(navigation image)
Home American Libraries | Canadian Libraries | Universal Library | Community Texts | Project Gutenberg | Children's Library | Biodiversity Heritage Library | Additional Collections
Search: Advanced Search
Anonymous User (login or join us)
Upload
See other formats

Full text of "The southern California district of the Communist Party, structure, objectives [and] leadership. Hearings"

Cy5Vot. :^9/ 



HARVARD COLLEGE 
LIBRARY 




GIFT OF THE 

GOVERNMENT 
OF THE UNITED STATES 



THE SOUTHERN CALIFORNIA DISTRICT 
OF THE COMMUNIST PARTY 
Structure — Objectives — Leadership 



HEARINGS 



BEFORE THE 



COMMITTEE ON UN-AMEEJCAN ACTIVITIES 
HOUSE OE EEPRESENTATIYES 



EIGHTY-FIFTH CONGRESS 

SECOND SESSION 



PART 1 

SEPTEMBER 2 AND 3, 1958 



Printt'd for the use of tlie Comuiittee on Un-Ameriean Activities 



(Index in Part 3) 




HARVARD COLLEGE LIBRARY. 

DEPOSITED BY THE 
UNITED STATES GOVERNMENT 

MAY U 1959 

UNITED STATES 
COVKKNIMBNT PRTNTTNC OFFICK] 
3S253 WASHINGTON : 1959 



COMMITTEE ON UN-AMERICAN ACTIVITIES 
United States House of Representatives 

FRANCIS E. WALTER, Pennsylvania, Chairman 
MORGAN M. MOULDER, Missouri BERNARD W. KEARNEY, New York i 

CLYDE DOYLE, California DONALD L. JACKSON, California 

EDWIN E. WILLIS, Louisiana GORDON H. SCHERER, Ohio 

WILLIAM M. TUCK, Virginia ROBERT J. McINTOSH, Michigan i 

Richard Aeens, Staff Director 

' Congressmen William E. Miller of New York and August E. Johansen of Michigan were appointed 
mcnihcrs of the committee by the 86th Congress, replacing Mr. Kearney and Mr. Mcintosh. 



CONTENTS 



IWRT 1 

September 2, 1958: Testimony of — 

Dorothy Ray Healey 18 

Afternoon session: 

Dorothy Ray Healey (resumed) 49 

Statements of Loren Miller and Al Wirin (attorneys for Don 

Wheeldin) 54 

Mary Lois Newman 55 

David Francis Arkin 58 

Thomas D. Creed 63 

Horace V. Alexander 68 

September 3, 1958: Testimony of — 

Cyril Valentine Briggs 75 

Alexander Ende 82 

Herbert Biskar 84 

Marvin Biskar 90 

Sophie Kishner 93 

Joseph Solomon 96 

Stella Choyke Biber 99 

Afternoon session: 

Joseph I. Gavron 102 

Esther Goldie Sokolow 110 

Sakae Ishihara 114 

Bernard Burton 118 

PART 2 

September 4, 1958: Testimony of — 

Harriet Blair 137 

Lorris Gosman 140 

Jane Swanhuyser 142 

Julius Kovner __ 144 

Bertha Marshall 148 

Ellie Henrickson 152 

Fay Kovner Makes 159 

Rosemary Lusher 162 

Afternoon session: 

Rosemary Lusher (resumed) 168 

Reva Mucha Zwolinski 180 

Leon Pape . 187 

Edith Weiner Pape 192 

Naomi Claire Blair _ 196 

Sophie Silver 201 

Jessie Josephson 203 

Archibald MacNair, Jr _ 205 

Charles H. Mosley, Jr 207 

Felix Padilla ._ 209 

Eli Katz 2!0 

III 



IV CONTENTS 

September 5, 1958: Testimony of— Page 

William A. Wheeler,". 213 

Jerry Atinsky 214 

Margarete Ann Byler 218 

Elizabeth Ricardo Jackson 220 

Ola Ross Pacifico 222 

Henry Sazer 224 

Vivian Vallens 227 

Leo Baefsky 230 

Estelle Parness 232 

Irving Sarnoff _ 233 

William W. Talbot 235 

PART 3 

Febniarv 24, 1959: Testimonv of— 

■ Charlene Mitchell _ _' 237 

Seymom- D. Brodsky 254 

Admiral George Dawson 255 

Eleanor Smith 258 

Clarence George Young 260 

Afternoon session: 

Helen Blair 263 

Ethel Biskar 267 

Edward M. Enfiajian L 270 

August Mavmudes 273 

Shifra Goldman 274 

Februarv 25, 1959: Testimonv of— 

' Matilda Molina Tollv 279 

Mark Robinson 282 

Delfino Varela 284 

Ben Karr 288 

Afternoon session: 

Sophie Siminoski 290 

Harry Hunt 293 

Arthur Brown 296 

Robert Klonskv 301 

Philip Rafalow'_ 304 

Solomon Monroy 306 

Index i 



Public Law 001, 79th Congress 

The legislation under which the House Committee on Un-American 
Activities operates is Public Law 601, 79th Congress [1946], chapter 
753, 2(1 session, wliich provides: 

Be it enacted by the Senate and ffnut^e of Repn-Kcnlative-'^ of the Ignited Slates 
of Ameriea in Congress assembled, * * * 

PART 2— RULES OF THE HOUSE OF REPRESENTATIVES 

Rule X 

.SKC. 121. STANDING COMMtTTKES 

18. (!ominittee on Un-American Activities, to consi.st of nine Members. 

Rule XI 

POWERS AND DUTIES OF COMMITTEES 
:ii :}; :t! :(::(: H= * 

(q) (1) Committee on Un-American Activities. 

(A) Un-American activities. 

(2) The Committee on Un-American Activities, as a whole or by subcommit- 
tee, is authorized to make from time to time investigations of (i) the extent, 
character, and objects of un-American propaganda activities in the United States, 
(ii) the diffusion within the United States of subversive and un-American propa- 
ganda that is instigated from foreign countries or of a domestic origin and attacks 
the principle of the form of government as guaranteed by our Constitution, and 
(iii) all other questions in relation thereto that would aid Congress in any necessary 
remedial legislation. 

The Committee on Un-American Activities shall report to the House (or to the 
Clerk of the House if the House is not in session) the results of any such investi- 
gation, together with such recommendations as it deems advisable. 

For the purpose of any such investigation, the Committee on Un-American 
Activities, or any subcommittee thereof, is authorized to sit and act at such 
times and places within the United States, whether or not the House is sitting, 
has recessed, or has adjourned, to hold such hearings, to require the attendance 
of such witnesses and the production of such books, papers, and documents, and 
to take such testimony, as it deems necessary. Subpenas may be issued under 
the signature of the chairman of the committee or any subcommittee, or by any 
member designated by any such chairman, and may be served by any person 
designated bj' any such chairman or member. 

Rule XII 

LEGISLATIVE OVERSIGHT BY STANDING COMMITTEES 

Sec. 136. To assist the Congress in appraising the administration of the laws 
and in developing such amendments or related legislation as it may deem neces- 
sary, each standing committee of the Senate and the House of Representatives 
shall exercise continuous watchfulness of the execution by the administrative 
agencies concerned of any laws, the subject matter of which is within the jurisdic- 
tion of such committee; and, for that purpose, shall study all pertinent re{)orts 
and data submitted to tin; Congress l)y the agencies in the executive l)r;nich of 
the (lovernment. 



RULES ADOPTED BY THE 85TH CONGRESS 

House Resolution 5, Jan nary 3, 11)57 
******* 

Rule X 

STANDING COMMITTEES 

1. There shall be elected by the House, at the commencement of each Con- 
gress, 

******* 

((j) Committee on Un-American Activities, to consist of nine Members. 

******* 

Rule XI 

POWERS AND DUTIES OF COMMITTEES 

18. C!ommittee on Un-American Activities. 

(a) Un-American activities. 

(b) The Committee on Un-American Activities, as a whole or by subcommittee, 
is authorized to make from time to time investigations of (1) the extent, char- 
acter, and objects' of un-American propaganda activities in the United States, 
(2) the diffusion within the United States of subversive and un-American prop- 
aganda that is instigated from foreign countries or of a domestic origin and 
attacks the principle of the form of government as guaranteed by our Constitu- 
tion, and (3) all other cjuestions in relation thereto that would aid Congress 
in any necessary remedial legislation. 

The Committee on Un-American Activities shall report to the House (or to the 
Clerk of the House if the House is not in session) the results of any such investi- 
gation, together with such recommendations as it deems advi.sable. 

For the purpose of any such investigation, the Committee on Un-American 
Activities, or any subcommittee thereof, is authorized to sit and act at such times 
and places within the United States, whether or not the House is sitting, has 
recessed, or has adjourned, to hold such hearings, to require the attendance 
of such witnesses and the production of such books, papers, and documents, and 
to take such testimony, as it deems necessary. Subpenas may be issued under 
the signature of the chairman of the committee or any subcommittee, or by any 
member designated by any such chairman, and may be served by any person 
designated by any such chairman or member. 

2G. To assist the House in appraising the administration of the laws and in 
developing such amendments or related legislation as it may deem necessary, 
each standing committee of the House shall exercise continuous watchfulness 
of the execution by the administrative agencies concerned of any laws, the subject 
matter of which is within the jurisdiction of such committee; and, for that 
purpose, shall study all pertinent reports and data submitted to the House by 
the agencies in the executive branch of the Government. 



THE SOUTHERN CALIFORNIA DISTRICT OF THE 
COMMUNIST PARTY 

Structure — Objectives — Leadership 
(Part 1) 



TUESDAY, SEPTEMBEB 2, 1958 

United States House of Representatives, 

Subcommittee of the 
Committee on Un-American Activities, 

Los Angeles^ Calif. 
executive session ^ 

The subcommittee met, pursuant to call, at 10 a.m., in room 229, 
Federal Building, Los Angeles, Calif., Hon. Francis E. Walter (chair- 
man) presiding. 

Present: Representatives Francis E. Walter, of Pennsylvania, and 
William M. Tuck, of Virginia. 

Staff members present : Frank S. Tavenner, Jr., counsel, and AVil- 
liam A. "WHieeler, investigator. 

The Chairman. Will you raise your right hand? Will you swear 
the testimony you are about to give will be the truth, the wliole truth, 
and nothing but the truth, so help you God ? 

Mrs. Healey. I do. 

The Chairman. The committee will come to order. 

This hearing is autliorized by the following resolution of the Com- 
mittee on Un-American Activities, House of Representatives: 

Be it resolved, That a hearing by the Committee ou Uu-Ameriean Activities, 
or a subcommittee thereof, to be lield in. Los Angeles, Calif., or at such other 
place or places as the chairman may designate, on such date or dates as the 
chairman may determine, be authorized and approved, including the conduct of 
investigations deemed reasonably necessary by the staff in preparation therefor, 
relating to the extent, character, and objects of Communist Party activities in 
California, with special reference to such activities in southern California, the 
legislative purpose being: 

(a) to obtain additional information for use by the committee in its considera- 
tion of section 16 of H.R. 9.352 



Mr, Margolis. May I have that section, section IG- 
The Chairman. Of H.R. 9352. 



1 Released by the committee and ordered to be printed. 

The executive testimony herewith released formed part of the background information 
on which is based the "Report on the Southern California District of the Communist 
Party: Structure — Objectives — Leadership," H. Rept. No. 259, released by the Comniittfe 
on T'n-Anieriean Activities on April 3, 1050. 

17 



18 COMMUNISM IN SOUTHERN CALIFORNIA AREA 

relating to the proposed ameudmeut of section 4 of the Communist Control Act 
of 1954, prescribing a penalty for knowingly and willfully becoming or remain- 
ing a member of the Coimnunist Party with knowledge of the purposes or ob- 
jectives thereof; and 

(b) to obtain additional information, adding to the committee's overall knowl- 
edge on the subject so that Congress may be kept informed and thus prepared 
to enact remedial legislation in the national defense, and for internal security, 
when and if the exigencies of the situation require it. 

Be, it further resolved, That the hearings may include any other matter within 
the jurisdiction of the committee, which it, or any subcommittee thereof ap- 
pointed to conduct this hearing, may designate. 

Let the record sho^Y that pursuant to law and the rules of this com- 
mittee, I, as chairman, appointed a subcommittee for the purpose of 
conducting these hearings composed of Representatives William M. 
Tuck, Bernard Kearney, as associate members, and myself, Francis 
E. Walter, as chairman. 

The order of appointment of the subconnnittee will be set forth 
in the record at this point : 

(Information referred to follows :) 

August 27, 1958. 
To Mr. Richard Arens, Staff Director, House Committee on Un-American 
Activities: 

Pursuant to the provisions of the law and the rules of this committee, I 
hereby appoint a subcommittee of the Committee on Un-American Activities, 
consisting of Representative William M. Tuck and Representative Bernard W. 
Kearney, as associate members, and myself, Francis E. "Walter, as chairman, to 
conduct executive hearings in Los Angeles, Calif., beginning on Tuesday, Sep- 
tember 2, 1958, on the subjects under investigation by the committee, and take 
such testimony on said day and succeeding days, as it may deem necessary. 

Please make this action a matter of committee record. 

If any member indicates his inability to serve, please notify me. 

Given under my hand this 27th day of August 1958. 

Francis E. Walter, 
Chairman, Committee on Un-Am,erican Activities. 

The Chairman. A majority of the subcommittee is present. 

The subcommittee has determined that this hearing will be in ex- 
ecutive session. 

Tlie committee resolution adequately sets forth the subject and pur- 
poses of this hearing. 

Information has come to the committee of renewed Communist 
Party activities in this, a highly sensitive and important area of the 
country. The degree and extent of this renewed activity is deemed by 
the committee to be of such importance to the national welfare and 
defense of the country as to justify this investigation in order that 
remedial legislation may be recommended in this field designed to 
meet new threats of subversion. 

Mr. Margolis. I wonder, in the light of the statement of purpose, 
if I miglit have a few moments to consult with my client. 

We heard this for the first time now. 

(Witness confers witli counsel.) 

Mr. Margolis. Thank you. 

TESTIMONY OF DOROTHY RAY HEALEY, ACCOMPANIED BY 
COUNSEL, BEN MARGOLIS 

The Chairman. Mr. Tavenner. 

Mr. Tavenner. Please state your name and place of residence. 



COMMUNISM IN SOUTHERN CALIFORNIA AREA 19 

Mrs. Healey. My name is Dorothy Ray Healey. 

Mr. Tavenner. Will counsel accompanying the witness please iden- 
tify himself for the record ? 

Mr. Margolis. My name is Ben Margolis, 112 West 9th Street, Los 
Angeles, Calif. 

Mr. Tavenner. What did you give as the residence ? 

Mrs. Healey. 1733 1/2 West 84th Street. 

Mr. Tavenner. Are you the wife of Mr. Phil Connelly ? 

Mrs. Healey. Mr. Tavenner, I would like to ask a question, if I 
may, at this point, in regard to the question of the nature of the hear- 
ing. This is an executive session. I am wondering. Congressman 
Walter, whether at the conclusion of my testimony this committee is 
going to issue any release to the papers about the testimony. I am 
concerned about it in regard to the question of my testimony here as 
well as the question of the release to the papers. 

The Chairman. I think we share your concern in that. That, I 
think, is important. We are going to discuss that question when we 
are able to get the committee together. We are not disposed to make 
this public. We are hoping that by so doing you will cooperate with 
us and give us every bit of assistance that we are sure that you can. 
So for that reason we are not for the moment going to decide this 
question. 

Mrs. Healey. Well, the question in my mind. Congressman, is that 
I am quite certain from previous experiences that the minute I leave 
the hearing room the press, of course, will be out there, and I am con- 
cerned. I don't care to be one to set the precedent of releasing testi- 
mony. 

On the other hand, I want to protect my own reputation and my own 
testimony here. Therefore, if there is going to be any such release 
now or later, I would like to know it now so I can guard myself 
accordingly. 

The Cir AIRMAN. I cannot answer the question. I do not think there 
will be any. I assume there will not be a release of the transcript 
of the testimony. That I will promise. 

Mrs. Healey. Will there be a digest of the testimony given by Mr. 
Wheeler or Mr. Tavenner or you gentlemen to the press ? 

The Chairman. It will not be done. If they find out what liap- 
pened here, that is something we have no control over. 

Mr. Margolis. We have trouble hearing you, sir, I am sorry. 

May we have read back what you said ? I couldn't hear you. 

The Chairman. The answer is, we will not officially release tliis 
i estimony. 

Go ahead, Mr. Tavenner. 

Mr. Tavenner. The question was: Are you the wife of Mr. Pliil 
Connelly ? 

Mrs. Healey. I am. 

Mr. Tavenner. Wlien and where were you born ? 

Mrs. Healey. I was born in Denver, Colo., September 22, 1914. 

Mr. Tavenner. What was your maiden name ? 

Mrs. Healey. Dorothy Rosenblum. 

Mr, Tavenner. Did you engage in activities of the Young (^om- 
munist League in soulhern (California in (he 11);)0"s under the name 
of Dorothy Ray? 



20 COMMUNISM IN SOUTHERN CALIFORNIA AREA 

Mrs. Healey. Well, this is — after listening to Congressman Walter 
as to the legislative purpose of this inquiry, the Supreme Court has 
ruled that the activities of the Communist Party are protected, the 
political activities of the Communist Party are protected by the first 
amendment as are the activities of any other political party or organi- 
zation. It is clear that this committee could not bring in legislation 
in regard to the activities, of the Communist Piii'ty as it has not been 
able to do heretofore and has been upheld as unconstitutional. 

Secondly, the fact remains that if there are activities that are not 
protected by the first amendment, there are certainly avenues by the 
U.S. Government on behalf of the United States to guarantee the 
ceasing of such activities. 

I happen to have suffered some 6 years of persecution on the ques- 
tion of the first amendment and the protection of that first amendment, 
and fi.nally, as I was sure G years earlier, the Supreme Court ruled 
and the Department of Justice later had to concur, in regard to 
renewed persecution, that there was nothing in my lifetime of activities 
of any kind that could Avarrant conviction in regard to any of the 
legislative questions or the questions of this inquiry which Congress- 
man Walter opened the hearing on. 

Because of that I therefore, first of all, decline to answer that 
question on the ground of the first amendment which prohibits this 
committe from inquiry into activities around ideas. 

I decline to answer on the ground of the 10th amendment, which very 
wisely our forefathers guaranteed to be inserted in order to say to 
any future political politicians that the activities of citizens are going 
to be pi'otocted and not only by the first br.t liy the clear statement 
ihat Avhatever poAvers are not delegated to the U.S. Government ex- 
pressly by the people through the Constitution and the Bill of Rights 
are relegated and saved to the people. I further decline to answer on 
the ground of the fifth amendment. 

I claim the privilege against self-incrimination. 

The Chairman. You are directed to answer the question. 

Mrs. Healey. The same answer. 

Mr. Tavener. Were you formerly the wife of Don Healey ? 

Mrs. Healey. I am not going to give you any answers to any further 
questions of this kind on the same grounds ; and further on the grounds 
that none of these questions are ])ertinent to any legislation which this 
committee could possibly bring into the Congress or which could 
possibly be upheld as constitutional. 

The Chairman. You are directed to answer that question . 

Mrs. Healey. Same answer. 

Mr. Tavenner. How did you acquire the name of Eiiy ? 

Mrs. Healey. Same answer. 

Mr. Ta\-enner. How do you spell Ray ? 

Mrs. Healey. Same answer. 

Mr. Tavenner. Is the spelling of the name Ray, R-a-y or R-a-e? 

Mrs. Healey. Same answer. 

Mr. Tavenner. May I have a direction to answer ? 

The Chairman. You are directed to answer the question. 

Mrs. Healey. Same answer. 

The Chairman. You see, one of the reasons for this inquiry is Ihc 
vpry decision yoii are talking about, because it is inroncoivnble to us 



COMMUNISM IN SOUTHERN CALIFORNIA AREA 21 

and to other Americans who have some smattering of knowledge of the 
law that the Supreme Court would find that the Communist con- 
spiracy is a political party. That is one of the purposes of these 
broad, general questions. We are hoping that the Supreme Court will 
take another guess. 

Mrs. HQealey. The point is, Congressman, if I may explain why I am 
answering this way, is that in regard to the question of conspiracy, 
first of all, the Supreme Court — I happen to be one where the Supreme 
Court has already found that I am not a part of any conspiracy, but 
secondly, my experience in a very long trial was that one can find 
oneself involved through what I gather legally is third party declar- 
ants in a conspiracy which one may have absolutely no knowledge of. 
I, therefore, must protect myself as well as the political activities of 
other Americans as well as the legal political activities of any minority 
political party in its functioning, and any answer, in my opinion, only 
makes it more possible to claim the validity of the right of this 
committee to ask. 

I must say that in regard to that it is my opinion that the mandate 
which this committee functions under is itself illegal inasmuch as the 
first amendment so expressly and specifically forbids legislation in the 
realm of ideas that the committee could not bring forth legislation 
which could conceivably be upheld as constitutional. 

Mr. Tavennee. Were you at one time organizational secretary of 
the Los Angeles County organization of the Communist Party ? 

Mrs. Healey. I must decline to answer on the same grounds. 

Mr. Tavenner. Were you at one time chairman of that organiza- 
tion? 

Mrs. Healet. I must decline to answer on the same grounds. 

Mr. Tavenner. Are you at this time the chairman of the Communist 
Party's new Southern California District? 

Mrs. Healet. The same answer. 

Mr. TA^'E]s^NER. Of the Communist Party ? Are you at this time a 
member of the National Committee of the Communist Party of the 
United States? 

Mrs. Healet. I should explain further in answer to your question 
that nothing in my lifetime, and there have been some thirty years 
of my life devoted to political activities within this country, have I 
done anything that I consider illegal or w^hich I am ashamed of. As 
a matter of fact, I am very proud of a lifetime of service to the Con- 
stitution and to democracy. 

If any group of citizens, including you two gentlemen sitting as a 
subcommittee representing the Congress of the United States, are 
genuinely interested, truly concerned with getting information as to 
political activities of one Dorothy Healey, I can assure you that 
if you will recess yourselves as a committee I would be very glad to 
answer all questions of you or any other groups of citizens of these 
United States; and I would be equally glad to do it under oath in 
order to not have people say that you will answer these things when 
you are not under oath. I will answer under oath to any group of 
citizens, all questions without reservation as to both political activi- 
ties, all questions relating to my own life. I would not, of course, 
ever answer any questions with regard to other citizens' activities, 

Mr. TA^^:N]S'ER. May I liave a direction? 



22 COMMUNISM IN SOUTHERN CALIFORNIA AREA 

The Chairman. You are directed to answer the question. 

Mrs. Healey. The same answer. 

The Chairman. Didn't you make comment when the Supreme 
Court decision came down to the effect that "Now we will move for- 
ward," something of that sort ? 

Mrs. Healey. May I consult with my attorney ? 

(The witness confers with her counsel.) 

Mrs. Healey. The same answer. 

The Chairman. I quoted that on the floor of the Congress. It is 
in the Congressional Record. 

Mrs. Healey. Again I would say, Congressman, that I would be 
very glad to discuss that with you as one citizen to another. I can- 
not, will not, yield to what my conscience dictates to answer any 
questions before this committee. 

Mr. Tavenner. Mr. Chairman, since you have asked that ques- 
tion, I desire to offer in evidence and ask that it be marked "Healey 
Exhibit No. 1" these two paragraphs from the June 19, 1957, issue 
of the Los Angeles Herald-Express : 

Most outspoken was Mrs. Dorothy Healey Connelly, Southern California 
District chairman of the Communist Party. 

"This decision will mark a rejuvenation of the party in America," she said. 
"We have lost some members in the last few years, but now we are on our way 
again." 

The Chairman. It will be admitted for what it is worth. 

(Document marked "Healey Exhibit No. 1" and retained in com- 
mittee files.) 

Mr. Tavenner. Do you deny making the statement attributed to 
you in the Los Angeles paper which I have just read ? 

(The witness confers with her counsel.) 

Mrs. Healey. I neither deny nor affirm the statement, Mr. Taven- 
ner. 

Mr. Tavenner, Were you a delegate to the 16th National Conven- 
tion of the Communist Party held in New York beginning February 
9, 1957? 

Mrs. Healey. I decline to answer on the grounds specifically stated. 

Mr, Tavenner. Did you participate in any manner in that conven- 
tion as a member of the Foster faction of the Communist Party or of 
the so-called revisionists group led by John Gates? 

Mrs. Healey. Same answer. 

Mr. Tavenner. Were you a member of the resolutions committee of 
that convention ? 

Mrs. Healey. The same answer. 

(Mr. Margolis confers with the witness.) 

Mr. Tavenner. A motion was quashed in the resolutions committee 
condemning the Soviet assault on Jewish culture. Was this action 
taken pursuant to a directive from Moscow to come to the defense of 
the Soviet Union ? 

(Witness confers with her counsel.) 

Mrs. Healey. In addition to the previous grounds stated, I decline 
to answer the question on the further ground that pursuant to the an- 
nounced purpose of the committee's inquiry here in southern Califor- 
nia, the questions, the last series of questions, certainly have nothing 
to do with the announced purpose given by Congressman Walter in 



COMMUNISM IN SOUTHERN CALIFORNIA AREA 23 

opening the hearing ; and I therefore decline to answer on this as well 
as the previously stated grounds. 

The Chairman. Now, just a moment. In the light of the bupreme 
Court decision that you have talked about with such obvious pleasure, 
you cannot invoke the fifth amendment because even if you were active 
in the Communist Party, still that is not a crime according to you. 
So, how could you be prosecuted for a criminal offense? 

Mrs. Healey. Except, as I pointed out to you previously, Congress- 
man, my experiences already, and they are very bitter experiences, 
where I had to be separated at that time from an 8-year-old boy for 
some 6 months in jail pending vindication that I knew would come. 
Kegardless of the fact that the activities of the Communist Party are 
k'gally protected, one can be tied into an unnamed conspiracy com- 
pletely without one's knowledge. 

While I certainly have no fear again of conviction, I have good 
grounds to be very concerned with continued persecution. 

The Chairman. I assure you that we are not persecuting anyone. 

Mrs. Healey, Well, I have some question of that inasmuch as al- 
ready as a result of this committee's serving subpenas on people at 
their places of employment, I know of already two people who already 
lost their jobs. 

The Chairman. Proceed, Mr. Tavenner. 

Mr. Tavenner. You stated that what occurred at the national con- 
vention of the Communist Party does not affect matters in California. 
For that reason you consider it is beyond the purpose of this hearing 
to go into those matters. Do you mean to contend that the action of 
the national convention of the Communist Party does not affect Com- 
munist Party activities in southern California ? 

Mrs. Healey. I have already stated to you, Mr. Tavenner, that 
I w^ould be very pleased, delighted 

Mr, Tavenner. Just answer my question. 

Mrs. Healey. Gratified to answer all questions regarding the Com- 
munist Party or any other political party activities. 

Mr. Tavenner. You are not answering my questions. 

Mrs. Healey. Outside the framework of this commmittee. 

Mr. Tavenner. You are evading. 

Mrs. Healey. I am not evading. I wall not answer any question 
in regard to political activities of any party or any individual while 
the committee is in official session because to do so is to yield to the 
\'alidity of this committee which I do not yield to and which I 
challenge. 

Mr. Tavenner. Then that is the reason ? 

Mrs. Healey. I therefore decline to answer on the grounds I f)re- 
viously stated. 

Mr. Tavenner. That is the real reason of your refusal ? 

Mrs. Healey. I would further go on to say that Congressman 
Walter announced very specifically — although I would still consider 
the announced purposes to be illegal and unconstitutional — never- 
theless, even within the framework of what he has announced, I would 
say that the questions have nothing to do, are not pertinent to the 
legislative questions which Congressman AV alter said this committee 
was interested in trying to gather further infonnation on. 



24 COMMUNISM IN SOUTHERN CALIFORNIA AREA 

The Chairman. Mrs. Healey, as I undei-stand you, you feel that 
the Supreme Court held that Communist Party activity is political 
activity in the sense that we know it in respect to other political 
parties ? 

Mrs. Healey. '\'\niat I am saying in my understandmg of the Su- 
preme Court decision was that the Communist Party's activities, such 
as within that ground of activity and in tiie realm of ideas, are pro- 
tected by the first amendment. 

The Chairman. Because it is a political party ? 

Mi"s. Healey. I didn't — I am only saying wliat I understand it to 
be. 

The Chairman. Yes. 

Mrs. Healey. It is my opinion that the Commimist Party is a 
legal political party. I cannot read the Supreme Court's mind. That 
is not in their statement. The Supreme Court mei-ely stated that 
activities, as such, are protected. I would differentiate between my 
own opinion that the Communist Party is a legal political party and 
the Supreme Court's because it would not do me to speak for any 
other body. I can only speak from my own understanding. 

Ml*. Tavenner. You liave taken a position, have you not, in south- 
ern California, in protection of the minority group in southern Cal- 
ifornia, particularly the Jewish group ? 

Mrs. Healey. I decline to answer that question on the same grounds, 
Mr, Tavenner. 

Mr. Tavenner. Let me ask you whether or not the action you have 
taken was influenced or limited in any way by the following: 

I find from the February 25, 1957, issue of the Xew Leader in an 
article written by Walter K. Lewis, entitled, "U.S. Communists Con- 
vene," this paragraph : 

The real key to the political tone of the convention lay in a seemingly small 
incident which was never reported to the daily press. Delegates close to the 
Morning Freiheit, Yiddish-language edition of the Daily Worker, introduced a 
motion to condemn the Soviet assault on Jewish culture (which included the 
liquidation of scores of Jewish writers as well as Jewish institutions). In the 
interest of "Party unity" the motion was quashed in the resolutions committee. 
Since the same consideration had led U.S. Communists to applaud the worst 
horrors of the Stalin era, it is difficult to see any significant change in the 
Party's essence 

(Witness confers with her counsel.) 
Mr. Tavenner (continuing reading) : 

as a result of the 16th convention. 

Did you participate in the convention in any manner in opposition 
to the action of the committee quasliing that resolution? 

Mrs. Healey. You know, Mr. Tavenner, the very type of question 
you are asl^ing in regard to the question of the conventions of a politi- 
cal party, regardless of your opinion of that political party, only 
confirms Congressman Hinshaw's warning in regard to the passage 
I would say at that time of the Smith Act but really much more 
pertinent to the activities of this committee when he in his very 
eminent, thoi'oughly conservative Congress stood up and turned to the 
Republicans in the Congress and told them that if they tolerated this 
type of legislation it could be only a matter of time until it was used 
ao;ainst them. 



COMMUNISM IN SOUTHERN CALIFORNIA AREA 25 

Now, the fact remains that when this committee inquires into con- 
ventions or political activities it should not take too much imagination 
to know that if you were allowed to do this, if citizens either co- 
operated or if it was upheld through due process, that it could be con- 
ceivably merely a matter of time until it was your activities which 
Mere being inquired into, into Democratic Party convention or Re- 
})ublican Party convention, depending upon which party was in and 
V. hich party was out. Therefore, to protect our political parties, I 
decline to answer these questions, all political activities, I decline to 
answer these questions on the previously stated grounds. 

The CiiAiRMAX. Of course, the big difference is that when my party 
meets and we are drafting a platform, and we are adopting resolu- 
tions, as a member of the committee, I have to fight to get in the room 
because of the press, pliotographers, and what not. We are very 
iiappy to have people present wlien we are preparing our platform. 
That is why I cannot understand why, if you contend that you are 
a member of a political party, it is none of our business what happens 
in the proceedings of tliat party. 

Mrs. Healey. Well, I would say two things in answer to that. Con- 
gressman, if I may. 

The first is that from the reading of the press of the convention 
about which Mr. Tavenner was so concerned, it was clear that the 
press was there at the press conference ; and secondly, that there were 
a whole number of eminent visitors who had been invited to attend the 
convention. 

But secondly, I would also say, Congressman, that if it meant your 
job that you were to be on that platform committee to exercise your 
American right to participate in the political drafting of a platform, 
you might not be so anxious to guarantee the right of a committee 
to inquire into it. If your party were being persecuted as the Com- 
munist Party had been persecuted, as members of the Communist 
Party have been persecuted, I doubt very much whether you would 
be so zealous in ansvrering or wanting to answer questions in regard 
to political activities. But that is v>-hy I have told you I am very 
proud of all the activities in which T have engaged. 

The Chaikman. If you are proud of them why do you not talk 
about them? 

Mrs. Healey. Because I do not believe that answering these ques- 
tions can in any way serve the interests of my fellow Americans. I 
think our forefathers were very sensible. I think they went on the 
basis of the best of the thinking of the whole world's philosophies 
when they drafted the Constitution. 

The Chairman. That was before there was a power trying to — 
that's beside the point. 

Mrs. IIealey. It really wasn't before there was a power because a 
reading of the history of that persecution at that time shows the 
whole country was in concern over the French conspiracy, over the 
fact that the French were trying to foment rebellion in this country. 
It was Thomas Jefferson, and I am sure you remember (his, Avho had 
to lead a more courageous and valiant fight. 

The Chairman. Let us not go way off. Tliat is very interesting — 
about which we all know a great deal. 

Go ahead, Mr. Tavenner. 



2G COMMUNISM IN SOUTHERN CALIFORNIA AREA 

Mr. Tavenner. What I am getting at is to what extent was the 
convention, to your knowledge, inflnenced in its action by the Soviet 
Union ? 

Mrs. Healey. I decline to answer on all the gronnds previously 
stated. 

Mr. Tavenner. Did you at that convention oppose any interest of 
the Soviet Union ? 

Mrs. Healey. I decline to answer on the grounds previously stated 
although I think by this time in jnst a reading of the testimony be- 
fore this committee, including those of ex-Communists who so glady 
testified in order to save their jobs, would indicate that all this non- 
sense that informers have given you, professional informers have 
given you, in regard to the dictation of Moscow to any political party, 
et cetera, any such nonsense 

Tlie Chairman. Where do you get the idea that anyone was an 
informer ? 

Mrs. Healey. Where do I get the idea ? From the reading of the 
transcripts of this committee. But I M'ould say that as is true his- 
torically again throughout the centuries of informers, the testimony 
of informers. Congressman, and I am sure you Avill agree with me, is 
of very little value in terms of its honesty or its truthfulness. 

Mr. Tavenner. Now, since you have raised the question of the influ- 
ence and direction of the Communist Party of the United States 

^y — 

Mrs. Healey. I didn't raise any such question. 

Mr. Tavt.nner. By the Soviet ITnion 

Mrs. Healey. I volunteered nothing. 

Mr. Tavenner. You volunteered a rebuttal of that before any ques- 
tion was asked regarding it. So I want to ask you wliat methods 
were used, if any, to your knowledge, either before or soon after the 
holding of the Sixteenth National Convention which indicated the 
Soviet desire and intention to whip the membership into line back of 
of tlie Foster faction and in opposition to the so-called revisionists 
led by John Gates ? 

Mrs. Healey. I told you tliat a reading of the testimony before this 
committee, and I spent some time in reading it because I have never 
appeared before the committee and I wanted to acquaint myself witli 
the procedures, with what convinced me that this is all a lot of poppy- 
cock that this committee has been propagating for many years. 

Mr. Tavenner. Just answer the questions. 

Mrs. Healey. As far as the question you are asking me, I decline 
to answer on all the grounds previously stated. 

(Witness confers with her counsel.) 

Mr. Ta\tenner. You are not frank with this connuittee. You are 
charging in general terms that from tlie committee's evidence there is 
no such thing existing, but when you are asked regarding your knowl- 
edge of the problem you refuse to answer. 

(Witness confers with her counsel.) 

Mrs. Healey. I would think by this time I have made myself clear. 
Ijet me then repeat it in order to have the weight of emphasis on it, 
and I will answer no such questions of this kind before this commit- 
tee because to answer those questions is to yield to this committee the 
i-ia'httoaskthem. 



COMMUNISM IN SOUTHERN CALIFORNIA AREA 27 

I challenge the right of this committee to ask any questions. It is a 
forbidden area as far as the Congress of tlie United States is con- 
cerned to inquire into these questions. It is protected by the first 
amendment. I, for one, will not yield what thousands and millions 
of Americans over the centuries have fought for in order to provide 
information, a momentary excursion into forbidden area by this 
committee. 

Mr. Tavenner. Mr. Chairman, I offer in evidence a thermoflax 
copy of an article by Harry Schwartz, appearing in tlie February 4, 
1957, issue of the New York Times, and ask that it be marked "Healey 
Exhibit No. 2." 

(Document marked "Healey Exhibit No. 2" and retained in 
committee files.) 

Mr. Tavenner. I will read excerpts from it as the basis for several 
questions. 

The heading of the article is: '"Soviet Backs Foster's Faction, 
Attacks Eight- Wing U.S. Keds." 

The Soviet Communist party made unmistakably clear yesterday that it 
favored victory for William Z. Foster's faction at the United States Communi.st 
party "national convention," which opens here Saturday. 

In language similar to that employed by Mr. Foster in an article published 
last October, the Moscow newspaper Sovetskaya Rossiya attacked "right-wing 
elements" among American Communists and singled out for particular criticism 
Joseph Clark, foreign editor of the Daily Worker here. 

As reported by the United press, the Soviet newspaper linked Secretary 
of State John Foster Dulles and rightwing Communists here as advocates of 
a "national communism" that would "divide and conquer" the Communist 
world. 

Further down in the article appears the title ; 
Third Outburst From Soviet : 

Yesterday's attack was the third recent indication of Moscow displeasure — — 

(Witness confers with her counsel.) 
Mr. Tavenner (reading) : 

with some groups of American Communists, particularly those associated with 
the Daily Worker. The two earlier indications had been an attack on the 
Daily Worker's editorial disapproval of the Soviet military intervention in 
Hungary last November, and a short, but bitter, onslaught on "Rightists" 
among American Communists by the Soviet Communist party magazine, Par- 
tinaya Zhizn. 

There has been much speculation recently that the rightwing elements among 
American Communists, whose leader is generally taken to be .John Gates, editor 
and chief of the Daily Worker, were weakening under the pressure of Moscow's 
displeasure. One sign so interpreted by some observers was the decision of the 
New York State Communists, w'here rightwing elements are particularly strong, 
a week ago not to press for immediate conversion of the Communist party into a 
Communist political education association. 

Since yesterday's Moscow attack came after the concessions made by the 
rightwing at the New York meeting, the inference would seem indicated that 
the Soviet leaders were still unsatisfied and demanded both the victory of 
Mr. Foster's group and the serious rewriting of the draft resolution. 

Do you not agree that is an effort made by the Soviet Union 1o 
dictate to the Communist Party of the United States ? 

Mr. Margolis. Is the question finished ? 

Mr. Tavenner. Yes. 

(Witness confers with her counsel.) 

Mrs. Healey. You know. I am rather curious about one thing, Mr. 
Tavenner. I have, I think, made reasonably clear to the committee 

38253—59— pt. 1 2 



28 COMMUNISM IN SOUTHERN CALIFORNIA AREA 

that I would consider any testimony before this committee a violation 
of principle, would yield to the pressures that would grant the right 
of the committee to inquire into these questions. I have no question 
that the cost of these hearings must be enormous. I am a taxpayer 
and I pay enormous taxes, and I am wondering 

Mr. Tavenner. You are deliberately evading my questions. 

Mrs. Healey. When you know that I am not going to answer, I am 
not going to answer this or any other question, including your ques- 
tion which simply asks for my opinions on the grounds previously 
stated. On this question, I simply decline to answer on the grounds 
my opinion has no validity to this committee. What I think or do 
not think, what I agree or do not agree with what a newsj^aperman 
writes in a story really has very little relevancy or pertinency to 
this committee. 

The Chairman. Does that purport to be a correct account of what 
happened at the convention ? 

Mr. Tavenner. What I read — at the convention? Yes. 

Mrs. Healet. Mr. Tavenner simply asked me whether I agree with 
whoever wrote that. 

Mr. Tavenner. It is not an account of what occurred at the con- 
vention, but it was an account of articles, or attem])ts, at least three 
attempts, made by the Soviet Union to make known to the Communist 
Party of this country what action it should take at its convention 
which was to be held on the following Saturday. 

The Chairman. Did you attend that convention ? 

Mrs. Healey. I decline to answer that question, Congressman, on 
the grounds previously stated. I would add further, again, however, 
my offer to this committee or to any other group of interested citizens 
in these United States, that I will under oath answer all ([uostions in 
regard to political activities of my own, all that I am aware of, with- 
out reservation or hesitation, but I will not do so in this committee, 
before this committee. 

Mr. Tavenner. This statement has l)een made at least four times in 
the record. 

The Chairman. We understand. 

Mrs. Healey. You ought to take up the statement sometime, then. 

The Chairman. We understand your position. 

Mrs. Healey. If you are really concerned and interested. 

The Chairman. Never mind. 

Mrs. PIealey. On the political activities of the party, then you 
ought to sometime take up the offer to do so. 

