have the James Moore Heating Co.
The Chairman. Is that in Chicago?
Mr. MooRE. That is in Des Plaines, 111.
The Chairman. That is a suburb of Chicago, is it?
Mr. Moore. Yes, sir.
The Chairman. You waive counsel, Mr. Moore, do you?
Mr. IMooRE. Yes.
Mr. Kennedy. Your name is spelled M-o-o-r-e; is that correct?
Mr. MooRE. Yes, sir.
Mr. Kennedy. You formed a partnership in September of 1952?
You started the Acme Heating Co. ?
Mr. Moore. Yes, sir.
Mr. Kennedy. How many employees did you have at that time?
Mr. Moore. Well, there was only two when we first started, but
then we hired more men later.
Mr. Ivennedy. Shortly after you formed your company with a Mr.
Wells— is that right ?
Mr. MooRE. Yes, sir.
Mr. IvENNEDY. Were you visited by a representative of the Sheet
Metal Workers Union?
Mr. MooRE. Yes, sir.
Mr. IvENNEDY. Could you tell us what happened then, who it was
and what conversation took place?
Mr. MooRE. Well, there was two of them, Mr. Caldwell and Mr.
Troutman.
15874 IMPROPER ACTIVITIES IN THE LABOR FIELD
Mr. Kexnedy. Mr. Caldwell, Ray Caldwell, and Mr. Shannon
Troutman ?
Mr. Moore. Yes, sir.
Mr. Kennedy. Wliat conversation took place ?
Mr. IMooKE. Well, they asked how long we had been running a shop.
They said, "It looks like you have been doing a lot of work. There is
a lot of scrap laying in the building.''
We had been working for maybe 2 months. They said we wasn't
supposed to open up a shop without first going through the union
hall. Then they said there would be this money to be paid in.
The Chairman. Would be what ?
Mr. Kennedy. He told you first that you shouldn't be setting up a
shop without going to the union hall ?
Mr. MooRE. That is right.
Mr. Kennedy. Then he said in addition to that there was some
money to be paid ?
Mr. Moore. Yes.
Mr. Kennedy. Would you tell of the conversation about that ?
Mr. MooRE. Well, he said, "You don't just start a shop," he said,
"witliout you set it all up," with them first, "and then you pay the
money."
Mr. Kennedy. How much money did he say needed to be paid?
Mr. Moore. Well, we paid $300.
Mr. Kennedy. Is that how much he asked for ?
Mr. MooRE. Yes.
Mr. Kennedy. Was there any discussion as to whether it would be
by check or cash ?
Mr. Moore. Cash. No checks.
Mr. Kennedy. He said it would just be cash. Which one asked for
the money ?
Mr. Moore. I don't remember which one. There was two of them
there.
Mr. Kennedy. Did you pay them the cash ?
Mr. Moore. We did ; yes. Not right away. We didn't have it that
day. But we did later on.
Mr. Kennedy. Where did you get the cash ?
Mr. MooRE. Well, we hadn't been in business long enough to have
a business account, so we each drew half of the money from our per-
sonal accounts and paid it.
Mr. Kennedy. Each one of j^ou drew $150 from your personal
accounts ?
Mr. Moore. Yes, sir.
Mr. Kennedy. Then did you turn over the $300 ? Who turned over
the $300 ?
Mr. Moore. Well, I think I did. I am not sure. One of us did,
I believe I was tlie one that did.
Mr. Kennedy. To whom did you give the money ?
Mr. Moore. We just laid it on a workbench in the shop.
The Chairman. Youwliat?
Mr. Moore. We laid it on a workbench in the shop. I don't know
who picked it up.
]Mr. Kennedy. Who was there at the time ?
Mr. Moore. Mr. Caldwell and Mr. Troutman.
IMPROPER ACTIVITIES IN THE LABOR FIELD 15875
Mr. Kennedy. Was that the same time, the first visit ?
Mr. Moore. No. We didn't have the money that day.
Mr. Kennedy. So they came back ?
jNIr. Moore. Yes.
]\Ir. Kennedy. You got the $300 and you laid it on a bench in front
of them ?
Mr. MooRE. Yes, sir.
Mr. Kennedy. And it was for them, the money was for them ?
]Mr. Moore. Yes, sir.
Mr. Kennedy. And they came by and picked it up ?
Mr. MooRE. Yes, sir.
Mr. IvENNEDY. They were present at tlie time 3'ou put the money
down there?
Mr. JNIooRE. Yes, sir.
Mr. Kennedy. What was the purpose of making the payment?
Mr. Moore. Well, they said it was for like a fund in case you was
ever in any trouble or you needed bailing out of jail or anything
like that, that there would be money there for that purpose.
Mr. Kennedy. If you got into any trouble or needed bail for jail,
that was the fund they were raising for that purpose ?
Mr. Moore. Yes, sir.
Mr. Kennedy. Why was it necessary to have it in cash ?
Mr. MooRE. I don't know, sir.
Mr. Kennedy. You knew that it was a payoff, did you not ?
Mr. MooRE. I thought it was ; yes, sir.
Mr. I^JENNEDY. Did you ever pay any other money to them ?
Mr. MooRE. Well, not then, but about a j-ear later we split up the
partnership and I started a shop of my own. Then I had to add an
additional $150 to make it up to $300 again.
Mr. Kennedy. Would you tell us how that came about?
Mr. MooRE. Well, I started a shop and nobody was around for
quite a while. Then they came around.
Mr. Kennedy. Who came around?
Mr. Moore. I believe ISIr. Caldwell. They actually was both there,
but it was two different trips then.
Mr. Kennedy. But both of them came to your new shop ?
Mr. MooRE. Yes, sir.
Mr. Kennedy. That is Mr. Troutman and Caldwell ?
Mr. MooRE. Yes, sir.
Mr. IvENNEDY. What did they say to you ?
Mr. Moore. Well, they said that tliey would need the additional
$150.
Mr. Kennedy. ^Vliy, in view^ of the fact that you had already paid
$300, whv was $150 more needed ?
Mr. Moore. Well, I was on my own then. I started my own shop.
Tliat was supposed to be the other half if I wanted that shop then,
I suppose.
The Chairman. The other half of what?
Mr. Moore. Of the $300.
Mr. Kennedy. You had only paid $150 yourself, and your partner
had paid $150. ' ' ^ i
Mr. Moore. That is ri^ht.
15876 IMPROPER ACTIVITIES IN THE LABOR FIELD
Mr. Kennedy. So they wanted, when you set up your new busi-
ness, for you to pay a new $150 to make the total $300 ?
Mr. MooRE. Yes, sir.
Mr. Kennedy. What did they say that was for ?
Mr. MooRE. The same thing. It was no different. They didn't
change that.
The Chairman. Was that to keep you out of jail or get you out?
Mr. MooRE. To get you out.
The Chairman. Which?
Mr. Moore. To get you out, I guess.
The Chairman. You haven't needed it yet, have you ?
Mr. Moore. No, sir.
Mr. Kennedy. They didn't talk about any old sheet-metal workers?
Mr. MooRE. Well, I have heard that.
Mr. Kennedy. But that wasn't the reason that was given to you ?
Mr. MooRE. No, sir.
Mr. Kennedy. Did you understand that this practice was generally
followed by the contractors, that they liad to make this payment?
Mr. MooRE. Yes, sir ; I had heard that before.
Mr. Kennedy. Did they insist on the second occasion that the pay-
ment would have to be in cash ?
Mr. Moore. Yes, sir.
The Chairman. How did you deliver that $150 ?
Mr. MooRE. Well, I didn't have it at the time, so I had to get it
later and take it down to the union hall.
The Chairman. To whom did you give it ?
Mr. Moore. I just put it on a desk in the union hall.
The Chairman. Who saw you put it there?
Mr. MooRE. I don't remember who was in there then. There was a
room and there was 2 or 3 desks. There was a couple of different
people in there. I don't even know.
The Chairman. What did you say to them when you put it down?
Mr. MooRE. I didn't say anything. I just laid it down.
The Chairman. How did they know what you were doing?
Mr. MooRE. Well, I had been told that I should bring it there
before.
The Chairman. To bring it there and lay it on the desk ?
Mr. MooRE. Yes.
The Chairman. And there was someone who saw you do it?
Mr. Moore. Yes, sir ; but I don't know who it was.
Mr. Kennedy. Who was in the room, do you know, at the time you
brought it down ?
Mr. MooRE. Well, I think the secretary. I don't know his name.
And maybe Mr, Caldwell.
Mr. IvENNEDY. You are not sure?
Mr. Moore. No ; I am not sure.
Mr. Kennedy. As I understand, on the second occasion, two, Cald-
well and Troutman, came to see you. Then did Mr. Caldwell come
to see you himself on one occasion?
Mr. MooRE. Yes, sir.
Mr. Kennedy. But you had conversations with both of them about
the extra $150 that had to be paid ?
Mr. Moore. Yes, sir.
IMPROPER ACTIVITIES IN THE LABOR FIELD 15877
Mr. Kennedy. And you got this money out of your personal bank
account and brought it down there ?
Mr. MooRE. Yes, sir.
Mr. Kennedy. Was this ever listed in your books or records?
Mr. Moore. AVell, I did liave the check, but we moved and then we
looked for it and we couldn't find it.
Mr. Kennedy. Was it listed in your company's books?
Mr. MooRE. No. It was a personal check. I just drew it out and
]iad "union dues" or "union payment" or sometliing wrote on it. But
I cashed tlie check and just put the notation on it myself. Then when
we moved I couldn't find the check. I might still have it. We have
some stuff that is packed up. Tliere is a lot of it.
Tlie Chairman. Will you make a search for it?
Mr. MooRE. Yes, sir.
The Chairman. If you find it, advise the committee.
Mr. MooRE. Yes, sir.
The Chairman. Tliank you.
Mr. Kennedy. Just so I understand, was this from your own per-
sonal bank account?
]\Ir. MooRE. Yes, sir.
Mr. Kennedy. This last $150 was from your own personal bank
accoimt ?
Mr. Moore. Yes, sir.
Mr. Kennedy. And you drew the check to cash, did you ?
Mr. Moore. Yes, sir.
Mr. Kennedy. You cashed the check and took the $150 in cash, put
it in an envelope and brouglit it to union headquarters ?
Mr. MooRE. It was in no envelope, I don't believe.
Mr. Kennedy. You just put the $150 on a desk ?
Mr. IVIooRE. Yes, sir.
Mr. Kennedy. Did you talk to somebody afterward so that they
would know you brought the $150 down ?
Mr. MooRE. I just said, "That is the money," but I don't know who
it was that was there.
Mr. Kennedy. Did you talk to Mr. Caldwell afterward or Mr.
Troutman ?
Mr. MooRE. At the time, yes, I talked to them.
Mr. Kennedy. They were there at the hall when you brought the
$150 down?
Mr. Moore. They was there, yes.
Mr. Kennedy. Did they suggest that you put it there ?
Mr. Moore. Yes, sir.
Mr. Kennedy. They suggested while you were in the hall ?
Mr. Moore. Yes, just to lay it on the desk.
Mr. Kennedy. Just to lay the money on a desk ?
Mr. Moore. Yes.
The Chairman. I was wondering how you were identified, how
they knew you were the one that made the payment. They were there
at the hall and when you went down you reported to them that you
had the money?
Mr. Moore. Yes, sir.
The Chairman. And they told you to go in there and put it on
the desk?
15878 IMPROPER ACTIVITIES IN THE LABOR FIELD
Mr, Moore. Yes, sir.
The Chairman. So you say there may have been someone else in
the room, but you don't know who that was ?
Mr. MooRE. No ; I don't. There was somebody.
The Chairman. But you do know that Caldwell and Troutman
were there, and you reported to them that you had brought the money ?
Mr. MooRE. Yes, sir.
The Chairman. And they told you to put it on the desk ?
Mr. MooRE. Yes, sir.
The Chairjvian. And you carried out their instructions?
Mr. Moore. Yes, sir.
Mr. Kennedy. That is all.
The Chairjvian. All right.
Thank you very much.
The instructions I gave the other witness with respect to continuing
under their present subpena — did you hear about that?
Mr. MooRE. Yes, sir.
The Chairman. You will continue under the jurisdiction of the
committee, subject to being recalled at such time as the committee may
need further testimony from you.
Mr. MooRE. Yes, sir.
T]ie Chairman. If you are bothered in any way, let us know.
Mr. MooRE. All right.
The Chairman. Thank you very much.
Mr. Kennedy. Mr. Ennnett D. Wells.
The Chairman. Come f orw^ard, Mr, Wells.
Be sworn, please, sir.
You do solemnly swear that the evidence you shall give before this
Senate select committee shall be the truth, the whole truth, and
nothing but the truth, so help you God ?
Mr, Wells, I do,
TESTIMONY OF EMMETT D. WELLS
The Chairman, State your name, your place of residence, and your
business or occupation.
Mr. Wells. My name is Emmett D. Wells. I live at 1895 Illinois
Street, Des Plaines, 111. I am the owner of Wells Heating & Sheet
Metal Co. in that same town.
The Chairman. You waive counsel, do you, Mr. Wells?
Mr. Wells. I do.
The Chairman. Proceed.
JNIr. Kennedy. Mr. Wells, you were a partner, were you not, of ISIr.
Moore ?
Mr. Wells. Yes.
Mr. Kennedy. Was that in the sheet metal business ?
Mr. Wells, Yes,
Mr. Kennedy. You formed this partnership in 1952 ?
:Mr. Wells. That is correct.
Mr. Kennedy. Jt Avas a company known as the Acme Heating Co.
of Des Plaines?
Mr. AVells. That is ria'ht.
IMPROPER ACTIVITIES IN THE LABOR FIELD 15879
jMr. Kennedy. Could you tell the committee whether you head some
discussions ^Yith any union olHcial regarding- the payment of any
money at the time 3'ou formed a partnership or shortly thereafter?
]Mr. Wells. "Well, it was al)out the same as Moore told. In 1952
we started this Acme Pleating Co. and o])erated a month or weeks.
Then we went to the union hall to see about getting an api)roval to
have a union shop. So they came out a week or 10 days later — Ray
Caldwell and Mr. Troutman, that is — to look over the shop. That is
about it. They told us it would cost us $oOO to operate.
