(navigation image)
Home American Libraries | Canadian Libraries | Universal Library | Community Texts | Project Gutenberg | Children's Library | Biodiversity Heritage Library | Additional Collections
Search: Advanced Search
Anonymous User (login or join us)
Upload
See other formats

Full text of "Special Senate investigation on charges and countercharges involving: Secretary of the Army Robert T. Stevens, John G. Adams, H. Struve Hensel and Senator Joe McCarthy, Roy M. Cohn, and Francis P. Carr. Hearings before the Special Subcommittee on Investigations of the Committee on Government Operations, United States Senate, Eighty-third Congress, second session, pursuant to S. Res. 189 .."

SPECIAL SENATE INVESTIGATION ON CHARGES 
AND COUNTERCHARGES INVOLVING: SECRE- 
TARY OF THE ARMY ROBERT T. STEVENS, JOHN 
G. ADAMS, H. STRUVE HENSEL AND SENATOR 

JOE McCarthy, roy m. cohn, and 

FRANCIS p. CARR 



^c .  ^^-i^ 



HEARING 

BEFORE THE 

SPECIAL SUBCOMMITTEE ON 
INVESTIGATIONS OF THE COMMITTEE ON 

GOVERNMENT OPERATIONS 

UNITED STATES SENATE 

EIGHTY-THIRD CONGRESS 

SECOND SESSION 
PURSUANT TO 



S. Res. 189 



PART 35 



MAY 17, 1954 



Printed for the use of the Committee on Government Operations 




UNITED STATES 
GOVERNMENT PRINTING OFFICE 
46620» WASHINGTON : 1954 



Boston Public I^ibrary 
Superintendent of Documents 

SEP 28 1954 



COMMITTEE ON GOVERNMENT OPERATIONS 

JOSEPH R. MCCARTHY, Wisconsin, Chairman 
KARL E. MUNDT, South Dakota JOHN L. McCLELLAN, Arkansas 

MARGARET CHASE SMITH, Maine HUBERT H. HUMPHREY, Minnesota 

HENRY C. DWORSHAK, Idaho HENRY M. JACKSON, Washington 

EVERETT McKINLEY DIRKSEN, IIlinolB JOHN F. KENNEDY, Massachusetts 
JOHN MARSHALL BUTLER, Maryland STUART SYMINGTON, Missouri 

CHARLES E. POTTER, Michigan ALTON A. LENNON, North Carolina 

Richard J. O'Melia, Qeneral Counsel 
Walter L. Reynolds, ChicJ Clerk 



Special Subcommittee on Investigations 

KARL E. MUNDT, South Dakota, Chairman 

HENRY C. DWORSHAK, Idaho JOHN L. McCLELLAN, Arkansas 

EVERETT MCKINLEY DIRKSEN, Illinois HENRY M. JACKSON, Washington 
CHARLES E. POTTER, Michigan STUART SYMINGTON, Missouri 

Ray H. Jenkins, Chief Counsel 

Thomas R. Prbwitt, Assistant Counsel 

Robert A. Collier, Assistant Counsel 

SoLis HoawiTz, Assistant Counsel 

II 



CONTENTS 



T J Page 

Index J 

III 



SPECIAL SENATE INVESTIGATION ON CHARGES AND 
COUNTEECHARGES INVOLVING: SECRETARY OF THE 
ARMY ROBERT T. STEVENS, JOHN G. ADAMS, H. STRUVE 
HENSEL AND SENATOR JOE McCARTHY, ROY M. COHN, 
AND FRANCIS P. CARR 



MONDAY, MAY 17, 1954 

United States Senate, 
Special Subcommtttee on Investigations of the 

CoMMiTi'EE on Government Operations, 

Washington^ D. G, 

AFTER RECESS 

(The hearing veas resumed at 3: 10 p. m., pursuant to recess.) 

Present : Senator Karl E. Mundt, Republican, South Dakota, chair- 
man; Senator Everett McKinley Dirksen, Republican, Illinois; 
Senator Charles E. Potter, Republican, Michigan ; Senator Henry C. 
Dworshak, Republican, Idaho; Senator John L. McClellan, Democrat, 
Arkansas; Senator Henry M. Jackson, Democrat, Washington; and 
Senator Stuart Symington, Democrat, INIissouri. 