Sir. Tavenner. The committee has learned a great deal regarding 
the Communist methods used in handing down directives to the Amer- 
ican Communist Party, one clear illustration being that of the Duclos 
letter which resulted in the ouster of Browder in 1945 and the so- 
called reconstitution of the Communist Party. Is this not just an- 
other illustration of that same tactic? 

Mrs. Healey. Same answer. 

Mr. Tav-enner. Did you submit to the pressures from Moscow and 
lend your support to the Foster faction as advised by Moscow ? 

Mrs. Healey. Same answer. 

(Witness confers with her counsel.) 

Mr. Tavenner. What effect did these directives have on other dele- 
gates to the convention ? 



COMMUNISM IN SOUTHERN CALIFORNIA AREA 29 

I notice you arc very much amused, but I wish you would pay 
attention to the questions and try to answer. 

Mrs. Healey. I am paying close attention. I am feeling an even 
greater degree of both insult and resentment of what I consider to be 
Avanton waste of taxpayers' money at a continuation of asking these 
questions when I have so clearly made known to you that I am not 
going to answer. 

Mr. Tavenner. Will you answer the question ? 

Mrs. Healey. I cannot answer for other people. I would say that 
I all my life have been my own boss and I continue, on what I will 
think, on what I did, that is regardless of what pressures may come 
from the U.S. Government, it may come from the Department of Jus- 
tice o]- tlie FBI or from any other source determining my conduct, I 
determine my conduct as my conscience dictates. 

Mr. Tavenner. Then you did not yield to the pressures of Moscow ? 

Mrs. Healey. I have already answered that question. 

Mr. Tavenner. You have not. 

Mrs. Healey. I have answered that question within my understand- 
ing of the question. 

Mr. Tavenner. Does your answer mean to impart the idea that 
you did not submit to the pressures from Moscow ? 

Mrs. Healey. I have submitted to no pressures or yield to no pres- 
sures from any source at any time. 

Mr. Tavenner. Including Moscow ? 

Mrs. Healey, You have asked the question. I have answered it. 

The Chairman. Will you answer the question ? 

Mrs. HexVley. Including Moscow, sir. 

The Chairman. All right. 

Mr. Taa^nner. Did you support the Foster faction, or the so- 
called revisionists faction at that convention ? 

Mrs. Healey. I decline to answer the question on the grounds pre- 
viously stated. 

Mr. Tavenner. Did you later change your support and attack the 
Foster faction ? 

Mrs. Healey. Same answer. 

Mr. Tavenner. I offer in evidence an article over the name of 
T. Timofeyev, appearing on page 104 of the March 1957 issue 
of International Affairs published in Moscow and ask that it be 
marked "Healey Exhibit No. 3," 

The Chairman. Yes, it will be. 

(Document marked "Healey Exliibit No. 3" and retained in com- 
mittee files.) 

Mr. Tavenner. Referring to the national convention of the Com- 
munist Party in New York in February of 1957, the writer states in 
part: 

An overwhelming majority voted against the idea of turning the Communist 
Party into a "political or educational association" and called for the strength- 
ening and consolidation of the Communist Party of the United States. 

The convention reaffirmed its loyalty to the principles of proletarion inter- 
nationalism. This point was made in the main reports and delegates' speeches 
and also in the resolutions, in one of which the convention reemphasized the 
American Party's loyalty to the "great principle of proletaiian international- 
ism." The preamble to the new party rules adopted at the convention upholds 
the cardinal principle that their common interests are the link uniting the work- 
ers of all countries. 



30 COMMUNISM IN SOUTHERN CALIFORNIA AREA 

Then I desire to read the final paragraph : 

Pursuing a policy based on tested Marxist-Leninist principles, and applying 
the great teachings of Marxism-Leninism to U.S. conditions, the American 
Communist Party will be able to utilize all the possibilities which exist for 
stepping up the struggle for the vital interests of the working class and the entire 
American people for peace, democratic freedoms, and social progress. 

Now, this is the statement from Moscow after the convention was 
held. Do you not agree that it places the stamp of Moscow's approval 
on basic subservience of the party in the United States to international 
connnunism ? 

Mrs. Heat.f.y. Would you read the question ? 

(Record read.) 

(The witness confers witli lier counseh) 

Mrs. Healky. Same answer. 

Mr. Tavenner. Did you take any action at tlie convention in re- 
affirming loyalty to the principles of proletarian internationalism? 

Mrs. Healey. The same answer. 

Mr. Tavenner. I refer you now to the closing paragraph which I 
have read, alluding to the utilization of all possibilities which exist for 
stepping up the struggle for peace, democratic freedoms and social 
progress, and ask you to state how the struggle mentioned is to be 
waged. 

Mrs. Healey. By whom ? 

Mr. Tavenner. By the Communists. 

Mrs. Healey. Same answer. 

Mr. Tavenner. "We find running through Commmiist Party litera- 
lure, like a tliread through a garment, the term referred to here in 
Moscow of "peace, democratic freedoms, and social progress." 

Mrs. Healey. You will also find it in all the speeches and writings 
of our forefathers, Mr. Tavenner. 

Ml-. Tavenner. What is the Connvninist meaning of tliose terms? 

Mrs. Healey. Same answer. 

Mr. Tavenner. It is noted that John Gates stated that he came into 
the Communist Party for tlie purpose of waging a fight for peace, 
democracy, and socialism, that on disbandment of the Daily Worker 
we find in the last issue lieadlines, "We will be back, fighting for 
peace, democracy, and socialism." 

We find John Gates, after he has left the party, saying he proposed 
to continue the fight for peace, democracy, and socialism. What 
kind of Communist jargon is this which permits the use of those 
terms both within and without the Communist Party ? 

(Witness confers with her counsel.) 

Mrs. Healey. Life would probably l)e much easier for both investi- 
gating committee as well as for the ordinary citizen if words were 
allowed to mean what words say. The fact that I decline to answer 
these questions does not mean that I am accepting your assumption 
as to what the words mean or that they are jargon or any other rather 
colorfnl adjectives which you use to describe them. But I do decline 
to answer this (juestion us well. 

Mr. Tavenner. Well, you see, (he committee has found so many 
instances in which words used in their normal application have an 
entirely dill'erent meaning in the Conmiunist Party. I am trying 
to get your ans^^■er as to the Conununist Party meaning of these 
words. 



COMMUNISM IN SOUTHERN CALIFORNIA AREA 31 

Mrs. Healey. There may l)e some validity in what, you say insofar 
as this is concerned. I liave found in readin^^ all of these transcripts 
that I read while I was on my vacation of the people who appeared 
on this committee and then the committee's statement afterwards that 
the committee has its own peculiar knack of not only making these 
assumptions but making them with a certain solenm declaration as 
if they are perforce what you say is true in terms of the misreading, 
it seems to me, of what is implied in anybody's statement. 

I would, however, decline to answer tliis or any other question you 
ask in regard to tliese questions. 

Mr. Tavennek. You have had considerable experience, have you 
not, with those who have recently withdrawn from the Comnuinist 
Party ? 

Mrs. He/VLey. Same answer. 

Mr. Tavenner. Will you state whether or not those who have with- 
drawn have indicated to you an intention to continue the fight for 
peace, democracy, and socialism ? 

Mrs. Healey. Well, I would come back to an earlier answer I gave 
you on this question, Mr. Tavenner, and that is tliat I again state 
that it is clear from the line of questions you are asking that the state- 
ment of the purposes that (yongressman Walter gave in opening the 
iiearing, and I would still challenge the legality of that statement, 
that it is clear, however, that these questions have absolutely no perti- 
nency to any possible legislation that the Congress of the United 
States could produce. 

Mr. Tavenner. You refuse to answer? 

Mrs. Healey. And I decline to answer the question. 

Mr. Tavenner. After all is said and done, doesn't it mean that the 
objectives of the Foster group in the Communist Party and the 
objectives of the so-called revisionists, with whom, our information 
is, tliat you liave had some experience, is just the same except one is 
within the party and the other is without the party, organizationally 
speaking ? 

Mrs. Healey. I just truthfully do not understand your question. 

Mr. Tavenner. Eead the question. 

(Record read.) 

Mrs. Healey. I heard the question. I simply do not understand its 
intent. I don't know what you mean. 

The Chairman. Reframe your question. 

Mrs. Healey. That one is within the Communist Party and tlie 
other is without the Communist Party. I just don't know what you 
are referring to. 

Mr. Tavenner. I am asking you to reduce the question to a very 
simple form, whether or not the objective purposes of the Foster gi-oup 
within the Communist Party are the same as those who liave pur- 
l)ortedly left the Communist Party although they may not now be 
inembei-s of the same group. 

Mrs. Healey. Well, in addition to all of the grounds previously 
stated, when you ask me to give my opinion as to other people's miuds, 
what is in their minds, is really going far afield. Certainly I can 
see no pertinency or relevancy to the question. 

Mr. Tavenner. Let me correct that. I am not asking you what is 
in their minds. I prefaced my question by the statement that ac- 



32 COMMUNISM IN SOUTHERN CALIFORNIA AREA 

cording to our infonnatioii j'oii have had considerable experience 
with the so-called revisionists who have left the Communist Party. 
I am asking you to base your answer on your Imowledge of their 
representations to you. 

Mrs. Healet. I decline to answer on the grounds previously stated. 

Mr. Tavenner. John Gates, in the November 1956 issue of Politi- 
cal Affairs, in commenting upon those who left the party, states : 

I do not think that Starobin and those like him are lost to the cause of 
socialism, but will continue to contribute to it in their own way and I believe 
that in the end we will be reunited. 

Do you anticipate that the revisionists group will return to active 
participation within the organization of the Communist Party ? 

Mrs. Healey. Do I understand, Mr. Tavenner, you are now inves- 
tigating the question of the ideas and the activities of those who gen- 
erally believe in socialism ? 

Mr. Ta'stsnner. No, I am asking you regarding plans of the Com- 
munist Party and those who apparently retain the same objectives. 

Mr. Margolis. Plans? 

Mr. Tavenner. Plans. 

Mr. Margolis. I think that is inconsistent witli the question you 
asked. 

Mr. Tavenner. No. 

(Witness confers with her counsel.) 

Mr. Margolis. I suggest we read back tlie record. 

The Chairman. Read the question. 

(Record read.) 

Mr. Tavenner. Now, answer the question. 

Mrs. Healey. I don't quite understand. You talk about the antic- 
ipation of plans. Am I understanding you correctly ? 

Mr. Tavenner. The question is plain enough. 

Do you anticipate that the revisionist group 

Mrs. Healey. Do I anticipate that people are planning to return to 
the Communist Party ? 

Mr. Tavenner. You could not very well know about it unless there 
was some indication to you of an intention or plan to do it. 

The Chairman. Has there been any indication that you know? 
Put it that way. 

jNIrs. Healey. I, of course, decline to answer the. question on the 
grounds previously stated, although I would again repeat that it is 
clear that the line of questioning goes further afield as the hearing 
continues in terms of pertinency to any legislation. 

Mr. Tavenner. Hasn't the Communist Party made as one of its 
foremost objectives an effort to establish close alliance with the so- 
called revisionists who haA-e left the party and to bring tliem back into 
the party, organizationally speaking? 

Mrs. Healey. Same answer. 

Mr. Ta\tenner. Returning now to the subject of directives fi-om 
Moscow, is it not true that the French Communist, Jacques Duclos, 
once again addressed a letter to the Communist Party of tlie United 
States while the convention was in process or immediately prior 
thereto, in which he stressed the leading role of the Soviet Coinmunist 
T^artyj 

(Witness confers with her counsel. ) 



COMMUNISM IN SOUTHERN CALIFORNIA AREA 33 

Mrs. Healey. The reading of the press coverage of that convention 
would indicate that the letter that you were referring to from Jacques 
Duclos w^as rejected and Mr. Duclos, I understand from reading the 
press, was told that the American Communists would determine their 
own policies of the American Communists. 

Mr. Ta\T3NNEr. What were the contents of that letter ? 
Mrs. Healey. My memory from tlie press is too scattered to re- 
member. 

Mr. Tavenxer. Did yon h'arn of its existence otlior tlian throiigli 
the press ? 

Mrs. Healey. I decline to answer the (Question on the groimds pre- 
viously stated. 

Mr. Tavennkk. Weren't you on hand and didn't you, as a member 
of the national committee, receive that letter? 

Mrs. Healey. I decline to answer on the grounds previously staled. 
Mr. Tavenner. You admit, then, that this is at least one instance 
in wliicb tlie foreign Connnunist Party, the international party, en- 
deavored to influence the members of your convention ? 

Mrs. Healey. Your assumptions are your own, Mr. Taxenner. I 
do not accept your assmnptions on this or any other questions that yon 
have raised, and my declining to answer should not be misunderstood 
that I am accepting the assumptions that are explicit in your question?. 
Mr. Tavenner, Did Steve Nelson, head of the Pittsburgh Commu- 
nists, at a predawn meeting of February 12, 1957, bring together the 
opposing leaders of the Communist Party and arrange the composi- 
tion of a caretaker's committee for the party? 

Mrs. Healey. I decline to answer the question on the grounds })re- 
viously stated. 

Mr. Tavenner. As a matter of fact, the main issues in the party 
were not settled at that convention, were they? 

Mrs. Healey. Well, I don't what your interpretation is, what you 
are asking would call for, but I decline to answer the question anyway. 
Mr. Tavenner. Let us drop that subject for the moment. I will 
return to it later. 

Is it not true that the November 1957 declaration of the 12 Com- 
munist parties entered into in Moscow was another method used by 
Moscow to support the Foster faction in its traditional stand on 
internationalism ? 

(Witnesses confers with her counsel.) 

Mrs. Healey. I would suggest you call either somebody from the 
Soviet Union or China or Poland or one of the 12 representatives 
of the 12 parties participating and ask them. 

Mr. Tavenner. As a member of the national committee and a very 
intelligent person, I am certain you would have no difficulty answer- 
ing these questions if you desire to. 

Mrs. Healey. I have already stated, sir, that I will be happy to 
answer these and all other questions before any group of interested 
people. For 30 years I have been looking for people, searching for 
people, to listen to what I think. I would be delighted to have a 
forum to answer this or any other question. I will not do so befoie 
a committee whose very existence chnllonges tlie Constitution nnd ilu^ 
Hill of Rights. 



34 COMMUNISM IN SOUTHERN CALIFORNIA AREA 

Mr. Tavenner. I desire to offer in evidence a copy of a newspaper 
account of the meeting in Moscow, November 1957, of Communist 
Party leaders of the 12 nations in which Yugoslavia refused to join, 
and ask that it be marked "Exhibit No. 4.'' 

The Chairman. So ordered. 

(Document marked "Healey Exhibit No. 4" and retained in com- 
mittee files.) 

The Chairman. Did you attend this meetino; with Steve Nelson 
and others that Mr. Tavenner just asked you about? 

Mrs. Healey. I decline to answer the question on tlie grounds pre- 
viously stated. I will be glad to answer the questions outside of this 
hearing room under oath. 

(Witness confers with her counsel.) 

Mr. Tavenner. Would you agree that the burden of the declara- 
tion from Moscow is an affirmation of the leadership of Moscow in 
world communism and the pointing up of the necessity of figliting 
revisionism? 

Mrs. Healey. Same answer. 

Mr. Tamsnner. According to Political Affairs issue of January 
1958, the National Executive Committee, CPUSA, at a meeting helH 
December 22, 1957, issued quite a lukewarm statement regarding the 
12-Party Declaration of allegiance to Moscow. 

Did you participate in the deliberations of that meeting? 

Mrs. Healey. Same answer. 

Mr. Tavenner. I offer and ask that it be marked "Healey Exhibit 
No. 5," a copy of the article by the National Executive Committee, 
(^PUSA, appearing in the January 1958 issue of Political Affairs. 

The Chairman. It will be made a part of the record. 

(Document marked "Healey Exhibit No. 5" and retained in commit- 
tee files.) 

jNIr. Tavenner. I have before me a copy of another statement made 
]>y the National Executive Committee, CPUSA, entitled, "On The 
Peace Manifesto and the 12-Party Declaration" and appearing in the 
June 1958 issue of Political Affairs. I desire to offer it in evidence 
and ask that it be marked "Healey Exhibit No. 6." 

The Chairman. May I see it, please? 

Let it be made a part of the record. 

(Document marked "Healey Exhibit No. 6" and retained in com- 
mittee files.) 

Mr. Tavenner. This statement is not a lukewarm endorsement of 
(he 12 

The Chairman. Before you go into tliat, this is by the national 
executive committee? 

Mr. Tavenner. Yes, sir. 

The Chairman. Are you a member of the national executive com- 
mittee? 

Mrs. Healey. I decline to answer the question. 

Mr. Tavenner. I may state for the record, Mr. Chairman, that she 
is not a member, although the committee has information that she 
is a member of the National Committee of the Communist Party. 

The Chairman. And the difference ? 

Mr. Tavenner. One is the executive ('ommittce ol" the national 
rnnimittee. 

(^^Qtness confers with her counsel.) 



COMMUNISM IN SOUTHERN CALIFORNIA AREA 35 

Mr. Tavf.nxer. As T -svas start iiitr to say, this June 1958 statement 
by the national executive committee is not merely a lukewarm en- 
dorsement, it is a welcominfi: of the action taken by the Moscoav 
12 Party dex^larations. It welcomes it in tliis language. It welcomes 
It "as renewed evidence of the great contribution to world peace and 
social progress" and said that the American Communists must truly 
study and systematically discuss it. 

Now I would like to ask you this question : It appears from our study 
of these two separate actions that in the tirst one that was taken, that 
is, the lukewarm endorsement, that the motion was voted for, or in 
favor of, by John Gates and his friend and it was opposed by William 
Z. Foster, Eugene Dennis, Benjamin Davis, James E. Jackson, and 
Bob Thompson. 

Can you explain that to the committee? 

Mrs. Healey. Can I explain the action of the voting of other 
people ? 

Mr. Tavenner. Yes. Explain why the Jolm Gates faction en- 
dorsed this lukewarm reception of the declaration whereas Foster and 
his group voted against it. 

Mrs. Healey. I would answer that on the same grounds previously 
stated 

Mr. Tavenner. In other woixls, you ref\ise to answer? 

Mrs. Healey. That is right. 

Mr. Tavenner. What change came about which enabled the Na- 
tional Executive Conunittee to change its attitude and give it a warm 
welcome ? 

Mrs. Healey. I decline to answer on the grounds previously stated. 

Mr. TA^T.NNER. Isn't it because after the adjournment of the con- 
vention, with the aid and assistance of Moscow, Foster had become 
firmly seated in the saddle in the organization of the Communist 
Party in the United States? 

Mrs. PIealey. I decline to answer on these same grounds. 

Mr. Ta\-enner. While these factional fights were progressing on the 
national level, what organizational change was nuule in the Communist 
Party in California ? 

Mrs. Healey. I decline to answer on the groimds previously stated. 

Mr. Tavenner. Is it true that at the California State Convention of 
the Communist Party held on January 19-20, 1957, action was taken 
to establisli the Communist Party of California in the form of two 
districts, the Southern California Disti'iet and the Northern Cali- 
fornia District? 

Mrs. Healey. Same answer. 

Mr. Tavenner. Will you define the geographic boundaries of the 
two new districts? 

Mrs. Healp:y. Same answer. 

Mr. Tavenner. Is not the boundary between the two this: that the 
area north of Santa Barbara and Kern (^ounties is the northern dis- 
trict ? 

Mrs. Healey. Same answer. 

Mr. Tavenner. And that the States of Arizoiui and Nevada bound 
both districts on the east ? 

Mrs. Healey. Same answer. 

Mr. Ta\hnner. And Mexico on the south? 



36 COMMUNISM IN SOUTHERN CALIFORNIA AREA 

Mrs. IIkalet. Saiiie answer. 

Mr. Tavennek. Isn't it true that yon are chairman of the newly 
created Southern California District at this time? 

Mrs. IIealey. Same answer. 

Mr. Tavennkr. Does not your organizatioii call for the establish- 
ment of a district council composed of 62 members ? 

Mrs. Healet. Same answer. 

Mr, Tavenner. And from this district council of 62 members, is 
there not a district executive hoard patterned after the executive 
committee of the national organization composed of 10 members? 

Mrs. Healet. Same answer. 

Mr. Tavenner. Are you not the cliairman of this executive board? 

Mrs. Healet. Same answer. 

Mr. Tavenner. Was one Don Wheeldin a member of this executive 
board of the district council prior to March 26, 1958? 

Mrs. Healet. Same answer. 

Mr. Tavenner. Is yours or is the Southern California District di- 
vided into 28 sections ? Am I wrong about that ? 

Mrs. Healet. Same answer, 

(Witness confers with her counsel.) 

Mr. Tavenner. Did Don Wheeldin resign from the Communist 
Party on March 26, 1958? 

Mrs, Healet, Same answer. 

Mr, Tavenner, According to our information, that would leave 
nine presently on the executive board of the district council. Is 
Horace V. Alexander a member of that executive board ? 

Mrs. Healet. Same answer, 

Mr. Tavenner. Is Thomas Creed a member ? 

Mrs. Healet. Same answer. 

Mr. Tavenner. Is Cornelius Crowe a member ? 

Mrs. Healet. Same answer. 

Mv. Tavenner. Is Ben Dobbs a member ? 

Mrs. Healet. Same answer. 

Mr. Tavenner. Is James Frederick Forest a member ? 

Mrs. Healet. Same answer. 

Mr. Tavenner, Is Bernard Lusher a member ? 

Mrs, Healet. Same answer. 

Mr. Tavenner. Is Charlene Mitchell a member ? 

Mrs. Healet. Same answer, 

Mr. Tavenner, Is Nemmy Sparks a member ? 

Mrs, Healet, Same answer. 

Mr, Tavenner, Will you state whether or not it is contem])lated, 
as far as you may have any control over the matter, that William 
Taylor, formerly of Washington, D,C., is slated to become a member 
of the executive board at your next meeting, wliich I believe is in 
October? 

Mrs, Healet. Same answer. 

Mr. Tavenner. When is the next meeting ? 

Mrs. Healet. Same answer. 

Mr. Tavenner. Mr. Chairman, this would be a good time for a 
5-minute break. 

The Chairman. We will have a recess of 5 minutes. 

(Members present : Representatives Walter and Tuck.) 

(Short recess.) 



COMMUNISM IN SOUTHERN CALIFORNIA AREA 37 

(Members present : Representatives Walter and Tuck.) 

The Chairman. Proceed, Mr. Tavenner. 

Mr. Tavenner. Was an orjranizational meetiiig of the newly formed 
Southern District of the Communist Party of California held in Los 
Angeles on April 13 and 14, 1957 ? 

Mrs. Healey. I decline to answer on the grounds previously stated. 

Mr. Tavenner. Mr. Chairman, T desire to offer in evidence nu- 
merous papers relating to the convention, including resolutions 
adopted and, in one instance, a resolution which was not voted out 
by the resolutions committee. 

The Chairman. These are resolutions considered at an executive 
session ? 

Mr. Tavenner. The one resolution I mentioned was considered at 
a meeting of the resolutions committee and was not voted out, but 
another resolution on the same subject was voted out. 

The Chairman. All right. 

Mr. Tavenner. I will ask the witness questions regarding that 
when we arrive at it. 

There is the organizational convention of the new district formed 
in southern California of which our information indicates that the 
witness was the chairman. 

The Chairman. Was this a public meeting ? 

Mr. Tavenner. No, sir. 

Our information is that very definite security provisions were made 
regarding those who attended the meeting. 

These documents are as follows : 

Report to Southern California District Convention by Dorotliy 
Ray Healey, 

(Healey Exhibit No. 7) 

(For text of document see Exhibit I of the Report on the Southern California 
District of the Communist Party, H. Rept. No. 2r)9, April 3, 19.39, p. 57) 

Mr. Tavenner. Trade Union Resolution, Southern California Dis- 
trict Convention. 

(Healey Exhibit No. 8) 

(For text of document see Exhibit II of the Report on the Southern California 
District of the Communist Party, H. Rept. No. 2.59, April 3, 19.59, p. 66) 

Mr. Tavenner. Rules of the Convention. 

(Healey Exhibit No. 9) 

(For text of document see Exhibit IX of the Report on the Southern California 
District of the Communist Party, H. Rept. No. 259, April 3, 1959, p. 77) 

Mr. Tavenner. Resolution offered by the Constitution and Organi- 
zational Committee for action by the convention. 

(Healey Exhibit No. 10) 

(For text of document see P^xhibit XI of the Report on the Southern California 
District of the Communist Party, H. liept. No. 259, April 3, 1959, p. 82) 

Mr. Tavenner. Copy of a letter dated April 12, 1957, from the 
People's World, Ivos Angeles staff' to the delegates to the convention. 



38 COMMUNISM IN SOUTHERN CALIFORNIA AREA 

(Healey Exhibit No. 11) 

(For text of document see Exhibit VII of the Report on the Southern California 
District of the Communist Party, H. Rept. No. 259, April 3, 1959, p. 75) 

Mr. Taa^nner. Kesolution on a Negro-Labor Alliance. 

(Healey Exhibit No. 12) 

(For text of document see Exhibit III of the Report on the Southern California 
District of the Communist Party. H. Rept. No. 259, April 3, 1959, p. 69) 

Mr. Tavenner. An excerpt from the California Eagle, a publica- 
tion bearing date, April 11 (1957), relating to a joint mass pilgrimage 
to Washington of 100,000 people set for May 17. 

(Document marked "Healey Exhibit No. 18" and retained in com- 
mittee files.) 

Mr. TA^^:lsrNER. A Resolution by Subcommittee on Mexican Work. 
I hand this document to the witness and ask whether or not this reso- 
lution was killed in the subcommittee. 

(Document marked "Healey Exhibit No. 14" and retained in coui- 
mittee files.) 

Mr. Tavenner. And was not voted out. 

Mrs. Healey. Same answer. 

Ml'. Tavenner. A Resolution on Mexican Work. 

(Healey Exhibit No. 15) 

(For text of document see Exhibit IV of the Report on the Southern California 
District of the Comnmnist Party. H. Rept. No. 259. April 3, 19.5!), p. 70) 

The Chairman. The first resolution you showed was a resolution 
that was proposed and rejected? 

Mr. Tavenner. And, according to our information, rejected. 

The CiiAiRM.\N. Was this a resolution offered by the witness? 

Mr. Tavenner. No. 

The Chairman. What connection did she have with it? 

Mr. Tavenner. She was chairman of the meeting and had filed 
a report on the subject of JNIexican matters as Avell as all of these 
other I'esolutions. 

The (yHATRMAN. Were all these furnished you by the witness? 

Mr. Tavenner. No, sir; slie has not furnished them. 

The Chairman. How many people attended this meeting? 

Ml'. Tavenner. I would like to ask the witness how nuiny were in 
attendance at this meeting. 

Mrs. Healey. I decline to answer on the grounds previously stated. 

Mr. Tavenner. Didn't 125 attend the first day and 140-odd the 
second day? 

Mrs. Healey. I decline to answer on tlie same grounds. 

Mr. Tavenner. The Jewish People in the United States. 

(Healey Exhibit No. 16) 

( For text of document see Exhibit V of the Report on the Southern California 
District of the C(Hiinmnist Party. II. Rept. No. 259, April 3, 1959, p. 71 ) 

Mr. Tavenner. A Resolution on the People's World. 



COMMUNISM IN SOUTHERN CALIFORNIA AREA 39 

(Healey Exhibit No. 17) 

(For text document see Exhibit VI of the Report on the Southern California 
District of the Communist Party, H. Rept. Xo. 259, April 3, 1959, p. 74) 

Mr. Tavenner. A reprint from the April 9, 1957, Daily Worker 
relating to the text of the Harry Bridges letter to George Meany. 

(Document marked "Healey Exhibit No. 18'' and retained in com- 
mittee files.) 

Mr. Tavenner. Constitution of the Communist Party, U.S.A. 
(adopted by the 16th National Convention, February 9-12, 1957). 

(Document marked "Healey Exhibit No. 19" and retained in com- 
mittee files.) 

Mr. Tavenner. Keport of the Constitution and Organization Com- 
mittee. 

(Healey Exhibit No. 20) 

(For text of document see Exhibit X of the Report on the Southern California 
District of the Communist Party, H. Rept. Xo. 259, April 3, 1959, p. 78) 

Mr. Tavenner. Communist Party Convention, an editorial. 

(Document marked "Healey Exhibit No. 21" and retained in com- 
mittee files.) 

Mr. Tavenner. It appears from your report to the convention, 
Healey Exhibit No. 7, that one of the specific programs assigned to the 
Southern California Conununists is the formation of an antimonopoly 
coalition. Is this the latest expression of the Communist Party in its 
struggle to destroy free enterprise in the United States ? 

Mrs. Healey. This — is that subversive to be against monopolies in 
the United States, Mr. Tavenner? 

Mr. Tavenner. Will you answer the question? 

Mrs. Healey. I do not think it is pertinent to the inquiry, legislative 
inquiry, that the Congressman announced as the purpose of this com- 
mittee. 

Mr. Tavenner. May I have a direction that the witness answer ? 

The Chairman. You are directed to answer. 

Mrs. Healey. I decline to answer on all the grounds previously 
stated, and in addition the ground of pertinency ._ 

Mr. Tavenner. In your discussion of the subject of monopoly, do 
you use that term in the sense of the free enterprise system in the 
United States? 

(Witness confers with her counsel.) 

Mrs. Healey. I decline to answer on the grounds previously stated. 

Mr. Tavenner. I ask you if it is not a fact that in the Communist 
use of the language that you are going to struggle against monopoly, 
you mean struggle against the free enterprise system of the United 
States? 

Mrs. Healey. I would imagine, Mr. Tavenner, that Communists use 
the word "monopoly" the way all other Americans use the word 
"monopoly," and that is referring to the giant trusts that have a 
stranglehold on the free economy. 

Mr. Tavenner. Is that the way you use it? 

Mrs. Healey. I decline to answer the question. 

Mr. Tavenner. It is also noted from this report, that is Healey 
Exhibit 7, that the Communist Party is not satisfied with the struggle 
for socialism, but that it demands participation in class and national 



40 COMMUNISM IN SOUTHERN CALIFORNIA AREA 

struggles in oi'der to convert non-Communists to revolutionary con- 
sciousness. Does that mean that the Communist Party is seeking to 
stir the masses into revolutionary action? 

Mrs, Healey. I decline to answer the question on the grounds previ- 
ously stated, the grounds being based on the 10th amendment, on the 
1st amendment, the 5th amendment, and pertinency, all four being in- 
cluded in all previous answers. 

Mr. Tavenner. May I have a direction ? 

The Chairman. You are directed to answer the question. 

Mrs. Healey. Same answer. 

Mr. Tavenner. It is stated in the report that the entire Communist 
Party in Southern California is called upon to concern itself with the 
problems of labor so that labor can move effectively to influence the 
affairs of the Nation and finally lead it. 

Is that a Conununist Party expression to the eft'ect that the Com- 
munist Party by this means has determined to establish the dictator- 
ship of the proletariat ? 

Mrs. Healey. Same answer. 

Mr. Tavenner. By having a Communist government? 

Mrs. Healey. Same answer, although do I understand your ques- 
tion that you are making synonymous a government led by labor with 
what you call the dictatorship of the proletraiat? 

Mr. Tavenner. I am asking you whether or not you are urging in 
your report that tlie Communist Paity concern itself with labor so that 
labor could finally lead the Government. I am asking you whether 
or not you mean by that if that is a step in the establishment of the 
dictatorship of the proletariat? 

Mrs. Healey. Same answer, Mr. Tavenner. 

Mr. Tavenner. Your report also states that "The working classes 
strive to fulfill the expression of ijiternationalism." I will ask you : 

])o you not mean by this that as a practical matter labor must sup- 
port or the masses must support the policies of the Soviet Union ? 

Mrs. Healey. Before I answer the specific question, I might point 
out to you, Mr, Tavenner, that I believe it was President Abraham 
Lincoln who declared the strongest bond in the world is that which 
unites the working people of the world. However, in regard to your 
sjjecific question, in regard to the question you asked, I decline to 
answer on the grounds previously stated. 

Mr. Tavenner. Didn't you change your views later to the extent 
that you Avere a violent opponent of the execution of Nagy? 

Mrs. Healey. I decline to answer the question on the grounds pre- 
viously stated. 

Mr. Tavenner. Your report makes a part of the Communist Party 
program in southern California a campaign to withdraw our forces 
from Europe; does it not? 

Mrs. Healey. I decline to answer the question on the grounds pre- 
viously stated. 

Mr. Tavenner. Actually, the Communist Party is serving as a 
willing tool for the foreign policy of the Soviet Union; isn't that 
correct ? 

Mrs. Healey. That is your assumption. I decline to answer the 
question on the grounds previously stated; and the fact that I am 
declining to answer it does not mean in any way that I agree with 
your assumption. 



COMMUNISM IN SOUTHERN CALIFORNIA AREA 41 

Mr. Tavenner. Does not your report demonstrate that to be the 
fact — that the Communist Party of the United States is bein^ used as 
a tool for the promotion of the foreign policy of the Soviet Union ? 

Mrs. Healey. I decline to answer on the grounds previously stated, 
although I will repeat again that as far as I am concerned and as far 
as a lifetime of conscious political thinking and activity is concerned, 
I have never been the tool of anyone or any country. 

Mr. Tavenner. But you have echoed in this report the directions 
of the National Committee of the Communist Party ; have you not ? 

Mrs. Healey. I decline to answer on the grounds previously stated 
although I would state again that never in my life have I said or 
acted in any way other than the dictates of my own conscience. 

Mr. Tavi^ner. And you are having trouble in the Communist 
Party because of it ; are you not ? 

Mrs. Healey. I decline to answer on the grounds previously stated. 

Mr. Tavenner. Will you tell us how this factional fight, between 
the Foster faction and the so-called revisionists on a national level, 
aifected the Communist Party in the Southern District of California 
of which you were and still are the chairman ? 

Mrs. Healey. That is a very broad question, Mr. Tavenner. 

Mr. Tavenner. Yes, and I am giving you quite a bit of latitude to 
answ^er it. How does it affect it ? 

Mrs. Healey. I decline the invitation, sir. I refuse to answer on 
the grounds previously stated. 

Mr. Tavenner. Let us start out by this. Did you not have many 
resignations as a result of it ? 

Mrs. Healey. I beg your pardon ? 

Mr. TA^^NNER. Didn't you have many resignations from the South- 
ern District of California as a result of these factional differences ? 

Mrs. Healey. I decline to answer ; same grounds. 

Mr. Tavenner. Wasn't the second manifestation in the form of a 
letter of grievances to the national committee signed by 22 members 
of your district? Wasn't that a manifestation? 

Mrs. Healey. Well, I am not responsible for your assumptions or 
interpretations of any questions, but I decline to answer the question 
on the grounds previously stated. 

Mr. Tavenner. Do not let us call it a manifestation. Let us call 
it a fact. Is it not a fact that a letter of grievances, signed by 22 
members of the Communist Party from the Los Angeles district, was 
addressed to the National Committee, Communist Party U.S.A. ? 

Mrs. Healey. I decline to answer the question on the grounds pre- 
viously stated although what this has to do with the legislation, I am 
still very much in the dark. 

Mr. Ta\t.nner. Mr. Chairman, I desire to offer in evidence as ex- 
hibit 22, a copy of a letter bearing da,te of December 14, 1957, ad- 
dressed to the National Committee 

(Witness confers with her counsel.) 

Mr. Tavenner. Of the Communist Party of the United States, 
signed by a number of people. 

The Cffatrjian. It will be made a part of tlie record. 



42 COMMUNISM IN SOUTHERN CALIFORNIA AREA 

(Healey Exhibit No. 22) 

(For text of document see Report on the Southern California District of the 
Communist Party, H. Kept. No. 250, April 3, 195t), p. 19) 

Mr. Tavknnkr. It is noted that this letter is signed by the full 
names of some individuals; it is signed b,y the first name and middle 
initial of otliers; and in some cases it is signed by merely a first name. 

Will you help us, please, to identify the names of these signatories 
to this letter^ 

* :;: * :;: * =!= * 

Mr. Tavkxnkr. There ai)pears here the name of Bebe, Boyle 
Heights. Does that indicate the luime of I^eatrice Goldstein of Boyle 
Heights, a section of the ( 'omnninist Party ? 

Mrs. Heai.ey. 1 decline to answer. 

Ml'. Tavknnf.r. The name Ada, Boyle Heights. Does that indi- 
cate the name of Ada Dobbs i 

Mrs. Healey. Same answer. 

Mr. Tavennek. Celeste, Zapata. Does that indicate the name of 
Celeste Strack Kaplan, of the Zapata Section of the Communist 
Party? 

Mrs. Healey. Same answer. 

Mr. Tavenner. The name Elizabeth, Moranda Smith. Does that 
indicate that is the name of Elizabeth Kicardo Jackson, of the Mo- 
randa Smith Section of the Connnunist Party ? 

Mrs. Healey. Same answer. 

Mr. Tavenner. Tliere is a second name of Elizabeth, Echo Park. 
Does that indicate the name of F'Jizabeth S|)ector of the P^cho Park 
Section of the ( 'ommunist Party ( 

Mrs. Healey. Same answer. 

Mr. Tavenner. Is Elizabeth Spector the wife of Frank Spector? 

Mrs. Healey. Same answer. 

Mr. Tavenner. Frank Carlson, Boyle Heights. Are you ac- 
quainted with him? 

Mrs. Healey. Same answer. 

Mr. Tavenner. Another name on this paper is Frank Spector, 
Echo Park. Are you acquainted with Frank Spector? 

Mrs. Healey. Same answer. 

Mr. Tavenner. Henry Steinberg, Valley 22. Does that indicate 
Henry Steinberg is of the Valley 22 Section of the Communist Party? 

]\Irs. Healey. Same answer. 

Mr. Tavenner. Joe. Valley 22. Does that indicate the name of 
Joe Gavron of the Valley 22 Section of tlie Communist Party? 

Mr's. Healey. Same answer. 

Mr. Tavenner. The name Kappy, Miscellaneous Industrial. Does 
that iiulicate tlie name of Leonard referred to as Kappy Kaplan? 

Mrs. Healey. Same answer. 

Mr. Tavenner. Of tlie Miscellaneous Industrial Section of the Com- 
munist Party? 

Lil C, Boyle Heights. Does that indicate Lillian Carlson of the 
iioyle Heights Section of the Comu)unist Party? 

j\lrs. Healey. Saino aiiswci-. 



COMMUNISM IN SOUTHERN CALIFORNIA AREA 43 

Mr. Tavenner. Lois Newman, San Gabriel. Does that indicate 
Lois Newman is of the San Gabriel Section of the Communist Party ? 

Mrs. Healey. Same answer. 

Mr. Tavenner. Lou B. Building Trades. Does that indicate Louis 
Baron as a member of the Building Trades Section of the Communist 
Party ? 

Mrs. Healet. Same answer. 

Mr. Tavenner. Mort Newman, Miscellaneous Industrial. Does 
tliat indicate that he was a member of the Miscellaneous Industrial 
Section of the Communist Party ? 

Mi^. Healey. Same answer. 

Mr. Tavenner. Phil, Western. Does it indicate Phil llafaloAV of 
the Western Division of the Communist Party '^ 

Mrs. Healey. Same answer. 

Mr. Tavenner, Sid, Miscellaneous Industrial. Does that indicate 
Sid London of the Miscellaneous Industrial Section of the Commu- 
nist Party ? 

Mrs. Healey. Same answer. 

Mr. Tavenner. Sophie, West Adams. Does that indicate Sophie 
Kislmer of the West Adams Club of the Communist Party? 

Mrs. Healey. Same answer. 

H: H< ^ >|: ^ H: H: 

Mr. Tavenner. Did you paHicipate directly or indirectly in the 
preparation of that letter of grievances^ 

Mrs. Healey. Same answer. 

Mr. Tavenner. Weren't you accused by Max Steinberg at the meet- 
of July 27, 1958, of the Southern (California District Council of the 
(^ounnunist Party that you had a part in the preparation of the letter 
of the Los Angeles 22?' 

Mrs. Healey. Same answer. 

Mr. Tavenner. Did you deny Max Steinberg's charges ? 

Mrs. Healey. Same answer. 

Mr. Tavenner. Who were its authors ? 

Mrs. Healey. Same answer. 

Mr. Tavenner. It is noted that this letter contains a recommenda- 
tion that the present structure of the party be made more flexible so 
that membership in the present type of party club is not necessarily 
a requirement for adherence to the (Communist Party organization. 
Do you recall that ? 

Mrs. Healey. Same answer. 

Mr. Tavenner. Do you need nie to reread that ? 

Mrs. Heaeey. I wouldn't. I would decline to answer any questions 
in regard to it, so that it isn't nex-essary. 