The Chairman. Don't say, '"That is about it." You give your ver-
sion as to exactly what occurred.
Afr. Wells. They told us it would cost us $300 to get an approval.
The CiiAiR^rAN. It would cost $300 to get an approval for you to
continue in business?
Mr. Wells. That is right ; to have a union shop.
The Chairman. To have a union shop ?
Mr. AVells. Yes, sir.
The Chairman. Proceed.
Mr. Kennedy. Did you put up the $300 ?
Mr. Wells. Xo, not at the time. We didn't have the money. I
suppose about a week later they came back and we each got $150 of
our own money and laid it on a workbench there in the shop, and one
of the gentlemen picked it up. I don't recall which one.
The Chairman. Did they see you place the money on the bench?
Mr. Wells. Yes, sir.
The Chairman. Was there anyone else there that saw you place the
money on the bench except them and Mr. Moore ?
Mr. Wells. No, sir.
The Chairman. How long was it after you put the money on the
bench before you noticed it was gone ?
Mr. Wells. A minute or so, probably.
The Chairman. A minute or so ?
JMr. Wells. Yes.
The Chairman. There wasn't anyone else in there to get the money
except them ?
jSIr. Wells. No, sir.
The Chairman. You are sure they got the money ?
Mr. Wells. Yes, sir.
Mr. Kennedy. Did they say at that time that the payment had to
be in cash ?
Mr. Wells. Yes, sir.
Mr. Kennedy. And did you understand what the payment was
going to be for ?
Mr. Wells. Yes, sir.
Mr. Kennedy. What did they say ?
Mr. Wells. For approval of a union shop.
Mr. Kennedy. For approval of a union
Mr. Wells. And a working agreement.
Mr. Kennedy. Did you ever make any other payments?
Mr. Wells. Yes, sir.
Mr. Kennedy. When was that ?
Mr. Wells. That was about 1 year later. I bought Moore's in-
terest in the business.
15880 IMPROPER ACTIVITIES IN THE LABOR FIELD
Mr. Kennedy. What happened then ?
Mr. Wells. Well, Moore signed the agreement in 1952 of Acme
Heating when we were partners, so after I bought Moore out that
left me without a working agreement. So I had to kick in $200 extra.
Mr. Kennedy. How much?
Mr. Wells. $200.
Mr. Kennedy. $200 at that time ?
Mr. Wells. Yes.
Mr. Kennedy. To whom did you give that money ?
Mr. Wells. Kay Caldwell.
Mr. Kennedy. He told you that you had to give another $200
then ?
Mr. Wells. Yes, sir.
Mr. Kennedy. Where did you give him that money ?
Mr. Wells. On the side of the bank building in Des Plaines.
Mr. Kennedy. Did you just give him the cash ?
]Mr. Wells. Yes.
Mr. Kennedy. Wliere did you get the $200 ?
Mr. Wells. I wrote a check out for cash, took it in the bank and
cashed it, and handed him the money.
Mr. Kennedy. How much did he ask for ?
Mr. Wells. He said it would cost $300.
Mr, Kennedy. How were you able to get him down ?
Mr Wells. Well, I don't know how we were able to. We finally
arrived at $200.
Mr. Kennedy. Bargained back and forth ?
Mr. Wells. Well, I suppose I was sort of short on funds after
buying out Moore, and I tried to get him down a little.
Mr. Kennedy. Did you make any other payments?
Mr. Wells. Yes, sir.
Mr. Kennedy. Who else ?
Mr Wells. About 1 year from that day I sold the Acme Heating
Co. to another party.
Mr. Kennedy. Who did you sell it to ?
Mr. Wells. Wallace Lischett.
Mr. Kennedy. What happened ?
Mr, Wells. Well, I left the area. I wasn't around for about a
year. I don't know exactly what took place then.
Mr. Kennedy. Then did you return to the business?
Mr. Wells. Yes, sir ; in about July of 1955 I came back and pur-
chased a truck, machinery, and rented a building.
Mr. Kennedy. You sold in about April of 1954 and you came back
in March or April of 1956 ; was it?
Mr. AVells. July of 1955.
Mr. Kennedy. July of 1955 ?
Mr. Wells. Yes, sir,
Mr. Kennedy. Did you have some conversations then with anybody
from the union ?
Mr. Wells. Well, yes, I did; after I bought the machinery and
truck and rented a building, then I called Ray Caldwell to get the
approval again.
Mr. Kennfj)Y. Wliat did he say ?
IMPROPER ACTIVITIES IN THE LABOR FIELD 15881
Mr. Wei>ls. He said they wasn't OlCiiig any sliops at that par-
ticuhir time.
Mr. Kennedy. So what liappened ?
Mr. Wells. So I went to work for another shop and worked for
about C) niontlis or 7.
Mr. Kennedy. You couldn't. <i:o into business yourself ?
Mr. Wells. No, sir.
The CiLviKMAN. Is there a law against your going into business?
Mr. Wells. No; there wasn't no law.
The Chairman. Just men ?
Mr. Wells. Yes, sir.
The Chairman. They are bigger than the Government out there?
Mr. Wells. Well, I suppose so. I don't know about that.
The Chairman. Well, the law didn't require you to
Mr. Wells. I could have operated the business, but I would have
been nonunion. Nobody could have stopped me from that.
The Chairman. You don't know whether you could operate or
not nonunion i
Mr. Wells. That is about the size of it.
The Chairman. You might have been stopped ?
Mr. Wells. Well, if I had done certain work, I sure probably would
have been stopped.
Mr. Kennedy. You couldn't get any new construction work unless
you were union ?
Mr. Wells. I never tried it because I know not to try to do new
work unless you were union,
Mr. Kennedy. So did you call him ?
Mr. Wells. Yes ; I called him periodically over this period of 6 or
7 months.
Mr. Kennedy. And he said you couldn't open your shop up ?
Mr. Wells. Yes, sir.
Mr. Kennedy. So what happened then; did you ever get permis-
sion to open it up ?
Mr. Wells. Yes, sir; the first part of 1956, in February or March,
I called him and made an appointment with him and I got the ap-
proval then to open up another business.
Mr. Kennedy. That was Mr. Caldwell?
Mr. Wells. Yes, sir.
Mr. Kennedy. Did you pay him any money?
Mr. Wells. Yes, sir.
Mr. Kennedy. How much did you pay him then ?
Mr. Wells. $400.
Mr. Kennedy. Why had it gone up?
Mr. Wells. I don't know about that.
Mr. Kennedy. What did he say about that? Did you say "I onl}'
paid you $300 a couple of years ago*' ?
Mr. Wells. No ; I didn't say anything.
Mr. Kennedy. "Wlien he asked for $400, did you tell him you
thought that was a little high?
Mr. Wells. Well, yes; I thought it was a little high.
Mr. Kennedy, What did he say ?
Mr. Wells. He said it is up to $400 now.
Mr. Kennedy. You didn't argue about it?
21243— 59— pt. 42 9
15882 IMPROPER ACTIVITIES IN THE LABOR FIELD
Mr. Wells. No, sir.
Mr. Kennedy. And you gave him $400 in cash?
Mr. Wells. Yes, sir.
Mr. Kennedy. Did you make an entry in your books?
jNIr. Wells. No, sir; I didn't have any books at the time.
Mr. Kennedy. You made no other payments; is that right?
Mr. Wells. No, sir.
Mr. Kennedy. You were first interviewed, Mr. Wells, by Mr. Lan-
genbacher?
Mr. Wells. Yes, sir.
Mr. Kennedy. And you told liim about these payments; is that
correct ?
Mr. Wells. Yes.
Mr. Kennedy. And then you were interviewed by Mr. Duffy and
Mr. Langenbacher and myself in Chicago last week ?
Mr. Wells. Yes, sir.
Mr. Kennedy. Now, between those two interviews, and again, you
reaffirmed the fact that you had made those payments; is that right?
Mr. Wells. Yes, sir.
Mr. Kennedy. And you say here under oatli that you did make the
payments ?
Mr. Wells. Yes, sir.
Mr. Kennedy. Now, in between those two interviews, did you go
down to the union headquarters or have any conversation with any
union officials or union attorneys regarding these payments ?
Mr. Wells. After that, you mean ?
Mr. Kennedy. No, betw^een the first interview by Mr. Langenbacher
and the second interview with us in Chicago.
Mr. Wells. Well, I didn't exactly make it a point then, and I called
to thft union hall for sheet-metal workers.
Mr. Kennedy. Did you have any conversations regarding these
payments ?
Mr. Wells. Yes, and at the same time I told Ray Caldwell that I
had been questioned about my relationship with the union.
Mr. Kennedy. AYliat did Mr. Caldwell say ?
Mr. Wells. He wanted to know what took place.
Mr. Kennedy. So what happened then ?
Mr. Wells. I told him that I had signed a statement and Mr.
Langenbacher came around, and I signed their statement.
Mr. Kennedy. Saying you had made these payments ?
Mr. Wells. That "is right.
Mr. Kennedy. What did he do, Mr. Caldwell ?
Mr. Wells. He didn't do anything.
Mr. Kennedy. Did lie take you down to union headquarters then ?
Mr. Wells. No, sir.
Mr. Kennedy. Did you go down to the union headquarters at all?
Did you go down to see Mr. Colien ?
Mr. Wells. Yes, I saw Mr. Cohen.
Mr. Kennedy. The attorney for the union ?
Mr. Wells. Yes, sir.
Mr. Kennedy. How did you happen to go to see Mr. Cohen, the
attorney for tlie union ?
Mr. Wells. I was under the impression T might need some counsel.
Mr. Kennedy. Who suggested you go to Mr. Cohen ?
IMPROPER ACTIVITIES IN THE LABOR FIELD 15883
Mr. Wells. Mr. Caldwell took me to his office.
Mr. Kennedy. You tliought yon might be looking for counsel?
Mr. Wells. Yes, sir.
Mr. Kennedy. A[r. (^aldwell was kind enough to take you down to
see his counsel ?
Mr. Wells. That is right.
Mr. Kennedy. Did you have a conversation witli Mr. (;ohen then?
Mr. Wells. A small one.
Mr. Kennedy. Did you then make out a statement, that you hadn't
made any of these i)ayments, for Mr. Cohen, and Mr. Caldwell?
Mr. Wells. Well, in the meantime, I liad a copy of Mr. Langen-
bacher'S statement on my presence at that time, and he looked it over.
The Chaiioian. Who looked it over?
Mr. Wplls. Cohen.
Mr. Kennedy. Did he question you as to whether you had made the
payments or not i
Mr. AVells. Mr. Cohen didn't.
Mr. Kennedy. Who questioned you?
Mr. Wells. I don't think I was questioned.
Mr. Kennedy. Did you make any statement to them or make any
written statement to them that you had not made these payments ?
Mr. Wells. Yes, I did.
Mr. Kennedy. What statement did you make?
Mr. Wells. AVell, I am afraid I don't know the contents of that.
Mr. Kennedy. Who dictated that statement?
Mr. Wells. Mr. Cohen.
Mr. Kennedy. Mr. Cohen?
Mr. Wells. Yes.
Mr. Kennedy. And you signed the statement?
]VIr. Wells. Yes, sir.
Mr. Kennedy. Do you know what the statement said ?
Mr. Wells. No, sir.
Mr. Kennedy. Mr. Cohen gave you a copy of the statement?
Mr. Wells. No, sir.
Mr. Kennedy. Did anybody ask you when you were down there
with Mr. Caldwell and Mr. Cohen, if they wanted the truth as to
whether you had made these payments or not, did you say that to
Mr. Caldwell or Mr. Cohen?
]Mr. Wells. I think maybe I did ; I am sure I did.
Mr. Kennedy. What did they say ?
Mr. Wells. They didn't say anything.
Mr. Kennedy. They didn't answer that question ?
Mr. Wells. No, sir.
Mr. Kennedy. Did they give you a copy of the statement that you
signed ?
Mr. Wells. No, sir.
j\Ir. Kennedy. Well, now, did you or did you not make the pay-
ments that you have testified to here ?
Mr. Wells. I did make the payments.
Mr. Kennedy. And if you said anything in the statement to the
contrary, then that statement is incorrect; is that right?
Mr. Wells. That is correct.
15884 IMPROPER ACTIVITIES IN THE LABOR FIELD
Mr. Kennedy. Wliy would you sign such a statement or why did
you sign a statement down there at union headquarters or Mr.
Cohen's office?
Mr. Wells. I wanted to stay on the good side of both.
Mr. Kennedy. You wanted to stay on the good side of both?
The Chairman. AVhicli one were you afraid of i
Mr. Wells. Both.
The Chairman. Are you scared now '\
Mr. Wells. I am a little shaky.
The Chairman. On which side?
Mr. Wells. Both sides, I suppose.
The Chairman. You are shaking all over, are you? All right;
proceed.
Mr. Kennedy. That is all.
The Chairman. Now, let me see if I followed your testimony cor-
rectly. You first paid $150 out of your own money when you went
in business with Moore?
Mr. Wells. Yes, sir.
The Chairman. That money was paid to Caldwell and Troutman?
Mr. Wells. That is correct.
The Chairman. Then when you bought Moore out about a year
later, you paid $200 more?
Mr. Wells. Yes, sir.
The Chairman. That is your own money ?
Mr. Wells. Yes.
The Chairman. And then when you sold out and later came back
and wanted to go into business after about 6 months or something,
w^hile you had to work for someone else, when they finally let you
go back in business you had to pay $400 ?
Mr. Wells. Yes, sir.
The Ciiaiuman. That makes a total of $750 you paid out to these
folks?
Mr. Wells. That is right.
The Chairman. Now, the first $150 was paid to Troutman and
Caldwell?
Mr. Wells. That is right.
The Chairman. Who was the second $200 paid to ?
Mr. Wells. Ray Caldwell.
The Chairman.' To Ray Caldwell, himself ?
Mr. Wells. Yes, sir.
The Chairman. And who was the $400 paid to ?
Mr. Wells. Ray Caldwell, also.
The Chairman. Ray Caldwell?
Mr. Wells. Yes, sir.