Also present: Ray H, Jenkins, chief counsel to the subcommittee; 
Thomas R. Prewitt, assistant counsel ; and Ruth Y. Watt, chief clerk. 

Principal participants: Senator Joseph R. McCarthy, a United 
States Senator from the State of Wisconsin; Roy M. Cohn, chief 
counsel to the subcommittee; Francis P. Carr, executive director of 
the subcommittee; John G. Adams, counselor to the Army; Joseph N. 
Welch, special counsel for the Army; James D. St. Clair, special 
counsel for the Army; and Charles A. Haskins, assistant counselor, 
Department of the Army. 

Senator Mundt. The committee will please come to order. 

The Chair would like to begin by welcoming the guests who have 
come to our committee room, and to state that you are completely 
welcome insofar as our quarters can accommodate your presence, and 
to point out that the committee has heretofore passed an order which 
the Chair has been asked to enforce, to the effect that there must be 
no manifestations audibly of approval or disapproval at any time 
or in any way from members of the audience, and that the uniformed 
officers and the plainclothes men in the room have a prevailing order 
from the Chair to politely escort from the room immediately any- 
one who violates the conditions under which he entered the hearing 
room, which were, of course, to comply with the committee order to 
refrain completely from audible manifestations of approval or 
disapproval. 

We have had iho. executive session which was announced by the 
Chair pursuant to the resolution to adjourn early this afternoon 

1277 



1278 SPECIAL INVESTIGATION 

in order to give us time to have an executive session to discuss the prob- 
lems growing out of the executive order dated May 17, which precluded 
Mr. Adams from answering certain questions that certain members 
of the committee would like to interrogate him about. Since this 
afternoon's session is undoubtedly going to be devoted, at least in part, 
to the making of motions and to a ventilation of the various opinions 
which committee members and perhaps counsel, because we are meet- 
ing on a common level, have about these motions, the Chair would 
like respectfully to suggest the adoption of a 5-minute rule bj^ unan- 
imous consent whereby, for one speaking period at least, no one 
among us talk longer than 5 minutes on one point. I recognize that 
would have to be done by unanimous consent, but I do think the mat- 
ters before us are important, those who w^ant to be heard should be 
heard, and if we can restrain ourselves by that device it should work 
in the interest of orderly procedure. 

Is there any objection to the Chair's enforcing a 5-minute rule on 
that basis for this discussion ? 

Senator McClellan. Mr. Chairman, a parliamentary inquiry. 

Senator Mundt. You may state it. 

Senator McClellan. Do you mean one 5-minute period or a circle 
of 5-minute periods ? 

Senator Mundt. I would say a circle. If they want to be heard 
more than once, that is perfectly all right. 

Senator McClellan. I just w^antecl to clarify it. 

Senator Mundt. Is there any objection to that? 

Senator Dirksen. No objection, Mr. Chairman. 

Senator Mundt. Will the timekeeper kindly instruct us accord- 
ingly? 

The Chair will recognize Senator Dirksen of Illinois. 

Senator Dirksen. ]\Ir. Chairman, may I say first of all that I 
intend to leave at 4 : 15 to catch a plane to attend some funeral serv- 
ices out of town. Consonant with the discussion we had this noon, 
I hereby make this motion which is not reduced to writing, INIr. Chair- 
man, but I believe its context will be clear. 

I move that as an accepted fact we take judicial notice of the Presi- 
dential directive or letter which was read into the record this morning, 
and in view of its impact upon one of the participants as a result of 
the impossibility of such participant making full and complete proof 
and presentation of his case because of the restriction upon witnesses 
who may have knowledge of information that are relevant or material 
to the countercharges and the answer that was made by Senator 
McCarthy, I move you, Mr. Chairman, that this committee recess until 
Monday morning next at 10 o'clock for the purpose of exploring that 
matter to see where we are. 

If there is a second to that motion 

Senator Potter. I second it, Mr. Chairman. 

Senator Mundt. The second is heard by the Chair. The second is 
made by Senator Potter, of Michigan. 