Mr. Tavenner. You mean you are not listening to these questions 
because you have made up j^our mind that you are not going to answer ? 

Mrs. Healey. It would be impossible to avoid listening, Mr, Taven- 
ner, as both of us know. Of course, I would. It is clear also that you 
are just continuing in what you ^^ ill forgive me if I will say is a rathei- 
willful, wasteful use of tax])ay('is'' money by continuation of a line of 
((iiestions which you already know I am not going to answer. 

?.S2r)3— 50— pt. 1 3 



44 COMMUNISM IN SOUTHERN CALIFORNIA AREA 

Mr. Tavenner. If it is the taxpayers' money, I lay the charge right 
at your door for refusing to make the effort profitable. 
(Counsel confers with the witness.) 

Mrs. Healey. No ; I think, Mr. Tavenner, that the aggressor usually 
is the one who is held responsible for the violation, not the victim. I 
did not invite the committee to come here. I did not ask for a sub- 
pena. I did not desire to appear. 

Mr. Ta%'enner. It is well known that the Communist Party desires 
to hide all of its manipulations, and we are trying to uncover some 
of them. 

Mrs. Healey. I have already stated, Mr. Tavenner, and let me repeat 
it again, that there is nothing in my lifetime that I am trying to hide. 
I will be very glad to answer all questions in regard to my own opin- 
ions and my own activities, my lifetime of pursuit of democracy — and 
I know you do not like the word — before any group of Americans. 
I vfiW not in any way yield to the violation of the Constitution which 
this committee perpetrates by its insistence on inquiring into a for- 
bidden area. 

Mr. Tavenner. Do you recall now the question that I asked you? 
Mrs. Healey. You were asking me in regard to a quotation from a 
document you have before you as to whether or not I remembered 
something was in there. 

Mr. Tavenner. Let me repeat the question. 

This letter contains a recommendation — I am speaking now of the 
letter of grievances written b}'^ the 22 Los Angeles members of the 
Communist Party — that the present structure of the pnrty be made 
more flexible so that membersliip in the present type of party club 
is not necessarily a requirement for adlierence to the organization. 

Does this not indicate that those withdrawing or contemplate with- 
drawing from the Communist Party because of factional differences 
:ire doing so in name only? 

(Witness confers with her comisel.) 

Mr. Tavenner. And that they are still for all essential purposes 
adherents to the Communist Party organization ? 

Mrs. Healey. Let me ask you, Mr. Tavenner, are you pursuing this 
line of inquiry in order that you can later make a very interesting 
sounding statement that the witness refused to answer some 500 
questions or something? I am really curious as to why the persist- 
ence in the line of inquiry. 

Mr. Tavenner. May I ask that the vritness be directed to answer? 
The Chairmen. The witness is directed to answer. 
Mrs. Healey. I decline to an.swer on the grounds previously stated. 
Mr Ta\T!:nner. Did you support that recommendation 
Mrs. Healey. Same answer. 

Mr. Tamdnner. Did you have anything to do with the preparation 
of that letter? 
Mrs. Healey. Same answer. 

Mr. Tavenner. A paragraph in this letter expresses the conviction 
that all avenues must be sought for unity with forces who have left, 
the party. Does this not indicate the desire on tlie part of the writers 
of the letter to still remain affiliated or to secure reafRliation with the 
Comnnmist Party of those \\ho liad left because of I'evisionist views, 
so-called revisionist views? 



COMMUNISM IN SOUTHERN CALIFORNIA AREA 45 

Mrs. IIeat.et. I will repeat again, Mr. Tavenner, that your contin- 
uation in tlie line of inquiry only documents my earlier statement 
fhat this is not a genuine inquiry. It is not a bona fide inquiry for 
the purposes of legislation, that by hook or by crook the committee is 
still attempting to find a way of evading the Supreme Court deci- 
sion on the Watkins and Sweezy cases. If the committee is really 
interested in investigating subversive activities, for instance on May 
18, J. Edgar Hoover announced that in violation of Federal law he 
was tapping 90 telephones. This is a committee in regard to the 
upholding supposedly ostensibly of the laws of the United States. 

The Chairman. We know what the purpose is. Certainly we have 
nothing to do with the tapping of telephones. 

Mrs. Healey. But it would seem to me if your concern is with the 
framework of the Government that you would at least take a position 
and call before this committee under subpena, Mr. Hoover to answer 
for his violations of Federal law. 

The Chaibman. We have nothing whatsoever to do with that type 
of activity. 

Mr. Tavenner. What action was taken by the National Committee 
of the Communist Party on this letter of grievances ? 

Mrs. Healey. I decline to answer. 

Mr. Tavenner. What action did you take ? 

Mrs. Healey. I decline to answer. 

Mr. Tavenner. I hand you what purports to be a copy of "Com- 
ments on the Status of the Party" by Dorothy Ray Healey. I wili 
ask you to identify it as a treatise prepared by you as a result of 
the letter of grievances. Will you identify its contents as a treatise 
prepared by you ? 

Mrs. Healey. Same answer. 

Mr. Tavenner. I desire to offer this document in evidence and ask 
that it be marked "Healey Exhibit No. 23." 

(Healey Exhibit No. 23) 

( For text of document see Exhibit XII of the Report on the Southern California 
District of the Communist Party, H. Rept. No. 259, April 3, 1959, p. S3) 

Mr. Tavenner. Was this treatise handed down by you on March 9, 
1958, to the 62 members of your district council for discussion on a 
section level ? 

Mrs. Healey. Same answer. 

Mr. Tavenner. Was this document a reversal of your position taken 
previously at the April 1957 organizational meeting of your district, 
on matters relating to the National Convention of the Commmiist 
Party held in February 195Y ? 

Mrs. Healey. Same answer. 

Mr. Tavenner. Did you not charge or undertake in this document 
to severely criticize the national leadership of the Communist Party 
for not having fulfilled what you call the responsibilities placed on it 
by the Sixteenth National Convention ? 

Mrs. Healey. Same answer. 

Mr. Tavenner. Among leaders of the Communist Party whom you 
Cj'iticized in this document were Eugene Demi is, James Jackson, James 
Allen, and William Z. Foster ; is that not true ? 

Mrs. Healey. Same answer. 



4G COMMUNISM IN SOUTHERN CALIFORNIA AREA 

Mr. Tavenner. Were you charged by Ben Davis of "T'S .^m ' as a 
result of your opposition to the leadership of the Comnnnti-t l^arty? 

Mrs. Healey. Same answer. 

Mr. Tavenner. Have you not by this criticism emloavr^red to set 
up a type of leadership in the Southern District of C:i :. iornia to differ 
in its purposes from the national leadership of the Communist Party 
with you at its head ? 

Mrs. HJEALEY. Same answer. 

Mr. Tavenner. Does the Communist P:^.i i y permit tliis t;, \w of oppo- 
sition to its national leaders? 

Mrs. Healey. Same answer. 

Mr. Tavenner. Do you not consider that i his p,< t ion on your part has 
caused your days to be numbered as a membei' (I tlie National Com- 
mittee of the Communist Party ? 

Mrs. Healey. Same answer. 

Mr. TA^^NNER. It is noted in this do'innent that you claim the 
distinction of having your dist i ict provide leadership on such political 
fronts as tlie H-bomb, Little Rock, and the South in general, and the 
1958 elections? That is a quotation from your document. "V^Hiat 
leadership have you furnished m each of these instances or fields? 

Mrs. Healey. Same answer. 

Mr. Tavenner. What means have you adopted to take part in the 
H-bomb campaign ? 

Mrs. Healey. Same answer. 

Mr. Tavenner. Did it include 

(Counsel confers with the witness.) 

Mr. Tavenner. Did it include the selection of a member of the 
Communist Party to make public talks on the subject of the H-bomb 
under the pretense tliat he was a scientist without revelation of the 
fact that he had been a member of the Communist Party? 

Mrs. Healey. Same answer, althougli are you going into the field of 
inquiry, Mr. Tavenner, that opposition to the H-bomb is something 
that this committee has any considered right at all that it can legislate 
against? 

Mr. Tavenner. I am going into the subject, as you well know, for 
the reason of showing wliat the Communist Party is actually doing 
here, and as far as we can ascertain, the purposes. 

Mrs. Healey. But isn't this all in an area that is already very em- 
phatically protected bv the first amendment and that the Supreme 
Court has rebuked this committee on this in the past for going into 
areas that are forbidden by the first ? 

The Chairman. Go ahead, Mr. Tavenner. 

Mr. Tavenner. What means have you used to exert Communist in- 
fluence at Little Kock and the South generally referred to in your 
document ? 

Mrs. Healey. I would urge that the most pressing thing in this 
country right now is the question whicli at this point happens to be 
centered around Little Rock. Again I would say that the committee 
is really to fulfill its ostensible obligation and inquire into thosewho 
are fornenting force and violence in Little Rock, to deprive citizens 
of constitutional rights, would be in the order of the day. 

Mr. Tavenner. On February 25, 1957, in the issue of the New 
Leader, to which I have referred earlier, there is an article "U.S. Com- 



COMMUNISM IN SOUTHERN CALIFORNIA AREA 47 

munists Convene" by Walter K. Lewis. I will read one section of a 
paragraph from that article: 

The Communists directed special emphasis to the Negro question in their 
declaration of principles and Carl Rachlin reported that a major effort to infil- 
trate the National Association for the Advancement of Colored People and the 
National Urban League should be anticipated. 

Plave you endeavored to carry out what is indicated to be anticipated 
in that field? 

Mrs. Healey. It seems to me that Ihis line of questioning, Mr. 
Tavenner, particularly at this moment, is a shameful thing, when you 
know as well as I know and probably even better because you are 
more acquainted with the South in a personal sense than I am, the 
gross attacks and violations and persecutions against Negro children 
that are taking place, that you would attempt to carry out what is a 
clear line of propaganda 

The Chairman. Will you answ' er the question ? 

Mrs. Healey. On the part of Southern supremacies by carrying on 
this line of inquiry, it would seem to me to be one of the most reprehen- 
sible acts of this committee in its history. Negro children are being 
deprived of the rights of education. 

The Chairman. Mrs. Plealey 

Mrs. Healey. You know and I laiow that, and, Congressman Wal- 
ter, you know it, and that you would attempt 

The Chairman. Just a moment. 

Mrs. Healey. To turn this terrible thing around into something 
til at seeks at this point not only your purpose 

The Chairman. Are you doing it ? 

Mrs. Healey. I decline to answer the question on all the grounds 
previously stated before and I would repeat again the fact that I am 
declining to answer in no way involves any assumption that your 
questions have any relevancy or validity. 

Mr. Tavenner. In what manner have you sought to use the Com- 
munist influence in the 1958 elections of which you make boast in your 
document ? 

Mrs. Healey. It is a well-known fact, unfortunately, and tragically, 
that every time California has an election, or almost every time Cali- 
fornia has an election, this committee appears on the scene. It seems 
that again the merry and w^eary farce is repeating itself. If I were I 
would have a constitutional right to do it. Any questions of election 
activities are certainly so patently forbidden from this committee to 
inquire into that I decline to answer on the grounds previously stated. 

Mr. Tavenner. You know very well that I am speaking of Com- 
munist Party plans, not what people do as individuals. So what are 
you doing as the Communist Party ? 

Mrs. Healey. I repeat again the answer that I gave you earlier, and 
that the Supreme Court in upholding the Constitution has already 
stated that the activities of the Communist Party as activities are 
protected by the first amendment and if there are any illegal activities 
concerned there are agencies of the Government to take care of them. 

I repeat again to you, gentlemen, the fact that after some 30 years 
and after G months' time with 25 FBI informers testifying, there 
could be found no proof that I have ever in my life engaged in any 
illegal activities, in any conspiratorial activities of the kind that are 



48 COMMUNISM IN SOUTHERN CALIFORNIA AREA 

prohibited, should be indication of the fact that the committee simply 
must carry on tliis type of thing not for the purpose of any genuine 
legislative purpose that would be of any help or interest to the people 
of the United States, but simply as a further attack on the Constitu- 
tion. 

Mr. Tavenner. How, if at all, did your treatise affect the Los 
Angeles 22 who signed the letter of grievances ? 

Mrs. Healey. I decline to answer on the grounds previously stated. 

Mr. Tavenner. I hand you what purports to be a copy of a letter 
of resignation to the National Committee, Communist Party of tha 
United States, bearing date March 26,1958, and ask whether you are 
familiar with its contents [handing letter to the witness] . 

Mrs. Healey. I decline to answer on the grounds previously stated. 

Mr. Tavenner, I desire to offer the letter in evidence and ask that 
it be marked "Healey Exhibit No. 24." 

The Chairman. It will be made a part of the record. 

(Healey Exhibit No. 24) 

(For text of document see Report on the Southern California District of the 
Communist Party, H. Kept. No. 259, April 3, 1959, p. 22) 

Mr. Tavenner. This letter of March 26, 1958, addressed to the 
National Committee, Communist Party of the United States, is signed 
by 16 people from southern California, some from northern California, 
resigning from the Communist Party and stating the reasons therefor. 

Did you have anything to do with the preparation of that letter of 
resignation ? 

Mrs. Healey. I decline to answer on the grounds previously stated. 

Mr. Tavenner. Were you consulted about it ? 

Mrs. Healey. Same answer. 

Mr. Tavenner. This letter clearly shows by its language and posi- 
tive declaration that it is the purpose of this group when the time is 
ripe to form an organization which will continue to advance com- 
munism in the United States. 

Will you tell the committee what knoAvledge you have regarding 
any such plan ? 

Mrs. Healey. Same answer. 

Mr. Tavenner. Have overtures been made to you to resign from 
the Communist Party and join this group? 

Mrs. Healey. Same answer. 

Mr. Tavenner. Mr. Chairman, at this point I go into another sub- 
ject. I do not know whether or not you want to stop here for lunch. 

The Chairman. We will take a break. We will resume tlie hear- 
ings at 2 o'clock. 

(Members present: Representatives Walter and Tuck.) 

(Wliereupon, at 12:25 p.m., Tuesday, September 2, 1958, a recess 
was taken until 2 :10 p.m., this same day.) 

AFTERNOON SESSION— TUESDAY, SEFFEMBER 2, 1958 

The hearing was resinned at 2 :1() p. in., pursuant to the recess. 
The Chairman. The committee will be m order. 
(Connnittee members present: Ilepresentatives Walter and Tuck.) 
The Chairman. Are you ready, Mr. Margolis ? 



COMMUNISM IN SOUTHERN CALIFORNIA AREA 49 

Mr. Margot.ts. Yes. 

TJie CifATRMAN. Proceed, Mr. Tavenner. 

TESTIMONY OP DOROTHY RAY HEALEY, ACCOMPANIED BY 
COUNSEL, BEN MARGOUS— Resumed 

Mr, Tavenner. Did you attend as a delegate a meeting of the Na- 
tional Committee of the Communist Party, U.S.A., held in New York 
(^ity on June 28-29, 1958 ? 

Mrs. IlF^iLEY. I decline to answei- on the grounds previously stated. 

Mr. Tavenner. Was Ben Dobbs one of the representatives or dele- 
gates to that meeting from tlie Southern District of California? 

Mrs. Hex^ley. Same answer. 

Mr. Tavenner. Was Charlene Alexander Mitchell a delegate to 
that meeting from the Southern District of California ? 

Mrs. Healey. Same answer. 

Mr. Tavenner. Was Pettis Perry a delegate to that meeting ? 

Mrs. Healey. Same answer. 

Mr, Tavenner. From southern California ? 

Mrs, Healey. Same answer. 

Mr. Tavenner, Was there an enlarged meeting of the District 
Council of the Southern District of California Communist Party and 
Comnnmist Party functionaries liekl at 607 South Western Avenue, 
Los Angeles, on Sunday, July 27, 1958, the purpose of which was to 
receive a report from delegates to the national committee meeting held 
on June 28 in New York City ? 

Mrs. Healey. Same answer. 

Mr. Tavenner. Is it not correct that the majority report to the 
district council meeting that I referred to consisted of a copy of the 
iieport of Eugene Dennis to the National Committee, CPITSA, pre- 
sented on June 28, 1958 ; a copy of the Labor Policy statement adopted 
by the National Committee, CPUSA, June 29, 1958, and a copy of a 
rep(n't to National Committee, June 28, 1958, On the Work and Con- 
solidation of the Party by Bob Thompson ? My question is : Did not 
those three reports constitute the majority report to the Southern Dis- 
trict Council of the California Communist Party? 

Mrs. Healey. Same answer. 

Mr. Tavenner. I oU'er iri evidence, Mr. Chairman and ask that the 
report of Eugene Dennis be marked "Healey Exhibit 25," the report 
On the Work and Consolidation of the party by Bob Thompson be 
marked "Healey Exhibit 26." 

(Documents marked "Plealey Exliibits Nos. 25 and 26 respectively.) 

( For text of documents see Exhibits XV and XVI of the Report on the Southern 
California District of the Communist Party, H. Rept. No. 259, April 3, 1959, 
pp. 100 and 110, respectively) 

Mr, Tavenner. Also the repoi-t of the labor policy statement 
adopted by the National Conunittee, CPUSA., as "Healey Exhibit 
No. 27." 
(Document marked "Healey Exhibit No. 27," and retained in committee files.) 

The Chairman. They will be so marked. 

Mr. Tavenner. Did you take the floor at the district council meeting- 
held on July 27, to whicli I refered, and announce that you would 
make a minority report on what took place at the national committee 
meeting of June 28, 1958 ? 



50 COMMUNISM IN SOUTHERN CALIFORNIA AREA 

Mrs. Healet. Same answer. 

(Witness confers with her counsel.) 

Mr. Tavenner. Did you not at this district council meeting dis- 
approve of the report of Dennis insofar as it related to Yugoslavia, 
France, and the execution of Nagy ? 

Mrs. Healey. Same answer. 

Mr. Tavenner. You understand that my reference to Yugoslavia 
and P^rance has reference to the Communist Party of those countries? 

Mrs. Healey. I understood. 

Mr. Tavenner. Was a resolution introduced at the national com- 
mittee meeting, June 28, opposing the execution of Nagy? 

Mrs. Healey. Same answer, Mr. Tavenner. 

Mr. Tavenner. Was this resolution proposed by a group on the na- 
tional committee generally referred to as the Healey bloc? 

]Mrs. Healey. Same answer, Mr. Tavenner. 

The Chairman. The Healey faction ? 

Mrs. Healey. Same answer. 

Mr. Tavenner. The connnittee has information that tliis bloc, 
known as the Healey bloc, Avas composed of 10 persons including 
yourself. Was Anna Correa one of those ? 

Mrs. Healey. The same answer, Mr. Tavenner. 

Mr. Tavenner. Was Ben Dobbs of southern California one of those. 

Mrs. Healey. Same answer. 

Mr. Tavenner. Was Steve Nelson one of them ? 

Mrs. Healey. Same answer. 

Mr. Tavenner. Was Joe Roberts one of them ? 

Mrs. Healey. Same answer. 

Mr. Tavenner. Was Dave Davis one of them ? 

Mrs. Healey. Same answer. 

Mr. Tavenner. Was Si Gerson one of them ? 

Mrs. Healey. Same answer. 

Mr. Tavenner. Was Mickey Lima one of them ? 

Mrs. Healey. Same answer. 

Mr. Tavenner. Was Al Richmond, editor of the People's World 
from northern California, one of tliat bloc ? 

Mrs. Healey. Same answer. 

Mr. Tavenner. Was Martha Stone of them ? 

Mrs. Healey. Same answer. 

Mr. Tavenner. Was the execution of Nagy the subject of discussion 
at the July meeting of the district council ? 

Mrs. Healey. I gather you are referring to the execution of Nagy ? 

The Chairman. Imre Nagy. 

Mrs. Healey. I decline to answer. 

The Chairman. Mr. Tavenner appreciates your superior knowledge 
of Mr. Nagy. 

Mrs. Healey. I am of Hungarian ancestry. 

Mr. Tavenner. Did not Pettis Perry and Charlene Mitchell, both 
members of the national committee, James Forest, William Taylor, 
and others, take the floor at the meeting of July 27, and express ap- 
proval of the Soviet execution of Prime Minister Nagy? 

Mrs. Healey. Same answer, Mr. Tavenner. 

Mr. Tavenner. Did you not oppose at the meeting of July 27 and 
disagree with that part of the Thompson report relating to the lack 



COMMUNISM IN SOUTHERN CALIFORNIA AREA 51 

of confidence by Communist Party members in the Communist Party 
and in its future ? 

Mrs. Healey. Same answer. 

Mr. Tavenner. The committee has information that at this meeting 
of July 27, you stated that the Thompson approach on this question 
was a real Trotsky line. Is that true ? 

Mrs. Healey. Same answer, Mr. Tavenner. 

Mr. Tavenner. I fail to see any reason for levity that you seem to 
be attempting to express here. 

Mrs. Healey. Well, I must confess that, in the first place, the repe- 
tition of questions in an illegal field becomes very wearisome. Sec- 
ondly, the contents of some of the questions I gather are being asked 
in a facetious manner. 

Mr. Tavenner. No. 

The Chairman. It must occur to you that someone knows all 
about your activities to give us this information. 

Mrs. Healey. Then if that is true, Mr. Walter, all the more rea- 
son why this hearing is even more farcical than I indicated earlier. 
If you already think that you know the answers to these questions 
then my appearance is certainly a waste of your time and my time. 

The Chairman. The last thing in the world I would do would be 
waste my time. 

Mrs. Healey. And I hope mine. 

The Chairman. I am disturbed, though, by your refusal to help 
this committee because we have every reason to believe that you 
could render a great deal of service in the strengthening of the se- 
curity of this great comitry of ours. 

Mrs. Healey. I have a very strong feeling about strengthening 
the security of our country. I feel it most passionately and deeply. 
I think the best strength of this committee would be the abolition of 
the mandate which, according to my opinion, weakens the security 
of the country. 

Mr. Tavenner. That is because of its efforts to present to Congress 
the real facts regarding the activities of the Communist Party of 
which you are a member, a leading member ; isn't that true ? 

Mrs. Healey. The fact is that for over at least 20 years this com- 
mittee has been carrying out ostensibly at least that purported pur- 
pose, and the fact remains that all that time this committee has not 
been able to bring in constitutional legislation because it is attempting 
to go into fields which the committee knows is forbidden to it, and 
tlierefore the conclusion of any citizen must be that what the commit- 
tee is attempting to do is sini])ly to i)erpetuate itself and to carry 
on an attack of black lies, of attempting exposure, in order to conduce 
an atmosphere of conformity in the country. It is not a new thing 
historically, and it is one of the reasons why the Bill of Rights was 
put into the Constitution. From time immemorial there have been 
political and ambitious men who have attempted to do precisely that. 

I consider that resistance to this committee's illegal activities is the 
highest attribute of patriotism. 

Mr. Tavenner. Will you tell the committee whether or not at this 
meeting of July 27, you criticized the leadership of the Communist 
Party by charging that there will soon be no interparty democracy 
in (lio ( ^oirnuunist Party? 



52 COMMUNISM IN SOUTHERN CALIFORNIA AREA 

Mrs. Healey. The same answer as previously given. 

Mr. Tavenner. Were you influenced to make any statement be- 
fore this meeting of July 27 on interparty democracy by reason of the 
dropping of Sam Kushner of ('hicago, slated for election to the na- 
tional committee, because he did not come to the defense of the Den- 
nis and Thompson reports ? 

Mrs. Healey. Same answer. 

Mr. Tavenner. In fact, didn't you make that charge? 

Mrs. Healey. Same answer. 

Mr. Tavenner. Did you not also announce at this meeting of July 
27 that you made a motion to elect Ben Dobbs to the National Execu- 
tive Committee of the Communist Party when this, the second largest 
Communist area in the country, had no representation on that body ? 

Mrs. Healey. Same answer. 

Mr. Tavenner. You did present such a motion, did you not, and 
it was defeated ? 

Mrs. Healey. Same answer. 

Mr, Tavenner. Were you influenced in your criticism of the leader- 
ship of the Communist Party by the fact that at the meeting of the 
national committee you were limited to 10 minutes over a period of 
3 days to express your views on Communist Party issues? 

Mrs. Healey. Same answer, 

Mr. Tavenner. Didn't you amiounce to the district meeting that 
that was all the time you were allowed ? 

Mrs, Healey. Same answer. 

Mr. Tavenner. Did you not criticize the leadership of the Com- 
munist Party on the ground that although the Thompson report was 
permitted to be filed and approved, you were not given an opportunity 
to even discuss it on the floor ? 

Mrs. Healey. Same answer. 

Mr. Tavenner. Didn't you charge that the penalty of nonconform- 
ity to the dictates of the leadership of the Coimnunist Party was 
expulsion from leadereliip ? 

Mrs. Healey. In view of all your questions, Mr. Tavenner, that 
you have been asking me, both you and the Congressman claim that 
you have tliis in your file, and it would appear to be at least para- 
doxical. You claim that I am a member of the national committee 
and then you recite all these lists of disagreements and contradictions 
tliat I have with the national committee, and yet you say 

The Chairman. Will you ansAver the question ? 

Mr. Tavenner. What do you say ? 

Mrs. Healey. I decline to ansAver tlie question. 

Mr. Tavenner. Did Ben Davis at the national committee meeting 
charge you with Titoism? 

Mrs. Heali:y. Same answer. 

Mr. Tavenner. Didn't you state that that occurred at the meeting 
of your district council on July 27 ? 

Mrs. Healey. Same answer. 

Mr. Tavenner. Did you not also say — ]p< ino put it this Avay — 
tlie committee has information tliat at the meeting of July 27, yon 
stated that Ben Davis at the national committee meeting said that you 
should be removed from leadership iu southern California? 

Mrs. Healey. Same answer. 



COMMUNISM IN SOUTHERN CALIFORNIA AREA 53 

]\Ir. Tavknnek. Is that true ? 

Mrs. Healey. Same answer. 

Mr. Ta\^nner. "VVTien you reported what Ben Davis had said, did 
not most of those present at the district convention applaud, thus 
indicating their approval of your removal from leadership in the 
Conmiunist Party in the Soutliern District of California (^ 

Mrs. Healey. Same answer. 

Mr. Tavenner. After the making of a minority report by you at 
the meeting of July 27 of the district council, what course was then 
taken at the meeting to stifle tlie opposition that you had expressed 
to tlie Dennis report, the execution of Nagy, and your opposition to 
the Thompson report ? 

Mrs. Healey. Same answer, Mr. Tavenner. 

Mr. Tavenner. Was not Pettis Perry called upon to make a ma- 
jority report from the floor? 

Mrs. Healey. Same answer, Mr. Tavenner. 

Mr. Ta^^nner. Did not Pettis Peri-y read to those present page 74 
of the Sixteenth National Convention party resolution, stating that 
the majority views must be abided by ? 

Mrs. Healey. Same answer. 

Mr. Tavenner. Did he not state that all Communists are duty- 
bound to support all three reports ? 

Mrs. Healey. Same answer. 

Mr. Tavenner. Did not Pettis Perry criticize the Healey bloc for 
standing up and criticizing Socialist countries in the national com- 
mittee meeting? 

Mrs. Healey. Same answer. 

Mr. Tavenner. Does not all this demonstrate that the Foster fac- 
tion is firmly in control of the Communist Party, USA, that demo- 
cratic centralism at its worst is being enforced under the threats of 
expulsion ? 

(Counsel confers with his client.) 

Mr. Tavenner. And the country is in fact being faced with the same 
Communist Party as existed prior to the Sixteenth National Conven- 
tion and under the tutelage and direction of Moscow ? 

Mrs. Healey. Well, if what you mean by demonstration, that type 
of demonstration that would be necessary under due process, I don't 
think your question demonstrates anything. No facts have been ad- 
duced that indicate that. But you obviously have an opinion. If 
you are asking my opinion, I decline to answer on the grounds 
previously stated. 

Mr. Tavenner. In fact, the only thing that saved you at the July 
meeting from disciplinary action of the Communist Party was the 
tabling of a motion that was made for your removal as district chair- 
man ; isn't that correct? 

Mrs. Healey. Same answer. 

(Counsel confers Avith his client.) 

Mr. Tavenner. What is the Connnunist Paity plan at this time for 
the infiltration of non-Communist associations in southern California? 

Mrs. Healey. Same answer. 

Mr. Tavenner. I have no further questions, Mr. Chairman. 

The Chairman. I have no questions. 

Mr. Tuck. I have no questions. 



54 COMMUNISM IN SOUTHERN CALIFORNIA AREA 

Mr. Ta\'enner. Mr. Chairman, three witnesses have been subpenaed 
who are represented by Mr. Margolis, each of whom has furnished 
medical information indicating serious ilhiess and, in the judgment of 
their physicians, it would be dangerous for them to appear as wit- 
nesses. I seem to have mislaid them. 

Mr. Margolis. I have them. 
^ The Chairman. Do you know the physicians ? 

Mr. Margolis. I do not, sir, but I know their reputation. One of 
them, for example, is from Cedars of Lebanon Hospital. I do not 
know if you are familiar with it, but it is considered one of the finest 
hospitals here. I do not think that I know any of the three doctors 
personally, if that is what you are asking, but I do know them by repu- 
tation. I have talked to them over the phone. 

The Chairman. They would not give certificates unless there was 
reason for it ? 

Mr. Margolis. I am absolutely positive they would not. I told them 
over the phone, though, I don't think it is necessary that they should 
be willing to submit each of these persons to a physical examination to 
any doctor that the committee desired if the committee desired it, 
and that we wanted the kind of report which any reputable doctor 
would agree with one way or the other. 

The Chairman. These are reputable doctors ? 

Mr. Margolis. Oh, yes : no question about it. 

The Chairman. I guess that is all right. 

Mr. Ta\^nner. The names of these witnesses are Morris Karson, 
, and . 

May I suggest that the medical statements be filed ? 

The Chairman. Yes, we will file them and continue these witnesses 
under subpena. 

]Mr. ]Margolis. Continue pending further investigation ? 

The Chairman. That is right. 

Mr. ]\Iargolis. As I say, they are willing, any of them, to submit to 
an examination if that is the desire of the committee. 

As I understand it, their present appearance date is vacated ; is that 
correct ? 

The Chairman. No ; it is not vacated. It is set aside for the moment. 
Tliey do not have to appear until they are notified. 

^fr. Margolis. I understand that. In other words, it will not be 
a defiance to this committee's order not to appear on the date for which 
they have the subpena. 

Tlie Chairman. Call your next witness. 

Mr. Ta'\t:nner. I would like to call Mr. Donald Wheeldin. 

The Chairman. Will you raise your right hand ? 

Mr. Miller. I am not Mr. "VVlieeldin, Your Honor. 

The Chairman. Do not call me "Your Honor." 

Mr. Millar. Excuse the old courtroom habit. 

STATEMENTS OF LOREN MILLER AND AL WIRIN, ATTORNEYS, 
LOS ANGELES, CALIT. 

Mr. Miller. My name is Loren Miller. I am an attorney at law 
with offices at 2822 South Western, Los Angeles. My telephone 
number is REpublic l-il42. I appear here with Mr. Al Wirin, who is 
also an attorney here on behalf of Mr. Wlieeldin. 



COMMUNISM IN SOUTHERN CALIFORNIA AREA 55 



If I may be permitted to do so 

The Chairman. On behalf of whom ? 

Mr. Tavenner. The name is Don Wheeldin, W-h-e-e-1-d-i-n. 

Mr. Miller. If I may be permitted, I would like to make a state- 
ment. 

Mr. Tavenner. May I ask a question first ? 

Mr. Miller. Yes. 

The Chairman. A'\niere is the witness? 

Mr. MILTJ2R. If I may make a statement, I will explain as best I 
can where the witness is. 

The Chairman. The witness was subpenaed and he is not here? 

Mr. Miller. That is the fact of the matter, sir. 

The Chairman. Is not that the end of it, Mr. Tavenner ? 

Mr. Tavenner. Yes, sir. 

The Chairman. All right. Call another witness. 

Mr. Miller. I take it by that yon would not permit me to make an 
explanation of his absence ? 

The Chairman. Your sole function in matters of this sort is to 
advise your client as to his rights under the Constitution of the 
United States, not to advise us. 

Mr. Miller. I understand that. 

The Chairman. Call your next witness. 

Mr. Tavenner. Mrs. Newman. 

The Chairman. Will you raise your right hand, please? 

Do you solemnly swear that the testimony you are about to give 
will be the truth, the whole truth, and nothing but the truth, so helj) 
you God ? 

Mrs. Newman. I do. 

TESTIMONY OF MARY LOIS NEWMAN, ACCOMPANIED BY COUNSEL, 

DAN MARSHALL 

Mr. Tavenner. Will you state your name, please ? 

Mrs. Newman. Mary Lois Newman. 

Mr. Tavenner. Let the record show the witness is accompanied by 
INIr. Dan Marshall, counsel, from the city of Los Angeles. 

Mr. Marshall. Mr. Tavenner and this committee, this witness 
intends — — 

The Chairman. Mr. Marshall, we have not asked her any questions. 

Mr. Marshall. One question. 

The Chairman. We will ask her the questions and then you can 
advise her, but we do not permit statements, as you well know. 

Mr. Marshall. There is a question pending. May I have it again ? 

Mr. Tavenner. What is your address? 

(Counsel confers with his client.) 

The ChxVIRman. Do you need legal advice as to where you live? 

(Counsel confers with his client.) 

Mrs. Newman. I am going to decline to answer under my constitu- 
tional privileges of the first amendment and fifth amendment. 

Mr. Marshall. Mr. Tavenner, the witness has not finished. 

(Counsel confers with his client.) 

'I'he Chairman. What is it you are reading? 

Mrs. Newman. A memorandum. 



56 COMMUNISM IN SOUTHERN CALIFORNIA AREA 

The Chairman. I think the record should show that counsel handed 
a piece of paper to the witness from which she is reading. 

Mrs. Newman. Yes. 

The Chairman. From what are you reading ? 

Mrs. Newman. A memorandum. 

The Chairman. All right. 

Mrs. Newman. I will decline to answer on the 1st amendment, the 
Bill of Rights, the 4th amendment of the Bill of Rights, the (itli amend- 
ment of the Bill of Rights, the 9th amendment of the Bill of Rights, 
and the 10th amendment of the Bill of Rights, and that it lacks 
pertinency. 

The Chairman. You are declining to answer for the reasons given 
to the question as to your address ? 

(Counsel confers with his client.) 

Mrs. Newman. Yes, sir. 

Mr. Tavenner. Do j^ou live at 215 Sandalwood Avenue, La Puente, 
Calif.? 

Mrs. Newman. I will decline to answer on the same grounds. 

Mr. Tavenner. What is your occupation ? 

Mrs. Newman. I decline to answer on the same grounds. 

Mr. Taa'enner. Are you a housewife and seamstress ? 

Mrs. Newman. Same answer. 

Mr. Marshall. Mr. Walter, will it be understood that 

The Chairman. By "the same answer," you mean the answers 
she read from the piece of paper that you handed her when she was 
asked the first question ? 

Mr. Marshall. That is, she will be deemed to have declined to 
answer upon all the grounds stated. 

The Chairman. That is right. 

Mr. Marshall. In her refusal to answer the first question. 

The Chairman. That is right. 

Mr. Tavenner. Was your maiden name Mary Lois Brahm ? 

Mrs. Newman. I decline to answer on the same grounds that I 
previously stated. 

Mr. Taa^enner. Was the date of your birth April 17, 1918, in 
Indiana ? 

Mrs. Newman. I decline to answer on the same grounds as stated 
before. 

Mr. Tavenner. Are you currently a member of the Communist 
Party of Los Angeles County ? 

Mrs. Newman. I decline to answer on the same gi-ounds. 

Mr. Tavenner. According to committee information, you were a 
member of the Communist Party as far back as 1943 in this area. Is 
that true, or is it false ? 

Mrs. Newman. I decline to answer on the same grounds. 

Mr. Tavenner. Have you recently resigned from the Communist 
Party? 

Mrs. Newman. I decline to answer on the same grounds. 

Mr. Ta\t:nner. According to information in possession of the com- 
mittee, you signed a letter dated December 14, 1957, as one of the 22 
individuals, addressed to the National Committee of tlie Conmiunist 
Party of the United States, which was in the form of a letter of 
grievances. 



COMMUNISM IN SOUTHERN CALIFORNIA AREA 57 

Our principal puq)ose in calling- you here is to ask 3^on the circum- 
stances under which you signed this letter. 

(Counsel confers with his client.) 

Mr. Marshaij,. May we have a copy of the letter that you referred 
to? 

The Chairman. After she answers the question we will be very 
Iiappy to furnish her with the letter. 

Air. Tavenner. My question is : Did you sign such a letter ? 

Mrs. Newman. I decline to answer on the same grounds. 

Mr. Tavenner. Were you a member of the San Gabriel Section of 
the Communist Party on December 14, 1957 ? 

(Counsel confers w^th his client.) 

Mrs. Newman. I decline to answer on the same grounds. 

Mr. Ta\tenner. You are the wife of Mr. Morton Newman ; are you 
not? 

Mrs. Newman. I decline to answer on the same grounds. 

Mr. Ta\'enner. Mr. Morton Newman also signed this letter or is 
purported to have signed this letter of December 14, 1957, and also 
js purported to have resigned from the Communist Party under date 
of March 26, 1958. 

Mr, Marshall. Could the entire question be ref ramed ? 

Mr. TA^^ENNER. Yes, if there is confusion about it. 

The committee has information that Mr. Morton Newman signed the 
Los Angeles 22 letter of grievances bearing date December 14, 1957, 
find that he also signed a letter of resignation to the Communist Party 
bearing date of March 26, 1958, thus indicating his resignation from 
the party on the latter date. 

Did you resign from the Communist Party on the 26th of March 
1958? 

Mrs. Newman. I decline to answer on the same grounds. 

Mr. Tavenner. Were you at any time a functionary of tlie Com- 
munist Party ? 

(Counsel confers with his client.) 

Mrs. Newman. I decline to answer on tlie same grounds. 

Mr. Tavenner. Were you directed by a Communist Party organiza- 
tion to Avork for the Communist Party in mass organizations, such as 
women's groups ? 

(Witness confers with her counsel.) 

Mrs. Newman. I will decline to answer on the same grounds. 

Mr. Tavenner. Or the Independent Progressive Party ? 

(Counsel confers with his client.) 

Mrs. Newman. I will decline to answer on the same grounds. 

Mr. Ta\t:nner. Did you engage in activities in those organizations 
for the Communist Party ? 

Mrs. Newman. I will decline to answer on the same grounds. 

Mr. Tavenner. I offer in evidence a copy of a petition to partici- 
pate in the primary election of June 1, 1948, of the Independent Pro- 
gressive Party of California to which there is appended an affidavit 
of Mrs. Mary Lois Newman, and ask that it be marked "Newman 
Exhibit No. 1." 

The Chairman. IMark it and let it be made a part of the record. 

(Document marked "Newman Exhibit No. 1" and retained in com- 
mittee files.) 



58 COMMUNISM IN SOUTHERN CALIFORNIA AREA 

Mr. Tavenner. I hand the witness the exhibit and ask if the signa- 
( lire appearing on the last page is her signature [document handed to 
witness and her counsel] . 

(Witness confers with her counsel.) 

Mrs. Newman. I will decline to answer on the same gi'ounds. 

Mr. TA\'EiNrNER. I have no further questions, Mr. Chairman. 

The Chairman. Are there any questions ? 

Mr. Tuck. No. 

Mr. WiRiN. This time the witness whom I represent is here. 

The Chairman. I notice. 

Will you raise your right hand ? Stand up, please. 

Do you swear the testimony you are about to give will be tlie truth, 
the whole truth, and nothing but the trutli, so help you God ? 

Mr. Arkin. I do. 

TESTIMONY OF DAVID FRANCIS ARKIN, ACCOMPANIED BY 
COUNSEL, AL WIRIN 

Mr. Tavenner. You are Mr. David Francis Arkin, A-r-k-i-n? 

Mr. Arkin. That is right, sir. 

Mr. Tavenner. It is noticed that the witness is accompanied by 
counsel, Mr. Al Wirin, of the Los Angeles Bar. 

"\^nien and where were you born, ISIr. Arkin ? 

Mr. Arkin. I was born December 19, 1906, in New York City. 

Mr. TAMi:NNER. What is your occupation ? 

Mr. Arkin. At the present time I am unemployed. 

Mr. Taa^enner. Previous to that, what was your occupation ? 

Mr. Arkin. I was a designer, draftsman. 

Mr. Tavenner. Previous to that ? 

Mr. Arkin. I was a teacher. 

Mr. Tavenner. Will you state briefly your formal educational 
training? 

Mr. Arkin. I had a bachelor's degree, a B.A., aud rouglily about 80 
postgraduate credits in general fields of education. 

The Chairman. Where ? 

Mr. Arkin. That was at New York University. 

Mr, Ta\t.nner. According to the committee's information, you were 
employed by the Los Angeles City Board of Education as a school- 
teacher from 1947 to approximately 1953, is that correct ? 