The Chairman. So you li;i'« t Uj^h out a total of $750 ?
Mr. Wells. Yes, sir.
The Chairman. I wont to ask you something. You say you want
to stay on the good sidt of both ; is that right ?
Mr. Wells. Tbst is why I went to the office ; that is what I said.
The Chairman. That is what you said to them ?
Mr. Welij Yes, sir.
The Chairman. I want to ask you now: Are you on the side of
tru<b ni are you uj) here telling a lie?
IMPROPER ACTIVITIES IN THE LABOR FIELD 15885
Mr. AVells. I am telling the truth.
The Chairman. You are tellincr tlie truth today, are you ?
Mr. Wells. Yes, sir.
The Chairman. If you are up here misrepresenting these facts, you
ought to be punished for it, and you realize that, don't you ?
Mr. "Wells. Yes, sir.
The Chairman. Now, you are now under oath and you are swearing
what you have said here to be the absolute truth.
Mr. Wells. I do.
The Chairman. All right ; thank you very much. You will remain
under the same injunction that I have given to the other witnesses,
subject to recall and continuing under the jurisdiction of the com-
mittee.
Mr. Wells. Yes, sir.
The Chairman. Do you agree?
Mr. Wells. Yes, sir.
The Chairman. Thank you very much.
Call the next witness.
Mr. Kennedy. Mr. Lischett, please.
The Chairman. Do you solemnly swear that the evidence you shall
give before this Senate select committee shall be the truth, the whole
truth, and nothing but the truth, so help you God ?
Mr. Lischett. I do.
TESTIMONY OF WALLACE J. LISCHETT
The Chairman. Give your name and your place of residence and
your business or occupation, please.
Mr. Lischett. The name is Wallace J. Lischett. My residence is
199 North Milwaukee Avenue, Wheeling, 111. I am owner of Acme
Heating Co., Des Plaines, 111.
The Chairman. Do you waive counsel, Mr. Lischett ?
Mr. Lischett. I do, sir.
The Chairman. Is this Acme Heating Co. one that you purchased
from someone else ?
Mr. Lischett. I purchased Acme Heating Co. from Emmett Wells
in 1954.
The Chairman. From Mr. Wells, one of the witnesses who testified
here ?
Mr. Lischett. Yes, sir.
The Chairman. Is he the one who bought out Mr. Moore ?
Mr. Lischett. Yes, sir.
The Chairman. So you now own the Acme Heating Co. that was
established by Mr. Moore and Mr. Wells ?
Mr. Lischett. That is correct, sir.
The Chairman. Thank you very much. Go ahead.
Mr. Kennedy. Mr. Lischett, after you purchased this business in
October of 1954, did you have any conversations with any union official
about the fact that you had made the purchase ?
Mr. Lischett. Yes, sir. I contacted the Steam Fitters local in Chi-
cago and asked for an agreement with the Steam Fitters for hot water
heat, which I received, and I contacted I^cal 73, Sheet Metal Workers,
and Mr. Caldwell and Mr. Troutman came out to see me at the shop
2124.S O— 50— pt. 42 10
15886 IMPROPER ACTIVITIES IX THE LABOR FIELD
in Des Plaines. Mr. Caldwell had a talk with me and told me it would
cost $400 to become a unionized shop. I informed them that the shop
was unionized when Mr. AVells had it, and I was told in so many words
that that didn't take effect ; if I wanted to do new construction it would
cost me $400.
At a later date, Mr. Caldwell came to me and I gave Mr. Caldwell
$400, and 1 made out a clieck for cash and cashed it and gave Mr.
Caldwell the money in an envelope.
Mr. Kennedy. Why did you give him the cash (
Mr. LiscHETT. Because, sir, he would not accept a check, and I
had to do new construction to make a living.
The Chairman. I present to you a photostatic copy of a check dated
December 30, 1954, signed by you, apparently, or signed by your
wife, in the amount of $400, made to cash, with the notation after the
word "cash," "union dues."' I ask you to examine this check and state
if you identify it.
Mr. LiscHETT. I identify the check, sir.
The Chairman. Is that the check that you referred to upon which
you got the cash to pay Mr. Caldwell ?
Mr. LiscHETT. Yes, sir ; that is the check.
The Chairman. And you, at the time you cashed it, made that nota-
tion on it, when you wrote that check. Did you write the check ?
Mr. LiscHETT. The check was written by my wife, who does my
bookkeeeping.
The Chairman. She does your bookkeeping?
Mr. LiscHETT. Yes, sir.
The Chairman. And she wrote the check?
Mr, LiscHETT. Yes, sir.
The Chairman. Did you instruct her?
Mr. Lischett. Yes; I told my wife to make the check out that wa}'
so I could tell where the money went.
The Chairman. So you could tell where the money went ?
Mr. Lischett. Yes, sir.
The Chairman. And you state positively that the $400 proceeds
you got on that check was out of, apparently, your wife's account?
Mr. Lischett. No, sir; it is a company account, and my wife and I
have the right to sign the checks.
The Chairman. It is out of your company money ?
Mr. Lischett. Yes, sir.
The Chairman. The proceeds of that check you personally delivered
to Mr. Caldwell?
Mr. Lischett. Yes, sir.
The Chairman. How did you deliver it to him ?
Mr. Lischett. By handing it to him in an envelope.
The Chairman. You handed it to him in an envelope where ?
Mr. Lischett. In the union office, sir.
The Chairman. You carried it down to the union office?
Mr. Lischett. Yes, sir.
The Chairman. How soon after the date of that check ?
Mr. Lischett. I couldn't be absolutely sure, but within a week or so
of that, as soon as I got the money I made it my business to get down
there and take care of it.
The (^hairman. As soon as you got the money you went down and
took care of it ?
IMPROPER ACTIVITIES IN THE LABOR FIELD 15887
Mr. LiscHETT. Yes, sir.
Mr. Kennedy. AVliat reason did they give you for making you pay
the $400?
Mr. LiscHETT. At the time, sir, I asked them and I was informed
it was a special fund, and I tried to make inquiries about it, and I was
told in so many words, it is a special fund and if jou want to be in the
heating business and do new construction, that is it, and I was in no
position to question the gentlemen.
Mr. Kennedy. How many employees did you have?
Mr. LiscHETT. At the time I had three union employees.
The Chairman. How many ?
Mr. LiscHETT. Three employees.
Mr. Kennedy. Were they all sheetmetal workers?
Mr. LiscHETT. Yes, sir.
Mr. Kennedy. How many do you have now ?
Mr. LiscHETT. I have none, sir.
Mr. Kennedy. You are self-employed ?
Mr. LiscHETT. Yes, sir.
The Chairman. The check which I presented to the witness and
which he identified may be made exhibit Xo. 15.
(Domment referred to was marked "Exhibit Xo. 15" for reference
and will be found in the appendix on p. 15945) .
Mr. Kennedy. For what reason did you make the payment? Why
did you make the payment ?
Mr. LiscHETT. Why, sir? Because I wanted to be a heating con-
tractor and make a living, and that is the only way you can do it in
Illinois.
Mr. Kennedy. You have to make these payments ?
Mr. LiscHETT. Yes, sir.
Mr. Kennedy. Did you understand that this was a general practice ?
Mr. LiscHETT. It is common knowledge, sir.
Mr. Kennedy. That you have to make this payment in order to get
into business ?
Mr. I^iscTiETT. Yes, sir.
The Chairman. Where does this money go so far as you know, just
in the pockets of these racketeers ?
Mr. LisciiETT. 1 j^iesunie it cud, sir.
The Chairman. Yon have never heard of any of it being expended
for any legitimate purposes or charitable purposes, have you ?
Mr. LiscHETT. Xo, sir.
The Chairman. All right.
Senator Kennedy. As I understand, this shop was already union-
ized.
Mr. Lischett. Yes, sir.
Senator Kennedy. And you had union sheet-metal workers?
Mr. Lischett. Yes, sir; and the shop was unionized three times
previously.
Senator Kennedy. Why did you have to, oi- wh}- did you telephone
local 73, then ?
Mr. LiscHETr. Because, as 1 said, it is a common j^ractice when you
go in business, you have to notify them that you are going into busi-
ness or otherwise they will stop the job. If you get a heating con-
tractor building a new home the union walks in and pulls your men
and all of the rest of the trades off, and that is the end of your contract.
15888 IMPROPER ACTIVITIES IN THE LABOR FIELD
Senator Kennedy. But they were unionized i
Mr. LiscHETT. Yes, sir.
Senator Kennedy. Does this happen with other unions in the con-
struction trades besides the Sheet Metal Workers?
Mr. LiscHETT. I am not in a position to say, sir, and I would not
know^
Senator Kennedy. Your personal experience is with the Sheet
Metal Workers ?
Mr. LiscHETT. Yes, sir.
Senator Kennedy. But the fact is that you were hiring union labor,
and Sheet Metal Worker I'nion members at the time that this trans-
action took place ?
Mr. LisCHETT. Yes, sir ; that is correct.
Senator Kennedy. You took this as a business deduction on your
income tax ?
Mr. LiscHETT. No, sir; I took that $400 and I just wrote it off as an
expense.
Senator Kennedy. Well, you charged it off on your income tax.
Mr. LiscHETT. No, sir ; I did not charge it off.
Senator Kennedy. It was personal ?
Mr. LiscHETT. Yes, sir.
Senator Kennedy. Well, now, Mr. Chairman, one of the witnesses
this morning gave as his theory as to why these witnesses are making
these charges against him and others is because they put the money in
their pockets. But there would be no advantage in this case of Mr.
Lischett putting it in his pocket, because he is taking it not as a
business deduction but as a personal deduction. So what possible
reason would there be for him 4 years later to admit that he made the
payment and to come down here and testify before us with all of the
risks which are involved if it merely was he wanted to get $400 in his
pocket, because there is not any economic advantage to him ?
So I see no possible reason why you would not be telling the truth,
because there is no possible economic advantage that you could have
gotten out of making this check out and cashing it and putting the
money in your own pocket and saying you had given it to the gentle-
man that you have stated you gave it to. The fact of the matter is if
you wanted the $400 you could have written it out to cash, and you
didn't take it as a business transaction.
I would think the burden of proof in the case that we have just had
is certainly the other side, and not on you, unless somebody can
bring some other reason in for you doing it, and I don't see any other
reason other than you would be telling the truth.
The Chairman. That holds true of some of the others who have
testified.
Senator Kennedy. So the charge made that they are doing this be-
cause they are lying because they have used it as a tax-evading device
does not stand up in those cases.. It may not be true in the other
cases, but it definitely does not stand up in the cases where they didn't
take it as a business deduction.
Mr. Kennedy. We didn't go into your books and records and start
asking you about certain checks or certain documents that you had'^
Mr. Lischett. No, sir.
IMPROPER ACTIVITIES IN THE LABOR FIELD 15889
Mr. Kennedy. We came in on the basis not of making an income
tax investigation of you, but on the basis we wanted to find any in-
formation regarding whether you had made any payments to any
union official ; is that not correct ?
Mr. LiscHETT. That is right.
Mr. Kennedy. So if you hadn't given us this information, there
would not have been any way we could haxe checked that; is that not
correct? And we were not holding you up on the grounds that you
were under investigation for income tax ^
Mr. LiscHETT. That is correct, sir.
Senator Kennedy. I want to say, Mr. Chairman, I am glad that
you have made it very strong and very clear that any action that
would be taken directly or indirectly by any people that might be
involved in or out of this union against any of these witnesses for
coming before us, certainly has been, 1 think, extremely useful, and
you have made it very clear that they would come across this commit-
tee's jurisdiction in those cases.
The Chairman. You have heard the admonition that the Chair
gave the other witnesses ?
Mr. LiscHETT. I have.
The Chairman. You will remain under your same subpena, and
under the jurisdiction of the committee, and with the same instruc-
tions to request that you report to us any incident that might arise by
reason of your testimony here.
Mr. LiscHETT. Yes, sir.
The Chairman. You will be subject to being recalled if and when
the committee needs further testimony from you.
Mr. LiscHETT. Yes, sir.
The Chairman. Again I just want to say to you, and to the others
who have come liere and testified, I know it takes some courage to
do it because of this underworld element that lu;s iniiltrated into
some labor unions and business organizations. They are tough and
they are rough, and they think that they are above the law, and they
are trying to be above the law. They have made a challenge to the
supremacy of Government, in the conduct that they are pursuing, and
I think that the time has come for this Government to call that chal-
lenge. We can only do it by men oi courage, and witnesses who will
I'ome forth and give us these sordid facts.
Thank you very much.
Senator Kennedy. I think that ygur statement to the witness cov-
ered any attempts to carry out any boycott against any of the witness"
products merely because of any action that he took before this com-
mittee, or any bids that he might make merely because of any action
he took before this committee.
The Chairman. Thank you very much.
Call the next witness.
Mr. Kennedy. Mr. Troutman and Mr. Caldwell.
The Chairman. Come around, Mr. Troutman and Mr. Caldwell.
Will you bring up another chair, and Mr. Counsel, you may sit in
between your clients, and let the clients sit in front of the micro-
phones.
Will you be sworn ^ Do you and each of you solennily swear that
the evidence you shall give before this Senate select committee shall
15890 IMPROPER ACTIVITIES IN THE LABOR FIELD
be the truth, the whole truth, and nothing but the truth, so help you
God?
Mr. Troutman. I do.
Mr. Caldwell. I do.
TESTIMONY OF SHANNON J. TROUTMAN AND RAY CALDWELL,
ACCOMPANIED BY COUNSEL, NATHAN M. COHEN
The Chairman. Beginning on my left, the witness on my left, state
your name, your place of residence, and your business or occupation,
please.
Mr. Caldwell. Ray Caldwell, 4934 Dobson, Skokie. Assistant
business agent. Sheet Metal Workers, Local 73, Chicago.
The Chairman. Thank you very much.
And the gentleman on my right.
Mr. Troutman. My name is Shannon J. Troutman, and I live at
4539 North Seeley Avenue, in Chicago. I am the recording secretary
and business agent of the Sheet Metal Workers Union, Local No. 73.
The Chairman. Thank you.
Gentlemen, you have counsel, and Mr. Cohen is the same attorney
who has appeared here for other witnesses. Let the record so show.
