View Post [edit]
Poster: | Matthew Vernon | Date: | Dec 1, 2005 5:02am |
Forum: | etree | Subject: | Classification Of Grateful Dead Recordings |
An audience recording is an audio recording made by someone from a location in the audience that used both microphones and tape decks that were not property of the Grateful Dead, i.e. the taper purchased a ticket for a show and brought their own microphones and tape deck to record the show.
Note that matrix, pre-fm, fm, or recordings from soundboard patches, irrespective of origin are classified as soundboard recordings and will be available only in streaming format from this web site.
Matt Vernon
Reply [edit]
Poster: | A Dude | Date: | Dec 1, 2005 6:33am |
Forum: | etree | Subject: | Re: Classification Of Grateful Dead Recordings |
FM recordings are made over the airwaves by fans on their own tape decks, in an entirely legal fashion, on airwaves that are paid for by taxpayer money.
Such recordings are legal in accordance with the precedent established by the US Supreme Court "Betamax" decision.
Fair Use applies to all over-the-air recordings that are not used for commercial benefit.
In fact, there is a strong case that any FM recording can be hosted by the Archive regardless of what artist is on it.
But I realize that you DO want to respect artist's wishes.
But, logically speaking, Soundboards, Audience recordings, and Radio recordings are three different entities.
As a professional studio engineer who has run studio and live soundboards, I've never allowed any recording of the soundboard feeds, and thus SBD's and Pre-FM's are both pirate unauthorized recordings, and a "Matrix" which uses a SBD is thus the same.
But an FM recording made in the home is entirely different, and I hereby request that you ask for a reconsideration of FM recordings on the basis that they are entirely legal.
PS Right now there is no 1966 available at all, which is sad, yet http://db.etree.org/shninfo_detail.php?shnid=6516 used to be available here, and it is an FM Broadcast.
Reply [edit]
Poster: | HighNRGOne | Date: | Dec 1, 2005 6:41am |
Forum: | etree | Subject: | Re: Classification Of Grateful Dead Recordings |
Were not there also many recordings made from soundboard radio broadcasts that Healy got into trouble for in the 80's? I recall the FCC cracking down on them because the Dead were acting, in simple terms, as an 'unlicensed radio station'. They clearly intended public (versus production-only) broadcast of the content. The broadcast range and signal strength were purposely elevated to reach beyond the venue space (to the parking lot, presumably).
I would have to say that any 'wireless' broadcasting the Dead did (Healy counts as the Dead, like it or not) that was public enough to get the FCC involved qualifies as public domain and 'fair use' material, particularly for non-profit, non-commercial purposes, as here. If Pre-FM is what I think it is it becomes FM when sent far enough to be captured publicly.
It would be interesting to see the Dead, with a straight face, assert control over the results of their own illegal FM broadcasts in violation of Federal communications laws.
(If anyone knows the real story there, please chime in....I am raising this point from vague memory of this).
Food for thought.
Reply [edit]
Poster: | A Dude | Date: | Dec 1, 2005 8:30am |
Forum: | etree | Subject: | Re: Classification Of Grateful Dead Recordings |
This post was modified by A Dude on 2005-12-01 16:30:29
Reply [edit]
Poster: | HighNRGOne | Date: | Dec 1, 2005 8:56am |
Forum: | etree | Subject: | Steal Your Archive (Back) |
This post was modified by HighNRGOne on 2005-12-01 16:56:02
Reply [edit]
Poster: | A Dude | Date: | Dec 1, 2005 8:52am |
Forum: | etree | Subject: | Re: Classification Of Grateful Dead Recordings |
There has been no change in the overall GD Policy on downloading shows.
So, we are free to download SBD shows from any other site (as long as there is no official release of the show).
And there are a number of such sites and they are seeing more traffic lately. :)
The one difference is that - unlike the Archive - they don't have all shows at all times. Someone says "how about doing 73 RFK" and then that is uploaded (usually by BitTorrent, occasionally on FTP).
To do the same thing as Archive would require the same huge investment in hard drives, servers and bandwidth - you'd need some very heavy duty sponsors. And then you would have GDM knocking at your door, and you would have to go through the same trip. If you chose not to honor the artist's wishes, THEN you need a whole building full of lawyers !
Reply [edit]
Poster: | Chris U. | Date: | Dec 1, 2005 9:30am |
Forum: | etree | Subject: | Re: Classification Of Grateful Dead Recordings |
Um, what is the Chimperor's phrase?
Oh yeah: "Bring it on."
And just to make it interesting, let's hire John Barlow as a testifying expert.
My question is what exactly is the threat that was communicated to brewster et al.?
If public domain soundboards remain available for download on this site, then ... what happens exactly?
The Dead sues its fans? Some "donors" pull their money and cease supporting the site?
My apologies if these questions have been answered already. As I've indicated, the general discussion among apologists for the "new rules" is that "we should do what Mickey Hart says because he played drums and he's entitled to change his mind and claim copyright to recordings he's never heard."