Mr. Arkin. That is cori-ect. 

^Ir. Tavenner. When did you first come to California from New 
^m-kCity? 

Mr. Arkin. I imagine in 1945. 

Mr. TA^^2NNER. What was the nature of your employment between 
1945 and 1947? 

Mr. Arkin. During the war years I was a draftsman, and prior to 
tliat I was a teacher, a substitute teacher. 

Mv. Ta\tenner. What Avas the cause of the change of your employ- 
ment from that of a schoolteacher to that of a draftsman? 

Mr. Arkin. It was twice that I changed from that of a school- 
teacher to that of a draftsman. The original cause, when I first was 
a substitute teacher I mentioned, the pay of a substitute teacher was 
roughly about half of that of a regular teacher, and when the war 



COMMUNISM IN SOUTHERN CALIFORNIA AREA 59 

came along, I quit teaching because of the low pay and became a 
draftsman. 

Mr. Tavt.nner. You said that was tlie first time ? 

Mr. Arkin. That was the first time. 

Mr. Tavenner. What about the second time ? 

]Mr. Arkin. The second time I appeared before the Los Angeles 
Board of Education. I was called there under the terms of the Dil- 
Avorth Act to answer questions relative to my political affiliations. 

Mr. Tav'enner. By "political affiliations," do you refer to member- 
ship in the Communist Party ? 

Mr. Arkin. Tliey asked me questions as to membership in a politi- 
cal party. 

Mr. Tavenner. Will you answer my question, please, sir? 

Mr. Arkin. Yes, it was relati\e to that question. 

Mr, Tavenner. What was the result of that hearing? 

Mr. Arkin. The result was that I was discharged from my posi- 
tion because I refused to answer the queries of the Board of Educa- 
tion because I thought it an invasion of my constitutional rights. 

Mr. Taatsnner. At that time, were you a member of the Communist 
Party? 

Mr. Arkin. I feel that questions of this character, as I stated be- 
fore to the committee, and I am consistent, in that I feel they are an 
invasion of my rights as an American citizen under the Constitution 
and I feel that the Supreme Court has very clearly stated that I can 
be protected by the Constitution so as not to answer these questions. 

I think the committee itself would agree with me if what I read 
in the press is correct that the Supreme Court has stated that the 
Constitution forbids that type of inquiry into one's political views. 
(\)nsequently, I would like to refuse to answer that question on the 
grounds, first, of the 1st amendment which guarantees free speech, 
free assembly; secondly, on the ground of the 5th amendment; and 
tliird, on the ground of the 14th amendment, which I think also pro- 
tects me, because anything that protects one citizen of the United 
States in his rights, in his civil rights, also protects all citizens of 
the United States. 

I feel that this amendment which protects their rights in questions 
of race also protects me in that same regard. 

I also would like to say that I refuse to answer that question for 
the same reason as a teacher, that teachers down in the South refuse 
to answer whether they Avere members of the National Association 
of Colored People, because they were in a hostile political environ- 
ment. 

The Chairman. Do you refuse to answer the question ? 

Mr. Arkin. I refuse to answer on certain grounds. 

The Chairman. All right. 

Mr. Arkin. And I have not completed my grounds. It will be 
just another half a minute. 

I do not intend to make a speech here, but I want to state my 
grounds clearly, and it is hard for me, not being a trained legal person, 
to state them clearly, but for your satisfaction and myself — then, also, 
I refuse to answer as to that letter because of the precept set down 
to me by another teacher whose opinion I value very, ver}^ highly. 

Mr. Tavenner. Is it not true 

38253— 59— pt. 1 4 



60 COMMUNISM IN SOUTHERN CALIFORNIA AREA 

The CirATiofAN. Just u niinnto. 

You (Iodine to answer for those reasons? 

Mr. AiJKTN. T decline to ans-sver for those reasons. 

The Chaikman. All rifrht. 

Mr. TaveN'Ner. Is it. not true tlial. you are at this time a member 
of the Hioliland Park Club of the Zapata Section of the Communist 
Party of tlie Southern District of the Communist Part}^ of California ? 

Mr. Arkin. Well, I believe that this question is similar in char- 
acter to the other questions and I think tlie same reasons would liold. 

(Counsel confers with his client.) 

The Chairman. By that I understand you to mean that you i-efuse 
to answer for the reasons given for not answering the last question ? 

Mr. Arkin. Yes, because of constitutional grounds. 

The Chairman. I just want the record to show that. 

Mr. Arkin. Yes, constitutional grounds. 

Mr. Tavenner. May I have direction that the witness answer the 
question ? 

Tlie Chairman. Yes; you are directed to answer that question. 

Mr. Arkin. I refuse to answer that question for the same reasons 
mentioned on the same grounds. 

Mr. Tavenner. Did you at any time receive directions from a Com- 
munist Party unit to engage in Communist Party activities within 
various youth groups and panel meetings sponsored by the Com- 
munist Party? 

Mr. Arkin. Well, I refuse to answer on the same grounds because 
this is of the same character. 

Mr. Tavenner. Did you engage in such activities at the instance 
of the Communist Party? 

Mr. Arkin. Well, I refuse to answer on the same grounds. 

I had not completed my grounds before, but also on the grounds, 
as I am advised by my counsel, that I do not believe this question is 
pertinent to the activities of the committee, to the nature of this 
hearing. 

Mr. Tavenner. Were you directed by the Communist Party to 
engage in Communist Party activities within the Independent Pro- 
gressive Party ? 

Mr. Arkin. Well, I had not completed the grounds on which I 
refuse to answer. I said that there was a teacher wdio advised me 
on this question by letter and I attached great weight to it at a pre- 
vious time when questions of a similar character were asked. 

He sent me a letter and I think it reinforces my convictions : 

(Heading :) 

As you well know, I have repeatedly expressed my opinions on all the present 
infringements on the private and political life of teachers and other citizens, 
and I am convinced that noncooperation in all investigations of that kind is 
justified and even a civic duty. I am convinced that if the present tempest 
is blown out the people will recognize the important service you and your col- 
leagues have rendered to your community by your active courage and resistance. 

Signed "Albert Einstein." This was dated sometime before he 
died. 

The Chairman. Never mind. Answer the questions. 

Mr. Tavenner. Will you answer the question that I asked ? 

Mr. Arkin. I refuse to ansAver on these grounds and on the grounds 
that Ih9,yestate(3, 



COMMUNISM IN SOUTHERN CALIFORNIA AREA 61 

Mr. Tavexxer. Mr. Chairman, I offer in evidence a copy of a pe- 
tition of the Independent Progi-essive Party of California to par- 
ticipate in the primary election of June 1, 1948, at the end of which is 
attached an affidavit of David F. Arkin, as one who circulated this 
petition. May it be admitted in evidence and marked "Arkin Exhibit 
No. 1"? 

The Chairman. We will mark it. 

(Document marked "Arkin Exhibit No. 1" and retained i)i com- 
mittee files.) 

Mr. Tavenner. I hand yon the document and ask you whether or 
not that is your signature to the affidavit on the last page? 

Mr. Arkin. Well, I refuse to answer on the same grounds. 

Mr. Tavenner. At the time that you were a teacher in the public 
school system of Los Angeles, did you engage in other teaching in the 
summer ? 

Mr. Arkix'. In other teaching ? 

Mr. Tavenner. Yes. 

Mr. Arkin. No ; not in other teaching. 

Mr. Tavenner. I have before me the summer session, 1946, catalog 
of the People's Educational Center, which on page 11 carries this 
headnote in black type : 

American History, An Introduction. David F. Arl<in, Instructor. 

This is a study of the main periods in American history designed to develop 
a unified understanding of the social forces in the development of the United 
States. It will meet the needs both of previous students of history and those 
who have had no earlier study. The topics to be discussed here include the 
American colonists on the eve of the Revolution ; the American Revolution and 
the War for Independence ; organizing the Nation ; the rise of Jeffersonian 
democracy ; the defense of the Nation ; Jacksonian democracy ; slavery and the 
antislavery movements ; the Civil War ; reconstructing the Nation ; America be- 
comes industrialized ; and America becomes a world power. Monday 7 :00 to 8 :30 
P.M. 

Did you conduct that course ? 

Mr. AiiKiN. No ; I did not conduct the course and at the time — your 
question was. Was I teaching at the time ? I was not teaching at that 
time. The course was never given. And consequently I did not con- 
duct the course. At that time I was without employment. They 
offered me some job with an educational center. 

Mr. Tavenner. You did have a job at the educational center ? 

Mr. Arkin. No ; I did not have a job. They offered me some work 
as a course. 

Mr. TA^^NNER. The People's Educational Center offered you 

Mr. Arkin. Some work. I was out of work at the time but I was 
not teaching at the time. You understand 

Mr. Tavenner. Nevertheless you were listed in the catalog for the 
summer session. 

Mr. Arkin. Well 

Mr. Tavenneh. As being prepared to give this course. 

Mr. Arkin. I was listed, but your original question had been, When 
I was teaching, did I teach during the summer? 

Mr. Tavenner. All right. You were listed in the catalog to give 
the course that I indicated. 

Mr. Arkin. The catalog gives my name and it was listed but tiie 
course was never ffiven. 



62 COMMUNISM IN SOUTHERN CALIFORNIA AREA 

Mr. Tavennj^r. But you did uot participate in the giving of this 
course ? 

Mr. Arkin. Xo ; I did not. 

Mr. Tavexner. Did you engage in any work for the People's Edu- 
cational Center with or without pay ? 

Mr. Arkin. I didn't participate there as an organized member. 
There was a prospectus given but I did not participate at this time. 

Mr. Tavenner. Did you at any otlier time ? 

Mr. Arkix. No; not at any otlier time. 

Mr. Tavenner. Did you lend your services in any way to the Peo- 
ple's Educational Center? 

Mr. Arkin. They wanted to organize the course. They were will- 
ing to pay a nominal sum for a course they knew that I had some ex- 
perience teaching and they wanted to organize the course. 

I at that time was unemployed and any chance to earn some money, 
to me, was a valuable chance. I agreed. The course was not given. 
There was a prospectus telling ab<)ut the course but I was not em- 
ployed. I never received any pay for it and the course was not 
promulgated. 

Mr. Tavenner. Yes, but you have not directly and specifically an- 
swered my question. Did you engage in any services of any char- 
acter for the People's Educational Center, whether it was conducting 
a course, assisting in the conducting of a course, or anything ? That 
is as broad as one can make it. 

Mr. Arkin. By services, do you mean paid services ? 

Mr. Tavenner. Xo, I specifically said paid or unpaid. 

Mr. Arkin. Well, I prepared prospectuses for this particular course, 
let us say. I assisted in preparing what I thought would be a good 
course in American histoiy. The course was never given. 

Mr. Tavenner. Did you perform any services other than the 
preparation of this prospectus ? 

Mr. Arkin. No. I simply wanted to be as frank as possible with 
the committee insofar as questions were asked me which I didn't think 
Avere an invasion of my constitutional rights. At this particular time 
I felt, after the war, was interested in general progressive ideas in- 
volved around the Roosevelt movement. So I lent my services to that 
course. 

Mr. Tavenner. Was the summer session of that school conducted 
at all? 

Mr. Arkin. That I don't knoAv, because I wasn't very greatly in- 
volved with that school because I was rather new to the city. I had 
come to the city rather early and I was looking for work in California 
as a draftsman and something came along in the interim and I 
thought that that might be a possibility there. But it wasn't. It 
didn't turn out to be a possibility for work. 

Mr. Tavenner. It was cited as a Communist and subversive organ- 
ization by the then Attorney General, Tom Clark, in a letter released 
on June 1, 104S. Were vou connected in any way with that organiza- 
tion after June 1, lO-tS?" 

Mr. Arkin. I doubt it. I really doubt it. I came to California, I 
think it Avas lO-iG. I doubt it. 



COMMUNISM IN SOUTHERN CALIFORNIA AREA 63 

j\Ir. Tavenner. Are you aware of the writing of a letter of griev- 
ances to the National Committee of the Communist Party by members 
of the Communist Party of Southern California, in December 1957? 

(Witness confers with his counsel.) 

Mr. Arkin. I refuse to answer that question on the same constitu- 
tional grounds. 

Mr. Tavenner. Were you solicited to be one of the signers of that 
letter? 

Mr. Arkin. I refuse to answer the question. 

]\Ir. Tavenner. The letter was followed by a reply made by Dorothy 
Ray Healey at a district council meeting, and then by a letter of 
resignation signed by quite a number of the Communist Party mem- 
bers of southern California under date of March 26, 1958. Were you 
solicited to join in that letter of resignation? 

Mr. Arkin. I refuse to answer on the same grounds. 

Mr. Tavenner. Were you a member of the Communist Party on 
March 26, 1958? 

Mr. Arkin. I refuse to answer on the same grounds. 

Mr. Tavenner. Are you a member of the Communist Party now ? 

Mr. Arkin. I refuse to answer on the same grounds, sir. 

Mr. Tavenner. I have no further questions, Mr. Chairman. 

The Chairman. Any questions ? 

Mr. Tuck. I have no questions. 

The Chairman. Will you stand and raise your right hand? 

Do you swear that the testmony you are about to give will be the 
truth, the wdiole truth, and nothing but the truth, so help you God ? 

Mr. Creed. I do. 

TESTIMONY OF THOMAS D. CREED, ACCOMPANIED BY COUNSEL, 

BEN MAEGOLIS 

Mr. Tavenner. What is your name, please, sir ? 

Mr. Creed. Thomas D. Creed. 

Mr. Tavenner. Will you spell your last name? 

Mr. Creed. C-r-e-e-d. 

Mr. Tavenner. Will counsel accompanying the witness please iden- 
tify himself for the record? 

Ail-. Margolis. Ben Margolis, 112 West 9th Street, Los Angeles, 
Calif. 

Mr. Tavenner. When and where were you bom, Mr. Creed ? 

Mr. Creed. I was born in Muscle Shoals, Ala., April 15, 1919. 

Mr. Tavenner. What is your occupation ? 

Mr. Creed. I am a stock chaser. 

Mr. Tavenner. A what ? 

Mr. Creed. Stock chaser. 

Mr. Tavenner. What industry ? 

Mr. Creed. The automobile industry. 

Mr. Tavenner. What is a stock chaser ? 

Mr. Creed. I belong with a group of other men in that line of work. 
We provide material to the assembly line so that it can operate. 

Mr. Tavenner. What is your residence ? 

Mr. Creed. 1436 West 48th Street, Los Angeles, Calif. 

Mr. Tavenner. Are you presently a member of the Communist 
Party? 



64 COMMUNISM IN SOUTHERN CALIFORNIA AREA 

Mr. Creed. I am ^oing to refuse to ansAver that question. 

The Chairman. Do you refuse to answer? 

Mr. Creed. I do refuse to answer that question. 

The Chairman. The record has to show that you refuse to answer. 

Mr. Tavenner. Is it not a fact that you are currently a member of 
the executive board of tlie Southern California District Council 
of the Communist Party ? 

Mr. Creed. I refuse to answer that question. 

Mr. Tavenner. The committee has information that this executive 
board is composed of 10 persons of which Dorothy Ray Ilealey 
is the chairman, and I am referring to the executive board of 
tlie district council. Will you state whether or not Horace V. Alex- 
ander is one of tlie members of that board? 

Mr. Creed. I refuse to answer that question. 

Mr. Tavenner. Is Ben Dobbs a member ? 

Mr. Creed. I refuse to answer that question. 

Mr, Tavenner. Is James Forest a member ? 

Mr. Creed. I refuse to answer that question. 

Mr, Tavenner. Is Bernard Lusher a member? 

Mr. Creed. I refuse to answer that question. 

Mr. Tavenner. Is Charlene Mitchell a member? 

Mr. Creed. I refuse to answer that question. 

Mr. Tavenner. Is Nemmy Sparks a member? 

Mr. Creed. I refuse to answer that question. 

Mr. Tavenner. Are you at the present time a member of the District 
Labor Commission of the Communist Party of the Southern District 
of California ? 

Mr. Creed. I refuse to answer that question. 

Mr. Tavenner. May I have a direction that the witness answer that 
question ? 

The Chairman. You are directed to answer. 

Mr. Margolis. Did the witness state the grounds for his refusal? 

The Chairman. No. 

Mr. Tavenner. If he says for the reasons heretofore given 

Mr, Margolis. I wondered if he hadn't given any reasons. 

Mr, Creed, I hadn't been directed to answer the question until the 
present time. I am refusing to answei' the question under direction 
for the following reasons: I don't think that any questions you might 
ask me about any people with whom I might associate or any organi- 
zations to which I might belong are pertinent to any field of legislation 
of which this committee is empowered to make an investigation. I 
think that such questions are an invasion of my rights under the first 
amendment guaranteeing me freedom of speech, assembly, and asso- 
ciation of people of my own choosing, and lastly, on refusing to answer, 
I am invoking my rights under the fifth amendment protecting me 
against possible self-incrimination. 

Mr. Tavenner. May I have a direction ? 

The Chairman. You are directed to answer. 

Mr. Creed. I refuse to answer the question on the grounds stated. 

Mr, Tavenner, I hand you a document entitled "Trade Union Reso- 
lution, Southern California District Convention, parts I and II." 
Will you examine it, please, and state whether or not you can identify 
it as a document of the Communist Party for the Southern District 
of California? 



COMMUNISM IN SOUTHERN CALIFORNIA AREA 65 

Mr. Creed. I refuse to identify tlie document on the grounds previ- 
ously stated. 

Mr. Tavenner. This document shows on its face that it deals with 
the national draft trade union resolution, and that it was adopted by 
the trade union subcommittee of the resolutions committee of the 
Southern California District Convention. 

Will you tell the committee, please, who composed the trade union 
subcommittee of the resolutions committee? 

Mr. Creed. I refuse to answer that question on the grounds pre- 
viously stated. 

Mr. Tavenner. As indicated, the committee has information that 
you were a member of the District Labor Commission of the Com- 
munist Party. Is that true? 

Mr. Creed. I refuse to answer that question on the grounds pre- 
viously stated. 

Mr. Ta\t!nner. Is not Bernard Lusher the head of that conunission ? 

Mr. Creed. I refuse to answer that question on the grounds stated. 

Mr. Tavenner. The committee has information that you have been 
active for the Communist Party for a number of years in the trade- 
union area. Is that correct ? 

Mr. Creed. I refuse to answer that question on the grounds pre- 
viously stated. 

Mr. Tavenner. Were you not a delegate to the Southern Cali- 
fornia District Convention of the Communist Party held on April 
13 and 14,1957? 

Mr. Creed. I refuse to answer that question for the same reasons. 

Mr. Tavenner. Did you not represent the labor section of the Com- 
munist Party at that convention ? 

Mr. Creed. I refuse to answer that question for the same reasons. 

Mr. Tavenner. While in attendance at that convention, did you 
hear the address of Dorothy Healey in w^hich she outlined the pro- 
gram of the Communist Party in the labor field ? 

Mr. Creed. I refuse to answer that question on the same grounds. 

Mr. Tavenner. Are you aware of the present plan for Com- 
munist Party activities within the field of labor in the Southern 
District of California ? 

Mr. Creed. I refuse to answer that question for the same reasons. 

Mr. Tavenner. Have you participated in any activity of the Com- 
munist Party in support of the Foster group of the Communist Party 
as distinguished from the so-called revisionists? 

Mr. Creed. I refuse to answer that question for the same reasons. 

Mr. Tavenner. You are aware of the fact, are you not, that at a 
meeting of the district council on the 27th of July 1958, a motion was 
made, although tabled, to oust Dorothy Ray Healey from leadership 
in the Communist Party in Southern California? You are aware 
of that ; are you not ? 

Mr. Creed. I refuse to answer that question on the grounds pre- 
viously stated. 

Mr. Tavenner. Are you suppoi-ting her in her activities in the 
Communist Party or are you opposing her ? 

Mr. Creed. I am refusing to answer the question on the grounds 
stated. 



66 COMMUNISM IN SOUTHERN CALIFORNIA AREA 

Mr. Tavenner. Are you now a member of the United Auto and 
Aircraft Workers Union ? 

Mr, Creed. I stated earlier I wasn't going to answer any questions 
concerning any organizations to which I am a member. I refuse to 
answer the question on the gi'ounds previously stated. 

Mr. Tavenner. May I have a direction ? 

The Chairman. You are directed to answer. 

Mr. Creed. I refuse to answer the question on the grounds pre- 
viously stated. 

Mr. Tavenner. Is action being taken because of the fact that 
you were discharged from Chrysler Local 230 as a member, or I 
should say suspended instead of discharged ? 

Mr. Creed. I didn't understand your question. 

Mr. Tavenner. Are you taking the position that you will 
not answer questions regarding your union because you were at one 
time, in 1952, discliarged from membership in Chrysler Local 280 
for conduct unbecoming a union member ? 

(Witness confers with his counsel.) 

Mr. Creed. You have been making a lot of statements which make 
assumptions. I don't necessarily accept your assumptions but I am 
refusing to answer the questions for the grounds stated. 

Mr. Tavenner. Since you refer to it as being an assumption, let 
me introduce in evidence a thermofax copy of an article from the 
February 13, 1952, issue of the People's World referring to the 
charges that had been made against you by your union, and ask that 
it be marked "Creed Exhibit No. 1." 

Tlie CHAiR:\rAN. It may be made a part of the record. 

(Document marked "Creed Exhibit No. 1" and retained in com- 
mittee files.) 

Mr. Tavenner. Were you not fined $100 and given a year's sus- 
pension ? 

Mr. Creed. I refuse to answer tliat question. I do so on the 
grounds previously stated. 

Afv. Tavenner. At a su1)sequent date did not the international ex- 
ecutive board of tlie CIO, Ignited Anto and Aircraft Workers, reverse 
the decision and restore you to employment ; isn't that correct ? 

Mr. Creed. I refuse to answer that question on the grounds pre- 
vionsly stated. You know all this. 

The Chairman. What do you mean he knows it ? 

Mr. Creed. You claim to know it. 

jNtr. Tavenner. Then you admit that it is correct? 

Mr. Creed. I am not admitting anything. 

Afr. Tavennkr. Let us come then to tliis <]nestion. Was it known to 
the international executive board. Ignited Auto and Aircraft Workers, 
;vt the time of the reversal, that vou were a member of the Communist 
Party ? 

Mr. Creed. I refuse to answer that question on the previous 
grounds. 

Mr. Tavenner. Your membership in the Communist Party was 
the subject, the real motivating subject, of your suspension; was it 
not? 
"Mr. Creed. I refuse to answer tliat question on pi'evious grounds. 



COMMUNISM IN SOUTHERN CALIFORNIA AREA 67 

Mr. Tavenner. You were during that period a member of tlie 
Communist Party? 

Mr. Creed. I refuse to answer that question for the same reasons. 

Mr. Tavenner. Do you liave a record of service in the Armed 
Forces ? 

Mr. Creed. I was in the United States Navy for 22 months. 

Mr. Tavenner. When and where were you discliarged ? 

Mr. Creed. February 16, 1946. 

Mr. Tavenner. It was an lionorable discharge ; was it not ? 

Mr. Creed. Yes, sir. 

Mr. Tavenner. After your discharge, did you become a member 
of the American Veterans Committee ? 

Mr. Creed. I refuse to answer that question on the grounds ])revi- 
ously stated. I have ah-eady said I wouldn't answer any questions con- 
cerning any organizations of whicli I am a member or may ha^e been 
a member. 

Mr. Tavenner. Were you a member in 1951 of the Haywood Section 
of the Communist Party ? 

Mr. Creed. I refuse to answer that question on previously stated 
grounds. 

Ml". Tavenner. Were you directed by any Communist Party unit 
to take part in the work of various organizations for the benefit of the 
Communist Party, for instance, the Negro Labor Council ? 

Mr. Creed. I refuse to answer that question on previous grounds. 

Mr. Tavenner. Didn't you become chairman of the publicity com- 
mittee of the Negro Labor Council of Los Angeles ? 

Mr. Creed. I refuse to answer that question on previously stated 
grounds. 

Mr. Tavenner. Were you not sent as a delegate of that council to 
the national convention held in Cleveland, Ohio, in 1952 ? 

Mr. Creed. I refuse to answer that question for the same reasons. 

Mr. Tavenner. Were you a delegate to the Los Angeles County (\)n- 
^'ention of the Communist Party held January 5 and 6, 1957 ? 

Mr. Creed. I refuse to answer that question for the same reasons. 

Mr. Tavenner. Were you not also a delegate to the California 
District Convention held on April 13 and 14, 1957, which was the or- 
ganizational meeting of the new district ? 

Mr. Creed. I refuse to answer that question for the same reasons. 

Mr. Tavenner. That is all, Mr. Chairman. 

The Chairman. Any questions ? 

Mr. Tuck. No questions. 

Mr. Creed. I am excused ? 

Mr. Tavenner. Yes, sir. 

The Chairman. We will take a brief recess. 

(Members present : Representatives Walter and Tuck.) 

( Short recess. ) 

( Members present : Representatives Walter and Tuck. ) 

The Chairman. AVill you stand please, and raise your right hand. 

Do you swear that the testimony you are about to give will be tlie 
truth, the whole truth, and nothing but the truth, so help you God ? 

Mr. Alexander. I do. 



G8 COMMUNISM IN SOUTHERN CALIFORNIA AREA 

TESTIMONY OF HORACE V. ALEXANDER, ACCOMPANIED BY 
COUNSEL, DAN MARSHALL 

Mr. Tavenner. State your name, please, sir. 

Mr. Alexander. My name is Horace V. Alexander. 

Mr. Tavenner. It is noted that the witness is accompanied by Mr. 
Dan Marshall, member of the Los Angeles Bar. 

"NVlieji and where were you born, Mr. Alexander? 

(Witness confers with his counsel.) 

Mr. Alexander. Mr. Chairman, I decline to answer this question 
on the following grounds : 

The 1st amendment of the Bill of Eights, the 4th amendment of the 
Bill of Rights, the 5th amendment of the Bill of Rights, the 6th 
amendment of the Bill of Rights, the 9th amendment of the Bill of 
Rights, the 10th amendment of the Bill of Rights; and further, Mr. 
Chairman, this question lacks pertinency. This committee has not 
given me or made available any knowledge which conceivably could 
make this inquiry and this question pertnient to that degree of ex- 
plicitness and authority required by the due process clause. The 
power of this committee is not unlimited, sir. It has no general 
authority to expose the private affairs of individuals simply for the 
sake of exposure. 

This investigation is unrelated to any legislative purpose, being 
beyond the powers conferred upon the Congress under the Consti- 
tution. 

This committee has not made it appear with undisputable clarity 
the subject matter of this inquiry. 

It is the duty of this committee on my present question on the 
grounds of pertinency to state for tlie record the subject of inquiry 
and the manner in which this question is pertinent. 

I further demand that this explanation must be meaningful, must 
define what the topic of the inquiry is, and the reason why the ques- 
tion now asked me relates to it. 

The Chairman. You have been merely asked your name. I direct 
you to answer the question. 

Mr. Marshall. I am sorry, Mr. Chairman, I couldn't quite hear 
v>^hat you said. 

Mr. Tavenner. It was the place of birth. 

The Chairman. He was asked the place of birth. Where were you 
born ? 

Mr. Alexander. I decline to answer the question, sir, on the 
grounds previously stated. 

Mr. Tavenner. Was the date of your birth May 17, 1924, and the 
city in Texas ? 

Mr, Alexander. I decline to answer that question, sir, on previous 
grounds. 

Mr. Tavenner. What is your address ? 

Mr. Alexander. I would decline to answer that question, sir, on 
tlie grounds stated. 

Mr. IVIarshall. Mr. Chairman, will it be understood that the wit- 
ness by declining to answer upon the grounds previously stated will 
be deemed to have incorporated in that objection all the grounds 
separately stated by him ? 



COMMUNISM IN SOUTHERN CALIFORNIA AREA 69 

The Chairman. Yes, it will be understood that when he objects 
and states ''on the grounds stated," it will include all of the grounds. 

Mr. Tavennek. Is your correct address 736 East 74:th Street, Los 
Angeles, Calif.? 

Mr. Alexandeh. I decline to answer that question sir, on the same 
grounds. 

jMr. Tavenner. Are you a machine shop foreman by occupation ? 

Mr. Alexander. I decline to answer that question on previous 
grounds. 

Mr. Tavenner. Did you serve in the Armed Forces of the United 
States? 

Mr. Alexander. I would decline to answer that question, sir, on the 
grounds stated above. 

Mr. Tavenner. Were you directed by any unit of the Communist 
I*arty to take part in any movement for the formation of the Inde- 
pendent Progressive Party ? 

Mr. Alexander. I would decline to answer that question, sir, on the 
grounds stated before. 

Mr. Tavenner. I offer in evidence a thermofax copy of an excerpt 
from the January 26, 1948, issue of People's World and ask that it be 
marked "Alexander Exhibit No. 1." 

The Chairman. It may be marked. 

(Document marked "Alexander Exliibit No. 1," and retained in 
committee files.) 

Mr. Tavenner. This article identifies the witnass as participating 
in the march sponsored by the youth committee of the Independent 
Progressive Party in opposition to universal military training. 

Did you engage in such an activity ? 

Mr. Marshall. Could we see the exhibit, Mr. Tavenner ? 

Mr. Tavenner. Yes. 

(Exhibit handed to the witness.) 

Mr. Alexander. I would decline to ansAver that question, sir, on 
(he grounds previously stated. 

Mr. Ta\t5NNEr. I olt'er in evidence a thermofax copy of an excerpt 
from the April 20, 1948, issue of the People's World,' entitled "2,000 
at Wallace Forum" and ask that it be marked "Alexander Exhibit No. 
2." This issue identifies the witness with the National Association 
for the Advancement of Colored People and also as a member of the 
Students For Wallace. 

(Document marked "Alexander Exhibit No. 2," and retained in 
committee files.) 

Mr. Tavenner. Will you state, Mr. Witness, whether or not on 
April 20, 1948, you were a member of the Communist Party ? 

Mr. Alexander. I decline to answei- that question, sir, on the same 
grounds stated before. 

Mr. Tavenner. I oftei- in evidence a thermofax copy of an excerpt 
from the July 27, 1948, issue of the People's World, and ask that it 
be nuii-ked "Alexander Exhibit No. o.'" 

(Document marked "Alexandrr l^^xhihit No. ■'<," and rt'laiucd in 
commiltee files.) 

Ml". Tavennek. This artich' idtMitllics (lie wilnt'ss as Slalc \icc 
chairman of Students For AYallace. 

Mr, Witness, were you on the 27th day of July 1948 a member of 
the Connnunist Party? 



70 COMMUNISM IN SOUTHERN CALIFORNIA AREA 

Mr. Alexander. I decline to answer tliat question on the grounds 
previously stated, sir. 

Mr. Tavenner. May the exhibits be received in evidence 'i 

The Chairman. They will be marked and received in the record. 

Mr. Tavenner. I desire to offer into evidence a therniofax copy of 
the March 30, 1954, issue of People's World and ask that it be 
marked "Alexander Exhibit No. 4." 

This document identifies the witness as a candidate for secretary of 
state on the Independent Progressive Party ticket. 

Were you a candidate for such an office in 1954? 

Mr. Alexander. I decline to answer the question on the grounds 
stated. 

(Document marked "Alexander Exhibit Xo. 4," and letained in 
conmiittee files.) 

Mr. Tavenner. Were you a member of the Communist Party on 
March 30, 1954? 

Mr. Alexander. I decline to answer that question, sir, on the pre- 
vious grounds stated. 

Mr. Tavenner. May the exhibit be accepted in evidence ? 

The Chairman. Yes. 

Mr. Tavenner. I offer in evidence !i photostatic copy of the ap- 
pomtment of members of the State Central Committee of the Inde- 
pendent Progressive Party in the year 1952 and ask that it be marked 
"Alexander Exhibit No. 5." 

The Chairman. Mark it and make it a part of the record. 

(Document marked "Alexander Exhibit No. 5," and retained in 
committee files.) 

Mr. Tavenner. This record identifies the witness as a member and 
shows the appointment of him as a member of the I.P.P., Independ- 
ent Progressive Party, State Central Committee, in the year 1952. 

Did you occupy that position in the year 1952 ? 

Mr. Alexader. I decline to answer that (iiiestion, sir, on the grounds 
previously stated. 

Mr. Tavenner. Were you a member of the Communist Party 

Mr. Alexander. I decline to answer tlie question, sir. 

Mr. Tavenner. Just a moment. On the 25th day of July 1952. 

Mr. Alexander. I decline to answer that question, sir, on the 
grounds previously stated. 

Mr. Tavenner. I offer in evidence an additional document, it being 
a photostatic copy of the appointment of members of the State Cen- 
tral Committee in the year 1954 which states tliat Horace V. Alexan- 
der, duly qualified as a delegate to the State convention by virtue of 
liis nomination to tlie office of secretary of state upon the Independent 
Progressive ticket, appoints the following three voters who wnll be 
members of the State Central Committee to meet on August 8, 1954; 
those persons being Mrs. Cliarlotta A. Bass, Reuben W. Borough, and 
Mrs. Ida Alvarez, and bears date the 30th day of July 1954, and ask 
that it be marked "Alexander Exhibit No. 6." 

The Chairman. It will be marked and received. 

(Document marked "Alexander Exhibit No. G" and retained in 
connnittee files.) 

Mr. Tavenner. Mr. Witness, will you examine the document, 
please, and state whether or not the signature appearing thereon is 
your genuine signature? 



COMMUNISM IN SOUTHERN CALIFORNIA AREA 71 

Mr. Alexander. I decline to answer that question, sir, on grounds 
previously stated. 

The Chairman. What is the secretary of state? Let me see that, 
Mr. Tavenner, please. 

Mr. Tavenner. I think he was a candidate for the secretary of 
state on the Independent Progressive ticket. 

The Chairman. Secretary of state of what ? 

Mr. Tavenner. California. 

I offer in evidence a thermof ax copy of an excerpt from the Novem- 
ber 25, 1949, issue of People's World, entitled, "NAACP Youth Re- 
jects Old Fashioned Advice," and ask that it be marked "Alexander 
Exhibit No. 7." 

The Chairman. It may be so marked. 

(Document marked "Alexander Exhibit No. 7," and retained in the 
committee files.) 

The Chairman. This article discloses that Mr. Alexander was 
elected as national vice president of the youth council of the NAACP. 

Were you a member of the Communist Party, Mr. Witness, on No- 
vember 25, 1949 ? 

Mr. Alexander. I decline to answer that question, sir, on the 
grounds previously stated. 

Mr. Tavenner. Did you serve as national vice president of the 
youth council of the NAACP ? 

Mr. Alexander. I decline to answer that question, sir, on the 
grounds previously stated. 

Mr. Tavenner. The March 22, 1955, issue of the People's World, at 
page 5, carries an article which is reprinted in Communist Political 
Subversion, Part 2, of a committee hearing. According to this article, 
Mr. Alexander participated in and spoke before the 5th Annual Con- 
ference of the Los Angeles Committee for Protection of Foreign Born. 

Do you recall the occasion of having appeared as a speaker before 
that group ? 

Mr. Alexander. I decline to answer that question on the grounds 
previously stated. 

Mr. Tavenner. Were you directed to appear before that group or 
coimseled in any way to do so by a unit of the Communist Party or 
any functionary of the Communist Party ? 

Mr. Alexander. I decline to answer that question, sir, on the 
grounds previously stated. 

Mr. Tavenner. Are you familiar with an organization which called 
itself the Emergency Free Press Committee ? 

Mr. Alexander. I decline to answer that question on all the grounds 
stated before, sir. 

Mr. Tavenner. I present you with a photostatic copy of a letter 
bearing date of November 1956 addressed to "Dear Friend," and bear- 
ing the signature of a number of persons including yourself, and at- 
tached to M-liich you will find an appeal or a solicitation for funds to 
be paid to Horace Alexander, trustee. 

Will you examine it, please, and state whether or not you were one 
of those who signed the letter ? 

(Document lianded to the witness and his counsel.) 

Mr. Alexander. I decline to answer that question, sir, on the 
grounds previously stated. 



72 COMMUNISM IN SOUTHERN CALIFORNIA AREA 

Mr. Tavenner. I desire to offer the document in evidence and ask 
that it be marked "Alexander Exhibit No. 8." 

The Chairman. It will be so marked. 

(Document marked "Alexander Exhibit No. 8," and retained in 
committee files.) 

Mr. TamsjS^ner. Was not the P^mergency Free Press Committee an 
organization set up for a brief period of time for the specific purpose 
of raising money for the Daily People's World ? 

Mr. Alexander. I decline to answer that question, sir, on the 
grounds previously stated. 

Mr. Tavenner. Were you a member of the Communist Party in No- 
vember 1956? 

Mr. Alexander. I decline to answer that question, sir, on the 
gromids previously stated. 

Mr. Ta\^nner. What position do you hold in the Communist Party 
now? 

Mr. Alexander. I decline to answer that question, sir, on the 
grounds stated before. 

Mr. Tavenner. The committee has information disclosing that you 
are a member at this time of the executive board of the Southern 
California District Council of the Communist Party. Is this not a 
fact? 

Mr. Alexander. I decline to answer that question, sir, on the 
grounds previously stated. 

Mr. Tavenner. Is it not true that the executive board to which 
I have referred is a committee of the Southern California District 
Comicil, which council is composed of 62 individuals from southern 
California? 

Mr. Alexander. I decline to answer that question, sir, on the 
grounds stated before. 

Mr. Ta\'ennp:r. Is it not a fact that this executive board is the 
controlling body of the Communist Party of the Southern District 
of California? 

ISIr. Alexander. I decline to answer the question, sir, on the grounds 
stated before. 

Mr. Tavenner. Is it not also true that the executive board has 10 
members? 

Mr. Alexander. I decline to answer that question, sir, on the 
grounds stated previously. 

Mr. Ta\t:nner. Eather I should say only nine members, since Don 
^"N^ieeldin resigned on the 26th day of March 1958. Correct ? 

Mr. Alexander. Are you asking me a question, sir? 

Mr. Tavenner. Yes. 

Mr. Alexander. I decline to answer the question on the grounds 
stated previously. 

Mr. Tavenner. Will you give us the names of the members of the 
executive board ? 

Mr. Alexander. I decline to answer that question, sir, on the 
gromids previously stated. 

Mr. Tavenner. Will you tell the committee, please, whether or not 
there is a convention of the Southern District of California of the 
Communist Party scheduled to be held in October of tliis year, at 
which time William Taylor is slated to fill the 10th spot on the 



COMMUNISM IN SOUTHERN CALIFORNIA AREA 73 

executive board which lias been made vacant by the resignation 
of Don Wheeldin? 

Mr. Alexander. I decline to answer that question, sir, on the 
grounds stated previously. 

Mr. Tavenner. Which side are you on in the division in the local 
Communist Party, the Healey side or the Pettis Perry side ? 

Mr. Alexander. I decline to answer that question, sir, on the 
grounds stated before. 

Mr. Tavenner. Were you present on the 27tli d-dj of July 1958, at 
which time a motion was made to oust Dorothy Healey as chairman 
of the Communist Party of this district? 

Mr. Alexander. I decline to answer that question, sir, on the 
grounds stated before. 

]Mr. Tavenner. That is all, Mr. Chairman. 

The Chairman. Any other witnesses? 

Mr. Tavenner. No, sir. 

The Chairman. We will recess until what time, t) iHO ? 

Mr. Wheeler. 9 :30 will be fine. 

(Whereupon, at 4:20 p.m., Tuesday, September 2, the conunittee 
recessed, to reconvene at 9 :30 a.m., Wednesday, September 3, 1958.) 



THE SOUTHERN CALIFORNIA DISTRICT OF THE 
COMMUNIST PARTY 

Structure — Objectives — Leadership 



WEDNESDAY, SEPTEMBER 3, 1958 

United States House of Representatives, 

Subcommittee of the 
Committee on Un-American Activities, 

Los Angeles^ Calif. 

EXECUTIVE session ^ 

The subcommittee of the Committee on Un-American Activities 
met, pursuant to recess, at 9 :30 a.m., in room 229, Federal Building, 
Los Angeles, Calif., Hon. Francis E. Walter (chairman) presiding. 

Committee members present: Representatives Francis E. Walter, 
of Pennsylvania, and Morgan M. Moulder, of Missouri. 

Staff members present: Frank S. Tavenner, Jr., counsel, and Wil- 
liam A. Wlieeler, investigator. 

The Chairman. Will you raise your right hand, please. Do you 
swear the testimony you are about to give will be the truth, the whole 
truth, and nothing but the truth, so help you God ? 

Mr. Briggs. I do. 

TESTIMONY OF CYRIL VALENTINE BRIGGS, ACCOMPANIED BY 
COUNSEL, BEN MARGOLIS AND FRANK MUNOZ 

Mr. Tavenner. Just be seated. Will you state your name, please ? 