Proceed.
Mr. Cohen. The witnesses complain that the taking of pictures
during their testimonv distracts them.
The Chairman. The Chair will make this observation : Witnesses
who cooperate with the committee by answering questions, when rais-
ing the issue or make a request that they not be photographed while
testifying by reason of possible distraction and interfering with their
concentrating while giving their testimony, where that request is
made and witnesses cooperate with the committee, we gladly grant
the request.
Therefore, the photographers will desist from photographing the
witnesses while testifying until further announcement from the Chair.
Proceed.
Mr. Kennedy. Mr. Caldwell, how long have you been with the
Sheet Metal Workers?
Mr. Caldwell. I have been a business agent since 1952.
Mr. Kennedy. What were you doing prior to that time ?
Mr. Caldwell. Working as a sheet- metal worker.
Mr. Kennedy. How long have you been with the union ?
Mr. Caldwell. In the neighborhood of 30 years.
Mr. Kennedy. Were you elected a business agent in 1952?
Mr. Caldwell. Yes, sir.
Mr. Kennedy. Did you have any opposition ?
Mr. Caldwell. No, sir; I was appointed in 1952.
Mr. Kennedy. By whom?
Mr. Caldwell. By the president of our union.
Mr. Kennedy. Mr. Cronin ?
Mr. Caldwell. Approved bv the membership and reelected in
1956 by them.
Mr. Kennedy. You were appointed by Mr. Cronin?
Mr. Caldwell. Right, sir.
Mr. Kennedy. What is your salary, as business agent ?
IMPROPER ACTIVITIES IN THE LABOR FIELD 15891
Mr. Caldwell. My take-home pay is $288 a week.
Mr. Kennedy. What is your salary ?
Mr. Caldwell. $350.
Mr. Kennedy. What are your expenses ?
Mr. Caldwell. $58 a quarter.
Mr. Kennedy, A quarter?
Mr. Caldwell. A month, rather.
Mr. Kennedy. $58?
Mr. Caldwell. $129 a quarter.
Mr. Kennedy. $129 for 2 weeks, isn't it ?
Mr. Caldwell. That is right.
Mr. Kennedy. Do you have any other source of income?
Mr. Caldwell. No, sir; I do not.
Mr. Kennedy. That is your only source ?
Mr. Caldwell, Yes, sir.
Mr. Kennedy. Have you had any other business interests or any
other source of income since 1950 ?
Mr. Caldwell. None whatsoever,
Mr, Kennedy. You have a bank accoinit, do you ?
Mr. Caldwell. Just the one that I showed you the book on.
Mr. Kennedy, Where is your bank account?
Mr, Caldwell, In the First National Bank of Skokie,
Mr, Kennedy. Where?
Mr. Caldwell. The Merchants National Bank at Madison, in
Chicago,
Mr, Kennedy, That is the only bank account that you have?
Mr, Caldwell, That is right,
Mr, Kennedy, Does your wife have a bank account?
Mr. Caldwell. My wife has a bank account.
Mr. Kennedy. Is that also there ?
Mr. Caldwell. No; that is in Skokie, a checking account.
Mr. Kennedy. Does she have any other bank accounts other than
that one ?
Mr. Caldwell. No.
Mr. Kennedy. Do you have any other bank accounts in any other
name, you or your wife ?
Mr. Caldwell. No, sir.
Mr. Kennedy. Those are the only two bank accounts?
Mr. Caldwell. That is right, sir.
Mr. Kennedy. We have had testimony before the committee by Mr.
Johnson that he gave you $50 or $100 in cash on one occasion; by
Mr. Wells that he gave you $150, $200, and then $400; by Mr. Moore
that he gave you $300 and $150; by Mr. Lischett that the gave you
$400. Did you receive this money ?
Mr. Caldwell. On the first three, Mr. Kennedy, I never received a
penny from either one of them.
Mr. Kennedy. You never received it ? Mr. Johnson was uncer-
tain whether it was $50 or $100. Did you receive that money?
Mr. Caldwell. I never saw Mr. Johnson in my life but twice, and
once was today. And I never received $50.
Mr. Kennedy. So his testimony that he did give you either $50
or $100 is incorrect : is that right ?
Mr. Caldw^ell. That is correct.
15892 IMPROPER ACTIVITIES IN THE LABOR FIELD
Mr. Kennedy. You did not receive that money ?
Mr. Caldwell. Never.
Mr. Kennedy. Mr. Wells states that he gave you $150 and $200 and
finally $400. Is that correct ?
Mr. Caldwell. I never got any money from Mr. Wells.
Mr, Kennedy. Do you know Mr. Wells ?
Mr. Caldwell. Yes ; I do.
Mr. Kennedy. You never received any money from him ?
Mr, Caldwell. No, sir.
Mr. Kennedy. Mr. Moore states that he gave you $300 and $150.
Mr. Caldwell. I never got any money from Mr. Moore.
Mr. Kennedy. He gave that money to you and Mr. Troutman.
Mr. Caldwell. That is incorrect.
Mr. Kennedy. Did you have any conversations with Mr. Moore
about this money ?
Mr. Caldwell. None whatever.
Mr. Kennedy. Did you have any conversations with any contractor
that they would have to pay money in order to open up a shop ?
Mr, Caldwell, I never told any contractor that.
Mr. Kennedy, And that that money would have to be in the form
of cash ?
Mr. Caldwell. I never told any contractor.
Mr. Kennedy, Mr. Lischett, who testified just prior to you, within
the last 5 minutes, that he gave you $400 in cash.
Mr. Caldwell. Mr. Lischett is lying,
Mr. Kennedy. He also didn't give you the money ?
Mr. Caldwell. I will tell you what happened in that case, Mr.
Kennedy.
Mr. Kennedy. Answer that question fir^t, please.
Mr. Caldwell. I never received it. I' received half of it in an
envelope and didn't know what it was for, that he left with the girl
in our office, at the switchboard. I took the envelope back and handed
it to Mr. Lischett. That was $200, not $400, and I didn't know what
it was for. That was sometime after he had gone in business.
Mr. Kennedy. What did the operator tell you ?
Mr. Caldwell. The operator told me there was an envelope left for
me by a Mr. Lischett.
Mr. Kennedy, She told you
Mr. Caldwell. I wasn't in the office when he came in there.
Mr. Kennedy. When was this that he left the envelope ?
Mr. Caldwell. Well, I don't know what date it was.
Mr. Kennedy. There was $200 in cash ?
Mr. Caldwell. $200 in cash.
Mr. Kennedy. And you brought it back to him ?
Mr. Caldwell, And I brought it back and handed it to him.
Mr. Kennedy. What did you say to him at that time 'i
Mr. Caldwell. I said to him, I said, ''I don't know what you left
that down there for. I don't know what the pui'{)ose of it is."
Mr. Kennedy. What did he say i
Mr. Caldwell. Pie didn't give me any answer to that. Hut he
took the money back.
Mr. Kennedy. So the testimony of Mr. Johnson, Mr. Wells, Mr.
Moore, and Mr. Lischett regarding you is incorrect; is that rights
Mr. Caldwell. Right, sir.
IMPROPER ACTIVITIES IN THE LABOR FIELD 15893
Mr. Kennedy. We also liad the testimony of Mr. Jolicoeur that he
had some discussions with you, either you or Mr. Cronin, regarding
the bidding that he would have on contracts, sug^estin^ to him that
he should not bid on certain contracts.
Mr. Caldwell. I never talked to him along- those lines.
Mr. Kennedy. You never did ?
Mr. Caldwell. No, sir.
Mr. Kennedy. Did you ever sujjgest to any contractor that he
not bid on a contract ?
Mr. Caldwell. I never did, sir.
Mr. Kennedy. So that testimony of Mr. Jolicoeur is incorrect?
Mr. Caldwell. If he includes me, it is incorrect.
Mr. Kennedy. Can you give any explanation as to why all of these
contractors would tell the story about giving you cash ?
Mr. Caldwell. I don't know of any reason.
Mr. Kennedy. You can't give any explanation ?
Mr. Caldwell. Xo, sir.
Mr. Kennedy. Mr. Troutman, what salary do vou received
Mr. Troutman. $350.
Mr. Kennedy. And the same expense account ?
Mr. Troutman. Yes, sir ; $129 every 2 weeks.
Mr. Kennedy. Have you had any other source of income since 1950?
Mr. Troutman. None whatever.
Mr. Kennedy. Xone at all. Where is your bank account ?
Mr. Troutman. Lakeview Trust, at Lincoln and Belmont.
Mr. Kennedy. Is that the only bank account ?
Mr. Troutman. No, sir. I told you the other day it was, but I was
excited. I got a couple of hundred dollars in the Midwest Bank. I
have that book with me. which I will gladly give you.
Mr. Kennedy. Any other bank accounts ?
Mr. Troutman. No, sir; none whatsoever.
Mr. Kennedy. Either of you or your wife i
Mr. Troutman. I am sorry; I ain't got it with me. No, sir.
Mr. Kennedy. We have had testimony before the committee by
Mr. Moore that he paid you and Mr. Caldwell $300 on one occasion
and $150 on another occasion.
Mr. Troitman. Mr. Moore never paid me 1 red cent.
Mr. Kennedy. So his testimony that he did
Mr. Troutman. His testimony is absolutely an out-and-out lie. I
realize I am under oath, and I certainly am not going to jeopardize
myself. I think I still am a Christian at least.
The Chairman. You still are what ?
Mr. Troutman. I say I think I am still a Christian. I believe in
telling the truth and not lying under oath.
The Chairman. That is fine.
Mr. Kennedy. Mr. Tapper testified that you asked him for $500.
Mr. Troutman. Mr. Tapper is lying also.
Mr. Kennedy. We have more liars.
Mr. Troutman. Well, I know, but, Mr. Kennedy, you have to give
us a right to defend ourselves. Mr. Tapper didn't like me to begin
with because I stopped in his shop twice and ridiculed him over the
way he was doing his work, which was very sloppy, if I may Siiy so.
Eor that reason — now, he didn't accuse me of taking any money, but
15894 IMPROPER ACTIVITIES IN THE LABOR FIELD
when he said that I tried to get money for Cronin, he is lying. Mr.
Cronin never asked me to take a penny from anybody, and had warned
us against it.
Mr. Kennedy. Mr. Cronin warned you against that (
Mr. Troutman. Mr. Cronin ; yes.
Mr. Kennedy. We have had five contractors say that they gave him
money.
Mr. Troutman. I know nothing about that whatsoever, Mr.
Kennedy.
Mr. Kennedy. I want to point out to you that I don't think Mr.
Cronin is a source of support for this.
Mr. Troutman. Mr. Cronin never sent me to Tapper's shop at all.
I went in there of my own accord, for the only reason of telling him
to correct his work.
Mr. Kennedy. Mr. Jolicoeur said you asked him for $300 and he
paid you $300. Is that correct ?
Mr. Troutman. He never paid me a cent. I believe, if I heard
right, Mr. Kennedy, pardon me for the interruption, but didn't he say
that either me or Mr. Cronin ?
Mr. Kennedy. You are right ; either you or Mr. Cronin.
Mr. Troutman. Well, that is not definite. It certainly wasn't me,
and I don't think it was Mr. Cronin.
Mr. Kennedy. But you never did ?
Mr. Troutman. No, sir. I was in Mr. Jolicoeur's shop once, and
that was to try to get him to come back into the union as him and his
brother had been expelled for nonpayment of dues. He agreed to do
that. One of them come back in the union a few weeks later and I
don't believe the other one ever did. That is the only conversation
I had with Mr. Jolicoeur.
Mr. Kennedy. Did you have any conversation with anyone regard-
ing how much they should bid on a certain contract ?
Mr. Troutman. No, sir.
Mr. Kennedy. You never suggested that they not bid on a contract ?
Mr. Troutman. No, sir.
Mr. Kennedy. And you never suggested to them that you would get
in touch with a contractor who would then tell them how much to bid
on the contract?
Mr. Troutman. I never told no contractor that; no, sir.
To begin with, I wouldn't know who to get in contact with.
Mr. Kennedy. Did you ever receive anything of value directly or
indirectly from anyone ?
Mr. Troutman. At Christmastime; yes, sir.
Mr. Kennedy. What did you receive ?
Mr. Troutman. Well, I received a couple of turkeys, maybe four
or five cartons of cigarettes, five or six bottles of whisky that I don't
use, and fruit cake, or something like that. No money, if that is
what you are asking about.
Mr. Kennedy. Well, anything of a value greater than $50^
Mr. Troutman. No, no, no, no. I don't tliink anytliing would be
any more value than $15 at the most.
The (^hairman. The committee will take ii 'i-minute recess.
(A sliort recess was taken.)
IMPROPER ACTIVITIES IN THE LABOR FIELD 15895
(Members of the select committee present at time of recess were
the chairman and Senator Kennedy.)
The Chairman. The committee will come to order.
Mr. Kennedy. Mr. Troutman, can you give any explanation as to
why these witnesses would testify that they gave you money?
Mr. Troutman, Why they should ?
Mr. Kennedy. Yes.
Mr. Troutman. No, I don't know, other than like I told you. Mr.
Lischett, I just barely know that man. I don't even know where
his shop is.
Mr. Kennedy. I don't think that is necessary.
Mr. Troutman. He accuses me of taking $400 from him.
Mr. Kennedy. Right.
Mr. Troutman. The truth is I never took 4 cents from the man. I
iiever had any conversations with him about money.
Mr. Kennedy. You wouldn't have to know him well to take the $400.
Mr. Troutman. A man ain't going to give you $400 without being
asked for it, I don't think.
Mr. Kennedy. Did you ask him for the $400 ?
Mr. Troutman. Sir ?
Mr. Kennedy. Did you ask him for the $400 ?
Mr. Troutman. I did not.
Mr. Kennedy. Can you give us any explanation as to why so many
jf these contractors come in here and testify under oath that they
have to make this payment in order to go into business in the Chicago
area?
Mr. Troutman. Mr. Kennedy, if 1 may, I don't know more than
two or three that accuse me of anything.