Senator Dirksen. Now, Mr, Chairman, I wish to discuss it very 
briefly. In a well-turned Bostonese phrrse that we have had from 
Mr. Welch, he has spoken on many occasions about traveling or plow- 
ing the long, hard furrow. Mr. Chairman, that furrow could become 
the solitary furrow of frustration if we put on witnesses day after 
day and heard testhnony only to discover at the end of the trial that 



SPECIAL INVESTIGATION 1279 

the interdiction upon the calling of certain witnesses that Senator 
McCarthy would deem material to his cause still stood and the proof 
in the case could not be completed. We would be in the unhappy 
position of litigants in a lawsuit where proof finally on one side 
could not be fully established. The result would be inconclusive in- 
deed. So much of the work of the committee would not only prove 
a frustration but frankly, Mr. Chairman, I do not see how this com- 
mittee sitting as investigators and judge and jurors could finally 
make a finding and make a report with the proof incomplete. 

Under those circumstances and because of the effect of this letter 
upon witnesses that cannot be called to testify, I earnestly admonish 
the committee that the prudent and the reasonable thing to do at the 
moment is to take enough time to explore the full impact of this 
Executive order to determine whether or not there are any modifica- 
tions or exceptions to it and to make that determination before we go 
further down this road. 

That is all, Mr. Chairman. 

Senator Mundt. The Chair will recognize any other member of 
the committee who wants to be heard, and, after that, members of 
any of tlie entities involved in the dispute who might want to be 
heard. 

Senator Potter. Mr. Chairman ? 

Senator Mundt. Senator Potter. 

Senator Potter. Mr. Chairman, I seconded the motion made by 
Senator Dirksen. I seconded the motion because it was understood 
that there lias been no effort made by any member of the committee, 
no desire expressed by any member of the committee, that this would 
end the hearing. But we have reached an impasse where the Execu- 
tive order has precluded one of the principals from participating as 
fully as he deems necessary to present his case. The committee ruled 
at the beginning that motive was an item which could be considered 
by the various principals in the case. This principal believes that 
motive could not be proven because of the Executive order. 

It is not our position at this time to judge whether the Executive 
order is correct or not. It is a fact that we have an Executive order 
which prohibits the committee from having the information on the 
conversation that took place in the office of the Attorney General. I 
believe that all members of the committee expressed themselves that 
this question must be resolved before we can continue on. If we 
continue with the hearing and bring out other witnesses with this 
hanging over our head, it will frustrate the hearings more than they 
have been frustrated already, and we will end up still in a cloudy area 
where it will be most difficult for the committee and for the public 
to reach any conclusion based upon fact. Therefore, it is my hope 
that as a result of this recess members of our committee, in con- 
junction with responsible leaders in the executive branch of Govern- 
ment, will be able to resolve parts of this controversy, and that the 
hearing may continue so that the facts may be ascertained for the 
benefit of the committee and the general public. 

Therefore, I seconded the motion made by Senator Dirksen. 

Senator Mundt. Senator Symington, you addressed the Chair. Do 
you want to be heard ? 

Senator Symington. Mr. Chairman, I have written a short state- 
ment, hastily here. I think this proposed action to recess the hear- 



1280 SPECIAL INVESTIGATION 

ings at this time is completely unfair. Secretary Stevens has been 
subjected to an ordeal that has few parallels in our congressional 
history. Army Counsel Adams has been questioned vigorously over 
some days. To adopt this transparent device now to let the other 
side avoid the necessity of taking the stand in public, and inform 
the American people of the facts under oath, is a flagrant denial of 
fairness and justice. For some days, leadership in the Senate and the 
administration have been anxious to see these hearings recessed if 
not terminated. They would already have been recessed or terminated 
now if Secretary Stevens had not stood up to his responsibilities. If 
you carry this proposed action to its logical conclusion, any legislative 
investigation of this character could be stopped by Executive direc- 
tive. I predict that if these hearings are recessed because of this 
Presidential directive, and the directive is not withdrawn, they may 
never start again and, therefore, I recommend we go ahead with other 
Army witnesses besides Mr. Adams, who are here ready to take the 
stand. It is my belief the American people will regard this latest 
development as but the first step in a possible whitewash and therefore 
I will have no part of it. 