Mr. Briggs. Cyril Briggs. 

Mr. Tavenner. Do jou have a middle name ? 

Mr. Briggs. Valentine. 

Mr. Tavenner. Will counsel accompanying the witness please iden- 
tify himself for the record ? 

Mr. Margolis. Ben Margolis and Frank Munoz, both of 112 West 
9th Street, Los Angeles, Calif. 

Mr. Tavenner. What is your address, Mr. Briggs ? 

Mr. Briggs. Is that pertinent to the inquiry ? 

Mr. Tavenner. Yes, it is necessary for us to properly identify you. 

Mr. Briggs. Well, considering that I have spent my life fighting 
Jim Crow segregation, I would willingly concede that I am, no doubt, 
the Cyril Briggs that this committee has in mind. 

Mr. Tavenner. Will you answer the question ? 

The Chairman. What is your answer ? 

Mr. Briggs. Well, I have no objections. 2517 Fairmont Street. 

* BeleaBed by the committee and orderedl to be printed. 

38253— 59— pt. 1 5 75 



76 COMMUNISM IN SOUTHERN CALIFORNIA AREA 

Mr. Tavenner. Will you please state the date and place of your 
birth? 

Mr. Briggs. Nevis, British West Indies, May_ 28, 1888. 

Mr. Tavenner. Wlien did you come to the United States ? 

Mr. Briggs. July 4, 1905. 

Mr. Tavenner. Are you a naturalized American citizen ? 

Mr. Briggs. I am an American by choice, naturalized, yes. 

Mr. Tavenner. When and where were you naturalized ? 

Mr. Briggs. New York City, in 1916. 

Mr. Tavenner. Wliat is your occupation ? 

Mr. Briggs. Publicity. 

Mr. Tavenner. How long have you been engaged in that occu- 
pation? 

Mr. Briggs. Since 1912, when I joined the staff of the New York 
Amsterdam News. 

Mr. Tavenner. Will you state briefly your formal educational 
iraining ? 

Mr. Briggs. Well, grade school and grammar school in the West 
Indies. 

Mr. Moulder. May I inquire, Mr. Chairman, is that a foreign- 
language newspaper? 

Mr. Tavenner. I will ask him the question. 

Is the paper to which you referred a foreign-language newspaper ? 

Mr. Briggs. No ; it is a Negro paper and as native 

Mr, Tavenner. Wlien did you come to California ? 

Mr. Briggs. In 1944. 

Mr. Tavenner. What has been your employment record in Cali- 
fornia since that date ? 

Mr. Briggs. I work on the newspaper now, twice a month publica- 
tion, and on the California Eagle as managing editor, and I have 
worked in construction also. 

Mr. Tavenner. Were you a. delegate to the Southern California 
District convention of the Communist Party held April 13 and 14, 
1957? 

Mr. Briggs. I don't see what pertinence that question has to me. In 
any event, I refuse to answer it on the ground of the first and fifth 
amendments. 

Mr. Tavenner. Are you at this time a member of the Juarez Club 
of the Communist Party of the Southern California District of the 
Communist Party ? 

Mr. Briggs. Same answer. 

Mr. Tavenner. As a matter of fact, weren't you the educational 
director of this club as late as 1956 ? 

Mr. Briggs. Same answer. 

The Chairman. When you say "same answer," I understand you 
to mean that you decline to answer on the grounds stated. 

Mr. Briggs. Not only that I decline, I refuse to answer it on the 
grounds of the first and fifth amendments. 

The Chairman. All right. 

Mr. Tavenner. Mr. Chairman, I offer in evidence a thermofax 
copy of the September 9, 1956, issue of The Worker and ask that it 
be marked "Briggs Exhibit No. 1." 

The Chairman. It will be made a part of the record. 



COMMUNISM IN SOUTHERN CALIFORNIA AREA 77 

(Document marked "Briggs Exhibit No. 1" and retained in com- 
mittee files.) 

Mr. Tavenner. Mr. Witness, I hand you this exhibit and ask you to 
state whether or not you see at the end of it the name of the author 
of the article appearing under the title "The American Koad to So- 
cialism." 

Mr. ]\Iargolis. Is the question whether he can read the name "Cyril 
Briggs" there ? 

Mr. Tavenner. Read the question. 

Mr. Briggs. I can read the name, yes. 

Mr. Ta\^nner. Will you read it ? 

Mr. Briggs. It says here "Cyril Briggs," yes. 

Mr. Tavenner. And what else? 

Mr. Briggs. "Educational Director," yes. 

Mr. Tavenner. Of what ? 

Mr. Briggs. I assume of the 

(Counsel conferred with witness.) 

Mr. Briggs. I refuse to answer that on the same grounds. 

Mr. Ta\^nner. Just keep that a moment. 

You have stated that the article bears the name of Cyril Briggs, 
educational director. Now didn't you leave off part of the descrip- 
tion of the title of the individual ? Will you look at it again and com- 
plete the statement which you started ? 

Mr. Margolis. There is nothing that appears on here except educa- 
tional director. 

Mr. Tavenner. Will you read what is immediately above the name 
of Cyril Briggs? 

Mr. Briggs. I have already told you I could read it and I would sug- 
gest that you read it for yourself. 

Mr. Tavenner. Well, if you can read it, what is the rest of the sig- 
nature to the article ? You have read your name and you have read 
educational director. Does not the description of the organization of 
which you are the education director also appear ? 

Mr. Briggs. I assume that you have seen it, that you can read it, 
and I refuse to answer that question on the same grounds as previ- 
ously stated. 

Mr. Tavenner. Did you compose and write the article appearing 
there? 

Mr. Briggs. I refuse to answer that on the same grounds as stated. 

The Chairman. Mr. Briggs, this is signed "Juarez Club, Los Ange- 
les, Calif., Cyril Briggs, Educational Director." Are you the Cyril 
Briggs whose name appears on this article ? 

Mr. Briggs. I refuse to answer that on the same grounds as stated. 

Mr. Tavenner. A subtitle to the article appearing in this exhibit 
is "Welcome to Inner-Party Democracy." Reference is then made in 
the first paragraph to an expression of "confidence in our national 
leadership" and commends that leadership for its "wise policy of 
leaving wide open all questions of program and policy pending the 
fullest and freest preconvention discussion. This, to us, is a welcome 
concrete expression of that inner-party democracy to which most of 
our leading cadres, including the national, have much too often in the 
past given only lip-service." 

As a matter of fact, Mr. Briggs, did not the chairman of the district 
organization of California — organization of the Communist Party — 



78 COMMUNISM IN SOUTHERN CALIFORNIA AREA 

contend and report at a meeting of that body that there was no inner- 
party democracy in the Communist Party at this time ? 

Mr. Briggs. I want to say this, that I resent being interrogated by 
a committee whose members include out-and-out white supremacists 
and people who have been inciting to insurrection in the South against 
the Supreme Court's integration mandate, and moreover a committee 
that during its 20 years has never once investigated the Ku Klux 
Klan. 

The Chairman. Let me interrupt at this point. That is not true. 
This committee asked the Ku Klux Klan for its first membership and 
tliey complied with the request, as I understand it. That is far more 
than the Communists would ever do. 

Mr. Briggs. Has this committee ever investigated the Southern 
White Citizens Committee ? 

The Chairman. That is not dominated by Russia, and your organi- 
zation is. That is the difference. Proceed, Mr. Tavenner. 

Mr. Tavenner. Will you answer the question ? 

Mr. Briggs, I want to say this, then, that I will have to assume then 
that in this committee's opinion lynching Negroes and spitting on 
little Negro children is 

Mr. Tavenner. You are evading the question. 

The Chairman. Just a minute, Mr. Tavenner. I want to get the 
record straight. This sort of thing resorted to by Communists hurts 
the cause that they say they espouse, because they are not sincere in 
the efforts to improve the conditions of the colored people in this 
country. 

Mr. Briggs. I don't know what Communists or communism have to 
do with my position, because this has been my position since 1912 
before there was, as I understand it, a Communist Party in the United 
States. It will continue to be my position despite any attempt by 
this committee to intimidate me. 

As to what the Communist Party is doing, I understand that in one 
of the hearings of this committee and today, also, by the last speaker, 
it is said that the Communist Party is exploiting the Negro people. 

I think, gentlemen, that the Negroes would be very glad to accept 
such exploitation at the hands of the Republicans. 

The Chairman. You hope that they would be ? 

Mr. Briggs. I know that they would be very glad to accept any 
exploitation that defends their interests. 

Mr. Tavenner. Now after having made this voluntary speech at 
great length, will you return to the question and answer ? 

Mr. Briggs. Which I refuse to answer on the same grounds as 
previously stated. 

Mr. Tavenner. In this article it is stated, "The Juarez Club hails 
this democratic approach to the * * * fundamental problems con- 
fronting our party." Did you make that statement ? 

Mr. Briggs. Same answer. 

Mr. Tavenner. The article then proceeds to state that the Juarez 
Club, recognizing the responsibility that it has upon it, objects to 
"bureaucratic centralism." What did you mean by "bureaucratic 
centralism?" 

Mr. Briggs. Same answer. 

Mr. Moulder. May I ask a question, Mr. Briggs ? 



COMMUNISM IN SOUTHERN CALIFORNIA AREA 79 

Mr. Brigqs. If you please. 

Mr. Moulder. Have you ever read the article ? 

Mr. Briggs. I object to you calling me Briggs. 

The Chairman. He called you Mister. 

Mr. Briggs. My mistake, I am sorry. To that question I give the 
same answer. 

Mr. Tavenner. You wrote the article, didn't you ? 

Mr. Briggs. Same answer. 

Mr. Tavenner. Does this statement not contain the assertion that 
the Juarez Club 

Mr. Briggs. Pardon me ? 

Mr. Tavenner. Does not this article state that the Juarez Club 
"takes this opportmiity to express its adamant opposition to any and 
all ideas and proposals aimed at the liquidation of the Communist 
Party" ? 

Mr. Briggs. I am willing to accept your statement. 

Mr. Tavenner. And did you, through your club, endeavor to 
support the Foster group in the Communist Party in its opposition 
to any effort to liquidate it ? 

Mr. Briggs. Same answer. 

Mr. Tavenner. Does not this article also state that "Our members 
are similarly opposed with one exception, to any change of name 
for our party" ? 

Mr. Briggs. If you say so. I presume it does. 

Mr. Tavenner. Did you make that contention through this article? 

Mr. Briggs. Same answer on the grounds of the first and fifth 
amendments. 

Mr. Tavenner. Who is the one person, a member of the Juarez 
Club, who was in favor of changing the name of the Communist 
Party ? 

Mr. Briggs. Same answer. 

Mr. Tavenner. It is noted that considerable emphasis in this 
article is pla<?ed upon an appeal to the membership to "pry our- 
selves loose from the Wailing Wall and conscientiously and vigor- 
ously carry forward the necessary task of reappraisal and the wiping 
out of bureaucracy, sectarianism, doctrinarism — and right oppor- 
tunism as well." 

Did you use the term "Wailing Wall" in the sense that the Com- 
munist Party felt that it was not enthusiastic in its work ? 

Mr. Briggs. Same answer. 

Mr. Tavenner. That it was losing time in discussing and complain- 
ing about previous mistakes instead of moving forward ? 

Mr. Briggs. Same answer. 

Mr. Tavenner. Was this article of yours republished in a publica- 
tion entitled "The Party Forum" in its September 10, 1956, issue? 

Mr. Briggs. Same answer. 

Mr. Tavenner. I desire to introduce in evidence a copy of that issue 
of The Party Forum and ask that it be marked "Briggs Exhibit 
No. 2." 

The Chairman. It will be so marked. 

(Document marked "Briggs Exhibit No. 2," and retained in 
committee files.) 



80 COMMUNISM IN SOUTHERN CALIFORNIA AREA 

Mr. Tavenner. Was not this a Communist intraparty publication ? 

Mr. Briggs. Same answer. 

Mr. Tavenner. Was not this paper organized for the purpose of 
giving an opportunity to members of the Communist Party to express 
their views prior to the Kussian invasion of Hungary? 

Mr. Briggs. Same answer. 

Mr. Tavenner. Is it now in existence ? 

Mr. Briggs. Same answer. 

Mr. Tavenner. You know it is not ? 

Mr. Briggs. Same answer. 

Mr. Tavenner. Were you a delegate to the Los Angeles Comity 
Communist Party convention on January 5 and 6, 1957 ? 

Mr. Briggs, Same answer on the grounds of the first and fifth 
amendments. 

Mr. Tavenner. Were you also a delegate to the Southern California 
District convention of the Communist Party held April 13 and 14, 
1957? 

Mr. Briggs. Same answer. 

Mr. Tavenner. Are you at this time assig-ned to the Zapata Section 
of the Communist Party, Southern District of California ? 

Mr. Briggs. Same answer. 

Mr. Tavenner. Have you, over a long period of time, contributed 
articles to various Communist Party organs in the country ? 

Mr. Briggs. Same answer. 

Mr. Tavenner. I hand you an issue of the "Labor Defender" of May 
1927, carrying an article entitled "Eally Labor for Passaic Strike 
Prisoners" by Cyril Briggs. Will you examine it, please, and state 
whether or not you prepared that article? 

Mr. Briggs. Same answer. 

Mr. Tavenner. I desire to offer this in evidence and ask that it be 
marked "Briggs Exhibt No. 3." 

(Document marked "Briggs Exhibit No. 3" and retained in com- 
mittee files.) 

Mr. Tavenner. I hand you a photostatic copy of the April 28, 1931, 
issue of the Daily Worker and call your attention to an article entitled 
"Mother of Haywood Patterson Appeals for United Effort To Save 
Lives of 9 Scottsboro Boy Victims," by Cyril Briggs, and ask whether 
or not you prepared the article appearing there — whether you wrote 
the article. 

Mr. Briggs. Same answer. 

Mr. Tavenner. I offer the document in evidence and ask that it be 
marked "Briggs Exhibit No. 4." 

The Chairman. It will be so marked. 

(Document marked "Briggs Exhibit No. 4," and retained in com- 
mittee files.) 

Mr. Tavenner. I hand you a copy of the June 1929 issue of "The 
Communist" carrying an article entitled "The Negro Question in the 
Southern Textile Strikes," by Cyril Briggs, and ask whether or not 
you prepared that article. 

Mr. Margolis. 1929? 

Mr. Tavenner. Doesn't it say that on the top ? 

Mr. Margolis. I was wondering if you had anything earlier. 

Mr. Tavenner. We did give you something earlier, 1927. 



COMMUNISM IN SOUTHERN CALIFORNIA AREA 81 

Mr. Bkiggs. Same answer. 

Mr. Tavenner. It indicates that you have been in the propaganda 
business for some years. 

I desire to offer the document in evidence and ask that it be marked 
"Briggs Exliibit No. 5." 

Tlie Chairman. It will be so marked. 

(Document marked "Briggs Exhibit No. 5," and retained in com- 
mittee files.) 

Mr. Briggs. May I ask if you are aware that the propaganda busi- 
ness is what the first amendment protests, freedom of speech and 
thought ? 

Mr. Tavenner. We didn't condemn you for that. 

Mr. Briggs. I thank you. 

Mr. Tavenner, Did you have any underground assignment from 
the Communist Party in 1950 ? 

Mr. Briggs. Same answer. 

Mr. Tavenner. The committee has information that you attended 
a meeting on July 27, 1958 of the District Council of the Southern 
l^istrict of California which was also attended by various function- 
aries of the Communist Party, at which time Dorothy Healey made 
a minority report criticizing the leadership of the Communist Party 
and at which she, in turn, was charged with Titoism and even a resolu- 
tion was presented to oust her from leadership in the Communist 
Party in this district. Which side of the argument did you take? 

Mr. Briggs. Same answer. 

Mr. Tavenner. Are you at this time a member of the Communist 
Party? 

Mr. Briggs. Same answer on the grounds of the first and fifth 
amendments. 

Mr. Tavenner. I have no further questions. 

Mr. ISIouLDER. I have one or two questions. Do you consider the 
Communist Party to be a political party in the sense that political 
parties are generally recognized in this country ? 

Mr. Briggs. I don't think that I am supposed to express my opinion 
here. 

Mr. Moulder. From any opportunity that you have had to observe 
or as a result of any of your experiences, could you give us that infor- 
mation — whether or not the people generally who are associated with 
the Communist Party do consider it a political party in the sense that 
other political parties are recognized in this country ? 
(Counsel confers with witness.) 

Mr, Briggs, I am not going to discuss the Communist Party here 
at this time. If you want to discuss conspiracies, such as are occurring 
in the South against the Federal Government and courts, I would be 
glad to. 

Mr, Moulder, Do you have any knowledge of any conspiracy move- 
ment within the Communist Party concerning the Communist Party's 
plans to change our form of Government in this country? 

Mr, Briggs, The only conspiracy I know of are those of which I 
mentioned, including those led by Governor Faubus, including conspir- 
acies to prevent Negro children from getting an equal education. 

Mr. Moulder. I didn't ask you that question. 



82 COMMUNISM IN SOUTHERN CALIFORNIA AREA 

Mr. Briggs. And conspiracies that nullify and defy the Supreme 
Court's mandates. 

Mr. Moulder. I didn't ask you that question. I asked you if you had 
any knowledge of any such conspiracy within the Communist Party. 

Mr. Briggs. I have answered that, that the only conspiracies I am 
aware of 

Mr. Moulder. Then I interpret your answer to mean that you know 
of no such movement w^ithin the Communist Party. 

Mr. Briggs. You can interpret it any way you wish to. 

Mr. Moulder. Do you know whether or not the Communist Party's 
philosophy and objectives are dominated and controlled by the Soviet 
Union? I just ask you whether or not you know. 

Mr. Briggs. Again I have no opinion to express here on such 
questions. 

The Chairman. That is all. 

Mr. Tavenner. Alexander Ende. 

The Chairman. Will you raise your right hand, please? Do you 
swear the testimony you are about to give will be the truth, the whole 
truth, and nothing but the truth, so help you God ? 

Mr. Ende. I do. 

TESTIMONY OF ALEXANDER ENDE, ACCOMPANIED BY COUNSEL, 
BEN MARGOLIS AND FRANK MUNOZ 

Mr. Tavenner. "Will you state your name, please, sir? 

Mr. Ende. Alexander Ende. 

Mr. Tavenner. How do you spell your last name ? 

Mr. Ende. Ende, E-n-d-e. 

Mr. Tavenner. Will counsel accompanying the witness please iden- 
tify yourselves for the record ? 

Mr. Margolis. Ben Margolis and Frank Munoz. 

Mr. Tavenner. Where do you live, Mr. Ende ? 

Mr. Ende. 10031 Roscoe Boulevard, Sun Valley. 

Mr. Tavenner. California ? 

Mr. Ende. Yes. 

Mr. Tavenner. Wliat is the date and place of your birth ? 

Mr. Ende. August 19, 1916, Brooklyn, N.Y. 

Mr. Tavenner. '^Vllat is your occupation ? 

Mr. Ende. I am an electrician. 

Mr, Tavenner. Will you tell the committee briefly what your formal 
educational training has been? 

Mr. Ende. Public school, high school, several colleges in electrical 
wiring over the years, technical courses at different adult training 
centers, and so forth and so on. 

Mr. Tavenner. "When did you come to California ? 

Mr. Ende. 1947. 

Mr. Tavenner. What has been your record of employment in Cali- 
fornia since that date ? 

Mr. Ende. I have worked as an electrician since that date. 

Mr. Tavenner. As an electrician, are you a member of the Inter- 
national Brotherhood of Electrical "\Vorkers ? 

Mr. Ende. I must at this point decline to answer this question be- 
cause I feel that my organizational associations and ties are not the 



COMMUNISM IN SOUTHERN CALIFORNIA AREA 83 

proper concern of this committee, and therefore I decline to answer on 
the grounds of protection afforded me under the fifth amendment and 
under the first amendment of the Constitution. 

The Chairman. Keep your voice up a little bit. 

Mr. Tavenner. May I have a direction that the witness answer this 
question ? 

The Chairman. You are directed to answer the question. 

Mr. Ende. I must decline to answer this question because I feel that 
my organizational associations and ties are not the proper concern of 
this committee. I therefore decline to answer on the grounds that it 
is not pertinent and on the grounds of the protection afforded me under 
the fifth amendment of the Constitution and under the first amend- 
ment of the Constitution. 

Mr. Tavenner. I think probably the direction should be repeated. 

The Chairman. Yes. You said you must decline. You are not 
under any compulsion. When you say that, I am assuming that you 
do decline. 

Mr. Ende. I wish to decline ; I do decline, yes, sir. 

The Chairman. All right. 

Mr. Tavenner. Have you held any office in the International Broth- 
erhood of Electrical Workers ? 

Mr. Ende. May I consult with my attorney for a while ? 

(Witness consults with his counsel.) 

Mr. Ende. The same answer as previously stated. 

Mr. Tavenner. Were you at one time a member of the United Elec- 
trical Workers of America ? 

Mr. Ende. The same answer as previously stated. 

Mr. Tavenner. Due to your special training in a field of electrical 
work, have you received any appointment within the Communist Party 
to a position on the Building Trades Section of the Communist Party ? 

Mr. Ende. The same answer as previously stated. 
_ Mr. Tavenner. The committee has information that you are at this 
hme the secretary of the Building Trades Section of the Communist 
Party. Is that not correct ? 

Mr. Ende. I will repeat and make the same answer that I previously 
stated. 

Mr. Tavenner. The first convention of the Southern District of the 
California Communist Party was held in April of 1957, at which time 
there was drafted a trade miion resolution. Are you familiar with 
that resolution ? 

Mr. Ende. I must decline— I do decline to answer on the same 
grounds as previously stated. 

Mr. Tavenner. Are you not, in fact, a member of the Southern 
California District Council of the Communist Party ? 

Mr. Ende. I decline to answer on the same grounds as previously 
stated. 

Mr. Tavenner. Is it not a fact that the district council is composed 
of 62 members representing various sections of the Communist Party 
in Southern California? 

Mr. Ende. The same answer as previously stated. 

Mr. Tavenner. In 1951 were you a member of the Los Angeles 
Negro Labor Council ? 



84 COMMUNISM IN SOUTHERN CALIFORNIA AREA 

Mr. Ende. I refuse to— I decline to answer on the same grounds as 

^^Mr^TAVENNER! Are you not still a member of that council? 

Mr. Ende. I declme to answer on the same grounds as previously 

The Chairman. Wliat council ? ^ , r^ .-, 

Mr. Tavenner. The Los Angeles Ne^ro Labor Council. 
Did vou receive any assignment within the Communist Party to 
engage in Commmiist Party work in the Independent Progressive 

\lr. Ende. I declme to answer on the same grounds as previously 

Mr Tavenner. And also in the Civil Pvights Congress? ^ 

Mr. Ende. I declme to answer on the same grounds as previously 

of ^ i" p Q • 

Mr Tavenner. Were you solicited to unite in a letter of resigna- 
tion, i3earing date March 26, 1958, of various members of the Commu- 
nist Party of Southern California? . 

Mr. Ende. I decline to answer on the same grounds as previously 

stated. 

Mr. Tavenner. That is all. 

The Chairman. Any questions? 

Mr. Moulder. Just one question, Mr. Chairman. _ 

Do you have any knowledge or information concerning the etiorts 
on the part of any person under the control of the Soviet Union to 
infiltratethiscountry to the cause of communism? 

Mr. Ende. Sir, I "have knowledge of no person who is under the 
control of the Soviet Union and I have no such knowledge. ^ 

Mr. Moulder. Have you ever attended Communist Party meetings i 

Mr. Ende. I must decline to answer that question on the same 
grounds as previously stated. 

The Chairman. That is all. 

Mr. Tavenner. Herbert Biskar. . 

The Chairman. Will you remain standing, please? Raise your 
ri<^ht hand. Do you swear the testimony you are about to give will be 
the truth, the whole truth, and nothing but the truth, so help you 
God? 

Mr. BiSKAR. I do. 

TESTIMONY OP HERBERT BISKAR, ACCOMPANIED BY COUNSEL, 

BEN MARGOLIS 

Mr. Tavenner. What is your name, please? 

Mr. BiSKAR. Herbert Biskar. 

Mr. Tavenner. Wliere do you live? 

Mr. Biskar. 411 Palmwood Drive, Los Angeles 8. 

Mr. Tavenner. When and where were you born ? 

Mr. Biskar. I was bom in November of 1933 in Washington, D.C. 

Mr. Tavenner. Wliat is your occupation ? 

Mr. Biskar. Shipping clerk. 

Mr. Tavenner. Will you state, please, briefly your formal educa- 
tional training? 

Mr. Biskar. I have a high school diploma and I have a bachelor 
degree, a B.A. 



COMMUNISM IN SOUTHERN CALIFORNIA AREA 85 

Mr. Tavenner. From what school ? 

Mr. BisKAR. I am going to refuse to answer that question. 

The Chairman. I direct you to answer this question. 

(Counsel confers with witness.) 

Mr. BiSKAR. I refuse to answer that question on the following 

f round : In the first place, I refuse to answer on the first amendment, 
consider it to be part of my associations and I think the first amend- 
ment protects the right of association, and I guess that also would be 
an action that would be the privacy of your associations. I also 
claim the privilege of not being a witness against myself, or the fifth 
amendment. 

Mr. Moulder. Did I understand you to say that you graduated 
from college and you received a degree ? You so stated, didn't you ? 

Mr. BisKAR. Yes, I did. 

Mr. Moulder. You have directed the witness to answer that ques- 
tion, have you not? 

The Chairman. Yes. 

Mr. Moulder. You have opened it up by saying that you have re- 
ceived such a degree, that you have graduated from college. 

Mr. BiSKAR. I don't believe I have opened anything up, sir. 

Mr. Tavenner. May the record show a direction after his expla- 
nation ? 

The Chairman. Yes; I directed him to answer the question as to 
where he received the degree that he just stated he had received. 

Mr. Margolis. Do you want another response to that direction ? 

The Chairman. He has already answered. 

Mr. Moulder. As I understand it, the witness still declines to an- 
swer the question. 

Mr. BisKAR. Yes ; on the previous grounds. 

Mr. ISIouLDER. Claiming the first ? 

Mr. BiSKAR. First and fifth amendments, and pertinency, too. I 
would add that I don't believe that it is pertinent to the purposes of 
this committee to find out just where I went to school. 

Mr. Tavenner. Did you attend the Los Angeles State College ? 

Mr. BisKAR. I would have to refuse that on the previous grounds ; 
that actually is the same question, or very similar. 

Mr. Tavenner. May I have a direction to answer ? 

The Chairman. You are directed to answer the question. 

Mr. BisKAR. I refuse to answer on the previous grounds, that is, the 
first amendment, the fifth amendment, pertinency. 

Mr. Tavenner. When did you first come to California to make this 
the place of your residence ? 

Mr. BiSKAR. I came here in 1952. 

Mr. Tavenner. What has been your record of employment since that 
time? 

Mr. BiSKAR. Well 

( Counsel confers with witness. ) 

Mr. BiSKAR. I have had a lot of miscellaneous part-time jobs except 
for this past year where I have been working as a shipping clerk full 
time. 

Mr. Tavenner. Very soon after your arrival in Los Angeles did you 
become identified with the Labor Youth League in its activities ? 



86 COMMUNISM IN SOUTHERN CALIFORNIA AREA 

Mr. BisKAR. I will have to refuse to answer on the previous grounds. 
Your questioning me on my political affiliations is expressly forbidden 
by the first amendment, so I am going to plead that and also my 
previous grounds. 

Mr. Tavenner. The Labor Youth League has been cited as a Com- 
munist organization by Attorney General McGrath in his letter 
to the Loyalty Eeview Board released August 30, 1950. 

The Chairman. Since recent decisions of the Supreme Court, I do 
not think that you can properly invoke the fifth amendment, because 
you are not exposing yourself to the danger of any prosecution 
criminally. So I direct you to answer that question. 

(Counsel confers with witness.) 

Mr. BiSKAR. I take the same answer that I took before. 

The Chairman. In other words, you decline to answer for the rea- 
sons that you gave ? 

Mr. BisKAR, Eight ; first, fifth, and pertinency. 

Mr. Tavenner. Mr. Chairman, I offer in evidence a thermof ax copy 
of an article appearing in the September 18, 1953, issue of the People's 
World, entitled "Weekend INIobilizations in Wells Case." May it be 
marked "Herbert Biskar Exhibit No. 1" ? 

The Chairman. It will be so marked. 

(Document marked "Herbert Biskar Exhibit No. 1," and retained 
in committee files.) 

Mr. Tavenner. Mr. Biskar, this article refers to various persons 
taking part in the activities indicated by the title, and among them is 
the name of Herbert Biskar, Labor Youth League. The name Biskar 
is spelled B-i-s-c-a-r, whereas I understand the correct spelling of your 
name is B-i-s-k-a-r. 

Will you state whether or not your name was accurately reported as 
one taking part in the movement indicated ? 

Mr. Biskar. B-i-s-c-a-r is not my name, otherwise I refuse to iden- 
tify the document or comment further on its accuracy or validity. 

Mr. Tavenner. Do I understand you refuse to state whether you 
are the Herbert Biscar, member of the Labor Youth League, referred 
to in this article ? 

Mr. Biskar. I refuse to identify it, yes, on the previous grounds 
stated. 

Mr. Tavenner. Were jou a member of the Labor Youth League on 
September 18, 1953? 

Mr. Biskar. Same answer. 

Mr. Tavenner. Were you a member of the Communist Party on the 
18th day of September 1953 ? 

Mr. Biskar. I cite my previous grounds. 

Mr. Tavenner. The investigation of the committee reflects that on 
January 10, 1956, a meeting was held of the Labor Youth League in 
Los Angeles and that you were chaimian of the student division of 
the Labor Youth League at that time ; is that correct ? 

Mr. Biskar. I refuse to answer that on the previously stated 
gi'ounds. 

Mr. Tavenner. Were you a member of the Communist Party on 
January 10, 1956 ? 

Mr. Biskar. Same answer. 



COMMUNISM IN SOUTHERN CALIFORNIA AREA 87 

Mr. Tavenner, Were you present on August 16, 1955, at a meeting 
of the Los Angeles County Labor Youth League which was addressed 
by Frank Carlson on dialectical materialism ? 

Mr. BisKAR. I refuse to answer that on the previous grounds. 

Mr. Tavenner. Were you a member of the Communist Party on 
August 16, 1955? 

Mr. BisKAR, Same answer. 

Mr. Tavenner. The information of the committee is that you were 
present at a membership meeting of the Los Angeles County Labor 
Youth League held at 3875 City Terrace Drive. This is the address 
of the City Terrace Cultural Center. This meeting, according to the 
committee's information, was concerned with whether or not to dis- 
solve the league, that is, the Labor Youth League; and a vote was 
taken on that subject at which it was determined by 27 to 24 not to 
dissolve it, thus indicating that there were at least 51 persons present 
at that league meeting. 

Will you tell us whether that vote was correctly stated ? 

Mr. BiSKAR. I don't think I am going to comment on the accuracy of 
your informers. 

Mr. Tavenner. Wliat informers do you refer to ? 

Mr. BisKAR. I don't want to comment on the accuracy of any in- 
formers of any of these things that you have stated previously. So I 
am going to refuse to answer that question. 

The Chairman. Where did you get the idea that there were any in- 
formers ? 

(Counsel confers with witness.) 

Mr. Biskar. I assume that you probably didn't make it up out of 
your own minds. 

The Chairman. In other words, the question that was asked indi- 
cates to you pretty definitely that we had some information on which 
you could throw some light ? 

Mr. BiSKAR. But not necessarily that the information is true. 

The Chairman. That is right. 

Mr. BisKAR. I assume that you didn't make it up. 

The Chairman. That is right. Well, I will set your mind 

Mr. BisKAR. Most informers do lie. 

The Chairman. I will set your mind at rest on that. The basis of 
this question was not made up. 

Mr. Tavenner. Is the committee's information correct that you 
were present at this meeting? 

Mr. Biskar. I refuse to answer that question on the previously 
stated grounds. All people know that professional informers do 
not tell the truth. 

The Chairman. Why do you mention professional informers or 
informers? We haven't said anything about any informers. Why 
do you talk about informers? 

Mr. Biskar. Well, anyone that would work for this committee or 
for a report on activities of various organizations and people I as- 
sume to be professional. They are being paid. 

The Chairman. Where do you get any idea that there has been 
anyone furnishing this committee or any of its staff with informa- 
tion? 

(Counsel confers with witness.) 



88 COMMUNISM IN SOUTHERN CALIFORNIA AREA 

Mr. BiSKAR. I stated before that I assumed it wasn't made up, 



so 

The Chairman. Wait a mmute. Let me go one step further. 
You say it was not made up ? 

Mr. BisKAR. I assume that it wasn't made up. 

Mr. Tavenner. And that any informer's information is not cor- 
rect ? Now tell us, was this correct — the basis of this question correct? 

Mr. BisKAR. I refuse to answer that question. 

Mr. Tavenner. Isn't it a fact that at one meeting it was decided 
that the successor organization to the Labor Youth League in this 
area should be the Los Angeles County Progressive Youth League? 

Mr. Biskar. I refuse to answer that question on the previously 
stated grounds, the first amendment, the fifth, and pertinency. 

Mr. Tavenner. In fact, the Labor Youth League was disbanded 
not very long after that ; isn't that true ? 

Mr. Biskar. I refuse to answer that on previously stated grounds. 

Mr. Tavenner. What organization is the successor to that league? 

Mr. Biskar. I refuse to answer that on the previously stated 
grounds. 

Mr. Tavenner. At a meeting held on December 11, 1956, of the 
Labor Youth League, did you not contend publicly for the exercise 
of greater discipline over the members ? 

Mr. Biskar. I refuse to answer that question on the previously 
stated grounds. 

Mr. Tavenner. Did you participate in the Southern California 
District convention of the Communist Paxty held on April 13 and 14, 
1957, in Los Angeles? 

Mr. Biskar. Same grounds. 

Mr. Tavenner. At that time did you receive and consider the re- 
port of Dorothy Healey relating in part to the youth organizations 
of the Communist Party ? 

Mr. Biskar. Same grounds. 

Mr. Tavenner. Did not the youth program announced by Dorothy 
Healey include special activities aimed at college youth ? 

Mr. Biskar. I refuse to answer that on the previously stated 
grounds. 

Mr. Tavenner. Do not the plans of the Communist Party con- 
template the establishment of a new youth organization in southern 
California and other areas of the country under the special direction 
of the Communist Party ? 

Mr. Biskar. I refuse to answer that question on the previous 
grounds. 

Mr. Tavenner. Aren't you one of the leading organizers of youth 
in the Communist Party in southern California ? 

Mr. Biskar. I refuse to answer that on the previously stated 
grounds. 

Mr. Tavenner. You state that you 

Mr. Biskar. Go ahead. Never mind, go ahead. 

Mr. Tavenner. I don't want to interrupt you. 

Mr. Biskar. That is all right. 

Mr. Tavenner. You stated that your work is that of a shipping 
clerk. Is that in Los Angeles ? 

Mr. Biskar. Yes ; it is. 



COMMUNISM IN SOUTHERN CALIFORNIA AREA 89 

Mr. Tavenner. Does your work take you outside of the city of 
Los Angeles ? 

Mr. BisKAR. No, sir. 

Mr. Tavenner. I have no further questions, Mr. Chairman. 

The Chairman. Any questions? 

Mr. Moulder. You have refused to answer certain questions deal- 
ing with Communist Party activities in the State of California, as I 
understand you, on the grounds that it concerns your political affilia- 
tions and associations, political beliefs and associations; is that 
correct ? 

Mr. BisKAR. That is one of my reasons. 

Mr. Moulder. That is one of your reasons ? 

Mr. BiSKAR. Eight. 

Mr. Moulder. Now, what is your reaction to this question? Do 
you approve of the Soviet Union Communist movement internation- 
ally? 

Mr. BisKAR. Is that the question ? 

Mr. Moulder. Do you approve of the movement on the part of 
the Soviet Union to dominate the world internationally through 
communism ? That has nothing whatsoever to do with political affilia- 
tion in this country. 

Mr. BisKAR. Actually it doesn't have anything to do with political 
affiliation necessarily, but it does have to do with part of the first 
amendment thereto because it is part of free speech, political opinion ; 
and whether I do or not, I don't think it is necessary for me to say. 
So I will refuse to answer that question on the previously stated 
grounds. 

Mr. Moulder. Then in view of your response to that question, I will 
ask this question : Would you render aid and assistance to the 
Soviet Union in its efforts to dominate our Government and our 
American form of Government as we know it in this country through 
the Communist Party internationally? 

Mr. BiSKAR. It is true that I don't accept all of your assumptions, 
so it is very difficult for me to answer that question. So I will just 
have to refuse to answer on the previously stated grounds. 

Mr. Moulder. Then I will ask this question : "Would you render 
assistance in any form to the Soviet Union in its efforts to dominate 
and control this country through communism? 

Mr. BiSKAR. It appears to me, sir, that that is the same question 
just worded differently, so I have to refuse to answer that on the 
previously stated grounds. 

Mr. Moulder. Then my closing question is this : You are a young 
man. Would you take every step possible to avoid military service 
in the event of a conflict with the Soviet Union ? 

Mr. BisKAR. No, I wouldn't. 

Mr. Moulder. Do I understand you to say then that you would 
fight for your country in the event of a conflict with the Soviet 
Union ? 

Mr. Biskar. Yes, I would. 

Mr. Moulder. That is all. 

The Chairman. All right, sir. We will have a break of 5 minutes; 

(Committee members present:. BeprQsentatiyes Walter and; 
Moulder.) 



90 COMMUNISM IN SOUTHERN CALIFORNIA AREA 

(Brief recess.) 

(Committee members present: Representatives Walter and 
Moulder.) 

Mr. Tavenner. Marvin Biskar. 

The Chairman. Will you raise your right hand please? Do you 
swear the testimony you are about to give will be the truth, the whole 
truth, and nothing but the truth, so help you God ? 

Mr. Biskar. I do. 

TESTIMONY OP MARVIN BISKAR, ACCOMPANIED BY COUNSEL, 

BEN MARGOLIS 

Mr. Tavenner. Will you state your name, please ? 

Mr. Biskar, Marvin Biskar. 

Mr. Tavenner. It is noted that the witness is accompanied by Mr. 
Ben Margolis, a member of the Los Angeles Bar. 

Will you state your place of residence, please ? 

Mr. Biskar. I don't think it is pertinent. I decline to answer the 
question. 

Mr. Ta^^nner. Do you reside at 4034 West Boulevard ? 

Mr. Biskar. That is the correct address, yes. 

The Chairman. "Wliat was that answer ? 

(The reporter read from her notes as requested.) 

Mr. Tavenner. Wlien and where were you born ? 

Mr. Biskar. Washington, D.C., April i7, 1927. 

Mr. Tavenner. "Wliat is your ocupation ? 

Mr. Biskar. I decline to answer that question. I don't think it is 
pertinent to the investigation. 

The Chairman. You are directed to answer that question. 

(Counsel confers with witness.) 

Mr. Biskar. I would like to refuse on grounds of pertinency, the 
basis of the first amendment, and also on the basis of the fifth 
amendment. 

The Chairman. When you say you would like to, you mean you 
do? 

Mr. Biskar. I do de<iline. 

Mr. Tavenner. Is it not a fact that you are a worker in the sheet 
metal industry? 

Mr. Biskar. I decline to answer on the grounds previously stated, 

Mr. Tavenner. When did you come to the State of California to 
make it the place of your residence ? 

Mr, Biskar. I decline on the same grounds. 

Mr. Tavenner. Wliat is your formal educational training? 

Mr. Biskar. I decline to answer that question. 

(Counsel confers with witness.) 

Mr, Margolis. Just one second. 

Mr. Biskar. Would you mean how far I went in my education ? 

Mr. Tavenner. I just wanted to know of what your educational 
training consisted. 

Mr, Biskar. I have been through 3i^ years of college, university. 

Mr. Tavenner. Wliere? 

Mr. Biskar. I decline to answer that question, 

Mr. Tavenner. Wasn't it in Washington, D,C, ? 



COMMUNISM IN SOUTHERN CALIFORNIA AREA 91 

Mr. BiSKAR. I decline to answer on the grounds previously stated. 

Mr. Tavenner. Is your refusal to answer that question based upon 
a contention that the answer might tend to incriminate you ? 

Mr. BiSKAR. Well, I decline on tlie grounds previously stated, which 
include the grounds of basis of self-incrimination, which could open 
me up to prosecution. That is true. 

Mr. Tavenner. Do you honestly feel that a truthful reply to that 
question might tend to incriminate you? 

(Witness confers with counsel.) 

Mr. BiSKAR. I feel that, in the atmosphere of this committee, that is 
quite possible. I don't feel that the committee is honestly seeking 
legislative information but has a certain malicious intent. And I 
am quite, quite possibly open to prosecution, although innocent. 