Mr, Kennedy. As a general practice. We have had 10 or so con-
tractors, and I am sure that as time goes along we will get more as we
continue to look, because, as I said this morning, at least 2 out of every
8 contractors that we interviewed stated that they made these pay-
ments to some member of the Sheet Metal Workers Union, to some
official of this union.
You were included at least on one occasion. Can you give any ex-
planation as to why contractors should come in here and testify under
oath that they made the payment ?
Mr. Troutman. No. Among the smaller contractors at least, like
Moore and Mr. Lischett, when you don't leave them run hog wild
the way they want to operate, right away quick you gain their dislike
at least. Whatever the proper term is right at the moment I can't
grasp.
In fact, one of them openly stated that he would get even with a lot
of us. For what, I don't know. But I can truthfully tell you like
I did that I did not
The Chairman. Which one i
Mr. Troutman. Sir ?
The Chairman. Which one (
Mr. Troutman. Tapper, for one.
The Chairman, He is for one. How many for two (
Mr. Troutman. Well, I don't know the others. But we hear im-
ports from time to time.
15896 IMPROPER ACTIVITIES IN THE LABOR FIELD
The Chairman. That they said they would ^et even with them I
Tapper said they would get even with them ?
Mr. Troutman. That is right.
The Chairman. Any others that you know of \
Mr. Troutman. No, not that I can put my finger on right at the
minute; no.
Senator Kennedy. You said when you don't let them operate just
the way thev want to they get mad at you. What do vou mean bv
that?
Mr. Troutman. Well, when they are trying to put in an installa-
tion, we look at it in this light, Mr. Senator: When you pay $600 or
$800 for a job of warm air, you are entitled to that much value, and
when they just tack an ordinary piece of light metal across two wooden
joints in the basement, instead of giving you a duct, you are getting
cheated someplace along the line.
The thing don't operate and then they won't go back and fix it or
anything else. When we get that kind of a contractor, the general
calls us and hollers and we go out and try to correct it.
Senator Kennedy. Isn't it up to the general contractor to give the
work to another contractor, and it is not for you to police the con-
tractor ?
Mr. Troutman. What I mean is this. Senator. The general con-
tractor is responsible for the job. That we all agree on. You come
along and buy the home and it don't operate. You get after the gen-
eral contractor. He, in turn, calls the subcontractor. They ignore it,
won't do nothing.
Then, as a last resort, they call us. We go out and very often the
contractor will correct it. But very often them smaller ones will not
correct it. That is what I meant.
Senator Kennedy. So you are making the statement about Mr. Tap-
per that you believe that the reason he is making these charges about
you is because he didn't do work that was satisfactory to the union ?
Mr. Troutman. That is right. That is my reason.
Senator Kennedy. Over w^hat contract did you have difficulty ?
Mr. Troutman. Well, I don't know right now. Senator, just which
ones they were, but there were several of them.
Senator Kennedy. Do you know what year ?
Mr. Troutman. Sir?
Senator Kennedy. When did you have your argument with Tap-
per ? Did you have a personal argument with hi m ?
Mr. Troutman. I think about 6 or 7 years ago.
Senator Kennedy. How many times have you seen him ?
Mr. Troutman. Twice. I was in the man's shop twice in my life,
both times to complain.
Senator Kennedy. You went to his shop twice ?
Mr. Troutman. That is right.
Senator Kennedy. Did you call him to tell him his work was unsat-
isfactory, or did you call him down to the shop ?
Mr. Troutman. No ; I went down there in person.
Senator Kennedy. The two times you have seen him were in his
shop when you came to ridicule him about the work ?
Mr. Troutman. Twice I went into his shop, yes, sir, and that was
6 or 7 years ago, because I don't work that district any more and I
IMPROPER ACTIVITIES IN THE LABOR FIELD 15897
have no occasion to go in and see him. Just last year — pardon me,
I got ahead of myself there.
Last year, Mr. Caldwell and me met Mr. Tapper. I don't recall
what that was abovit, but he took us into the Elks Lodge and bought
us dinner. Now, if we were holding him up like that, I don't know
why he would invite us to be his guests. That is my statement.
Senator Kennedy, If he was trynng to get even with you, I don't
know why he would either.
Mr. Troutman. I don't know either, but he did.
Senator Kennedy. Was it a pleasant dinner?
Mr. Troutman. Yes; it was a nice dinner.
Senator Kennedy. What about Mr. Lischett? Did you have a
fight with him?
Mr. Troutman. Xo.
Senator Kennedy. You never talked to him about his work ?
Mr. Troutman. No, sir; I know who he is ; that is all.
Senator Kennedy. You have met him ?
Mr. Troutman. I have met him, yes, in a businesslike way.
Senator Kennedy. Where ?
Mr. Troutman. I believe once or twice he came down to the union.
Senator Kennedy. What did he come down there for ?
Mr. Troutman. To say hello, that was all. He didn't come down to
see me. He probably came down to pay his dues or something.
Senator Kennedy. He isn't in the union, is he? Do you mean the
checkoff ?
Mr. Trouttman. No.
Senator Kennedy. Why would he come down to pay his dues?
Mr. Troutman. Where else would you go to pay your union dues?
Senator Kennedy. He is not in the union ; is he ?
Mr, Troutman. Sir?
Senator Kennedy. Is he in the union ?
Mr. Troutman. I believe he is a member of the union. I am not
sure of that either. I believe he is out on a withdrawal card, if my
memory serves me rightly.
Senator Kennedy. Maybe he is in the union.
Mr. Troutman. He wouldn't pay when he was on a withdrawal
card, but up to that time he would.
Senator Kennedy. That is the only occasion you saw him?
Mr. Troutman. That I recall.
Senator Kennedy. He isn't a member of the union. He is not pay-
ing his dues. Does he have a withdrawal card ?
Mr. Troutman. When he has a withdrawal card he does not pay
dues.
Senator Kennedy. Then whv would he have been down at the
union
Mr, Troutman, This was probably before he got the withdrawal
card, I don't know, Senator, just what date or hour it was. I don't
know why you are all laughing, either. I think I am entitled to a
little more courtesy than that.
Senator Kennedy. I am not laughing at you. I am trying to get it
organized in my mind.
Mr. Trotttman. Everybody is laughing. I am trying to answer
your questions as truthfully as I can.
15898 IMPROPER ACTIVITIES IN THE LABOR FIELD
Senator Kennedy. Well, I don't mean to be laughing.
The Chairman. All right; let's cease laughing and see if the wit-
ness can concentrate. Proceed.
Mr. Troutman. I can't concentrate very well, Senator, if everybody
is laughing at me. I don't want to be up here like a goof.
The Chairman. Just a moment. I will stop the laughing insofar
as I can.
Senator Kennedy. I am finished, Mr. Chairman.
The Chairman. I want to ask you one question, Mr. Troutman.
Mr. Troutman. I will be glad to answer you.
The Chairman. I believe you said — was it Mr. Lischett who left
the envelope there ?
Mr. Troutman. No; I did not say that. Mr. Caldwell said that.
The Chairman. Then Mr. Caldwell is the one I want to interrogate.
Mr. Caldwell, you said, I believe, that Mr. Lischett left the envelope
with $200 in it ? Is he the one ?
Mr. Caldwell. He left the envelope with $200 in it, with the girl
at the switchboard. A sealed envelope with my name on it.
The Chairman. Did you open it ?
Mr. Caldwt:ll. I did, sir.
The Chairman. You found in it $200?
Mr. Caldwell. $200.
The Chairman. What did you do with the envelope ?
Mr. Caldwell. I took the envelope back to Mr. Lischett, the enve-
lope and the money, just the way he give it to me, with the exception
that it had been opened.
The Chairman. How long after the envelope was given to you?
Mr. Caldwell. Well, I went back to his shop on several occasions.
It is quite a way out, and we don't always get out that far. I couldn't
find anybody there.
The Chairman. You said he just came in there and laid it down
without any reason at all ?
Mr. Caldwell. He handed it to the girl at the desk, the switch-
board.
The Chairman. No reason, no prearrangements, no undei"standing,
or anything?
Mr. Caldwell. Nothing so far as I know.
The Chairman. Mr. Troutman, I heard you say "Who would do a
thing like that a while ago."
Mr. Troutman. To give me $400. I don't know anything about
this money.
The Chairman. But you raise the question on who would do it. I
see your associate has had a different experience.
Mr. Troutman. That very well could be. Senator.
The Chairman. I didn't quite understand it.
Mr. Troutman. I am sorry if I didn't explain myself right,
properly.
The Chairman. All right, Mr. Caldwell, you gave back to Mr.
Lischett the same envelope, did you ?
Mr. Caldwell. The same envelope and the same bills that were in
it.
The Chairman. And the same bills that were in it ?
Mr. Caldwell. Yes, sir.
IMPROPER ACTIVITIES IN THE LABOR FIELD 15899
The (^HAiRMAN. The envelope had been left at the union headquar-
ters on a desk, had it ?
Mr. Caldwell. Not on a desk. Handed to the girl at the switch-
board desk, through the window.
The Chairman. Handed to the girl at the switchboard desk through
the window. Were you in the building at the time ?
Mr. Caldwell. No, sir.
The Chairman. How long after the money had been left for you
was the envelope delivered to vou ?
Mr. Caldweli,. 1 believe it was the next day.
Tlie Chairman. You think it was the next day?
Mr. Caldwell. Yes, sir.
The Chairman. How long was it after that before you gave the
envelope back ?
Mr. Caldwell. As I say, I went back on several occasions and never
found anybody in the shop. One day I went back there and a man in
an office near his shop was there and I asked him if he knew where I
could find Mr. Lischett. He said, "Yes, I know the job they are
working on today," which was probably 2 or 8 miles from where his
shop was.
I went out and found him at that job and handed him back the
envelope with the money in it in that house that he was working on.
It was a house that had been occupied, but there was nobody m it.
They were doing some remodeling of the heating system.
The Chairman. AVhat did you say to him when you handed him the
envelope ?
Mr. Caldwell. I said, "Here is the envelope that you left at the
office, Walter, and I don't know what you left it there for."
The Chairman. What did he say?
Mr. Caldwell. He didn't say anything.
The Chairman. He didn't say anything ?
Mr. Caldwell. No, sir. He just took the envelope and the money,
took the money out and counted it and put it in his pocket.
The Chairman. He didn't say a word ?
Mr. Caldwell. No, sir.
The Chairman. You didn't ask him why he left it there ?
Mr. Caldwell. I said, ''I don't know why you left it there."
The Chairman. Is that all that was said between you ?
Mr. Caldwell. That is all, sir.
The Chairman. Nothing else ?
Mr. Caldwell. No, sir.
The Chairman. How long after the money had been left, or after
it had been turned over to you, was it before you think — you said you
made trips — before you returned it ?
Mr. Caldwell. Well, it was several weeks, if I remember right.
Senator. I called on several occasions, and got no answer. When T
was out in that direction I stopped at the shop on several occasions.
I found no one there. This one day I was lucky enough to find some-
body that knew where he was.
The Chairman. Mr, Lischett, come forward, please.
Mr. Lischett, you have already been sworn. I want to ask you
about the return of the envelope in which you left the money. You
say you left $400 in the envelope ?
15900 IMPROPER ACTIVITIES IN THE LABOR FIELD
Mr. LiscHETT. That is correct, sir.
The Chairman. Did you hand it to the girl at the switchboard?
Mr. LiscHETT. I notified the girl at the switchboard that I came
to the union to see Mr. Caldwell. I handed her the envelope. I was
told to sit down and wait. Mr. Caldwell was in the office. I went
down to Mr. Caldwell, his office, and we signed a union agreement at
that time.
The Chairman. At that time he was there ?
Mr. LiscHETT. Yes, sir.
The Chairman. Did you tell him you had left the envelope?
Mr. LiscHETT. Yes, sir.
The Chairman. You told him at the time that you had left the
money ?
Mr. LiscHETT. Yes, sir.
The Chairman. Did you say "money" or "envelope" ?
Mr. LiscHETT. Envelope.
The Chairman. He knew w^hat you meant?
Mr. LiscHETT. Yes, sir.
The Chairman. Was the envelope ever returned to you ?
Mr. LiscHETT. Yes, sir; at a later date. I would say a good month
or maybe 2 months aft4r that. Mr. Caldwell came out on the job site
in Des Plaines, 111. 'At that time I had my steamfitter with me,
whose name is Mike Porter.
Mr. Porter had a financial investment in the company at the time
with me. And Mr. Porter, myself and Mr. Caldwell had quite a
heated discussion about this union payoff.
The Chairman. At that time?
Mr. LiscHETT. At that time, at that house. Mike, Mr. Melvin Por-
ter, got quite hostile and told him at that time Senator Kefauver was
having some kind of investigating committee, and told him at that
time if he didn't lay off and leave us alone that he was going to turn it
over to Mr. Kefauver.
From that day on I have not seen Mr. Caldwell. At this time, as
far as Mr. Troutman goes, I met Mr. Troutman four times. Mr.
Troutman has never asked me for any money. He ran me off the job
in Joliet, 111. I had a helper's permit, w^orking for L. H. Sohn, and
he came out on the job site and said, "Helpers are not allowed here.
Get back to the shop."
I went back to the shop of L. H. Sohn, and they had quite a dis-
cussion over there. To make a long story short, about a week later
I was laid off. I went back to the union hall and told Mr. Troutman
I was laid off as a helper and I had the ability to work as journeyman.
Mr. Troutman signed my card as a journeyman.
That is the only time that I have talked to ]Mr. Troutman. At no
time did he ask me for any money.
The Chairman. At the time the money was returned to you, who
returned it to you ?
Mr. LisciiETT. Mr. Caldwell.
The Chairman. In your presence ?
Mr. LiscHETT. I was on the job site ; yes, sir.
The CiiAHtMAN. Did you see liim deliver it to Mr. Porter I
Mr. LiscHETT. I have the enveloj^e that he gave, sir.
The Chairman. Do you still luive it ?
IMPROPER ACTIVITIES IN THE LABOR FIELD 15901
Mr. LiscHETT. Yes, sir.
The Chairman. Do you have it with you (
Mr. LiscHETT. No, sir.
The Chairman. How was it addressed ?