Senator Mundt. Any other members of the committee ? 

Senator Jackson. 

Senator Jackson. Mr. Chairman, my own personal view is that 
we could proceed to hear the balance of the witnesses that I understand 
will be presented or can be presented by our counsel in connection 
with the so-called Army side of this controversy. I frankly have 
grave misgivings about the need for any recess at this time. But 
in a spirit of fairness, and if it is possible for appropriate people 
to get in touch with the White House, so that this order can be modi- 
fied, I would be willing to make a substitute motion that the com- 
mittee stand in recess until 10 o'clock this Wednesday morning. If 
this Executive order is going to be modified, it will be modified by 
that time. I do not believe we need a full week to take up this serious 
question raised by the issuance of the Executive order as of today. 
I would therefore like to move, as a substitute, that the committee 
stand in recess until Wednesday morning at 10 a. m. I believe, while 
this motion may be against my better judgment, I believe it is fair, 
in the light of the serious questions raised by the proposed Executive 
order, or by the Executive order. 

Senator McClellan. Mr. Chairman? 

Senator Mundt. Senator McClellan. 

Senator McClellan. Mr. Chairman, this is not an easy decision 
to make. I think it is very unfortunate that such an Executive order 
has been issued. I think the issuance of this Executive order is a 
serious mistake. If such an order was to be issued, I think it should 
have been issued long ago and we could have known then that a 
part of the truth possibly would never be available to this committee. 
We could have determined then whether we would undertake these 
hearings under those conditions. But there have been repeated state- 
ments made from both sides and from all participants that they 
wanted to get the whole truth. That has been my purpose. But if 
this order prevails, if it is not modified or rescinded, I am convinced 
now we cannot get the truth, the whole truth, because the witness who 
is now on the stand is precluded from telling us whether the responsi- 



I 



SPECIAL INVESTIGATION 1281 



bility shifted from the Secretary of the Army after the conference 
on January 21 or 22, or if it still remained there. 

Mr. Chairman, I want to be fair, too. As far as I am concerned, 
I disagree with the President's Executive directive at least to this 
extent: My interpretation of it does not prohibit this witness from 
telling when his responsibility ceased for his acts and when the re- 
sponsibility of the Secretary of the Army for his acts ceased. Unless, 
Mr. Chairman, we can determine that, then we .are precluded from 
pursuing the truth in this controversy. 

But in order to be fair, to give the administration the opportunity 
to reconsider the action it has taken, I am willing to vote for the 
substitute motion. 

Mr. Chairman, I remind you and my colleagues that Ave have heard 
at this investigating table, day after day, that these proceedings 
are holding up the work of this committee in a very responsible field 
of investigating communism and subversion in government and, 
Mr. Chairman, if we recess over until Monday we are delaying it 
that much longer. 

I do believe those responsible for this Executive order can recon- 
sider and either confirm the action that has already been taken or 
modify or rescind it within 48 hours from this time. 

My belief is that if this order stands as it is now, it means these 
hearings are terminated. 

I must saj^, Mr. Chairman, in my opinion that is a pretty grave 
responsibility for the administration to take, to stop these proceedings 

liOAV. 

Therefore, with the purpose of being fair and considerate and 
giving an opportunity, as I believe, to correct an error, I shall vote for 
the substitute motion, and therefore I second the motion, Mr. Chair- 
man. 

Senator Mundt. Senator Dworshak, do you wish to be heard? 

Senator Dw^orshak. Mr. Chairman, my remarks will be very brief. 

I have tried to maintain an unbiased approach in these hearings 
so that we might arrive at a just and equitable conclusion. I do not 
think there is any justification for making the charge or implying that 
any whitewash is involved or that any attempt is being made at this 
time to prevent Senator McCarthy from taking the stand for as long 
as the members of this committee or the counsel desire him to answer 
questions. 