Mr. Tavenner. Mr. Chairman, I think, in the light of the witness' 
refusal to answer questions of this character, I may just as well at 
this point read into the record the testimony of Mary Markward be- 
fore this committee on June 11, 1951, in Washington, D.C. You will 
recall Mary Markward as the person who, at the instance of the Fed- 
eral Bureau of Investigation, became a member of the Communist 
Party and rose to the position of treasurer of the Communist Party 
comprising the city of Washington and the State of Maryland, and 
part of Virginia. 

This question was asked by Mr. Owens : 

Next, we come to the Students Club. Can you identify for the committee 

individuals whom you knew to be members of the Communist Party of the 
District of Columbia assigned to the Students Club, breaking it down into 
schools where the students were in attendance, if you can? 

Mrs. Markward. The students principally came from Howard University and 
George Washington University. I think a little history of the Students Club 
would clarify the situation for the committee's information. Frances Crystal in 
1945 was a student on the George Washington University campus, and I believe 
on her own initiative had organized a group of students in what was called at 
the time the Young Citizens' League. From this group they organized a Marxist 
study class. From this Marxist study class which was taught by members of the 
leadership of the Communist Party, members were recruited. Among these were 
Howard Phillips and Robert Phillips. 

I might mention that it was prior to this time that Frances Crystal had trans- 
ferred to our party here. I believe she came from one of the other organizations 
in Washington, the underground organization, I believe. Just about this time 
a number of veterans who had either been Young Communist League members 
or Communist Party members before their period in the service, returned and 
went to school and became members of this club. Bernie Cristopher Campbell 
was one of these. 

Moe Falk was a member. He was transferred in from one of the New Eng- 
land States at a later date. 

Chester Kurrier was transferred from one of the New England States. He was 
already a party member. 

These veterans were active in veterans' organizations and were able to recruit 
a number of other members. I am not certain who was the initial contact on 
the campus at Howard University. 

Mr. Owens. Before we leave this other group, the group you have just iden- 
tified were all students at George Washington University? 

Mrs. Markward. Except Chet Kurrier. He went to King-Smith Art School. 

Mr. Owens. Were there any others in attendance at George Washington 
University? 

Mrs. Markward. Marvin Biskar ; Eddie Majchrzyk ; Morty Goldstein, a girl 
who married Marvin Biskar, her name was Galpert, I believe Ida Galpert. 

Mr. Owens. Mrs. Markward, these individuals whom you have identified at 
George Washington University, to the best of your knowledge are most of them 
still in Washington, or have they left the city of Washington? 

38253— 59— pt. 1 6 



92 COMMUNISM IN SOUTHERN CALIFORNIA AREA 

That apparently is not answered. I am not going to ask you any 
question relating to Ida Galpert; but other than the matter contained 
herein relating to Ida Galpert, is there any statement that I read to 
you from the testimony of Mrs. Markward which is untrue? 

Mr. BisKAR. I decline to answer that question on the grounds pre- 
viously stated. 

Mr. Tavenner. Did you attend George Washington University? 

Mr. BiSKAR. I decline for the same reasons. 

Mr. Tavenner. Were you a member of the Communist Party while 
on the campus at George Washington University? 

Mr. BisKAR. I decline on the same grounds. 

Mr. Ta\^nner. Haven't you been continuously engaged in Com- 
munist Party activities among youth since arriving in California? 

Mr. BiSKAR. I decline on the same grounds. 

Mr. Ta\^nner. Were you a member of the Communist Party at 
the time you came to Los Angeles ? 

Mr. BisKAR. That is the same question, but I decline on the same 
grounds. 

Mr. Tavenner. The committee has information that on January 4, 
1957, you attended the Los Angeles County Labor Youth League 
meeting at 3875 City Terrace, at which time the election of officers of 
the Labor Youth League took place. Were j-ou elected an officer on 
that occasion ? 

Mr. Biskar. I decline on the same grounds previously stated. 

Mr. Taa^nner. The committee also is informed that on January 5, 
and 6, 1957, you were a delegate to the Los Angeles County Commu- 
nist Party convention. Is that correct ? 

Mr. Biskar. I decline on the same grounds. 

Mr. Tavenner. Did you also attend the first district convention for 
the Southern District of California on April 13 and 14, 1957? 

Mr. Biskar. The first district convention of what, sir ? 

Mr. Tavenner. Of the Communist Party of the district for the 
Southern District of California. 

Mr. Biskar. I decline on the same grounds. 

Mr. Tavenner. Will you tell the committee, please, whether you 
have studied the report made by Dorothy Healey on April 13 and 14, 
1957, regarding the plans of the Communist Party with regard to 
youth ? 

Mr. Biskar. I decline as previously stated. 

Mr. TA^^NNER. '^^Hiat work is being performed now in the Com- 
munist Party in the youth movement in Los Angeles ? 

Mr. Biskar. I decline as previously stated. 

Mr. Tavenner. I have no further questions, Mr. Chairman. 

The Chairman. Maybe he could throw some light on this move to 
oust Mrs. Healey. 

Mr. Tavenner. Yes. Are you aware of the motion that was made 
on the floor at the meeting held on July 27, 1958, of the District Coun- 
cil of the Communist Party for the Southern District of California 
to oust Dorothy Healey from leadership in the Communist Party ? 

Mr. Biskar. I decline on the grounds previously stated. 

The Chairman. When was that motion made, Mr. Tavenner? 

Mr. Tavenner. July 27, 1958. 

The Chairman. That was made at this closed party meeting? 



COMMUNISM IN SOUTHERN CALIFORNIA AREA 93 

Mr. Tavenner. Yes ; at a meeting of the district council, at which 
time Dorothy Healey made a minority report regarding the June 28 
meeting of the National Committee of the Communist Party. 

Were you present ? 

Mr. BiSKAR. I decline to answer. 

Mr. Tavenner. I do not think the witness was present. 

The Chairman. Any questions, Mr. Moulder ? 

Mr. Moulder. What was the name of the witness previous to this 
one? 

Mr. Tavenner. Herbert Biskar. 

Mr. Moulder. Are you the brother of Herbert Biskar ? 

(Witness confers with counsel. ) 

Mr. Biskar. I decline on grounds previously stated. 

Mr. Moulder. You mean to decline to answer the question of wheth- 
er or not Herbert is your brother ? 

Mr. Biskar. It is not such an innocent question. Many questions 
have intent to open prosecution. Even though I am innocent and I 
decline to answer questions. 

Mr. Moulder. You say you resided in Washington, D.C., up until 
what date ? 

Mr. Biskar. I just stated that I was born in Washington, D.C. 

Mr. Moulder. When did you leave Washington, D.C. ? 

Mr. Biskar. I declined to answer that question previously. 

Mr. Moulder. What caused you to come to California ? 

Mr. Biskar. Climate, like many Southern Californians. 

Mr. Moulder. Were you a student at the time you came to Cali- 
fornia ? 

Mr. Biskar. I decline to answer that question on the grounds pre- 
viously stated. 

Mr. Moulder. Did anyone connected with the Communist Party 
movement in California solicit your moving to California ? 

Mr. Biskar. I decline to answer that question. 

Mr. Moulder. Do you consider being a member of the Communist 
Party to be an act of disloyalty to our country ? 

Mr. Biskar. I decline to answer that question. 

The Chairman. The witness is excused. 

Mr. Tavenner. Sophie Kishner. 

The Chairman. Will you stand up, please, and raise your right 
hand? Do you swear the testimony you are about to give will be the 
truth, the whole truth, and nothing but the truth, so help you God ? 

Mrs. Kishner. I do. 

TESTIMONY OF SOPHIE KISHNER, ACCOMPANIED BY COUNSEL, 

DAN MARSHALL 

Mr. Tavenner. Would you state your name, please ? 
Mrs. Kishner. My name is Sophie Kishner. 
Mr. Tavenner. Will you spell your last name ? 
Mrs. Kishner. K-i-s-h-n-e-r. 

Mr. Tavenner. It is noted that Mrs. Kishner is accompanied by 
Mr. Dan Marshall, a member of the Los Angeles Bar. 
Where do you reside ? 
(Witness confers with counsel.) 



94 COMMUNISM IN SOUTHERN CALIFORNIA AREA 

Mrs. KiSHNER. I decline to answer this question on the following 
ground : The 1st amendment of the Bill of Rights, the 4th amendment 
of the Bill of Rights, the 5th amendment of the Bill of Rights, the 6th 
amendment of the Bill of Rights, the 9th amendment of the Bill of 
Rights, and the 10th amendment of the Bill of Rights, and the lack of 
pertinency. 

Mr. Marshall. Will it be understood that, in the event of any fur- 
ther questions being asked the witness to which she wishes to decline 
to answer, her declination will have been deemed to be made upon all 
the grounds she has so stated ? 

The Chairman. That will be understood ; that any declination will 
be based on those grounds. 

Mr. Tavenner. In relying on the fifth amendment as a ground for 
your refusal to answer, are you relying upon that part of the fifth 
amendment which relates to the use of testimony against yourself ? 

(Counsel confers with witness.) 

Mrs. KisHNER. I will decline to answer by the same grounds. 

Mr. Tavenner. Are you of the opinion that to answer the question 
truthfully might tend to incriminate you ? 

Mrs. KiSHNER. I decline to answer on the same grounds. 

Mr. Tavenner. I ask, Mr. Chairman, that she be directed to answer 
the question. 

The Chairman. She is directed to answer the question. 

Mr. Marshall. May we have the question read now ? 

The Chairman. Read the question. 

(The reporter read the record as requested.) 

(Witness confers with counsel.) 

Mr. Marshall. Would you care to amend that question by adding 
"or tend to expose you to prosecution" ? 

Mr. Tavenner. No, sir. 

Mrs. Kjshner. Yes. 

Mr. Tavenner. "What is your occupation ? 

Mrs. Kishner. I decline to answer on the previously stated reasons. 

Mr. Marshall. Just a moment, Mr. Tavenner. 

You have to keep your voice up so the reporter can hear you. 

Mr. TA^^NNER. Where were you born ? 

Mrs. Kishner. I decline to answer for the same reasons. 

Mr. Tavenner. Is Sophie Kishner your married name ? 

Mrs. Kishner. I decline to answer. 

Mr. Tavenner. Have you at any time lived under another name? 

Mrs. Kishner. I decline to answer. 

Mr. Tavenner. The committee's investigation has disclosed that 
you have expressed dissatisfaction with the current operations of the 
Communist Party and that in fact you signed a letter of grievances 
on December 14, 1957, addressed to the National Committee of the 
Communist Party on that subject. Did you sign the letter using only 
your first name? 

Mrs. Kishner. I decline to answer this question, sir, on the same 
grounds. 

Mr. Tavenner. Do you honestly contend and believe that to admit 
the signing of a letter of grievances addressed to the Communist 
Party of the United States would tend to incriminate you ? 

Mrs. Kishner. I will decline to answer that question. 



COMMUNISM IN SOUTHERN CALIFORNIA AREA 95 

Mr. Tavenner. The letter of December 14, 1957, to which I have 
referred is Healey Exhibit No. 22. In this letter is found a recom- 
mendation that the present structure of the party be made more 
flexible so that membership in the present type of party club is not 
necessarily a requirement for adherence to the organization. What 
is your understanding of the meaning of that ? 

Mrs. KiSHNER. I declme to answer, sir, on the same grounds. 

Mr. Tavenner. Do you know the meaning? 

Mrs. KiSHNER. I decline to answer, sir, on the same grounds. 

Mr. Tavenner. Are you acquainted with the fact that at a subse- 
quent date Dorothy Healey attempted to answer this letter of griev- 
ances ? 

Mrs. KiSHNER. I decline to answer on the same grounds. 

Mr. Tavenner. Are you not also aware of the fact that, after she 
attempted to answer the grievances, a number of the members of the 
Communist Party in the Southern District of California wrote a letter 
of resignation bearing date of March 26, 1958? 

Mrs. KiSHNER. I decline to answer that question on the same 
grounds. 

Mr. Tavenner, Did you, although not a signer of that letter of 
resignation, nevertheless express agreement with it? 

Mrs. KisHNER. No. 

Mr. Tavenner, And follow it by your own resignation from the 
Communist Party ? 

Mrs. KiSHNER, I decline to answer this question also on the same 
grounds. 

Mr. Tavenner. You are honestly of the opinion that to admit now 
that you have resigned from the Communist Party might tend to 
incriminate you ? 

Mrs. KiSHNER. I will have to decline to answer that question, too, 
sir. 

Mr. Tavenner. Will you tell us to what extent Dorothy Healey 
herself participated in the preparation of the letter of December 14, 
1957, constituting a statement of grievances ? 

Mrs. KiSHNER. I am going to decline to answer on the same 
grounds. 

Mr. Tavenner. How could it possibly incriminate you? We are 
asking about what part she played in it. 

Mrs, KisiiNER. I am going to decline to answer, sir, on the same 
grounds. 

Mr. Tavenner. I have no further questions, Mr. Chairman. 

The Chairman. Any questions, Mr. Moulder? 

Mr. Moulder. I have one question, Mr. Chairman. 

You refused to answer any and all questions propounded to you 
by counsel for the committee. If you had any information on sub- 
versive activities or acts of treason or disloyalty within the Commu- 
nist Party, would you inform this committee ? 

(Counsel confers with witness.) 

Mrs. KiSHNER. I decline to answer this question. 

The Chairman. That is all. 

Mr. Tavenner. I would like the witness to return to the stand, 
please. 

The Chairman, Mr. Marshall, we would like to ask one more 
question. 



96 COMMUNISM IN SOUTHERN CALIFORNIA AREA 

Mr. Tavenner. The committee's investigation has disclosed that 
you, as a matter of fact, resigned from the Communist Party in 
March of 1958. Is that true? 

Mrs. KiSHNER. I decline to answer that question. 

Mr. Tavenner. Is not your real reason for refusing to answer any 
questions about your resignation from the Communist Party due to 
the fact that you and others who have withdrawn from the Commu- 
nist Party still support the Communist Party in its objectives and, 
for all intents and purposes, you are still members though not mem- 
bers organizationally speaking ? 

Mrs. Kishner. I am going to have to decline to answer that on the 
grounds previously stated. 

Mr, Tavenner. I have no further questions. 

The Chairman. Will you raise your ri^ht hand, please? Do you 
swear the testimony you are about to give will be the truth, the 
whole truth, and nothing but the truth, so help you God ? 

Mr. Solomon. I do. 

TESTIMONY OF JOSEPH SOLOMON, ACCOMPANIED BY COUNSEL, 

AL WIRIN 

Mr. Tavenner. Will you state your name, please? 

Mr. Solomon. Joseph Solomon. 

Mr. Tavenner. Wliere do you live? 

Mr. Solomon. 1333 Bates Avenue. 

Mr. Tavenner. Wlien and where were you born ? 

Mr. Solomon. August 26, 1913. 

Mr. Tavenner. Where? 

Mr. Solomon. San Diego. 

Mr. Tavenner. Wliat is your occupation ? 

(Counsel confers with witness.) 

Mr. Solomon. I refuse to answer that on the basis of the first and 
the fifth and I don't think it is pertinent. 

Mr. Tavenner. ^Vlien you say you base your declination on the 
fifth amendment, do you mean that provision of the fifth amendment 
relating to self-incrimination ? 

Mr. Solomon. Yes, sir. 

Mr. Moulder. Do you honestly believe in good faith that to answer 
that question might tend to incriminate you ? 

Mr. Solomon. Yes. 

Mr. Tavenner. Aren't you engaged in work with the Griswold 
Duplicating Products, Inc., at 1820 Beverly Boulevard? 

Mr. Solomon. I refuse to answer on the previous grounds. 

Mr. Tavenner. Mr. Solomon, the committee's investigation has dis- 
closed that you resigned from the Communist Party in the middle of 
1957 or that you were relieved of your Communist Party duties at 
that time. Wliich is correct ? 

Mr. Solomon. I refuse to answer that on the same grounds. 

Mr. Tavenner. Were you relieved of actual membership at the 
instance^ of the Communist Party because of other duties that you 
were assigned to by the Communist Party ? 

Mr. Solomon. I refuse to answer that question on the same grounds 
previously stated. 



COMMUNISM IN SOUTHERN CALIFORNIA AREA 97 

Mr. Tavenner. Were you assigned by the Communist Party to 
work of a political character? 

Mr. Solomon. I refuse to answer that question on the same grounds 
as previously stated. 

Mr. Tavenner. Do you honestly believe that to answer that ques- 
tion would tend to incriminate you? 

Mr. Solomon, Yes. 

Mr. Tavenner. Are you at the present time under Communist Party 
discipline? 

Mr. Solomon. I refuse to answer that question on the same grounds, 
first and fifth. 

Mr. Tavenner. The committee's investigation also discloses that 
you were at one time active within the Independent Progressive 
Party of California. 

(Witness confers with counsel.) 

Mr. Tavenner. Will you state whether or not that activity on your 
part was instigated, suggested, or directed by the Communist Party ? 

Mr. Solomon. I refuse to answer the question on tlie same grounds 
as previously stated. 

Mr. Tavenner. Well, as a matter of fact, you were active in the 
work of the Independent Progressive Party, were you not ? 

(Witness confers with counsel.) 

Mr. Solomon. I refuse to answer that question. 

Mr. Tavenner. Mr. Chairman, I offer in evidence a photostatic 
copy of an Appointment of Members of the State Central Committee 
for the year 1954 and ask that it be marked "Solomon Exhibit No. 1." 

The Chairman. Make it a part of the record. 

(Document marked "Solomon Exhibit No. 1," and retained in com- 
mittee files.) 

Mr. Tavenner. Will you examine this exhibit, please, and state 
whether or not the first person mentioned as an appointee to the State 
Central Committee as of August 8, 1954, is Joseph Solomon ? 

Mr. Solomon. I refuse to answer this question on the same grounds 
as previously stated. 

Mr. Tavenner. Are you the Joseph Solomon mentioned as the first 
appointee on this exhibit? 

Mr. Solomon. I refuse to answer the question. 

Mr. Tavenner. I also offer in evidence an additional photostatic 
copy of an Appointment of Members of the State Central Committee 
for the year 1952, tliat is of the Independent Progressive Party. This 
relates to the appointment of three other persons but it purports to 
have been signed by Joseph Solomon as a qualified delegate to the 
State Convention for that year. May it be marked "Solomon Exhibit 
No. 2." 

Will you examine it, please, and state whether or not the signature 
is your genuine signature ? 

Mr. Solomon. I refuse to answer the question. 

Mr. Tavenner. May it be received in evidence ? 

The Chairman. Make it a part of the record. 

(Document marked "Solomon Exhibit No. 2," and retained in com- 
mittee files.) 

Mr. Tavenner. I also have a third document to offer in evidence 
and ask that it be marked "Solomon Exhibit No. 3." It is a photo- 



98 COMMUNISM IN SOUTHERN CALIFORNIA AREA 

static copy of Appointment of Membei-s of the State Central Com- 
mittee of the Independent Progi'essive Party for the year 1950. 

The Chairman. Make it a part of the record. 

(Document marked "Solomon Exhibit No. 3," and retained in com- 
mittee files. ) 

Mr. Tavenner. Mr. Solomon, will you look at the second name ap- 
pearing as an appointee for that year and state whose name it is ? 

Mr. Solomon. I refuse to answer the question. 

Mr. Tavenner. Were you not appointed to the State Central Com- 
mittee for the year 1950 ? 

Mr. Solomon. I refuse to answer the question, sir. 

Mr. Tavenner. Where did you reside in 1945 ? 

(Witness confers with counsel.) 

Mr. Solomon. I refuse to answer the question, sir. 

Mr. Tavenner. In 1945 were you a member of the San Pedro Club 
of the Communist Political Association ? 

Mr. Solomon. I refuse to answer the question. 

Mr. Moulder. May I interrupt, Mr. Chairman, at that point? 

You refuse to answer that question on the same grovuids you used 
previously ? 

Mr. Solomon. Same grounds, yes. 

Mr. Moulder. Also, Mr. Tavenner asked you if you honestly be- 
lieved that a truthful answer to the question mig'ht tend to incrimi- 
nate you. You said "yes." Do you believe that if you honestly 
answered the question just propomided it might tend to incriminate 
you? 

Mr. Solomon. Yes, sir. 

Mr, Moulder. While a member of that club, did you ever commit 
a crime or any act of treason or disloyalty to our country ? 

Mr. Solomon. I refuse to answer that question, sir. Same grounds 
as previously stated. 

Mr. Tavenner. After the so-called reconstruction of the Commu- 
nist Party in 1946, did you become a member of the Communist Party 
in San Pedro ? 

Mr. Solomon. I refuse to answer that question on the same grounds 
as previously stated, sir. 

Mr. Tavenner. I offer in evidence, and ask that it be marked "Solo- 
mon Exhibit No. 4," a thermof ax copy of an article appearing in the 
May 10, 1946, issue of People's World, entitled "Negro Girl De- 
fended — Communist Group Pulls Cover Off of Bus Driver's Charges." 
May it be received in evidence ? 

The Chairman. Let it be received. 

(Document marked "Solomon Exhibit No. 4," and retained in com- 
mittee files.) 

Mr. Tavenner. The last paragraph of this article reads as follows : 

On the Communist committee are Morel, Robert Levlne, Steve Edney, William 
Wright, Helen Robello and Joseph Solomon. 

Is the identification of Joseph Solomon a correct identification 
of you ? 

Mr. Solomon. I refuse to answer that question, sir, on the same 
grounds as previously stated. 

The Chairman. Let me see that. 



COMMUNISM IN SOUTHERN CALIFORNIA AREA 99 

Mr. Tavenner. Were you a member of the committee of the Com- 
munist Party on the date indicated? 

Mr. Solomon. I refuse to answer again on the same basis. 

Mr. Tavenner. Is it not true that as late as May 1956 you were 
section organizer of the Eastern Division of the Los Angeles County 
Communist Party ? 

Mr. Solomon. I refuse to answer that question on the same gromids 
as previously stated. 

Mr. Tavenner. As indicated in my earlier question, there was some 
uncertainty as to whether you resigned from the Communist Party or 
whether you were assigned some particular activity and that your 
name should be dropi^ed as an organizational member of the Com- 
munist Party. So let me ask you this question : Are you now a mem- 
ber of the Communist Party ? 

Mr. Solomon. I refuse to answer the question, sir, on the same 
grounds previously stated. 

Mr. Tavenner. Have you at any time gone through the formality 
of resigning from the Communist Party ? 

Mr. Solomon. I refuse to answer that question. 

Mr. Tavenner. I have no further questions. 

Mr. Moulder. Were you ever a member of the U.S. Armed Forces ? 

Mr. Solomon. No, sir. 

Mr. Moulder. Were you subject to military service call during the 
last war? 

Mr. Solomon. You mean was I classified, and so forth ? 

Mr. Moulder. Yes. 

Mr. Solomon. Yes; I was subject. 

Mr. Moulder. What was your classification ? 

Mr. Solomon. I believe it was III-A. 

Mr. Moulder. You were how old at the time ? 

Mr. Solomon. Which year are you referring to now ? 

Mr. Moulder. 1942. 

Mr. Solomon. 1942, that is 16 years ago. 29. 

Mr. Moulder. That is all. 

The Chairman. Will you raise your right hand, please? Do you 
swear the testimony you are about to give will be the truth, the whole 
truth, and nothing but the truth, so help you God ? 

Mrs. BiBER. I do. 

TESTIMONY OF STELLA CHOYKE BIBER, ACCOMPANIED BY 
COUNSEL, LOREN MILLER 

Mr. Tavenner. Will you state your name, please ? 

Mrs. Biber. My name is Stella Biber. 

Mr. Tavenner. How do you spell your last name ? 

Mrs. Biber. B-i-b-e-r. 

Mr. Tavenner, Do you have a middle initial ? 

Mrs. Biber. Sometimes I use the initial "C." 

Mr. Tavenner. Will counsel identify himself for the record ? 

Mr. Miller. My name is Loren Miller. 

Mr. Tavenner. Wlien and where were you born ? 

Mrs. Biber. I was born in New York City, September 11, 1902. 



100 COMMUNISM IN SOUTHERN CALIFORNIA AREA 

Mr. Tavenner. Wlien did you come to California to make it the 
place of your residence? 

Mrs. BiBER. About 15 years ago. 

Mr. Tavenner. Wliat is your occupation? 

Mrs. Biber. I am a bookkeeper. 

Mr. Tavenner. Will you please tell the committee what your tormal 
educational training has been? -,. • >t a^ i n-4. f: 

Mrs Biber. Grammar school— it was all m New lork Oity, ot 
course— and Julia Kichman High School, and I went to New York 
University where I studied accounting and business administration. 

Mr. Tavenner. You say you are presently engaged as a bookkeeper ( 

Mrs. Biber. That is tme. . . i i 

Mr. Tavenner. Over how long a period of time have you been so 

employed? , , ^ , ^ .^ 

Mrs Biber. Oh, I have been a bookkeeper for almost 40 years. _ 
Mr. Tavenner. That has been your constant work since being in 
California? 

Mrs. Biber. Yes ; also since I was 16 years ot age. 
Mr. Tavenner. Have you at any time engaged m any other occupa- 
tion besides that of a bookkeeper? 

Mrs. Biber. No. , . .. ^ ,. , 

Mr. Tavenner. The committee's investigation indicates that you 
were an organizational secretary of the 62d Assembly District of the 
Communist Party in 1951. Is that correct ? 

Mrs. Biber. Well, I refuse to answer that question. 
Mr. Tavenner. Wliy ? ^ , . ^ . i 

Mrs. Biber. Under— well, first, I claim the hrst amendment to the 
Constitution, and I wish to invoke the fifth amendment of the Con- 
stitution of the United States. . 

Mr. Tavenner. Have you at any time been assigned by the Com- 
munist Party to become active in the Independent Progressive Party 

of California ? ,. , • 

Mrs. Biber. I decline to answer that question for the reason previ- 
ously stated. 

Mr. Tavenner. Well, you have been active m that work, have you 

not? 

Mrs. Biber. I decline to answer that question. 

Mr. Tavenner. I desire to offer in evidence a photostatic copy ot 
a petition of the Independent Progressive Party to participate in the 
primary election of June 1, 1948, to wliich there is attached an affidavit 
over the signature of a Stella C. Biber. I desire to offer it m evidence 
and ask that it be marked "Biber Exhibit No. 1." 

The Chairman. Make it a part of the record. 

(Document marked "Biber Exhibit No. 1" and retained m committee 
files.) 

Mr. Tavenner. Will you examine it, please, and state wliether or 
not there is an affidavit at the end of that petition stating that you 
circulated and obtained the signatures of the persons appearing 

above ? 

Mrs. Biber. I decline to answer the question for the reasons pre- 
viously stated. 

Mr. Tavenner. Is the signature appearing at the bottom ot the 
petition your signature? 



COAIMUNISM IN SOUTHERN CALIFORNIA AREA 101 

Mrs. BiBER. Same answer. 

Mr. Tavenner. Have you at any time been assigned by the Com- 
munist Party to work in the Los Angeles Negro Labor Council ? 

Mrs. BiBER. I decline to answer that question and invoke the fifth 
amendment. 

Mr. Moulder. Do you honestly believe that the truthful answer 
to that question would tend to incriminate you ? 

Mrs. BiBER. Well, that is my answer. I claim the privilege of the 
first amendment, which deals with right of association, and also the 
privilege of the fifth amendment. 

Mr. Moulder. Do you believe that to tell whether or not you are 
a member of a Negro Labor Council might tend to incriminate you to 
the extent that you would be subjected to prosecution ? 
Mrs. BiBER. I have given my answer. 

Mr. Moulder. You haven't answered my question. I just asked 
you a question. 

Mrs. BiBER. I have no other answer. 

Mr. TA^^3NNER. I failed to ask you, is the name Stella C. Biber your 
maiden name or your married name ? 
Mrs. Biber. That is my married name. 
Mr. Tavenner. What was your maiden name? 
Mrs. Biber. Stella Choyke. That is where the C comes from. 
Mr. Tavenner. Were you a member of the executive board of the 
Wiggins Club of the Communist Party of Los Angeles in 1949 ? 
Mrs. Biber. I decline to answer for the reasons previously stated. 
Mr. Ta\'enner. There was a convention— in fact the organization 
convention— of the Southern District of the California Communist 
Party held in Los Angeles on April 13 and 14, 1957, which was ad- 
dressed at that time by the chairman of this district, Dorothy Healey. 
Our information is that you were a delegate to that convention, is 
that correct? 

Mrs. Biber. I decline to answer. 
Mr. Tavenner. Did you attend the convention ? 
Mrs. Biber. I decline to answer for the reasons previously stated. 
Mr. Tavenner. You are acquainted with the character of the 
report that she made, are you not ? 
Mrs. Biber. I decline to answer. 

Mr. Tavenner. Let me ask you a little about it. She reported the 
decision of the National Committee of the Communist Party, support- 
ing the Soviet use of armed forces in Himgary. Did you at any time 
remonstrate against that? 

Mrs. Biber. I decline to answer that question for the reasons pre- 
viously stated. 

Mr. Tavenner. Did you at any time support, directly or in- 
directly, the Communist Party in its support of the Soviet Union's 
action in Hungary ? 

Mrs. Biber. I decline to answer that question for the reasons pre- 
viously stated. 

Mr. Tavenner. You are aware of the great division of opinion 
among the members of the District Council of the Southern District 
of California regarding the execution of Nagy; are you not? 
Mrs. Biber. I decline to answer that question. 



102 COMMUNISM IN SOUTHERN CALIFORNIA AREA 

Mr. Tavenner. Were you present at a meeting held on July 27, 
1958, of the District Council of the Commimis*^ ^arty for the Southern 
District of California? 

Mrs. BiBER. I decline to answer that question for the reasons pre- 
viously stated. 

Mr. Ta\^nner. It is not our information that you were present, 
but I thought if you happened to be and we missed it in some way, 
you might enlighten us on the subject. 

Mrs. Biber. I would be glad to be helpful to you, sir. 

Mr. Tavenner. Then, let me ask you what the plans of the Com- 
munist Party are regarding Dorothy Healey's retention as the leader 
of the Communist Party in this area? Now you can be helpful. 

Mrs. Biber. That is"^quite a question. I decline to answer that 
question. 

Mr. Tavenner. You are very helpful. That is all. 

The Chairman. No further questions. We will recess imtil 2 
o'clock. 

(Members present: Representatives Walter and Moulder.) 

(Whereupon, at 12:05 p.m., Wednesday, September 3, 1958, the 
committee recessed, to reconvene at 2 p.m. of the same day.) 

AFTERNOON SESSION— WEDNESDAY, SEPTEMBER 3, 1958 

The hearing was resumed at 2 :20 p.m., pui*suant to the recess. 

(Committee members present: Representatives Walter and 
Moulder.) 

The Chairman. The hearing will be in order. 

Will you raise your right hand, please ? 

Do you swear the testimony you are about to give will be the truth, 
the whole truth, and nothing but the truth, so help you God ? 

Mr. Gavron. I do. 

The Chairman. Sit down. 

TESTIMONY OF JOSEPH I. GAVRON, ACCOMPANIED BY COUNSEL, 
ROBERT J. SCHMORLEITZ 

Mr. Tavenner. Will you state your name, please, sir ? 

Mr. Gavron. Joseph I. Gavron. 

Mr. Tavenner. Will you spell your last name ? 

Mr. Gavron. G-a-v-r-o-n. 

Mr. Tavenner. It is noticed that the witness is accompanied by 
counsel. Will counsel please identify himself for the record? 

Mr. Schmorleitz. Robert J. Schmorleitz, member of the California 
Bar, offices at 11108 Houston Street, North Hollywood. 

Mr. Ta\^nner. Where do you reside, Mr. Gavron ? 

Mr. Gavron. In Sun Valley. 

Mr. Ta\^nner. What is the address ? 

Mr. Gavron. 10447 Lanark Street. 

Mr. Tavenner. When and where were you bom ? 

Mr. Ga^tion. I w^as born in Perth Amboy, N. J., in 1920, November 1. 

Mr. Tavenner. When did you first come to California to make it 
the place of your permanent residence, if it is the place of your 
permanent residence ? 

Mr. Gavron. In 1946. 



COMMUNISM IN SOUTHERN CALIFORNIA AREA 103 

Mr. Tavenner. Wliat is your occupation ? 

Mr. Gavron. I am a salesman. 

Mr. Tavenner. Will you tell the committee, briefly, what your 
formal educational training has been ? 

Mr. Gavron. Well, I went to elementary school, then to junior high, 
and was graduated from high school in 1937 ; and I went for a period 
of 314 years to a number of junior colleges in the evening. That is 
the extent of my formal education. 

Mr. Tavenner. Wliat has been your record of employment in Cali- 
fornia since your arrival in 1946 ? 

Mr. Gavron. I have always been a salesman. 

Mr. Tavenner. Salesman in what type of work ? 

Mr. Gavron. In general food industry. 

Mr. Tavenner. Does this carry you outside of the corporate limits 
of Los Angeles ? 

(Witness confers with counsel. ) 

Mr. Gavron. May I ask, sir, the pertinency of that question, the 
pertinency of that question relative to the committee hearing? 

Mr. Tavenner. The pertinency of that question is that the com- 
mittee desires to know to what extent you have been available in the 
Southern District of California for carrying on presently the work 
of the Communist Party in this area; and the fact that your duties 
confine you to the city of Los Angeles or whether it is over a broader 
area is certainly pertinent in following the committee's investiga- 
tion of the present activities and purposes of the present activities 
of the Communist Party in this area, 

(Witness confers with counsel.) 

Mr. Gavron. Sir, I respectfully decline to answer that question 
on the grounds of the first and fifth amendments and also on the 
grounds of pertinency. 

Mr. Tavenner. Are you relying on that part of the fifth amend- 
ment which has to do with the giving of testimony against yourself 
or the self-incrimination section of the fifth amendment ? 

(Witness confers with counsel.) 

Mr. Gavron. I am relying on the entire fifth amendment, which 
includes, of course, the section that you just stated. 

Mr. Tavenner. Do you honestly apprehend that a truthful an- 
swer to the question I asked you would tend to incriminate you ? 

Mr. Gavron. Sir, I have already given my answer to that ques- 
tion. 

The Chairman, You have not answered this question. Answer 
the question. 

Mr, Gavron. I answer the question, sir, on the same grounds that 
I have previously stated. 

The Chairman. In other words, you refuse to answer the question 
on the grounds that you have stated ? 

Mr. Gavron. That is correct, sir. 

The Chairman. All right. 

Mr. Tavenner. I think, Mr. Chairman, in light of the witness' re- 
fusal to answer a plain question which is addressed to the real motive 
of his refusal to answer, that he should be directed to answer. 

The Chairman. I have directed him to answer. 

Mr. Tavenner. You understand you have been directed to answer 
the question ? 



104 COMMUNISM IN SOUTHERN CALIFORNIA AREA 

(Witness confers with counsel.) 

Mr. Gaveoivt. For the record, I have refused to answer the question 
on the grounds that I have previously stated, based on the first and 
fifth amendments of the Constitution, and I refuse to answer this 
question on the same gi'ounds. 

Mr. Tavenner. Mr. Gavron, during the course of this hearing and 
the investigation made by the committee prior to the hearing, it has 
been ascertained that a new organizational setup has been made for 
the Communist Party in the State of California. The State of Cali- 
fornia has now been divided into two districts, one being the South- 
ern District of the Communist Party of California, which we un- 
derstand has a district council composed of 62 members. 

Are you a member of that council ? 

Mr. Gavron. I respectfully, sir, refuse to answer the question on 
the grounds of the first amendment to the Constitution, supplemented 
by the fifth amendment. 

Mr. Tavenner. The committee understands that the first organiza- 
tional meeting of the newly established district occurred on April 13 
and 14, 1957, and at this meeting the chairman of this district, Doro- 
thy Healey, made a rather extended report on trade union matters, 
the Jewish question, the People's World, and numerous other sub- 
jects. Among the items covered by her report was a section relating 
to youth. 

Have you been particularly interested in Communist Party ac- 
tivities within youth groups ? 

Mr. Gavron. Sir, I respectfully decline to answer the question on 
the grounds of the first amendment and the fifth amendment. 

Mr. Tavenner. Have you read the section of Dorothy Healey's 
report on youth ? 

Mr. Gavron. Sir, I again respectfully decline to answer this ques- 
tion both on the grounds of the first fimendment to the Constitution, 
supplemented by the fifth amendment to the Constitution. 

Mr. Tavenner. Have you not, for a long period of time, been inter- 
ested actively in various phases of the youth movement at the instance 
of the Communist Party ? 

Mr. Gavron. Again, sir, I respectfully decline to answer that ques- 
tion on the grounds of the first amendment to the Constitution as well 
as the fifth amendment to the Constitution. 

Mr. Tavenner. Mr. Chairman, I desire to offer in evidence a ther- 
mof ax copy of the February 16, 1948, issue of People's World and ask 
that it be marked "Gavron Exhibit No. 1." 

The Chairman. It will be made a part of the record. 

(Document marked "Gavron Exhibit No. 1," and retained in com- 
mittee files.) 

Mr. Tavenner. This excerpt includes an article entitled, "Army 
Draft Protest Set Tonight." It announces the speakers who were to 
appear on this program, and the last one mentioned is Joseph Gavron, 
American Youth for Democracy board member. 

Were you correctly described there as a board member of the 
American Youth for Democracy? 

( Document handed to witness. ) 

Mr. Gavron. Sir, I respectfully decline to answer the question both 
on the grounds of the first amendment to our Constitution, supple- 
mented by the fifth amendment to our Constitution. 



COMMUNISM IN SOUTHERN CALIFORNIA AREA 105 

Mr. Tavenner. Have you also been active in the work of the Labor 
Youth League in Los Angeles ? 

Mr. Gavkon. Sir, I respectfully decline to answer that question on 
the grounds both of the first amendment to our Constitution, supple- 
mented by the fifth amendment to our Constitution. 

Mr. Tavenner. It is our understanding from the records of the 
Sixteenth National Convention of the Communist Party, held in 
New York February 1957, that generally speaking the work of the 
Communist Party in youth groups was failing, or at least that they 
were being unsuccessful, in attracting the attention of the youth of 
the country as it had hoped to do. 

You are familiar with that, are you not ? 

Mr. Gavron. I again, sir, respectfully refuse to answer the question 
both on the grounds of the first and fifth amendments. 

Mr. Tavenner. Has this not led to the disbandment of the Labor 
Youth League of America, which is, of course, a cited organization, 
cited as a Communist organization ? 

Mr. Gavron. Again, sir, I respectfully decline to answer the ques- 
tion, based both on the grounds of the first amendment to our Consti- 
tution as well as on the grounds of the fifth amendment to our 
Constitution. 

Mr. Tavenner. Aren't you involved now in a plan of the Communist 
Party to extend and renew its activities among youth ? 

Mr. Gavron. Again, sir, I respectfully decline to answer the ques- 
tion, based on the grounds of the first amendment to the Constitution 
as well as the fifth amendment to the Constitution . 

Mr. Tavenner. Will you give the committee the benefit of what 
knowledge you have of the present plan of the Communist Party to 
extend its activities among youth or in youth fields ? 

Mr. Gavron. Again, sir, I respectfully decline to answer the ques- 
tion, based on the first amendment to the Constitution as well as tho 
fifth amendment to the Constitution. 

Mr. Tavenner. Have you, at any time, engaged in work within the 
Independent Progressive Party of California at the instance of the 
Communist Party? That is, work carrying on Communist Party 
activities within that group ? 

Mr. Gavron. Again, sir, I respectfully decline to answer the ques- 
tion, based on both the first amendment to the Constitution, as well as 
on the grounds of the fifth amendment to our Constitution. 

Mr. Tavenner. Mr. Chairman, I offer in evidence a photostatic copy 
of the petition to participate in the primary election June 1, 1948, of 
the Independent Progressive Party of California and ask that it be 
marked "Gavron Exhibit No. 2." 

The Chairman. It will be put in the record. 

(Document marked "Gavron Exhibit No. 2," and retained in com- 
mittee files.) 

Mr. Tavenner. At the end of this petition, which lists a number of 
names as petitioners, there is an affidavit in the name of Joseph Gavron 
regarding the circulation of the petition. 

Mr. Gavron, will you examine this affidavit and state whether or not 
the signature appearing there is your genuine signature ? 

Mr. Gavron. Sir 

(Witness confers with counsel.) 



106 COMMUNISM IN SOUTHERN CALIFORNIA AREA 

Mr. Gavron. Sir, I respectfully decline to answer that question, 
based on the first amendment to our Constitution as well as the fifth 
amendment to our Constitution. 

Mr. Tavenner. Mr. Gavron, there has been introduced in evidence, 
during the course of this hearing, a letter of grievances signed by 22 
persons, under date of December 14, 1957, and directed to the National 
Committee of the Communist Party. This letter is quite a severe 
indictment of the leadersliip, the present leadership of the Communist 
Party, on a national level. 