Mr. LiscHETT. Just the Acme Heating name on it and the envelope.
The Chairman. Written on there or printed ?
Mr. LiscHETT. Printed, sir.
The Chairman. Your stationery ?
Mr. LiscHETT. Yes, sir.
The Chairman. And when the envelope was returned to you, what
was in it ?
Mr. LiscHETT. At that time, sir, at that time when Mr. Caldwell
gave the envelope to Mike Porter, nothing was in it to my knowledge.
I did not count any money and neither did Mike count any money.
The Chairman. If there was only $200 in it, was that half of what
you paid ?
Mr. LiscHETT. I paid $400, sir.
The Chairman. And there was no $400 returned to you ?
Mr. LiscHETT. Xo, sir.
The Chairman. Or any other amount returned to you ?
Mr. LiscHETT. No, sir.
The Chairman. AVhere is Mr. Porter ?
Mr. LiscHETT. Mr. Porter lives in Windsor, Vt., sir.
The Chairman. He lives now in Vermont?
Mr. LiscHETT. Yes, sir.
The Chairman. I will direct the staff to immediately check on this
statement.
One of you parties is not telling the truth. That is perfectly
obvious.
Mr. Cohen. Senator McClellan, I believe under your rules we are
permitted to suggest a question for cross-examination to another
witness ?
The Chairman. You are permitted to ask a question.
Mr. Cohen, May I ask you, sir, to pose the question to this witness :
What, if anything, was in the envelope that you received ?
The Chairman. I shall.
Was there anything in the envelope ? If so, what ?
Mr. Lischett. I did not receive "the envelope to start with. Mr.
Porter received it, and there was nothing in the envelope to my
knowledge.
The Chairman. Not anything?
Mr. Lischett. No, sir. Air.
The Chairman. Air ?
Mr. Lischett. That is right.
The Chairman. Nothing else?
Mr, Lischett. That is right, sir.
Senator Kennedy. Why would Mr. Caldwell return an empty enve-
lope 5 weeks later when the transaction was in confidence between you
and he?
Mr. Lischett. I don't know, sir. All I know is that Mr. Caldwell
and Mike Porter at that time had quite a heated discussion in this
house.
21243 O— 5.9— pt. 42 11
15902 IMPROPER ACTIVITIES IN THE LABOR FIELD
Senator Kennedy. Did you inform the members of the staff that
you had received this envelope back previous to your testimony?
Mr. LiscHETT. I told the committee that I had an envelope.
Senator Kennedy. You informed the staff* that Mike Porter had
received this envelope back ?
Mr. LiscHETT. Mike Porter.
Senator Kennedy. You don't know whether there was any monej'
in it or not ; is that correct ?
Mr. Lischett. No, sir.
Senator Kennedy. You are not ready to say that you know that it
was empty. You just are saying that you don't know whether it had
money or not ?
Mr. Lischett. I know that Mike Porter and I didn't count on any
money, because as far as my knowledge goes, there was no money in it.
Senator Kennedy. Did you look ?
Mr. Lischett. When Mike gave me the envelope, the envelope was
empty.
Senator Kennedy. How long after he received it from Mr. Cald-
well did Mike give it to you ?
Mr. Lischett. I would say no longer than 4 or 5 minutes.
Senator Kennedy. Then you don't know for a fact whether it had
money or did not have money when Mr. Caldwell gave it to Mike?
Mr. Lischett. No, I don't know, sir.
Senator Kennedy. Can you give me any possible explanation as to
why, when you gave this money to Mr. Caldwell in his office at a
private transaction involving $400 in cash, why 5 weeks later he
would have that envelope with him and run into the both of you and
have an argument with you and turn over an envelope which was
empty to Mr. Porter ?
I don't understand what possible reason there could be for him to
do that.
Mr. Lischett. I can see no possible reason for liim to be at the
house to start with.
Senator Kennedy. What possible reason would he have to carry
that envelope around with him and then give an empty envelope to
Mr. Porter, your assistant ?
Mr. Lischett. I don't know, sir.
Senator Kennedy. Is it possible that what he is saying is the
truth, that he had money in it, that you gave the money and he didn't
want the money and he turned the money back to Mr. Porter to give
f o you ? Is that possible ?
Mr. Lischett. Possible ; but very improbable.
Senator Kennedy. Is it any more improbable than he could give
Mr. Porter an empty envelope ?
Mr. Lischett. I don't think so, sir.
Senator Kennedy. I don't understand this transaction. Has Mr.
Porter been asked by the staff' as to whether there was any money
there when he got the envelope ?
Mr. Langenbacher. No, sir. He is in Vermont.
The Chairman. I have instructed the staff to contact him.
Senator Kennedy. It is a strange story, first because it seems to me
Mr. Caldwell would have looked at the envelope.
Was the envelope given to you or to a girl in the office ?
IMPROPER ACTIVITIES IN THE LABOR FIELD 15903
Mr, Caldwell. Given to the girl at the switchboard, Senator.
Senator Kennedy. Is that correct ?
Mr. LiscnETT. That is correct.
Senator Kennedy. I think we would have to wait on what Mr.
Porter stated was in the envelope when it was given to him.
To the best of your knowledge, he told you there was nothing in the
envelope ?
Mr. LiscHETT. That is correct. I have the envelope at the shop
someplace. In fact, I was looking for it when the investigator was
there.
Senator Kennedy. There still is a basic discrepancy between your
story or Mr. Porter's story and Mr. Caldwell's. On the other hand,
I don't see a logical explanation for Mr. Caldwell to turn the envelope
over to Mr. Porter unless there was something in it.
Mr. Caldwell. I didn't even know Mr. Porter.
Mr. Kennedy. What was the conversation that took place at the
time he came out ?
Mr. LiscHETT. It basically was on union dealings, about making
payoffs to the unions and different things like that. Mike Porter
was a member of the Steamfitters local for a number of years. I
was a member in good standing of our Sheet Metal local for a num-
ber of years, and we saw no reason why we should have to pay off
the union, especially in getting started.
You need all the money you can get. It just started out in a heated
discussion and that was it.
Mr. Kennedy. Did you meet Mr. Porter there?
Mr. Caldwell. I met him that day for the first time.
Mr. Kennedy. Did you have this discussion about payoffs?
Mr. Caldwell. I had no discussion with the man. I never met the
man until I walked in that house.
Mr. Kennedy. Did he say that he was going to turn this over to Mr.
Kef auver ?
Mr. Caldwell. Not a word.
Mr. Kennedy. You never had any conversation with Mr. Porter at
all?
Mr. Caldwell. That is right, sir.
Mr. Kennedy. None at all ?
Mr. Caldwell. None at all.
Mr. Kennedy. You say Mr. Porter did discuss this ?
Mr. LiscHETT. That is right.
Mr. Caldwell. The only man I talked to was Mr. Lischett.
Mr. Kennedy. How did you know he was there ?
Mr. Caldwell. There were two men in the house.
Mr. Kennedy. Did you meet Mr. Porter ?
Mr. Caldwell. I met him for the first time.
Mr. Kennedy. What conversation did you have with him?
Mr. Caldwell. I had none with him because he was a steamfitter
and didn't come under my jurisdiction.
Mr. Kennedy. He didn't say anything to you ^
Mr. Caldwell. No, sir.
Mr. Kennedy. Where did you meet him ?
Mr. Caldwell. Mr. Porter^ At the house where they were work-
ing.
15904 IMPROPER ACTIVITIES IN THE LABOR FIELD
Mr. Kennedy. Inside the house or outside i
Mr. Caldwell. Inside the house.
Mr. Kennedy. There was never any discussion about labor union
officials shaking down employers ?
Mr. Caldwell. Not a thing.
Mr. Kennedy. You say there was ?
Mr. LiscHETT. Absolutely.
Mr. Kennedy. How long were you out there with Mr. Porter and
this gentleman ?
Mr. CALD^VELL. I would say I was there for 15 minutes.
Mr. Kennedy. Why were you there for 15 minutes ?
Mr. Caldwell. We were just talking about business and the job
they were doing.
Mr. Kennedy. I thought you just returned the envelope to them
and said, "Here is your money back,'' and he didn't say anything.
Mr. Caldwell. I did that. He didn't say nothing. I gave the
envelope to Mr. Lischett.
Mr. Kennedy. Then you left ?
Mr. Caldwell. Then I left.
Mr. Kennedy. Where did the rest of the 141/2 minutes go ?
Mr. Caldwell. When I went in there I handed Mr. Lischett the
envelope and told him that he had come down to my office and handed
it to the girl, and I didn't know what it was for.
Mr. Kennedy. Right.
Mr. Caldwell. Mr. Lischett took the envelope, took the money
out of it and put it in his pocket and said no more about it. Then I
talked about the job that they were doing, and I left.
It might have been 10 minutes; it might have been 12 minutes. I
don't know the exact time.
Mr. Kennedy. And you talked to Mr. Lischett about the job?
Mr. Caldwell. Mr. Lischett ; and I met Mr. Porter.
Mr. Kennedy. But you didn't have any conversation ?
Mr. Caldwell. No conversation.
Mr. Kennedy. That was just about generally the work out there ?
Mr. Caldwt:ll. That is right.
Mr. Kennedy. If somebody had just tried to bribe you with $200,
why did you carry on this conversation with him about general busi-
ness conditions ?
Mr. Caldwell. Well, after all, he was one of ray contacts.
Mr. Kennedy. Weren't you outraged that he tried to bribe you ?
Mr. Caldwell. I was.
Mr. Kennedy. AVhy did you have a conversation with him ?
Mr. Caldwell. Well, that is an everyday occurrence.
Mr. Kennedy. Bribing?
Mr. Caldwell. No ; having a conversation with a contractor.
The Chairman. Have you ever had this experience before, that
somebody came in and left $800 or $400 on your desk ?
Mr. Caldwell. Never did.
The Chairman. That was an unusual thing, too, was it not ?
Mr. Caldwell. To have him leave it there ?
The (^H airman. I mean this money being left there for you.
Mr. Caldwell. It was very unusual. I don't know what it was all
about.
IMPROPER ACTIVITIES IN THE LABOR FIELD 15905
The Chairman. Have you ever had that experience before ?
Mr. Caldwell. No, sir.
The Chairman. Have you, Mr. Troutman ?
Mr. Troutman. Never.
The Chairman. You never had such an experience before ?
Mr. Troutman. Never.
The Chairman. Then it would be a most unusual thing.
Mr. Calda\t:ll. It was unusual.
The Chairman. How can you account for a man walking in there
and laying down $200 ?
Mr. Caldwell. I couldn't account for it.
The Chairman. You can't account for it now ?
Mr. Caldwell. No, sir.
The Chairman. That is a strange thing.
Can you give an accounting for it, other than what you have given ?
Mr. Lischett. No, sir.
The Chairman. The accounting you have given you swear is
correct ?
Mr. Lischett. I do, sir.
Mr. Kennedy. And that was in order for you to start business?
Mr. Lischett. In order for me to do new construction, sir.
Mr. Kennedy. He told you that he wanted the $400 prior to that
time?
Mr. Lischett. That is corre<:'t.
Mr. Kennedy. And you paid the $400 at his request ?
Mr. Lischett. That is correct.
Mr. Kennedy. You are directly contradicting in your testimony on
this point?
Mr. Lischett. I am contradicting Mr. Caldwell.
Senator Kennedy. Did you say that you gave the envelope to Mr.
Lischett ?
Mr. Caldwell. Yes, sir.
Senator Kennedy. Mr. Lischett, did you say that he gave the en-
velope to Mike Porter ?
Mr. Lischett. That is correct.
Senator Kennedy. He didn't hand it to you '.
Mr. Lischett. No, sir.
Senator Kennedy. He stated that you opened the envelope and
put the money in your pocket. You state that he gave it to Mr. Por-
ter, and Mr. Porter held it for 4 or 5 minutes and then showed it to
you, and at that time it was empty ?
Mr. Lischett. That is correct.
Senator Kennedy. It seems to me that Mr. Porter is a witness to
this thing very clearly and should be able to settle this matter.
Mr. Kennedy. Wliat is Mr. Porter's firet name ?
Mr. Lischett. Melvin.
Mr. Kennedy. We have also liad testimony of Mr. Moore, Mr.
Chairman, and I Avould like to have him come forward. AVe had
testimony that he paid.
The Chairman. Come forward, Mr. Moore.
You will remain under your same oath.
Proceed, Mr. Kennedy.
15906 IMPROPER ACTIVITIES IN THE LABOR FIELD
Mr. Kennedy. Mr. Moore, did you in fact pay Mr. Caldwell $300
at one time and $150 at another time ?
Mr. Moore. We paid $300 for the original shop when we started
out, and then the other time I paid $150.
Mr. Kennedy. That was paid to Mr. Caldwell ?
Mr. Moore. Yes, sir.
Mr. Kennedy. It was put down on the bench and he was the one
that was in the room ; is that correct ?
Mr. MooRE. The first time.
Mr. Kennedy. And he requested that you pay the money ; is that
right?
Mr. Moore. Yes, sir.
Mr. Kennedy. Is this correct, Mr. Caldwell ?
Mr. Caldwell. No, sir ; it is not correct.
Mr. Kennedy. And the $150, the second payment that you made,
was that requested by Mr, Caldwell ?
Mr. MooRE. Yes, sir.
Mr. Kennedy. And you paid him the money at that time?
Mr. MooRE. I took that down to the hall,
Mr. Kennedy. And put it on a table ?
Mr. Moore. On a desk.
Mr. Kennedy. And he was present ? He told you to put the money
there ?
Mr. Moore. Well, they was in the hall.
Mr, Kennedy. And he told you to put tlie money there?
Mr. MooRE. Yes, sir.
Mr. Kennedy. And he told you to bring the money down to the
union headquarters ?
Mr. Moore. Yes, sir.
Mr. Kennedy. Is that correct, Mr. Caldwell ?
Mr. Caldwell. Incorrect.
Mr. Kennedy. You never received any money at all from Mr.
Moore ?
Mr. Caldwell. None whatever.
Mr. Kennedy. Did you ever receive any money or anything of value
directly or indirectly from any contractor ?
Mr. Caldwell. Nothing outside a fruitcake, a basket of fruit, or a
bottle of whisky at Christmas.