I supported the proposal recently to expedite the hearings so they 
may be terminated as quickly as possible when all the facts were 
ascertained. That was an unsuccessful effort. I think now, with 
this development involving the Executive order of the President, it 
is extremely difficult for the members of this subcommittee to delve 
into the various aspects of this controversy, because obviously a 
hobble, shackles, would be placed upon some of the witnesses, making 
it extremely difficult for the members of this subcommittee to know 
what the motive is and what is actually back of this entire controversy. 

I think at a time like this, when we reach an impasse, it is highly 
desirable to have a brief recess to explore all of the possibilities of 
renewing the hearings on a basis that will make it possible for the 
subcommittee to reach an equitable conclusion. I do not think that 



12S2 SPECIAL INVESTIGATION 

this proposed recess in any way will serve to sabotaoje these hearinf>;s 
or prevent Senator McCarthy from appearing or in any other way 
to prejudice them so we cannot arrive at the kind of verdict that the 
people of this country will approve. 

On this basis, I think we must recess and resolve these extreme 
difficulties which we encountered today. 

Senator Mundt. The Chair would like to read the original instruc- 
tions of charges and countercharges which he read the first morning, 
which were worked out in collaboration with Senator McClellan and 
our counsel. It was agreed I should read them as representing the 
committee position so we can have the framework of this discussion 
clearly before us. 

I said then in behalf of Senator McClellan, Counsel Jenkins and 
myself that: 

The purpose of investigating charges heretofore made by Secretary of the 
Army Robert T. Stevens and his counsel, John G. Adams, and formalized in a 
document dated April 13, 1954, and tiled with this subcommittee and in which a 
gen(M-al charge is made that Senator Joseph R. McCarthy as chairman of the 
Permanent Investigation Subcommittee, its chief counsel, Roy M. Cohn, as well 
as other members of its staff sought by improper means to obtain preferential 
treatment for one G. David Schine, United States Army. 

and so forth. 

I point out that the charges, as we thought at the time, were charges 
heretofore made by Secretary of the Army Robert T. Stevens and 
his counsel, John G. Adams. 

The answer which Mr. Adams has been unable to give because of the 
Presidential directive, to a question asked by Senator McClellan, pro- 
eludes us from knowing wdiether or not those original charges were 
based on the proper premise. I read further : 

It is the further purpose of this subcommittee to investigate countercharges 
by Senator McCarthy, Cohn, and other members of the staff against Mr. Stevens, 
Mr. Adams, and Mr. Hensel. These countercharges were formalized in a 
statement signed and filed with the subconunittee under date of April 10, 1954. 
in which they generally alleged that Mr. Stevens, Mr. Adams, and Mr. Hensel 
attempted to discredit what is generally referred to as the McCarthy Investi- 
gating Committee and to force a discontinuation of further attempts by that 
committee to expose Connnunist infiltration in the Army, and in which it is 
further charged that Mr. Stevens and Mr. Adams made constant attempts 
to tra<le off preferential treatment for Private Schine as an inducement to the 
subcommittee to hold its exposition of the mishandling of Communist infiltration 
in the military — 

and point out that until we can get some kind of answer from Mr. 
Adams as to what occurred at that luncheon, if there was a shifting 
of responsibility, it may well be that the committee has been asking 
the wrong questions of the wrong people for a long time in these 
hearings. 

Because of that difficult situation, it seems to me that it is wise that 
we take some time to consult with the Attorney General and with the 
White House, to see whether or not there cannot be a modification, or an 
interpretation, or an understanding of the Executive order, which 
will ])ermit Mr. Adams and those associated with him at that meeting 
to testify on the pertinent points so that we can be sure whether or 
not we have been proceeding on proper and firm ground in the hear- 
ings up to this time. So we proceed with the interrogation of Sena- 
tor IMcCarthy and Mr. Cohn, we can be sure of the background in order 
that the questions can be pertinent to the case. In the executive ses- 






SPECIAL INVESTIGATION 1283 

sion, it was discussed that it would be well if the counsel for the 
committee and the Chair approached the proper authorities in the 
executive department to see whether there could be such a modification 
or reinterpretation. I think that we want to continue these hearings 
until we get all of the truth. As is well known, the Chair departed 
from the accustomed company of his three Republican colleagues 
one day, and voted in the unfamiliar company of three of his Democrat 
associates, in order to provide that we could continue until all of the 
facts were provided. 