According to the committee's information, we are able to identify 
the names of those who signed that letter. The full names of some are 
given. In other instances, only the first name and middle initial. 
In some instances, only the first name is given. We find here, for 
instance, the name of "Joe," with the designation of the Communist 
Party unit of which he was a member as "Valley 22." 

Will you state whether or not that was your method of signing this 
letter of grievances? 

Mr. Gaveon. Sir, I respectfully decline to answer the question, 
based upon the grounds of the first amendment to our Constitution, 
supplemented by the fifth amendment to our Constitution. 

Mr. Tavenner. Did you sign it ? 

Mr. Gavron. I have already answered the question, sir. I will 
answer it again. 

I do respectfully decline to answer it, based on the constitutional 
grounds of the first amendment to our Constitution as well as the 
fifth amendment to our Constitution, sir. 

Mr. Tavenner. Were you a member of the Communist Party of 
the Southern District of California on December 14, 1957? 

Mr. Gavron. I again, sir, respectfully refuse, decline to answer 
the question, based on the first and fifth amendments to our Con- 
stitution. 

Mr. Tavenner. That letter of protest or letter of grievances was 
replied to by Dorothy Healey. She circulated her reply in writing 
on the 9th day of March 1958, among the 62 members of the District 
Council of the Communist Party for the Southern District of Cali- 
fornia. 

Did you receive a copy of that reply ? 

Mr. Gavron. Sir, I respectfully decline to answer the question, 
based on both the first and fifth amendments to our Constitution. 

Mr. Tavenner. The reply apparently did not persuade the majority 
of those who signed the letter of grievances or, rather, it may have 
persuaded the majority, but not all of those who signed the letter of 
♦rrievances, for on JNIarch 26, 1958, a letter of resignation was signed 
by a number of persons, directed to the National Committee of the 
Communist Party. Did you sign any such letter? 

We do not find your name ; I will state it fairly that we do not find 
your name or anything indicating the presence of your name on the 
letter of resignation. But have you signed any resignation, whether 
on that date or any other date, as a member of the Communist Party ? 

(Witness confers with his counsel.) 

Mr. Gavron. Sir, I respectfully decline to answer the question, 
based on the grounds of the first amendment and the fifth amendment 
to our Constitution. 



COMMUNISM IN SOUTHERN CALIFORNIA AREA 107 

Mr. Tavenner. Now, having studied the letter of grievances to 
which your name is attached, I am convinced that you do not agree 
with the leadership of the Communist Party on a national level. 
I am rather persuaded to think that you are not now a member of 
the Coimnunist Party, Why do you not give us the facts? 

Is it true that vou are not now^ a member of the Communist Party ? 

Mr. Gavron. Sir, you have a number of questions involved in the 
last statement, so if you would 

Mr. Tavenner. Just answer the last one. You are not now^ a mem- 
ber of the Communist Party, are you ? 

Mr. Gavron. I am not a member of the Communist Party. 

Mr, Tavenner. I thought not. And you are not a member because 
you disagreed with the leadership of the Conununist Party, did you 
not? 

Mr. Gavron. I respectfully decline to answer the question, based 
on the first and fifth amendments to our Constitution. 

Mr. Tavenner, As a practical matter, Mr. Gavron, the members of 
this committee understand these problems. You are not fooling any- 
body by saying that you are not a member now but not saying any- 
thing about having resigned from the Communist Party. There can 
only be one fair, reasonable inference from your testimony. Now, 
why do you not give the committee the full facts in regard to it? 
We have important matters to ask you that are certainly within your 
knowledge. 

Why are you not frank with this group and tell them the facts, 
instead of trying to play a game with the committee? 

Mr. Gavron. Would the counsel kindly rephrase the question ? 

Mr. Tavenner, Yes. Wliy do you continue to play a game with 
the committee and refuse to answer a question which relates to im- 
portant matters that this committee wants to learn about? 

Mr. Gavron. Sir, I respectfully suggest that I am not playing a 
game with the committee, and have in the past and will continue to, 
during the process of the hearing, answer the questions or decline 
to answer the questions in as proper and respectful a manner as I can. 

Mr. Tavenner. Yes, I am impressed with that. I am impressed 
with your respectful attitude. And I think you want to tell this 
committee the facts. Why don't you do it? What is there to pre- 
vent you from doing it? Is there any fear or have there been any 
threats of any character that would influence you ? 

(Witness confers with his counsel.) 

Mr. Gavron. It is, sir, my feeling that in regard to the general 
areas protected by the first amendment relative to association, free- 
dom of speech and press, political persuasion, that these areas are 
quite specifically protected from inquiry from a congressional com- 
mittee, and it is for this reason that I respectfully refrain from dis- 
cussing matters that fall into this general category. 

Mr. Tavenner, Although your name is not subscribed as one of 
those who signed the letter of resignation, did you later subscribe 
to it, in any form, by way of approval ? 

Mr. Gavron. Sir, I respectfully decline to answer the question, 
based on the first amendment to our Constitution and the fifth amend- 
ment to our Constitution. 



88258 — 69— pt, 1- 



108 COMMUNISM m SOUTHERN CALIFORNIA AREA 

Mr. Tavenner. Now, having ascertained that you are no longer 
a member of the Commmiist Party and having the informa- 
tion of which I have spoken regarding your former Communist Party 
membership and the signing of j^our name as one of those who opposed 
the leadership of the Communist Party in the letter of grievances, 
and coupled with your continual refusal after having every oppor- 
tunity to give us an explanation, I am left with no possible conclusion 
in the matter other than this which appears in the letter of grievances 
which you signed. There is a recommendation in this letter asking 
that the present structure of the Communist Party be made more 
flexible so that membership in the present type of party club is not 
necessarily a requirement for adherence to the Communist Party. 
You understand what I mean ? 

Mr. Gavron. I believe I understand what you just said. 

Mr. Tavenner. In other words, here is a request or, rather, a state- 
ment of grievances signed by you which is asking the privilege of not 
being, organizationally speaking, a member of the Communist Party, 
but yet 

( Witness confers with counsel. ) 

Mr. Tavenner. But yet one who adheres to the organization. 

Now, doesn't that mean that as far as you are concerned— I will 
not ask about other people in regard to it, but only as to you— that 
you are just as much a member of the Communist Party today m 
carrying out its objectives as you were before this letter of grievances 
was sent forth except that you are not, organizationally speaking, a 
dues-paying member? 

You are nodding your head with approval. 

Mr. Gavron. Sir 

Mr. Tavenner. And I assume you agree to that. 

Mr. Gavron. No, sir. I would like to say that your reference 

( Counsel confers with witness. ) 

Mr. Gavron. Sir, you made reference to the signature to a letter of 
grievances, allegedly mine. I made no such statement in recognition 
of any signature or letter. The assmnption that the name is mine is 
yours to make. 

The Chairman. Was it yours? 

Mr. Gavron. Sir, I respectfully declined to answer the question m 
a previous statement put forward to me by counsel. 

The Chairman. Ask another question, Mr. Tavenner. 

Mr. Tavenner. You have not answered the question. 

The Chairman. Of course he has not. Go ahead and ask another 
one. 

Mr. Tavenner. Are you now an adherent to the Communist Party 
organization although not, organizationally speaking, a dues-paying 
member ? 

Mr. Gavron. I respectfully. Counselor, decline to answer the ques- 
tion based on the grounds of the first and fifth amendments to our 
Constitution. 

Mr. Tavenner. And do you apprehend that a truthful answer to 
that question might tend to incriminate you ? 

Mr. Gavron. I have, sir, respectfully indicated my answer to the 
question. 

Mr. Tavenner. I have no further questions, Mr. Chairman. 



CO:^£MUXISM IX SOUTHERX CALIFORNIA AREA 109 

The CHAmiiAN-. Any questions ? 

]Mr. Moulder. Just one question, Mr. Chairman. 

Did you know that this committee is striving to secure through 
witnesses all the information it possibly can to assist the committee 
in formulating legislation to protect our national security ? Do you 
have any knowledge or information concerning the act of any person 
within the Communist Party which is subversive or which endangers 
our national security ? 

("Witness confers with counsel.) 

Mr. Gaveox. Sir, I have no knowledge of any individual who is a 
threat to the security of our country. 

Mr. MouLDEE. Have you yourself been guilty of committing any 
acts, subversive acts or conduct, which might endanger our national 
security or present system or form of Government ? 

'Mr. Gavro:s. Sir, I say most unequivocally that I have not ever 
committed any illegal acts, and in regard to th.e general reference to 
subversive, I would need a more definitive explanation of the term, 
sir. 

Mr. Moulder. Well, then, your answer causes me to ask you this 
question : How can you, in good faith, claim the provisions of the fifth 
amendment ? By answering the questions in that way you are placing 
yourself in the position of being subjected to prosecution, when you 
say you have not violated any law or committed any act of disloyalty 
which is a threat to our national security. Then how do you claim 
the provisions of the fifth amendment in answering questions which 
were propounded by counsel — that to answer might tend to incrimi- 
nate you and subject you to prosecution? 

Mr. GAVRoy^. I respectfully suggest that the concept of the fifth 
amendment is indeed not a shield for the guilty but rather, in fact, 
a shield for the innocent; and it is in that sense and in that regard 
that I claim the fifth amendment in response to the questions put for- 
ward to me by counsel. 

The CHAiRiiAX. Thtat is the modem concept of the fifth amendment. 

Anything further, Mr. Tavenner ? 

Mr. Ta\-exxer. Yes, sir, one question. Are you at this time a 
member of the 22d Congressional District unit of the Communist 
Party? 

Mr. Gaveok". Sir, I respectfully decline to answer the question, 
based on the first and the fifth amendments. 

Mr. Tavenner. Just a moment ago, a little while ago, you said you 
were not at the present time a member of the Communist Party. 
Maybe you misunderstood my question. This is almost the same 
thing, when I ask you whether you are a member of a particular unit 
of the Communist Party at this time. Do you understand what I 
mean ? 

Mr. Gaveon. Yes, sir. 

(Witness confers with counsel.) 

Mr. Gaveon. Sir, would you kindly repeat the last question? 

Mr. Tavenner. Yes. Are you at this time a member of the 22d 
Congressional District unit of the Communist Party? 

Mr. Ga\tion. Sir, in the question, rather, put forward to me by you 
relative to membership in the Communist Party where I answered 
negatively, I again answer I do not belong nor am I a member of the 
Communist Part v. 



110 COMMUNISM IN SOUTHERN CALIFORNIA AREA 

Mr. Tavenner. Were you a member of that imit of the Communist 
Party at any time in March of 1958 ? 

Mr. Gavron. Sir, I respectfully decline to answer the question, 
based on the grounds of the first amendment, supplemented by the 
fifth. 

Mr. Tavexner. There was a very impoi-tant meeting of the district 
comicil of the Communist Party on the 27th of July 1958. So I 
would like to ask you whether or not at any time during the month 
of July 1958 you were a member of the 22d Congi^essional District 
unit of the Commmiist Party? 

Mr. Gaveon. Sir, I again respectfully decline to answer the ques- 
tion, based on the first and fifth amendments to our Constitution. 

Mr. Tavenner. Although you say you are not a member of the 
Communist Party today, which is the 3d day of September, were you 
a member of the Communist Party on the 1st day of September 1958 ? 

Let me correct that by saying : Were you a member of the 22d Con- 

§ressional District unit of the Communist Party on the 1st day of 
eptember of this year, just 2 or 3 days ago ? 

Mr. Gavron. Sir, I respectfully decline to answer the question, 
based on both the first and the fifth amendments to the Constitution. 

Mr. Ta-venner. You see that makes us question your good faith in 
your denial of Communist Party membership. Did you determine 
that you were no longer a member of the Communist Party when 
you appeared in this building to attend this hearing? Was that 
the time you ceased to become a member ? 

Mr. Gavron. I respectfully give the same answer, sir, that I gave 
a moment ago, based on the first and fifth amendments. 

Mr. Tavenner. Let us come to the point. Were you a member of 
the Communist Party when you entered the door to this hearing room 
immediately prior to taking the witness stand ? 

Mr. Gavron. The same answer to the question, sir. I decline to 
answer it, respectfully decline, on the grounds of the fii*st and fifth 
amendments. 

The Chairman. Is that all, Mr. Tavenner ? 

Mr. Tavenner. Yes, sir. 

The Chairman. The witness is excused. 

Mr. Tavenner, Call Esther Sokolow. 

The Chairman. Will you raise your right hand, please? 

Do you swear the testimony you are about to give will be the 
truth, the whole truth, and nothing but the truth, so help you God? 

Mrs. SoKOLOW. I do. 

TESTIMONY OF ESTHER GOLDIE SOKOLOW, ACCOMPANIED BY 
COUNSEL, AL WIRIN 

Mr. Tavenner. What is your name, please? 

Mrs. SoKOLOW. Esther Sokolow. 

Mr. Tavenner. Will you spell your last name ? 

Mrs. SoKOLow. S-o-k-o-l-o-w. 

Mr. Tavenner. Do you have a middle name? 

Mrs. SoKOLOw. No,"l don't. 

Mr. Tavenner. Is that your married name ? 



COMMUNISM IN SOUTHERN CALIFORNIA AREA 111 

Mrs. SoKOLOW. Oh, wait a minute. I had a middle name once. It 
was Goldie, G-o-l-d-i-e. I never use it, 

Mr. Tavenner. Is that your married name or your maiden name? 

Mrs. SoKOLOw. My married name. 

Mr. Tavenner. What was your name prior to marriage ? 

Mrs. SoKOLow. I am afraid I won't be able to answer that question 
under the fifth amendment. 

Mr. Tavenner. It is noted that the witness is accompanied by coun- 
sel, Mr. Al Wirin, a member of the Los Angeles Bar. 

Where were you born ? 

Mrs. SoKOLOw. Cincinnati, Ohio. 

Mr. Tavenner. What day? 

Mrs. SoKOLOw. April 1, 1902. 

Mr. Tavenner. When did you first come to California to make it 
your permanent place of residence? 

Mrs. SoKOLOw. Let's see. I was brought here — I can't remember 
whether it was 1910 or 1911, one of those 2 years. 

Mr. Tavenner. What is your profession ? 

Mrs. SoKOLOw. I am a social worker. 

Mr. Tavenner. Have you been engaged in the work of any pro- 
fession ? 

Mrs. SoKOLOw. Yes. I taught for a short while. 

Mr. Tavenner. Over what period of time ? 

Mrs. SoKOLOw. 19 — one semester in 1923 and one semester in 1924, 
and I was on the substitute list for about 2 years, but I didn't get called 
very often. 

Mr. Tavenner. When was that ? 

Mrs. SoKOLow. Immediately following — no, wait a minute — 1927 — 
I don't remember those dates, up to 1928. 

(Counsel confers with witness.) 

Mr. Tavenner. 1928? 

Mrs. SoKOLow. I think that was the date that I terminated being on 
the substitute list. 

Mr. Tavenner. Did you apply for a teaching position in any more 
recent period than that ? 

Mrs. SoKOLow. Not for teaching. 

Mr. Tavenner. What did you apply for ? 

Mrs. SoKOLOW. Well, I will tell you, I think I had better take the 
fifth on that. 

Mr. Tavenner. You say you think you should ? Won't you change 
your mind and tell us the facts ? 

Mrs. SoKOLOw. No; I think maybe I had better take the fifth on 
that. 

Mr. Tavenner. Do you take the fifth amendment ? 

Mrs. SoKOLOw. I do. 

Mr. Tavenner. And by taking the fifth amendment, do you mean 
to state that if you gave a truthful answer, it might tend to incriminate 
you? 

Mrs. SoKOLOw. It might. It wouldn't incriminate me. 

Mr. Tavenner. That is the definition of the fifth amendment. 

Mrs. SoKOLOw. But it might open me up to prosecution, and my 
lawyer 

(Counsel confers with witness. ) 



112 COMMUNISM IN SOUTHERN CALIFORNIA AREA 

Mrs. SoKOLow. And my lawyer tells me that that is incrimination. 

Mr. Tavenner. Will you tell us briefly what your formal educa- 
tional training has been ? 

Mrs. SoKOLOW. Well, I have a B.A. and about 3 years of graduate 
work, including a master's in English. 

Mr. Tavenner. In what school did you receive your B.A. degree 
and do your master's work ? 

Mrs. SoKOLOw. The B.A. was from the University of California 
in Berkeley. The master's is from Occidental College. 

Mr. Tavenner. What year? 

Mrs. SoKOLOw. Let me see. June of 1925, 1 got the master's. 

Mr. Tavenner. You stated that more recently you have been a social 
worker. Over what period of time specifically and where? 

Mrs. SoKOLOw. A long time. But as I told you before, Mr. Taven- 
ner, with respect to that — just a minute. 

(Witness confers with counsel.) 

Mr. WiRiN. May the question be read to the witness ? 

The Chairman. Read the question. 

Mr. Tavenner. I will restate the question. 

Over what period of time have you been engaged in social work or 
welfare work? 

Mrs. SoKOLow. You know, I am just wondering, that doesn't seem 
too pertinent to me, and I am afraid I am going to have to take the 
fifth on that. 

The Chairman. Don't you be afraid. Are you going to invoke the 
fifth amendment? Do you invoke the fifth amendment? 

Mrs. SoKOLOw. Oh, yes, I do. 

Mr. Moulder. May I inteipose this question? Are you now em- 
ployed by the city govermnent or State government in that capacity, 
as a social worker? 

(Counsel confers with witness.) 

Mr. WiRiN. May I speak to the witness ? 

The Chairman. Yes, you may. 

Mrs. SoKOLOw. May I ask you to repeat that question ? 

Mr. Moulder. Are you now employed by the city government or the 
county. State, or Federal Government as a social worker or in any 
other capacity ? 

Mrs. SoKOLow. I ask to be excused from this question. You see, 
the committee knows where I work. I was served 

The Chairman. Your request to be excused is not adequate. You 
are directed to answer the question. 

Mrs. SoKOLow. I asked to be excused on the basis 

The Chairman. I already said you would not be excused from an- 
swering the question, and I am directing you to answer the question 
that Judge Moulder just propounded. 

Mr. WiRiN. May she state the reasons why she cannot answer the 
question ? She has not finished her answer, Mr. Walter. She has be- 
gun to state the reasons. 

The Chairman. No, she did not at all. She said she wanted to be 
excused. 

Mr. WiRiN. This was her way of beginning to state her reasons. 
May she continue ? 

The Chairman. Just say you are not going to answer it and then 
tell us why. 



COMMUNISM IN SOUTHERN CALIFORNIA AREA 113 

Mrs. SoKOLOW. I cannot answer because, first, you know where I am 
employed. I was served there. Secondly, I work for a very reputable 
agency and I do not want to embarrass my employers. 

The Chairman. Why would it be embarrassing to your employers? 

Mrs. SoKOLOW. It would be embarrassing to my employers, and also 
I really don't want to lose my job. 

Mr. WiRiN. Just one second. 

(Counsel confers with witness.) 

Mr. WiRiN. She wants to answer your question a little more fully. 
She hasn't answered your inquiry. 

The Chairman. Can we assume from that that you are not employed 
by the Government or any subdivision thereof ? 

Mrs. SoKOLOw. You may assume thereof. 

The Chairman. Now we are making a little progress. Go ahead, 
Mr. Tavenner. 

Mr. Tavenner. Were you a member at any time of the Communist 
Party in the Silver Lake area ? 

Mrs. SoKOLow. I decline to answer on the basis of the fifth amend- 
ment and on the basis that it is hardly pertinent. 

Mr. Tavenner. Have you not expressed a disagreement with the 
present leadership of the Communist Party in its methods of 
operation ? 

Mrs. SoKOLOw. I decline to answer on the basis of the fifth 
amendment. 

Mr. Tavenner. As a result of a disagreement, haven't you now 
resigned from the Communist Party ? 

Mr. WiRiN. Mr. Lloyd Wright has just come into the room. 

The Chairman. Please sit down, Lloyd. That is all right. 

Go ahead. 

Mr. WiRiN. Mr. Wright's presence is not in connection with this 
present interrogation ? 

Mr. Tavenner. Not at all. 

Mr. WiRiN. He is here with regard to representation in a possible 
litigation ? 

Mrs. SoKOLow. Your question was 

Mr. Tavenner. My question was : Haven't you resigned from the 
Communist Party because of the opposition to the Communist Party 
leadership and the view that it is now ineffective ? 

(Witness confers with counsel.) 

Mrs. SoKOLOw. I refuse to answer on the grounds of the fifth amend- 
ment and pertinency. 

Mr. Tavenner. We understand that you are not a member of tho 
Communist Party. 

Mrs. SoKOLOw. Same reason. 

Mr. Tavenner. I have no further questions. 

The Chairman. The witness is excused. 

We will take a few minutes' recess. 

(Committee members present: Representatives Walter and 
Moulder.) 

(Short recess.) 

(Committee members present: Representatives Walter and Moul- 
der.) 



114 COMMUNISM m SOUTHERN CALIFORNIA AREA 

The Chairman. Will you raise your right hand, please? Do you 
swear the testimony you are about to give will be the truth, the whole 
truth, and nothing but the truth, so help you God ? 

Mr. IsHiHARA. I do. 

TESTIMONY OF SAKAE ISHIHARA, ACCOMPANIED BY COUNSEL, 

AL WIRIN 

Mr. Tavenner. What is your name? 

Mr. IsHiHARA. Sakae Ishihara. 

Mr. Tavenner. How do you spell your name ? 

Mr. Ishihara. S-a-k-a-e I-s-h-i-h-a-r-a. 

Mr. Ta^xnner. It is noted for the record that Mr. Al Wirin, a 
member of the California Bar and engaged in practice in Los Angeles, 
accompanies the witness. 

Where do you reside, Mr. Ishihara ? 

Mr. Ishihara. In Los Angeles. 

Mr. TAi'ENNER. What address ? 

(Witness confers with counsel.) 

Mr. Ishihara. 4205 Mandalay Drive, 

Mr. Tavenner. When and where were you born ? 

Mr. Ishihara. Born April 20, 1921, in Dominguez, Calif. 

Mr. Tavenner. "\^niat is your occupation ? 

Mr. Ishihara. Printer. 

Mr. Tavenner. Will you tell the committee briefly what your formal 
educational training has been ? 

Mr. Ishihailv. Graduate from high school and 2 years of univer- 
sity training. 

Mr. Tavenner. How long have you lived in Los Angeles ? 

Mr. Ishihara. 12 years. 

Mr. Tavenner. I understand you have a very outstanding war 
record. Wliat was the period of your service in the Armed Forces 
of the United States? 

Mr. Ishihara. Since January of 1943 to February of 1946. 

Mr. Tavenner. You were not in the 442d Infantry were you ? 

Mr, Ishihara. No. I was in the military intelligence in the Pacific 
as a language inter]>reter and interrogator. 

Mr. Tavenner. Air. Ishiliara, the committee is inquiring into cur- 
rent Communist Party activities in Los Angeles resulting from a 
reorganization of the Communist Party in this area. 

The committee has information that the first convention or the 
organizational convention of the present Southern District of the 
Communist Party of California was held in Los Angeles on April 13 
and 14, 1957. We have information that you attended that con- 
vention. Are we correct in that ? 

(Witness confers with counsel.) 

Mr. Ishihara. I refuse to answer on the grounds of the fifth amend- 
ment. I don't know how pertinent that is to what you mentioned. 

Mr. Tavenner. Well, if there is doubt about the pertinency, I 
think the pertinency will clearly appear from this question. 

According to the committee's information, Dorothy Healey, the 
chairman of tlie Communist Party for the Southern District of 
California, at the convention, made a report on nimierous questions 



COMMUNISM IN SOUTHERN CALIFORNIA AREA 115 

pursuant to her duties as a member of the National Committee of 
the Communist Party; and one of the subjects upon which she re- 
ported was the youth movement within the Communist Party. 

Now, as preliminary to the questions to you about the youth move- 
ment of the Communist Party, my first question was whether you 
were there and heard the report. 

(Witness confers with counsel.) 

Mr. IsHiHARA. Well, I take — in regards to your question, I re- 
fuse to aaiswer on the fifth amendment. 

Mr. Tavenner. By the fifth amendment are you referring to that 
part of the fifth amendment relating to self-incrimination ? 

Mr. IsHiHARA. Yes. 

Mr. Tavenner. When you received your discharge from the Armed 
Forces of the United States, did you immediately come to the area 
of Los Angeles? 

Mr. IsHiHARA. Well, I was discharged in Fort Douglas, Utah. 

Mr. Tavenner. Then did you come to Los Angeles at that time? 

Mr. IsHiHARA. I believe I came within a period of a month. I am 
not sure now because my family was still living in Salt Lake City 
and my brother was here at the time, so I know within a period of 
a month I was here in Los Angeles. 

Mr. Tavenner. Did you become affiliated or reaffiliated with the 
Communist Party after returning to Los Angeles from your service 
in the Armed Forces? 

Mr. IsHiHARA. I refuse to answer that on the fifth amendment. 

Mr. Tavenner. Did you, at the suggestion of any Communist Party 
unit or Communist Party functionary, engage in Communist Party 
activities in mass organizations or other groups outside the Com- 
munist Party? 

Mr. IsHiHARA. I have to refuse that under the fifth amendment, 
also. 

The Chairman. You do not have to. You say "I have to." 

Mr. IsHiHARA. I am sorry. 

The Chairman. Say "I do." 

Mr. IsHiHARA. I am sony. 

Mr. Tavenner. I offer in evidence a photostatic copy of the Inde- 
pendent Progressive Party of California petition to participate in 
the primary election of June 1, 1948^ signed by a number of persons, 
at the end of which there is an affidavit regarding the circulation 
of the petition over the name of Sakae Ishihara, and ask that it be 
marked "Ishihara Exhibit No. 1." 

The Chairman. It will be marked and made a part of the record. 

(Document marked "Ishihara Exhibit No. 1," and retained in 
committee files.) 

Mr. Tavenner. Will you examine the affidavit at the end of the 
petition and state whether or not it was signed by you ? 

(Witness confers with counsel.) 

Mr. Tavenner. It is at the bottom of the page. 

Mr. Ishihara. Yes, I see it. I refuse to answer under the fifth 
amendment. 

Mr. Tavenner. Did you work with the Independent Progressive 
Party in carrying out Communist Party directives in the year 1948 
or at any time since that date? 

Mr. Ishihara. I refuse to answer imder the fifth amendment. 



116 COMMUNISM IN SOUTHERN CALIFORNIA AREA 

Mr. Tavenner. I offer in evidence a thermof ax copy of an excerpt 
from the May 7, 1948, issue of the People's World, which contains 
an article entitled "Southland Nisei Set Up Committee for Wallace," 
and ask that it be marked "Ishihara Exhibit No. 2." 

The Chairman. It may be admitted and made a part of the record. 

(Document marked "Ishihara Exhibit No. 2," and retained in 
committee files.) 

Mr. Tavenner. This article refers to "a steering committee of five, 
headed by Sakaye Ishihara." 

Will you examine it, please, and state whether it accurately de- 
scribes you as a member of that committee ? 

Mr. Ishihara. I refuse to answer under the fifth amendment. 

Mr. Tavenner. Were you commissioned to organize within the 
Nisei group an organization known as the Nisei Progressives? I 
mean to say were you commissioned by the Communist Party to work 
in the organization of such a group ? 

Mr. Ishihara. I refuse to answer under the fifth amendment. 

Mr. Tavenner. Mr. Chairman, I offer in evidence a thermofax 
copy of an excerpt from the January 26, 1949, issue of the People's 
World. 

The Chairman. Is that a Communist organization ? 

Mr. Tavenner. I believe what I will say will throw a little more 
light on it. 

The article entitled, "Nisei Group's Founding Rally On Tonight" 
has this to say : 

Purpose of the conference, as outlined by Chairman Sakae Ishihara, is to 
found a new Nisei political action organization. 

I would like to ask you, Witness, whether or not that organization 
was designed to succeed the Committee for Wallace organization in 
which you played an important part? 

(Witness confers with his counsel.) 

Mr. Ishihara. I refuse to answer under the fifth amendment. 

Mr. Tavenner. I desire to offer the document in evidence and ask 
that it be marked "Ishihara Exhibit No. 3." 

The Chairman. It will be made a part of the record. 

(Document marked "Ishihara Exhibit No. 3," and retained in com- 
mittee files.) 

Mr. Tavenner. In addition to the activities that I have mentioned, 
were you active in the Labor Youth League at the instance of the 
Communist Party ? 

Mr. Ishihara. I refuse to answer under the fifth amendment. 

Mr. Tavenner. Were you aware of the plans of the Communist 
Party in this area regarding the promotion of Communist activities 
among youth ? 

Mr. Ishihara. I refuse to answer under the fifth amendment. 

Mr. Tavenner. Have you been a sponsor of, or participant in, the 
work of the Los Angeles Committee for Protection of Foreign Born ? 

Mr. Ishihara. I refuse to answer under the fifth amendment. 

Mr. Tavenner. I desire to offer in evidence a thermofax excerpt 
from the February 2, 1954, issue of the People's World entitled, 
"Foreign Born Committee Sets Parley Feb. 28," and ask that it 
be marked "Ishihara Exhibit No. 4." 



COMMUNISM IN SOUTHERN CALIFORNIA AREA 117 

The Chairman. We will make it part of the record. 

(Document marked "Ishihara Exhibit No. 4," and retained in com- 
mittee files.) 

Mr. Tavenner. Did you attend the conference of February 28, 
1954? 

Mr. Ishihara. I refuse to answer under the fifth amendment. 

Mr. Tavenner. Exhibit 447, on page 7870 of Communist Political 
Subversion issued by the Committee on Un-American Activities,^ lists 
you as a sponsor of a conference to defend the rights of foreign-born 
Americans held by the Los Angeles Conmiittee for Protection of For- 
eign Born on February 7, 1953. Did you permit your name to be used 
as a sponsor of that meeting ? 

Mr. Ishihara. I refuse to answer under the fifth amendment. 

Mr. Tavenner. Exhibit 464, on page 7798 of Communist Political 
Subversion consists of a letterliead of the Los Angeles Committee for 
Protection of Foreign Born. It is dated February 2, 1954. You are 
carried on the letterhead as a sponsor. 

Did you permit your name to be used as a sponsor ? 

Mr. Ishihara. I refuse to answer 

Mr. Tavenner. And you were a sponsor ? 

Mr. Ishihara. I refuse to answer under the fifth amendment. 

Mr. Tavenner. Again at page 7901 of the same document, exhibit 
467 carries a letterhead of May 17, 1956, showing you as a sponsor 
of the Sixth Annual Conference to Repeal the Walter McCarran Law 
and to Defend Its Victims. Were you such a sponsor ? 

Mr. Ishihara. I refuse to answer that on the same gi'ounds. 

Mr. Tavenner. Exhibit 474A, at page 7906 of the same publication, 
is a letterhead of the Sixth Annual Conference to Repeal the Walter 
McCarran Law and to Defend Its Victims. It is dated March 8, 1956. 
You are carried on this letterhead as a sponsor. Were you such a 
sponsor ? 

Mr. Ishihara. I refuse to answer on the same grounds. 

Mr. Tavenner. Exhibit 502A of the same document is a letterhead 
of the Los Angeles Committee for Protection of Foreign Born. It is 
dated February 24, 1956, and you are listed as a sponsor. Were you 
such a sponsor ? 

Mr. Ishihara. I refuse to answer under the fifth amendment. 

Mr. Tavenner. Are you a member of the Communist Party at this 
time? 

Mr. Ishihara. I refuse to answer under the fifth amendment. 

Mr. Tavenner. Did you attend a meeting of the District Council of 
the Communist Party for the Southern District of California and 
other functionaries held on the 27th of July 1958 ? 

Mr. Ishihara. I refuse to answer under the fifth amendment. 

Mr. Tavenner. It is our information that you did not attend such 
a meeting, but did you receive information relating to any of the 
views expressed in the reports made at that meeting regarding the 
Soviet Union and Hungary, the Soviet Union and the Arabic situa- 
tion, and the views regarding minority groups in this country ? 

Mr. Ishihara. I refuse to answer under the fifth amendment. 



^ See appendix to hearings of Committee on Un-American Activities on Communist 
Political Subversion, 1956, 84th Cong., 2d sess. 



118 COMMUNISM IN SOUTHERN CALIFORNIA AREA 

Mr. Tavenner. Are you a supporter of Dorothy Healey in her con- 
test within the organization for this district ? 

Mr. IsHiHARA. I refuse to answer under the fifth amendment. 

Mr. Tavenner. You will not say which side you are on ? 

Mr. Ishihara. Not here. 

Mr. Tavenner. All right. That's good enough. 

Mr. Ishihara. I do not know what you are talking about. 

Mr. Tavenner. I assume, then, you expect to be present in October 
when the question is decided ? 

Mr. Ishihara. You seem to know more about it than I do. 

Mr. Tavenner. Well, I know a great deal about it. I have no 
further questions. 

Mr. WiRiN. May the witness be excused ? 

The Chairman. I never expected to see Americans of Japanese 
ancestry testify before this committee. You enjoy a distinction. 

Is there anything further, Mr. Tavenner ? 

Mr. Tavenner. No, sir. 

The Chairman. The witness is excused. 

Will you raise your right hand, please ? 

Do you swear the testimony you are about to give will be the truth, 
the whole truth, and nothing but the truth, so help you God ? 

Mr. Burton. I do. 

The Chairman. Sit down. 

TESTIMONY OF BERNARD BURTON, ACCOMPANIED BY COUNSEL, 

AL WIRIN 

Mr. Tavenner. What is your name, please ? 

Mr. Burton. Sir, my name is Bernard Burton, B-u-r-t-o-n. 

Mr. Tavenner. It is noted for the record that the witness is accom- 
panied by Mr. Al Wirin, member of the California Bar, having his 
offices in the city of Los Angeles. 

Wliere do you live, Mr. Burton ? 

Mr, Burton. 1811 Baxter Street, Los Angeles. 

Mr. Tavenner. Will you please state the place and time of your 
birth? ^ 

Mr. Burton. June 10, 1915, Brooklyn, N.Y. 

Mr. Tavenner. Wliat is your occupation ? 

Mr. Burton. Well, as a result of the work of this committee, I am 
presently unemployed and have been so for the last month. 

Mr. Tavenner. Wliat is your occupation ? 

Mr. Burton. I am a proofreader and a journalist. 

Mr. Tavenner. Will you give the committee, please, a brief state- 
ment of your formal educational training? 

Mr. Burton. I had 2 years of college at the College of the City of 
New York, CCNY. 

Mr. Tavenner. When were you there ? 

Mr. Burton. 1931 to 1934. Maybe it is 1932 to 1935. I can't be 
sure at this moment. 

Mr. Tavenner. When did you first come to California to make it 
the place of your business or your residence ? 

Mr. Burton. September of 1955. 

Mr. Tavenner. Where did you live prior to that ? 



COMMUNISM IN SOUTHERN CALIFORNIA AREA 119 

Mr. Burton. In New York City. 

Mr. Tavenner. What was your occupation there ? 

Mr. Burton. I was an editor. 

Mr. Tavenner. Editor of what paper ? 

Mr. Burton. Of the New York Daily Worker. 

Mr. TA^^NNER. How long were you an editor of the Daily Worker? 

Mr. Burton. Well, I was with the Daily Worker a total of — let me 
see now — it is a total of almost 9 years, and I think for the last 4 or 5 
years, I was an editor. 

Mr. Tavenner. That would take you back to about 1946 when 
you first went with the Daily Worker ? 

Mr. Burton. That is correct. 

Mr. Tavenner. Prior to that what was the nature of your occu- 
pation ? 

Mr. Burton. I was still a journalist. I worked on the Baltimore 
Sun. 

Mr. Tavenner. How long were you employed there? 

Mr. Burton. Only a few months. I left the Baltimore Sun to take 
a trip. That was shortly after my discharge. I only had a tempo- 
rary job on the Baltimore Sun, waiting for a veteran to return. 1 
took a trip over to California and then when I retuiTied back East, 
I was offered 'a job on the Daily Worker. 

Mr. Tavenner. Prior to your employment with the Baltimore Sun, 
what was your occupation ? 

Mr. Burton. I was still a journalist. I was in the service at the 
time on the Stars and Stripes. 

Mr. Tavenner. Over what period of time were you in the armed 
services ? 

Mr. Burton. I was in the armed services from March 1943 to De- 
cember of 1945. 

( Counsel confers with witness. ) 

Mr. Tavenner. What were you prior to your entry into the service ? 

Mr. Burton. First in the service I did not spend my complete time 
on the Stars and Stripes. I had 275 days of front line action, which 
the War Department records will show as a combat infantryman. 
Prior to my service I was in upstate New York. 

Mr. Tavenner. Elmira, N. Y. ? 

Mr. Burton. Part of it was in Elmira, N. Y. 

Mr. Tavenner. Were your headquarters in Elmira, N. Y. ? 

Mr. Burton. I didn't have any headquarters. I lived in Elmira, 
N.Y. 

Mr. Tavenner. Were you the Communist Party organizer of that 
area ? 

Mr. Burton. Yes; I was the Communist Party organizer of that 
area. 

Mr. Tavenner. Over what period of time ? 

Mr. Burton. From 1939 until my entry into the service. I don't 
know what part of 1939. My recollection is it was the latter part of 
1939. 

Mr. Tavenner. Were any of the organizers of UE members of the 
Communist Party over the area in which you had control ? 

Mr. Burton. Well, I must respectfully decline to answer that ques- 
tion on the grounds that (1) as a matter of morality and conscience I 



120 COMMUNISM m SOUTHERN CALIFORNIA AREA 

cannot be an informer. No. 2, I don't believe that names are perti- 
nent to any legislative question. And No. 3, on the grounds of the 
first and fifth amendment to the Constitution. 

Mr. Tavenner. By the fifth amendment, are you including that 
part of the fifth amendment relating to self-incrimination ? 

Mr. BuKTON". Yes ; I include that, too. 

Mr, Tavenner. Having admitted that he was the Communist Party 
organizer at Elmira, N.Y., it certainly is apparent, Mr. Chairman, 
that any right that he may have had to refuse to answer the question 
on the grounds of self-incrimination is now waived ; and, therefore, I 
request that the witness be directed to answer the question. 

Mr. WiRiN. May I state for the record, just briefly, that I have ad- 
vised the witness that under the present law he does not waive his 
right to privilege merely by having answered the question as to his 
occupation and as to participation in activities of the Communist Party 
with respect to names. 

The Chairman. Let us ask another question, Mr. Tavenner. 

Mr. Burton. May I merely interject here ? 

The Chairman. There is no question pending. 

Mr. Burton. I am sorry, Mr. Chairman. 

Mr. Tavenner. Did you attend the National Training School set 
up by the National Committee of the Communist Party for the train- 
ing of theoreticians and propagandists in Camp Beacon on the 
Hudson in the spring of 1946 ? 

(Witness confers with counsel.) 

Mr. Burton. Yes, I attended that. 

Mr. Tavenner. Was that school run and operated by the Commu- 
nist Party as indicated in my question? 

Mr. Burton. I believe it was, yes. 

Mr. Tavenner. You know it was, do you not ? 

Mr. Burton. Let us see, on concrete information, all I can say is 
I believe it was. I cannot produce any documentary proof to show 
that it was. 

Mr. Tavenner. When did you first become a member of the Com- 
munist Party ? 

Mr. Burton. 1935. 

Mr. Tavenner. Where ? 

Mr. Burton. In Brooklyin, N.Y. No, no, Newburgh, N.Y. 

Mr. Tavenner. Newburgh? 

Mr. Burton. Yes. 

Mr. Tavenner. What was the first Communist Party unit to which 
you were assigned ? 

Mr. Burton. As far as I know there was one Communist Party club 
in Newburgh, N. Y., and I joined it. 

Mr. Tavenner. Wliat were the circumstances under which you 
became a member ? 

Mr. Burton. I was moved by the depression that then existed in 
the land. It seemed to me that the Communist Party, at the time, 
was filling a vacuum in attempting to do something for the unemploy- 
ment in presenting some kind of a positive program. It was a basic 
reason for my joining the party. 

Mr. Tavenner. What official positions have you held in the Com- 
munist Party ? 



COMMUNISM IN SOUTHERN CALIFORNIA AREA 121 

Mr. Burton. Well, I don't know what you mean by official posi- 
tions — members of committees ? 

Mr. Tavenner. Let us take first members of units or groups or 
commissions of the Communist Party. 

Mr. Burton. Well, I might have held various club offices. As a 
matter of fact, I don't even remember holding a club office. I have 
been what you call a Communist Party section organizer, as I testified 
before. 

Mr. Tavenner. Yes. Over w^hat period of time were you a Commu- 
nist Party organizer ? 

Mr. Burton. From 19 — wait — 1935 to 1937 first. Latter part of 
1935 to 1937, and then from 1939 to 1943, as I previously testified. 