Reply [edit]
Poster: | brewster | Date: | Dec 1, 2005 11:43am |
Forum: | etree | Subject: | Streaming Grateful Dead Recordings |
I am going to side with the grateful dead on this one. You will notice there is very little stream-only things on this site... why? because we dont think it works well.
But why stream these recordings? because it seems to be a compromise that keeps some access but not enough to cause severe problems.
Please take a bigger view and a nicer one: lets let our whole community: bands, fans, tapers, archivists learn a bit and flex. As they say: bend, dont break.
With respect and patience we will come up with something great. With hard-lines that seem extreme we could lose much more than we can gain.
Your words sting, they hurt. We do this because we love it, we dont get paid much, we live in the public sphere. Other people are in different situations, but everyone wants respect.
We had a hard week last week. We have something going here. Lets give it a rest and celebrate.
I may be asking too much, but please consider apologizing to the band, pull down one of those great '71 auds like I did an hour ago and pop it in your cd player.
It is more fun.
Peace.
-brewster
Reply [edit]
Poster: | sonomajon | Date: | Dec 2, 2005 2:47am |
Forum: | etree | Subject: | Re: Streaming Grateful Dead Recordings |
in great appreciation and respect,
jon
Reply [edit]
Poster: | smagnolia | Date: | Dec 1, 2005 11:57am |
Forum: | etree | Subject: | Re: Streaming Grateful Dead Recordings |
Peace back atcha!
Reply [edit]
Poster: | kymusicjunky | Date: | Dec 1, 2005 11:56am |
Forum: | etree | Subject: | Re: Streaming Grateful Dead Recordings |
Also, www.yousendit.com allows up to 1 GB file transfers directly to someone's email. You should check it out if you're interested in doing person to person trades without using USPS. Contact me at kymusicjunky@yahoo.com if you want some more information or would like to trade some shows. Bye for now, Dave.
Reply [edit]
Poster: | Diana Hamilton | Date: | Dec 2, 2005 12:12am |
Forum: | etree | Subject: | Re: Streaming Grateful Dead Recordings |
http://www.archive.org/iathreads/post-view.php?id=49677
Reply [edit]
Poster: | laptaper | Date: | Mar 15, 2006 7:27am |
Forum: | etree | Subject: | Re: Streaming Grateful Dead Recordings |
Reply [edit]
Poster: | cousinkix1953 | Date: | Dec 20, 2005 12:13am |
Forum: | etree | Subject: | Re: Classification Of Grateful Dead Recordings |
This post was modified by cousinkix1953 on 2005-12-20 08:13:32
Reply [edit]
Poster: | patkelley | Date: | Feb 23, 2006 10:29am |
Forum: | etree | Subject: | Re: Classification Of Grateful Dead Recordings |
Reply [edit]
Poster: | Diana Hamilton | Date: | Feb 23, 2006 8:43pm |
Forum: | etree | Subject: | Re: movin' on |
Reply [edit]
Poster: | nagdot | Date: | Feb 23, 2006 9:18pm |
Forum: | etree | Subject: | Re: movin' on |
Reply [edit]
Poster: | patkelley | Date: | Feb 23, 2006 10:16pm |
Forum: | etree | Subject: | Re: movin' on |
Reply [edit]
Poster: | Dub Irie | Date: | Feb 23, 2006 9:48am |
Forum: | etree | Subject: | Re: Classification Of Grateful Dead Recordings |
Reply [edit]
Poster: | cosmicharlie | Date: | Feb 23, 2006 11:55pm |
Forum: | etree | Subject: | Re: Classification Of Grateful Dead Recordings |
I was at the Bill Graham Memorial and would love to have a copy of that. BTW, Nagdot 'n pat, I've never read DH being rude at all. We must be movin on concerning Dead-rehashed subjects or I swear I'll smoke more fatties!!
Reply [edit]
Poster: | cosmicharlie | Date: | Feb 24, 2006 12:21am |
Forum: | etree | Subject: | Re: Classification Of Grateful Dead Recordings |
Reply [edit]
Poster: | cosmicharlie | Date: | Feb 24, 2006 12:24am |
Forum: | etree | Subject: | Re: Classification Of Grateful Dead Recordings |
Is not uploading to a torrent site as ez as uploading here?
And i mean legal stuff...
Reply [edit]
Poster: | nagdot | Date: | Feb 24, 2006 12:06am |
Forum: | etree | Subject: | Re: Classification Of Grateful Dead Recordings |
Reply [edit]
Poster: | Dub Irie | Date: | Feb 26, 2006 8:20am |
Forum: | etree | Subject: | Re: Classification Of Grateful Dead Recordings |
Reply [edit]
Poster: | Diana Hamilton | Date: | Dec 1, 2005 7:13am |
Forum: | etree | Subject: | Re: Classification Of Grateful Dead Recordings |