The Chair believes that a recess at this time may be conducive to a 
rearrangement of situations so that we can continue to get out all 
of the facts, and he is well aware of the validity of that portion of 
the remarks made by Senator McClellan that we labor under a very 
difficult handicap in our search for truth if we are unable to bring 
out certain of the facts which Mr. Adams now feels he is unable to 
provide because of the Executive order. Having said that, the Chair 
would simply say if we are going to recess at all, he thinks we should 
recess until Monday. The President is a very busy man. He has the 
problems of Indochina on his hands. He has a great many confer- 
ences. I think it is completely unreasonable to expect that we can go 
down there without any advance notice, and by Wednesday morning, 
in about 24 hours, reach a type of understanding, essential for the 
jjroper continuation of these hearings. He believes that the White 
House and the Attorney General would want time to read a consid- 
erable amount of the transcript, the significance of the charges and 
countercharges, to have the full background before them before they 
wanted to reevaluate, if reevaluate they will, their determinations. 
So, if it is in the interest of truth and fact to get out all the informa- 
tion, as the Chair believes it is, it is certainly in the interest of those 
basic goals to provide a time limit, to have a reasonable opportunity 
to present the full impact of this Executive order upon those who 
made it, and to get a reasoned and careful reply in return. 

Senator Dirksen. I move we vote. 

Senator Mundt. The Chair believes he should give an opportunity 
now, as is the custom of doing, to Mr. Welch and Senator McCarthy 
to make any statement they might care to or to voice any protest they 
might care to voice, concerning the contemplated action of the com- 
mittee. I will call on Mr. Welch first. 

Mr. Welch. Mr. Chairman, as everyone knows, if I am anything, 
I am just a trial lawyer who came to Washington hoping to try a 
case. At this moment, I am neither blind nor deaf. No one sitting 
in this chair could hope to summon words so persuasive or so golden 
as to influence a single vote on this committee. I therefore confine 
myself to the only thing where I have any choice, and that is whether 
we have an adjournment for 48 hours or until next Monday. On 
that, the Army stands indifferent. But this I wish to say: When 
the adjournment ends, the Army will be ready. 

Senator Mundt. Senator McCarthy ? 

Senator McCarthy. Mr. Chairman, I think that the President 
when he signed this order, is. No. 1, a reasonable man. No. 2, a fair 
man. I doubt that with all the work that he has before him, that he 
had any complete conception or picture of what he was doing. I think 
"we should bring to his attention the fact that his order provides, in 
effect, that where the machinery was set in motion to initiate the 



1284 SPECIAL INVESTIGATION 

smear charges against Mr. Colin, Mr. Carr and myself, if his order 
stands we will be forever precluded from finding out who was re- 
sponsible, who was the initiating force. I think this is doubly im- 
portant, Mr. Chairman, because of the testimony heretofore taken 
to the effect that Mr. Brownell, the Attorney General, Mr. Rogers, 
the Deputy Attorney General, were present at that time and that at 
least some of the action taken by Mr. Adams was a result of sugges- 
tions from Mr. Rogers. As the Chair knows, a suggestion from the 
White House is the same as an order. I think we must know what 
part either the Attorney General or the Deputy Attorney General took 
in this. May I say at this time I am completely in the dark. I don't 
know. I think it is extremely important, because each day we send 
to the Attorney General a transcript of the record. I know that when 
we get through with this testimony, the testimony of witnesses will be 
diametrically opposed. 

I know that someone will have to have his case presented to a grand 
jury for indictment for perjury. In other words, when my testimony 
has ended, either McCarthy will be guilty of perjury, or some of the 
other witnesses in this case will be. The Attorney General must pass 
upon that. Therefore, I think we must know what party took in 
this whole picture. 

It is also important, Mr. Chairman, in view of the fact he has been 
called upon almost daily to give an opinion as to what documents 
can be admitted. 

I would like to, if I may, say this, that if this were in a court of 
law, Mr. Stevens and Mr. Adams having finished their testimony, if 
this were in a court of law I would move for a directed verdict. 
Before a committee, such a procedure is not possible. 