Mr. Tavenner. For the period 1935 to 1937, where were you 
located ? 

Mr. Burton. In Newburgh, N. Y. 

Mr. Tavenner. And then the latter period you were a Communist 
organizer at what place ? 

Mr. Burton. The Elmira-Binghamton area, commonly referred 
to as the southern tier of New York State. 

Mr. Tavenner. Did I understand that it was from 1939 to 1943? 

Mr. Burton. Yes. 

Mr. Tavenner. What was your affiliation with the Communist 
Party in the period between the times that you occupied those posi- 
tions which you have described ? 

Mr. Burton. I was a member of the Communist Party. 

Mr. Tavenner. Wliere were you ? 

Mr. Burton. Up and down in the Hudson Valley. 

Mr. Tavenner. Engaged in what work ? 

Mr. Burton. I was an organizer for the CIO Textile Workers Or- 
ganizing Committee. 

Mr. Tavenner. Were you at any time connected with the UE as an 
organizer ? 

Mr. Burton. No, I was never connected with the UE. 

Mr. Moulder. Do I understand that you are an organizer, solicit- 
ing Communist Party membership within the CIO ? 

Mr. Burton. No, I was a trade union organizer, soliciting workers 
into membership in a trade union. 

Mr. Moulder. In a trade union ? 

Mr. Burton. Yes, sir. 

Mr. Moulder. Counsel made reference to your being an organizer 
of the Communist Party, as I understand the question. 

Mr. Burton. I understood it to be what was I doing between 1937 
and 1939. 

The Chairman. That is right. 

Mr. Tavenner. That is correct, between the two periods when he 
said he had been a Communist Party organizer. 

Mr. Burton. Yes, that is the way I understood it. 

Mr. WiRiN. He admitted he was a Communist Party organizer on 
dates other than when he was working for the Textile Workers Union. 

Mr. Moulder. Then you were not a Communist Party organizer at 
that time? 

Mr. Burton. Not at that time. 

Mr. Tavenner. You were a member of the Communist Party dur- 
ing the time you were an organizer for the textile union ? 



122 COMMUNISM IN SOUTHERN CALIFORNIA AREA 

Mr. Burton. Yes. 

Mr. Tavenner. Did you hold a position in the Communist Party 
during that period of time ? 

Mr. Burton. I don't recall holding any position. 

Mr. Tavenner. Were you on any commission or committee of the 
Communist Party during that period ? 

Mr. Burton. No, I don't believe I was. At least I can't remember 
being. At a later period I was on a committee but that was pro 
forma. 

Mr. Moulder. Was your employment as an organizer of the CIO 
the result of your being an active Communist Party member? 

Mr. Burton. No, I became an organizer of the CIO as a result of 
the participating in the CIO volunteering drive. 

Mr. Moulder. You do not then feel that the Communist Party 
members had any influence in securing your position in the CIO as an 
organizer ? 

INIr. Burton. None that I was aware of, because textile was one 
union in which the Communists had very little influence. 

The Chairman. "Who was the head of that union at that time? 

Mr. Burton. At that time the late Sidney Hillman. 

Mr. Tavenner. Will you give us the names of any other organizers 
of the textile union of the CIO while you were an organizer for that 
organization who were known by you to be members of the Com- 
munist Party ? 

Mr. Burton. I must respectfully decline on previously stated 
grounds. 

Mr. Tavenner. May I ask that the witness be directed to answer? 

The Chairman. You are directed to answer that question, 

Mr. Burton. I beg your pardon. I must respectfully decline on 
the same grounds. 

The Chairman. You say "must." By that you mean "I do"? 

Mr. Burton. I am using "must" in the sense of conscience and 
volition. 

Mr. Tavenner. Then I believe you entered the armed services in 
1943? 

Mr. Burton. Yes. 

Mr. Tavenner. And you returned and were discharged when ? 

Mr. Burton. December 1945. 

Mr. TA^^NNER. An honorable discharge, I presume ? 

Mr. Burton. Yes, indeed. 

Mr. Ta\'-enner. When you retumed in 1945, did you again resume 
\our activities with the Communist Party? 

Mr. Burton. Yes, I rejoined the Communist Party. 

Mr. Tavenner. Wliere and when ? 

Mr. Burton. In Baltimore. 

Mr. Tavenner. Wlio was the head of the Communist Party in 
Baltimore at that time ? 

Mr. Burton. I again respectfully decline to answer on the same 
grounds. 

Mr. Tavenner. Was it Earl Reno ? 

Mr. Burton. Same answer. 

Mr. Moulder. May I ask, were you solicited to join at that time or 
did you voluntarily seek out the headquarters of the Communist Party 
to become a member ? 



COMMUNISM IN SOUTHERN CALIFORNIA AREA 123 

Mr. Burton. I can't really recall. The ground would have been — 
the substance would not have made much difference. I mean I was 
willing to go back whether I had been solicited, whether somebody 
came to see me, or whether I went myself. I don't recall, 

Mr. Tavenner. Were you still on military leave at the time that you 
became a member ? 

Mr. Burton. No, sir. 

Mr. Taa^nner. Did you hold any oiRcial position in the Com- 
munist Party at Baltimore ? 

Mr. Burton. No, I did not. 

Mr. Ta\^nner. Or in District No. 3, which comprised the District 
of Columbia and the State of Maryland ? 

Mr. Burton. I didn't know that was the district number. No, I 
didn't know. 

Mr. Tavenner. Were you acquainted with Mary Markward, the 
treasurer of the Communist Party of that district ? 

Mr. Burton. I do decline on the same grounds. 

Mr. Tavenner. Was the Communist Party of Baltimore at that 
time engaged in centralizing its work in the steel industry in Balti- 
more? 

Mr. Burton. I don't know what that means. I don't know what 
you mean by "centralizing." 

Mr. Tavenner. I mean by that, that it concentrated its effort within 
the steel unions in Baltimore. 

Mr. Burton. I don't really know. 

Mr. Tavenner. Wliat type of a cell of the Communist Party was it 
to which you were assigned ? 

(Witness confers with counsel.) 

Mr. Burton. Excuse me for a moment. First, I was assigned to a 
neighborhood club. 

Mr. Ta\'enner. What was the name of the club ? 

Mr. Burton. I don't even recall that. I don't even know if it had 
any. 

Mr. Ta\^nner. In what area of Baltimore was it located ? 

Mr. Burton. I think that was known as the Highland area. 

Mr. Tavenner. Very well. Wliat was the next group ? 

Mr. Burton. I think it was the Steel Club of the Communist Party. 

Mr. Tavenner. Then, apparently, you know something about the 
concentration of effort in the steel industry ? 

Mr. Burton. No, I would not know. 

Mr. Tavenner. If you were in the Steel Club of the Communist 
Party ? 

Mr. Burton. I was in the Steel Club of the Communist Party be- 
cause for a short while I was working in a steel mill. 

Mr. Tavenner. What mill ? 

Mr. Burton. Bethlehem. 

Mr. Tavenner. How many composed your Communist Party unit 
in Bethlehem Steel ? 

Mr. Burton. I don't recall that. I just don't know how many there 
were at this late stage. 

Mr. Tavenner. Can you give us approximately the number? 

Mr, Burton. No, I wouldn't be able to, the reason being that I 
worked in Bethlehem Steel about 3 weeks, and as far as I can recall, 

38253— 59— pt. 1 8 



124 COMMUNISM IN SOUTHERN CALIFORNIA AREA 

I never went to a meeting of the Steel Club. I was asked to be in the 
Steel Club but I never got to one. I left for New York. 

Mr. Tavenner. You went to New York. In what business did you 
engage there and when ? 

Mr. BuKTON. I went to New York as a reporter for the Daily 
Worker. 

Mr. Tavenner. Wliat was that date ? 

Mr. Burton. July of 1946. 

Mr. Tavenner. I assume you were a close friend of John Gates. 

Mr. Burton. I decline to answer that on the same grounds just to 
be consistent. 

Mr. Tavenner. And you left the Daily Worker when ? 

Mr. Burton. August of 1955. 

Mr. Tavenner, And came to California ? 

Mr. Burton. Yes. 

Mr. Tavenner. Were you a member of the Communist Party when 
you left the Daily Worker ? 

Mr. Burton. Yes. 

Mr. Tavenner. What was your reason for leaving the Daily 
Worker? 

Mr. Burton. Well, there was an opening for a reporter on the Daily 
People's World here, and I sort of had a hankering to come out to 
California, and I sought to fill that opening. 

Mr. Tavenner. And how long were you engaged in work at the 
Daily People's World? 

Mr. Burton. From September of 1955 to exactly June 10 of 1957, 
when I resigned from the People's World. 

Mr. Tavenner. Now, were you transferred from the Daily Worker 
to the People's World ? Did you know that you were going to receive 
the position before you left ? 

Mr. Burton. Before I left, yes, I knew ; but it wasn't a transfer. It 
was two separate papers. 

Mr. Tavenner. Through whom were your arrangements made to 
be employed on the Daily People's World ? 

Mr. Burton. Well, I guess we get into the same grounds again, then. 

Mr. Ta\^nner. Was it Al Richmond ? 

Mr. Burton. I will have to decline to answer that on the same 
grounds. I do that most respectfully. 

Mr. Tavenner. You say you resigned from the Communist Party 
in June ? 

Mr. Burton. No, I resigned from the Daily People's World in June. 
I resigned from the Communist Party in April of 1957. 

Mr. Tavenner. April of 1957? 

Mr. Moulder. At that point, would you care to elaborate on that— 
why you resigned, why you disassociated yourself from the Commu- 
nist Party ? 

Mr. Burton. I would be most happy to. 

As the committee may be aware, if they followed the somewhat 
dreary Communist Party debates that followed the secret Khrushchev 
report of 1956, so-called secret report, there was great dissension 
within the Communist Party. I was considered one of those fightin<T 
existing concepts. I published articles to that extent. '^ 

Mr. Moulder. Existing concepts ? 



COMMUNISM IN SOUTHERN CALIFORNIA AREA 125 

Mr. Burton. Existing concepts, old concepts, under which the 
Communist Party had grown up, functioned. I raised many ques- 
tions. 

The final note came with the revolution in Hungary. I did not 
and do not accept the proposition that Hungary represented a Fascist 
counterrevolution. I held to the position then, and I still hold to it 
now, that Soviet intervention was not justified. I urged the Commu- 
nist Party to take a critical stand, I and many others. 

Mr. Moulder. Communist Party where ? 

Mr. Burton-. Of the United States. It was a preconvention period 
where a national convention was coming up. You are hoping to 
accomplish something that way. I had entertained hopes for a while 
that it might happen, especially because of a number of Daily Worker 
editorials from back East which were highly critical. 

And finally, when it came to the point following the national con- 
vention, where I became convinced this would not happen, I decided 
to leave the party. There were many others involved. I will bring 
in John Gates only to this point, saying that my views were consid- 
ered similar to those of John Gates. I, for example, wrote an arti- 
cle — I still have it here — of what was then known as the National 
Discussion Bulletin of the Communist Party. 

The Chairman. Is that what brought about someone calling you 
Tito. Didn't I read that somewhere ? 

Mr. Burton. I think they may have. They called me worse than 
that. 

This was a front-page article which called for the dissolution of 
the Communist Party, its establishment of a political action organi- 
zation, the concept being that it should stop its nonsense about being 
the vanguard of the American working class — when, as far as the 
American working class goes, it hardly knows it exists — and start 
learning something about America. 

I might add, again without mentioning names, that this became 
something of a cause celebre in party leaders who now control the 
party, who went throughout the land condemning this as a new 
form of liquidationism, Titoism, et cetera, et cetera. 

All of these things culminated, and I came to the conclusion that 
the Communist Party was finished in this country, and I left the 
Communist Party. 

That is it in brief. I can go into much more detail about theoreti- 
cal concepts, and so on. 

Mr. Tavenner. Proceed. 

Mr, Burton. Well, I held to the views, for example, which at that 
time Togliatti of the Italian Communist Party advanced and since 
seems to have withdrawn, that any kind of communism or Socialist 
movement any plac« in the world, can interest only on what he called 
a poly centric basis, meaning by that that there cannot be a Com- 
munist Party of any one country which is judged superior in wisdom 
or in any way to that of another Communist Party. This apparently 
was not well received by those who now control the party. 

Mr. Moulder. Do I understand that you agreed to that concept? 

Mr. Burton. I agreed with that proposition. This apparently was 
not well received by those wlio control the party. 

I might say, in more simple form, the final thing w\as that it became 
a sort of a mark of opprobrium. I was given the title of "West Coast 



126 COMMUNISM IN SOUTHERN CALIFORNIA AREA 

John Gates" which I had not earned, I do not think, but I was given 
that title, I think you gentlemen know the story of John Gates. 

I might say that our positions, without ever having been in con- 
tact with each other during this period, were quite similar on almost 
all points. Actually, I preceded John Gates out of the party. John 
Gates and that group from the Daily Worker, as I recall, left the 
party at the time the Daily Worker folded. I don't recall the dates. 
But I know I preceded him out. I don't know what else to tell here. 

May I add something here ? Maybe I am anticipating the question 
and the chairman can stop me if I am. 

As far as my views are concerned, I still consider myself a Socialist 
in outlook. I consider myself an independent Socialist. I hold to 
the view that there is not a single, existing organization in the United 
States today which holds to a Socialist viewpoint which is in any 
way capable of doing justice to that viewpoint or in any way capable 
of providing the germ or doing anything along the lines of socialism. 

I also want to add here, without being disrespectful, that in my 
opinion the Communist Party would be even more atomized than it 
is today, had it not been for the work of this committee. I say that 
in most respectful terms. 

The Chairman. It is an interesting thing. We are going to have 
a witness this week who will say just the opposite. He will say that 
the work of this committee prevented the Communist Party from ex- 
panding because it was not a popular thing to do — to be active in 
the Communist front. 

Mr. Burton. Let me say it this way : that there were great hazards 
in being a Communist. There still are. One risks economic conse- 
quences. One also risks certain other kinds of consequences, even 
legal consequences. 

I think what happened in the Communist Party in the last 2 years 
was a wide-open debate which would have gone much further, had 
not a feeling arisen that you have got to hold back because you will 
be giving names out and, when you give names out, then some com- 
mittee or other gets these names, and the next thing that happens 
these people lose their jobs. 

Now, I may have the most profound disagreement with many peo- 
ple in the Communist Party and I do, as a matter of fact, with al- 
most all of the people in the Communist Party. I do not put it on a 
personal basis; I put it purely on a political basis. Some I like as 
persons, some I dislike as persons, as everybody else ; but, at the same 
time, morally and in conscience, I cannot talk about them and their 
views because I feel these people might lose their jobs, as I have lost 
mine. This becomes a big question in inhibiting interdebate in the 
Communist Party, which I believe would be good not only for what 
might happen later, but good for the country as a whole. 

The Chairman. Do you think that perhaps Hungary would have 
stimulated such discussion that members would have torn each other 
apart? 

Mr. Burton. I think so. It came close to it. At least I almost 
felt the hot breath down my back. 

The Chairman. I had a very interesting discussion with Johnny 
Santo. 

Mr. Burton. Is he in this country now ? 



COMMUNISM IN SOUTHERN CALIFORNIA AREA 127 

The Chairman. No, I saw him in Geneva. 

Mr. Burton. One of the things that convinced me more than ever 
that what happened, in Hungary was not a Fascist counterrevolution, 
was when I saw Johnny Santo's name in the New York Times. There 
were other things since then that convinced me. I do not think 
there can be indirect aggression by the State Department, just 
as I don't believe there can be by the Soviet Union. One country 
may try to keep the coals on the fire but they don't start the fire. 
I did not believe the Soviet propoganda that America started this 
thing, just as I am sorry to say that I do not believe the State De- 
partment propaganda that the Soviet Union started the trouble in 
Lebanon. 

Mr. Moulder. Going back to your point with reference^ to this 
committee, do I understand you to say that it is your belief that 
those who are undecided, or were undecided, in connection with the 
Communist activities were influenced to stay morally affiliated with 
the Communist Party because of sympathy with certain people or 
because of prejudice against the committee? 

Mr. Burton. I think that was a factor — not the sole factor — ^but 
that was a factor, because despite what may be thought generally. 
Communist Party members are Americans and subject to certain 
American attitudes. You do not kick a man while he is down. In 
other words, if a man is in jail and subject to penalty, imprisonment, 
subject to being fired from his job, you are going to lay off him, and 
you do not feel like walking out on people when they are in need 
of help. 

Mr. Moulder. Going back to the point that you raised about losing 
employment, you say you lost your employment ? 

Mr. Burton. Yes. 

Mr. Moulder. How long ago? 

Mr. Burton. August 8. 

Mr. Moulder. What caused it? 

Mr. Burton. I had served as a proofreader at the Times for 13 
months. 

Mr. WiRiN. Los Angeles Times. 

Mr. Burton. Los Angeles Times. 

The Chairman. Wliy did you lose your job ? 

Mr. Burton. I am just explaining it. 

I came in to work one day and was informed by the superintendent 
of the composing room, the print shop, that there was a subpena 
waiting for me in the legal office of the Los Angeles Times on the 
fourth floor. I went up there, and there was a marshal. I believe 
it was the marshal. I didn't ask what he was. He had plain clothes 
on. And he handed me the subpena in front of one of the Times 
attorneys, a subpena of this committee asking me to appear, I think 
it was then dated for August 22. 

When I got the subpena I felt I wanted to go and talk to the Los 
Angeles Times administration myself. I didn't want it to come from 
the committee. 

I will preface it by saying that the Los Angeles Times did not know 
of my former connections with the Daily Worker or with the People's 
World. I also preface it by saying that my leaving it out had noth- 
ing to do with my competency or my ability as a craftsman. I had 



128 COMMUNISM IN SOUTHERN CALIFORNIA AREA 

sufficient abilities and I did not overstate my abilities as a craftsman 
because, as a matter of fact, only 2 weeks before receiving the subpena 
I received a raise. 
The Chairman. What type of work were you doing? 

Mr. Burton. Proofreading. I might also say that the reason for 
ray applying for proofreading was I did not want to take a job that, 
by any stretch of the imagination, could be construed sensitive. I 
spent most of my time as a proofreader seeing that there were no 
typographical errors in advertisements. 

' So I asked to see the management of the Los Angeles Times and 
I had a conference with the secretarv of the Times-Mirror Co. in 
which I told him my whole background — I left nothing out — the same 
as I am telling this committee. 

I told him my attitude, if I had to appear as a witness before the 
committee, would be that I am willing to testify about anything 
about myself but I cannot in conscience be an informer to provide 
names. They understood that but they felt that the Times was in a 
very difficult position, and I understood that, too; that the Times was. 

Then I recognized that they had a legal right on those grounds to 
discharge me for not stating, giving my full employment background 
and my record. 

Mr. Moulder. Did you conceal it? 

Mr. Burton. Well, rather than concealing it, I omitted it. Yes, I 
omitted the Daily Worker and the People's World in my record. I 
knew I would never be employed by the Times had I put it down. 
And I might say that when I left the People's World, I thought, well, 
I will try to say where I had worked. 

Mr. Tavenner. I am sorry to interrupt you. The direct question 
was asked you. Is that your explanation ? 

Mr. Burton. When you apply for employment at the personnel 
department, you are asked to list your previous employment. 

Mr. Tavenner. I see. 

Mr. Burton. Then I frankly resorted to subterfuges. For example, 
in the period of the Daily Worker, instead of saying the Daily Worker, 
I said the F and D Printing Co., which published the Daily Worker. 
The secretary of the company so stated that he understood. I needed 
a job. I had found that I could not obtain a job by telling the truth. 
I had tried that when I left the People's World. 

When I heard of an opening for a proofreader at the Los Angeles 
Times, I felt, well, this is my area which nobody can say I am possibly 
infiltrating the paper, hunting for typographical errors and seeing 
that they are not made. 

As a matter of fact, at that time I had heard of an opening on the 
copy desk of the Los Angeles Times for which I also was well qualified, 
on the editorial side, and I would not apply because I felt I just 
didn't want to get into anything that, by any stretch of the imagina- 
tion, could be construed as sensitive or creative or anything or the 
sort. I took this job as a proofreader. 

Well, the Los Angeles Times, the Times-Mirror Co., felt apparently 
that they would be put in a very difficult position. As a matter of 
fact, I was asked this question, and I say this because I don't feel any 
ill will toward the Los Angeles Times, I recognize that they had a 
right and I recognize things that the climate that then existed, they 
had a very difficult choice to make. 



COMMUNISM IN SOUTHERN CALIFORNIA AREA 129 

The Times— at least I got this impression from the discussion— the 
Times management felt that it would appear that I had not really 
resigned from the Communist Party. It would appear that I might 
not have really resigned from the People's World, because the interval 
of my leaving the People's World and obtaining a job on the Los 
Angeles Times was from June 10 to July 1. 

I was in the unfortunate position of not having to wear a crown of 
thorns at the time. I was able to obtain work. I might point out 
that none of my former colleagues on the Daily Worker — and I 
pointed this out to the Los Angeles Times — Gates and the rest of them 
mcluded — despite the fact that there had been editorial columns ap- 
pearing in the papers at the time, you remember, praising Gates and 
the othei*s, yet when these people left the paper, not one of them, not 
a smgle one of them has been able to obtain a job in the only craft 
and profession they know. 

So that was the situation. I think, again without being disrespect- 
ful, had it not been for the kind of climate that is often spread by 
investigations of this type, there is a chance that the management may 
have overlooked it, may have decided that we have the right to do it, 
but we don't exercise this right, nothing compels us to exercise this 
right. 

Mr. Tavenner. Can we have a few minutes ? 

Mr. Burton. I also wanted to state here 

Mr. Tavenner. Wait just a minute. 

The Chairman. We will take a recess. 

(Committee members present: Representatives Walter and 
Moulder.) 

Mr. Tavenner. You will have an opportunity to finish what you 
started to say. 

Mr. Burton. I do not consider it a weighty thought. 

(Short recess.) 

(Committee members present: Representatives Walter and 
Moulder.) 

The Chairman. All right, Mr. Tavenner. 

Mr. Burton. I wanted to state that I feel that it was a result of 
the subpena that I was discharged. 

Secondly, I again want to add that I feel that the committee, mean- 
ing no disrespect to any members of the committee, the committee in 
its method of functioning is not doing a service at this moment in tlie 
country. I think it is doing a disservice because, by its very nature, 
you are spreading a sort of atmosphere of fear, a sort of gray con- 
formity, of fear of expressing any independent thought, and, if you 
please, dangerous thoughts. 

Mr. Tavenner. Then I take it you disagree with Congress' determi- 
nation to keep informed as to the progress of Communist Party activi- 
ties and its objects in this country ? 

Mr. Burton. I might say as a Washington correspondent for two 
sessions of Congress, and again meaning no disrespect to the Con- 
gressmen, I think very few Congressmen are informed even despite 
the volumes of material that have been published by the committee. 

Mr. Tavenner. Yes, but you have not answered my question. 

Mr. Burton. Will you rephrase it ? 

Mr. Tavenner. Will you read the question ? 



130 COMMUNISM IN SOUTHERN CALIFORNIA AREA 

(Record read.) 

Mr. Burton. I think there are much more objective, much more 
rounded ways of keeping informed. For example, I have been quite 
impressed with the recent Ford Foundation study called "The Roots 
of American Communism." 

The Chairman. It is a great book. 

Mr. Burton. Which made me feel like the biggest fool that ever 
lived, having been a Commmiist for so many years and not having 
known about these things. But I was also impressed by the fact that 
this was scholarly, objective, and was not based upon what may be 
disgruntled statements of informers, of people who were defeated in 
some objective or some office or anything of the sort, but was fully 
documented, romided, and everything else. It is this kind of a study, 
to me, which is the basis of objective understanding. 

The Chairman. But who reads that ? I will bet they do not sell a 
thousand copies over the United States, and it is one of the best works 
I have ever seen. There is another volume coming out, you know. 

Mr. Burton. Yes, I am looking forward to it. 

The Chairman. Who is going to read it ? Wlio is gomg to pay $9 
for the two volumes ? 

Mr. Burton. Let me put it this way. Congressman : You, yourself, 
were complaining before that very few people read the reports of the 
House Committee on Un-American Activities. 

The Chairman. You can find this volmne on my desk. I read it 
and laid it there with the hope that some day someone will notice it. 
It is a trap. I have it there for the benefit of a lot of people, 
including the employees of the coimnittee. This is the old booby 
trap. No one looks at it. It has been there for a month, 

Mr. Burton. Maybe they should have left the name "Communism" 
out of the title. 

The Chairman. That is the point. You just do not bring the story 
home to the people. 

Mr. Burton. Well, if I may say 

The Chairivian. Take Johnny Santo, for example : The immigrant, 
the labor organizer, the Conununist, the Communist Party organizer, 
deported. The official of the Hungarian Government. And then all 
of a sudden a revolutionist. A terrific story. You would have a 
terrible time selling that to the Saturday Evening Post for $500. 

Mr. Burton. I have been trying to freelance some stuff to the Sat- 
urday Evening Post and have been collecting a lot of rejects. 

The Chairman. I mean it. It is a difficult thing to make people 
come to an appreciation of what is the right tiling to do. That is what 
we want to know — what is the right thing to do. 

Mr. Burton. In my opinion, from long experience within the Com- 
munist movement, which may not be the typical experience, because 
most of it was as a newspaperman — in my opinion, people whom you 
may want to influence — I don't only mean Communists; I include 
Communists — but I mean people with liberal outlooks, if you please, 
radical outlooks, need radical outlook; I think the country needs a 
native radicalism. Begin with the proposition that anything issued 
by a congressional committee is suspect. It has happened down 
through the history of the radical movement in this country. I think 
the Ford Foundation bears this out, because there were definite reports 



COMMUNISM IN SOUTHERN CALIFORNIA AREA 131 

on these very same questions. But there are in this country a whole 
number of people like me who would welcome, and look for, a resur- 
gence of a native type of radicalism. 

Mr. Moulder. What kind ? 

Mr. Burton. Native radicalism like Eugene Debs. 

The Chairman. Would you stand up on the housetops and say that 
finyone who is a Communist today, or has been a Communist since 
Hungary, is a sucker? Would you say that publicly? You would 
not. 

Mr. Burton. Let me say this : What has influenced Communists to 
leave the party, as far as reading material goes, more than anything 
else are certain Marxist non-Communist publications rather than pub- 
lications of this committee. I include such things as the American 
Socialist, a monthly publication; the National Guardian, a weekly 
publication; certain stuff from abroad published in England called 
the New Reasoner, the University and Left Review, a very scholarly 
kind of thing. 

The Chairman. Who reads that scholarly material ? 

Mr. Burton. Communists do, at least those who study ; not all of 
them do. This is because this is taken in an atmosphere of free take- 
and-give debate, whereas one feels with a report from a congressional 
committee there is, rightly or wrongly, an element of compulsion. 

The Chairman. But why ? Now, Mr. Moulder was nominated. He 
has not a thing to worry about. I have been elected 13 times. Being 
here today just deprives me of the pleasure of sitting on the boardwalk 
of Atlantic City and helping to pick the winner of the beauty con- 
test. But here I sit. But we do not enjoy this. 

Mr. Burton. I am sure you do not. 

The Chairman. But a lot of people have an idea that we hold hear- 
ings just for the purpose of doing something. 

Mr. Burton. I have covered many hearings in Washington. I know 
the Congressmen do not enjoy it and often try to get out of it. 

The Chairman. Of course we try to get out of it. 

Mr. Burton. I think it goes back to an old American tradition, "I 
will think what I please, and nobody is going to tell me what I will 
think." Tliere is also an atmosphere that if any agency of the 
Government 

The Chairman. Do you think the same thing is true, for example, 
when the Monopoly Subcommittee of the Judiciary Committee holds 
a hearing on the question of whether or not organized sports should 
be subject to the antitrust laws? Do you think people listen to those 
witnesses and pay attention ? 

Mr. Burton. There, yes, because again of an old antimonopoly 
tradition in this country. 

The Chairman. Every congressional committee is holding hearings 
constantly, you know that as well as I do. 

Mr. Burton. Also, although I am not a lawyer, far from it, there 
one feels Congress has the power and the right to legislate. Many 
people, including me, feel that Congress has no right to legislate in 
fields of thought, press, conviction, and so on. 

The Chairman. It is not easy, is it ? 

Mr. Burton. It is a fine point, I grant you. But it goes back to an 
old, I think, grassroots tradition in this country, which I am all in 
favor of. 



132 COMMUNISM IN SOUTHERN CALIFORNIA AREA 

The Chairman. Mr. Tavenner, do you have any questions ? 

Mr. Tavenner. I would like to know whether the witness was a 
delegate to the Sixteenth National Convention of the Communist 
Party. 

Mr. Burton. No, I was not. I didn't stay in the show. My position 
was in print. I couldn't get elected. 

Mr. Tavenner. You have no first-hand knowledge of your own of 
the operation of that convention ? 

Mr. Burton. It would be hearsay, purely hearsay. 

Mr. Tavenner. We have heard, during the course of this hearing, 
a great deal about recent activities of the Communist Party in this 
area in its effort to reorganize and advance in various directions. The 
last meeting to which we have referred was that of the District Coun- 
cil for the Southern District of California of July 27, 1958. "Wlien 
did you say that you left the Communist Party ? 

Mr. Burton. April of 1957. 

Mr. Tavenner. And have you any knowledge of the workings of 
that meeting ? 

Mr. Burton. The first I heard it was an element of surprise that 
this committee knew anything about it. That is the first I heard of it. 
I have not been involved in any Communist Party activities. 

Mr. Tavenner. On December 14, 1957, which is still subsequent to 
the time that you left the Communist Party, there was a letter of 
grievances signed by 22 members of the party here in Los Angeles 
directed to the National Committee of the Communist Party. 

Were you in any way connected with that? 

Mr. Burton. No ; I was not. 

Mr. Tavenner. Now, going back earlier and to about the time of 
your leaving the Communist Party, the organizing convention of the 
new Southern California District of the Communist Party was held 
April 13 and 14, 1957. Did you attend it? 

Mr. Burton. May I consult with my attorney ? 

(Witness confers with counsel.) 

Mr. Burton. Yes ; I attended that. 

Mr. Tavenner. What was the difficulty presented to the member- 
ship of the council at that meeting? 

Mr. Burton. I don't quite — it doesn't connect in my mind. The 
difficulties of the council ? 

Mr. Tavenner. Yes; were there any difficulties that arose before 
the council at that time ? 

Mr. Burton. There wasn't a council in existence at that time. That 
was a convention you are referring to ? 

Mr. Tavenner. Yes ; it was a convention, not a council meeting. 

Mr. Burton. I can't recall any. I know I was nominated for office 
there and I declined. I had made up my mind I was leaving then. 

Mr. Tavenner. Wliat office? 

Mr. Burton. District council. 

Mr. Tavenner. Were you ever a member of the district council ? 

Mr. Burton. No ; I was not. I was never — I never held any party 
post in California. 

Mr. Tavenner. Did you hear the report made at that convention by 
Dorothy Healey ? 



COMMUNISM IN SOUTHERN CALIFORNIA AREA 133 

Mr. Burton. Well, we are getting into the realm of names again, 
and I would again respectfully decline on the grounds previously 
stated. 

Mr. Tavenner. There is nothing of a secret character about Doro- 
thy Healey's chairmanship of the Communist Party of this area, 
is there ? 

Mr. Burton. I prefer to sta^ consistent. I just don't want to testify 
to her activities or I will get into that realm. 

Mr. Tavenner. Well, did you hear a report made by anyone at that 
convention, outlining the objectives of the Communist Party for this 
district? 

Mr. Burton. Yes ; I did. 

Mr. Tavenner. Did you agree with the objectives of that report ? 

Mr. Burton. It is a little difficult for me to recall. I heard so many 
reports in those days. But my impression is that I did not. That is 
the reason I refused to accept nomination for office. That is the reason 
I, at that time, made up my mind I was going to leave. 

Mr. Tavenner. What was the basic area of your objection ? 

Mr. Burton. Well, I think there was one place in there — and it 
may be another report ; I may be a little hazy here — for example 

Mr. Tavenner. Would you like to look at the report ? 

(Document handed to the witness.) 

Mr. Burton. If you don't mind, because I heard so many reports 
that they all dissolve together in my mind. I can go through the 
subheadmgs and tell you. In the first place, I don't think this anti- 
monopoly coalition means anything. 

Mr. Tavenner. Enlarge on that. Why ? 

Mr. Burton. Well, I think nobody needs the Commimist Party to 
tell the American people they are antimonopoly. 

Mr. Tavenner. Actually speaking, from the Communist viewpoint, 
isn't that reference to antimonopoly just another way of opposition 
to the free enterprise system in this country ? 

Mr. Burton. No, I don't think so. 

Mr. Tavenner. In the way in which it was used in the Communist 
Party? 

Mr. Burton. I think it was an attempt to sort of bring up to date 
the popular front line of working with other groups toward a com- 
mon objective which, in itself, I don't think is wrong. But as a poli- 
tical perspective for any individual party, I thought it was just non- 
sense because, in my opinion — again meaning no disrespect for people 
who run for office — any political candidate who says, "I am for 
monopoly 100 percent" wouldn't stand a show. It doesn't mean any- 
thing to me to say that the Communist Party is against monopoly. 
I don't know any party who is for monopoly. I saw that as no basis 
for a political program. 

So there were a whole number of things which were really, in a 
sense, the basic line of the party. 

I am trying to skim through quickly, if it is of interest to the 
committee. 

Well, of course, the business on labor, the general slogans of the 
Communist Party here are nothing to object to ; they are general pro- 
labor slogans, and I am prolabor. An article in the National Discus- 
sion Bulletin, on the front page, of November 1956 became one of the 



134 COMMUNISM IN SOUTHERN CALIFORNIA AREA 

points under which my position was attacked ; namely, that the Com- 
munist Party has no right and no business acting as a group within 
anotlier organization ; namely, a trade union m this case. This whole 
thing was skirted. Nobody said they were going to do it. But there 
was my basic objection stated in print. I just didn't have to take the 
floor. Everybody knew where I stood on it. 

Then again I say there are immediate things that they put up 
there, legislative things. There is nothing that I object to. It is 
omissions that I object to. 

I certainly agree with their position on winning full citizenship for 
the Negro people in this country. 

No sense in going through it all. I find some things which point 
up some of my differences. Some of this stuff is good public rela- 
tions, and you have to be against motherhood to be against here. 

I might state that the position developed in this report in relation 
to the Communist Party of Russia, although adopted by the conven- 
tion, is one which is opposed by the present national leadership of 
the Communist Party. I did not disagi-ee with the position put forth 
here. I thought there were some mealy-mouthed phrases. I would 
have liked to have had a stronger statement but I thought it was prog- 
ress at the time in the context of the situation. 

Of coulee, this part here is one which I objected to very 
strenuously. 

An attempt to reach unity where this report speaks about no need 
to take a position on Hungary, actually I felt that if the Comrnunist 
Party did not take a position on Hungary, it is political suicide; 
and I still believe it. 

Mr. Tavenner. Dorothy Healey, at a later time, expressed very vig- 
orously her disapproval of the execution of Nagy and the whole Com- 
munist line against Hungary, but you were not present at that 
meeting ? 

Mr. Burton. No. I heard about it. Wliether it was in the press 
or on television that she stated it, I don't remember; but I heard it. 
This thing here, this report here, the question of Hungary was 
skirted. 

I might say that had the reporter, whoever it was, taken, in my 
opinion, a full position on Hungary the way the particular reporter 
felt, that convention would have been thrown into turmoil. It was 
an attempt to avoid a position that keeps them calm. 

Mr. Tavenner. That evasion at that time served the national or- 
ganization of the Communist Party in a very substantial way, didn't 
it? 

Mr. Burton. That was my feeling and that is why I left. 

Mr. Tavenner. There were a number of efforts made by the Soviet 
Union prior to, and immediately following the Sixteenth National 
Convention of the Communist Party, indicating a renewed effort to 
control the Communist Party in this country in much the same man- 
ner as Duclos in his letter in 1945. That is true, is it not ? 

Mr. Burton. I felt that way. I felt that way. I felt that the 
promise which was opened up by the wide debate and variance of 
opinion in the world Communist movement following the so-called 
secret Khrushchev report held great hope, but I soon began to feel 
that this was being withdrawn. 



COMMUNISM IN SOUTHERN gALIFORNIA AREA 135 

Mr. Tavenner. And the declaration of the 12 Communist coun- 
tries in 1957 was another action of the foreign Communist group 
which no doubt influenced you in your attitude? 

Mr. Burton. I agreed with the Yugoslavs even though I wasn't 
there. 

Mr. Tavenner. Yugoslavia was the only Communist coimtry which 
would not become a party to it ? 

Mr. Burton. Yes. 

Mr. Tavenner. And the 12-Party Declaration was warmly wel- 
comed by the national committee after that committee had been sub- 
jected to the full control of the Foster group ? 

Mr. Burton. I gather there were some shenanigans about that; al- 
though I was not there I gathered what happened. I don't believe 
I was in at the time. Maybe I was. I learned about it later any- 
way. I gather what happened is that a small group, the resident 
committee there, immediately warmly hailed it, to use an old leftwing 
cliche, and immediately there were protests from the nonresident 
members over various parts of the country. I don't know whether it 
was a majority protest, but there was considerable protest. I know 
there was some from California. So that's as I remember the situ- 
ation. 

Mr. Tavenner. Now you expressed very vividly your opposition to 
the Communist Party program within labor as being a Communist 
Party group within a labor union. 

I want to ask you if you take the same view with reference to the 
activities of the Communist Party with respect to the Negro question. 

Mr. Burton. As a matter of fact, in this article of November 
1956, 1 statei very explicitly that a political party to have any validity 
in the American scene must function in its own right. Communists 
who happen to be trade unionists, who happen to be any other kind 
of thing, they will function as trade unionists — just as any other 
person may be a Democrat and function as a trade unionist, and 
there is no doubt his philosophy will lead him in certain directions; 
but it is wrong, it is futile, and it is resented by a member of any 
organization to have the feeling that another member has a dual 
loyalty. This has been my position all along. 

Mr. Tavenner. Not only in the field of labor but in other fields? 

Mr. Burton. Any field. 

Mr. Tavenner. In connection with the Jewish question as posed 
in that report, in connection with the Negro question as posed in that 
report, do you not agree ? 

Mr. Burton. Yes. Let me put it this way: If I were — I am a 
member of a Jewish center organization. I would like to see us reach 
the day that, supposing I were a Communist, a Socialist, whatever 
it is, I can be a Communist in philosophy, the director of the center 
may be a democrat in philosophy, but our first loyalty when we are 
in the center or in an organization is that center and that organiza- 
tion. When we go to a Communist Party meeting or a Democratic 
Party meeting, that is another question that has nothing to do with 
the center. 

Mr. Tavenner. But you do not believe in the Communist Party 
sending you, for instance, as a member in that organization to in- 
fluence on behalf of the Communist Party even in cases against the 
interest of that organization ? 



136 COMMUNISM IN SOUTHERN CALIFORNIA AREA 

Mr. Burton. Of course, I have never known it to influence it in the 
case against the interests but I don't believe any organization should 
do that, Communist Party or anybody else. I don't believe in any 
group that is not native to that organization organizing itself as a 
group. 

Mr. Tavenner. But that has been the great basic plan of the Com- 
munist Party in order to capture membership. 

Mr. Burton. It is one which I disagree with and stated publicly. 

Mr. Tavenner. Yes, but it is one ? 

Mr. Burton. Yes. 

Mr. Tavenner. One of the great basic principles upon which the 
Communist Party operates ? 

Mr. Burton. Yes, and I think it is a futile one. I think the period 
has demonstrated that. 

Mr. Tavenner. Let me ask you this — it is now getting late. I 
think it would be to the advantage of the committee, and to you, if we 
are able to talk with you on these general problems a little at leisure, 
rather than continuing here at this time in this hearing. 

Would you be willing to meet the investigator of the committee 
at some time and place that is convenient to you and discuss these 
problems which we have been discussing in a more thorough manner? 

(Witness confers with counsel. ) 

Mr. Tavenner. With your counsel present, if he desires. 

Mr. Burton. I would very much like to consult my counsel at 
length about this. 

If I have the power, I would rather postpone my answer, if it is 
possible, because I have some questions and some problems that arise 
that I would rather discuss with my counsel, if I may. 

Mr. WiRiN. We will give you an answer or give Mr. Wheeler an 
answer in short order. 

Mr. Tavenner. That is all right. 

The Chairman. All right. 

(Whereupon, at 5 :25 p.m., Wednesday, September 3, the com- 
mittee recessed, to reconvene at 9:30 a.m., Thursday, September 4, 
1958. 

X 



jiliiBL 

3 9999 05706 oioi 



This book should be returned to 
the Library on or before the last date 
stamped below. 

A fine is incurred by retaining it 
beyond the specified time. 
Please return promptly.