Mr. Kennedy. Anything worth more than $50 ?
Mr. Caldw^ell. No, sir.
Mr. Kennedy. Did you ever receive anything of value worth more
than $50 directly or indirectly from any contractor ?
Mr. Caldwell. No, sir.
Mr. Kennedy. Did you ever receive anything of value worth more
than $50 directly or indirectly ?
Ml'. Troitman. I don't believe so, Mr. Kennedy.
Mr. Kennedy. What do you mean you don't think so i
Mr. Troitman. Well, I don't know the value of some of these
things, a couple of bottles of whisky. It might be $2 a bottle or — I
am not a judge of whisky,
Mr, Kennedy. Other than the two bottles of whisky, did you ever
receive anything of value from any contractor, directly or indirectly?
Mr, Troitman, No, Cigarettesor baskets of fruits.
IMPROPER ACTIVITIES IN THE LABOR FIELD 15907
Mr. Kennedy. That is not above $50 ?
Mr. Troutman. No, sir.
Mr. Kennedy. So you never received anything of value directly
or indirectly from any contractor ?
Mr. Troutman. That is right.
Mr. Kennedy. Could we call Mr. Wells, Mr. Chairman ?
The Chairman. Mr. Wells, come forward, please.
You will remain under the same oath.
Proceed, Mr. Kennedy.
Mr. Kennedy. You have testified here under oath about the pay-
ments to Mr. Caldwell of $150 and then $200 and $400.
Mr. Wells. Yes, sir.
Mr. Kennedy. You did make those payments to him ?
Mr. Wells. Yes, sir.
Mr. Kennedy. You gave it to him in cash ?
Mr. Wells. Yes, sir.
Mr. Kennedy. And he requested the money from you ?
Mr. Wells. Yes, sir.
Mr. Kennedy. Did you make those payments ?
Mr. Caldwell. I didn't receive the money.
Mr. Kennedy. Did you ever request the money from him ?
Mr. Caldwell. No, sir.
Mr. Kennedy. So this testimony of Mr. Wells is inaccurate, untrue ?
Mr. Caldwell. Yes, sir.
Mr. Kennedy. Is the testimony of Mr. Caldwell that he denies that
he requested the payments and denies that he received the payments
inaccurate and untrue, Mr. Wells?
Mr. Wells. Would you repeat that, please?
Mr. Kennedy. Is the testimony of Mr. Caldwell when he denies
that he received the payments from you inaccurate and untrue?
Mr. Wells. Yes. It is untrue.
The Chairman. Is there anything further?
If not, thank you very much.
Is there anything of these other witnesses ?
Mr. Ken:;edy. Not now, Mr. Chairman. We might have Mr. Cald-
well stand b}'.
The Chairman. You will not need the other witness?
Mr. Kennedy. I don't think so.
The Chairman. I think, Mr. Troutman, you may be excused from
further attendance at this time.
Mr. Caldwell, it may be well for you to remain over until tomorrow.
There may be some further testimony that you will be confronted
with.
Mr. Troutman. Thank you.
Mr. Caldw^ell. Thank you.
Mr. Cohen. Senator, at what time tomorrow do you wish Mr. Cald-
well to return ?
The Chairman. When we recess, it will be until 10:30 in the
morning.
Mr. Cohen. Are the other witnesses excused at this time?
The Chairman, (^ounsel suggested we get started at 10 o'clock.
That will be all right with me, so the recess will be until 10 o'clock in
the morning.
15908 IMPROPER ACTIVITIES IN THE LABOR FIELD
Mr. Cohen. I wanted to ask whether the witnesses Kaberlein,
Howard, Cronin, would also be requested to return tomorrow or
whether they are excused at this time until further notice.
The Chairman. I believe they can be excused.
Will you need them ?
Mr. Kennedy. No, as long as we have the understanding to contact
Mr. Cohen.
The Chairman. May I say with respect to the -witnesses you have
represented, Mr. Cohen, do I understand that if further testimony is
needed, you will be responsible for seeing that they return without
further subpena ?
Mr. Cohen. I think I arranged for their appearance thus far.
The Chairman. If there is any question I want to call them up here
now and put them under recognizance to reappear.
Mr. Cohen. You mean you are holding the same subpena in effect.
Senator ?
The Chairman. That is right.
Mr. Cohen. They will be given their travel allowance, and so
forth?
The Chairman. Yes. There is no question about that. If you
accept recognizance for them to reappear at such time as the com-
mittee may desire, if it does, further testimony from them without
being subpenaed, resubpenaed, they will remain under their present
subpena, they will be given reasonable notice of the time and place
where this committee desires to hear them. In all probability, that
place will be right here.
Mr. Cohen. I wall rely on your sense of fairness as to what is rea-
sonable notice, and we will be guided accordingly.
The Chairman. And you will be responsible for their presence, as
their counsel.
Mr. Cohen. Within the reach of my ability, yes, sir.
The Chairman. All right. Call the next witness,
Mr. Kennedy. Mr. Tracy.
The Chairman. Do you solemnly swear that the evidence you shall
give before this Senate select committee shall be the truth, the whole
truth, and nothing but the truth, so help you God ?
Mr. Tracy. I do,
TESTIMONY OF JAMES T. TRACY, ACCOMPANIED BY COUNSEL,
GEORGE F. CALLAGHAN
The Chairman. State your name, your place of residence, and your
business or occupation.
Mr. Tracy. James T, Tracy, 1642 Uland Avenue, Chicago, 111., sec-
retary-treasurer of the Sheet Metal Workers International Union,
Local 73.
The Chairman, You have counsel, Mr, Tracy ?
Mr, Tracy, Yes ; I do.
The Chairman. Will you identify yourself, Mr. Counsel ?
Mr, Callaghan. George F. (^allaghan, 105 West Adams, Chicago,
member of the Illinois bar.
Mr. Kennedy. How long have you been with the Sheet Metal
Workers ?
IMPROPER ACTIVITIES IN THE LABOR FIELD 15909
Mr. Tracy. I was with the Sheet Metal Workers, Local 159, from
1929 to 1944, when the amalgamated local 159 was 73, and I have been
with them since. I have been secretary-treasurer of the union since
1948.
Mr. Kennedy. How long have you been secretary -treasurer ?
Mr. Tr.\cy. Since 1948.
Mr. Kennedy. Since 1948?
Mr. Tracy. Yes, sir.
Mr. Kennedy. You received $350 a week salary ?
Mr. Tracy. $18,200 a year; yes, sir.
Mr. Kennedy. And $258 a month expense allowance ?
Mr. Tracy. No ; I received $3,100 in expense account.
Mr. Kennedy. Have you had any other source of income since 1950
other than your Sheet Metal Workers ?
Mr. Tracy. Yes ; I have.
Mr. Kennedy. "What has that been ?
Mr. Tracy. Well, I get expenses from the Sheet Metal Workers
International Union, if I am sent on conventions or to meetings, and
I have some stock, and I was president of a building company.
Mr. Kennedy. ^Yhat was the building company ?
Mr. Tracy. Kern- Weber Corp.
Mr. Kennedy. What is that ?
Mr. Tracy. Kern & Weber Corp.
Mr. Kennedy. Beyond that, have you had any other source of
income ?
Mr. Tracy. Just from my stock.
Mr. Kennedy. What was the stock in ; stock in what companies ?
Mr. Tracy. The Able Co.
Mr. Kennedy. A^Hiat kind of a company is that ?
Mr. Tracy. A sign-erecting company.
Mr. Kennedy. Is that in Chicago ?
Mr. Tracy. Yes, sir.
Mr. Kennedy. Any other company ?
Mr. Tracy. No, sir.
Mr. Kennedy. Now, have you heard of the practice of requiring
contractors to pay a certain amount of money in order to open up a
union shop ?
Mr. Tracy. No ; I haven't.
Mr. Kennedy. Have you ever received any money from any con-
tractors, directly or indirectly, yourself ?
Mr. Tracy. No, sir ; I haven't.
Mr. Kennedy. You have not ?
Mr. Tracy. No, sir.
Mr. Kennedy. Do you know of any of your fellow union officials
who have received any money directly or indirectly from any such
shop?
Mr. Tracy. No, sir.
Mr. Kennedy. Have you received anything of value directly or in-
directly — and when I speak of value, I mean more than $50 — directly
or indirectly from any contractor ?
Mr. Tracy. No, sir ; I have not.
Mr. Kennedy. Do you have your records available ?
Mr. Tracy. Yes ; I do.
15910 IMPROPER ACTIVITIES IN THE LABOR FIELD
Mr. Kennedy. Could you make those available to the committee?
Mr. Tracy. Yes; I will.
Mr. Kennedy. Do you want to turn tliem over i
Mr. Tracy. Yes.
The Chairman. You were served witli a subpena for these records,
were you ?
Mr. Tracy. Yes, sir; I was.
The Chairman. Have you complied with the subpena by delivering
all of the records and by bringing all of the records here ?
Mr. Tracy. Yes, sir; I have.
The Chairman. All of the records called for by the subpena ?
Mr. Tracy. Well, I am short some checks, of 1954 and 1955 and
1956, that the Internal Revenue just has gotten through going over
those years with me, and we have been housecleaning and I don't
know whether the records of the checks are there, but the bank state-
ments are there, and I don't know whether they are in my home or
office, but I think that I will try to find them.
Tlie Chairman. You have complied as fully as you could or have
been able to up to date ?
Mr. Tracy. That is right, sir.
The Chairman. There are some missing that you may be able to
find?
Mr. Tracy. That is right ; they are canceled checks.
The Chairman, There are some canceled checks ?
Mr. Tracy. That is right.
The Chairman. Is that all that is missing, as far as you know ?
Mr. Tracy. That is right ; as far as I know.
The Chairman. All right. You may deliver to a member of the
staff, or the clerk of the committee may receive the documents and the
records.
Mr. Callaghan. He would like to have a receipt for the docu-
ments.
The Chairman. You will get a receipt. We will prepare a receipt
for them.
Mr. Kennedy. That will be all for Mr. Tracy until we have had an
opportunity to examine the records.
The Chairman. You may stand aside, and we will arrange with
the clerk and the clerk will give you a receipt for the records.
Mr. Callaghan. May we be excused? We will stand, subject to
reasonable notice, of course.
The Chairman. All right, under the present subpena, subject to
call at such time as the committee may need further testimony from
you, Mr. Tracy.
Is there anything further this afternoon ?
Mr. Kennedy. That is all, Mr. Chairman.
The Chairman. The Chair may announce that subject to one or
two other witnesses whom we will try to procure, whose testimony we
will try to get in connection with this matter of shakedown and
racketeering in connection with the Sheet Metal Workers Union, along
the lines of the testimony that has been developed here — subject to
getting these witnesses available and getting tlieir testimony, this will
conclude that phase of this series of hearings.
IMPROPER ACTIVITIES IN THE LABOR FIELD 15911
The Chair has previously observed in the course of the taking of
the testimony that there is considerable evidence or testimony of wit-
nesses before the committee in this particular series of hearings that
is in irreconcilable conflict. There is no way to reconcile it and find
the truth. There is no way to accept it as being honest differences of
opinion, and there is definitely willful perjury present before this
committee, having been committed by some of the witnesses who have
testified.
The committee has no power to prosecute or to enforce the laws
against perjury or any other crime. For that reason, as we have here-
tofore stated this complete record will go to the Justice Department,
because those who have imposed upon this committee and upon their
Government by coming here and willfully perjuring themselves, belong
in the penitentiary, and I hope that will be the end result, and the
fruits of the labors of the Justice Department, who has the respon-
sibility for pursuing it and to the end that justice may be meted out
to those who are guilty.
Are there any further statements?
Of course, it goes without saying that as counsel has suggested to
me, this practice we find from evidence before the committee is going
on, this shakedown and this paying for the privilege of working, and
paying for the privilege of operating a business or buying what we
call labor peace, this is not the only instance of it. We have had
others.
It is an outrageous situation, and it is un-American, and it should
not prevail or be permitted to exist in any decent society anywhere.
It is a parasite upon the economy of this country. There is hardly
anything that you could say about it that could be restrained.
i am hopeful that not only the Justice Depaitment will be able to
perform with effective results, but I am also hopeful that the Congress
of the United States will meet its responsibility by the enactment of
legislation, not union-busting legislation, but racketeer and gangster
and hoodlum and thug and crook and criminal busting legislation.
These practices, these evil practices, and these improper activities
that we have discovered prevail in some areas must be stopped. If the
Congress fails to enact such legislation, in my judgment it will be
seriously derelict in its responsibility, and the whole country will
suffer as a result of its failure, and lack of courage to meet its respon-
sibility, and I hope all good citizens in this country will support the
effort that will be made to get legislation to deal with these elements
that are not only unwholesome, but are criminal, not only in intent,
but in their purposes and in their activities.
The committee will stand in recess until 10 o'clock in the morning.
(Thereupon, at 4 p.m., the committee recessed, to reconvene at 10
a.m., Thursday, December 4, 1958.)
APPENDIX
Exhibit No. 1A
The C oleman C ompan y. I nc
W r-H.TA 1, Kansas
;952
•ji;'-s t. iotinson, . e 'o-i i Vic IresiiiPT
• t JT-nt'il ; Hi no 1 6 :;-ili->nal .iank aai
.a th:it *:!:n>-, - .
of .laflfi. ^.in;e n" lid not w ;
f>er«or. while :n *rar.3it, w^ ■ir'^
- :r bank ir.
■ hl!s 'ijv^n
•0,1
^la.
T. ion/. .
s oosigned •
:1entifi --at!
he
-:0
^rte<
ies
«xt
end«d to Mr.
SliT-erely,
/ oecretar:-'
A. \yr<-/t\.
15914 IMPROPER ACTIVITIES IN THE LABOR FIELD
Exhibit No. IB
IMPROPER ACTIVITIES IN THE LABOR FIELD 15915
Exhibit No. IC
r CHECK REQUISITION
;^ ^^f^^!,..^.^^ lyi^^_i^« <'-t- -^"^ ' *^i.