As the Chair knows, No. 1, there were charges against Mr. Francis 
Carr, my chief of staff, a young man who was head of the subversive 
squad for the FBI until the night before he came to my committee. 
It has now been established by the testimony of the two principals, 
Mr. Adams and Mr. Stevens, that Mr. Carr is guilty of nothing except 
remaining silent when McCarthy and Cohn were talking. I think 
the committee is acquainted with both McCarthy and Mr. Cohn, and 
I don't think it is a crime to be unable to get in a word while we are 
talking. 

That seems to be the only crime Mr. Carr is guilty of. It is a very 
serious charge against this young man. I think we must find out 
who initiated that, who was responsible for it. It was fraud upon 
the committee. Whoever is responsible is guilty of contempt of this 
committee. 

May I just take a minute now to review the testimony in so far as 
Mr. Cohn is concerned. 

The testimony of Mr. Adams and Mr. Stevens up to this point is 
that he used strong language. But the only act he was guilty of w^ere 
two acts; No. 1, he made Mr. Adams take a cab to go to the depot, 
let him out, in New York, let him out of the car and. No. 2, that he 
was unable to induce me to call off the subpenas for the loyalty board. 

Outside of that there has been no testimony of any improper act on 
Mr. Cohn's part. I think it is a very serious charge here, to try 
and rob this young man of his reputation, a young man who has a 
tremendous record, as the committee all knows, a record of taking 
an active part in the conviction of the Rosenbergs, the Communist 



SPECIAL INVESTIGATION 1285 

espionaf^e agents, of the top Communists who were convicted, William 
Remington, and presenting almost single-handedly the testimony to 
the grand jury which resulted in the discharge of some thirty-odd, 
I believe, from the United Nations, Communists. 

For that reason, Mr. Chairman, I think it is of the utmost impor- 
tance that this order be rescinded. Unless it is rescinded my hands 
are completely tied. There is no way that I can go into the question 
of motive. 

As the Chair knows, in conclusion may I say this, that as the 
Chair well knows, I have taken the position time and again that this 
hassel was called on, called into being by individuals who wanted to 
discontinue the exposure of Communists in Government, and to avoid 
the exposure of those responsible for the coddling of those Communists. 
Whoever had that in mind was successful, because, as the Chair knows, 
we haven't been doing anything for the past few weeks, except going 
into this question of Schine's shoes. 

But I think we have a situation much more important than that 
now. I think the committee would want to know who was responsible 
for the planning, the guiding, of that activity which resulted in a 
vast waste of time on the part of this committee and the military. 

So may I say I approve of the Chair or someone getting in touch 
with the President, and I think that he is a reasonable man, to try 
to induce him to rescind this order so we can proceed with our hear- 
ings. Whether it is a matter of days or weeks I frankly don't care. 

Senator Mundt. The Senator's time has expired. 

Does any other member of the committee want to say anything 
further before we vote ? 

We have before us the two propositions, and the vote will occur 
on the substitute proposition first. The Chairman Avould like to say 
only this before the vote is taken: Since it seems that he has been 
singled out by virtue of his office to make the contact, to try to find 
out if we can develop a formula of procedure which will enable ns 
to get the facts we want and the facts we need, despite the Executive 
order, he pleads with his colleagues to give him at least a reasonable 
amount of time so that there can be a reasonable chance for success, 
because I think we all want these hearings to continue, and we want 
to get out all the facts. To do that, I feel it would be utterly un- 
reasonable to expect to have all of the various ramifications adequately 
considered short, certainly, of several days. Twenty-four hours 
would be woefully inadequate. 

May the Chair say finally : Neither of these motions, the one to 
recess for a day until 10 o'clock AVednesday, or the one to recess 
until 10 o'clock Monday morning, even remotely implies a discon- 
tinuation of the hearings. There is nothing in either of them which 
says tliat the hearing is over. Both of them are directed to the ob- 
jective of trying to find some modus operandi by which we can con- 
tinue to get out all of the facts. 

Senator Symington. Mr. Chairman? 

Senator ]\Iundt. Senator Symington. 