:/'r'^
eXP€NS£ OiSfHiBUTiON
!-T?fiiT
;'tf
"4
'f/v,^^ y^
15916 IMPROPER ACTIVITIES IN THE LABOR FIELD
Exhibit No. 2A
Tiie c olemaa Company. I nc.
■lOUSCI-IOLO APPI.IANCCS FOM nCATiKO
ClOMTiNO. COOKINO. ANO IWONIMO
SALES Of 'ICtS
J J. A. OVf
Wichita 1, Kanbab
15 January 1953
hnson. Second
injnois Nati.
1 r
V.
a!
1 : •■:: t : c : :rr.
ted the check,
• ■. another o.'; _ _
, again introd^
s Manager of t--
comj-a;-.
- A..; be in your city Ln the n^.'V i-». .. s n.^^, ai • .
I .-f.g»nt our check ^179^ payable to hi^ it-awn on your bttj^
;nt cf $5,000. We ask that you cash th::9 che:k for hie .p
jn presentation.
You will note that Mr. Burrows has countersigned ••
writer - this should give you additional Identif;
Thank you To- the courtesies extended to Mr. Burrowa.
'J. A. Dye/bh
Cordially,
Secretary
^^
IMPROPER ACTIVITIES IN THE LABOR FIELD
Exhibit No. 2B
15917
:!
^
a
E
oi
O
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o
o
O
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8
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j w i O ■ ..
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4^
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.
21243 O— 59— pt. 42-
-12
15918 IMPROPER ACTIVITIES IN THE LABOR FIELD
Exhibit No. 2C
1
! 8
IMPROPER ACTIVITIES IN THE LABOR FIELD
Exhibit No. 3A
•CNiaii. orr
TJl5 C oleman CfiJnPLiny, |n£.
LlOMTINa. COOKINO. ANO lltONINO
15919
WlCHfTA 1, KanBAB
IS JuM 1953
J«M«« P» Johnaon, Se^oni Vice President
Continent*! Illin' •'. Bank and Trust Company
Chirtigp, Illinois
Hear Mr. Jchriaon:
This l<»tter will introduce Mr. Louis M. Marks, Sales Manager, Major
Appliance Division, of this coap&nj. Tou ■a<1<> the acquaintance nf
Mr. Marks In Jajiuary, l'?5'', when he was in your bank with our Mr.
C, L. Burrows, Vice President in Chargs of Sales. Mr. Burrows, at
that liae, presented a check lo you and ihtained a sizeable a»ount,
of cash.
Mr. Marks will be in your ':ity in the next few days and at that tis
will present to yo»J, or one of your associates, our chsck #21, 92,
dated June 18, payable to you- bank. In the «j»eant of $5tOOO« Ite
ask that you -ash this check for Mr. Marks upon pr>*sentation.
Should you ieslre additional identification or .nformation at the
time Mr. Marks presents the check for payment' oleasa caJLl •• or
Mr. C. B. Kuhn.
Thank you for the courtasiva axtsndad to Mr. Marks.
Sincerely,
J. t. t>yeA>ii
' ./^ ^ K
Asalatant Secretary 4
iaalataat Treaaarar
y^
15920 IMPROPER ACTIVITIES IN THE LABOR FIELD
Exhibit No. 3B
• «» •
■<-?»•»
>#<
■ o •
«»» « o
V « »
- <
o < X
6^
IMPROPER ACTIVITIES IN THE LABOR FIELD 15921
Exhibit No. 3C
15922
IMPROI
'ER ACTIVITIES
IN THE LABOR
FIELD
Exhibit No. 4A
The
Coleman
Comoany.
Inc.
-., O *.PP1.IA»
Wichita 1
■4Ct% FOB -t*Ti^ ■.
KANBAa
.K; Dece«b«r 1953
r
1
'2, pays'-:-
' rs wni'n y<>i. r;;s , -
i-s, National :">!iios *-
: 'ago scwwt '.rcf .i'' • :
sion the a'
' Mr. M*rk;> ,
•session a --i. .,.
(5 th*t he *;^n th»
3ince.-«;y,
Kre of Louis M. Karko)
^
IMPROPER ACTIVITIES IN THE LABOR FIELD 15923
Exhibit No. 4B
15924 IMPROPER ACTIVITIES IN THE LABOR FIELD
Exhibit No. 4C
i
\
h- J: K
CO ij
a V
o ^
^ ^ Cm
r r ri ? r t ^ ■
*-^
5 3
Li.lJi
IMPROPER ACTIVITIES IN THE LABOR FIELD 15925
Exhibit No. 5 A
WWMrr* 1. HAMMS
Jun. 10, 19V»
"^^^U-V^^-o
Mr. Jumn P. Johnson
ContinMiUl Illinois IUtlona.1 B*nk
•nd TruBt Ccm^pvxy of Chlc*go
231 South La Sail* Stp««l
Chlo««o 90, Illinois
Oo*r Jlat
I vt sirinc Lou Kvics « ch*ck in Ut* smount ^f !5,>X pAj-vbls to
th* Contin«nt4d. Illinois M*tioa^ B«nk *n<1 Trust CoBqp4n7 of ChlcAfo.
This Is tha <1««1 thst ws tundlod with /ou b«ror« wvi Lou will nsod
to g«t ths cash in sxehuics f»r this chsek . I bsllsve /ou Ar«
AO^uAlntcd vlt.h his now tat, norsrtholass, I will h«s« hia plaoe his
•l^naturs or his zopy of ths Lstt«r and I will spprovs ths s«as with
Mf slgastur* so that yrxt will know Utal ih« signature 1« (•nulas
when hs fsts this vonsj frosi jrou.
ntanks, J\m, for tAKlnc 9*r* of this for us. Just whon Lo>i will bs
in Chic«^ and will drop lo to so* yvu. I do not xnow for surs but
I think It wlU bs soaatlJM nwct wMk.
31noorsl/,
C. I. Kuhn
■iiU
Mt Rr. L. H. IterksA-
^glpfg^J::^
1h« aboTs is ths fsoulns si^m tT i
of L. K. Karics
SAfis
j^^^^^^^^^f-r'i
COPY
%^
15926 IMPROPER ACTIVITIES IN THE LABOR FIELD
Exhibit No. 5B
IMPROPER ACTIVITIES IN THE LABOR FIELD 15927
Exhibit No. 5C
15928 IMPROPER ACTIVITIES IN THE LABOR FIELD
Exhibit No. 6A
Coleman Company, \n£, {/ "^ "^
B^tna^t. 6rrict>
MOUStMOCD A»Pl.lAHCt« »^0» HBATINO ,. ,,
LICHTIMO COOKINO. AND IMOMINO , ., .n
PSS:
-
J. A. OVK
Wichita ), Kansa*
: December 1954
■',01'
[)fH'- M"-:
Th . L. 3urrows, vl . .
t,f .., I :!.»?, will be in netd
of a siz^a':' ssjed our Check «^v6'i,
dated Dftc»»m(.-- jnoi:nt of J5,OCIO. Mr.
letXfr, vfiT hf- '^Ijs upon you.
I ■. ■
ish, 1 ahouid
a' : on , Y,': s, ^' '?r
owe since he visited
. . — , .^.., ... v.... .... , ...,.....-- i sizeaole aaoujit of
iTPntlon, also, that :n case you n»«d signature ident.*"'-
.;it I'-e is on file at ycur bank.
Th;.
•sies extended to Mr. Burrows.
Cordially,
C^ ^ ^ ^ ^
/bh
Janes A. Dye
Assistant Secretary
IMPROPER ACTIVITIES IN THE LABOR FIELD
Exhibit No. 6B
15929
15930 IMPROPER ACTIVITIES IN THE LABOR FIELD
Exhibit No. 6C
IMPROPER ACTIVITIES IN THE LABOR FIELD 15931
Exhibit No. 7 A
15932 IMPROPER ACTIVITIES IN THE LABOR FIELD
Exhibit No. 7B
IIOMK <;AK CXI.
Ottotmr U» 1954
Th« CoImmi Oo., lae*
Omur Mr. Bwrovit
Im nplgr to rour Ivtvvr of October 9Uu T^« n«» And addrMS
of tho Lm«1 UnlOA biitloiM «^i:«nt i», John 'rndfr^M, e/o
Cmitral Labor 'To^neil, ?nj\* ^OAg, irtn* i-mat, rofotu
Tooro trulj.
"^oho S
Bokahas
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IMPROPER ACTIVITIES IN THE LABOR FIELD 15933
Exhibit No. 7C'
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y
Hmwf Mr. l«k«lM«i
lav fww l«M«r of Oct«k«r 14 r«gar4lBf f»w« ObImi probUm. Thit
•f Mag •MMMtHWS rafwira* - Ucti« Uom »•>(>• caa r«»(Ui> aad«r»ta»<l;
ivar* 1 vttl atart ckacldai latj th« n»«ti«r iroin«<liat«ly avl wi'.i ^c: in
taacli wlHb foa aa ••an aa I kav« aAytv.iig af a coacr«i« nature lo rii>ort.
Y jar» v«ry tr^iy,
Tli£ COUbMAN COMPANY. INC.
c. u
21243 O — 59— 4)t. 42' -1.3
15934 IMPROPER ACTIVITIES IN THE LABOR FIELD
Exhibit No. 8A
Decmber 2A, 1994.
Mr. Carl Burrows,
Colenan Company,
Wlehlta, Kansas.
Dear Sir,
On '^center 21, i.-.-., ai the LaJalle hotel In
Chicago, you handed ne an envelope together with sooe
corresnonden-c fror. a flr^tnts Pass, Oregon flna and sug-
^stGi that I examine the letter emd the contents of the
envelope at ra:/ leisure.
When tlmr riermltt*- : I read the correspondience
you handed mo ^nJ ecunlned the ccntonts of the envelope.
Tt wr.:: then that I :lsc -)vero '. that you handed ae $5000.00.
Had I t3"i0wn ifhr.* *' • ■ "-c ccntalnod when T- was with
you I would hav it to you unopened.
.3 T.oncy under -ire; clr^:u.'nstances
.'l-v herewith n cashiers checJc In
ti.^ .i.-.oj:;i :r .'. ~-;."„ .^overlnf the above, I a-^ retaining?
In T' r'os-55rlor: the'corrosponden-;e vou fmvr ne fro.T. the
V-T^' Truly Yrurs,
. . . :rn\'
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IMPROPER ACTIVITIES IN THE LABOR FIELD 15935
Exhibit No. 8B
.'J-'Pt-^-i ,1^54.
It ha.'; ; "'n tut unlersl-ir. lir that Coleaan Pre-
f-itjrlc^t'! 1 MKt syst-'rnr ir': ^Tinufactured by Union
laror -m ! tr:at It nar r",'on r^flnltely e3tabllshe(3
that th^^-- nynt 'T? io not n. luiro sheet aetal worKers
to -nri/.f th-^ Insfillatlcms.
our l.xj'il Union has Dc»«n civin)? us a bit of tr<xtf)le
ty Insl.Ttla' that ire use their Union sheet aetal warker*
on al 1 ."'ur .' .tcri,
Kill yju n^easo rive us all the facts regarding tftts
na'l'T?
ir :>o33it : , t U5 ■> H letter frora the National Union
Heai.:juart»rc .' >nf irminp same.
Yours truly,
HOME QAS coyPAJor
^•^sS^assjf
(S^JtAf **f*f J^*'^ *^ ^ f^
puxl^iu*^, *^/^'
^U # r»*o <y > 'j
.i^^mMI
IMPROPER ACTIVITIES IN THE LABOR FIELD 15937
Exhibit No. 9A
15938 IMPROPER ACTIVITIES IN THE LABOR FIELD
Exhibit No. 9B
w -'-^^f^. L<y
v.'^ ^-^^♦" -V •tVA. —
/-. '*i -J
CHICAGO, ( ^
UXINOLS.
«•! < .«••-.•.
jMMi «( •« ir«H»)
tf. O Ml »(««• i< adtffiHJt
IMPROPER ACTIVITIES IN THE LABOR FIELD 15939
Exhibit No. 9C
RETURN RECEIPT
Coimf>a*Ccj'-^^ '•*
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/«•• • • ■«►
f>.)tt Of'.rr r'?.uf;f f:»
••»« •«ir«»"nn»«t
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ILIJNOi>
15940 IMPROPER ACTIVITIES IN THE LABOR FIELD
Exhibit No. lOA
MCMMM«-«oao
Jaly 3, 1955
Mr. Carl Ihirrow*
Th* Colwawi Conpany
Viehlta, Kanaas
Oaar Mr, Burrows t
Tha vrltar apvnt • plaaaaat fa* hours tsltti
Lou Murks in Chloa<TO, Illinois l«at «aak. Va diseussa4
conditions in varloiw parts of tha eouatry ralatlva to toot
product and atraln Z would lilts to aasora you of our eooparatloa
as wa faal that tha aTraanant la of svtiaal banaflt.-
Oanaral Saaratary l iwr d F. CarlofOi^ avwgastad
that you visit our offieas In tha- Tranapoptatlon i^ilding atMn
you ara in Washin«(t<m. Fa also thoufibl^at It ail«^t ba a (rood
idaa if you could ftxmish hiis with soiaa piotoraa snd data on
the manufaetura of your fii.ttlnii(s. Ra Unou^t it sil|(ht waka
an intar<«stlnR artlola for our national Journal which Is
puMlshad nonthly. This too* would ba a irood way of lattiOK
our maoibars all ovar tha eounlry know that tha fittinors in
oonnaetton with your ihstallati<Mis carry our T^nton Labal,
Looking foward to saaim^ you in tha naar
futura and with bast alshas, X Wk
Vary truly yo t«.
CtfrCi^y^
Praaidant
AKCtala
IMPROPER ACTIVITIES IN THE LABOR FIELD 15941
Exhibit No. lOB
15942 IMPROPER ACTIVITIES IN THE LABOR FIELD
Exhibit No. 11
IMPROPER ACTIVITIES IN THE LABOR FIELD 15943
Exhibit No. 12
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'4*7^
15944 IMPROPER ACTIVITIES IN THE LABOR FIELD
Exhibit No. 13
IMPROPER ACTIVITIES IN THE LABOR FIELD 15945
F^XHIBIT No. 15
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3 9999
06352
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