Senator Symington. Mr. Chairman, if I agreed with your premise 
that the hearings could not go along with other Army witnesses prior 
to a decision — which presumably could be expedited, if made at 
all — then I would be very glad to extend the time in order to do what 
apparently you wish to do, namely, take this matter up with the 



128G SPECIAL INVESTIGATION 

White House; but inasmuch as I do not agree with your premise that 
the hearing can't go along properly until the decision is made, and 
if it is to be made I agree it would be made soon — therefore I believe 
the hearing should go on with other Army witnesses. 

Senator Mundt. Does any other Senator want to be heard before 
we vote? If not, the question occurs first on the substitute offered 
by Senator Jackson, seconded by Senator McClellan, that we recess 
until 10 o'clock Wednesday morning. Those in favor will respond 
by answering "aye." 

Senator McClellan ? 

Senator McClellan. Aye. 

Senator Mundt. Senator Dirksen ? 

Senator Dirksen. No. 

Senator Mundt. Senator Jackson ? 

Senator Jackson. Aye. 

Senator Mundt. Senator Potter ? 

Senator Potter. No. 

Senator Mundt. Senator Symington? 

Senator Symington. No. 

Senator Mundt. Senator Dworshak? 

Senator Dworshak. No. 

Senator Mundt. The Chair votes "no." 

The question now recurs on the motion made by Senator Dirksen 
and seconded by Senator Potter, that we recess until 10 o'clock 
Monday next. The Chair will call the roll. 

Senator McClellan? 

Senator McClellan. No. 

Senator Mundt. Senator Dirksen ? 

Senator Dirksen. Aye. 

Senator Mundt. Senator Jackson ? 

Senator Jackson. No. 

Senator Mundt. Senator Potter? 

Senator Potter. Aye. 

Senator Mundt. Senator Symington? 

Senator Symington. No. 

Senator Mundt. Senator Dworshak? 

Senator Dworshak. Aye. 

Senator Mundt. The Chair votes "aye." 

We stand in recess until 10 o'clock Monday morning. 

( Wliereupon, at 3 : 50 p. m., the hearing was recessed until 10 a. m., 
lSIonday,May 24, 1954.) 



INDEX 



Page 

Adams, John G 1278, 1280, 1282-1284 

Army (United iStates) 1280, 1282, 1283, 1285, 1286 

Army counsel 1278, 1280, 1282-1284 

Army witnesses 1280, 1285, 1286 

Attorney General 1279, 12S2-12S4 

Brownell, Attorney General 1284 

Carr, Francis P 1284 

Cohn, Roy M 1282, 1284 

Communism and subversion in Government 1281 

Communist espionage agents 1284, 1285 

Communist infiltration in the Army 1282 

Communists 1281, 1282, 1284, 1285 

Communists (United Nations) 1285 

Communists in Government 1285 

Counselor to the Army 1278, 1280, 12S2 

Deputy Attorney General 1284 

Executive directive 1280 

Executive order 1279, 1280-1283, 1285 

FBI subversive squad 1284 

Federal Bureau of Investigation (FBI) 1284 

Loyalty board 1284 

McCarthy, Senator Joe 1278, 1279, 1281-1 2S4 

McCarthy committee 1282 

McCIellan, Senator 1282, 1283 

New York City 1284 

President of the United States 1283, 1285 

President's Executive directive 1281 

Remington, William 12s.') 

Republican colleagues 1283 

Rogers, Deputy Attorney General 3284 

Rosenbergs 1284 

Schine, G. David 1282, 12.S5 

Secretary of the Army 1280-1282, 1284 

Senate of the United States 1280 

Stevens, Robert T 1280-1282, 1284 

Subversive squad (FBI) 12*^4 

United Nations Communists 1285 

United States Army 1280, 1282, 1283, 12^5. 128(5 

United States Attorney General 1279, 1282-1284 

United States Deputy Attorney General 1284 

United States President 1283 

United States Senate 12S0 

Washington, D. C 1283 

White House 1280, 1282-1284, 1286 

I 



o 



BOSTON PUBLIC LIBRARY 

Jllllilllill 

3 9999 05442 1746 



iiiiiini